elfkicker5000Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 23Arc User
edited May 2013
I think this is a pretty fair interpretation of the 4e rules set. The fact that this is an MMO demands that certain sacrifices be made, but I think they did a good job recreating the spirit of the rules, which are are much more focused on action and fast-paced, swashbuckling style combat than 3 or 3.5. The only thing I do not like so much is the weapon restrictions.
But, as others have said, the Foundry is where the real D&D is. This weekend I played the Foundry "module" 'B2: Keep on the Borderlands'!! It was awesome to see the first D&D adventure I experienced "brought to life" and playing out before me.
I expect there are many great adventures to come from our fellow players.
The main selling point for Neverwinter in my eyes is that there is user generated content. Not whether it was 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 4th edition.
Again this is in MY eyes
That is the only reason I am still here, to see if I can get my DM on...I am pretty sure I wont be able to, but until I get the chance to check it out......
But, having played all but 4th edition, I can tell you, that each one of them, while slightly different, still felt like DnD, and were'nt all that discernable from each other rules wise. Sure there was some things that were radically different...THAC0 ....1 out of D100 for Psy powers.
You know why I havent played 4th edition. Cause the gaming shop I went to for years told me not to bother, and when the hard core DnD guys dont like it, I knew a purist such as myself would be in for a sad disappointment and from what I have read since that time, I dont regret it all.
If I havent offended you today....dont worry!!!....there's always tomorrow. Of course, you could also go to here for all I care.
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sasheriaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 1Arc User
That is the only reason I am still here, to see if I can get my DM on...I am pretty sure I wont be able to, but until I get the chance to check it out......
But, having played all but 4th edition, I can tell you, that each one of them, while slightly different, still felt like DnD, and were'nt all that discernable from each other rules wise. Sure there was some things that were radically different...THAC0 ....1 out of D100 for Psy powers.
You know why I havent played 4th edition. Cause the gaming shop I went to for years told me not to bother, and when the hard core DnD guys dont like it, I knew a purist such as myself would be in for a sad disappointment and from what I have read since that time, I dont regret it all.
I finally start tinkering with the Foundry (that is my personal draw too) I can start create a whole campaign or just a mission. Since it is F2P I can get my gaming group to play with me. (at least custom missions)
there are A LOT of talented people out there (WAY more talent than me) who are making some really awesome missions/campaign.
I think this is a pretty fair interpretation of the 4e rules set. The fact that this is an MMO demands that certain sacrifices be made, but I think they did a good job recreating the spirit of the rules, which are are much more focused on action and fast-paced, swashbuckling style combat than 3 or 3.5. The only thing I do not like so much is the weapon restrictions.
But, as others have said, the Foundry is where the real D&D is. This weekend I played the Foundry "module" 'B2: Keep on the Borderlands'!! It was awesome to see the first D&D adventure I experienced "brought to life" and playing out before me.
I expect there are many great adventures to come from our fellow players.
You know...I am wondering....are those old modules still under copyright and will there be some cease and desist letters for creating content in NW...cause you can be reimbursed with AD which translates in Zen which is considered money which means you are being compensated for anothers IP. ......*shrugs* I aint no lawyer, it just crossed my mind when I spoke with that guy a week or two back.
If I havent offended you today....dont worry!!!....there's always tomorrow. Of course, you could also go to here for all I care.
Sorry friend, you are obviously thinking of the game created by Dave Arneson and Gary Gygax. Sorry, we left that game lying in the gutter when WotC mugged and enslaved TSR then capitulated to Hasbro.
or
Sorry Friend, we left that game back in 3.5.
hated Dnd 2nd edition myself, hated 4th as well.
DND Next is really good. Ive been playing since the first books and next so far is the closest to that.
I really hate the fact that you are stuck with certain weapons in this game. Hopefully that changes when more classes are added. A rogue should be able to carry a club, a dagger, a short sword etc. The different weapons make it fun.
And to the people that seem to think this game is some kind of representation of 4e rules, it isn't at all. It's a pretty decent MMO, but so far to me plays pretty much like most other MMOs out there. The setting is DnD awesomeness, but the actual game-play is not representative of any version of the DnD rulesets.
