Ah, I see. Let me see if I understand you correctly: "Legit Players" doing "X": Fair Play "Botters" doing "X": Exploit
Very compelling argument you have there. /sarcasm off
Legit players are not bots, because bots doing something is an exploit while legit players doing the same thing is not. Go on.
Wait a second! So are you saying that doing T1 dungeons whole time, doing PVP and doing in game content like Arcane Reservoir and Ghost Stories is ALL exploiting! OH MY! Now it all makes soo much sense! (yes deep sarcasm intended)
"You stand as inspiration. You are practically the Avatar of Buttkicking." -Quote towards Minsc "I choose You Jymaru!" ~for there are times when more than words need to do the talk
Ah, I see. Let me see if I understand you correctly: "Legit Players" doing "X": Fair Play "Botters" doing "X": Exploit
Very compelling argument you have there. /sarcasm off
Legit players are not bots, because bots doing something is an exploit while legit players doing the same thing is not. Go on.
Wait a second! So are you saying that doing T1 dungeons whole time, doing PVP and doing in game content like Arcane Reservoir and Ghost Stories is ALL exploiting! OH MY! Now it all makes soo much sense! (yes deep sarcasm intended)
Lets be brutally honest, They could CARE less about your feedback for or against leadership, they will set up a new paradigm now every few months and shift it to their advantage for whatever is the most direct route to progress, as players pay to do this, they will shift it again.
Anyone who thinks otherwise is really a fool here. One of my reasons why I do not like this change, it now enables them to shift anytime they want without real logical explanations and care about what the playerbase thinks.
When you give them this tool without proper dissent, then this is what you will be left with. Reason and foresight brings us to this logical conclusion, these leaves either A. we argue against these type of changes without proper management and balance or B. we follow along with whatever they want and either pay or leave the game.
B. is basically a outcome of rapidly shifting player-base populations as no one can sustain this type of game for long.
then you need to consider C. , C. points to their improper handling of the last few months of terrible design and content work while making the game less enjoyable for all.
This. This is one of the reasons my wallet will be staying closed to them, as I said. I don't trust them not to do it again. And it's why this dissent needs to be kept up and while people need to stop direct Zen purchases. Cryptic/PWE has demonstrated that the only sort of feedback they understand is a direct attack on the bottom line of their income. If you continue to purchase from them, you are, in effect, sending the message that you are willing to tolerate being taken for granted, having your money taken and the rules of the game changed as quickly as the very next day with no warning whatsoever.
At present, I have no reason to suspect that if I give them an inch, they will not try to take a mile. I will not condone this behavior. I will not endorse it, however tempting it is. I will take the money I was planning to use for another VIP rank and dye packs and upgrading some companions (like the Zhentarium Warlock I just acquired and which I couldn't be happier to have fighting at my main's side), and I will instead put it towards other purposes.
This is the route the majority of the base needs to take. Even if you don't leave, just don't give them your money. They'll get the message soon enough.
"You stand as inspiration. You are practically the Avatar of Buttkicking." -Quote towards Minsc "I choose You Jymaru!" ~for there are times when more than words need to do the talk
And no, you can't call it an exploit "at best" -- it wasn't against any stated or assumed rules of the game to do it.
I can call it an exploit as much as I desire. I do not make the rules. People (including botters) were exploiting leadership to amass the gigantic sums.
ex·ploit verb ikˈsploit/ 1. make full use of and derive benefit from (a resource). "500 companies sprang up to exploit this new technology" synonyms: utilize, harness, use, make use of, turn/put to good use, make the most of, capitalize on, benefit from; informalcash in on "we should exploit this new technology"
You're ignoring that, in the gaming community, exploit implies the usage of taking advantage of a flaw in the code to extract something from the game that wasn't intended, eg the AD exploit in the AH on the Gateway. I certainly agree that by standard english definitions, leadership armies are an exploit, but the emotional attachment to the term carries weight, and if you use words because of their "technical" definition without considering context, you're just deliberately being bad at communication.
Let me stop you there sir/maddam....
"A flaw in the code..."
There was no flaw in the code.
They provided the profession Leadership, character slots at $5 in USD
So you are saying we are cheaters for months on end of work and paying hundreds of USD to support and use the mechanics provided by the GAME?
LOL!!!
And let me add to this by stating once again that the economy was ruined LONG BEFORE LEADERSHIP buddy.... if you ever heard of Caturday the exploit on the gateway that allowed players to put negative values in the bid put BILLIONS of AD into the economy and I guarantee you a ton is still there from that "EXPLOIT"... THAT was an EXPLOIT... a flaw in the code.
