Ekhm... what you are suggesting is not a f2p anymore. Seriously, that you could play for free til 60 means nothing.
You have some good points, that leveling is too fast for instance, and that everything willl most likely be BoP in the near future, but overall - no and no.
AH is crucial in the f2p model and making everything BoP is not helping. Making AD easier to obtain would make prices higher.
Really, all we need are AD sinks (I am tired of repeating myself. This is so simple, why people can't understand it?) to make AD more desirable. Paying customers would also be more eager to charge zen and exchange it for AD if they had something to do with those AD.
Point is, you stop the bots at the first task they cannot complete. Any normal player brings the crown back to Knox at least once on his account.
Really? Because you just said that it was such a simple task that it would only take 10 minutes to do. Do you honestly think the botters will simply go. "Well guys, they out smarted us. We gota do blacklake now, and despite all this money we are making, its just to much trouble to do. So thats it, we have been beaten, lets pack up shop and go elsewhere."
You seriously think this is what will break them? that they wont simply just step over this new line and continue to do business? That they wont find a way to speed it up, automate it, or simply just get past it? They already have high level bots, for farming. They have these bots ALREADY, by the thousands. They have already more then likely crossed your magical threshold and would have nothing, at all, to fear by it.
Put simply, your wonderful idea is more then likely to catch some new player unaware of danger of skipping this one singular area. Then it would do anything to stop or slow the bots.
So? how does that matter? One of your alts surely has completed the blacklake lairs achievement. That's the key in distiquising players from bots. Bots cannot handle Karzov. Players can. Your alts are 100% safe.
I'm pointing out it is possible to have an account with only lvl 4 characters (so they don't even know where Blacklake is), enchants at least lvl 3, and making AD, all legit and without paying real money. True it is hard to imagine why someone would play like that, but it is possible. Also how can you know bots can't beat Karzov?
And even if they really can't, a real human can do it for them (although it is more likely that bot's AI would be improved to beat him) and after that let them do their job.
And I still don't know how exactly are you going to tell the difference between a bot and a real player.
Auto-ban everyone who got killed by Karzov?
Couple my characters would be in the same boat as sockmunkey. Legit players that lvl characters through PVP/invoking/leadership, would get caught in that net.
The real problem is that people want it *NOW*. If you watch real life stock markets you'll know that it is the people who go for the long run who make the most money consistently.
Is the backlog of AD-to-Zen a problem? Yes, but only if you are impatient. It is not really a problem. The problem is expecting instant gratification.
IF YOU'RE SMART: You'll proffer your AD for Zen exchange now not wait until you need it. If you're just looking to build-up your Zen *reserves* (as the smart people will do) then waiting one or two weeks for the Proffer to sell isn;t a big deal. Come on, people, you *know* there is new content coming, you *know* there will be sales for Zen market items and new items you will want - so why whine and cry about how long it takes to exchange AD for Zen? Instead of crying about it Proffer your AD now. So what if it take a week to go through, there's still two weeks before the new content is released.
Build up a Zen Reserve. The way the *Smart people do it.
Couple my characters would be in the same boat as sockmunkey. Legit players that lvl characters through PVP/invoking/leadership, would get caught in that net.
I'm not sure about that since you need lvl 10 to start any of those things, so you need to do Blacklake to get there... oh wait, we have foundry
0
beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
edited July 2014
It's actually a bit difficult to level through any of those means without doing Blacklake, since you need to be a minimum of level 10 to access any of them. So there's the storyline or there's Foundry, until you hit level 10. Then you can campfire-level to your heart's content.
I think the idea is that bots falter at a sequence like pressing F to unlock the door, doing the fight, obtaining the crown (open box, deal with the explosion, and then take the crown), taking the crown back to Knox and proceeding through the dialogue.
But if someone doesn't come up with an automated script to handle all that because it's now required of them, they can pay a pittance to some worker who now does that for a living instead of making crappy T-shirts. Then the account gets handed over to automation, and they start a new one.
First, adding humans to the equation seriously slows down bot production. That's why human actions are not required. Time is money in the world of bots. Humans have to be paid. Bots work for free. That's the whole point.
Still, it is not nearly as hard/expensive to stop botting because of such a small obstacle.
