Im a new player, played almost 2 weeks now, and Im just learning about this change.
Im playing several alts but my main just hit 60. If I understand correctly, I can now run both skirmish RQ and and leveling dungeon RQ for 13K AD, but once I hit 70 then I will no longer qualify for the skirmish RQ due to the higher item level requirements for some of the later skirmishes?
Is this correct? If so then how is this an improvement for new players?
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viperwitch23Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 205Arc User
They expect Elite players with GS 13000+ to Q randomly and then carry x4 players who are 11000 through the dungeon for 2-3h and enjoy doing it..... I remember the time when I joined a PUG dungeon and I was kicked almost straight away. As they inspected and decided I am not good enough. The Elitists who think that everyone spawns in game with rank 12 enchantments and anyone less then that is worthless. Devs really think that those people will be jumping over each other to randomly Q so they enjoy 2-3h carry for the bonus. 60 Seals cache being GONE = DOWNGRADE. What Elitist players will do? They are likely to just run an extra VT or Elol. That daily AD bonus with +50% bonus +10% vip is 8150 per char right now To get this they need to run 1 extra Elol to open 2 chests at the end. To get 2 pieces salvage it with same bonuses and they earn back the lost bonus. Or First elol now with 2 chests + current bonus with bonus being a profit. Then same elol with 2 chests without bonus. So, elitist needs 1 extra Elol on top to get salvage to earn back the bonus. So, 4 elols instead of 2 will get him/her the AD for the bonus that no longer present. Same with skirmish. If he/she can't open second Esot chest then he/she needs to run an extra esot on top of the esot he/she usually runs. And the daily AD loss will be earned back with salvage. Also, the loss of 60 seals cache will be earned back by extra elol Seals cache is 60 seals So, in elol first boss drops 20, second boss 20, Lostmauth I can't exactly remember i think was 30, but ok if it is also 20, then each chest 30 and 30. So, 20+20+20+30+30 = 100 seals. 1 extra elol earns that cache back with profit. So, now he/she runs x2 elols to get 8150 ad each plus salvage and 100 seals each Then he/she would run 4 elols and get x8 salvage pieces. 4 normal and x4 to get loss of daily bonus. and 400 seals I have been on the teams that ran 1 ESOT in 4 mins flat And like 8 mins for elol. So, if people can privately assemble and o them this fast. On, fter bonding nerf might be slower let's say 10 mins for elol VT about 10 mins too So, if 5 of them can run 1 elol in 10mins why would they randomly Q to risk a group with minimal item level that gives them 2-3h to complete that random dungeon? WHY? He/she leaves and that 30 mins leaver penalty is enough to do 3 elols I had a run once with people who sadly quit now I did 100 Esots with them at rate of 12 per hour - 1 straight run. And then 3 days later it was 30 Elols at 8 mins per each straight run And next day 30 Etos 10 mins each one. Yes, those guys were bit crazy, but in a good way. So, why would people like this muddle through a random dungeon for the bonuses? They won't They would only join that Q when they got halve a day to loose and for personal entertainment. Other wise they will run +50% of other quicker dungeons to get back the losses - while starting players would be NUKED. A few people I know using 4-5 low geared alts to run x2master of the hunt and x2 TOS now with vip and invoke bonus to get cash and to fund their main. Main run his daily on epic and then alts are ran on solo She gets 81500 x2 and 4500 x2 = 25000 or so Plus some salvage from main. x6 chars 150k a day across all. So, she been saying another week and she can afford her desired set of rank 9 enchantments
Just for the numbers.
1 Rank, 9 Azure now on AH costs 162000 cheapest. So, a player with like 6 alts. Let's say 7 alts minimal can do 2 normal dungeons and 2 skirmishes every day and by transferring AD to 1 char can probably buy this rank 9 you need a total of 16 gems on the character 1 per Helmet 1 per armor 1 per bracers 2 per main hand if it's epic Wootz 2 per epic Wootz off-hand 1 Per boots 1 per cloak/necklace 2 per 1 ring 2 per another ring 1 per belt 1 per shirt 1 per pants
And if she has a companion that is augment and uses that is +6 more so 22 total
So, she can run for 22 days same set every day and she can afford all rank 9 at 1 per day. Then 2 more days runs to buy lesser Soulforge And 2 more days for lesser Vorpal So, let's say 1 month of hard work and she can ( could ) to get her main rank 9 gems, her comp rank 9 gems. Seals on the main for ostorian rings for main and even for companion. Buy Wootz wepons and afford refining. Buy a few artifacts that cheap now And after 1 month she would be decently geared. Not any more. Now she would need like 1 year to do the same thing. Perhaps longer So, where is the reasoning? OK, We killed off botters. Whoopsie, it looks like that most of honest played died with with the botters. Never mind that.
Also, what about <level 70 players? If I am level 30, will I be able to do a Leveling random queue? If yes, will I be put in something like CT or in Caverns of Karrundax (which makes no sense because it is level 54 or something like that)? And the random skirmishes, is the queue only "Epic" Random Skirmishes (10k IL) or when sub-level 70 I can join a SRQ of whatever I have accesible?