Calling players taking the time to level a profession provided in game "Exploiters" is just wrong. You play your way more power to you.
Obvious trolls are obvious. I don't know why people keep responding to him. It will only serve to get the thread shut down as being "not productive". Which is probably the desired outcome.
This 100 times!
They are fanboys, who come or are sent here with different agenda to troll and present a reason for closure of threads. Old and boring trick, it was used against me in the past 99% of the time, so i can spot them from a mile away.
Ok, my question to Cryptic, what shall we do in the game? In current state the game has zero fun, only grind of the remaining few maps, that were left. I love PVP, but PVP all day? For what, what reward?
The game itself became boring and lackluster with Mod 6. We are now many months away from Mod 6, we have not seen any addition to the game or mind you even the old dungeons coming back.
Cryptic should understand, that the lackluster game had only 2 options left, either grind for SH or some gear for your toons. Now they eliminated both of them. In current state the game is max worth to log on for 1 1/2 hours max. , do 1 dungeons, 1 skirmish, 1 pvp and you can log off. Since we get nearly zero AD from playing the game, we can't donate to the high requirements of SH and we can't play our alts either.
Don't you feel Cryptic, it is like a wooden bridge, that you are cutting under yourself?! At least lower SH costs, give us some realistic AD from dungeons, skirmishes, PVP and solo game (cause currently doing dailies for our SH is not worth a dime, we can't progress and we aren't rewarded either) and most importantly give us CONTENT.
The real honest man is honest from conviction of what is right, not from policy.
Robert E. Lee
I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself.
Winston Churchill
The human race is a herd. Here we are, unique, eternal aspects of consciousness with an infinity of potential, and we have allowed ourselves to become an unthinking, unquestioning blob of conformity and uniformity. A herd. Once we concede to the herd mentality, we can be controlled and directed by a tiny few. And we are.
David Icke
Obvious trolls are obvious. I don't know why people keep responding to him. It will only serve to get the thread shut down as being "not productive". Which is probably the desired outcome.
This 100 times!
They are fanboys, who come or are sent here with different agenda to troll and present a reason for closure of threads. Old and boring trick, it was used against me in the past 99% of the time, so i can spot them from a mile away.
Wow, paranoia will destroya. Not going to bother trying to convince you I am new to the game.
Coming into a game and enjoying the content and then visiting the auction house to see things listed for 20 million +, and then learning that a number of players can afford it because they had armies of non-playing entities clicking away in the background. Yeah, made me care little for those people.
Fasnboi? Hah.
The funny thing is I agree with your last two paragraphs in entirety.
And let me add to this by stating once again that the economy was ruined LONG BEFORE LEADERSHIP buddy.... if you ever heard of Caturday the exploit on the gateway that allowed players to put negative values in the bid put BILLIONS of AD into the economy and I guarantee you a ton is still there from that "EXPLOIT"... THAT was an EXPLOIT... a flaw in the code.
Calling players taking the time to level a profession provided in game "Exploiters" is just wrong. You play your way more power to you.
Oh yeh, Caturday was a tragedy and "Caturday Survivor" title which 3 of my characters carry is probably one of those I'm most proud of.
We need to remember also exploit of Mod 1 (was it?) when equipment and currency number were coded on... player client side! The case was never truly resolved and we have no idea who got 100 000 000 AD on several toons just by little mettle with the code.
I imagine all those people who did not get deleted during those occurrences to still have least amount of currency they made (since most likely: only they had enough currency to control Exchange and AH prices, an thus could actually earn ever more). They surely could not be happier than they are now since massive AD deflation means that their stocks only gain and gain economical power beyond recognition. It's probably one of the most frightening aspects of changes so far.
"You stand as inspiration. You are practically the Avatar of Buttkicking." -Quote towards Minsc "I choose You Jymaru!" ~for there are times when more than words need to do the talk
Obvious trolls are obvious. I don't know why people keep responding to him. It will only serve to get the thread shut down as being "not productive". Which is probably the desired outcome.
This 100 times!
They are fanboys, who come or are sent here with different agenda to troll and present a reason for closure of threads. Old and boring trick, it was used against me in the past 99% of the time, so i can spot them from a mile away.
Wow, paranoia will destroya. Not going to bother trying to convince you I am new to the game.
Failure in your logic! If you are new to the game, how can you tell, if the things i and many state here are right or wrong. A beginner arguing with people, who are here since beta or launch.
The real honest man is honest from conviction of what is right, not from policy.
Robert E. Lee
I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself.
Winston Churchill
The human race is a herd. Here we are, unique, eternal aspects of consciousness with an infinity of potential, and we have allowed ourselves to become an unthinking, unquestioning blob of conformity and uniformity. A herd. Once we concede to the herd mentality, we can be controlled and directed by a tiny few. And we are.
