I always play how I would act in RL ... I know boring. If it something that upsets me and is considered evil in game I do it. My jedi in SWTOR wasn't to pure, but he wasn't evil. That how I would play if it makes any sense.
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elewyndylMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Corellon - who grants the magic of nature, i.e. cold, fire, lightning etc.
Selune - who grants good magic like charm, radiant magic etc.
Sseth who grants bad agic like power drain, life drain and necromancy.
Oghma and Mystra used to hate each other. Oghma is not the god of magic but god of knowledge. A wizard does not have magic - if a wizard reads a scroll he can use any magic without learning how to use it.
I don't agree. You might be fully correct about Correllon and Seth no arguments there.
Oghma is mentioned as new Mages God also... http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Oghma
Quote:
"Those who worship Oghma include artists, bards, cartographers, inventors, loremasters, sages, scholars, scribes and wizards—archivists, a generalist cleric prestige class, might pray to him as well."
Selune a mage god? Lol! I have read many Forgotten Realms books. Selune is much more close to nature then arcane magic. Actually Selune is close to NATURE MAGIC. Typical Selune worshippers that I have read in books are either neutral or good lycantrophes or some Druids. Evil lycantrophes usually prefer Malar.
Finally while lycantrophes maybe can not cast nature spells they can shapechange and that is a supernatural nature ability.
Selune is goddess of Moon. Selune might be goddess of radiance, but that radiance is likely more related to Moon radiance and not sun.
Yes many Druids worship Silvanus, but Selune is much more to my liking as deity...
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elewyndylMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I don't agree. You might be fully correct about Correllon and Seth no arguments there.
Oghma is mentioned as new Mages God also... http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Oghma
Quote:
"Those who worship Oghma include artists, bards, cartographers, inventors, loremasters, sages, scholars, scribes and wizards—archivists, a generalist cleric prestige class, might pray to him as well."
Selune a mage god? Lol! I have read many Forgotten Realms books. Selune is much more close to nature then arcane magic. Actually Selune is close to NATURE MAGIC. Typical Selune worshippers that I have read in books are either neutral or good lycantrophes or some Druids. Evil lycantrophes usually prefer Malar.
Finally while lycantrophes maybe can not cast nature spells they can shapechange and that is a supernatural nature ability.
Selune is goddess of Moon. Selune might be goddess of radiance, but that radiance is likely more related to Moon radiance and not sun.
Yes many Druids worship Silvanus, but Selune is much more to my liking as deity...
I am sorry but your interpretation of that wiki is wrong. Oghma is not the god of Mages. Mages just tend to worship him because of his portfolio over Knowledge. It even says, those who to worship him "include" ... It even shows his portfolio ( and spheres of influence) as Knowledge, bards, invention and inspiration... not Magic. Last I knew, include did not mean exclusively.
Still, I'll take my official WotC publications any day over that or any wiki. Besides, as far back as Oghma has been in publication, he has always been stated as having Mages follow him because of his portfolio so that is nothing new.
What's so hard to believe about Selune having power over or even having an affinity for Magic? You do know her history and the creation lore of Mystra, yes? Selune and Shar were battling, as usual. Selune, in a rage, tore all the magic from herself and hurled it at Shar to destroy her. Instead, it ripped through Shar and took Shar's magic with it and both magics formed into and gave consciousness to Mystryl, who later became known as Mystra - pure magic given consciousness. Everytime Mystryl has "died" she really only went dormant, for until you destroy all the magic in the Multiverse, Mystryl will exist in some form, sentient or not.
Furthermore, Selune is the Goddess of Light and Shar the Goddess of Darkness and are the two creator Deities that existed before all others after Ao created Realmspace. Many Realms' gods arose either directly or indirectly from their actions or will.
I am sorry but your interpretation of that wiki is wrong. Oghma is not the god of Mages. Mages just tend to worship him because of his portfolio over Knowledge. It even says, those who to worship him "tend to be" ... It even shows his portfolio (spheres of influence) as Knowledge, not Magic.
