Post Your Detailed Ideas For Improving PVP

trgluestickz

For the devs, I wrote up 2 large posts worth of PVP update ideas for a different thread. Since that thread is quickly turning into another class war, I've decided to move my feedback here, both posts are located directly below this one.

If anyone has their own well thought out suggestions to add, I encourage you to post them below or start your own thread.

If anyone spots an issue with my suggestions, feel free to post that as well.

I will also use my dev handles list since the suggestions in this thread are intended for them to make use of. I still don't know exactly who does what so I am linking everyone on the team I could find:

List of Devs, Mods, and Admins:

@rgutscheradev
@frozenfirevr
@terramak
@dreadnaught
@chaidrin#2320
@nitocris83
@asterdahl
@mimicking#6533
@uimaven
@noworries#8859
@ctatumdev#6113
@crypticarkayne
@zebular
@ambisinisterr
@tripsofthrymr
@kreatyve
@sgrantdev
@balanced#2849
@bicyclops#3731
@ncoreadev#4548
@crypticmapolis
@scarabman

trgluestickz

Here is part 1 of my bucketlist of changes I'd like to see implemented for PVP. Part 2 is directly below this post:

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Among the #1 hot topics for the PVP community right now is the latest wave of broken and overpowered items plaguing PVP. Even when not bugged, these Items are too strong in a PVP setting and are intimately involved with a lot of player's decision to quit PVP.

A lot of PVP players want non-stat related item powers disabled in PVP, with some calling for more items to be included in this list than others. In particular, disabling most or all non-stat related gear powers in PVP is a popular request right now. This is something I recommend as well, this would put a stop to hated items like mane of the manticore, cowl of the dead, chitters fangs, sandy's pants, ring powers, ect. It would also prevent many future items the devs release from causing problems in PVP.

There are also 2 other items that should be removed from the game entirely. These items despite the devs' repeated attempts to nerf them, are as hated as ever. Removing these 2 items from the game would likely result in comically little resistance if any. Since these item's release, I have yet to find a single PVPer who is against their removal from the game, even the people who use them don't seem to like that drains exist:

Mark of stamina drain

Mark of AP drain

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Another change I want to see is a safeguard for the solo que that prevents sync queing. A good idea would be adding a team reshuffler that automatically reshuffles the teams after everyone has accepted the que.

Right now, people can and do exploit the solo que to bring in premades or buddies, you hear about full premade sync queuing happening more on xbox but it also occasionally happens on PC. Sync queing into solo que with a buddy is extremely common on PC as well.

Preventing solo que syncing will also help a lot if the PVP rewards system gets an overhaul to go with it. This would keep premades from farming pugs in the solo que for easy rewards.

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A rewards pass for PVP is also long overdue and would increase the PVP population by attracting more newer players and allowing people to progress through PVP instead of having to devote huge swaths of time to grinding PVE content for everything they need. Many players over the years have end up quitting or converting to full PVE play. Some of these people were diehard PVP players who didn't enjoy playing PVE and weren't going to turn to 100% pay to win to sustain their activities. You also have people who like both PVE and PVP but choose to devote 100% of their time to PVE owing to the lack of progression offered by PVP. The PVP ques were extremely active during the discontinued NCL event as well and a lot of these nostalgic PVP players would start playing again if a good rewards overhaul was implemented. Here are my suggestions:

A rework to the outdated veteran PVP campaign is much needed. The boons it offers are nearly useless and the novelty items it offers can only be claimed one time and are very lacking. A good adjustment to this would be adding in some desirable new stuff and repeatable milestone tasks that grant rewards. These sorts of tasks could be tied to reworked leader board accomplishments and scores. Strongholds siege should also be added to the veteran campaign.

PVP's currencies and match drops only net you outdated HAMSTER right now save for gear you only need to purchase one time. There is better equipment available through PVE and nothing to motivate people to keep coming back for more. The glory and grym coin stores badly need a rework and should include items that keep people coming back for more. Making grym coin stores have desirable rewards again would probably revive the close to abandoned guantlgrym que and is especially important. Banners of the fallen from strongholds siege also don't buy you much desirable stuff and this store should get an overhaul as well after the PVP population has increased some.

A PVP season system AKA revamped Neverwinter Combat League event is something a ton of PVP players have been asking for over the years and I highly recommend implementing something like this.

