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OFFICIAL M17 - Appearance System

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  • bpstuartbpstuart Member Posts: 229 Arc User
    A welcome inclusion
    Ego etiam cupo recrari et amari diu post mortem meam
    I too wish to be recreated, and to be loved long after my death.
  • badgerpants999badgerpants999 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 70 Arc User
    Copied this from another forum but, It's more relevant to this one

    OK, Had another look at the new fashions options and, It's VERY clunky! I've got several dye options I've recieved from various dye packs but, no way to apply all the dye options from one pack simultaneously. I used to be able to just add all three dye colours to a garment at once and I do appreciate that I can change colours individually but. I kind of liked the option to use the dye packs.

    I miss just clicking on a dye pack and having the whole garment change colour. Now I need to select each colour individually. And I don't even know which colours I was using previously! I can, after many false starts, select a colour scheme that looks similar to one of the dye packs but, I've no way of knowing if it is the right colours. I liked those colours and was using them for a reason! Please give us the ability to apply all the colours from a dye pack to a garment with just one click!

    Also the ability to save colour patterns across characters would be nice, All I'd need to do then is, buy the right dye pack(s) and load a colour scheme from a file. Much easier than creating a spread sheet that sits next to my computer, full of all the various colour combinations I have used!
  • ailliver#7283 ailliver Member Posts: 16 Arc User
    I am thoroughly enjoying the new appearance system. I foresee a lot of gold and AD going into that until I get my characters just right. There are definitely some issues though.

    On the shield users, you can either have a shield or a weapon but not both and the appearance of the other item completely disappears if you use a fashion item there. You can clearly see it's an issue in how the items are tagged in the system as I can pick a shield for my main hand transmuted item slot.

    Something also needs to be done to allow us to use the existing fashion items (ie things like the wedding gown). They are not coded to be an armor or even one piece so it is acting like it just doesn't know where to put them so it eats the item like it is putting it into the library, but it is nowhere to be found on the fashion tab.
  • micky1p00micky1p00 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,462 Arc User


    I guess it's to late, and probably too much to ask, but any chance that visual setups will have 'loadouts' of their own.

    With best effort on missing or disabled slots - meaning that I can put the visual and change it (and save it) but it will be grayed out if my actual gear slot has visual disabled or missing the gear item.

    Can work exactly the same as regular loadouts, with 1-2 free slots, and ZEN purchase. With a visual loadout can be set as default for some gear loadout.


  • arcanjo86arcanjo86 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,061 Arc User
    micky1p00 said:



    I guess it's to late, and probably too much to ask, but any chance that visual setups will have 'loadouts' of their own.

    With best effort on missing or disabled slots - meaning that I can put the visual and change it (and save it) but it will be grayed out if my actual gear slot has visual disabled or missing the gear item.

    Can work exactly the same as regular loadouts, with 1-2 free slots, and ZEN purchase. With a visual loadout can be set as default for some gear loadout.


    if im not mistaken appearance tab have aplly to all loadouts option, so im assuming each loadout can have different appearance? can't check today, but will tomorow for sure.
  • isaacorion#1994 isaacorion Member Posts: 106 Arc User
    For Rangers:
    Dye-ing the main hand weapon Bow also applies the dye color scheme to the Offhand melee weapons. Attempting to dye the melee weapons afterwards does not over-ride the dye color scheme from the main hand Bow.
    (imagine this is in red, I don't remember the code for it)
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    Cleric: You can be an angel of mercy or give in to hate. - Shinedown
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  • adinosiiadinosii Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,294 Arc User
    Just a comment to let you know that we really appreciate the quick responces and upcoming fixes.
    uimaven said:

    3) When you add a transmuted item to your Appearance Library, the current transmuted appearance should be added to the library. If anything else is happening, please tell us!

