they never said ranger will be in at launch. It is in the works.
You are ready to play a bugged bad ranger instead of it being done right a few months after launch? Then no, I can't agree with you. They should not let impatience destroy the game. That in itself says a lot about cryptic, all good things.
Yup I sugjest to show Cryptic the error of their ways people go roll a ranger in DDO.
DDO rangers have been ruined by massive nerfing in the name of balance. Now the only way to do real damage with a ranger in ddo is to go melee and you have no skills to support that build except the basic melee skills every class gets like cleave, trip, and sunder. Missle rangers had embues that they put in their arrows and the ability to conjure returning arrows which was all they could do. their damage is laughable because it takes them almost 12 shots that connect to do the same damage as 1 druid attack or 2 artificer attacks. the spells they got too are worthless because they are low level spells that you get up to level 10 and they never upgrade or become stronger so most things over level 10 don't even show damage when you use them. DDO knows that the ranger class is broken, they don't care... why? because they now have artifciers and druids and say go play one of those if you want to play a ranged class. Its the whole reason I left DDO they killed my favorite class to play in the name of "balance" and never fixed him to bring the balance back.
Oh Atari how I miss you!
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
We've known about this for a while, we just haven't been able to find the quote by a developer that was posted some time ago. They are still working internally on the Ranger and are apparently holding off on releasing it until after game release. Gillrmn, Truth (or Ambi?) and I have been trying to clear this confusion up, but with the wonky search being bugged, none of us can find it and the devs haven't had a chance to find it for us or comment on it, or aren't able to for NDA reasons.
Bottom line, last we knew on these forums, they were still planning on having a Ranger at some point.
DDO rangers have been ruined by massive nerfing in the name of balance. Now the only way to do real damage with a ranger in ddo is to go melee and you have no skills to support that build except the basic melee skills every class gets like cleave, trip, and sunder. Missle rangers had embues that they put in their arrows and the ability to conjure returning arrows which was all they could do. their damage is laughable because it takes them almost 12 shots that connect to do the same damage as 1 druid attack or 2 artificer attacks. the spells they got too are worthless because they are low level spells that you get up to level 10 and they never upgrade or become stronger so most things over level 10 don't even show damage when you use them. DDO knows that the ranger class is broken, they don't care... why? because they now have artifciers and druids and say go play one of those if you want to play a ranged class. Its the whole reason I left DDO they killed my favorite class to play in the name of "balance" and never fixed him to bring the balance back.
However the point is to show Cryptic we want Rangers at launch. It was originaly stated we would have them at launch but in true Cryptic style they wont be. That was one of the issues they had with STO. Failure to back-up their claims. http://ve3d.ign.com/articles/interviews/56890/Neverwinter-Interview-with-Jack-Emmert
VE: What are the five classes that you're starting out with?
Jack Emmert: Fighter, Wizard, Cleric, Ranger, Rogue.
We've known about this for a while, we just haven't been able to find the quote by a developer that was posted some time ago. They are still working internally on the Ranger and are apparently holding off on releasing it until after game release. Gillrmn, Truth (or Ambi?) and I have been trying to clear this confusion up, but with the wonky search being bugged, none of us can find it and the devs haven't had a chance to find it for us or comment on it, or aren't able to for NDA reasons.
Bottom line, last we knew on these forums, they were still planning on having a Ranger at some point.
Search h2oratty. Don't listen to that source, check source for date first.
What is confusing is, which dev did say "archer ranger" is not but "melee ranger" is in works. I can bet my *censored* that I read it on the forums... or maybe somewhere I was not supposed to know of... I am wondering.
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
However the point is to show Cryptic we want Rangers at launch. It was originaly stated we would have them at launch but in true Cryptic style they wont be. That was one of the issues they had with STO. Failure to back-up their claims. http://ve3d.ign.com/articles/interviews/56890/Neverwinter-Interview-with-Jack-Emmert
VE: What are the five classes that you're starting out with?
Jack Emmert: Fighter, Wizard, Cleric, Ranger, Rogue.
Also, I'd like to point out in relation to Gillrmn's comment on your out-dated article, your resentment is misplaced for everything Cryptic did back then was dictated by Atari. You should be blaming Atari for these false promises, not Cryptic. Regardless, Atari is out of the picture and now the proven Perfect World Entertainment is calling the shots, along with Wizards of the Coast themselves, in regards to Neverwinter Specifically.
really? Are you raising up an ancient undead and outdated source? And he also said this game will be Co-Op. Raise that too!