And the incentive of doing ERQ, if not for the seals and salvage and RAD (it should give more RAD than a LRQ, iirc) is the SH quest. The moment you hit level 70, the game thinks you can do ERQ and sends you there (but if you are a noob level 70 with 7k GS, what the hell do you do? Buy Cloak Ascendancy and SKT and the gear to get to 11kIL and qualify for the ERQ? That's weird).
Also, legit question: KR is an epic dungeon or a skirmish? In the new RQ.
I'm not very happy with the "quitter penalty". The reason for this is when I have been grouped up in queues with bots who just stand there and do nothing (don't fight, don't contribute, don't respond, don't move) I immediately abandon that instance.
Consider this:
What is the point in remaining in a group if I'm the only human being playing the game?
How can I complete a dungeon if the bots don't move from the dungeon entrance to the circle... at the other end of the dungeon?
Have the developers not been paying attention to the player-reports of so many bots infesting the game like maggots?
I will not waste my time running a dungeon I can't complete on account of bots. If quitting a group on that account will result in my being punished through no fault of my own... I might as well quit playing Neverwinter altogether.
Please think this through. This honestly is a game-breaker.
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viperwitch23Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 205Arc User
I'm not very happy with the "quitter penalty". The reason for this is when I have been grouped up in queues with bots who just stand there and do nothing (don't fight, don't contribute, don't respond, don't move) I immediately abandon that instance.
Consider this:
What is the point in remaining in a group if I'm the only human being playing the game?
How can I complete a dungeon if the bots don't move from the dungeon entrance to the circle... at the other end of the dungeon?
Have the developers not been paying attention to the player-reports of so many bots infesting the game like maggots?
I will not waste my time running a dungeon I can't complete on account of bots. If quitting a group on that account will result in my being punished through no fault of my own... I might as well quit playing Neverwinter altogether.
Please think this through. This honestly is a game-breaker.
What bots? Here are no bots with 11000 Or very very few of them. And you can't bot epics. And they not gonna bot epics cuz here be no automatic daily AD for them. They have to bot 8 Elols with daily key or 4 Elols with 1 daily 1 arcane key. To make arcane key they need to bot Tyranny of dragons on their alts - means won't justify result for them. This system is a perfect bot killer. It kills a whole flock of birds for them. Bird #1 - botters get nuked and probably we gonna get unhappy botters DDOSING server again Bird #2 - all players lower then lev 70 might be locked out of ANY AD AT ALL.
ladypeanut66 said ''Also, what about <level 70 players? If I am level 30, will I be able to do a Leveling random queue? If yes, will I be put in something like CT or in Caverns of Karrundax (which makes no sense because it is level 54 or something like that)? And the random skirmishes, is the queue only "Epic" Random Skirmishes (10k IL) or when sub-level 70 I can join a SRQ of whatever I have accesible?'' That is level 54. And if char is level 30 for example he can only do cloak tower and crag mire crypts. Meaning he need to wait till someone 2 people join the same Random Q in order to get in. If no one below lev 36 will join the Q - he can't do even those at all. Not even with botters as botters would have no reason to join those now. And since solo gives you NOTHING now he gets exactly that - nothing. In order for random Q to work others need to be eager to join it.
The way it is I am not likely wanting to join it myself. As I would be doing what I calculate above - extra dungeon runs for account for losses. And that is what everyone else who understands even a little how game works is going to be doing. May be choose PUG will be more alive as people be Q here for extras
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viperwitch23Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 205Arc User
I'm not very happy with the "quitter penalty". The reason for this is when I have been grouped up in queues with bots who just stand there and do nothing (don't fight, don't contribute, don't respond, don't move) I immediately abandon that instance.
Consider this:
What is the point in remaining in a group if I'm the only human being playing the game?
How can I complete a dungeon if the bots don't move from the dungeon entrance to the circle... at the other end of the dungeon?
Have the developers not been paying attention to the player-reports of so many bots infesting the game like maggots?
I will not waste my time running a dungeon I can't complete on account of bots. If quitting a group on that account will result in my being punished through no fault of my own... I might as well quit playing Neverwinter altogether.
Please think this through. This honestly is a game-breaker.
Man listen Look at my calculation above. To account for the losses based on Elol and vt and we can add mc to it cuz it has second chest. You would-need to do 2 extra elols vts or mcs to earn back a Goner daily bonus via salvaging. Yes, it would need 2 extra set of keys and extra time, but it can be earned back faster then joining random Q and getting pug FBI. If Etos then it would need - if average drop is 1 ring - 2 extra etos on top = 6 total. It is that simple
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viperwitch23Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 205Arc User
It would just become impossible for legit players to farm low dungeons and fun their mains. They will have to only use high level chars that can get into pre-made private teams. And then move extra salvage onto alts if that char has ran out of invoke bonus We have to do +100% more of the current T1 and up-to 200% more of the current T2 to account for daily bonus loss
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,403Arc User
Also, what about lower than level 70 players? If I am level 30, will I be able to do a Leveling random queue? If yes, will I be put in something like CT or in Caverns of Karrundax (which makes no sense because it is level 54 or something like that)? And the random skirmishes, is the queue only "Epic" Random Skirmishes (10k IL) or when sub-level 70 I can join a SRQ of whatever I have accesible?