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sasheriaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 1Arc User
astaziaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 51
edited May 2013
I don't play tabletop, I read some old rule books once, but that's about it. I've played lots of D&D PC games, since Baldur's Gate, through NWN2, including offshoots like Temple of Elemental Evil and Dark Alliance. They all had a distinct feel and set of rules that I truly grew to love over the years. This game has no resemblance whatsoever to that D&D. It is truly disappointing. I don't know if it's 4e or just how the game interpreted it, but this is just not D&D IMO. It's not. That's not necessarily a "flaw" other than the fact that they put D&D in the title. Had this game been called something else I would not have thought twice about it, it just would have been a great new game to me. Instead, having been preparing myself to play essentially an online NWN3, I instead find myself thinking about going back and playing more NWN2 or DDO, or maybe the updated version BG that just came out. I can't get the thought of how much better this game would have been if it followed the 3.5e rules or whatever, and how much I miss all those mechanics that just aren't here.
Anything that resembles the D&D are the ability scores your roll when creating a character, but even then you should be able to modify it on your own once you rolled the dice, and speaking of dice rolling, there is no such thing in this game, and it is the basics of D&D.
Also, where are proficiencies? Concentration, weapon proficiency, spell mastery, and so on. In this game they are called feats, but sadly they have nothing to do with them.
1) Skill check system (nicely implemented I might add)
2) Encounter/Daily powers (nicely implemented as well)
3) Forgotten Realms setting
4) Class kits right outta 4th Edition
5) Races right out for Forgotten Realms
6) Spells/Skills right out of 4th Ed.
7) Gods/Deities right out of 4th Ed. and Forgotten Realms
8) Monsters right out of the Monster Manuals
Haven't seen a game to date, be it single player going way back to Pools of Radiance on my Mac SE Circa 1987 to now that has done a better job at transposing a tabletop game to a video game.
Some people just have complainer ingrained in their DNA.
Yep. I played Sojourn.. and then Toril after the split. Some of the devs from those MUDs had published actual TSR modules and books.... and even that game resembled nothing like the tabletop game. It had the names of places, gods, classes, and mobs but that was about it.
Really miss the days of MUDs... those that never played back in those days won't ever understand how a text adventure could be so fun but some of my best online experiences were back in the days of MUDs. Things were so social and pleasant online in those days... then came the warcraft generation.
Yeah it's not quite as D&D as I would like, but hopefully they will fix that eventually.
If you want a "true" D&D game, check out Turbine's version. It's much closer to 3.5 rules, but it still has its share of problems.
God DDO was horrible, bad, terribad. I lasted 2 hours in that garbage of a game. Running around a dungeon destroying crates and boxes for gold. Running the same dungeons 500 times. An interface like looked like openlook circa 1985 SunOS. Equipment skins that looked atrocious.
Horrible. That game is on my all time top 10 biggest disappointments.
God DDO was horrible, bad, terribad. I lasted 2 hours in that garbage of a game. Running around a dungeon destroying crates and boxes for gold. Running the same dungeons 500 times. An interface like looked like openlook circa 1985 SunOS. Equipment skins that looked atrocious.
Horrible. That game is on my all time top 10 biggest disappointments.
Yes, those would be the problems I mentioned. However, it's still pretty close to D&D with rolls to hit, saves, traps that kill, etc.
It's also in-game. There are dungeons, and there are dragons.
What you're asking for is a specific feel from a specific campaign designed by a specific individual based on rules from decades ago that changed arbitrarily from one release to the next.
You are quite mistaken. I have played since Basic, through 2nd, 3rd and 3.5. This is classic Cryptic Studios buying intellectual property, then throwing out the game systems that it is founded on. They did the EXACT same thing with Champions Online, buying outright the IP and then abandoning the game it is founded on.
This game has, in no particular order, no variation in controls to let you optimize for your style of game play, no ability to make a character that is unique to you, no skill allocation and expects the community to GIVE it most of the content it runs while at the same time DEMANDING that property rights be maintained on their part.
There have been D&D games throughout the history of computer gaming, and, aside from graphics, this is the worst I have seen in the last fifteen years. A blatant impersonation of, and attempt to exploit, an earlier sucessful game while providing none of the value that caused the first and second games to thrive.