Still, I'll take my official WotC publications any day over that or any wiki. Besides, as far back as Oghma has been in publication, he has always been stated as having Mages follow him because of his portfolio so that is nothing new.
You are right.
Dragon Magzine 378, Page 32 shows the domains of deities. Domain of Arcana is shared by Selune, Corellon and Sseth.
Oghma, binder of all that is known, has the domains of knowledge, trickery and skill.
EDIT:
Oghma likes the creative, inventive aspects of bluffing and trickery more than the ability to deceive. Clever words please the Lord of Knowledge when applied to satire or debate, but he doesn’t abide lies or rumors.
EDIT:
The Lord of Knowledge inspires skill at music and invention.
EDIT:
Also pre 4e, all mages who hated Mystra followed Oghma who also hated Mystra.
EDIT 2:
Also as I said before, mages who follow Oghma are supposed to like to use scrolls and not use spells using talent.
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elewyndylMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I am sorry but your interpretation of that wiki is wrong. Oghma is not the god of Mages. Mages just tend to worship him because of his portfolio over Knowledge. It even says, those who to worship him "tend to be" ... It even shows his portfolio ( and spheres of influence) as Knowledge, bards, invention and inspiration... not Magic.
Still, I'll take my official WotC publications any day over that or any wiki. Besides, as far back as Oghma has been in publication, he has always been stated as having Mages follow him because of his portfolio so that is nothing new.
What's so hard to believe about Selune having power over or even having an affinity for Magic? You do know her history and the creation lore of Mystra, yes? Selune and Shar were battling, as usual. Selune, in a rage, tore all the magic from herself and hurled it at Shar to destroy her. Instead, it ripped through Shar and took Shar's magic with it and both magics formed into and gave consciousness to Mystryl, who later became known as Mystra - pure magic given consciousness. Everytime Mystryl has "died" she really only went dormant, for until you destroy all the magic in the Multiverse, Mystryl will exist in some form, sentient or not.
Right arguing with 2 GURUS is like that. Everybody has their stonehard belief. Well If I think of Oghma that deity is more related to bards and scholars and not fireball casting mages.
I have not followed new WOTC publications. I have read my Forgotten Realms books and take my impression from them. You can be sure that I would never create a Mage that worhships Selune. Unless you consider a Druid as "Mage". Even Ranger character is better worshipping Selune. Selune may have very potent magic herself as Goddes but hardly what I would call typical Mages god.
Anyway this is thoretical. At the end of a day a Paladin could worship Bane though I doubt that Paladin could remain Lawful Good in that belief. Selune is not a mages god for me period but as always there is no strict rule what to worship.
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
Right arguing with 2 GURUS is like that. Everybody has their stonehard belief. Well If I think of Oghma that deity is maybe more related to bards and scholars and not fireball casting mages.
I have not followed new WOTC publications. I have read my Forgotten Realms books and take my impression from them. You can be sure that I would never create a Mage that worhships Selune. Unless you consider a Druid as "Mage". Even Ranger character is better worshipping Selune.
Anyway this is thoretical. At the end of a day a Paladin could worship Bane though I doubt that Paladin could remain Lawful Good in that belief. Selune is not a mages god for me period but as always there is no strict rule what to worship.
Nothing I stated was belief, opinion or theory -- it is fact whether you choose to believe it or not is up to you. Everything I stated comes straight from my WotC publications, except for my mention of that wiki you referenced. Selune (and Shar) was the original Goddess of Magic, (Light and Dark respectfully) - until that event took place that I mentioned which gave rise to Mystryl. Then there is Lurue.. who is primal magic and was actually the idea of a Goddess of Magic prior to Mystryl being created by its authors.
...
I have not followed new WOTC publications. I have read my Forgotten Realms books and take my impression from them. You can be sure that I would never create a Mage that worhships Selune. Unless you consider a Druid as "Mage". Even Ranger character is better worshipping Selune.....
Silverstar paragon path - only paragon path where Selune shares her divine power with hose who use arcane implements.
No other god does so.
