They used to have terrible smileys before. I think it was pigs. So when they introduced bears, people embraced them with open hearts. Give the worst scenario to the masses first and then introduce the worse and worse shall become good :-)
Well, Forsaken World still has and has always had the standard tiny circle smilies you see in most forums. So it's not like the bears are the universal PWE smilies or anything.
So, I guess it's just that they made the wrong decission and noone cba to change it before beta...
Still, could be worse... FW's forum avatars were absolutely broken for a year (and still are, though they have fixed a few issues) (And before anyone says "Can't be worse than having one avatar for everyone", I'm gonna say "how about 1/3 of the people being stuck with an image error pic for an avatar?")
They used to have terrible smileys before. I think it was pigs. So when they introduced bears, people embraced them with open hearts. Give the worst scenario to the masses first and then introduce the worse and worse shall become good :-)
Eh, I've moderated anime forums, I've seen worse smileys in my day. Frankly, I think they should just give up the pretenses and go ahead and use the onion emoticons. Ohwell.
Ive waited over year now, this better come before Elder Scroll Online, or you'll not see me here.
Year? That's nothing, I've been waiting since announcement, that's almost 2. And just because you post about ESO in every thread, it won't make them release it any faster :P
...
Year? That's nothing, I've been waiting since announcement, that's almost 2. And just because you post about ESO in every thread, it won't make them release it any faster :P
Yeah, back then they had five shadows with text box showing you what they do when you hover over them. That page was all the website was. Has it been 2 years already? Time sure flies...
Eh, I've moderated anime forums, I've seen worse smileys in my day. Frankly, I think they should just give up the pretenses and go ahead and use the onion emoticons. Ohwell.
Year? That's nothing, I've been waiting since announcement, that's almost 2. And just because you post about ESO in every thread, it won't make them release it any faster :P
Why is what the smilies look like such a big issue? I've seen it come up in like 4 different threads; there's even a topic been started specifically about it. b:chuckle
Why can't you just grin and bear it? b:laugh
I can't imagine them being anything more than place-holders anyway; they already mentioned something about the avatars changing to character portraits after release, so I'd presume the smilies would change when there are thousands of people posting here.
I just wish you could insert images and youtube videos into posts instead of having to hyperlink everything.
I can't imagine them being anything more than place-holders anyway; they already mentioned something about the avatars changing to character portraits after release,
...
The reason why avatar have been changed to limited portraits is to keep the NW theme on the forums. So that forums do not look fragmented.
Using the smileys goes completely against that idea itself. How can you look at those atrocious bears and say they have integrated to this forum site? It defeats the whole point of limiting avatars.
That aside, smileys are not the only problem. There is a large background of black instead of greys. They should have alternating strips of This, greys and black to accentuate the forum part Vs the background e.g. STO. The large amount of blackness kills all the aesthetics of the site. There are more issues but they are too much to list without making this post a wall of text.
If terrible smilies are the most people have to complain about then all isn't lost.
For me the recent Foundry footage has gone beyond all expectations:
- Every asset/monster available in game will be available for players in the Foundry
- You can customize mobs with an insane number of options, INCLUDING the powers/attacks/abilities that mobs have
- Hundreds of pre-sets for quick builds or a plethora of decorative objects and full customization to build from the ground up.
For me this is why I want to play the game, to make content. All Foundry content will be publishable to the general community, so realistically Cryptic/PW wont have to focus as much of their resources on providing game content as they will have a community doing it for them.
Yeah, back then they had five shadows with text box showing you what they do when you hover over them. That page was all the website was. Has it been 2 years already? Time sure flies...
Yeah, I went back to check the Circle of Eight forum just today, and the first rumors/announcements of Neverwinter first cropped up in August 2010...
Yeah, I went back to check the Circle of Eight forum just today, and the first rumors/announcements of Neverwinter first cropped up in August 2010...
I remember when Craig Zinkievich did a video interview back in late 2009, a lot of folks on the STO forums commented about all the 4th ed D&D books on his desk, that progressed into "OMG Baldures gate online!!!" One other person said something about NWN Online but the hoopla died out a couple days later, I do wonder if it was in the planning stages then though.