4th Edition is a much more simplified version of Dungeons and Dragons. My group was never won over by it, to be honest, and my first thought upon looking at the rule set was "this looks like someone tried to convert an MMO into a Role Playing Game, and I don't think it's going to work so well."
So yes, 4th Edition bears only passing resemblance to previous editions of the rule set, which is why this game has no resemblance to earlier Dungeons and Dragons based games (even DDO).
<digression>
Of course my dislike for the 4th Edition rules is tempered by my absolute hatred at what was done to the Forgotten Realms to bring it "into line" with 4th Edition. It took me a long time to accept... oh who am I kidding? I haven't accepted it. In pencil and paper, I have stayed staunchly in the pre-spellplague Realms. But time has allowed me to be slightly more detached about, which is how I'm able to play Neverwinter at all. I just consider it a "what if".</digression>
MMo's make any pen and paper playing very difficult to translate. Sadly this is a typical mmo with a DnD flavored background.
There is close to nothing that makes this game a Dungeons and Dragons product other then name.
That does not mean it is poorly made or is trashworthy.
So far I have enjoyed the game but I would pay 100 dollars for a magic missile or fireball..maybe a melfs acid arrow as well.
I would pay a larger sum for a DnD game based off of the 2nd Edition rules or thereabouts. In My opinion that was the "GOOD OLE DAYS" of Dungeons and Dragons. No Disrespect to younging who know very little other then Lizards of the Coast as daddy Gygax.
That being said i am playing the game and wasting away a few hours and have enjoyed myself...I wont over analyze it because that will cause me to 2nd guess the game too much.
Today we fight the GAULS......monstrous and HAIRY beyond reason.
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cigaranMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
The game is good. The combat system great. The foundry one of the best features ever. But where is the D&D.
Locked weapons and armor. I'm a dwarf great weapon fighter you wont let me wear full plate and no ax I'm a dwarf you never see a dwarf with a great-sword. D&D was always about choice but where is it here you should be able to wield a dagger as a great weapon fighter wear plate as a mage (yes it would be silly and never work) where is my studded leather, scale mail, splint mail.
Where is the environment of D&D i can run down hallways unafraid. I hope this is because I'm lower level but I haven't seen a single trap yet and all our class skills (Dungeoneering, Arcana, Religion, ect.) are just for getting crafting materials. Nothing is threatening as I can drip feed myself potions, at most in D&D you had 2 (mainly casue they were not that useful) not 15 and that's just from looting.
This game make me want to play a good D&D mmo sadly that is more of what D&D online offers than Neverwinter. It's not that Neverwinter is bad, it's a great game with wonderful combat and user created content just not a D&D game.
I hope this will be taken as a criticism that can be fixed and not as someone just whining. Hopefully this game will get better with time and it can become the game i wanted.
Unfortunately, (or fortunately if you enjoy it) this is what D&D has become. The 4th edition of the game initially featured a very dumbed down system compared to what previous additions had been. Right or wrong, it was done with the intention of drawing in more players specifically new players who and they wanted the barrier to entry to be as low as possible. Sadly that meant a lot of options went out the window or became so trivialized that they no longer really mattered.
I agree though, there does need to be more flexibility offered as time goes on. Hopefully we'll see that in future updates to the game.
4th edition is to D&D as The Spirits Within is to Final Fantasy.
Account retired August 22, 2013. May Perfect World choke on the exploited Nightmare mounts.
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keterysMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
If you're trying to edition war based on how things play in Neverwinter, you really might want to stop. Cause it's a really good way to look uninformed and devalue any actual arguments about Neverwinter.
Video games have different needs than tabletop. The game works like how Cryptic wanted it work, not like how WotC wanted it work, nor how tabletop can or should work. Give it a try, decide whether you like it based on its own merits. Don't go in with a preconception - especially not one 5 - 20 years old - without looking at the actual description and documentation of the character you're making.
Also, don't be surprised if you can't do everything you'd expect to be able to do at 1st level. You're in tutorial mode. If you're 10th and you haven't found a way for a cleric to heal, wizard to wiz, or rogue to sneak, then you've got more room to complain. Or haven't looked too closely at your bars.
Finally - check out Foundry. It's the single greatest asset this game has to offer. It lets you be a Dungeon Master to thousands of people, in full graphic glory. If you can't make the game feel D&D after designing your very own adventure for it, then you aren't trying very hard. Hats off to some of the folks who've made amazing adventures already.