I quote from 4e FR-PHB
Selune is the only deity who shares part of her divine power with those who use arcane magic as Moon has mysterious connection with magic. So apart from divine classes, arcanists such as sorcerers, bards, warlocks can also become silverstars.
Opinions should be based on facts.
Quoting:-
Unlike many of the other gods and goddesses, Selune is willing to share some of her power with worshipers who are not solely devoted to studying her will. Wizards, warlocks, bards, and sorcerers can become silverstars of note.
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elewyndylMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Silverstar paragon path - only paragon path where Selune shares her divine power with hose who use arcane implements.
No other god does so.
I quote from 4e FR-PHB
Selune is the only deity who shares part of her divine power with those who use arcane magic as Moon has mysterious connection with magic. So apart from divine classes, arcanists such as sorcerers, bards, warlocks can also become silverstars.
Ok lets end this argument here. I am not saying you are wrong anymore. Apparently WOTC have CHANGED that Selune is also Goddess for arcane users. Fine so be it. Personally if I create a Druid or become shapeshifter then I will worship Selune.
The difference is your source is WOTC 4th edition material while mine are old WIKI and old Forgotten Realms books.
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zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
Ok lets end this argument here. I am not saying you are wrong anymore. Apparently WOTC have CHANGED that Selune is also Goddess for arcane users. Fine so be it. Personally if I create a Druid or become shapeshifter then I will worship Selune.
Selune does not bar Druids from worshiping her, in fact I agree with you in that she would be a good candidate for a Druid, especially one who loves the moon. Other candidates would have been such as Silvanus, Jannath or Chauntea.
I really cannot express enough how one should not use public wikis as a source of facts for more often than not they themselves are riddled with their author's own opinions, theories and beliefs - something you have protested against but seem to fail to realize is a fundamental flaw in your source for facts.
zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
edited January 2013
Back to the topic at hand, I will play in a Neutral Good manner on my Wizard who will follow the old ways of Mystryl. My drow cleric will be Chaotic Good in nature, following the ways of Selune now that Elistraseee is dead, as well as keeping with her love and service to Mystra.
My cleric's son, a Rogue, will be Chaotic Neutral in nature with extreme tendencies on both sides of the coin not taking a liking to any deity in particular. He will pay homage to them all. Other than those three, any others are up in the air but I generally do not roleplay Evil characters except for when I am the DM.
elewyndylMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited January 2013
Back to topic. I like to play Chaotic Neutral or Chaotic Good characters, but as said before depends lot on my deity. I must not have exactly same alignment as my Deity but pretty near would be logical.
If this game would allow to be infected by Evil Lycantrophy then Malar would be interesting, but to my best knowdledge lycantrophy affection is not supported.
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ghrysMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 20Arc User
As a completionist, I don't care much for alignments. If you are forced to choose one, your in-game choices are going to be limited to those. With opposing alignments and objectives, your character will ALWAYS be excluded from SOME content. That's why I dislike any morality systems. Of course, you can always just play the game as if you're NOT in rp.
Barring alignment-dependant classes, alignment isn't a restriction, your character acts however your character would based on the personality you gave them and alignment will change to reflect it. If you have a good understanding about how your character's personality will be, then you should be able to assign them an alignment that won't change unless something significant happens to change their worldview.
Remember, even if an action or several actions don't quite fit with the chosen alignment, as long as the majority, or the most significant actions do, the alignment will remain the same.
That being said... I think that most alignment objections come down to not really understanding them. In 3.5E you could boil the good/evil axis down to the value placed on sentient life, and the law/chaos axis to whether the character favors having rules/codes deciding what they will do in situations before they enter them, or prefer to decide things on the fly based on the individual circumstances of the particular situation. Not sure about 4E.
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iamtruthseekerMember, Moonstars, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Right arguing with 2 GURUS is like that. Everybody has their stonehard belief. Well If I think of Oghma that deity is more related to bards and scholars and not fireball casting mages.
I have not followed new WOTC publications. I have read my Forgotten Realms books and take my impression from them. You can be sure that I would never create a Mage that worhships Selune. Unless you consider a Druid as "Mage". Even Ranger character is better worshipping Selune. Selune may have very potent magic herself as Goddes but hardly what I would call typical Mages god.