David Icke
Obvious trolls are obvious. I don't know why people keep responding to him. It will only serve to get the thread shut down as being "not productive". Which is probably the desired outcome.
This 100 times!
They are fanboys, who come or are sent here with different agenda to troll and present a reason for closure of threads. Old and boring trick, it was used against me in the past 99% of the time, so i can spot them from a mile away.
Wow, paranoia will destroya. Not going to bother trying to convince you I am new to the game.
Failure in your logic! If you are new to the game, how can you tell, if the things i and many state here are right or wrong. A beginner arguing with people, who are here since beta or launch.
Perhaps this is not my first MMO? Is NW a special unique snowflake?
Cryptic's staff popped smoked and dropped artillery. That is... they are conducting a retrograde maneuver... or, in other words, they're hiding in a hole waiting for us to stop shooting at them. Once everyone quiets down, they can get back to finding more ways to squeeze more money out of players while telling you the change is to fix something. I mean, they're not lying I guess - it's to fix falling revenues, and maybe to fix the fact the bosses need to get themselves into new 2016 BMWs... I mean, the 2015s are so..... this year.
the way the game been shedding players since April they'll be lucky if they can swing a used Fiat.
Obvious trolls are obvious. I don't know why people keep responding to him. It will only serve to get the thread shut down as being "not productive". Which is probably the desired outcome.
This 100 times!
They are fanboys, who come or are sent here with different agenda to troll and present a reason for closure of threads. Old and boring trick, it was used against me in the past 99% of the time, so i can spot them from a mile away.
Wow, paranoia will destroya. Not going to bother trying to convince you I am new to the game.
Failure in your logic! If you are new to the game, how can you tell, if the things i and many state here are right or wrong. A beginner arguing with people, who are here since beta or launch.
Perhaps this is not my first MMO? Is NW a special unique snowflake?
Dunno. How many MMOs are headed by people without a causal connection to reality, their own player base, and have a lead dev so out of touch he's talking about PVP by using the model that was removed several months ago?
Obvious trolls are obvious. I don't know why people keep responding to him. It will only serve to get the thread shut down as being "not productive". Which is probably the desired outcome.
This 100 times!
They are fanboys, who come or are sent here with different agenda to troll and present a reason for closure of threads. Old and boring trick, it was used against me in the past 99% of the time, so i can spot them from a mile away.
Wow, paranoia will destroya. Not going to bother trying to convince you I am new to the game.
Failure in your logic! If you are new to the game, how can you tell, if the things i and many state here are right or wrong. A beginner arguing with people, who are here since beta or launch.
Perhaps this is not my first MMO? Is NW a special unique snowflake?
Dunno. How many MMOs are headed by people without a causal connection to reality, their own player base, and have a lead dev so out of touch he's talking about PVP by using the model that was removed several months ago?
Does Blizzard count? They pretty much killed the Diablo franchise after D2 and WoW was on a slide since the first expansion.
My point is that I am not new to MMO economies.
0
matiagronxMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 251Arc User
Isn't this great ? So many new features coming up and no players to use it.
These changes had made the game impossible to play by casual players. Do you want to have anything worthy in game? you need AD for it. Ok, how do I get AD? Oh, do some dungeons, PvP and skirmishes. Nice! but I don't have much time to do these things. Well no AD for you then. OK, what can I do without AD? NOTHING !!!
There are so many things done wrong in this game BUT the AD removal from Leadership is NOT one of them. It was rushed, true. Some people invested in it recently and didnt have the time to get back their investment. I doubt they were more than a handfull and i wish Cryptic would do something to compensate them for their investment. The rest of the players who had invested in Leadership bots got their money back MULTIPLE times, you cant possibly imagine the figures. So that was a GOOD thing, mkay! Now to correct something, If you dont have time to farm ad dear meltzar then PAY SOME REAL MONEY. If you are in a hurry, PAY. The rest of the playerbase who dedicated their precious time get rewarded with ad, the more time u spend the more ad you get. Since leadership became a plague, the ad rewards (BoE items, Gmops etc) were removed to balance out the Leadership bots. But still if u run enough you push your luck to the limit and get good ad. You will not get tens of millions but you will surely get enough.
Isn't this great ? So many new features coming up and no players to use it.
These changes had made the game impossible to play by casual players. Do you want to have anything worthy in game? you need AD for it. Ok, how do I get AD? Oh, do some dungeons, PvP and skirmishes. Nice! but I don't have much time to do these things. Well no AD for you then. OK, what can I do without AD? NOTHING !!!