1) Skill check system (nicely implemented I might add)
2) Encounter/Daily powers (nicely implemented as well)
3) Forgotten Realms setting
4) Class kits right outta 4th Edition
5) Races right out for Forgotten Realms
6) Spells/Skills right out of 4th Ed.
7) Gods/Deities right out of 4th Ed. and Forgotten Realms
8) Monsters right out of the Monster Manuals
Haven't seen a game to date, be it single player going way back to Pools of Radiance on my Mac SE Circa 1987 to now that has done a better job at transposing a tabletop game to a video game.
Some people just have complainer ingrained in their DNA.
I think the real complaint here is that 4th edition sucks. And how can you not say the original NWN games were not translated as well as this game? If anything NWN is a literal translation strait from the table top version.
I think the real complaint here is that 4th edition sucks. And how can you not say the original NWN games were not translated as well as this game? If anything NWN is a literal translation strait from the table top version.
I agree... I play in a 4th edition tabletop campaign once a week and most of us agree we miss the days of 2nd edition. We are even debating running a 2nd edition campaign after this one.
I think the real complaint here is that 4th edition sucks. And how can you not say the original NWN games were not translated as well as this game? If anything NWN is a literal translation strait from the table top version.
This is not good for WoTC. They wanted this game to be a flagship for the 4.0 ruleset. This game was to inspire D&D players to rush out and buy up the 4th edition rule set and revive the D&D pen and paper game. They were counting on a big cash flow to come in when this game launched.
Instead we have a lot of push back. D&D players not happy and not wanting much to do with that ruleset. Good thing this game does not rely only upon D&D players to find its player base. Otherwise it would dry up and blow away. No there are enough mmo players that are sick of other mmo's to come here and find what they want to keep this game going for a long time. Some D&D players will like this as well in spite of the rule set.
This is not good for WoTC. They wanted this game to be a flagship for the 4.0 ruleset. This game was to inspire D&D players to rush out and buy up the 4th edition rule set and revive the D&D pen and paper game. They were counting on a big cash flow to come in when this game launched.
Instead we have a lot of push back. D&D players not happy and not wanting much to do with that ruleset. Good thing this game does not rely only upon D&D players to find its player base. Otherwise it would dry up and blow away. No there are enough mmo players that are sick of other mmo's to come here and find what they want to keep this game going for a long time. Some D&D players will like this as well in spite of the rule set.
Wizards of the Coast has always been the most horribly managed entity ever. They are so greedy with licensing and everything. Just look back at the history of D&D and how it evolved into WoTC and how legends like Gygax got the shaft.
Did you know that Blizzard originally wanted an MMO based on D&D and ended up going with Warcraft. WotC was being too greedy so Blizzard went a different direction.. Just think of the revenue WoTC lost in that brain blunder.... Think of all the books and merchandise sales that game would have gleaned them.
I'm sure they got much less greedy and Neverwinter just might be here now because of it.
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cigaranMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
This is not good for WoTC. They wanted this game to be a flagship for the 4.0 ruleset. This game was to inspire D&D players to rush out and buy up the 4th edition rule set and revive the D&D pen and paper game. They were counting on a big cash flow to come in when this game launched.
If that's the case, then they're a few years late to their own party... With D&D Next (5th edition) well in to development, bringing in a ton of new people in the hopes that they'll latch on to an edition that's on it's way out seems like a huge waste.
4th edition is to D&D as The Spirits Within is to Final Fantasy.
Account retired August 22, 2013. May Perfect World choke on the exploited Nightmare mounts.
I'm starting to take another issue with this game besides agonizing the loss of exp due to server crashes.
[delete long rant, insert summary]
It is nothing like D&D 4th edition when it comes to the mechanics, you don't have 1000 hp at level 1 in 4e, nor do you recharge daily powers by taking damage, and it's actually turn-based and kind of tedious. 4e has WAY more options for customization than this game though, and allows for a lot more freedom.
Anyway, I give up on anyone helping me with this error, so I'm going to try some Forge missions, and see if that revives my interest in playing this.