Could you now answer my question? Look, I'm even quoting myself:
Really, all we need are AD sinks (I am tired of repeating myself. This is so simple, why people can't understand it?) to make AD more desirable. Paying customers would also be more eager to charge zen and exchange it for AD if they had something to do with those AD.
AD sinks will no longer work in this economy. AD sinks are fixed priced items that remove AD from the game. A cat used to be an AD sink a long time ago, took a while for me to get one and many beta players may have bought one like me. Now players can easily afford multiple cats.
The rate at which players and gold sellers generate free AD is ever increasing, fast enough to overcome AD sinks introduce. So far the temporary measures by PWE have always resulted fall in prices for a few days, and prices continue rise beyond what it was before the event/sale happened. Permanent AD sinks will only have a longer duration effect before they too are overcome by the increasing rate of AD influx into the economy and its devaluation. AD cannot be more desirable when it's value is ever decreasing. People prefer to hold on to Zen and buy what they need from the Zen store instead of dealing with the increasingly high prices and lowering value of AD.
0
adernathMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
The primary reason is that past exploiters and/or botters got enough AD that they can now manipulate, if not outright control, the AH markets.
I think it is the contrary: In the past many things were cheap (like enchants) because of the bot farmers offering them in mass. The zen prices rised astronomically only after they made coalescent wards bind. But without the black market those prices would already be from the beginning very high. The black market of bot farmers and their customers balanced that out. Now PWE/Cryptic attempt to combat the black market with bound items, which leads to alot of free AD, because coalescent wards and keys will not be tradable anymore. This drives the prices I think.
Suggestions to improve NW:
- Dualspec
- Better rewarding foundry and foundry pvp maps
- Custom PvP leagues with leaderboards instead of the current 'matchmaking'.
- Armory
- make jumping cost stamina (to reduce hopping in pvp)
But anyways on topic of the title of the thread. It was inevitable this would happen.
Because this.
The rate at which players and gold sellers generate free AD is ever increasing, fast enough to overcome AD sinks introduce. So far the temporary measures by PWE have always resulted fall in prices for a few days, and prices continue rise beyond what it was before the event/sale happened. Permanent AD sinks will only have a longer duration effect before they too are overcome by the increasing rate of AD influx into the economy and its devaluation. AD cannot be more desirable when it's value is ever decreasing. People prefer to hold on to Zen and buy what they need from the Zen store instead of dealing with the increasingly high prices and lowering value of AD.
The timeframe in which it would occur was accelerated by a multitude of reasons, bots being one, but probably not even the main cause. PWE/Cryptic is using it as red herring to implement a bunch of changes, that will help the economy. (those changes would be some of the main issues, but they will up play the bot issue to distract you from the changes/issues)
I think it is the contrary: In the past many things were cheap (like enchants) because of the bot farmers offering them in mass. The zen prices rised astronomically only after they made coalescent wards bind. But without the black market those prices would already be from the beginning very high. The black market of bot farmers and their customers balanced that out. Now PWE/Cryptic attempt to combat the black market with bound items, which leads to alot of free AD, because coalescent wards and keys will not be tradable anymore. This drives the prices I think.
You also have to wonder if prices would have reached this high on their own. The black market spoilt the community and created a very high demand, and also consolidated AD towards their faction to future manipulation of prices. As soon as the latest preview went live, dragon eggs were swiped from the market and reposted for double. A lot of the damage is done earlier in the game and you can't help but wonder if PWE's measures simply forced their (gold sellers/market manipulators) hand and really fixes nothing at all.
AD sinks will no longer work in this economy. Why do you think so? We just need reasonable sinks, something everyone can afford and not only whales.AD sinks are fixed priced items that remove AD from the game. A cat used to be an AD sink a long time ago, took a while for me to get one and many beta players may have bought one like me. Now players can easily afford multiple cats. You also have more players that played for a long time therefore accumulated AD.
