What should NW's currencies be named?

thetruthurts

In STO, the standard in game currency used to buy common items is called "energy credits". The "special" currency which is used to buy rare items, as well as trade for zen(the game store currency) is called "dilithium"(supposedly a rare ore in the Trek universe).

So what should NW's standard currency be? And what should its "special" currency be?

zebular

Standard Currency? That should be what the Realms' always has been and really shouldn't be something up for debate on change as it already has a canon foundation.

(granted, the values have changed over the editions but their foundation remains)

1 platinum piece = 1 platinum
1 platinum piece = 10 gold
1 platinum piece = 100 silver
1 platinum piece = 1000 copper


As for the cash shop currency however, my thoughts are as follows:

Probably the best "Faerun" currency, unless it is already used in game for something else, would be Trade Bars. Mayhaps something like Star Sapphires could also work. It really depends on what types of currencies we will have at launch that are earn-able in game.

On the other hand, the best choice for a non-prime material plane item however would be some material or gemstone from the Planes, such as an Astral Diamond. Astral Diamonds are already used in the facebook game, D&D: Heroes of Neverwinter, as the cash shop currency.. so this really does make the most sense to use in regards to it's rarity and value, it's non-prime origin, and it already having a foundation as FR cash shop currency.

I just hope they keep in-game currency and cash shop currency separate and nothing like the Dilithium System.

aavarius

zebular wrote: »

Standard Currency? That should be what the Realms' always has been and really shouldn't be something up for debate on change as it already has a canon foundation.

See, I disagree that canon trumps practicality in this case. I feel like the needs of the MMO come first. Moreover, I feel like there are way more important aspects than the currency conversion rate of the setting to preserve first.

pilf3r

When it comes to coins i hope they stick to gold and silver as that has always been the most steady and prevalent currency throughout Fearun.

http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Currency

I really don't see a problem for the game to use canon currency, it doesn't hurt practicality at all so I'm pretty much in agreement with all that zebular has posted.

gillrmn

aavarius wrote: »

See, I disagree that canon trumps practicality in this case. I feel like the needs of the MMO come first. Moreover, I feel like there are way more important aspects than the currency conversion rate of the setting to preserve first.

I understand but I still believe canon system is more practical. Plat-gold-silver-copper. Too much platinum and we can go to old barter system of medieval times.

Also purity of metals was a great way to control a kingdom's economy in old times. I wish they could emulate that too, but this isn't a merchant-sim so...

Above platinum, they can perhaps add mithral. So the mithrial sword would be worth... omg!!!

eshnick

I think the standard currency should be the "Esh". They can come in platinum, gold, silver, and copper, at the relationships mentioned above.

b:laugh

gillrmn

eshnick wrote: »

I think the standard currency should be the "Esh". They can come in platinum, gold, silver, and copper, at the relationships mentioned above.

b:laugh

It won't be flattering in a conversation of a cleric buying spell components (though we no longer need them here...)

I would vote or "Drizz" without t to avoid copyright.

PC: "I need cow dung for prayer to forest god"
Merchant: "1 cow dung is 10 drizz"
PC: "Hmm... thats cheap!"

iamtruthseeker

Based on interviews and images, we know Astral Diamonds are the secondary player buy RL stuff and Donate currency while gold is the main currency.

bardbarian

zebular wrote: »

Standard Currency? That should be what the Realms' always has been and really shouldn't be something up for debate on change as it already has a canon foundation.

(granted, the values have changed over the editions but their foundation remains)

1 platinum piece = 1 platinum
1 platinum piece = 10 gold
1 platinum piece = 100 silver
1 platinum piece = 1000 copper


As for the cash shop currency however, my thoughts are as follows:

Probably the best "Faerun" currency, unless it is already used in game for something else, would be Trade Bars. Mayhaps something like Star Sapphires could also work. It really depends on what types of currencies we will have at launch that are earn-able in game.

On the other hand, the best choice for a non-prime material plane item however would be some material or gemstone from the Planes, such as an Astral Diamond. Astral Diamonds are already used in the facebook game, D&D: Heroes of Neverwinter, as the cash shop currency.. so this really does make the most sense to use in regards to it's rarity and value, it's non-prime origin, and it already having a foundation as FR cash shop currency.

I just hope they keep in-game currency and cash shop currency separate and nothing like the Dilithium System.

I'd have to agree with you, so long as the database could handle it. Don't want jerks crashing the database because they wanted to see what happens when you accumulate 1,000,000,000,000 copper. If not, gold is a fairly standard by itself. The only problem is the really cheap items, if they include them. (oil, parchment, caltrops, etc.)