Wizards of the Coast has always been the most horribly managed entity ever. They are so greedy with licensing and everything. Just look back at the history of D&D and how it evolved into WoTC and how legends like Gygax got the shaft.
Did you know that Blizzard originally wanted an MMO based on D&D and ended up going with Warcraft. WotC was being too greedy so Blizzard went a different direction.. Just think of the revenue WoTC lost in that brain blunder.... Think of all the books and merchandise that game would have brought them in.
I'm sure they got much less greedy and Neverwinter just might be here now because of it.
No WoTC are still that greedy. Just ask the guys that are trying to make BG3. They want to use the 2nd edition rules but WoTC is making it impossible to do so.
No WoTC are still that greedy. Just ask the guys that are trying to make BG3. They want to use the 2nd edition rules but WoTC is making it impossible to do so.
Sweet, had no idea a BG3 was in the works... Hopefully their greed won't ruin it.
Well there's no pointy wizard hat.
It ain't D&D without the pointy wizard hat.
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keterysMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
Neverwinter is not like 4th edition. You can't blame its failings on 4th edition, nor the other way around. Also, WotC's clearly not counting on it to be a flagship for the system since they stopped supporting the edition before this game came out.
And Blizzard went to Games Workshop for the Warhammer system before making Warcraft: Orcs and Humans, ages before the MMO, which was always going to use their own intellectual property.
Why folks would want to have obvious mistakes in their random complaints about a game they don't play influencing a game they could be playing, and companies that have little to do with the discussion at hand, I have no idea, but how glaringly awful people's information is kinda painful.
Anyhow, the game has a lot of work to do in terms of character customization. I'm not sure if they plan to introduce new weapon skins and implements at some point, but it certainly would be nice, even if it's just for appearance and no statistic difference. Also, missing classes like ranger and warlock will help with diversity.
I'd love to see less force feeding on the power points side, since it's got an awful lot of illusion of choice and required mis-spending of points depending on what you're going for. It also precludes easily adding more options later, if they ever decide that maybe they should add fireball or similar.
Guess we'll see - wouldn't surprise me if the game looks pretty different a few months after beta ends, whenever that ends.
The D&D is wherever you want to find it. D&D is a wholly different experience based on your playgroup, so video game could exactly replicate what you find with your group. Try the foundry; that gives a user created experience that gets closer.
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But, as others have said, the Foundry is where the real D&D is. This weekend I played the Foundry "module" 'B2: Keep on the Borderlands'!! It was awesome to see the first D&D adventure I experienced "brought to life" and playing out before me.
I expect there are many great adventures to come from our fellow players.
That is the only reason I am still here, to see if I can get my DM on...I am pretty sure I wont be able to, but until I get the chance to check it out......
But, having played all but 4th edition, I can tell you, that each one of them, while slightly different, still felt like DnD, and were'nt all that discernable from each other rules wise. Sure there was some things that were radically different...THAC0 ....1 out of D100 for Psy powers.
You know why I havent played 4th edition. Cause the gaming shop I went to for years told me not to bother, and when the hard core DnD guys dont like it, I knew a purist such as myself would be in for a sad disappointment and from what I have read since that time, I dont regret it all.
I finally start tinkering with the Foundry (that is my personal draw too) I can start create a whole campaign or just a mission. Since it is F2P I can get my gaming group to play with me. (at least custom missions)
there are A LOT of talented people out there (WAY more talent than me) who are making some really awesome missions/campaign.
Please review my campaign and I'll return the favor.
You know...I am wondering....are those old modules still under copyright and will there be some cease and desist letters for creating content in NW...cause you can be reimbursed with AD which translates in Zen which is considered money which means you are being compensated for anothers IP. ......*shrugs* I aint no lawyer, it just crossed my mind when I spoke with that guy a week or two back.
DND Next is really good. Ive been playing since the first books and next so far is the closest to that.
I really hate the fact that you are stuck with certain weapons in this game. Hopefully that changes when more classes are added. A rogue should be able to carry a club, a dagger, a short sword etc. The different weapons make it fun.
That's an interesting point but since you are not getting actual money it might not matter.
And to the people that seem to think this game is some kind of representation of 4e rules, it isn't at all. It's a pretty decent MMO, but so far to me plays pretty much like most other MMOs out there. The setting is DnD awesomeness, but the actual game-play is not representative of any version of the DnD rulesets.
