vylent2Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
Dont use a GWF as an example/comparison for anything. They're obviously jacked up atm and everyone pretty much agrees on that. Atleast from what ive been seeing.
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layol692k7Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
CW would still stomp you. Honestly, GWF needs a buff. Don't start whining for other classes to be nerfed because yours is underpowered. If anything, they need to add 200% hp to PvP. Everything dies too fast.
all classes are jacked up atm yes trickster rogues need a nerf! Thier tactics should be run tap the target a few times and not for 20 plus k a hit either. The way it is now tricksters are hitting like a brutal scoundrel rogue if you bother to read any of the offical D&D guides about rogues They shoould not have a daily quest that increases thier damage at all
Rogue don't need a nerf, I like rogue in a party dungeon cause they take down those l33ts rly fast while I take adds. Other underpowered classes need a buff, like gwf\gf.
Carnage TR Dragon shard - retired? hell yea it's retired along with Nevewinter
Seze - Rogue - Necropolis - RIFT
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layol692k7Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Rogue don't need a nerf, I like rogue in a party dungeon cause they take down those l33ts rly fast while I take adds. Other underpowered classes need a buff, like gwf\gf.
Why so defensive on the subject it is just nerfing a daily quest that no one else has access to. it is anfair advantage that is put in the game by cryptic that quest is nothing to do with the class. as long as there is no balance there will be no competitive pvp such as arena or other rated system.
Yes, lets nerf the only 2 skills that TR has that can kill anyone and make them a squishy GWF without defence.
1. TR doesnt have any hardlock CC like CW, they cant stop enemies from moving
2. Throwing daggers have charges, after a couple of second they run out and cant cast them anymore.
3. TR has very few skills to close the gap between CW and themselves, once a CW starts cc:ing the TR, he has no chance of getting to the CW
4. At lvl 60, GWF has some very powerful skills that makes them control immune and takes almost no damage, its almost 50/50 of who wins between a good GWF and a good TR in 1v1
6. GF has some very annoying knockbacks and ive also been hit for 20k damage from GF
7. TR has no knockbacks, so they cant fight DC in Astral Shields, again Smoke Bomb doesnt stop the enemy from moving.
8. CW Ice Knife doesnt require enemy to be lower health to be effective, and it hits from longer range.
Its liek that in all mmos, Scissors wont be satisfied until Stone cant kill them, then they think their balanced
I've just started playing this game a few days ago. I went CW and Rogue, both seem very powerful, BUT as I quest I get Fighters jumping into my fights sometimes I'm dieing and they save me and others its just a kill for them.
That being said, I play for fun, and to see if this game is like D&D of old (played since 1976) and I have watch both classes of fighters quest below lvl 15 and they make it look very easy to kill the mobs......not so much for me.
Bottom line is, so far this game is fun, makes u think, and I always have to have a plan to escape (run away run away waving arms madly"not an option":rolleyes:) someday I hope to be a high lvl player like all of you, but untill then I'll just have fun.
Cheers
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cloudspiderMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
Here's a solution.
Just run away from a TR.
Problem solved
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celestiangc22Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 8Arc User
edited May 2013
Wow, seems PVP is already going to ruin one class.
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layol692k7Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
give me an a quest that allows 1 shots and see how many people gripe about the only reason that so many paople are against tr nerf is because they play one and do not want to have to work as hard as another class does
I repeat once again a trickster rogue should not be able to hit as hard as brutal scoundrel rogue period if they are alowed to then their survivabilty needs a nerf for the simple fact that brutal scoundrel rogue has very little survivability
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code004Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 9Arc User
edited May 2013
After playing GWF to 60, and Rogue to 60. I can tell you, with all honesty, this class is completely broken compared to GWF, at least. I'm not being in favor of other classes, it's just the way it is. Especially in PvP, the advantage is insane. You can be running from someone who has 100% hp, and you have 10% hp, wait for cooldowns, turn around and kill him, because of the insane damage, that no class should have in PvP. As for the PvE part, you can pretty much one-shot any mob in solo pve content, it's dumb, and it made the game very boring for me, when leveling a rogue.
I mean, every game has a faceroll class at one point, but this goes even beyond that.
It always made more sense to me that rogue has lower damage, but much, much faster attack rate than other classes, so that over-time, he does same amount of damage as other damage dealers, or even more.
When I picked my first class, I picked a GWF first, because I expected big numbers from a class that uses a giant, 2h weapon. It makes sense? WRONG. You don't even do half the damage that Rogue does on 1 target. The only way to do great amount of damage, and it's a trick, I don't even consider it a real damage, is to turn on stomp (AoE pulsing damage) in dungeon, when there's like, 298423789 monsters around, and that's how you can get close to rogue's damage on the damage meter in dungeons. However, this doesn't work in PvP.