The date of the interveiw doesn't matter. Cryptic made claims they can't live up to thats what matters. Jack Emmert the last I saw was the head of Cryptic and if he says rangers are in at launch then they should be. His excuse for the issue with STO was they only had 18 months to do it. What's Cryptics excuse now?
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
The date of the interveiw doesn't matter. Cryptic made claims they can't live up to thats what matters. Jack Emmert the last I saw was the head of Cryptic and if he says rangers are in at launch then they should be. His excuse for the issue with STO was they only had 18 months to do it. What's Cryptics excuse now?
*cough* Atari & PWE
You seem to be confusing the Employee with the Boss. Cryptic is employed/owned by PWE now (used to be Atari), your blame is misplaced.
Also, I'd like to point out in relation to Gillrmn's comment on your out-dated article, your resentment is misplaced for everything Cryptic did back then was dictated by Atari. You should be blaming Atari for these false promises, not Cryptic. Regardless, Atari is out of the picture and now the proven Perfect World Entertainment is calling the shots, along with Wizards of the Coast themselves, in regards to Neverwinter Specifically.
Last I saw Jack was still the head of Cryptic so what is the excuse for no Ranger at launch? Why even develope the game if you can't/won't be faithfull to the exsisting game/lore? BTW I don't resent Cryptic but I do beleive they could and should do better then what they have.
Well I guess it's PWE blocking Ranger not the talent of the dev team.
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quorforgedMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
The date of the interveiw doesn't matter. Cryptic made claims they can't live up to thats what matters. Jack Emmert the last I saw was the head of Cryptic and if he says rangers are in at launch then they should be. His excuse for the issue with STO was they only had 18 months to do it. What's Cryptics excuse now?
This is why they have to be so stingy with information. Until release, everything is open to change. Telling us things before release is not a promise. Especially not things from an interview over 2 years old, from before the fundamental nature of the game changed from co-op RPG to MMORPG.
Last I saw Jack was still the head of Cryptic so what is the excuse for no Ranger at launch? Why even develope the game if you can't/won't be faithfull to the exsisting game/lore? BTW I don't resent Cryptic but I do beleive they could and should do better then what they have.
Launching with the truly core classes (Fighter, Rogue, Cleric, Wizard) is faithful to the existing game/lore. Would more classes be nice? Sure. More stuff is always nice. But there's only so much they can do for launch, and I don't see any reason why Ranger should be prioritized over Paladin, Warlock, Warlord, Druid, Bard, or Sorcerer.
The date of the interveiw doesn't matter. Cryptic made claims they can't live up to thats what matters. Jack Emmert the last I saw was the head of Cryptic and if he says rangers are in at launch then they should be. His excuse for the issue with STO was they only had 18 months to do it. What's Cryptics excuse now?
Then you missed your time to criticize them by one+ years. They gave the statement later that due to it being MMO they were facing some challanges with ranger class.
They only confirmed three classes later - Guardian Fighter, COntrol Wizzy and Trickster Rogue.
They didn't even confirm cleric till later.
About ranger they said, "no comments"
h2oratty was gracious to let us know (cause he is a good spy!) that it is in the works.
If you actually like ranger class then you should have been following this, or at least kept an eye on truth's FAQ. I am of the view that you are just criticizing cryptic for the sake of criticizing them.
Full one year ago, truth's FAQ stated that three classes have been confirmed (ranger was not in them) and cleric may be there at launch. That was based on updated official sources. It has only changed w.r.t. cleric after that.
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jim1771Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
This is why they have to be so stingy with information. Until release, everything is open to change. Telling us things before release is not a promise. Especially not things from an interview over 2 years old, from before the fundamental nature of the game changed from co-op RPG to MMORPG.
Launching with the truly core classes (Fighter, Rogue, Cleric, Wizard) is faithful to the existing game/lore. Would more classes be nice? Sure. More stuff is always nice. But there's only so much they can do for launch, and I don't see any reason why Ranger should be prioritized over Paladin, Warlock, Warlord, Druid, Bard, or Sorcerer.
Now the question is what did they do dureing the time they had to develope the game. Because four classes shows a lack of development somewhere.