And the incentive of doing ERQ, if not for the seals and salvage and RAD (it should give more RAD than a LRQ, iirc) is the SH quest. The moment you hit level 70, the game thinks you can do ERQ and sends you there (but if you are a noob level 70 with 7k GS, what the hell do you do? Buy Cloak Ascendancy and SKT and the gear to get to 11kIL and qualify for the ERQ? That's weird).
Also, legit question: KR is an epic dungeon or a skirmish? In the new RQ.
Before Level 70, if you join RQ, you will be in the dungeon up to your level. Since you are level 30, you won't be in the dungeon which is above 30 when you do RQ.
Not sure about random skirmish. We will find out the answer when the game comes back up.
When you hit level 70, you will not be allowed to do ERQ at all until your toon has all the requirement to enter all the dungeons under the banner of ERQ.
We will find out the answer of KR when the game comes back up.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
I'm optamisticly holding out on this in the hopes that it helps earn more Dungeoneers shards for my guild because as it stands now,, since we are a small guild,, nobody wants to q for epics because there have been days where i've gone hours waiting for one to pop,, the only ones being fairly regular being Throne and Prophecy,, and due to the cleric rotation you can only get them like once a week,,, making it take forever to earn them,,, well,, hopefully this helps some,, we'll see i guess
I'm optamisticly holding out on this in the hopes that it helps earn more Dungeoneers shards for my guild because as it stands now,, since we are a small guild,, nobody wants to q for epics because there have been days where i've gone hours waiting for one to pop,, the only ones being fairly regular being Throne and Prophecy,, and due to the cleric rotation you can only get them like once a week,,, making it take forever to earn them,,, well,, hopefully this helps some,, we'll see i guess
Actually, the "problem" of random queues will only regard FBI and MSP (which can take forever or result in an abandon). I don't mind carrying people in other dungeons. People are not eager to run random queues but personally, I used to pug a lot in the past, it is not the end of the world, and it will be a new opportunity to meet other players (as long as they are willing to play this new rule) and to have another kind of challenge.
My guildies are very reluctant but I hope they will try.
Well, thank you Cryptic for removing my ability to earn diamonds one of the major currencies in the game. You now need a 10,000 item level to do random skirmishes at level 70, a 11,000 to get any from doing epic dungeons, and an 11,000 to get any from doing epic trials. Before I could get all my diamonds and bonuses for the day from two dungeons and two skirmishes. You just hamstring'd any level 70 that isn't paying to play the game. Bravo, and good job this may run me right out of the game. Because whats the point if all i can earn diamonds from each day is one measly regular dungeon.
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
Also, what about [under] level 70 players? If I am level 30, will I be able to do a Leveling random queue? If yes, will I be put in something like CT or in Caverns of Karrundax (which makes no sense because it is level 54 or something like that)? And the random skirmishes, is the queue only "Epic" Random Skirmishes (10k IL) or when sub-level 70 I can join a SRQ of whatever I have accesible?
This has been answered repeatedly, and is included in the introductory posts.
YES you can RQ while levelling. NO it will only place you into content you'd be able to queue for normally.
So now i need 5 greater marks of potency to upgrade my artifact, only it'll take me three days to get the diamonds from the only random cue i can run to buy one mark. so what would have been a four or five day grind to get the marks I need has become a 15 day grind (i'm estimating it way be closer to 12 or 13 days) just to get the greater marks of potency I need for the refinement jump to the next tier.
I understand what you dev's were going for here but the reality of the situation is that you've made it so if we aren't already top dogs with 10k or 11k iLevel's we're gonna be grinding for ages just to buy our marks.
It's very frustrating when you guys roll out something telling us it'll make the game more playable just to find out it makes us poor in the game. What this looks like to us is that the intention is to make us purchase zen and turn it to diamonds. I used to spend less than two hours earning my diamonds then I would go on to campaign tasks. Now I can only earn about 10k diamonds a day and I can't raise my iLevel with out the diamonds to buy the greater marks of potency and the other marks I need. I really had hoped the dev's would think more about the people with lower item levels when they did this.
Sounds like I am better off NOT leveling to 70 for as long as possible if I want to continue to earn a decent number of AD per day.
Was the intention of this system to de-incentivise leveling?
1. You cannot avoid leveling. When you are doing dungeon, you will get XP and you will level up. 2. When you reach level 70, you still can do level dungeon RQ to earn the AD you get before reaching 70.
Hence, I don't see too much edge of avoiding leveling and you can't avoid that anyway. The only edge I can see is between level 64 to 69, you can do skirmish RQ but you may not be able to do that when you reach 70.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
So I'm out of quing system since you have removed the reason to que rAD/seals. Good job. No.
You force me to go back and do content I abhored to unlock the dungeon/trial/skirmish list. No.
You force me to random join even if I have the list unlocked to get rAD/seals and risk getting into content I hate or a group I dislike. No.
You take away rAD rewards/seals from content I specific join even if I have to do repeats, so it drives me to random que? No.
The rAD/seals were offsets for the pathetic rewards at end of skirm/dungeon/trial, the pathetic loot hasn't been addressed and the only reason to run them (rAD/seal) has been pulled unless I subject myself to random one? No.
Fill a role that is coming up short for a mere 1k rAD? *busts out laughing* No.