Anyway this is thoretical. At the end of a day a Paladin could worship Bane though I doubt that Paladin could remain Lawful Good in that belief. Selune is not a mages god for me period but as always there is no strict rule what to worship.
Speaking of updates,
Paladins in 4E are neither restricted to only LG nor get their powers from a diety but from the source that ordained them. Once they get said magics, they do not risk losing it from breaking their alignment but the granting source could hunt them down if they betray their intentions to a level it's considered "betrayed" or "heresy."
And yes, sometimes deities do directly grant their divine touch bypassing the groups.
I'm hoping you've also read the FR novels that came out mid to late 2008 onward as your info seems to be stuck at the 3rd ed part for some of your conclusions. It's a whole new world literally in Faerum.
As Selune teaches us, change is the natural order of things.
Or how Lord Cyric teaches us, any method or means is justified if it brings about the desired end.
(it's funny how Cyric dogma resembles Machiavelli - The Prince)
That being said I really think alignment is most of the time the result of the race+class pick. At least that is the case with me.
If I go Paladin Aasimar....beacon of justice
If I go Wizard Drow -> bam evil to the core
etc.
Comments
Good ! Good ! Let the hate flow through you! Lord Cyric is please to see the holy fall.
*the mage nods*
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
AHAHAHAHA AHAHAHAHAHAHA
Long live Cyric
St. Augustinus
Curses! *cough cough* The blind followers of the Sun...
You are brave in the light ! We shall see how you will fare in the shadows were the mad dwell
The touch of Selune cures all insanities.
*desperately tries to quickly grab and hide the Selunite followers called Lunatics*
Oghma is mentioned as new Mages God also...
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Oghma
Quote:
"Those who worship Oghma include artists, bards, cartographers, inventors, loremasters, sages, scholars, scribes and wizards—archivists, a generalist cleric prestige class, might pray to him as well."
Selune a mage god? Lol! I have read many Forgotten Realms books. Selune is much more close to nature then arcane magic. Actually Selune is close to NATURE MAGIC. Typical Selune worshippers that I have read in books are either neutral or good lycantrophes or some Druids. Evil lycantrophes usually prefer Malar.
Finally while lycantrophes maybe can not cast nature spells they can shapechange and that is a supernatural nature ability.
Selune is goddess of Moon. Selune might be goddess of radiance, but that radiance is likely more related to Moon radiance and not sun.
Yes many Druids worship Silvanus, but Selune is much more to my liking as deity...
What I am telling you are the facts, not opinions. If you have got a problem with it, take it up with WotC.
There is no point QQ to me about it. Facts will remain facts and I cannot change them for you.
If you want source, I can give it to you after few hours of searching in my dragon magzines. I think it was dragon #390 perhaps but I need to see.
My work: Heroes Blacksmith - Library
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?21051-Heroes-Blacksmith-Library
Still, I'll take my official WotC publications any day over that or any wiki. Besides, as far back as Oghma has been in publication, he has always been stated as having Mages follow him because of his portfolio so that is nothing new.
What's so hard to believe about Selune having power over or even having an affinity for Magic? You do know her history and the creation lore of Mystra, yes? Selune and Shar were battling, as usual. Selune, in a rage, tore all the magic from herself and hurled it at Shar to destroy her. Instead, it ripped through Shar and took Shar's magic with it and both magics formed into and gave consciousness to Mystryl, who later became known as Mystra - pure magic given consciousness. Everytime Mystryl has "died" she really only went dormant, for until you destroy all the magic in the Multiverse, Mystryl will exist in some form, sentient or not.
Furthermore, Selune is the Goddess of Light and Shar the Goddess of Darkness and are the two creator Deities that existed before all others after Ao created Realmspace. Many Realms' gods arose either directly or indirectly from their actions or will.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
You are right.
Dragon Magzine 378, Page 32 shows the domains of deities. Domain of Arcana is shared by Selune, Corellon and Sseth.
Oghma, binder of all that is known, has the domains of knowledge, trickery and skill.