There are so many things done wrong in this game BUT the AD removal from Leadership is NOT one of them. It was rushed, true. Some people invested in it recently and didnt have the time to get back their investment. I doubt they were more than a handfull and i wish Cryptic would do something to compensate them for their investment. The rest of the players who had invested in Leadership bots got their money back MULTIPLE times, you cant possibly imagine the figures. So that was a GOOD thing, mkay! Now to correct something, If you dont have time to farm ad dear meltzar then PAY SOME REAL MONEY. If you are in a hurry, PAY. The rest of the playerbase who dedicated their precious time get rewarded with ad, the more time u spend the more ad you get. Since leadership became a plague, the ad rewards (BoE items, Gmops etc) were removed to balance out the Leadership bots. But still if u run enough you push your luck to the limit and get good ad. You will not get tens of millions but you will surely get enough.
Agree in entirety. I suspect the forum is being filled with the vocal minority that believe taking AD from leadership was wrong. Many have left, but I doubt many believe that leadership armies were a good thing for the game (good for themselves personally, sure)
Isn't this great ? So many new features coming up and no players to use it.
These changes had made the game impossible to play by casual players. Do you want to have anything worthy in game? you need AD for it. Ok, how do I get AD? Oh, do some dungeons, PvP and skirmishes. Nice! but I don't have much time to do these things. Well no AD for you then. OK, what can I do without AD? NOTHING !!!
There are so many things done wrong in this game BUT the AD removal from Leadership is NOT one of them. It was rushed, true. Some people invested in it recently and didnt have the time to get back their investment. I doubt they were more than a handfull and i wish Cryptic would do something to compensate them for their investment. The rest of the players who had invested in Leadership bots got their money back MULTIPLE times, you cant possibly imagine the figures. So that was a GOOD thing, mkay! Now to correct something, If you dont have time to farm ad dear meltzar then PAY SOME REAL MONEY. If you are in a hurry, PAY. The rest of the playerbase who dedicated their precious time get rewarded with ad, the more time u spend the more ad you get. Since leadership became a plague, the ad rewards (BoE items, Gmops etc) were removed to balance out the Leadership bots. But still if u run enough you push your luck to the limit and get good ad. You will not get tens of millions but you will surely get enough.
Mati. My time is short, as my break is coming to its end....
I have three characters. I don't have time to upgrade them all thanks to these new changes. Now. Why should I pay so much money (run the math, going by the in-house system, it's about 400$ to upgrade an artifact weapon, under ideal circumstances) that I could buy a brand new computer, when I have no reason to suspect Cryptic won't just turn around and render my massive investment invalid with no warning and no compensation for the money invested?
Isn't this great ? So many new features coming up and no players to use it.
These changes had made the game impossible to play by casual players. Do you want to have anything worthy in game? you need AD for it. Ok, how do I get AD? Oh, do some dungeons, PvP and skirmishes. Nice! but I don't have much time to do these things. Well no AD for you then. OK, what can I do without AD? NOTHING !!!
There are so many things done wrong in this game BUT the AD removal from Leadership is NOT one of them. It was rushed, true. Some people invested in it recently and didnt have the time to get back their investment. I doubt they were more than a handfull and i wish Cryptic would do something to compensate them for their investment. The rest of the players who had invested in Leadership bots got their money back MULTIPLE times, you cant possibly imagine the figures. So that was a GOOD thing, mkay! Now to correct something, If you dont have time to farm ad dear meltzar then PAY SOME REAL MONEY. If you are in a hurry, PAY. The rest of the playerbase who dedicated their precious time get rewarded with ad, the more time u spend the more ad you get. Since leadership became a plague, the ad rewards (BoE items, Gmops etc) were removed to balance out the Leadership bots. But still if u run enough you push your luck to the limit and get good ad. You will not get tens of millions but you will surely get enough.
Mati. My time is short, as my break is coming to its end....
I have three characters. I don't have time to upgrade them all thanks to these new changes. Now. Why should I pay so much money (run the math, going by the in-house system, it's about 400$ to upgrade an artifact weapon, under ideal circumstances) that I could buy a brand new computer, when I have no reason to suspect Cryptic won't just turn around and render my massive investment invalid with no warning and no compensation for the money invested?
Answer: I shouldn't.
No one thinks the leadership change alone will solve everything. A lot more needs to be adjusted to make the game viable for folks like you and I.
Thing that sucks is that F2P games all rely on Microtransactions to remain afloat. Sub model MMOs dont really care how much wealth a player amasses (or they cap it somehow) because they dont rely on this type of thing. In NW you have to kiss the ring at some point when the king gets upset that the taxes aren't being paid.