Year? That's nothing, I've been waiting since announcement, that's almost 2. And just because you post about ESO in every thread, it won't make them release it any faster :P
Well, we know its coming in 2013. This is delayed more, who knows what happens. ESO is going to be massive, Skyrim absolutely crushed Amalur already.
0
vindiconMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
ESO is going to be massive, Skyrim absolutely crushed Amalur already.
I... have my doubts about that. From what we've been shown so far, I'd be more inclined to believe that it's not gonna be that succesful. Sure, it's gonna have some sizeable playerbase - it is has the TES logo on it after all - but as we've been shown time and time again, people are moving away fro the traditional MMORPGs and towards either action(y) MMORPGs or MOBAs. And ESO does not seem to go too far away from the traditional MMORPG gameplay...
If ESO launches with a p2p model on top of that, I'm willing to bet it's gonna fail hard. Look at the most recent p2p MMORPGs - SWTOR was forced to go f2p within mere months of its release, and TSW... well, it has nearly sunk the studio that made it...
And btw, since when was Amalur ever competing with Skyrim in terms of sales? One is an Elder Scrolls game, the other was some new IP from some unknown studio... there was never a question of which would sell the most copies... which is a pity, because Amalur was a much better game than Skyrim...
I... have my doubts about that. From what we've been shown so far, I'd be more inclined to believe that it's not gonna be that succesful. Sure, it's gonna have some sizeable playerbase - it is has the TES logo on it after all - but as we've been shown time and time again, people are moving away fro the traditional MMORPGs and towards either action(y) MMORPGs or MOBAs. And ESO does not seem to go too far away from the traditional MMORPG gameplay...
If ESO launches with a p2p model on top of that, I'm willing to bet it's gonna fail hard. Look at the most recent p2p MMORPGs - SWTOR was forced to go f2p within mere months of its release, and TSW... well, it has nearly sunk the studio that made it...
I agree. The p2p PC MMO model is pretty much dead. I believe their pre-fab plan is to start as p2p, then switch to f2p. Therefore they've already got a chunk of change in the front end... and then as the sales start to plummet, "surprise" everyone, go f2p, and collect significantly more residual funds.
In fact, at this point this sales technique, in my vocabulary, is a digital form of bait and switch, they sell one item as a complete package, then sell it again and again as a continually developed project.
I agree with you, I have my doubts about ESO too. That p2p community is going to be very very demanding of Bethesda, and I will hedge a bet with anyone that their angst will make this forum feel like Mr Rogers Neighborhood....
Well, we know its coming in 2013. This is delayed more, who knows what happens. ESO is going to be massive, Skyrim absolutely crushed Amalur already.
I have never player ESO or Skyrim, but I was kind of saying the same thing for Connan. Moderate success of SW, ST, LOTRO and other big titles have eventually turned me to skeptic about famous things. Fame is perhaps spontaneous. Both lost and gained.
0
ambisinisterrMember, Neverwinter ModeratorPosts: 10,462Community Moderator
edited August 2012
Skyrim was an amazing game. While I can easily say there are some faults with the actual mechanics and even the story design the game was simply amazing to play, especially on my 55" television, just because of the beauty of the game.
I know at least one person on these forums bashedthe graphics but I played that game with eyes wide and mouth agape. Due to issues with the ATI Catylist Control Center I couldn't even use AA without causing massive graphical glitches but even without AA I felt like I was walking through a dream.
Half the fun of the game was walking around and looking at this breathtaking landscape.
The only major downside that I would put on a negative to make me not want to play is the fact it has NO multiplayer support.
And I doubt they could have done half the things which made the game so great if they also had to worry about multiplayer support. Multiplayer is something which limits graphics to what they are in current games.
Basically, don't expect ESO to be Skyrim Online. It might have the same mechanics and similar storyline but to me that was the weaker end of Skyrim. It was an enjoyable game but once I beat the story and played around a bit more that was the end...
*Points to The Foundry* That defines the major difference between NWN, NWN2 and NWO from any other game currently on or soon to be on the market. Players know what players want. Give them the power and we'll have a great game yet.