Using rare gems as cash shop currency makes sense roleplay-wise too, especially if they're occasionally awarded in game. It makes sense that at the end of a particularly challenging quest such a valuable and rare commodity might be awarded.

ausdoerrt

The "special currency" should be Electrum b:chuckle

muzrub333

Oh come on, how about a tip of the hat to those of us who still play AD&D 1st edition. Shoot, I still have my original Basic boxed set with the orange dice and brown crayon from the early 80's.

Electrum is a must!

surf13

Except Electrum never existed in the corresponding historical realities

iamtruthseeker

muzrub333 wrote: »

Oh come on, how about a tip of the hat to those of us who still play AD&D 1st edition. Shoot, I still have my original Basic boxed set with the orange dice and brown crayon from the early 80's.

Electrum is a must!

It *is*n in D&D Next once again. Just not 4th unless it's a "lost" currency

bardbarian

muzrub333 wrote: »

Oh come on, how about a tip of the hat to those of us who still play AD&D 1st edition. Shoot, I still have my original Basic boxed set with the orange dice and brown crayon from the early 80's.

Electrum is a must!

Now that's taking me back a little bit Electrum FTW! lol

surf13

I always remember those days fondly

Electrum was (a) to difficult for most period societies to manufacture and (b) most societies that came across it melted it down for component gold and silver. Meh.

aavarius

You guys misunderstood. I said maintaining the currency conversion rate was what I disagreed with when it came to MMO needs vs. setting needs. I.E. 1 gold = x silver = y copper, etc, etc. The names of the coins should be what they've always been called in D&D. Their traditional value, however, I feel is a trivial loss when it comes to making the MMO economy work better.

Additionally, I will point you all to a neat FR article that I think makes this world interesting. Since, more or less, Neverember represents a Waterdhavian ploy to take power in Neverwinter, it might be interesting to see Waterdeep-style coin names minted in the Protector's Enclave.

surf13

Yeah that would be teh awesome...

muzrub333

aavarius wrote: »

You guys misunderstood.

Yep, I totally misunderstood you. I thought you were implying that getting rid of the many currency types, in favor of a single type, would be preferred.

I'd love to see something like what the article linked describes. Small things add up quickly to really add depth to a game.

It was mentioned above that this is not a merchant sim, but I am hoping for a crafting system that supports a fairly robust economy, with a good trade system. Not necessarily at release, but it would be nice. (I know it's not really what D&D is about, but it is a pretty standard feature of MMORPG's)

iamtruthseeker

aavarius wrote: »

You guys misunderstood. I said maintaining the currency conversion rate was what I disagreed with when it came to MMO needs vs. setting needs. I.E. 1 gold = x silver = y copper, etc, etc. The names of the coins should be what they've always been called in D&D. Their traditional value, however, I feel is a trivial loss when it comes to making the MMO economy work better.

Additionally, I will point you all to a neat FR article that I think makes this world interesting. Since, more or less, Neverember represents a Waterdhavian ploy to take power in Neverwinter, it might be interesting to see Waterdeep-style coin names minted in the Protector's Enclave.

I would LOVE to have these as treasure objects in the NW Online game whether to keep as souvenir items to show or trade in for coin:

• A Waterdhavian toal is worth 2gp in Waterdeep and practically nothing elsewhere.[3]
• A Waterdhavian Harbor moon is a special coin in the shape of a crescent, made of platinum and inset with electrum. It is used in bulk purchases in Waterdeep where it is worth 50gp. Outside Waterdeep the value drops to 2gp.[3]
• Bela is paper money used by barbarian tribes to the east in Kara-Tur. In western Realms it is worthless and occasionally offered as an insult.[3]
• Blood notes are scrolls, letters, or other carvings representing I.O.U.s and promissory notes from the listed person(s) to the holder of the note. Blood notes can be offered by individuals, adventuring companies, or countries and cities to cover debts. In common usage the debtor is legally obligated to pay when the note is presented. Blood notes from deceased individuals are not binding.[3]
• Trade bars from (Mirabar) are made of black iron and shaped like rectangular spindels(sic). They are worth 10gp in Mirabar and 5gp in the rest of the Realms.[3]
• Trade bars from merchants are thin silver bars marked at one end with the value, typically 10, 20, or 50gp, and the other end has the symbol of the trading institution or coster which created it. An increasing number of these bars bear the mint mark of Baldur's Gate. Trade bars of the Iron Throne trading group are not honored by other trading organizations because this group is considered disreputable. Broken trade bars have no value but most merchants will continue to honor the trade bars of defunct institutions.[3]
• Trade bars from Sembia are ingot-shaped silver bars dotted with copper and the Sembian symbol. They are considered "face value" and typically come in 5, 10, 25, and 50gp denominations.[3]
• Trade bars from Lantan are flat envelope-shaped bars of worked steel marked with the great wheel of Gond. They are worth 20gp each and used primarily along the Sword Coast.[3]
• The Sembian steelpense was introduced by the Sembian government to replace the silver piece but was overproduced and the value has dropped to 1cp.[3]
• Shou Lung copper is any copper coin which is not immediately recognizable and therefore declared to come from the mystical East and is given a value of 1cp. Only a small number of these coins actually come from Shou Lung, or any of the Kara-Tur nations, but the name stuck.[3]
• Shou Lung silver is similar: any unknown or badly worn silver coin given a value of 1sp.[3]
• Trade bars from Shou Lung are slender bars of silver, definitely oriental in origin, that have made their way to the West. Shou Lung trade bars are worth about 40gp each.[3]
• a Letter of Trade is similar to a Blood Note and calls for a delivery of a particular item or items to the bearer.
• Tharsult Statues are small art objects used in trade. They are made of ivory, jade, or serpentine and are used as coinage in that region. Most of these that reach the North are treated as curios and are worth around 15gp. In their native land they are worth about 5gp each.[3]
• Shaar Rings are made of sliced and bored ivory and hung on long strings by the plainsmen of Shaar. Rings will be found in bundles, and each ring will be worth 3gp each.[3]
• Gond bells were introduced by the Lantanese and used in regions of the North, in particular in trade between worshipers of Gond. The small brass bells enclose a loose ornamental stone which causes it to clatter. Each is worth 10gp on the open market or 20gp if traded to a church of Gond.[3][5]
• Mercenary Cards are small cards of parchment about the size of a Talis card, marked on one side with the symbol of a particular mercenary company. The reverse is usually a handwritten scrawl from the troop's paymaster authorizing payment. These become currency by being found in loot caches, won in card games, or stolen from the unwary.[3]