Also, I'd like to point out in relation to Gillrmn's comment on your out-dated article, your resentment is misplaced for everything Cryptic did back then was dictated by Atari. You should be blaming Atari for these false promises, not Cryptic. Regardless, Atari is out of the picture and now the proven Perfect World Entertainment is calling the shots, along with Wizards of the Coast themselves, in regards to Neverwinter Specifically.
this^
Perfect World is famous for dragging their feet and not doing much. If it comes down to it the game will be out for 3 years before rangers are added and that's as a big expansion you have to buy and rangers will be a paid subscription only class that you have to prepay for 1 year to unlock.
they cash cow all their games into non existance and put what should be normal game content as special added expansion content to make more money. I never liked how they run games even their own namesake Perfect World was pay to win run into the ground cash cowed and lost most its crowd to other games. I was hoping since Cryptic has been working on this game BEFORE they become the property of PWE that this game would still be good like Champions Online was.
What I'm hearing tho scares me and makes me think this game will be just another victim of the assassination of Cryptic by its new owners.
... rangers will be a paid subscription only class that you have to prepay for 1 year to unlock...
Classes will not be paid ... everytime I had a cent...
*sigh*
I just give up. If you are not willing to look for facts first and revel in baseless assumptions and ill-informed rumors, go ahead with your fantasies.
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quorforgedMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Now the question is what did they do dureing the time they had to develope the game. Because four classes shows a lack of development somewhere.
There are 5 classes. There are two classes based on the PnP Fighter. And there are certainly others they have worked on, but don't expect to have ready for launch.
Anyway, to ask this suggests you have no idea what it takes to make an MMO. It's way more complicated than a co-op RPG.
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jim1771Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
There are 5 classes. There are two classes based on the PnP Fighter. And there are certainly others they have worked on, but don't expect to have ready for launch.
Anyway, to ask this suggests you have no idea what it takes to make an MMO. It's way more complicated than a co-op RPG.
Oh actualy I do. I have alpha and Beta tested many MMO's.
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slambitMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 282Bounty Hunter
edited January 2013
then you'd also know that porting the ranger over from the co-op to mmo, could have revealed so many issues, that to hold back
the rest of the game, just to fix those, makes no sense, not from a development point of view, not business side of things.
It does how ever serve your real purpose, bashing cryptic.
Personally i'd rather see the game launch with classes that they know works, as well as any class works at launch, and have them
add in a smooth playing ranger later, and they made it quite clear earlier, they will NOT be selling classes or races, so you will get access to ranger for free
Now should they end up selling access to ranger, i'll come light your torch myself, but i do not see that happening.
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jim1771Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
then you'd also know that porting the ranger over from the co-op to mmo, could have revealed so many issues, that to hold back
the rest of the game, just to fix those, makes no sense, not from a development point of view, not business side of things.
It does how ever serve your real purpose, bashing cryptic.
Personally i'd rather see the game launch with classes that they know works, as well as any class works at launch, and have them
add in a smooth playing ranger later, and they made it quite clear earlier, they will NOT be selling classes or races, so you will get access to ranger for free
Now should they end up selling access to ranger, i'll come light your torch myself, but i do not see that happening.
No but in the end once again Cryptic launches with a unfinished game. It is becomeing a bad cycle for them that it appears they will never escape.
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slambitMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 282Bounty Hunter
edited January 2013
A class never confirmed to be in the mmo not making it into launch, does not make the game unfinished.
Had they launched their co-op without ranger you would be right.
But insisting on using an interview from the co-op days to validate your cryptic clobbings, just shows you're not really interested in anything else.
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quorforgedMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
World of Warcraft was "finished" they day they released Cataclysm.
I think you mean to say it will never stop growing until they shut it down.
Oh Atari how I miss you!
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ambisinisterrMember, Neverwinter ModeratorPosts: 10,462Community Moderator
edited January 2013
Unfinished?
I'm pretty sure they always planned to add classes to the game periodically...post PWE that is.
They NEVER planned to "finish" the game. They planned to expand on it for many years to come.
I wish the game had more classes and wouldn't mind seeing it delayed to add them the same way they delayed to add pvp. The only reason I want the delay is right now with the information given I don't see any of the ready made characters/themes being anything I can mangle into a style I like to play but I'm hoping Beta will prove me wrong. Heck I still wish they hadn't converted it and I could be playing right now. I am certain other classes will make their appearance fairly quickly as cryptic will not want to lose players who get tired of waiting for something else to play. What is fairly quickly, shrugs, that will depend on how entertaining the game is. If I find the game entertaining as is then fairly quickll can be several months if I find the exting themes boring then fairly quickly fo rme become a couple of months.