To protect a revamped PVP rewards system from botters and moochers, a major safeguard PVP needs is to gate most rewards behind winning the match. AD, special drops, ect should all be win only rewards. Glory should remain available as a participation prize, you could make everything in the glory stores bound to account to prevent botter mishaps and ensure that players who lost the match get something for their effort. Most of the win only prizes should be made sellable/tradeable.

Another major safeguard that should be implemented alongside a rewards overhaul is the solo que sync prevention safeguard I mentioned earlyer. This will prevent premades from farming solo que pugs for rewards.

I will link an older thread I posted on a possible way to overhaul PVP rewards. The parts of that suggestion thread that deal with old discontinued transmutes are no longer viable but the rest of it is still a decent framework to work with:

https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1237309/to-the-devs-a-fleshed-out-suggestion-for-pvp-rewards

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The PVP leaderboard should be updated. This would help bring back the competitive element of PVP. My suggestions below would also provide greater score accuracy, encourage better teamwork, make the leaderboard more support class friendly, and discourage self serving behavior:

Add more categories to the leaderboard scores. Here are a few good options for new categories:
-- All scores should be grouped by the que they were made in. As an example, if you got 50 kills/102 deaths in the regular que, 800 kills/4 deaths in the solo que, and 36 kills/20 deaths in guantlgrym, the leaderboard would list them all separately.
-- Add more support class friendly categories.
-- If possible, add a nodes defended category.
-- Add node caps to the leaderboard categories.

As I suggested earlier, connect the veteran campaign repeatable milestones task idea to the leaderboard. One of these tasks should be to get the majority of your kills while standing on a node for X number of matches. So support classes can get in on the action as well, there should be another variant of this task for doing the majority of your healing, buffing, and damage taking while on node.

Make everyone's match history including player names on both teams publicly visible. Right now, only you can see your own match history details.

Add strongholds siege to the list of PVP types the scoreboard recognizes.

Add in a team leaderboard and score categories oriented towards ranking entire teams. This would help a lot if a ravamped NCL event/PVP season system was ever released.

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Another hot topic lately for the PVP community has been the idea of adding more PVP updates that cater to competitive PVP play. I've already discussed leaderboard fixes above which touches on this some but another popular idea is a PVP team window and competitive PVP que to go along with the solo que. Here is an excellent thread that went over this idea in detail:

https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1238432/req-team-competitive-queue-for-domination-details

I will also post a similar que related thread. This one requires more que categories to get it working than the one above, because of this, it likely can't be implemented without first expanding the PVP population via other updates. It had some good ideas related to enchantment scaling for PVP that deserve a mention though:

https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1240181/pvp-category-queues-details

trgluestickz

Here is part 2 of my bucketlist of changes I'd like to see implemented for PVP:
Part 1 is directly above this post.

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Related to class balance, I'd like to see a consorted effort to increase build variety for all classes. Many feats trees and paragon paths lag behind the rest and need some love and attention. Many powers are underwhelming and see significantly less use than others. Many classes are stuck with only 1 or 2 meta builds and are nearly clones of each other as a result.

Creating a duplicate of each power in the game for PVP and then tweaking those duplicates for one game mode or the other as needed would help with build variety by making it easier to buff weak powers. This would also make balancing the classes for both PVE and PVP much easier and end the conflict of interest between PVE and PVP players vieing for power adjustments. Some powers already carry separate effects in PVP vs PVE, this idea would expand upon that and would make needed adjustments easier to carry out in the future.

Also related to this, is how some classes don't need certain stats in PVP, a major example being critical strike. If I remember right, critical hits deal less damage than your regular hits unless you are past a certain critical severity threshold, I can't remember for sure what that threshold was though. If this is still true, doing some work on this stat in PVP could improve build variety by providing more viable stat stacking options.

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I also want to see icewind dale PVP get revived. Right now, its nearly abandoned and no serious play happens here.

One of the biggest issues facing icewind dale PVP was thankfully addressed in the module 14 patch notes, I'd like to give the devs a warm thank you for removing the conqueror's shards requirement from the barracks boon structure. This put a stop to a longstanding ugly conflict of interest between PVE shard farmers and the few PVPers that still hang out in icewind dale.