    This is the only thing I have seen happening. ...and this is exactly how it should be. Really important for those who are using "unavailable" items for transmuting - perhaps copied from one item to another over and over.
    uimaven said:

    1) The red box to indicate disabled visuals is a placeholder and will be replaced by the real art. Our UI artist has been very busy!

    As someone else said, we need a better way to handle things when you are adding an item for a slot where you have visuals disabled. I suggest adding them as normally, but maybe pop up a box warning that it will not be selectable as visuals are currently disabled.
    uimaven said:

    3)5) We've added descriptions to all the library colour items saying the packs they come from.

    Brilliant. I have 45 different dye packs and there are still some colors missing...looking forward to see where they are from.

    Overall I like the system. Personally I would have liked the ability to save specific "outfits", as in saving a setup of a specific set of transformation items and colours. Then I could have a "wardrobe" of "outfits" and switch between complete outfits with a single click...Hey, I'd be happy to pay Zen for wardrobe slots. Any thoughts on whether we might get something like that at some point ?
    Hoping for improvements...
  • hustin1hustin1 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,318 Arc User
    edited July 2019
    Greywolf Breastplate before and after conversion. Dye colors are destroyed!

    screenshot-2019-07-14-18-08-46

    screenshot-2019-07-14-18-09-50
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  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,216 Arc User
    Your library of gear will have the colors of the original gear, you will need to convert dyes to your library to get the colors of the dungeon dye you had on it and then apply the dyes.
  • hustin1hustin1 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,318 Arc User
    edited July 2019
    arazith07 said:

    Your library of gear will have the colors of the original gear, you will need to convert dyes to your library to get the colors of the dungeon dye you had on it and then apply the dyes.

    Well, therein lies a problem. The gear *came* dyed: "dungeon dye packs" and "questing dye packs" are not separate dye packs that you can acquire. They're dyes that Cryptic assigned to the items when the items were created. Complicating the matter further is that not all Dungeon Dye Packs (as well as Questing Dye Packs) are the same. A Dungeon Dye Pack for one item can (and usually does) contain completely different colors than a Dungeon Dye Pack for another item.

    And then there's the real rub: some of the colors in these packs are completely unique and don't exist in any other pack (like the slightly pinkish red you see on my CW in page 1 of this thread -- that color doesn't exist in *any* pack that you can currently acquire). What we really need is a way to *extract* these dyes (or craft them).
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  • fdsakhfduewhfiuffdsakhfduewhfiuf Member Posts: 604 Arc User
    It would be cool to somewhere see a list of all possible appearance items. For a collector this would be a nice incentive for trying to collect all of them.
  • arcanjo86arcanjo86 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,061 Arc User
    hustin1 said:

    Greywolf Breastplate before and after conversion. Dye colors are destroyed!

    screenshot-2019-07-14-18-08-46

    screenshot-2019-07-14-18-09-50

    only the origina piece of gear and original color gets added to library the dyes need to be added individualy
  • aimsiesaimsies Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 66 Arc User
    While I really like the new changes and can finally clear out all the inventory slots storing transmutes for the last 4 years...
    The new system defeats the original intent of "free transmute" weapon items obtained from every CTA/Event as well as thew new fashion bag introduced not so long ago.

    I'll admit, paying 1k AD to transmute an item is a bit less of a hit than the 5k and 8k of present for most items, but spending 1k AD on an item that was obtained from a CTA or Event that's specifically listed as a Level 1 item intended only as a transmute and nothing more, is kind of a kick in the teeth when it used to be free and one of the reason people would collect/keep them.

    I'm also not a fan of the "double dip" on cost to change the appearance on the gear. There's the AD cost to change appearance of gear items, but then there's a gold cost as well on the dyes. As in the past both of these would be essentially free it kind of feels like you're sticking it to people a bit who like to change their dyes fairly frequently.