Subject myself to a 30min lockout if something is lame on content of group? Pfft. No. (I'd log that toon and switch, life is too short to subject myself to stupid, so much for the "penalty") No.
Will all this forcing a dynamic down my throat to get a piffling rAD make me start to populate random to flesh out all that abandoned content? No.
In fact it's a total backfire, I will be even LESS inclined to join something and add one more body...enough of other "me's" and you just made the problem worst, fixing a problem? No.
Simply No.
Fix it right. Make the content reward itself, add loot to vacant content so they WANT to que for it, not be forced into it. Yes.
Roles coming up short for content? Add a REAL reward not pfft 1k rAD. Yes.
Need me and others to go back to old content to unlock dungeons/skirms/trials that we previously found to painful or dumb? Fix and revamp the old content and make it rewarding and/or fun so we WANT to do it not be FORCED to do it. Yes.
When you get to forcing people to do things they hate, rather than lure them with things they love, you have failed. I've quit dozens of games in the past because they got to forcing dynamics, don't make this one more please.
So *sigh* I guess it's back to weeklies only, to earn crippled AD generation rate. *shakes head*, good job. one less body in the quing system and one less person willing to join with all my alts to fill roles to help other players. Sad.
I kinda like the fact that I am pretty much garaunteed 20 Dungeoneers Shards (10 minimum if you just do a random skirmish which are easier) per day now... those were always the bottleneck in my guild
Guilds are going to take a HUGE hit to leveling. For instance, say you have a fairly new guild, or an old guild that never bothered to recruit till recently, you are probably not going to have many new level 70's with gear scores of 12k. Or who have completed all the quest requirements... That said, their daily cleric quest to do a random EPIC dungeon queue will go untouched.
So for another example, lets say you and 4 friends joined the game, all leveled together in the guild you made, and all hit 70. Maybe you don't like to interact with random gamers that may or may not play well with others, so you don't intend to invite other people to the guild. As soon as you hit 70, your ability to improve the guild hall is cut in half. OH!!! WAIT!!! If their gear score is under 10k, they won't be able to do random skirmishes either will they? So hitting 70 will nearly STOP their ability to level their guild hall... I understand that you can get 20 shards every 5 days from EE/UD campaigns, but that's only if they are complete.
All of those factors affect my entire alliance. (some old with nearly all new players, some new with new players, some are slightly antisocial as they are very particular on who joins) So even though there are close to 500 members, I don't think anyone has much more than 11k GS. The only good news is it seems to be easier for the lower levels to get their D-Shards, but what about the 70's?
Side note... I love all the haters that just want to run their CT's and skirm of choice to get their AD. I have multiple toons that I used to run through just CT to get some extra AD. I have NOOOOO desire to commit my life to running dungeons all day, so only my main runs real content. Running a random for AD is kind of a drag, as some take much longer than others. I dunno, it's not great, but it's hardly a deal breaker. If not for the potential hit to guild leveling, I don't mind the new system.
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adinosiiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,294Arc User
Before, I didn't really aim to run 2xSkirmish and 2xEtoS for the daily AD bonus anyhow. If I needed AD, I might play on the AH, craft something profitable or just run something enjoyable for salvage. Sure, I would frequently join a guild/alliance group if they needed a DC for their runs, so I ended up getting the daily bonus frequently, but it was not a major source of my income.
What changes for me are the Dungeoneering shards. I would typically collect all the daily quests over the week, and run all the dungeons on a weekend when I have more time to play. Now I cannot do that any more, so it means I will not bet getting shards.
Fortunately my guild is GH 20, with the PvE boon structures maxed (just upgrading final support/PvP structures now) so we don't really need the shards badly, but I could have donated them to other guilds in the alliance that are still building up.
And yes, as I (and others) have said, there is not really any motivation for me to run random queues. I hate the leveling dungeons, because of the lack of challenge. And too many of the epic dungeons are just not worth my time.
I did run specific dungeons/skirmishes a lot if I wanted a particular drop (like the Bloodstained Shirt or the Psion's Shroud), but today all I run is ToNG, and I won't run that with a random queue, as it basically forces me into a sub-optimal group composition.
I not saying a "1 Tank, 1 Healer, 3 DPS" group cannot complete it - I had a great run yesterday with an OP/DC/GWF/GWF/HR group, but a random "tank/healer/DPS/DPS/DPS" group could have ended up a lot, lot worse.
Now, I might join a random queue for skirmishes - they are reasonably quick and easy anyhow, but dungeons...forget it!
As I have said before, I consider the whole RQ implementation an absolute disaster.
Hoping for improvements...
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viperwitch23Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 205Arc User
I done 10 dungeons of different kind and i got 0 enchantment of rank 5 at all Influence run gives me black pearls Did they nerfed rank 5 enchantment drops 100%
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,403Arc User
I done 10 dungeons of different kind and i got 0 enchantment of rank 5 at all Influence run gives me black pearls Did they nerfed rank 5 enchantment drops 100%
They don't drop enchantment anymore. It is replaced by RP items such as Black Pearls.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,403Arc User
What changes for me are the Dungeoneering shards. I would typically collect all the daily quests over the week, and run all the dungeons on a weekend when I have more time to play. Now I cannot do that any more, so it means I will not bet getting shards.