However, more work still needs to be done to salvage PVP in this zone. Another major reason for how little traffic open world PVP gets is that you can use companions and their active powers here. Companion powers and bonuses are built with PVE in mind and tend to be overpowered when placed into a PVP setting. The summoned companion grants you a huge amount of added stats and sometimes the companion itself is able to hit for huge amounts of damage. The active bonuses can be even worse considering killing the companion doesn't make their effects go away. As a few examples, there are 4 companions that grant insane amounts of control bonus and control resist, a total of 65% control bonus and 75% control resist adding up all of them. There are numerous companions that grant massive extra heals as well. You can also add extra control powers, tons of extra damage, ect. It is absolutely essential that companions be disabled in icewind dale PVP if an attempt to revive this PVP type is made.

Icewind Dale also lost a huge chunk of its PVP population due to the instance switching nerf the zone got a long time ago. This was probably done to stop one team from filling up the zone with a majority of their own teammates and outnumbering the other team. However this nerf ended up nearly killing icewind dale PVP altogether, massive guild vs guild fights no longer take place here and organizing matches in general here is a pain. It is common knowledge that you can get around the instance switch nerf if you are partied with a friend on the instance you want to get to and change maps and back, this means you can still unbalance teams in the zone but the extra difficulty heavily discouraged the PVP community from using this zone for much.
This instance switch nerf needs to be removed if this zone is ever to see high activity rates again.

When black ice was newer, the presence of larger black ice mining spots in openworld PVP drew a crowd of PVE farmers to the PVP zone. These PVEers weren't interested in fighting and a conflict of interest between usually peaceful PVEers and PVPers wanting free reign to attack anyone they wished was born. Trolls and bullies started attacking weak PVEers here as well and did a number on the relationship between PVEers and PVPers. Many PVPers set up a loose honor code of sorts and most PVPers started asking permission to fight a player instead of just attacking them outright. This helped PVEers but also lowered the icewind dale PVP population. Black ice farmers are in short supply nowadays but still occasionally show up. A good way to encourage more free fighting would be to change black ice mining sites in PVP to the same size and distance apart as the ones in the PVE sections of the map.

A rewards overhaul would also help revitalize icewind dale PVP, though some extra care will probably need to be taken for this zone to prevent farming and I'm not entirely sure what to suggest. Win only rewards aren't safe from icewind dale farming attempts, people simply create farming channels for this zone when there is something worth getting.

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I would also like to see strongholds siege PVP get revived though this should happen later on when the PVP population has increased some from other updates.

The biggest obstacle to reviving siege PVP is low population size due to all of PVP's other problems right now.

A close runner up in why nobody plays siege is the infamously bad lag this map gets. Finding ways to reduce the lag here would help a lot.

Similarly to icewind dale PVP, the presence of companion active bonuses in siege PVP play a huge role in why most PVP players don't touch this que. Removing active companion bonuses from this que is a must.

The effects of class inbalances and powercreep are amplified in siege thanks to the number of people you can have. The issues from this could be reduced with more class adjustments and a powercreep reduction overhaul to PVP.

A lack of compelling rewards in siege also contribute to why nobody plays this. Siege has a great participation weekly quest but this has not resulted in any real PVP matches being started, instead people just do no-fight farming matches. Granted I'm not bothered by people farming this quest since you can do it in the private que safely out of anybody's way and can only complete it once per character a week. To encourage real PVP matches to take place here, desirable win only rewards and a currency store overhaul for banners of the fallen should be added to siege PVP.

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Guantlgrym I won't discuss much here since my part 1 post's section on a PVP rewards overhaul would likely be enough to get this que popping again. I will reiterate the essential thing that guantlgrym needs though, grym coin vendors need to be reworked to include desirable rewards that aren't all the same as rewards offered by other PVP types. Some of the rewards offered also need to be things that keep people comming back for more instead of 1 time purchases.

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For larger PVP matches and PVE raids, the que leader has to go through a lot of trouble to reshuffle the parties. They have to kick each person they want to move from the que group and invite them back in a specific order. Things get even more tedious if you try to organize the que group when inside the raid, whoever you invite back in will simply be dropped into a vacant slot and the que group comp will no longer match the party comps, making it much more difficult to put people where they need to be. It would be a huge quality of life improvement for PVPers and PVEers alike if que leaders could use a simple drag and drop option to move players in the que around.