Isn't this great ? So many new features coming up and no players to use it.
These changes had made the game impossible to play by casual players. Do you want to have anything worthy in game? you need AD for it. Ok, how do I get AD? Oh, do some dungeons, PvP and skirmishes. Nice! but I don't have much time to do these things. Well no AD for you then. OK, what can I do without AD? NOTHING !!!
There are so many things done wrong in this game BUT the AD removal from Leadership is NOT one of them. It was rushed, true. Some people invested in it recently and didnt have the time to get back their investment. I doubt they were more than a handfull and i wish Cryptic would do something to compensate them for their investment. The rest of the players who had invested in Leadership bots got their money back MULTIPLE times, you cant possibly imagine the figures. So that was a GOOD thing, mkay! Now to correct something, If you dont have time to farm ad dear meltzar then PAY SOME REAL MONEY. If you are in a hurry, PAY. The rest of the playerbase who dedicated their precious time get rewarded with ad, the more time u spend the more ad you get. Since leadership became a plague, the ad rewards (BoE items, Gmops etc) were removed to balance out the Leadership bots. But still if u run enough you push your luck to the limit and get good ad. You will not get tens of millions but you will surely get enough.
Agree in entirety. I suspect the forum is being filled with the vocal minority that believe taking AD from leadership was wrong. Many have left, but I doubt many believe that leadership armies were a good thing for the game (good for themselves personally, sure)
*sighs*
Again. We don't object to the removal of the leadership AD in and of itself. We object to the removal of it in what is clearly an at best knee-jerk unplanned attempt to squeeze more real life cash out of us while giving us nothing else in return (such as adjusting the time of the leadership tasks, giving us better alternative rewards etc) while giving us a comparative pittance in return that requires us to make the game a second job (I ran a dungeon last night. Second time through, TOS, and got 75AD for my trouble. With nary a sign of the 3K bonus I was promised, indicating they either flat out lied to me or they moved forward with a buggy, hastily implemented plan with very little testing done to make sure it actually freaking worked*).
*Frankly, my money is on the latter. I generally believe that it is best not to ascribe to malice that which can be explained by incompetence, and the current dev team is clearly not the sharpest blades in the armory, if Mod 6 was anything to go by, but there's a bitter cynic in me that won't let me forget that Cryptic has made bald-face lies to its customer base before in this very game, and pulled off a doozy of one during the Second Year Anniversary.
in my opinion the devp did far more damage to the game then any botter ever has done, fire the whole team responsable for that disaster called mod 6 and get back every single programmer that made the game good when it was originally released many years ago. Now they seem top think they have to make radacle changes every day to " justify" their paychecks when the best think they can to is call out sick or not show up and definitly not change anything for a lon long time other then to roll back to mod 5. They are working on new mods befor old ones are bugged and lagged, i can predict the future of nw its going to be called ghost towns
Not even the company says it was an exploit. The company says BOTS were using it as an exploit. And legit players are not bots.
Ah, I see. Let me see if I understand you correctly: "Legit Players" doing "X": Fair Play "Botters" doing "X": Exploit
Very compelling argument you have there. /sarcasm off
Legit players are not bots, because bots doing something is an exploit while legit players doing the same thing is not. Go on.
yep, bots are a exploit so anything they do is exploiting, hence them using leadership was exploiting or invoking or runing skirmishes, all exploiting, so long as a bot is doing it. but bots were just the excuse the real reason is they want to make anyone that wants to have top 10% gear pay $4000 because lets face it it it takes about 30 million AD to buy all your artifacts(the best artys on there own are 9-15million, the better perfect+ rank weapon enchantments are 5-10mill AD ) upgrade all your enchantments, if your a bit patient and wait for double periods,
at 24k a day thats 1250 days worth of daily refining.
I mean I can explain everything but I made one post and have had my words twisted completely to the point I end up backtracking and arguing against statements I never said to begin with.
Hey folks, Scott here again to give you an update on the state of the Neverwinter and the Astral Diamond economy. We’re going to be making a number of changes, all of which should increase the amount of AD most players earn in a given day.
Goatshark's statement here is a bit of a fallacy to begin with. Without reference to relatives like time and other factors, we are already given the assumption that players will be making more AD in a given day. As it is, this is not true. In the future we are not even certain of other changes, diamond sinks, bugged skirmishes. Even the dwindling player base.
You simply cannot make the guarantee that goatshark made..... And think again if you want to highlight the "should" part, since the eye catching bolded part does not include it. If you want your words not to be twisted, start off by leveling with people and telling the straight honest truth. not a fairytale dreamt up by some pixie dev.