Personally I'm fine with them releasing the game with only 5 classes at launch. That gives them more classes to release later on in expansions and keeps the playerbase growing. If they put everything everyone wanted in at launch there'd be little content to release later on.
By doing it this way they can put in rangers and other classes a little at a time, perhaps even release them as premium classes. Who knows?
Personally I'm fine with them releasing the game with only 5 classes at launch. That gives them more classes to release later on in expansions and keeps the playerbase growing. If they put everything everyone wanted in at launch there'd be little content to release later on.
By doing it this way they can put in rangers and other classes a little at a time, perhaps even release them as premium classes. Who knows?
I would prefer the new content to be storyline and places to play. Yes, I am sure that new content will not only be classes.
I am fairly certain they won't be charging for as yet unrelased classes.
All that said onto the game. Even in what I would consider while not unfinished definitely shy on playable classes for DnD.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
*sniffs* Me want ranger
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ambisinisterrMember, Neverwinter ModeratorPosts: 10,462Community Moderator
edited January 2013
Tinbender, the best part about this game is The Foundry.
Cryptic won't *have* to release more Storylines. The players will be more than happy to do that as long as Cryptic releases Classes, Races and supports Foundry Developers.
I'm pretty sure they always planned to add classes to the game periodically...post PWE that is.
They NEVER planned to "finish" the game. They planned to expand on it for many years to come.
By unfinished I mean things that should be in at launch but are not. Like Ranger for instance.
Tinbender, the best part about this game is The Foundry.
Cryptic won't *have* to release more Storylines. The players will be more than happy to do that as long as Cryptic releases Classes, Races and supports Foundry Developers.
I'm actually trying not to think about that as having to constantly wipe off the drool of anticipation from my keyboard is getting annoying. I can't wait to see what the community brings to the table. I played/play in in many sandboxes for NWN 1 and am looking forward to doing the same here. The foundry content in many ways is what I am looking forward to the most.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
*sniffs* Me want ranger
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muzrub333Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Comments
Actualy Jack Emmert did originaly say they would have rangers at launch.
http://ve3d.ign.com/articles/interviews/56890/Neverwinter-Interview-with-Jack-Emmert
VE: What are the five classes that you're starting out with?
Jack Emmert: Fighter, Wizard, Cleric, Ranger, Rogue.
DDO rangers have been ruined by massive nerfing in the name of balance. Now the only way to do real damage with a ranger in ddo is to go melee and you have no skills to support that build except the basic melee skills every class gets like cleave, trip, and sunder. Missle rangers had embues that they put in their arrows and the ability to conjure returning arrows which was all they could do. their damage is laughable because it takes them almost 12 shots that connect to do the same damage as 1 druid attack or 2 artificer attacks. the spells they got too are worthless because they are low level spells that you get up to level 10 and they never upgrade or become stronger so most things over level 10 don't even show damage when you use them. DDO knows that the ranger class is broken, they don't care... why? because they now have artifciers and druids and say go play one of those if you want to play a ranged class. Its the whole reason I left DDO they killed my favorite class to play in the name of "balance" and never fixed him to bring the balance back.
Bottom line, last we knew on these forums, they were still planning on having a Ranger at some point.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
*sigh*
really? Are you raising up an ancient undead and outdated source? And he also said this game will be Co-Op. Raise that too!
However the point is to show Cryptic we want Rangers at launch. It was originaly stated we would have them at launch but in true Cryptic style they wont be. That was one of the issues they had with STO. Failure to back-up their claims.
http://ve3d.ign.com/articles/interviews/56890/Neverwinter-Interview-with-Jack-Emmert
VE: What are the five classes that you're starting out with?
Jack Emmert: Fighter, Wizard, Cleric, Ranger, Rogue.
Search h2oratty. Don't listen to that source, check source for date first.
What is confusing is, which dev did say "archer ranger" is not but "melee ranger" is in works. I can bet my *censored* that I read it on the forums... or maybe somewhere I was not supposed to know of... I am wondering.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
The date of the interveiw doesn't matter. Cryptic made claims they can't live up to thats what matters. Jack Emmert the last I saw was the head of Cryptic and if he says rangers are in at launch then they should be. His excuse for the issue with STO was they only had 18 months to do it. What's Cryptics excuse now?