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Removing the crazy strict voting kick restrictions for PVP is also something I want to see. These restrictions make it much harder for teams to remove trolls, AFK people, toxic teammates, exploiters, AD moochers, and botters from their matches. These sorts of people seem to have gotten bolder than before thanks to the new restrictions. You can kick once, but oftentimes there are only a handful of matches going on at one time and you will most likely run into that person again or another person you have good reason to kick in under 4 hours. You can leave the match but you are likely to get a 30 minute que penalty if you do.

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Someone suggested elsewhere that there should be a basic PVP tutorial available. This tutorial should include important basics on how to best help your team. (going to 2 at the begining of a match, the basics of how to rotate, fighting on node when possible, ect.)

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At some point, I'd like to see new PVP types get introduced, capture the flag and deathmatches would likely go over well.

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Many players over the years have been requesting the foundry to be brought back and overhauled, it is severely outdated and has a lot of potential if it gets a proper overhaul. Among the updates the foundry should get if it is overhauled is an option to create custom PVP maps for the public to play.

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kalina311

1. assign Permanent devs for pvp changes only.. mandate mandatory pvp forums involvement / participation
2.assign a few forums mods for pvp only
3. assign class representatives .
4. have devs created polls in pvp forums that are actually acted upon and actionable within scope ,
5. pvp state of the game
6. list of pvp changes being worked on / roadmap
7. dream on

kalina311

new pvp item to introduce .... from the DUNGEONS MASTERS GUIDE ..

Hat of Stupidity: This hat is indistinguishable from any other magical hat, even when most carefully detected by magical means. Only by placing it upon the head can its powers be determined. Of course, once on the head, the wearer (PLAYER / DEV ) will believe that the hat is a beneficial item (FOR PVP ), for he will be overcome by stupidity. Intelligence is lowered to 7, or by -1 if the wearer has a 7 or lower Intelligence normally. The wearer will always desire to have the hat on—especially when he is engaged in any activity which requires thinking, spellcasting, etc (CLASS BALANCING) . Without the benefit of a remove curse spell or similar magic, the wearer (DEV / PLAYER )will never be free from the magic of the hat OR BE ABLE TO REMOVE / INSIST ON USING BROKEN ITEMS. If released, the wearer's Intelligence returns to its normal level.

eclipseblood

I would like a different PvP match, maybe a free for all match sort of like king of the hill or whatever that game is called, whoever has the crown earns point over time whoever reaches 1k points 1st wins. i would love for an in game PvP event where it keeps track of players similar to the leaderboards, at the end rewards are distributed. Having rewards separate for Dom and solo Dom along with gg and sh seige with private queue not counting.

slysnow

Ctf 5v5 mode would be a huge boost to activity. No stamina usage allowed while carrying flag plus you're slowed. The strategies would (could) make pvp addictive lol.

A convert glory to "key" option in pvp menu much like the create a key in under dark. (Can make Enchanted key create, legendary Dragon key, etc).

Disable pve gear from pvp. Give everyone (non discardable) basic pvp gear if they're new.

Worthwhile rewards: pvp only legendary mounts (2k control resist or combat advantage, etc).

Pvp weapons with (random rerollable) bonuses

Re rollable gear (pvp only, can only roll one stat up to 5 times before lockout). Can make rolling a Zen only currency that will increase "your coin."

Move some pve mats needed for vivifying, or master crafting etc pvp locked. This will significantly boost pvp participation.

Kick system fix and enact auto kick to people at camp fire longer than two minutes with a loss on record

schietindebux

kalina311 said:

new pvp item to introduce .... from the DUNGEONS MASTERS GUIDE ..

Hat of Stupidity: This hat is indistinguishable from any other magical hat, even when most carefully detected by magical means. Only by placing it upon the head can its powers be determined. Of course, once on the head, the wearer (PLAYER / DEV ) will believe that the hat is a beneficial item (FOR PVP ), for he will be overcome by stupidity. Intelligence is lowered to 7, or by -1 if the wearer has a 7 or lower Intelligence normally. The wearer will always desire to have the hat on—especially when he is engaged in any activity which requires thinking, spellcasting, etc (CLASS BALANCING) . Without the benefit of a remove curse spell or similar magic, the wearer (DEV / PLAYER )will never be free from the magic of the hat OR BE ABLE TO REMOVE / INSIST ON USING BROKEN ITEMS. If released, the wearer's Intelligence returns to its normal level.