As a fellow rogue player to others, stop acting like you don't know what everyone's complaining about, you know very well that rogues do way more damage than they should. You think that you have "skill" in playing this game, and that's why you're doing good with a rogue? NO, it's same for me, it's same for you, it's same for everyone who is playing this class at the moment, faceroll dumb class, that anyone can pick up and own in every aspect of the game with it, with just a little getting used to, which is gained through the leveling process.
Let them balance the game, so that we can actually have classes that take at least some skill to play.
code004Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 9Arc User
edited May 2013
You mean "The great weapon fighter is an unstoppable force of DAMAGE and steel"? Did you even bring that up? It just proves my point further.
The damage part is a complete lie in that class description. Similar description is there for rogue, as well, talking about being a damage dealer, only for rogue, it's actually true.
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layol692k7Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
After playing GWF to 60, and Rogue to 60. I can tell you, with all honesty, this class is completely broken compared to GWF, at least. I'm not being in favor of other classes, it's just the way it is. Especially in PvP, the advantage is insane. You can be running from someone who has 100% hp, and you have 10% hp, wait for cooldowns, turn around and kill him, because of the insane damage, that no class should have in PvP. As for the PvE part, you can pretty much one-shot any mob in solo pve content, it's dumb, and it made the game very boring for me, when leveling a rogue.
I mean, every game has a faceroll class at one point, but this goes even beyond that.
It always made more sense to me that rogue has lower damage, but much, much faster attack rate than other classes, so that over-time, he does same amount of damage as other damage dealers, or even more.
When I picked my first class, I picked a GWF first, because I expected big numbers from a class that uses a giant, 2h weapon. It makes sense? WRONG. You don't even do half the damage that Rogue does on 1 target. The only way to do great amount of damage, and it's a trick, I don't even consider it a real damage, is to turn on stomp (AoE pulsing damage) in dungeon, when there's like, 298423789 monsters around, and that's how you can get close to rogue's damage on the damage meter in dungeons. However, this doesn't work in PvP.
As a fellow rogue player to others, stop acting like you don't know what everyone's complaining about, you know very well that rogues do way more damage than they should. You think that you have "skill" in playing this game, and that's why you're doing good with a rogue? NO, it's same for me, it's same for you, it's same for everyone who is playing this class at the moment, faceroll dumb class, that anyone can pick up and own in every aspect of the game with it, with just a little getting used to, which is gained through the leveling process.
Let them balance the game, so that we can actually have classes that take at least some skill to play.
One word Amen!
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layol692k7Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
You mean "The great weapon fighter is an unstoppable force of DAMAGE and steel"? Did you even bring that up? It just proves my point further.
The damage part is a complete lie in that class description. Similar description is there for rogue, as well, talking about being a damage dealer, only for rogue, it's actually true.
You sir are dead wrong. you mean usless aoe damage the actual single target damage that is needed for pvp is not there
make a Tr and come back if you reach 60. stay solo all the time. then tell me it was a cakewalk. idiot
if someone needs a nerf its the cleric. his shield makes tanks useless. THIS ****ing shield is op not a one shotting DAILY from the TR which is ready every few minutes.
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code004Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 9Arc User
make a Tr and come back if you reach 60. stay solo all the time. then tell me it was a cakewalk. idiot
if someone needs a nerf its the cleric. his shield makes tanks useless. THIS ****ing shield is op not a one shotting DAILY from the TR which is ready every few minutes.
I leveled a rogue to 60. It was a cakewalk. Compared to GWF that I also leveled, leveling a rogue was a breeze. I was on top of the damage meter in dungeons without any effort at all. While with a GWF, I had to use every advantage I could find to get even close to rogue's damage (Rushing forward to AoE on group of monsters, before other party members arrive, saving Stomp daily for very large group of monsters...and so on). Let me remind you, GWF is also a damage dealer, at least according to the class description.
I want to be able to compete with my currently main class for the top damage, without having to do stuff like run in front of the group to get a head start on damage. In a dungeon where there is no large group of monsters, you can forget about coming on top with GWF, rogue will outdps both GWF and Mage by millions of damage, MILLIONS, even if you have better gear than him.
