Kicks still not removed... say goodbye to another 20 hardcore pvpers

xavior44

Theres a group of us today that have all suffered losses either due to getting kicked or joining a in progress game thats already over but the team decided to kick somebody anyways.

REMOVE KICKING FROM PVP ITS NOT HARD

I myself and can speak for a few others WILL NOT touch pvp until kicking is removed and when somebody asks me how is pvp in this game.. im going to tell them its HAMSTER and not to waste their time.

@cwhitesidedev#9752 @nitocris83

unthoughtknown

20 hardcore players? Name them. PvP better off without toxic players who troll, corpse jump and trash talk.

trgluestickz

Who are these "20 hardcore PVPers", calling BS on this claim.

Kicking is frequently abused but its clear as day what your motive is here. You just want to be able to get away with being a complete HAMSTER to everyone without suffering any consequences for it.

I myself am torn on whether or not kicking being removed would actually change much. It definitely would need to be paired with other changes to PVP, and some way to safeguard against and discourage the other abuses that will get more common if kicking gets taken out.

I am often adversely affected by kick abuse, everyone is.
On the other hand, I am also often adversely affected by AFK or disconnected people, early quitters, people that make no effort to contribute to a match, people who throw games, bug abusers, trolls ect.
I benefit some of the time and I lose some of the time from the kick system.

PVP right now in general is maddeningly random and frustrating and doesn't reward people for their efforts as much as it should right now.

kalina311

it is easy / less likely to not join a match in progress using a simple search to see if/which a pvp instance map are still open/ in progress lol not to mention asking in pvp channel

kalina311

however after a team is leading by 300 points and the other team is at 0-50 points and cumulative of 10 deaths + (clearly a loss )there should be no kicking or reinforcements allowed ..there need to be a threshold established

trgluestickz

kalina311 said:

it is easy / less likely to not join a match in progress using a simple search to see if/which a pvp instance map are still open/ in progress lol not to mention asking in pvp channel

If you mean the 0/1 que popups, these are often joined accidentally. If you see 0/1, it means its an in progress match where someone either left or got kicked. Many people don't know better or they go to accept but forget to check if its 0/1 first. Or in my case, I sometimes press accept too fast to see what I just accepted.

These 0/1s I think shouldn't penalize or reward people who join them at all, as in make them not count towards the joining person's score at all. If there is a way to make this happen that is. In meantime, only thing I can suggest is try harder not to accept those 0/1s.

ashbury#6333

There needs to be kicking allowed so some of the idiots dont get to just verbally abuse people in there. When someone is just talking <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> I'll kick them. We dont need that in there. A major flaw in the kick system is not being able to view stats before accepting or decling the kick. If a kick is initiated, the stats of the player to be kicked should be able to be viewed without having to decline the kick to be able to inspect the player. You should be able to see not only their gear but time at camp, time engaged in battle, healing output, damage taken, k/d ratio, assists and whatever else. Kicking sucks when its abused but sometimes its necessary when you have AFK, toxic players, and people who throw matches for whatever reason. But declining a kick because you cant view these stats also just wasted that persons kick.

thefiresidecat

the easy solution is to just remove pvp from the game. no more aggro no more kicks.. no more toxic. it's win win win win

tom#6998

goodbye malebot o/

ashbury#6333

> @thefiresidecat said:
> the easy solution is to just remove pvp from the game. no more aggro no more kicks.. no more toxic. it's win win win win

I'll disagree. PvP is way more fun then fighting a computer. I dont want to run the same dungeon over and over and over. It's the same boring game. PvP every match is different. Properly built toons played by people who know the classes and how to play will bring out a match that is way more exciting than PvE content.

nightwish021

thefiresidecat said:

the easy solution is to just remove pvp from the game. no more aggro no more kicks.. no more toxic. it's win win win win

That`s a good idea, but in that case, they might as well remove the game for good, no more bugs, no more rants or upset people.

Now on a serious note, I am pretty certain that we as players mostly kick because of the leaderboard, we want to be in top 10% because of the rewards.

A better idea would be that if the rewards were based on the amount of matches you play, not on the leaderboard position, in this way a lost game won`t bother us that much.

At the moment, if you already are in the top 10% and care about the rewards, then you will most likely stop playing PVP on that char till the end of season so you don`t lose your place, but if the rewards were based on a number of matches, there won`t be anything holding you back from play more PVP.

autumnwitch

I would be curious is to know what the income ratio for Cryptic is for players that PVP vs those that don't. Last year they cut the Foundry and we all know they are having to to do more with less now. I wonder how cost effective it is to keep PVP. I'm not saying this because I think PVP should go because it's bad but if it's a drain and also obvious when you read PVP threads, it's in a bad state, is it really worth it for it to stay?