This is the killer. I do the same thing. I don't run those dungeon everyday. This forces you to run everyday in order to get the shard reward. I used to run a few in the weekend to get multiple shard rewards in one day.
The dungeoneering shard production will be destroyed by first, RQ. Second, 1 shard reward per day.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
> @plasticbat said: > I done 10 dungeons of different kind and i got 0 enchantment of rank 5 at all > Influence run gives me black pearls > Did they nerfed rank 5 enchantment drops 100% > > > They don't drop enchantment anymore. It is replaced by RP items such as Black Pearls.
That's funny... I was having enchants drop along with the new gems the whole time I played yesterday... I do have a fey touched enchant equipped tho so that may be what's dropping them... not sure what the dragon one is dropping.. gems? Enchants?
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,403Arc User
> I done 10 dungeons of different kind and i got 0 enchantment of rank 5 at all
> Influence run gives me black pearls
> Did they nerfed rank 5 enchantment drops 100%
>
>
> They don't drop enchantment anymore. It is replaced by RP items such as Black Pearls.
That's funny... I was having enchants drop along with the new gems the whole time I played yesterday... I do have a fey touched enchant equipped tho so that may be what's dropping them... not sure what the dragon one is dropping.. gems? Enchants?
From another thread written by dev:
Enchantment/Runestone drops
Regular enchantments and runestones (ones that aren't part of campaigns or events) will no longer drop in normal play. Instead rank 1s of these items can be bought in Protector's Enclave. Due to not needing the matching bonuses anymore and (as will be mentioned a bit more further down this post) we got rid of the requirement on ranks of requiring a second enchantment/runestone to upgrade, it is more straight forward to just get gemstones, which are purely for RP, in loot vs enchantments and runestones that you are just going to convert into RP anyways.
This also works towards wanting to make the system easier for new players to interact with. Instead of waiting for random drops and trying to figure out which to keep/break down, new players can see all of the regular tier 1s, make their choice, and level it up with the RP they acquire while playing. To go along with this, Tier 1 enchantments have a 100% success rate to become Tier 2, further easing the learning curve of Refinement.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
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viperwitch23Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 205Arc User
And did they forgotten that those rank 5 were THE BIG RP GAIN?????? I had 8 black pears in 18 dungeons I did 8 more after my post and I got 8 pearls... While in the same time I would see as much as 30-40 enchantments rank 5
Where is that rank 1 enchantments selling now? This is a joke. I really hoped for those rank 5 to help me with tradable refining points Now this is gone
Where I look i see only nerfs in everything 1 GOOD nerf ->5 bad nerfs
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,403Arc User
And did they forgotten that those rank 5 were THE BIG RP GAIN?????? I had 8 black pears in 18 dungeons I did 8 more after my post and I got 8 pearls... While in the same time I would see as much as 30-40 enchantments rank 5
Where is that rank 1 enchantments selling now? This is a joke. I really hoped for those rank 5 to help me with tradable refining points Now this is gone
Where I look i see only nerfs in everything 1 GOOD nerf ->5 bad nerfs
Did you pick up all the green junk on the floor? Each one is a peridot.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
Ever play the "game" mouse trap? It's this over engineered Rube Goldberg device game. The ball drops on the lever to push the switch that starts the cog that ticks around to push the pendulum to move the x the y the z all around bunch of things and doodads to finally trigger the cage that drops on the mouse nibbling on the cheese.
Que system=Mouse Trap So they perceived that older dungeons/skirmishs etc. weren't getting used enough and folks that wanted to experience that content couldn't get a group though the que system (gee, go make some friends and get them to go with you..problem solved). Nope that would be easy...let's make a huge failure prone machine to cage a mouse.
Your new que system is over engineered! It fails in so many ways. It in effect does opposite of what you say you want...get more players, doing more diverse content, so everyone can get a group to go experience it. In practice it fails..... 1.It locks out huge chunks of people, from not having category of type open, so less people grouping. 2.Forcing people who have opened the stuff to do content they hate. so even less people grouping. 3.Stealing the one thing that lured people to even do the little content they could stomach (AD/Seals) and applying it behind stuff they loath (oh that will go well for sure!) less people grouping. 4.Locking out groups that were there for other reasons other than AD/Seals. Like guilds doing it for shards to grow their SH. Hmm less grouping again?
Leave the old AD/seal as is, lure the meeses to the other stuff with even better stinkier cheese! Fix the loot. Fix the pre-qualifiers. Why, even open the categories at L70...how novel!
If I'm not getting a reward from a category (epics/dungeons/skirms/trials/role fill) because I'm locked out, why would I even do the run? For the chest at the end, which I might not have a key and even if I do, the loot is HAMSTER? Please, I'm not going. The only other thing to "lure" in people is :content they have to do to advance i.e. ToD/Demo for the boon drops/gear. So Umm even with the random que, everyone is still doing the underdarks and not the others...what did you solve?
Comments
Im playing several alts but my main just hit 60. If I understand correctly, I can now run both skirmish RQ and and leveling dungeon RQ for 13K AD, but once I hit 70 then I will no longer qualify for the skirmish RQ due to the higher item level requirements for some of the later skirmishes?
Is this correct? If so then how is this an improvement for new players?
I remember the time when I joined a PUG dungeon and I was kicked almost straight away. As they inspected and decided I am not good enough.