It sure was. I coincidentally got my new monitor just in time to play it too
In a nutshell, Skyrim in my mind was designed to be the "last great rpg". They took the dying RPG genre, and went balls to the wall. Best graphics, best sound, ever. The story and combat were kinda meh. But the graphics (and sounds) were so far ahead of best-in-class, that I'd walk around the game trying to imagine what Pool of Radiance, Dark Queen of Krynn, Might & Magic, Bard's Tale and all the classics would have looked like if it they were published with today's technology.
That said, once you dummy down the graphics to mmo standards, and add in the internet nuances (lag) I think quite a few gamers are going to quickly realize that the "magic" and nostalgia they felt playing the this gorgeous rpg genre flashback game called Skyrim, is simply not the same.
vindiconMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited August 2012
Skyrim sure was a very good game. I dumbed a solid 150 hours in it, and that's a win in my book.
However, I personally would not call it "amazing". Aside from the fact that the world was gorgeous, it really didn't have much else to it. The combat was meh, the storylines were meeeeh and too linear, the game was buggier than a termite nest and the RPG systems were flawed in design and majorly unbalanced. Not to mention it looked like all the dungeons had been randomly generated from the same 4-5 tilesets...
Oh well, maybe this is just my nostalgia for the good ol'days, but I have yet to find a game that is to me better than FF XII. Or maybe it's not, because I recently loaded it again just to check out and I still find it the best game I've ever played (just above NWN2)
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
0
ausdoerrtMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited August 2012
@FFXII: gorgeous setting and atmosphere. I wish I had the time to kill to finish it these days.
I also chuckle every time someone calls Skyrim "an RPG", and another time for every "great" or "amazing" used in the same sentence. b:chuckle
I... have my doubts about that. From what we've been shown so far, I'd be more inclined to believe that it's not gonna be that succesful. Sure, it's gonna have some sizeable playerbase - it is has the TES logo on it after all - but as we've been shown time and time again, people are moving away fro the traditional MMORPGs and towards either action(y) MMORPGs or MOBAs. And ESO does not seem to go too far away from the traditional MMORPG gameplay...
If ESO launches with a p2p model on top of that, I'm willing to bet it's gonna fail hard. Look at the most recent p2p MMORPGs - SWTOR was forced to go f2p within mere months of its release, and TSW... well, it has nearly sunk the studio that made it...
And btw, since when was Amalur ever competing with Skyrim in terms of sales? One is an Elder Scrolls game, the other was some new IP from some unknown studio... there was never a question of which would sell the most copies... which is a pity, because Amalur was a much better game than Skyrim...
Lots of people still play Rift. If stronger fantasy IP (Strongest in game world? Good example, fan made youtube video and over 8mill views. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SEuoEJkODE) and older company cant do better than that Im surprised.
Btw, P2P is dead is is probably biggest troll ever. No way they cant give that right to Blizzard only, no ****ing ever. Anyone who believe P2P is dead, needs to do some head check.
Anyway, I thought you guys would be happy when theres more fantasy MMO coming but I guess not.
I am also of the opinion that pay-to-play is dead, or at least dying quickly. It is just like Gmail gobbling up premium email sites.
This has gradually been replaced by free-to-pay. Which is good as people should not be forced to pay, but should be free to pay. This system also leaves everyone happy.
Games like this and GW2 are forced to go F2P or without sub fees because they cant compete with triplle A MMORPGs. Also TSW, its far from triple A MMORPG. Funcom's next big thing is probably AO2.
0
zebularMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 15,270Community Moderator
Lots of people still play Rift. If stronger fantasy IP (Strongest in game world? Good example, fan made youtube video and over 8mill views. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SEuoEJkODE) and older company cant do better than that Im surprised.
Btw, P2P is dead is is probably biggest troll ever. No way they cant give that right to Blizzard only, no ****ing ever. Anyone who believe P2P is dead, needs to do some head check.
Anyway, I thought you guys would be happy when theres more fantasy MMO coming but I guess not.