bardbarian

Those would be great trade items if they did that and would add a lot of flavor. One worry would be, will it get old? Maybe pick select ones from the list, or scale them to the level and relevant loot drops...dunno...

zebular

I've never stopped using Electrum in my Campaign. Of course, my campaign started in 1st edition and has remained the "same" campaign all these years. Over time, I boosted the rarity and value of Star Sapphires to the point where they are the most valuable and sought after gemstone found in the Faerun region, especially by magic users seeking to use them to make magical items. So, a lot of times I mistakenly automatically assume Star Sapphires are the best gemstone, when PCing in someone else's campaign. Old habits and all...

gillrmn

The purity of the metal should be considered during currency conversion rates. For example, 99% gold coin may be worth 1000 silver coins and can be "standard" but 99.9% pure gold coin should be worth 1,000,000 silver. Purest of gold (like 99.99998% pure) should be able to buy you a city. Puryfying metal too much requires very long and advanced techniques.

That was how the coins controlled the economy in medieval times(what faerun is based on). For example a king facing financial problems may suddenly reduce amount of gold in his coins and get more money (until everyone around the kingdom realized the change). A king trying to show off its power would increase the purity. So 10 Neverwinter gold is worth 11 waterdeep gold means neverwinter is strong economically.

This is also the reason that in old times measuring the purity of gold coins was so much important among merchants.

If something that realistic can be implemented I would be flabbergasted... and it might attract a lot of merchants based role-players to this MMO too.

iamtruthseeker

gillrmn wrote: »

The purity of the metal should be considered during currency conversion rates. For example, 99% gold coin may be worth 1000 silver coins and can be "standard" but 99.9% pure gold coin should be worth 1,000,000 silver. Purest of gold (like 99.99998% pure) should be able to buy you a city. Puryfying metal too much requires very long and advanced techniques.

That was how the coins controlled the economy in medieval times(what faerun is based on). For example a king facing financial problems may suddenly reduce amount of gold in his coins and get more money (until everyone around the kingdom realized the change). A king trying to show off its power would increase the purity. So 10 Neverwinter gold is worth 11 waterdeep gold means neverwinter is strong economically.

This is also the reason that in old times measuring the purity of gold coins was so much important among merchants.

If something that realistic can be implemented I would be flabbergasted... and it might attract a lot of merchants based role-players to this MMO too.

And in the D&D world, you just use alchemists to set the gold purity.

This also kind of goes back to my item wish-list where the amount of rare metal and the support of those items in that city for that amount will set the value in the local city and elsewhere (why for instance you can get a lot less silver value for a Miribar trade bar at 10 GP but only 5 gp elsewhere.)

tinyish

I agree that Neverwinter should use the same copper/silver/gold/platinum system that D&D has always used. And since this is 4th edition they should include Astral Diamonds, which are worth 10,000gp, or 1000 platinum.

Additionally, in 4th edition there is a substance which is used to create magical items called residuum. A pound of residuum is worth 500,000gp, or or 50,000 plat or 50 astral diamonds.