The Elitists who think that everyone spawns in game with rank 12 enchantments and anyone less then that is worthless. Devs really think that those people will be jumping over each other to randomly Q so they enjoy 2-3h carry for the bonus.
60 Seals cache being GONE = DOWNGRADE.
What Elitist players will do? They are likely to just run an extra VT or Elol.
That daily AD bonus with +50% bonus +10% vip is 8150 per char right now
To get this they need to run 1 extra Elol to open 2 chests at the end. To get 2 pieces salvage it with same bonuses and they earn back the lost bonus.
Or
First elol now with 2 chests + current bonus with bonus being a profit.
Then same elol with 2 chests without bonus. So, elitist needs 1 extra Elol on top to get salvage to earn back the bonus. So, 4 elols instead of 2 will get him/her the AD for the bonus that no longer present.
Same with skirmish.
If he/she can't open second Esot chest then he/she needs to run an extra esot on top of the esot he/she usually runs.
And the daily AD loss will be earned back with salvage.
Also, the loss of 60 seals cache will be earned back by extra elol
Seals cache is 60 seals
So, in elol first boss drops 20, second boss 20, Lostmauth I can't exactly remember i think was 30, but ok if it is also 20, then each chest 30 and 30. So, 20+20+20+30+30 = 100 seals. 1 extra elol earns that cache back with profit.
So, now he/she runs x2 elols to get 8150 ad each plus salvage and 100 seals each
Then he/she would run 4 elols and get x8 salvage pieces. 4 normal and x4 to get loss of daily bonus. and 400 seals
I have been on the teams that ran 1 ESOT in 4 mins flat
And like 8 mins for elol.
So, if people can privately assemble and o them this fast. On, fter bonding nerf might be slower let's say 10 mins for elol
VT about 10 mins too
So, if 5 of them can run 1 elol in 10mins why would they randomly Q to risk a group with minimal item level that gives them 2-3h to complete that random dungeon?
WHY?
He/she leaves and that 30 mins leaver penalty is enough to do 3 elols
I had a run once with people who sadly quit now
I did 100 Esots with them at rate of 12 per hour - 1 straight run.
And then 3 days later it was 30 Elols at 8 mins per each straight run
And next day 30 Etos 10 mins each one.
Yes, those guys were bit crazy, but in a good way.
So, why would people like this muddle through a random dungeon for the bonuses?
They won't
They would only join that Q when they got halve a day to loose and for personal entertainment. Other wise they will run +50% of other quicker dungeons to get back the losses - while starting players would be NUKED.
A few people I know using 4-5 low geared alts to run x2master of the hunt and x2 TOS now with vip and invoke bonus to get cash and to fund their main. Main run his daily on epic and then alts are ran on solo
She gets 81500 x2 and 4500 x2 = 25000 or so
Plus some salvage from main.
x6 chars 150k a day across all. So, she been saying another week and she can afford her desired set of rank 9 enchantments
Just for the numbers.
1 Rank, 9 Azure now on AH costs 162000 cheapest. So, a player with like 6 alts. Let's say 7 alts minimal can do 2 normal dungeons and 2 skirmishes every day and by transferring AD to 1 char can probably buy this rank 9
you need a total of 16 gems on the character
1 per Helmet
1 per armor
1 per bracers
2 per main hand if it's epic Wootz
2 per epic Wootz off-hand
1 Per boots
1 per cloak/necklace
2 per 1 ring
2 per another ring
1 per belt
1 per shirt
1 per pants
And if she has a companion that is augment and uses that is +6 more so 22 total
So, she can run for 22 days same set every day and she can afford all rank 9 at 1 per day.
Then 2 more days runs to buy lesser Soulforge
And 2 more days for lesser Vorpal
So, let's say 1 month of hard work and she can ( could ) to get her main rank 9 gems, her comp rank 9 gems. Seals on the main for ostorian rings for main and even for companion. Buy Wootz wepons and afford refining. Buy a few artifacts that cheap now
And after 1 month she would be decently geared.
Not any more.
Now she would need like 1 year to do the same thing. Perhaps longer
So, where is the reasoning?
OK, We killed off botters. Whoopsie, it looks like that most of honest played died with with the botters. Never mind that.
Please feel free to comment
And the incentive of doing ERQ, if not for the seals and salvage and RAD (it should give more RAD than a LRQ, iirc) is the SH quest. The moment you hit level 70, the game thinks you can do ERQ and sends you there (but if you are a noob level 70 with 7k GS, what the hell do you do? Buy Cloak Ascendancy and SKT and the gear to get to 11kIL and qualify for the ERQ? That's weird).
Also, legit question: KR is an epic dungeon or a skirmish? In the new RQ.
Consider this:
What is the point in remaining in a group if I'm the only human being playing the game?
How can I complete a dungeon if the bots don't move from the dungeon entrance to the circle... at the other end of the dungeon?
Have the developers not been paying attention to the player-reports of so many bots infesting the game like maggots?
I will not waste my time running a dungeon I can't complete on account of bots. If quitting a group on that account will result in my being punished through no fault of my own... I might as well quit playing Neverwinter altogether.
Please think this through. This honestly is a game-breaker.