The hat also leads to an irresistable desire to put on AP- and Stamina-drains... you forgot about that small side effect.

cilginordek

slysnow#2290 said:

A convert glory to "key" option in pvp menu much like the create a key in under dark. (Can make Enchanted key create, legendary Dragon key, etc).

Can't wait till everyone starts PvP key farm bots, that will be excellent for PvP.

They also tried most of your armor suggestions before. The problem is they never maintain them so it falls into obscurity. Any suggestion that requires having different sets for PvE and PvP is more effort than they are willing to put into PvP from what we've seen in the past, so you should come up with a solution that requires less work on their end, not more.

trgluestickz

slysnow#2290 said:

Ctf 5v5 mode would be a huge boost to activity. No stamina usage allowed while carrying flag plus you're slowed. The strategies would (could) make pvp addictive lol.



A convert glory to "key" option in pvp menu much like the create a key in under dark. (Can make Enchanted key create, legendary Dragon key, etc).



Disable pve gear from pvp. Give everyone (non discardable) basic pvp gear if they're new.



Worthwhile rewards: pvp only legendary mounts (2k control resist or combat advantage, etc).



Pvp weapons with (random rerollable) bonuses



Re rollable gear (pvp only, can only roll one stat up to 5 times before lockout). Can make rolling a Zen only currency that will increase "your coin."



Move some pve mats needed for vivifying, or master crafting etc pvp locked. This will significantly boost pvp participation.



Kick system fix and enact auto kick to people at camp fire longer than two minutes with a loss on record

Most of these ideas would be good options to consider.

However, there is one thing on your list I am against, the idea of locking some PVE profession or vivifying mats behind PVP in order to boost participation. I'm in favor of more desirable PVP rewards but the devs shouldn't make any important PVE items only obtainable through PVP, it seems like a great idea on paper but historically has not turned out well for PVPers or PVEers. Take the infamous barracks boon structure conquerer's shards of power cost requirement as a prime example.

The devs also need to be careful with rewards that you can get though PVE but are significantly easier to obtain by PVPing. There is probably a way to implement this well but what first comes to mind is an example of a bad implementation, black ice. It is easier to farm black ice in the PVP zone than it is to farm it on the PVE sections of the map, historically this caused more problems than benefits for both PVPers and PVEers.

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I like your idea of auto kicking anyone who has been standing in the spawn area for 2 minutes and adding a loss to their record, it is however a double edged sword and I'm not sure whether I'd support its implementation or not.

The downside is that for severely unbalanced matches, a team that wants to kill farm your team can now do so freely since you have nowhere safe to wait until the match ends.

The upside is that quitters, moochers, and AFK players won't get positive match credit for sitting in a safezone instead of helping out. Another upside is that this could encourage people to fight for longer before giving up.

On PC, this idea would likely be beneficial more often than not, though the same probably isn't true of consoles, consoles have more issues with badly behaved premades from what I've heard.

Another thing worth mentioning about the campfire idea is that 2 mins may not be the best timeframe to pick, I think it would need to be shorter, probably 1 minute. I'm also concerned how this would interact with matches where one of your teammates takes a long time to load in, after 1 min, everyone in the match might get kicked and a loss added to their record simply because the gate didn't open yet.

trgluestickz

cilginordek said:

slysnow#2290 said:

A convert glory to "key" option in pvp menu much like the create a key in under dark. (Can make Enchanted key create, legendary Dragon key, etc).

Can't wait till everyone starts PvP key farm bots, that will be excellent for PvP.

They also tried most of your armor suggestions before. The problem is they never maintain them so it falls into obscurity. Any suggestion that requires having different sets for PvE and PvP is more effort than they are willing to put into PvP from what we've seen in the past, so you should come up with a solution that requires less work on their end, not more.

@slysnow#2290 's key craft idea is probably doable actually. Especially if its for various campaign dungeon chest keys. You would need these basic safeguards:

Keys would need to be non-sellable/bound since glory is a participation prize. This would mean that in order to turn a profit, you would have to actually play PVE content on the characters you acquired the keys on, which would make farming campaign keys unappealing to botters.