    I also don't see why there's a gold cost to change the dyes on the Fashion side of things since those appearance changes are (and always have been) free. If you're not one of those that hoarded every dye back/bottle of dye you're going to be paying in either time (running the events) or AD/Tradebars (instant gratification) for those colors, paying to use them, and paying to change the clothes you're wearing at the same time. You're getting hit with a cost at every opportunity.

    I know Lord Neverember is broke and all but c'mon...


    Dye remover should be removed from the Tradebar store as it no longer appears to be necessary.
  • hustin1hustin1 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,318 Arc User
    arcanjo86 said:

    hustin1 said:

    Greywolf Breastplate before and after conversion. Dye colors are destroyed!

    screenshot-2019-07-14-18-08-46

    screenshot-2019-07-14-18-09-50

    only the origina piece of gear and original color gets added to library the dyes need to be added individualy
    Well, a dev did say to notify them if the *transmuted look* of something doesn't match when converted to an appearance item. This is such a case.
    Harper Chronicles: Cap Snatchers (RELEASED) - NW-DPUTABC6X
    Blood Magic (RELEASED) - NW-DUU2P7HCO
    Children of the Fey (RELEASED) - NW-DKSSAPFPF
    Buried Under Blacklake (WIP) - NW-DEDV2PAEP
    The Redcap Rebels (WIP) - NW-DO23AFHFH
  • cilginordekcilginordek Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    Wonderful feature, about time. Thanks.
  • c1k4ml3kc3c1k4ml3kc3 Member Posts: 1,257 Arc User
    edited July 2019
    "While I really like the new changes and can finally clear out all the inventory slots storing transmutes for the last 4 years...
    The new system defeats the original intent of "free transmute" weapon items obtained from every CTA/Event as well as thew new fashion bag introduced not so long ago.
    "


    How? Just, how?
    CTA events with transmutes are meant to obtain for people who haven't acquired them. So, basically, you have one - you forever have it on one toon.


    "I'll admit, paying 1k AD to transmute an item is a bit less of a hit than the 5k and 8k of present for most items, but spending 1k AD on an item that was obtained from a CTA or Event that's specifically listed as a Level 1 item intended only as a transmute and nothing more, is kind of a kick in the teeth when it used to be free and one of the reason people would collect/keep them."

    I literally can't believe what I'm reading.


    The changes implemented I see this as something nice that the team did for us, the players, and then see your comment like "ah, ah, I'm blind, one gold need to be spent, ah!"
    Changing fashion was always expensive imho, and these changes alleviate it by quite a wide margin.
    I suggest to try, instead, giving a support to some rather nice changes which benefit a more dynamic gameplay and help the community to enjoy and immerse into the game more. And this is such a great, great feature.

    Don't stress over spending a bit of gold which I'm sure you already have far enough. And everyone had so much gold that they were trading it not that long ago, something like 2.000 gold for one-two gmop. And this changed when professions got introduced. It gives some purpose to the gold. And finally it feels good. Finally, you have to do something. And move around.

    What you present is art, actually. It's a vanity post about vanity.
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  • arcanjo86arcanjo86 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,061 Arc User
    hustin1 said:

    arazith07 said:

    Your library of gear will have the colors of the original gear, you will need to convert dyes to your library to get the colors of the dungeon dye you had on it and then apply the dyes.

    Well, therein lies a problem. The gear *came* dyed: "dungeon dye packs" and "questing dye packs" are not separate dye packs that you can acquire. They're dyes that Cryptic assigned to the items when the items were created. Complicating the matter further is that not all Dungeon Dye Packs (as well as Questing Dye Packs) are the same. A Dungeon Dye Pack for one item can (and usually does) contain completely different colors than a Dungeon Dye Pack for another item.