Games like this and GW2 are forced to go F2P or without sub fees because they cant compete with triplle A MMORPGs. Also TSW, its far from triple A MMORPG. Funcom's next big thing is probably AO2.
I don't believe GW2 fits the equation here. For you see, Guild Wars never was pay to play. Just Buy to Play, which is how they always intended (and did) to release GW2, as Buy to Play, with no subscription - just like it's predecessor.
Telling people they need to get their heads checked for having a different opinion however, is quite unfair. Surely there is a better way to argue a topic without resorting to such a demeanor.
Well, I cant see Blizzard dropping sub fees when Titan comes, Blizzard is who decide the pace and other devs follow if they can. So P2P isnt dying any time soon.
0
vindiconMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Lots of people still play Rift. If stronger fantasy IP (Strongest in game world? Good example, fan made youtube video and over 8mill views. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SEuoEJkODE) and older company cant do better than that Im surprised.
Btw, P2P is dead is is probably biggest troll ever. No way they cant give that right to Blizzard only, no ****ing ever. Anyone who believe P2P is dead, needs to do some head check.
Anyway, I thought you guys would be happy when theres more fantasy MMO coming but I guess not.
Well, it's not necessarily dead, but it certainly isn't the way to go anymore. It is still perfectly viable for some games - SWTOR was still viable with the amount of subs they had left - but f2p is where the money is right now, and unless the company running the game is satisfied with having 10 times less players and 2-3 times less profits than they could have - which would make them idiots - they should make the move.
Right now, everyone is jumping in the f2p wagon en masse. Big players like Bioware are going into f2p, and Crytek has even anounced they're gonna focus to f2p games after Crysis 3. Whole genres are now entirely f2p - non-f2p MOBAs for example do not exist anymore, even b2p is non-viable in the genre anymore. fps are almost there as well - unless you're CoD of BF, or possibly CS, it's f2p or sink. And MMORPGs are quickly approaching that point as well.
The thing with subscriptions is what exactly you're paying for. You're paying a monthly rent for your characters. Technically, even in f2p you do not own your characters - all server data are still property of the company - but you may come and go as you please and they will be there as long as the game exists. You don't have to worry that they'll be wiped unless you pay on time, and you don't have to worry if you're getting your money's worth out of the sub - you're almost always getting your money's worth in f2p because for the most part you're not buying timed passes, you're buying items and fluff of your choice and out of your own accord, not because you have to to keep playing. If you even buy anything, because you might as well not buy anything, and then the reward/money ratio is infinite. And that's why the majority of MMO players prefer f2p games.
Also, MMORPGs take a lot of time to get to the point where they have enough content to justify subscriptions. WoW and Eve have that, because they've been out since shortly after the last Ice Age, but everything else quite frankly doesn't. It's just not possible to get a healthy amount of content in an MMORPG before at least 1-2 years woth of patches and expansions have passed, and that means people will generally get bored of having nothing more tom do after a few months. Especially if your game is designed with 0 replayability, like TSW or SWTOR. Thus, you're gonna want to let your players come and go as they see fit, so that you can attract as many as possible to your game, and be able to lure them back whenever a new expansion comes, without them having to worry if it's gonna be worth it to come back again. And that's what f2p does best, and that's why traditional subscription models, now that MMORPGs have lost the unique appeal they once had, are dying.
Well, I cant see Blizzard dropping sub fees when Titan comes, Blizzard is who decide the pace and other devs follow if they can. So P2P isnt dying any time soon.
I'm willing to bet otherwise. WoW can remain p2p because it's the only themepark MMPRPG with enough content to justify a prolonged subscription. Titan will simply be another new kid on the block - and will have to compete with AAA MMORPGs that are free to play. DOTA was the leader in MOBAs but DOTA 2 simply had to go f2p to compete in the current market of its genre. Titan will likely be no different.
wow is overpriced, but still people pay for it because it already has an ecosystem. In society we buy a lot of things which are overpriced. There was a previous thread on it. GW2 as vindicon has pointed out, does not have subscription fee.
When a game comes out, what do you actually pay for? Maintained of servers? It doesnt not justify high subscription rates. For development of game itself? It was paid for when you actually bought it (or soon from the profits).