Keys crafted through PVP would need to be a convert currency system and be subject to the same timegate/quantity per day restrictions as ones obtained through PVE. Meaning each day, you can either craft your daily key per campaign using glory or PVE currency but you don't get extra keys for doing both PVE and PVP each day. If you later changed the key system to have different restrictions or fewer restrictions, those new system changes should apply to both PVP and PVE crafted keys.

The amount of glory charged per crafted key should require a similar time investment as grinding out PVE currency for the same campiagn keys.

Enchanted keys are a little bit riskyer as far as good glory store items go, they open boxes containing unbound items. They aren't available directly through playing PVE either and that further raises risks since the only non zen related way to get them would be through PVP and they are highly desirable for both PVEers and PVPers. If they were made a prize, both PVE and PVP should be given a way to earn these at the same time. If they were implemented as a craft system like other keys, similar safeguards as above would be needed. Another option would be for enchanted keys to have a rare chance to drop from winning a PVP match, the PVE counterpart would be for enchanted keys to have a rare chance to drop in dungeon chests.

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As far as the armor suggestions he made goes, it could work if done right. The main workload actually wouldn't be maintaining a system like this but implementing it in the first place.

The system the devs tried before was greatly flawed and doesn't appear to be the same thing as what he is suggesting. In the old PVP gear system, you didn't automatically start out with viable PVP gear, you had to earn it through playing PVP. This was problematic since PVP gear was an absolute need; it was what gave you your tenacity stat and without tenacity, you were everyone else's free kill. If you tried to take your PVP gear into PVE, it was significantly weaker than PVE gear too, making it harder to switch between gamemodes since you not only needed 2 different sets, you had to go earn 2 different sets and keep up with earning new ones as they got released.

It looks like what he is suggesting is for non-discardable PVP gear to be automatically provided to everyone and PVE gear to be disabled in PVP, this is more viable now since loadouts and global tenacity are a thing.

A further way to augment his idea for gear would be for there to be a BIS PVP gear set you could earn but it would only provide a mild advantage over the basic one, so it would be more of a want than a need. Doing this would be needed to keep the hamster wheel turning and this is the part the devs would need to do followup maintenance on, they would occasionally need to release a new better set and scale up the basic set. This probably would take a similar amount of effort to maintain as what the devs already do, every few modules, they release a new PVP gear set anyway.

theguiido

Also, for console it would be nice for friends and guild mates naturally not be able to get on the team unless it's simply down by a low % rate. Right now I think if they are added and you queue up, you have a higher chance to q sync with them. Great post though bro.

wdj40

Its going to be too late by the time the Devs actually think about doing anything with PvP, they have missed an apportunity to make a truely great PvP experience with the combat system they have in place.

ELIMINATE THE ABILITY TO BE A STUN-BOT PLAYER!!!!!

Remove ALL stuns and Dazes from PvP period... 1 or 2 may have been fine but even then thats just poor design.

HR roots is fine as a class mechanic but it should not daze or stun at all. But giving a Root Boon to all players was an awful thing to do. Its a class mechanic and should not be given to other classes at all. This makes me feel you should give all players a GF Shield as a Boon or whatever. You start giving out class mechanics as Boons and you no longer have unique classes.

Also CW should be the only class able to control people as that is their class really... but this control should also have minimal stuns/dazes if any at all.

So ZERO stuns and Dazes in PvP would certainly improve things straight away. Or if you are Stunned/Dazed you should be completely immune to any Control for 10 seconds.

I am pretty much happy for all PvE equipment to work in PvP but just remove the stuns/dazes from them.

Unknown

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ashbury

Can make rewards given for number of matches played on a character. Such as game 100, 200, 300, etc if it is to reset each mod.

heckelvonloki

Your losing a lot of pvp player's because elitist are booting anyone at will. When new or crappy players get booted even though they're trying and get nothing for the effort your not going to get a new pvp base.

theguiido

heckelvonloki said:

Your losing a lot of pvp player's because elitist are booting anyone at will. When new or crappy players get booted even though they're trying and get nothing for the effort your not going to get a new pvp base.

I mean as much as the blame is on players with gear. I don't want to play with a 10k or a 9k or a freakin 4k AT LEVEL 70 THATS RIDICULOUS. How they hell are they even allowed to queue up at such low item levels? Thats unfair to people like me who want to win. They get kicked because they are roasting marsh mellows at the fire more than playing, they have no concept of how to play the game and nor are they interested to win as much as I am, so yeah nobody with a brain would wanna deal with that. Super unfun and unfair to anybody looking to win. It's both a Developer fault for not creating brackets, and also a player fault FOR GROWING A BRAIN AND LOOK AT THERE CHARACTER.