In a dungeon where there is no large group of monsters, you can forget about coming on top with GWF, rogue will outdps both GWF and Mage by millions of damage, MILLIONS, even if you have better gear than him.
dont be stupid. wa wa i want i want. what you want basically is to top a SINGLE DPS CLASS with a HEAL/AOE DPS HYBRID CLASS.
you sir, have no idea about gaming at all. go home.
not believing you the 60 TR. if you have done it, you would know that you have to go full out in every pull later on (50-60).
i just level my third rogue to 60, experimenting with base stats.
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steppenkatMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I leveled a rogue to 60. It was a cakewalk. Compared to GWF that I also leveled, leveling a rogue was a breeze. I was on top of the damage meter in dungeons without any effort at all. While with a GWF, I had to use every advantage I could find to get even close to rogue's damage (Rushing forward to AoE on group of monsters, before other party members arrive, saving Stomp daily for very large group of monsters...and so on). Let me remind you, GWF is also a damage dealer, at least according to the class description.
I want to be able to compete with my currently main class for the top damage, without having to do stuff like run in front of the group to get a head start on damage. In a dungeon where there is no large group of monsters, you can forget about coming on top with GWF, rogue will outdps both GWF and Mage by millions of damage, MILLIONS, even if you have better gear than him.
You don't need to compete with him, as he cannot do some things you can. Rogue sucks at waveclearing while doing that easily is what defines a good GWF. It doesn't matter if the TR does zillions of single target damage, the addwave whill chew him if you don't wipe it with your Slam + WMS + Punishing Charge combo.
Characters: - Titania Silverblade, the Iron Rose of Myth Drannor (Lvl 60 GWF, Destroyer) - Gwyneth, the Cowardly Cat Burglar Drowling (Lvl 60 TR, Saboteur) - Lady Rowanne Firehair, Heartwarder of Sune (Lvl 33 DC) - Satella, Sensate (LvL 44 CW, Renegade, Non-Active)
make a Tr and come back if you reach 60. stay solo all the time. then tell me it was a cakewalk. idiot
if someone needs a nerf its the cleric. his shield makes tanks useless. THIS ****ing shield is op not a one shotting DAILY from the TR which is ready every few minutes.
agreed clerics are mostly untouchable without cw targeting them
i destroy rogues (guardian fighter) the only prob with them is the 12 or so daggers being thrown though stealth that magically hit 2k crits through 4.5k def other than that there isnt anything wrong with them
After playing GWF to 60, and Rogue to 60. I can tell you, with all honesty, this class is completely broken compared to GWF, at least. I'm not being in favor of other classes, it's just the way it is. Especially in PvP, the advantage is insane. You can be running from someone who has 100% hp, and you have 10% hp, wait for cooldowns, turn around and kill him, because of the insane damage, that no class should have in PvP. As for the PvE part, you can pretty much one-shot any mob in solo pve content, it's dumb, and it made the game very boring for me, when leveling a rogue.
I mean, every game has a faceroll class at one point, but this goes even beyond that.
It always made more sense to me that rogue has lower damage, but much, much faster attack rate than other classes, so that over-time, he does same amount of damage as other damage dealers, or even more.
When I picked my first class, I picked a GWF first, because I expected big numbers from a class that uses a giant, 2h weapon. It makes sense? WRONG. You don't even do half the damage that Rogue does on 1 target. The only way to do great amount of damage, and it's a trick, I don't even consider it a real damage, is to turn on stomp (AoE pulsing damage) in dungeon, when there's like, 298423789 monsters around, and that's how you can get close to rogue's damage on the damage meter in dungeons. However, this doesn't work in PvP.
As a fellow rogue player to others, stop acting like you don't know what everyone's complaining about, you know very well that rogues do way more damage than they should. You think that you have "skill" in playing this game, and that's why you're doing good with a rogue? NO, it's same for me, it's same for you, it's same for everyone who is playing this class at the moment, faceroll dumb class, that anyone can pick up and own in every aspect of the game with it, with just a little getting used to, which is gained through the leveling process.
Let them balance the game, so that we can actually have classes that take at least some skill to play.
Everyone keeps focusing on the kills in pvp and the most damage dealt in pve.
And yet they forget that a TR on his own is a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> waste of space.
It cannot tank that much damage. It has to dodge (skills needed). It cannot aoe it has to focus a target and not let it out of it's sight (skill needed). It cannot CC more then one target unless everyone is in an orgy pile (skill needed).
So you all forget that the team behind the TR is just as overpowered as the team behind it.
I bet in the pvp instances where people get <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. The CW is holding him and then the TR comes along and assists.
Or the TR focuses the Healer and no-one bothers to help.
Or they try to 1v1 a TR which unless you are a CW or TR. There's no point in trying because Paper doesn't beat scissors.