WoTC owns D&D title.
Please review my campaign and I'll return the favor.
1) Skill check system (nicely implemented I might add)
2) Encounter/Daily powers (nicely implemented as well)
3) Forgotten Realms setting
4) Class kits right outta 4th Edition
5) Races right out for Forgotten Realms
6) Spells/Skills right out of 4th Ed.
7) Gods/Deities right out of 4th Ed. and Forgotten Realms
8) Monsters right out of the Monster Manuals
Haven't seen a game to date, be it single player going way back to Pools of Radiance on my Mac SE Circa 1987 to now that has done a better job at transposing a tabletop game to a video game.
Some people just have complainer ingrained in their DNA.
Yep. I played Sojourn.. and then Toril after the split. Some of the devs from those MUDs had published actual TSR modules and books.... and even that game resembled nothing like the tabletop game. It had the names of places, gods, classes, and mobs but that was about it.
Really miss the days of MUDs... those that never played back in those days won't ever understand how a text adventure could be so fun but some of my best online experiences were back in the days of MUDs. Things were so social and pleasant online in those days... then came the warcraft generation.
If you want a "true" D&D game, check out Turbine's version. It's much closer to 3.5 rules, but it still has its share of problems.
God DDO was horrible, bad, terribad. I lasted 2 hours in that garbage of a game. Running around a dungeon destroying crates and boxes for gold. Running the same dungeons 500 times. An interface like looked like openlook circa 1985 SunOS. Equipment skins that looked atrocious.
Horrible. That game is on my all time top 10 biggest disappointments.
Yes, those would be the problems I mentioned. However, it's still pretty close to D&D with rolls to hit, saves, traps that kill, etc.
You are quite mistaken. I have played since Basic, through 2nd, 3rd and 3.5. This is classic Cryptic Studios buying intellectual property, then throwing out the game systems that it is founded on. They did the EXACT same thing with Champions Online, buying outright the IP and then abandoning the game it is founded on.
This game has, in no particular order, no variation in controls to let you optimize for your style of game play, no ability to make a character that is unique to you, no skill allocation and expects the community to GIVE it most of the content it runs while at the same time DEMANDING that property rights be maintained on their part.
There have been D&D games throughout the history of computer gaming, and, aside from graphics, this is the worst I have seen in the last fifteen years. A blatant impersonation of, and attempt to exploit, an earlier sucessful game while providing none of the value that caused the first and second games to thrive.
So yes, 4th Edition bears only passing resemblance to previous editions of the rule set, which is why this game has no resemblance to earlier Dungeons and Dragons based games (even DDO).
<digression>
Of course my dislike for the 4th Edition rules is tempered by my absolute hatred at what was done to the Forgotten Realms to bring it "into line" with 4th Edition. It took me a long time to accept... oh who am I kidding? I haven't accepted it. In pencil and paper, I have stayed staunchly in the pre-spellplague Realms. But time has allowed me to be slightly more detached about, which is how I'm able to play Neverwinter at all. I just consider it a "what if".</digression>
There is close to nothing that makes this game a Dungeons and Dragons product other then name.
That does not mean it is poorly made or is trashworthy.
So far I have enjoyed the game but I would pay 100 dollars for a magic missile or fireball..maybe a melfs acid arrow as well.
I would pay a larger sum for a DnD game based off of the 2nd Edition rules or thereabouts. In My opinion that was the "GOOD OLE DAYS" of Dungeons and Dragons. No Disrespect to younging who know very little other then Lizards of the Coast as daddy Gygax.
That being said i am playing the game and wasting away a few hours and have enjoyed myself...I wont over analyze it because that will cause me to 2nd guess the game too much.
Unfortunately, (or fortunately if you enjoy it) this is what D&D has become. The 4th edition of the game initially featured a very dumbed down system compared to what previous additions had been. Right or wrong, it was done with the intention of drawing in more players specifically new players who and they wanted the barrier to entry to be as low as possible. Sadly that meant a lot of options went out the window or became so trivialized that they no longer really mattered.
I agree though, there does need to be more flexibility offered as time goes on. Hopefully we'll see that in future updates to the game.