If they created a system where you are matched similarly based on K/D/A ratios and gear, games will be much better.

wdj40

wdj40 said:

Its going to be too late by the time the Devs actually think about doing anything with PvP, they have missed an apportunity to make a truely great PvP experience with the combat system they have in place.

ELIMINATE THE ABILITY TO BE A STUN-BOT PLAYER!!!!!

Remove ALL stuns and Dazes from PvP period... 1 or 2 may have been fine but even then thats just poor design.

HR roots is fine as a class mechanic but it should not daze or stun at all. But giving a Root Boon to all players was an awful thing to do. Its a class mechanic and should not be given to other classes at all. This makes me feel you should give all players a GF Shield as a Boon or whatever. You start giving out class mechanics as Boons and you no longer have unique classes.

Also CW should be the only class able to control people as that is their class really... but this control should also have minimal stuns/dazes if any at all.

So ZERO stuns and Dazes in PvP would certainly improve things straight away. Or if you are Stunned/Dazed you should be completely immune to any Control for 10 seconds.

I am pretty much happy for all PvE equipment to work in PvP but just remove the stuns/dazes from them.

Also as I have moaned about in the past... not just stun-bots, but players abusing multiproccing systems. Manticore mane was bad but this also is pretty awful https://xboxdvr.com/gamer/wdj40/video/59891275

I took the video as
1. Something felt off... It has been explained well what is happening in the HR section of this forum towards the end of the How to Archer thread.
And 2. I was actually using the clip as an example of using Shadowclad so this GF glitching actually helped me to achieve that unbeknownst to him.

My 2 main gripes with this game are the broken multiproccing things and stun-bots... both of which are still in the game Mod 14!

ashbury

They need to focus a mod focused strictly on pvp fixes. They need to make pvp and pve completely separate load outs so they can make changes to the one without it affecting the other. Hopefully that is possible. They should make immediate changes to the class that's most broken now as well as remove the troublesome items or their bonuses so they aren't abused. Make changes to CC again. Add REALLY good rewards for playing pvp...items, mounts, titles, winners of tournaments, whatever it be to make pvp enticing for everyone. For the amazing game play and competition and the awesome rewards. And add a new map. The following MOD after everyone is in the DOM arena make changes to the match making. Set up brackets according to item level, boons, kills/death/assists ratios, and games played. Keeping a long running total as well as each mod totals. Each successive mod pick the next class that needs work and do it to it.

feanor70118

1) In depth class balance. This will mean doing what Cryptic has been resisting for years, redrawing animations.
a) Every DPS class should be able to do the same amount of damage with animations costing the same amount of time.
b) Lightly armored classes should move faster than heavily armored classes. It makes no sense at all for GFs and GWFs to be able to chase down CWs, HRs and TRs.
c) Control effects should not stack with similar control effects.
d) HARD COOLDOWNS FOR ALL DAILIES IN PVP ONLY. Preferably 60 seconds, just like mounts and artifacts. PArtial AP abilities in HR already have their own hard cooldowns, and don't need to be made any more difficult.
e) Classes that can't tank as much should do more damage. Classes/builds that can facetank DPS classes shouldn't be able to do huge instadeath damage. This would restore the idea that there is a difference between the two.

2) Just disable all damage and control effects that proc from gear. And yeah, delete stamina and AP drains. They were a terrible idea and have never worked as intended.