    And then there's the real rub: some of the colors in these packs are completely unique and don't exist in any other pack (like the slightly pinkish red you see on my CW in page 1 of this thread -- that color doesn't exist in *any* pack that you can currently acquire). What we really need is a way to *extract* these dyes (or craft them).
    or simply don't apply a dye on the slots you want to keep the dye
  • aimsiesaimsies Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 66 Arc User

    "While I really like the new changes and can finally clear out all the inventory slots storing transmutes for the last 4 years...
    The new system defeats the original intent of "free transmute" weapon items obtained from every CTA/Event as well as thew new fashion bag introduced not so long ago.
    "


    How? Just, how?
    CTA events with transmutes are meant to obtain for people who haven't acquired them. So, basically, you have one - you forever have it on one toon.


    "I'll admit, paying 1k AD to transmute an item is a bit less of a hit than the 5k and 8k of present for most items, but spending 1k AD on an item that was obtained from a CTA or Event that's specifically listed as a Level 1 item intended only as a transmute and nothing more, is kind of a kick in the teeth when it used to be free and one of the reason people would collect/keep them."

    I literally can't believe what I'm reading.


    The changes implemented I see this as something nice that the team did for us, the players, and then see your comment like "ah, ah, I'm blind, one gold need to be spent, ah!"
    Changing fashion was always expensive imho, and these changes alleviate it by quite a wide margin.
    I suggest to try, instead, giving a support to some rather nice changes which benefit a more dynamic gameplay and help the community to enjoy and immerse into the game more. And this is such a great, great feature.

    Don't stress over spending a bit of gold which I'm sure you already have far enough. And everyone had so much gold that they were trading it not that long ago, something like 2.000 gold for one-two gmop. And this changed when professions got introduced. It gives some purpose to the gold. And finally it feels good. Finally, you have to do something. And move around.

    What you present is art, actually. It's a vanity post about vanity.

    You kinda missed my point a little.

    I meant that the idea of the free transmute ability from those CTA items is gone - it's not free anymore. One of the reasons people would use those items over other pieces of gear for transmutation was because they were free. Especially in the early days when AD was rather hard to come by and later on because why waste the AD on a transmute when you can do it for free. When M16 came and the cost to transmute certain pieces went from 5k per piece to 8k and change I know several people went to transmute and thought "ehhh not really worth it" and used a free one or just left it.

    Secondly, they gave us a fashion bag to store all the fashion items that were taking up inventory spaces, some people paid Zen for extra room - now that is effectively not needed unless you're storing the unbound items to sell on the AH or trade to a current/future alt. I'm not complaining about this by any means, I truly think this part is great, it just seems like a waste of programming a few mods ago just to change it all again now.

    Thirdly - Yes I'm complaining about the gold cost. Think about it in a real world application setting. You want to change the shirt you're wearing - you go to to the store and pay for a new one and take it home. Great! A week goes by and you decide that you want to change the color on it because you don't really love it anymore. You don't want to buy a brand new shirt so you just buy a bottle of dye to change the color yourself and bring it home. Again, great! Except... every time you want to use that bottle of dye you've already purchased and now own you have to pay another fee for it. THAT'S the part I have an issue with. Charge me to change the item I want to use, but don't repeatedly charge me to use the same bottle of dye I already paid for. I get that it's minimal but it does add up and feels like it's nickel-and-diming the players "just because" and I don't like it. You don't have to agree with me, I'm just stating how I feel about it.

    Overall I really do like the changes and the entire interface, just not that one small piece with the repeated cost.
  • uimavenuimaven Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 31 Cryptic Developer


    Something also needs to be done to allow us to use the existing fashion items (ie things like the wedding gown). They are not coded to be an armor or even one piece so it is acting like it just doesn't know where to put them so it eats the item like it is putting it into the library, but it is nowhere to be found on the fashion tab.

    I just tested this and the wedding fashion items seem to work for me. Your fashion look is a different set of slots from your gear slots (just like it was before) so you have to change to your fashion slots by clicking the little purple mask icon to the lower right of the fashion paperdoll (just like you did before). Once you do that, you should see your three fashion slots (head, upper body and lower body) and any fashion items you've converted should be available in the appearance libraries of those slots.