Account retired August 22, 2013. May Perfect World choke on the exploited Nightmare mounts.
Video games have different needs than tabletop. The game works like how Cryptic wanted it work, not like how WotC wanted it work, nor how tabletop can or should work. Give it a try, decide whether you like it based on its own merits. Don't go in with a preconception - especially not one 5 - 20 years old - without looking at the actual description and documentation of the character you're making.
Also, don't be surprised if you can't do everything you'd expect to be able to do at 1st level. You're in tutorial mode. If you're 10th and you haven't found a way for a cleric to heal, wizard to wiz, or rogue to sneak, then you've got more room to complain. Or haven't looked too closely at your bars.
Finally - check out Foundry. It's the single greatest asset this game has to offer. It lets you be a Dungeon Master to thousands of people, in full graphic glory. If you can't make the game feel D&D after designing your very own adventure for it, then you aren't trying very hard. Hats off to some of the folks who've made amazing adventures already.
I think the real complaint here is that 4th edition sucks. And how can you not say the original NWN games were not translated as well as this game? If anything NWN is a literal translation strait from the table top version.
I agree... I play in a 4th edition tabletop campaign once a week and most of us agree we miss the days of 2nd edition. We are even debating running a 2nd edition campaign after this one.
This is not good for WoTC. They wanted this game to be a flagship for the 4.0 ruleset. This game was to inspire D&D players to rush out and buy up the 4th edition rule set and revive the D&D pen and paper game. They were counting on a big cash flow to come in when this game launched.
Instead we have a lot of push back. D&D players not happy and not wanting much to do with that ruleset. Good thing this game does not rely only upon D&D players to find its player base. Otherwise it would dry up and blow away. No there are enough mmo players that are sick of other mmo's to come here and find what they want to keep this game going for a long time. Some D&D players will like this as well in spite of the rule set.
Wizards of the Coast has always been the most horribly managed entity ever. They are so greedy with licensing and everything. Just look back at the history of D&D and how it evolved into WoTC and how legends like Gygax got the shaft.
Did you know that Blizzard originally wanted an MMO based on D&D and ended up going with Warcraft. WotC was being too greedy so Blizzard went a different direction.. Just think of the revenue WoTC lost in that brain blunder.... Think of all the books and merchandise sales that game would have gleaned them.
I'm sure they got much less greedy and Neverwinter just might be here now because of it.
If that's the case, then they're a few years late to their own party... With D&D Next (5th edition) well in to development, bringing in a ton of new people in the hopes that they'll latch on to an edition that's on it's way out seems like a huge waste.
Account retired August 22, 2013. May Perfect World choke on the exploited Nightmare mounts.
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It is nothing like D&D 4th edition when it comes to the mechanics, you don't have 1000 hp at level 1 in 4e, nor do you recharge daily powers by taking damage, and it's actually turn-based and kind of tedious. 4e has WAY more options for customization than this game though, and allows for a lot more freedom.
Anyway, I give up on anyone helping me with this error, so I'm going to try some Forge missions, and see if that revives my interest in playing this.
No WoTC are still that greedy. Just ask the guys that are trying to make BG3. They want to use the 2nd edition rules but WoTC is making it impossible to do so.
Sweet, had no idea a BG3 was in the works... Hopefully their greed won't ruin it.
It ain't D&D without the pointy wizard hat.
And Blizzard went to Games Workshop for the Warhammer system before making Warcraft: Orcs and Humans, ages before the MMO, which was always going to use their own intellectual property.
Why folks would want to have obvious mistakes in their random complaints about a game they don't play influencing a game they could be playing, and companies that have little to do with the discussion at hand, I have no idea, but how glaringly awful people's information is kinda painful.
Anyhow, the game has a lot of work to do in terms of character customization. I'm not sure if they plan to introduce new weapon skins and implements at some point, but it certainly would be nice, even if it's just for appearance and no statistic difference. Also, missing classes like ranger and warlock will help with diversity.
I'd love to see less force feeding on the power points side, since it's got an awful lot of illusion of choice and required mis-spending of points depending on what you're going for. It also precludes easily adding more options later, if they ever decide that maybe they should add fireball or similar.
Guess we'll see - wouldn't surprise me if the game looks pretty different a few months after beta ends, whenever that ends.