Valid arguments are being considered but two way communication requires people to stop twisting words and comparing apples to oranges.
Botting RP by farming nodes and such in ghost stories is not the same as botting AD. Certainly it needs to and is being addressed but it really is not relevant to the botting and farming of Leadership which generated AD at a rate which players could not hope to compete with. This is why the Zen Exchange has been capped for nearly two years and is why these changes are being made.
Yes they could just keep making more AD sinks but the more sinks they add the more hurt people who play the game instead of farm leadership become. As such the necessary act is to switch rewarding NW Farmville to rewarding playing Neverwinter.
As far as twisting words i hardly see why cryptic/pwe/you would expect a level playing field as this discussion goes when in fact a level playing field was never provided to begin with. The very fact that the dev post looks like the product of a spin doctors effort to say "we are taking diamonds out of leadership". Throw in some promises of a more stable economy and some half baked numbers of how much we could be getting per pve/pvp run is the reason why so many people are upset.
I'll even point out again.... the launcher on tuesday had an over glorified advertisement for stronghold seige being patched in that day. No word on Leadership changes going live. If you cannot admit that looked shady aswell then less respect to this game and company, much less. And percentage of people in game that knew about the changes versus people that didn't know because they don't go to the forums? I think from last week first day this discussion went up would be 30% didn't know versus a 60% did know give or take 10% either way. still at best 20% did not seem to know what was going. Do you want to lose even 20% of your players? How about 20% less profit for the game? in zone chat thursday/friday "wait whats this talk about no diamonds in leadership?" was common . Would have been better for players if leadership change was announced in launcher: "Important news about leadership profession, click to read discussion". not that hard to link.
As for your arguement about apples and oranges, both are fruit. Fruit in this case: diamonds. Leadership, you get diamonds. RP Farm, get rp items which are then listed in AH to be sold for..... diamonds. End result? diamonds!. Bots in skirmishes/dungeons/pvp afking? diamonds!! not that hard to understand, unless your rigidity on the subject results in the proverbial horse blinders being put on.
As it stands, i like many others was conned into getting vip. 57 days left on it. Only reason for me to log now is to collect my vastly useless key and open a lockbox to get my 2 tarmalune bar average and HAMSTER booster pack.
HA! "twisting my words" Announcement VIP Access!! get an enchanted key a day per account!
*not advertised*Significantly reduced rewards out of lockboxes due to VIP rewarded daily key *not advertised*
My guild chief is helping me see this whole thing in a different light; it's a shift in economic models from a strong allotment-based (rAD) system - which he says you're pretty much a sucker if you lean on that - to more of a player-exchange economy - sort of like moving from welfare to the stock exchange. It is a bit of a shock for people like me, but it has potential if you know what you're doing. That said, it's not what they're telling us it is. Of course, he was also talking about selling blue drops from epic/level 70 content, which is not yet available to me.
That said, it appears selling blue drops from normal content is not entirely without dividends.
… All that being said, I do sill think they should give out a flatter, fairer rate of rAD rewards - certainly during CTA events; building a fat stockpile was fun, and I've still got leftovers to nibble on - and it did get me one pirate tricorn.
If you want robofarming, go play farmville or something.
lol aye a stock exchange were 10% or less of the population controls 95% of the wealth and has no finanical oversight or insider trading and already has syndicates in the form of botters :P if he has lots of ad already hell do well, much like the real world but on steroids cause no finacial colusion laws
i sujest you see howmany african tribesmen are big players in the real world stock market unless your starting with a hoard
i would more likely say that your guild masters desperatly trying to keep members from leaving and thats the best he could come up with
lol aye a stock exchange were 10% or less of the population controls 95% of the wealth and has no finanical oversight or insider trading and already has syndicates in the form of botters :P if he has lots of ad already hell do well, much like the real world but on steroids cause no finacial colusion laws
i sujest you see howmany african tribesmen are big players in the real world stock market unless your starting with a hoard
I forsee another potential problem with this tactic. Not only is much of the player base leaving (meaning fewer people buying), but AH prices are adjusting to compensate for the drop in rAD rewards. The AH may not be very profitable for much longer. In any case, it's a HUGE shift in the game's economy, and the shockwaves are doubtless just getting started. Even if it isn't really an a-bomb at this point, it may reach those proportions in time.
If you want robofarming, go play farmville or something.
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WELCOME TO MY ART CORNER!
"I choose You Jymaru!" ~for there are times when more than words need to do the talk
Rage against the zeitgeist.