    Does that help?
  • uimavenuimaven Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 31 Cryptic Developer
    edited July 2019

    Copied this from another forum but, It's more relevant to this one

    OK, Had another look at the new fashions options and, It's VERY clunky! I've got several dye options I've recieved from various dye packs but, no way to apply all the dye options from one pack simultaneously. I used to be able to just add all three dye colours to a garment at once and I do appreciate that I can change colours individually but. I kind of liked the option to use the dye packs.

    I miss just clicking on a dye pack and having the whole garment change colour. Now I need to select each colour individually. And I don't even know which colours I was using previously! I can, after many false starts, select a colour scheme that looks similar to one of the dye packs but, I've no way of knowing if it is the right colours. I liked those colours and was using them for a reason! Please give us the ability to apply all the colours from a dye pack to a garment with just one click!

    Also the ability to save colour patterns across characters would be nice, All I'd need to do then is, buy the right dye pack(s) and load a colour scheme from a file. Much easier than creating a spread sheet that sits next to my computer, full of all the various colour combinations I have used!

    I'm sorry you find it clunky. When we redefined and harmonized all the dye colours to give a better palette, though, we made several dye packs give some of the same colours. There's no longer a one-to-one relationship with the library colours and the dye packs and in fact the library colours don't actually know (in a meaningful sense) what dye pack they came from. So there's simply no list of dye packs to apply to a slot (you don't dye garments any more, remember, you're defining colours of a slot).

    I hope that the feature I'm adding, where you'll be able to copy the three colours from one slot to another with two clicks, will allow you to effectively make your own "dye pack" with any of your own unlocked library colours, at least as far as being able to quickly change all three colours goes.

    We'll add saving appearance information between characters to our list of possible future improvements, thanks!
  • rafaeldarafaelda Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 662 Arc User

    After adding a LOT of Dyes to the library, i looks at the trade bard dyes and i cant believe even buying all of them i would be able to unlock the missing colors.

    Will these missing color be add in some form, like Crafting or event drop ? is this already planned, not decided yet or a i'm missing something ?
  • ailliver#7283 ailliver Member Posts: 16 Arc User
    uimaven said:


    Something also needs to be done to allow us to use the existing fashion items (ie things like the wedding gown). They are not coded to be an armor or even one piece so it is acting like it just doesn't know where to put them so it eats the item like it is putting it into the library, but it is nowhere to be found on the fashion tab.

    I just tested this and the wedding fashion items seem to work for me. Your fashion look is a different set of slots from your gear slots (just like it was before) so you have to change to your fashion slots by clicking the little purple mask icon to the lower right of the fashion paperdoll (just like you did before). Once you do that, you should see your three fashion slots (head, upper body and lower body) and any fashion items you've converted should be available in the appearance libraries of those slots.

    Does that help?
    Thank you for your reply. You are correct. That's where they were hiding at. I had high hopes that this system was going to let us mix and match the fashion items in with the gear items, but doesn't look like that is the case. I am happy that my outward appearance can be that of my fashion clothing while i look at my gear page (right now to look at gear and swap pieces the public must see whatever I'm trying to hide and hope i don't forget to turn back to the fashion page).
  • ailliver#7283 ailliver Member Posts: 16 Arc User
    Oh, another question came up that I forgot to ask. When I open some of the dye packs to add to the colors, it says that they are already there and won't open but I only have 1 of the 3 colors in the pack. IE pack A came with black, red, blue, and pack B came with black, purple, and green but won't open because I have black already. I assume this is a bug?
  • hustin1hustin1 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,318 Arc User
    edited July 2019
    arcanjo86 said:

    hustin1 said:

    arazith07 said:

    Your library of gear will have the colors of the original gear, you will need to convert dyes to your library to get the colors of the dungeon dye you had on it and then apply the dyes.