EDIT:
EDIT:
EDIT:
Also pre 4e, all mages who hated Mystra followed Oghma who also hated Mystra.
EDIT 2:
Also as I said before, mages who follow Oghma are supposed to like to use scrolls and not use spells using talent.
Right arguing with 2 GURUS is like that. Everybody has their stonehard belief. Well If I think of Oghma that deity is more related to bards and scholars and not fireball casting mages.
I have not followed new WOTC publications. I have read my Forgotten Realms books and take my impression from them. You can be sure that I would never create a Mage that worhships Selune. Unless you consider a Druid as "Mage". Even Ranger character is better worshipping Selune. Selune may have very potent magic herself as Goddes but hardly what I would call typical Mages god.
Anyway this is thoretical. At the end of a day a Paladin could worship Bane though I doubt that Paladin could remain Lawful Good in that belief. Selune is not a mages god for me period but as always there is no strict rule what to worship.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
Silverstar paragon path - only paragon path where Selune shares her divine power with hose who use arcane implements.
No other god does so.
I quote from 4e FR-PHB
Selune is the only deity who shares part of her divine power with those who use arcane magic as Moon has mysterious connection with magic. So apart from divine classes, arcanists such as sorcerers, bards, warlocks can also become silverstars.
Opinions should be based on facts.
Quoting:-
Opinions are based on facts. My are based on WIKI:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sel%C3%BBne
Ok lets end this argument here. I am not saying you are wrong anymore. Apparently WOTC have CHANGED that Selune is also Goddess for arcane users. Fine so be it. Personally if I create a Druid or become shapeshifter then I will worship Selune.
The difference is your source is WOTC 4th edition material while mine are old WIKI and old Forgotten Realms books.
I really cannot express enough how one should not use public wikis as a source of facts for more often than not they themselves are riddled with their author's own opinions, theories and beliefs - something you have protested against but seem to fail to realize is a fundamental flaw in your source for facts.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
My cleric's son, a Rogue, will be Chaotic Neutral in nature with extreme tendencies on both sides of the coin not taking a liking to any deity in particular. He will pay homage to them all. Other than those three, any others are up in the air but I generally do not roleplay Evil characters except for when I am the DM.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
If this game would allow to be infected by Evil Lycantrophy then Malar would be interesting, but to my best knowdledge lycantrophy affection is not supported.
Remember, even if an action or several actions don't quite fit with the chosen alignment, as long as the majority, or the most significant actions do, the alignment will remain the same.
That being said... I think that most alignment objections come down to not really understanding them. In 3.5E you could boil the good/evil axis down to the value placed on sentient life, and the law/chaos axis to whether the character favors having rules/codes deciding what they will do in situations before they enter them, or prefer to decide things on the fly based on the individual circumstances of the particular situation. Not sure about 4E.
Speaking of updates,
Paladins in 4E are neither restricted to only LG nor get their powers from a diety but from the source that ordained them. Once they get said magics, they do not risk losing it from breaking their alignment but the granting source could hunt them down if they betray their intentions to a level it's considered "betrayed" or "heresy."
And yes, sometimes deities do directly grant their divine touch bypassing the groups.
I'm hoping you've also read the FR novels that came out mid to late 2008 onward as your info seems to be stuck at the 3rd ed part for some of your conclusions. It's a whole new world literally in Faerum.
As Selune teaches us, change is the natural order of things.
Or how Lord Cyric teaches us, any method or means is justified if it brings about the desired end.
(it's funny how Cyric dogma resembles Machiavelli - The Prince)
That being said I really think alignment is most of the time the result of the race+class pick. At least that is the case with me.
If I go Paladin Aasimar....beacon of justice
If I go Wizard Drow -> bam evil to the core
etc.
Cyric lies.
EDIT: Would have liked to link "Liar Liar Pants on Fire" here, but it is not allowed. So instead search on youtube for it
hmm not in option list... -.-;
hehehe
No. For then he will just be mistaken to be cleric of Sune...
but they only worship the beds!!!... =/
hmm, remembers a long time question
about devas that worships sune... =p