And i can bet my friggin bottom dollar that if they did nerf TR any more then they already did, then people would QQ about lack of dps.
The Best PVP Guild on Dragon/Neverwinter: YoloOldSkoolSwagLoveNeverGingersLuvDupStep even if it's just one of us, you might as well just afk.
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americanjediMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
Actually I think the rogues and GWP are pretty balanced in pvp. Its win some lose some. Control Wizards give my rogue problems but thats expected (getting kited around the map). You crybabies prove that there is not a problem with classes (this game is very well balanced imo) but there is problem with lag behind your keyboard.
In other words: you, not your class, sucks
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Coming Soon To A Forsaken World Near You Erm... Well Hopefully Soon
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steelpulseMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
rogue received a lot of nerf, lurker's assault has had it's duration SEVERELY nerfed and damage nerfed too. stealth no longer grants +25% damage (not a small nerf at all). lashing blade from stealth now is a guaranteed crit insated of +50% damage. and other stuff.
the rogue is a very early bloomer making the first part of the game trivial but the game eventually catches up to them. try playing a rogue from 50 to 60 and see if it is still immortal. suddendly enemies are too tough to go down in 1 stealth and they WILL kill you in a matter of seconds outside stealth.
rogue has been nerfed enough, gwf has been nerfed too much (needs to get a bit more damage now imho) and cleric kinda sucks. power up gwf and cleric and stop hating the rogue.
remember rogues outside stealth has no capacity to take a hit at all (yeah i played rogue a lot, it just dies if it doesn't avoid being hit entirely), very limited control capabilities and cannot perform any kind of support or AoE damage. single target dps and gimmick damage avoidance is what they do and they shouldn't stop being able to do it.
Agreed 100%
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layol692k7Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Maybe enemies are finally starting to hit hard enough where I noticed it, or did we get ninja nerfed?
Because I thought being hit while in stealth dropped your stealth bar, meaning you'll be out in the open that much sooner, sure. But when not in stealth, getting hit should just stop the bar from regenerating, right? Not make it go down to boot?
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unoqualunqueMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 1Arc User
edited July 2013
I agree that they're pretty much OP. Not about the damage output that is in line with all the other classes but with the fact they can attack while cloaked without revealing their position. Make them forcefully remove cloak during attacks (all) and put a cooldown of let's say 1-2 secs and they'll be fine
Comments
all classes are jacked up atm yes trickster rogues need a nerf! Thier tactics should be run tap the target a few times and not for 20 plus k a hit either. The way it is now tricksters are hitting like a brutal scoundrel rogue if you bother to read any of the offical D&D guides about rogues They shoould not have a daily quest that increases thier damage at all
Seze - Rogue - Necropolis -
Why so defensive on the subject it is just nerfing a daily quest that no one else has access to. it is anfair advantage that is put in the game by cryptic that quest is nothing to do with the class. as long as there is no balance there will be no competitive pvp such as arena or other rated system.
1. TR doesnt have any hardlock CC like CW, they cant stop enemies from moving
2. Throwing daggers have charges, after a couple of second they run out and cant cast them anymore.
3. TR has very few skills to close the gap between CW and themselves, once a CW starts cc:ing the TR, he has no chance of getting to the CW
4. At lvl 60, GWF has some very powerful skills that makes them control immune and takes almost no damage, its almost 50/50 of who wins between a good GWF and a good TR in 1v1
6. GF has some very annoying knockbacks and ive also been hit for 20k damage from GF
7. TR has no knockbacks, so they cant fight DC in Astral Shields, again Smoke Bomb doesnt stop the enemy from moving.
8. CW Ice Knife doesnt require enemy to be lower health to be effective, and it hits from longer range.
Its liek that in all mmos, Scissors wont be satisfied until Stone cant kill them, then they think their balanced
That being said, I play for fun, and to see if this game is like D&D of old (played since 1976) and I have watch both classes of fighters quest below lvl 15 and they make it look very easy to kill the mobs......not so much for me.
Bottom line is, so far this game is fun, makes u think, and I always have to have a plan to escape (run away run away waving arms madly"not an option":rolleyes:) someday I hope to be a high lvl player like all of you, but untill then I'll just have fun.
Cheers
Just run away from a TR.
Problem solved
I repeat once again a trickster rogue should not be able to hit as hard as brutal scoundrel rogue period if they are alowed to then their survivabilty needs a nerf for the simple fact that brutal scoundrel rogue has very little survivability
I mean, every game has a faceroll class at one point, but this goes even beyond that.