I'm not sure if the weight of currency should actually slow the character down, but the player should be able to convert thier money back and forth between these fairly freely. Thus, you could sell an item to another player for .5 pounds of residuum or 250,000 plat or 25 ad and it would be effectively the same thing.

aavarius

gillrmn wrote: »

The purity of the metal should be considered during currency conversion rates. For example, 99% gold coin may be worth 1000 silver coins and can be "standard" but 99.9% pure gold coin should be worth 1,000,000 silver. Purest of gold (like 99.99998% pure) should be able to buy you a city. Puryfying metal too much requires very long and advanced techniques.

That was how the coins controlled the economy in medieval times(what faerun is based on). For example a king facing financial problems may suddenly reduce amount of gold in his coins and get more money (until everyone around the kingdom realized the change). A king trying to show off its power would increase the purity. So 10 Neverwinter gold is worth 11 waterdeep gold means neverwinter is strong economically.

This is also the reason that in old times measuring the purity of gold coins was so much important among merchants.

If something that realistic can be implemented I would be flabbergasted... and it might attract a lot of merchants based role-players to this MMO too.

I'm not really interested in EVE: Neverwinter Edition. At a certain point I'm quite all right handwaving out the details when it means I don't have to manage that level minutia of detail.

katalystik

I'm with Aavarius on this one. That is too mathy for most people and we need the casuals to throw money at this game to keep it running for us hardcore players. :P

pilf3r

aavarius wrote: »

You guys misunderstood. I said maintaining the currency conversion rate was what I disagreed with when it came to MMO needs vs. setting needs. I.E. 1 gold = x silver = y copper, etc, etc. The names of the coins should be what they've always been called in D&D. Their traditional value, however, I feel is a trivial loss when it comes to making the MMO economy work better.

Additionally, I will point you all to a neat FR article that I think makes this world interesting. Since, more or less, Neverember represents a Waterdhavian ploy to take power in Neverwinter, it might be interesting to see Waterdeep-style coin names minted in the Protector's Enclave.

I still think it could be left as is.

We just add in silver and gold trade bars and adjust the value of those seeing as their value was not always the same depending on where they were minted and they also had various denominations.



Like aavarius has said we do not really want Eve: Neverwinter so lets not make things over complicated. All the devs really need to do is adjust the rate at which coins drop etc and the various value of items.

aavarius

pilf3r wrote: »

I still think it could be left as is.

We just add in silver and gold trade bars and adjust the value of those seeing as their value was not always the same depending on where they were minted and they also had various denominations.



Like aavarius has said we do not really want Eve: Neverwinter so lets not make things over complicated. All the devs really need to do is adjust the rate at which coins drop etc and the various value of items.

I'm having difficulty understanding what you mean, so please bear with me.

What should be left as is: the coin values, or the denominations of currencies?

pilf3r

aavarius wrote: »

I'm having difficulty understanding what you mean, so please bear with me.

What should be left as is: the coin values, or the denominations of currencies?

The coin values should remain as is we can adjust item the rate at which gold drops to fit accordingly and for trade bars the value we can tweak that for bigger amounts.

Also lets no have all the different values of coins and just choose one for the whole game, 1 gold = 1 gold no matter where it comes from. I mean do we really want to overcomplicate things with toals, shards, nibs, dragons, suns and moons floating around to confuse everyone lol

I mean trade bars can come in values of 5 to 50 gold in canon dnd so lets just tweak that to what we would need for "high level/value" items.

Heh sorry if I'm being confusing but the ale is tasting good tonight lol

aavarius

I don't actually expect there to be anything more than gold, silver, and copper as the general purpose currency. I wouldn't be surprised if it was just gold by itself.

I do, however, think it would be neat (but not necessary) for cosmetic differences in currencies, such as coins minted in Waterdeep on Waterdhavian soldiers look like x and are called y, (or Netherese coins on people from Netheril respectively, etc etc.) but when you pick them up they just simply go into your inventory as gold, silver, and copper worth exactly the same as any other gold, silver, or copper coin, respectively. Alternatively, it would be neat (but not necessary) for there to be a textual description of the coins in your inventory that noted that they come in different values, shapes, sizes, and so forth depending on where they were minted. Both of these would make a nod to the larger world of Faerun and the resources coming in to lay a claim on the city without complicating how much your money's actually worth.

gillrmn

aavarius wrote: »

I'm not really interested in EVE: Neverwinter Edition. At a certain point I'm quite all right handwaving out the details when it means I don't have to manage that level minutia of detail.

I haven't played EVE, but does it have realistic currency system of medivial world in which 10 Neverwinter gold may be equal to 11 Waterdhavian gold? And in case there is a Coup d'?tat in Neverwinter, suddenly the money becomes worthless and all you can get is actual value of metal?

In that case why not? FR is simulating medieval world after all.