The rate at which players and gold sellers generate free AD is ever increasing, nope, it is 24k/day/char, as always (or was the refining limit higher once?). The only AD that is not refined by yourself comes from AH i.e it does not enter the system when you are obtaining it, it already was there and 10% of it is lost with every transaction. fast enough to overcome AD sinks introduce. So far the temporary measures by PWE have always resulted fall in prices for a few days, and prices continue rise beyond what it was before the event/sale happened. Permanent AD sinks will only have a longer duration permanent sinks will have permanent duration. 1 item that I bet would remove a lot of AD: teleportation scrolls, if only theye were like 10 times cheaper. those would be so helpful while leveling, as they are now nobody buys them. effect before they too are overcome by the increasing rate of AD influx into the economy and its devaluation. AD cannot be more desirable when it's value is ever decreasing. AD value is decreasing because it is not desirable, not the other way round. People prefer to hold on to Zen and buy what they need from the Zen store instead of dealing with the increasingly high prices and lowering value of AD. which is because there is nothing to spend AD on.
nope, it is 24k/day/char, as always (or was the refining limit higher once?).
This is the only statement I'm responding to, as the basis of your arguments is the bulk of AD is circulated through the AH and disbelieve that there are vast amounts of AD generated.
24k/char/day is not the limit on an account, the freedom to have as many characters generating 24k/char/day is the true limit or lack of. There's even a forum guide on it.
Oh no. It's a combination of things. You can get killed by Karzov all you want. It doesn't matter. Till blacklake you're nothing more than a normal player with some map and chat restrictions. It's getting past it without finishing the quest-line that'll get you. Because you cannot. And that's what stopping bots from progressing any further. You simply have to kill Karzov and take the crown to Knox before anything else in the game.
It's been a while since I did blacklake but what makes it impossible for the botters just add code to complete the quest line?
There's no reason that players/gold farmers are getting AD any faster than they have in the past. 24k/char/day has been around for a while now.
I firmly believe people just need more things they can spend AD on. As it stands, the main use of AD is to buy things on the auction house, so of course as time passes the prices are increasingly pushed ridiculously high. (As an example) if Cryptic frequently introduced cosmetics that could be purchased with AD, I think we would see the amount of AD in circulation go down.
I would spend more AD on upgrading companions and mounts if their AD prices were quartered or halved even. In fact, I would probably spend even MORE AD simply because I'd want to upgrade everything since I'm a collector. However, there is no way in hell I'm going to spend what they want currently to upgrade anything. I get it, they would rather you buy zen and a purple pet than upgrading a green to purple because in the end, they get nothing out of it. However, it drives their player base to make certain decisions which are actually detrimental to ultimate goal of making money.
Actually, I can. All it takes is a little usage of that rare commodity called common sense.
<SNIP>
Your solution wouldn't work at all. The only reason bots don't do all of Blacklake currently is that they don't have to. And I've noticed a sudden rise in the number of level 60 rogues with randomly generated account names running around Blacklake since that zen buying change last week so they already are setting up scripts to do it.
All your solution would do is limit legitimate players' options a tiny bit more, which is pretty much exactly what Cryptic has been doing.
The only real solution is to make content extremely difficult to bot, and preferably in a way that won't significantly affect regular players. Here's a couple sample ideas.
Random dialogue choice ordering generation combined with dialogue scripting to minimize botting. For example: A dialogue NPC has 4 choices from the base dialogue prompt, one moves the quest forward, two are recursive, and one exits the prompt without progressing the quest. The order of the choices is randomly generated each time the base prompt is reached.
Random interactive object placement within an area. All quest progression interactive objects (NPCs, chests, etc.) are randomly placed within a relatively small area (to limit graphic collision issues) near their previous static locations, when the instance is generated.
The above should be relatively simple to implement and would have zero impact on players running content for the first time, with only minimal impact on non-bots who repeat the content. While at the same time making script generation more difficult and significantly increase the resources required to run the scripts....and they could get rid of that ridiculous looking, and annoying, loot piñata effect which hardly has any impact on bots since so few quest progression items are dropped that way anyway.
This is the only statement I'm responding to, as the basis of your arguments is the bulk of AD is circulated through the AH and disbelieve that there are vast amounts of AD generated.
24k/char/day is not the limit on an account, the freedom to have as many characters generating 24k/char/day is the true limit or lack of. There's even a stickied guide on it.
I said 24k/char/day, not 24k/account/day, so I didn't make mistake.
And it was always like this, the limit of chars per account didn't change either, therefore the amount of AD generated in the system did not increase, what you were suggesting.
The unlimited AD production via armies of invokers/leadership mules is a myth btw, and if you don't belive me, try it yourself. How many characters can you "milk" daily, huh?