Here are no bots with 11000
Or very very few of them. And you can't bot epics. And they not gonna bot epics cuz here be no automatic daily AD for them. They have to bot 8 Elols with daily key or 4 Elols with 1 daily 1 arcane key. To make arcane key they need to bot Tyranny of dragons on their alts - means won't justify result for them. This system is a perfect bot killer.
It kills a whole flock of birds for them.
Bird #1 - botters get nuked and probably we gonna get unhappy botters DDOSING server again
Bird #2 - all players lower then lev 70 might be locked out of ANY AD AT ALL.
ladypeanut66 said ''Also, what about <level 70 players? If I am level 30, will I be able to do a Leveling random queue? If yes, will I be put in something like CT or in Caverns of Karrundax (which makes no sense because it is level 54 or something like that)? And the random skirmishes, is the queue only "Epic" Random Skirmishes (10k IL) or when sub-level 70 I can join a SRQ of whatever I have accesible?''
That is level 54. And if char is level 30 for example he can only do cloak tower and crag mire crypts. Meaning he need to wait till someone 2 people join the same Random Q in order to get in. If no one below lev 36 will join the Q - he can't do even those at all. Not even with botters as botters would have no reason to join those now.
And since solo gives you NOTHING now he gets exactly that - nothing.
In order for random Q to work others need to be eager to join it.
The way it is I am not likely wanting to join it myself. As I would be doing what I calculate above - extra dungeon runs for account for losses.
And that is what everyone else who understands even a little how game works is going to be doing.
May be choose PUG will be more alive as people be Q here for extras
Look at my calculation above. To account for the losses based on Elol and vt and we can add mc to it cuz it has second chest.
You would-need to do 2 extra elols vts or mcs to earn back a Goner daily bonus via salvaging.
Yes, it would need 2 extra set of keys and extra time, but it can be earned back faster then joining random Q and getting pug FBI.
If Etos then it would need - if average drop is 1 ring - 2 extra etos on top = 6 total.
It is that simple
They will have to only use high level chars that can get into pre-made private teams.
And then move extra salvage onto alts if that char has ran out of invoke bonus
We have to do +100% more of the current T1 and up-to 200% more of the current T2 to account for daily bonus loss
Not sure about random skirmish. We will find out the answer when the game comes back up.
When you hit level 70, you will not be allowed to do ERQ at all until your toon has all the requirement to enter all the dungeons under the banner of ERQ.
We will find out the answer of KR when the game comes back up.
People are not eager to run random queues but personally, I used to pug a lot in the past, it is not the end of the world, and it will be a new opportunity to meet other players (as long as they are willing to play this new rule) and to have another kind of challenge.
My guildies are very reluctant but I hope they will try.
YES you can RQ while levelling. NO it will only place you into content you'd be able to queue for normally.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
I understand what you dev's were going for here but the reality of the situation is that you've made it so if we aren't already top dogs with 10k or 11k iLevel's we're gonna be grinding for ages just to buy our marks.
Was the intention of this system to de-incentivise leveling?
2. When you reach level 70, you still can do level dungeon RQ to earn the AD you get before reaching 70.
Hence, I don't see too much edge of avoiding leveling and you can't avoid that anyway.
The only edge I can see is between level 64 to 69, you can do skirmish RQ but you may not be able to do that when you reach 70.
You force me to go back and do content I abhored to unlock the dungeon/trial/skirmish list. No.
You force me to random join even if I have the list unlocked to get rAD/seals and risk getting into content I hate or a group I dislike. No.
You take away rAD rewards/seals from content I specific join even if I have to do repeats, so it drives me to random que? No.
The rAD/seals were offsets for the pathetic rewards at end of skirm/dungeon/trial, the pathetic loot hasn't been addressed and the only reason to run them (rAD/seal) has been pulled unless I subject myself to random one? No.
Fill a role that is coming up short for a mere 1k rAD? *busts out laughing* No.
Subject myself to a 30min lockout if something is lame on content of group? Pfft. No. (I'd log that toon and switch, life is too short to subject myself to stupid, so much for the "penalty") No.
Will all this forcing a dynamic down my throat to get a piffling rAD make me start to populate random to flesh out all that abandoned content? No.
In fact it's a total backfire, I will be even LESS inclined to join something and add one more body...enough of other "me's" and you just made the problem worst, fixing a problem? No.
Simply No.
Fix it right. Make the content reward itself, add loot to vacant content so they WANT to que for it, not be forced into it. Yes.
Roles coming up short for content? Add a REAL reward not pfft 1k rAD. Yes.
Need me and others to go back to old content to unlock dungeons/skirms/trials that we previously found to painful or dumb? Fix and revamp the old content and make it rewarding and/or fun so we WANT to do it not be FORCED to do it. Yes.
When you get to forcing people to do things they hate, rather than lure them with things they love, you have failed. I've quit dozens of games in the past because they got to forcing dynamics, don't make this one more please.
So *sigh* I guess it's back to weeklies only, to earn crippled AD generation rate. *shakes head*, good job. one less body in the quing system and one less person willing to join with all my alts to fill roles to help other players. Sad.