It always made more sense to me that rogue has lower damage, but much, much faster attack rate than other classes, so that over-time, he does same amount of damage as other damage dealers, or even more.
When I picked my first class, I picked a GWF first, because I expected big numbers from a class that uses a giant, 2h weapon. It makes sense? WRONG. You don't even do half the damage that Rogue does on 1 target. The only way to do great amount of damage, and it's a trick, I don't even consider it a real damage, is to turn on stomp (AoE pulsing damage) in dungeon, when there's like, 298423789 monsters around, and that's how you can get close to rogue's damage on the damage meter in dungeons. However, this doesn't work in PvP.
As a fellow rogue player to others, stop acting like you don't know what everyone's complaining about, you know very well that rogues do way more damage than they should. You think that you have "skill" in playing this game, and that's why you're doing good with a rogue? NO, it's same for me, it's same for you, it's same for everyone who is playing this class at the moment, faceroll dumb class, that anyone can pick up and own in every aspect of the game with it, with just a little getting used to, which is gained through the leveling process.
Let them balance the game, so that we can actually have classes that take at least some skill to play.
The damage part is a complete lie in that class description. Similar description is there for rogue, as well, talking about being a damage dealer, only for rogue, it's actually true.
One word Amen!
You sir are dead wrong. you mean usless aoe damage the actual single target damage that is needed for pvp is not there
You didn't understand that right. I am saying that the Aoe damage is useless, and that the class description is a lie.
if someone needs a nerf its the cleric. his shield makes tanks useless. THIS ****ing shield is op not a one shotting DAILY from the TR which is ready every few minutes.
I leveled a rogue to 60. It was a cakewalk. Compared to GWF that I also leveled, leveling a rogue was a breeze. I was on top of the damage meter in dungeons without any effort at all. While with a GWF, I had to use every advantage I could find to get even close to rogue's damage (Rushing forward to AoE on group of monsters, before other party members arrive, saving Stomp daily for very large group of monsters...and so on). Let me remind you, GWF is also a damage dealer, at least according to the class description.
I want to be able to compete with my currently main class for the top damage, without having to do stuff like run in front of the group to get a head start on damage. In a dungeon where there is no large group of monsters, you can forget about coming on top with GWF, rogue will outdps both GWF and Mage by millions of damage, MILLIONS, even if you have better gear than him.
dont be stupid. wa wa i want i want. what you want basically is to top a SINGLE DPS CLASS with a HEAL/AOE DPS HYBRID CLASS.
you sir, have no idea about gaming at all. go home.
not believing you the 60 TR. if you have done it, you would know that you have to go full out in every pull later on (50-60).
i just level my third rogue to 60, experimenting with base stats.
You don't need to compete with him, as he cannot do some things you can. Rogue sucks at waveclearing while doing that easily is what defines a good GWF. It doesn't matter if the TR does zillions of single target damage, the addwave whill chew him if you don't wipe it with your Slam + WMS + Punishing Charge combo.
- Titania Silverblade, the Iron Rose of Myth Drannor (Lvl 60 GWF, Destroyer)
- Gwyneth, the Cowardly Cat Burglar Drowling (Lvl 60 TR, Saboteur)
- Lady Rowanne Firehair, Heartwarder of Sune (Lvl 33 DC)
- Satella, Sensate (LvL 44 CW, Renegade, Non-Active)
Check Steppenkat's Foundry Quest Reviews!
agreed clerics are mostly untouchable without cw targeting them
challenge accepted :-)
Everyone keeps focusing on the kills in pvp and the most damage dealt in pve.
And yet they forget that a TR on his own is a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> waste of space.
It cannot tank that much damage. It has to dodge (skills needed). It cannot aoe it has to focus a target and not let it out of it's sight (skill needed). It cannot CC more then one target unless everyone is in an orgy pile (skill needed).
So you all forget that the team behind the TR is just as overpowered as the team behind it.
I bet in the pvp instances where people get <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. The CW is holding him and then the TR comes along and assists.
Or the TR focuses the Healer and no-one bothers to help.
Or they try to 1v1 a TR which unless you are a CW or TR. There's no point in trying because Paper doesn't beat scissors.
And i can bet my friggin bottom dollar that if they did nerf TR any more then they already did, then people would QQ about lack of dps.
In other words: you, not your class, sucks
Coming Soon To A Forsaken World Near You
Erm... Well Hopefully Soon
Agreed 100%
Because I thought being hit while in stealth dropped your stealth bar, meaning you'll be out in the open that much sooner, sure. But when not in stealth, getting hit should just stop the bar from regenerating, right? Not make it go down to boot?