One thing I will say, I buy the 20key bundles now and again and the PVP set that comes with the Star Rover bundle always sells really fast on the AH so someone is out there playing.

ashbury#6333

I really dont think there are very many strictly PvP players only on XBox. Most of the cash cows have probably quit by now. Most people who PvP also PvE. I say this because player base is so small now and I do occasionally see a few of the veteran PvP players that are still around posting in zone chat building groups for PvE content. Someone that is new to the game probably isnt buying out campaign completions and purchasing the best gear to go into dom.

kalina311

thefiresidecat said:

the easy solution is to just remove pvp from the game. no more aggro no more kicks.. no more toxic. it's win win win win

fascinating cause you seem to love forum pvp .. i think regular Pvp would actually be good for you : D

I am looking forward to diverting "precious" games resources to pvp in the new pvp thread Chris will be launching
cya there :P

kiraskytower

ashbury#6333 said:

I really dont think there are very many strictly PvP players only on XBox. Most of the cash cows have probably quit by now. Most people who PvP also PvE. I say this because player base is so small now and I do occasionally see a few of the veteran PvP players that are still around posting in zone chat building groups for PvE content. Someone that is new to the game probably isnt buying out campaign completions and purchasing the best gear to go into dom.

The pool of PvPers is very, very small these days. Right now on PC there are 7 pages (of 20 people each) on the leaderboard for a total of 140 PvP characters. Total game population is on the order of 100-200+ times that (15-30K plus active players, depending on whose estimate you take). So on PC PvPers are less than 1% of the population ... and of course, almost all of them are also PvE players (you pretty much have to be to get decently geared up). Prior to Mod 17 PvP had basically died on PC ... none of the queues popped. Now, with the changes to PvP, only the solo queue pops and even then only during the "PvP Season". So if it is a question of PvP feeding Cryptic's bottom line ... it probably isn't even a blip on their radar. However ... unlike the foundry ... PvP also requires little maintenance on Cryptic's part, so while it does not earn them money, it likely doesn't cost them much to keep PvP around for the few who enjoy it either.

xavior44

tom#6998 said:

goodbye malebot o/

I didn't know you could say goodbye when your already gone

ashbury#6333

> @kiraskytower said:
> (Quote)
> The pool of PvPers is very, very small these days. Right now on PC there are 7 pages (of 20 people each) on the leaderboard for a total of 140 PvP characters. Total game population is on the order of 100-200+ times that (15-30K plus active players, depending on whose estimate you take). So on PC PvPers are less than 1% of the population ... and of course, almost all of them are also PvE players (you pretty much have to be to get decently geared up). Prior to Mod 17 PvP had basically died on PC ... none of the queues popped. Now, with the changes to PvP, only the solo queue pops and even then only during the "PvP Season". So if it is a question of PvP feeding Cryptic's bottom line ... it probably isn't even a blip on their radar. However ... unlike the foundry ... PvP also requires little maintenance on Cryptic's part, so while it does not earn them money, it likely doesn't cost them much to keep PvP around for the few who enjoy it either.

You are exactly right. This also what its starting to look like on xbox as well. When the season ends the Q is dead. But like you said it cant cost much if anything to have it in the game.

thefiresidecat

the easy solution is to just remove pvp from the game. no more aggro no more kicks.. no more toxic. it's win win win win

ashbury#6333 said:

> @thefiresidecat said:

> the easy solution is to just remove pvp from the game. no more aggro no more kicks.. no more toxic. it's win win win win



I'll disagree. PvP is way more fun then fighting a computer. I dont want to run the same dungeon over and over and over. It's the same boring game. PvP every match is different. Properly built toons played by people who know the classes and how to play will bring out a match that is way more exciting than PvE content.

I play pvp in other games. the other game I played for as long a time as this was uncharted pvp. this game is just never going to be balanced correctly. the different classes have way too much variation. and you get people gaming the q to go in against true randoms. I'd much rather load up destiny or COD for mp. the only time I had fun in this game with pvp was the levelling que when it was all very pared down. and even then it was pretty boring. the maps are meh. this is just a wrong game type for it imo. although a battle royale where you go in with no powers of any kind and find stuff on the ground. random powers from any toon type. basically going in as a no class and finding class powers on the ground or whatever could be fun. but having things levelled up and various classes in pvp just doesn't work. not to mention, while the shooter pvp community can be pretty toxic somehow my experience with neverwinter's pvp is even more so. i find it weird.

I really do think it has no place in this particular game.

gweddry

Kicking should be removed simply because 90% of kicks nowadays target newer players who are trying their best but just can't do as much as a more experienced, bis character. Not just that, there are many bis pve players who try PvP, but their poor builds and inexperience hold them back and they get kicked. They don't even get a chance to try and figure out how PvP works and give up.

Toxic players, trash talk, corpse jumping? Instant ignore list. Also some people just are that way and it's a problem shared by all PvP games.

Disabling kicks is certainly not the perfect solution, but it's the lesser evil. It could be made so that you can kick people who haven't touched a node, received/dealt damage in a certain amount of time.

thefiresidecat

gweddry said:

Kicking should be removed simply because 90% of kicks nowadays target newer players who are trying their best but just can't do as much as a more experienced, bis character. Not just that, there are many bis pve players who try PvP, but their poor builds and inexperience hold them back and they get kicked. They don't even get a chance to try and figure out how PvP works and give up.



Toxic players, trash talk, corpse jumping? Instant ignore list. Also some people just are that way and it's a problem shared by all PvP games.



Disabling kicks is certainly not the perfect solution, but it's the lesser evil. It could be made so that you can kick people who haven't touched a node, received/dealt damage in a certain amount of time.

toxic describes most pvp games but this one is more like advanced sepsis than the boil most communities are. I've seen a lot of toxic. I've played many pvp games. but honestly in my personal experience, anyway.. this one is by far the worst. kill it.. kill it with fire..

jmo