So for another example, lets say you and 4 friends joined the game, all leveled together in the guild you made, and all hit 70. Maybe you don't like to interact with random gamers that may or may not play well with others, so you don't intend to invite other people to the guild. As soon as you hit 70, your ability to improve the guild hall is cut in half. OH!!! WAIT!!! If their gear score is under 10k, they won't be able to do random skirmishes either will they? So hitting 70 will nearly STOP their ability to level their guild hall... I understand that you can get 20 shards every 5 days from EE/UD campaigns, but that's only if they are complete.
All of those factors affect my entire alliance. (some old with nearly all new players, some new with new players, some are slightly antisocial as they are very particular on who joins) So even though there are close to 500 members, I don't think anyone has much more than 11k GS. The only good news is it seems to be easier for the lower levels to get their D-Shards, but what about the 70's?
What changes for me are the Dungeoneering shards. I would typically collect all the daily quests over the week, and run all the dungeons on a weekend when I have more time to play. Now I cannot do that any more, so it means I will not bet getting shards.
Fortunately my guild is GH 20, with the PvE boon structures maxed (just upgrading final support/PvP structures now) so we don't really need the shards badly, but I could have donated them to other guilds in the alliance that are still building up.
And yes, as I (and others) have said, there is not really any motivation for me to run random queues. I hate the leveling dungeons, because of the lack of challenge. And too many of the epic dungeons are just not worth my time.
I did run specific dungeons/skirmishes a lot if I wanted a particular drop (like the Bloodstained Shirt or the Psion's Shroud), but today all I run is ToNG, and I won't run that with a random queue, as it basically forces me into a sub-optimal group composition.
I not saying a "1 Tank, 1 Healer, 3 DPS" group cannot complete it - I had a great run yesterday with an OP/DC/GWF/GWF/HR group, but a random "tank/healer/DPS/DPS/DPS" group could have ended up a lot, lot worse.
Now, I might join a random queue for skirmishes - they are reasonably quick and easy anyhow, but dungeons...forget it!
As I have said before, I consider the whole RQ implementation an absolute disaster.
Influence run gives me black pearls
Did they nerfed rank 5 enchantment drops 100%
The dungeoneering shard production will be destroyed by first, RQ. Second, 1 shard reward per day.
> I done 10 dungeons of different kind and i got 0 enchantment of rank 5 at all
> Influence run gives me black pearls
> Did they nerfed rank 5 enchantment drops 100%
>
>
> They don't drop enchantment anymore. It is replaced by RP items such as Black Pearls.
That's funny... I was having enchants drop along with the new gems the whole time I played yesterday... I do have a fey touched enchant equipped tho so that may be what's dropping them... not sure what the dragon one is dropping.. gems? Enchants?
Enchantment/Runestone drops
Regular enchantments and runestones (ones that aren't part of campaigns or events) will no longer drop in normal play. Instead rank 1s of these items can be bought in Protector's Enclave. Due to not needing the matching bonuses anymore and (as will be mentioned a bit more further down this post) we got rid of the requirement on ranks of requiring a second enchantment/runestone to upgrade, it is more straight forward to just get gemstones, which are purely for RP, in loot vs enchantments and runestones that you are just going to convert into RP anyways.
This also works towards wanting to make the system easier for new players to interact with. Instead of waiting for random drops and trying to figure out which to keep/break down, new players can see all of the regular tier 1s, make their choice, and level it up with the RP they acquire while playing. To go along with this, Tier 1 enchantments have a 100% success rate to become Tier 2, further easing the learning curve of Refinement.
I had 8 black pears in 18 dungeons
I did 8 more after my post and I got 8 pearls...
While in the same time I would see as much as 30-40 enchantments rank 5
Where is that rank 1 enchantments selling now?
This is a joke.
I really hoped for those rank 5 to help me with tradable refining points
Now this is gone
Where I look i see only nerfs in everything
1 GOOD nerf ->5 bad nerfs
Que system=Mouse Trap
So they perceived that older dungeons/skirmishs etc. weren't getting used enough and folks that wanted to experience that content couldn't get a group though the que system (gee, go make some friends and get them to go with you..problem solved). Nope that would be easy...let's make a huge failure prone machine to cage a mouse.
Your new que system is over engineered! It fails in so many ways. It in effect does opposite of what you say you want...get more players, doing more diverse content, so everyone can get a group to go experience it. In practice it fails.....
1.It locks out huge chunks of people, from not having category of type open, so less people grouping.
2.Forcing people who have opened the stuff to do content they hate. so even less people grouping.
3.Stealing the one thing that lured people to even do the little content they could stomach (AD/Seals) and applying it behind stuff they loath (oh that will go well for sure!) less people grouping.
4.Locking out groups that were there for other reasons other than AD/Seals. Like guilds doing it for shards to grow their SH. Hmm less grouping again?
Leave the old AD/seal as is, lure the meeses to the other stuff with even better stinkier cheese! Fix the loot. Fix the pre-qualifiers. Why, even open the categories at L70...how novel!
If I'm not getting a reward from a category (epics/dungeons/skirms/trials/role fill) because I'm locked out, why would I even do the run? For the chest at the end, which I might not have a key and even if I do, the loot is HAMSTER? Please, I'm not going. The only other thing to "lure" in people is :content they have to do to advance i.e. ToD/Demo for the boon drops/gear. So Umm even with the random que, everyone is still doing the underdarks and not the others...what did you solve?