You seem to be confusing the Employee with the Boss. Cryptic is employed/owned by PWE now (used to be Atari), your blame is misplaced.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
Well I guess it's PWE blocking Ranger not the talent of the dev team.
This is why they have to be so stingy with information. Until release, everything is open to change. Telling us things before release is not a promise. Especially not things from an interview over 2 years old, from before the fundamental nature of the game changed from co-op RPG to MMORPG.
Launching with the truly core classes (Fighter, Rogue, Cleric, Wizard) is faithful to the existing game/lore. Would more classes be nice? Sure. More stuff is always nice. But there's only so much they can do for launch, and I don't see any reason why Ranger should be prioritized over Paladin, Warlock, Warlord, Druid, Bard, or Sorcerer.
Then you missed your time to criticize them by one+ years. They gave the statement later that due to it being MMO they were facing some challanges with ranger class.
They only confirmed three classes later - Guardian Fighter, COntrol Wizzy and Trickster Rogue.
They didn't even confirm cleric till later.
About ranger they said, "no comments"
h2oratty was gracious to let us know (cause he is a good spy!) that it is in the works.
If you actually like ranger class then you should have been following this, or at least kept an eye on truth's FAQ. I am of the view that you are just criticizing cryptic for the sake of criticizing them.
Full one year ago, truth's FAQ stated that three classes have been confirmed (ranger was not in them) and cleric may be there at launch. That was based on updated official sources. It has only changed w.r.t. cleric after that.
Now the question is what did they do dureing the time they had to develope the game. Because four classes shows a lack of development somewhere.
this^
Perfect World is famous for dragging their feet and not doing much. If it comes down to it the game will be out for 3 years before rangers are added and that's as a big expansion you have to buy and rangers will be a paid subscription only class that you have to prepay for 1 year to unlock.
they cash cow all their games into non existance and put what should be normal game content as special added expansion content to make more money. I never liked how they run games even their own namesake Perfect World was pay to win run into the ground cash cowed and lost most its crowd to other games. I was hoping since Cryptic has been working on this game BEFORE they become the property of PWE that this game would still be good like Champions Online was.
What I'm hearing tho scares me and makes me think this game will be just another victim of the assassination of Cryptic by its new owners.
Classes will not be paid ... everytime I had a cent...
*sigh*
I just give up. If you are not willing to look for facts first and revel in baseless assumptions and ill-informed rumors, go ahead with your fantasies.
There are 5 classes. There are two classes based on the PnP Fighter. And there are certainly others they have worked on, but don't expect to have ready for launch.
Anyway, to ask this suggests you have no idea what it takes to make an MMO. It's way more complicated than a co-op RPG.
the rest of the game, just to fix those, makes no sense, not from a development point of view, not business side of things.
It does how ever serve your real purpose, bashing cryptic.
Personally i'd rather see the game launch with classes that they know works, as well as any class works at launch, and have them
add in a smooth playing ranger later, and they made it quite clear earlier, they will NOT be selling classes or races, so you will get access to ranger for free
Now should they end up selling access to ranger, i'll come light your torch myself, but i do not see that happening.
Had they launched their co-op without ranger you would be right.
But insisting on using an interview from the co-op days to validate your cryptic clobbings, just shows you're not really interested in anything else.
An MMO is never "finished".
I think you mean to say it will never stop growing until they shut it down.
I'm pretty sure they always planned to add classes to the game periodically...post PWE that is.
They NEVER planned to "finish" the game. They planned to expand on it for many years to come.
By doing it this way they can put in rangers and other classes a little at a time, perhaps even release them as premium classes. Who knows?
I would prefer the new content to be storyline and places to play. Yes, I am sure that new content will not only be classes.
I am fairly certain they won't be charging for as yet unrelased classes.
All that said onto the game. Even in what I would consider while not unfinished definitely shy on playable classes for DnD.
Cryptic won't *have* to release more Storylines. The players will be more than happy to do that as long as Cryptic releases Classes, Races and supports Foundry Developers.
I'm actually trying not to think about that as having to constantly wipe off the drool of anticipation from my keyboard is getting annoying. I can't wait to see what the community brings to the table. I played/play in in many sandboxes for NWN 1 and am looking forward to doing the same here. The foundry content in many ways is what I am looking forward to the most.
Yeah, who are we all going to blame for pulling agro of the tank, and wiping the raid without a Ranger?