There was a very good article with analysis of budget etc. before WoW introduced fake-f2p model in which a good analysis was given. But such good articles get drowned over time in the seas of unreasonableness...
The model being followed by NW is a very viable method. Apart from that, boxed set-cost involved system like GW is also fair. But subscription based model is not the way to go anymore, unless you already have a very successful game (because then you form friends/guilds etc who probably won't try other game and you don't want to leave that game for them).
p.s. This topic was discussed before forums were merged. Truthseeker did post the link to that article. It compares the costs of different MMO in different stages to deduce how subscription based model doesn't justify the cost on it anymore.
0
ausdoerrtMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
The model being followed by NW is a very viable method.
So long as they keep to their word on "cosmetics and convenience items only", yes. Nothing cripples an MMO like artificial limitations to force the players to use the store to not be bored with their progress.
Comments
Well, Forsaken World still has and has always had the standard tiny circle smilies you see in most forums. So it's not like the bears are the universal PWE smilies or anything.
So, I guess it's just that they made the wrong decission and noone cba to change it before beta...
Still, could be worse... FW's forum avatars were absolutely broken for a year (and still are, though they have fixed a few issues) (And before anyone says "Can't be worse than having one avatar for everyone", I'm gonna say "how about 1/3 of the people being stuck with an image error pic for an avatar?")
Eh, I've moderated anime forums, I've seen worse smileys in my day. Frankly, I think they should just give up the pretenses and go ahead and use the onion emoticons.
Year? That's nothing, I've been waiting since announcement, that's almost 2. And just because you post about ESO in every thread, it won't make them release it any faster :P
Yeah, back then they had five shadows with text box showing you what they do when you hover over them. That page was all the website was. Has it been 2 years already? Time sure flies...
Is it wrong that I like those emotes better?
Why can't you just grin and bear it? b:laugh
I can't imagine them being anything more than place-holders anyway; they already mentioned something about the avatars changing to character portraits after release, so I'd presume the smilies would change when there are thousands of people posting here.
I just wish you could insert images and youtube videos into posts instead of having to hyperlink everything.
The reason why avatar have been changed to limited portraits is to keep the NW theme on the forums. So that forums do not look fragmented.
Using the smileys goes completely against that idea itself. How can you look at those atrocious bears and say they have integrated to this forum site? It defeats the whole point of limiting avatars.
That aside, smileys are not the only problem. There is a large background of black instead of greys. They should have alternating strips of This, greys and black to accentuate the forum part Vs the background e.g. STO. The large amount of blackness kills all the aesthetics of the site. There are more issues but they are too much to list without making this post a wall of text.
For me the recent Foundry footage has gone beyond all expectations:
- Every asset/monster available in game will be available for players in the Foundry
- You can customize mobs with an insane number of options, INCLUDING the powers/attacks/abilities that mobs have
- Hundreds of pre-sets for quick builds or a plethora of decorative objects and full customization to build from the ground up.
For me this is why I want to play the game, to make content. All Foundry content will be publishable to the general community, so realistically Cryptic/PW wont have to focus as much of their resources on providing game content as they will have a community doing it for them.
Yeah, I went back to check the Circle of Eight forum just today, and the first rumors/announcements of Neverwinter first cropped up in August 2010...
I remember when Craig Zinkievich did a video interview back in late 2009, a lot of folks on the STO forums commented about all the 4th ed D&D books on his desk, that progressed into "OMG Baldures gate online!!!" One other person said something about NWN Online but the hoopla died out a couple days later, I do wonder if it was in the planning stages then though.
Well, we know its coming in 2013. This is delayed more, who knows what happens. ESO is going to be massive, Skyrim absolutely crushed Amalur already.
I... have my doubts about that. From what we've been shown so far, I'd be more inclined to believe that it's not gonna be that succesful. Sure, it's gonna have some sizeable playerbase - it is has the TES logo on it after all - but as we've been shown time and time again, people are moving away fro the traditional MMORPGs and towards either action(y) MMORPGs or MOBAs. And ESO does not seem to go too far away from the traditional MMORPG gameplay...