3) The total HR rework that we were promised 2 years ago with mod 10b, when since then we've only gotten a long series of uncalled for nerfs and piercing damage that just gets nerfed later. A short version of the wish list includes:
a) shorten the animations for Careful Attack, Split The Sky, Aimed Shot, Gushing Wound, Aimed Strike, Commanding Shot and Hawk Shot.
b) Eliminate the animation for Forest Ghost. It should just work like TR's tab.
c) Make HR's stealth abilities actually provide stealth. I've been targeted a full second after entering stealth more times than I can count and it's absurd.
d) Make HR's healing and DR buff abilities actually relevant. The temp HP from Stag Heart is laughable. The healing from Oak Skin is laughable. The buff from Boar Hide is laughable. The healing from Wilds Medicine is laughable.
e) Eliminate the visibility to other players of the Commanding Shot and Hawk Shot animations, at least when used from stealth.
f) Stealth provided by Ambush should be doubled, or should only start counting down after the player attacks. It makes no sense that a player who's decided to hide in cover should be more rather than less visible after sitting still for a long time.
g) HR movement buffs should be doubled in length across the board and native movement should be about 35% faster than currently. Also, movement buffs should not begin counting down until the player actually moves. Currently the usual archery rotation consumes almost all the movement buff time that it provides, making those buffs near-irrelevant.
h) HR control abilities do not control (except other HRs). Disruptive shot does not disrupt. Make the control abilities acutally function as described. Also, the trapper stunbot build was always obnoxious. Give us back the mod 2 hybrid instead. There was never a reason to replace that path.
i) Redo every single irrelevant class aspect and ability. Bear Trap is useless. The animation for Boar Charge still has that pointless, self-destructive 1 second freeze at its end. I've forgotten the names of the really useless class aspects because I haven't used them ever. 400 regeneration when regeneration has been irrelevant since mod 6? Please.
j) Make the HR dodge big enough to avoid other classes' AoE and melee abilities. Make it actually dodge control effects as well as damage. A dodge should be a dodge should be a dodge.
k) Give the class a control break or immunity.
l) Finally make all HR damage proc with all buffs and items, like it does for other classes. We're tired of the ninja nerfs and just plain broken nonsense.
m) Fix all the HR abilities that require multiple presses before they actually work. The list is long and probably requires a thread of its own.
n) Redo HR feat trees to balance with how the game actually calculates damage done by players. We can ramp up crit severity but get only a fraction of the benefit it promises due to diminishing returns. Give us damage buffs that actually buff damage.
o) Increase native stamina regeneration by about 50%.
p) Increase maximum range by 25'. Archers are supposed to be the ultimate ranged class. Let them be.
q) Increase deflect severity to 75% (or reduce TR's to 50%). There's no reason for the two to be different.

athena

I once posted a alternate method of calculating whether a person is ready for a RQ based not on IL but on points gained on gear level, rare = 1 point epic = 2, legend = 4, mythic = 8. This was to be used on all items that currently have an item level. Well, my advice on PVP (other than shutting it down) is to rank players based on this new gear score and have them compete on 1v1 2v2, 5v5 matches. Players gain "average" placement which means they get the average W/L ratio of last 20 PVP matches (averaging starts at 20 matches), and this is calculated for rewards. Players can only PVP against their peer Gear score players.

Second, PVP locations are expanded to include current dungeon (for race matches of same class), trial zones for capture the flag and tag matches (like demogorgon zone but no mobs, just player capturing the flag and throwing into randomly popped portals), similar mount race matches (like the nostura RD boss zone, but better), specific sport setups like the saha ball game (but much faster pls), etc....

class race matches: leveling dungeons - karundax (no doors, many more traps, random trapping mobs like you see in VO9, puzzles to run around gathering and solving)

Capture the flag matches: Demogorgon, Orcus pit, throne of DG, etc. A flag (say an imp or something) randomly pops into zone and moves around at OP running speed, lasts for 5 seconds then dissapears. If a player hits the "flag" then they captured it and must run to the demon portal that coresponds to the flag color. They have 30 seconds to 'hit' the portal to throw the flag into it and score a point. If another player hits your player they have a chance of 'sniping' the flag and taking it away from you. Portal colors change every minute or so.

Defend the Fort matches: You and your opponent teams have a flag that you must defend. if an opponent comes and takes your flag (they slow a bit) then you must hit them to take it back, if they take the flag back to their fort and place into the mark they win the point. Hitting non flag opponents vary in effects like stuns and such, but no killing.

Mount race matches: everyones mount is the same 110 speed (without SH mount speed bonus) and you must navigate the dugeons,jumping over obsticles and avoiding traps. Places that would be great are Nostura (the entirety not just the stag race), Malabog castle, Castle Never, Valindra tower, LOL, MSP and FBI

Unique games: Saaha ball (must faster and larger field please), a version of tennis/ volleyball / PONG (1v1 PVP)

ashbury

When a player has been chosen to be kicked from a match their stats should be shown. This should not only include item level but also match stats like kills, deaths, heals, damage taken, time in combat, nodes capped, and nodes defended.