    Well, therein lies a problem. The gear *came* dyed: "dungeon dye packs" and "questing dye packs" are not separate dye packs that you can acquire. They're dyes that Cryptic assigned to the items when the items were created. Complicating the matter further is that not all Dungeon Dye Packs (as well as Questing Dye Packs) are the same. A Dungeon Dye Pack for one item can (and usually does) contain completely different colors than a Dungeon Dye Pack for another item.

    And then there's the real rub: some of the colors in these packs are completely unique and don't exist in any other pack (like the slightly pinkish red you see on my CW in page 1 of this thread -- that color doesn't exist in *any* pack that you can currently acquire). What we really need is a way to *extract* these dyes (or craft them).
    or simply don't apply a dye on the slots you want to keep the dye
    Who is applying dyes? When the item drops, it already has the dyes applied to it. Players are not applying these dyes -- the items come this way.

    I think before this issue gets too blown up, we need a response from a dev. Can the missing "dungeon dye pack" or "questing dye pack" colors be added to the library when the item is converted? Can the packs be added as craftable recipes? It shoudn't take more than a few SQL queries to identify all existing such packs in whatever item database they have. There is more than one reasonable way to deal with this issue.
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  • shafuqshafuq Member Posts: 15 Arc User
    Feature request:

    I would really appreciate a "disable visual" for the doohickey with the new fashion system. I don't want to wear fashion gear, would rather use my normal armor and not have its visual open.
  • adinosiiadinosii Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,294 Arc User
    The dye system is a great QoL improvement - however, it has a fundamental flaw. If you only ever wear one "outfit" and just want to find the perfect color combination for that, it is just great...no issues.

    If, however, you like switching between multiple outfits, with a particular combination of transformations and colors, it is...well, cumbersome, to say the least. I need to re-select all the transformation items, and then re select the right combination of colours for all of them.

    I did comment on it earlier, but here are the details:

    I define "outfit" as a set of transformation items or as a particular set of fashion items, and the associated dye colors. Ideally, I would like a button where I could "save" my current combination and name it. I would have a "wardrobe", with a set of slots for saved/named outfits (And I would be happy to pay Zen for additional slots, as needed), where I could select a specific outfit with just a click or two. That would then switch to the specific set of transformation or fashion items and dye colors I had saved originally.

    And yes, there would be no need to distinguish between regular outfits and "fashion" outfits in the wardrobe - if I select a transformation item outfit, I would switch to regular view...if I switch to a fashion outfit, I would automatically switch to fashion view.
    Hoping for improvements...
  • uimavenuimaven Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 31 Cryptic Developer

    Oh, another question came up that I forgot to ask. When I open some of the dye packs to add to the colors, it says that they are already there and won't open but I only have 1 of the 3 colors in the pack. IE pack A came with black, red, blue, and pack B came with black, purple, and green but won't open because I have black already. I assume this is a bug?

    If you already have one or two of the colours in a pack, then the remaining two or one should still unlock. You should only see the "This color already exists in the Color Library" tooltip if all three colours are already unlocked. So what you're describing is definitely a bug. Which dye packs were you using?






  • uimavenuimaven Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 31 Cryptic Developer
    edited July 2019
    shafuq said:

    Feature request:

    I would really appreciate a "disable visual" for the doohickey with the new fashion system. I don't want to wear fashion gear, would rather use my normal armor and not have its visual open.

    I'm not clear what you're asking for, sorry. Are you asking specifically about the "Doohickey" from the Wonders of Gond event? That does add a visual effect to your character, but it doesn't change you to wearing fashion.

    In general, though, if you don't want to wear a fashion outfit, don't click on the purple mask and don't click on "Wear Fashion."

    ETA: Oh, I see what you mean, I think. The only way to not see the Doohickey is to wear fashion, right? I see what you mean now. Disabling effects is actually a whole other system, and we are indeed looking at it.


    Post edited by uimaven on
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