If ESO launches with a p2p model on top of that, I'm willing to bet it's gonna fail hard. Look at the most recent p2p MMORPGs - SWTOR was forced to go f2p within mere months of its release, and TSW... well, it has nearly sunk the studio that made it...
And btw, since when was Amalur ever competing with Skyrim in terms of sales? One is an Elder Scrolls game, the other was some new IP from some unknown studio... there was never a question of which would sell the most copies... which is a pity, because Amalur was a much better game than Skyrim...
I agree. The p2p PC MMO model is pretty much dead. I believe their pre-fab plan is to start as p2p, then switch to f2p. Therefore they've already got a chunk of change in the front end... and then as the sales start to plummet, "surprise" everyone, go f2p, and collect significantly more residual funds.
In fact, at this point this sales technique, in my vocabulary, is a digital form of bait and switch, they sell one item as a complete package, then sell it again and again as a continually developed project.
I agree with you, I have my doubts about ESO too. That p2p community is going to be very very demanding of Bethesda, and I will hedge a bet with anyone that their angst will make this forum feel like Mr Rogers Neighborhood....
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!
I have never player ESO or Skyrim, but I was kind of saying the same thing for Connan. Moderate success of SW, ST, LOTRO and other big titles have eventually turned me to skeptic about famous things. Fame is perhaps spontaneous. Both lost and gained.
I know at least one person on these forums bashedthe graphics but I played that game with eyes wide and mouth agape. Due to issues with the ATI Catylist Control Center I couldn't even use AA without causing massive graphical glitches but even without AA I felt like I was walking through a dream.
Half the fun of the game was walking around and looking at this breathtaking landscape.
The only major downside that I would put on a negative to make me not want to play is the fact it has NO multiplayer support.
And I doubt they could have done half the things which made the game so great if they also had to worry about multiplayer support. Multiplayer is something which limits graphics to what they are in current games.
Basically, don't expect ESO to be Skyrim Online. It might have the same mechanics and similar storyline but to me that was the weaker end of Skyrim. It was an enjoyable game but once I beat the story and played around a bit more that was the end...
*Points to The Foundry* That defines the major difference between NWN, NWN2 and NWO from any other game currently on or soon to be on the market. Players know what players want. Give them the power and we'll have a great game yet.
It sure was. I coincidentally got my new monitor just in time to play it too
In a nutshell, Skyrim in my mind was designed to be the "last great rpg". They took the dying RPG genre, and went balls to the wall. Best graphics, best sound, ever. The story and combat were kinda meh. But the graphics (and sounds) were so far ahead of best-in-class, that I'd walk around the game trying to imagine what Pool of Radiance, Dark Queen of Krynn, Might & Magic, Bard's Tale and all the classics would have looked like if it they were published with today's technology.
That said, once you dummy down the graphics to mmo standards, and add in the internet nuances (lag) I think quite a few gamers are going to quickly realize that the "magic" and nostalgia they felt playing the this gorgeous rpg genre flashback game called Skyrim, is simply not the same.
I do wish the game well though...
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!
However, I personally would not call it "amazing". Aside from the fact that the world was gorgeous, it really didn't have much else to it. The combat was meh, the storylines were meeeeh and too linear, the game was buggier than a termite nest and the RPG systems were flawed in design and majorly unbalanced. Not to mention it looked like all the dungeons had been randomly generated from the same 4-5 tilesets...
Oh well, maybe this is just my nostalgia for the good ol'days, but I have yet to find a game that is to me better than FF XII. Or maybe it's not, because I recently loaded it again just to check out and I still find it the best game I've ever played (just above NWN2)
I also chuckle every time someone calls Skyrim "an RPG", and another time for every "great" or "amazing" used in the same sentence. b:chuckle
Lots of people still play Rift. If stronger fantasy IP (Strongest in game world? Good example, fan made youtube video and over 8mill views. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SEuoEJkODE) and older company cant do better than that Im surprised.
Btw, P2P is dead is is probably biggest troll ever. No way they cant give that right to Blizzard only, no ****ing ever. Anyone who believe P2P is dead, needs to do some head check.