At present, I have no reason to suspect that if I give them an inch, they will not try to take a mile. I will not condone this behavior. I will not endorse it, however tempting it is. I will take the money I was planning to use for another VIP rank and dye packs and upgrading some companions (like the Zhentarium Warlock I just acquired and which I couldn't be happier to have fighting at my main's side), and I will instead put it towards other purposes.
This is the route the majority of the base needs to take. Even if you don't leave, just don't give them your money. They'll get the message soon enough.
That being said I'll try to refrain from such actions in future of this topic. And it seems like things won't end anywhere in 'nearest' future.
WELCOME TO MY ART CORNER!
"I choose You Jymaru!" ~for there are times when more than words need to do the talk
"A flaw in the code..."
There was no flaw in the code.
They provided the profession Leadership, character slots at $5 in USD
So you are saying we are cheaters for months on end of work and paying hundreds of USD to support and use the mechanics provided by the GAME?
LOL!!!
And let me add to this by stating once again that the economy was ruined LONG BEFORE LEADERSHIP buddy.... if you ever heard of Caturday the exploit on the gateway that allowed players to put negative values in the bid put BILLIONS of AD into the economy and I guarantee you a ton is still there from that "EXPLOIT"... THAT was an EXPLOIT... a flaw in the code.
Calling players taking the time to level a profession provided in game "Exploiters" is just wrong. You play your way more power to you.
They are fanboys, who come or are sent here with different agenda to troll and present a reason for closure of threads. Old and boring trick, it was used against me in the past 99% of the time, so i can spot them from a mile away.
Ok, my question to Cryptic, what shall we do in the game? In current state the game has zero fun, only grind of the remaining few maps, that were left. I love PVP, but PVP all day? For what, what reward?
The game itself became boring and lackluster with Mod 6. We are now many months away from Mod 6, we have not seen any addition to the game or mind you even the old dungeons coming back.
Cryptic should understand, that the lackluster game had only 2 options left, either grind for SH or some gear for your toons. Now they eliminated both of them. In current state the game is max worth to log on for 1 1/2 hours max. , do 1 dungeons, 1 skirmish, 1 pvp and you can log off. Since we get nearly zero AD from playing the game, we can't donate to the high requirements of SH and we can't play our alts either.
Don't you feel Cryptic, it is like a wooden bridge, that you are cutting under yourself?! At least lower SH costs, give us some realistic AD from dungeons, skirmishes, PVP and solo game (cause currently doing dailies for our SH is not worth a dime, we can't progress and we aren't rewarded either) and most importantly give us CONTENT.
Robert E. Lee
I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself.
Winston Churchill
The human race is a herd. Here we are, unique, eternal aspects of consciousness with an infinity of potential, and we have allowed ourselves to become an unthinking, unquestioning blob of conformity and uniformity. A herd. Once we concede to the herd mentality, we can be controlled and directed by a tiny few. And we are.
David Icke
Not going to bother trying to convince you I am new to the game.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Coming into a game and enjoying the content and then visiting the auction house to see things listed for 20 million +, and then learning that a number of players can afford it because they had armies of non-playing entities clicking away in the background. Yeah, made me care little for those people.
Fasnboi? Hah.
The funny thing is I agree with your last two paragraphs in entirety.
We need to remember also exploit of Mod 1 (was it?) when equipment and currency number were coded on... player client side! The case was never truly resolved and we have no idea who got 100 000 000 AD on several toons just by little mettle with the code.
I imagine all those people who did not get deleted during those occurrences to still have least amount of currency they made (since most likely: only they had enough currency to control Exchange and AH prices, an thus could actually earn ever more). They surely could not be happier than they are now since massive AD deflation means that their stocks only gain and gain economical power beyond recognition. It's probably one of the most frightening aspects of changes so far.
WELCOME TO MY ART CORNER!
"I choose You Jymaru!" ~for there are times when more than words need to do the talk
Robert E. Lee
I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself.
Winston Churchill
The human race is a herd. Here we are, unique, eternal aspects of consciousness with an infinity of potential, and we have allowed ourselves to become an unthinking, unquestioning blob of conformity and uniformity. A herd. Once we concede to the herd mentality, we can be controlled and directed by a tiny few. And we are.
David Icke
My point is that I am not new to MMO economies.
Now to correct something, If you dont have time to farm ad dear meltzar then PAY SOME REAL MONEY. If you are in a hurry, PAY. The rest of the playerbase who dedicated their precious time get rewarded with ad, the more time u spend the more ad you get. Since leadership became a plague, the ad rewards (BoE items, Gmops etc) were removed to balance out the Leadership bots. But still if u run enough you push your luck to the limit and get good ad. You will not get tens of millions but you will surely get enough.
I have three characters. I don't have time to upgrade them all thanks to these new changes. Now. Why should I pay so much money (run the math, going by the in-house system, it's about 400$ to upgrade an artifact weapon, under ideal circumstances) that I could buy a brand new computer, when I have no reason to suspect Cryptic won't just turn around and render my massive investment invalid with no warning and no compensation for the money invested?
Answer: I shouldn't.
Again. We don't object to the removal of the leadership AD in and of itself. We object to the removal of it in what is clearly an at best knee-jerk unplanned attempt to squeeze more real life cash out of us while giving us nothing else in return (such as adjusting the time of the leadership tasks, giving us better alternative rewards etc) while giving us a comparative pittance in return that requires us to make the game a second job (I ran a dungeon last night. Second time through, TOS, and got 75AD for my trouble. With nary a sign of the 3K bonus I was promised, indicating they either flat out lied to me or they moved forward with a buggy, hastily implemented plan with very little testing done to make sure it actually freaking worked*).
*Frankly, my money is on the latter. I generally believe that it is best not to ascribe to malice that which can be explained by incompetence, and the current dev team is clearly not the sharpest blades in the armory, if Mod 6 was anything to go by, but there's a bitter cynic in me that won't let me forget that Cryptic has made bald-face lies to its customer base before in this very game, and pulled off a doozy of one during the Second Year Anniversary.
but bots were just the excuse the real reason is they want to make anyone that wants to have top 10% gear pay $4000
because lets face it it it takes about 30 million AD to buy all your artifacts(the best artys on there own are 9-15million, the better perfect+ rank weapon enchantments are 5-10mill AD ) upgrade all your enchantments, if your a bit patient and wait for double periods,
at 24k a day thats 1250 days worth of daily refining.
Goatshark's statement here is a bit of a fallacy to begin with. Without reference to relatives like time and other factors, we are already given the assumption that players will be making more AD in a given day. As it is, this is not true. In the future we are not even certain of other changes, diamond sinks, bugged skirmishes. Even the dwindling player base.
You simply cannot make the guarantee that goatshark made..... And think again if you want to highlight the "should" part, since the eye catching bolded part does not include it. If you want your words not to be twisted, start off by leveling with people and telling the straight honest truth. not a fairytale dreamt up by some pixie dev. As far as twisting words i hardly see why cryptic/pwe/you would expect a level playing field as this discussion goes when in fact a level playing field was never provided to begin with. The very fact that the dev post looks like the product of a spin doctors effort to say "we are taking diamonds out of leadership". Throw in some promises of a more stable economy and some half baked numbers of how much we could be getting per pve/pvp run is the reason why so many people are upset.
I'll even point out again.... the launcher on tuesday had an over glorified advertisement for stronghold seige being patched in that day. No word on Leadership changes going live. If you cannot admit that looked shady aswell then less respect to this game and company, much less. And percentage of people in game that knew about the changes versus people that didn't know because they don't go to the forums? I think from last week first day this discussion went up would be 30% didn't know versus a 60% did know give or take 10% either way. still at best 20% did not seem to know what was going. Do you want to lose even 20% of your players? How about 20% less profit for the game? in zone chat thursday/friday "wait whats this talk about no diamonds in leadership?" was common . Would have been better for players if leadership change was announced in launcher: "Important news about leadership profession, click to read discussion". not that hard to link.
As for your arguement about apples and oranges, both are fruit. Fruit in this case: diamonds. Leadership, you get diamonds. RP Farm, get rp items which are then listed in AH to be sold for..... diamonds. End result? diamonds!. Bots in skirmishes/dungeons/pvp afking? diamonds!! not that hard to understand, unless your rigidity on the subject results in the proverbial horse blinders being put on.
As it stands, i like many others was conned into getting vip. 57 days left on it. Only reason for me to log now is to collect my vastly useless key and open a lockbox to get my 2 tarmalune bar average and HAMSTER booster pack.
HA! "twisting my words" Announcement VIP Access!! get an enchanted key a day per account!
*not advertised*Significantly reduced rewards out of lockboxes due to VIP rewarded daily key *not advertised*
amirite?
That said, it appears selling blue drops from normal content is not entirely without dividends.
… All that being said, I do sill think they should give out a flatter, fairer rate of rAD rewards - certainly during CTA events; building a fat stockpile was fun, and I've still got leftovers to nibble on - and it did get me one pirate tricorn.
Rage against the zeitgeist.
i sujest you see howmany african tribesmen are big players in the real world stock market unless your starting with a hoard
i would more likely say that your guild masters desperatly trying to keep members from leaving and thats the best he could come up with
Rage against the zeitgeist.