Anyway, I thought you guys would be happy when theres more fantasy MMO coming but I guess not.
This has gradually been replaced by free-to-pay. Which is good as people should not be forced to pay, but should be free to pay. This system also leaves everyone happy.
I don't believe GW2 fits the equation here. For you see, Guild Wars never was pay to play. Just Buy to Play, which is how they always intended (and did) to release GW2, as Buy to Play, with no subscription - just like it's predecessor.
Telling people they need to get their heads checked for having a different opinion however, is quite unfair. Surely there is a better way to argue a topic without resorting to such a demeanor.
[ Support Center • Rules & Policies and Guidelines • ARC ToS • Guild Recruitment Guidelines | FR DM Since 1993 ]
Well, it's not necessarily dead, but it certainly isn't the way to go anymore. It is still perfectly viable for some games - SWTOR was still viable with the amount of subs they had left - but f2p is where the money is right now, and unless the company running the game is satisfied with having 10 times less players and 2-3 times less profits than they could have - which would make them idiots - they should make the move.
Right now, everyone is jumping in the f2p wagon en masse. Big players like Bioware are going into f2p, and Crytek has even anounced they're gonna focus to f2p games after Crysis 3. Whole genres are now entirely f2p - non-f2p MOBAs for example do not exist anymore, even b2p is non-viable in the genre anymore. fps are almost there as well - unless you're CoD of BF, or possibly CS, it's f2p or sink. And MMORPGs are quickly approaching that point as well.
The thing with subscriptions is what exactly you're paying for. You're paying a monthly rent for your characters. Technically, even in f2p you do not own your characters - all server data are still property of the company - but you may come and go as you please and they will be there as long as the game exists. You don't have to worry that they'll be wiped unless you pay on time, and you don't have to worry if you're getting your money's worth out of the sub - you're almost always getting your money's worth in f2p because for the most part you're not buying timed passes, you're buying items and fluff of your choice and out of your own accord, not because you have to to keep playing. If you even buy anything, because you might as well not buy anything, and then the reward/money ratio is infinite. And that's why the majority of MMO players prefer f2p games.
Also, MMORPGs take a lot of time to get to the point where they have enough content to justify subscriptions. WoW and Eve have that, because they've been out since shortly after the last Ice Age, but everything else quite frankly doesn't. It's just not possible to get a healthy amount of content in an MMORPG before at least 1-2 years woth of patches and expansions have passed, and that means people will generally get bored of having nothing more tom do after a few months. Especially if your game is designed with 0 replayability, like TSW or SWTOR. Thus, you're gonna want to let your players come and go as they see fit, so that you can attract as many as possible to your game, and be able to lure them back whenever a new expansion comes, without them having to worry if it's gonna be worth it to come back again. And that's what f2p does best, and that's why traditional subscription models, now that MMORPGs have lost the unique appeal they once had, are dying.
I'm willing to bet otherwise. WoW can remain p2p because it's the only themepark MMPRPG with enough content to justify a prolonged subscription. Titan will simply be another new kid on the block - and will have to compete with AAA MMORPGs that are free to play. DOTA was the leader in MOBAs but DOTA 2 simply had to go f2p to compete in the current market of its genre. Titan will likely be no different.
When a game comes out, what do you actually pay for? Maintained of servers? It doesnt not justify high subscription rates. For development of game itself? It was paid for when you actually bought it (or soon from the profits).
There was a very good article with analysis of budget etc. before WoW introduced fake-f2p model in which a good analysis was given. But such good articles get drowned over time in the seas of unreasonableness...
The model being followed by NW is a very viable method. Apart from that, boxed set-cost involved system like GW is also fair. But subscription based model is not the way to go anymore, unless you already have a very successful game (because then you form friends/guilds etc who probably won't try other game and you don't want to leave that game for them).
p.s. This topic was discussed before forums were merged. Truthseeker did post the link to that article. It compares the costs of different MMO in different stages to deduce how subscription based model doesn't justify the cost on it anymore.
So long as they keep to their word on "cosmetics and convenience items only", yes. Nothing cripples an MMO like artificial limitations to force the players to use the store to not be bored with their progress.