The current devaluation of AD is not a result of increasing AD production, but the increased Zen demand. Many stuff you could buy with Zen was introduced, but we didn't get any new AD stuff except for cockatrice event, which was just not enough, and only temporary, not to mention it targeted the most wealthy players (i.e. minority). I'm not counting marks from wondrous bazaar since they are overpriced. In fact, getting those from lockboxes is more cost-effective.
Making things BoP doesn't help either since a) you don't buy/sell it in AH, therefore no -10% AD, b) instead of using AH, you need to buy those things with Zen now > even higher Zen demand.
The current devaluation of AD is not a result of increasing AD production, but the increased Zen demand. Many stuff you could buy with Zen was introduced, but we didn't get any new AD stuff except for cockatrice event, which was just not enough, and only temporary, not to mention it targeted the most wealthy players (i.e. minority). I'm not counting marks from wondrous bazaar since they are overpriced. In fact, getting those from lockboxes is more cost-effective.
Making things BoP doesn't help either since a) you don't buy/sell it in AH, therefore no -10% AD, b) instead of using AH, you need to buy those things with Zen now > even higher Zen demand.
I more blame the whole section where they made Coal wards bound - before then everyone thought that $10 per coal was too expensive and the market was seling them at 200k which even with today's 500/zen limit about $4 - so it was more effective for cash players to translate their cash into AD via the zen exchange, and they did, which meant that the supply of zen coming in was a lot more than now. Once the binding happened then the supply of Coals from outside the cash shop dissipated so the price was locked in to be with the cash shop pricing again and there is no incentive to go beyond putting cash into the game and utilising the exchange to get AD. There is still a supply coming in from new players or new chars since people still want armors etc. but nowhere near as much. Mod 4 introduces a new class so we'll see a rise in new chars wanting gear so that will ease out the exchange a bit but only temporarily unless a significant persistent AD sink is created.
i remember when perfect enchants were only 8-9 mil now a perfect is 18-19mil know why because the only way to get coal wards is through the zen store. and if you say well the coffer good luck with that PWE was even going to remove that option till players figured it out in mod 3 and it would have truly become not a F2p game at all as it stands no one can reach 20mil AD and if you could why even bother with the zax in the first place
what happened was there are probably thousands of leftover accounts from caturday or "lucky" thursday who have well over the AD cap and these people control the market .
The unlimited AD production via armies of invokers/leadership mules is a myth btw, and if you don't belive me, try it yourself. How many characters can you "milk" daily, huh?
Defrag posted he can make 1.2-2mil AD a week. He is probably the 1% in that category. But he's also posted he has a family, job, and other responsibilities. And he's not a bot.
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
0
mircalla83Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 36
edited July 2014
AD Sinks are useless as long as they are 'Optional' and 'Cosmetic'. The 'Whales' are definately not going to touch their Billions.
A Companion/Mount Upgrade needs to be a quarter of what it it now.
Right now, upgrading 1 'Gold Purchased' Mount to 110% requires the equivalent of nearly 6k Zen.
Reducing it to 50% of the current value makes it still more desireable for a new Player to buy an Accountwide 110% Mount from the Zen Store, for only 500z more.
Mount Upgrades to maximum Speed MUST be cheap enough to get 2 Characters onto 110% Mounts, for the AD one would need to exchange to 3500 Zen.
Companions are more in Line, but the 'white' Companions, since the 'Active Bonus' Introduction, are, with maybe an exception for the Sellsword, not worth it to be upgraded. For the AD it costs to upgrade a 'White' Companion to purple, it is cheaper to buy a purple companion on the Z Store.
A couple weeks ago, one of the socalled 'Whales' suggested a 'I would totally pay AD for this' Sink: Rank 12 Enchants, only able to be aquired with AD.
Which would mean that HE puts his AD onto the ZAX, in the form of a 'Buy Zen' Order, as the PvPers and other selfdeclared 'Elite' Powergamers jump to each others' throat over the latest overpowered Gear that breaks the Game even more, and causes them to cry even more about messed up 'Balance'.
Then, he buys Keys, flips 1k Lockboxes, and, while giggling like a crazed Supervillain, lists his Stuff on the Auction House, pawning it off for enough AD to break even and THEN pull a Profit on top.
People need sinks. A lot of the zen store could become AD priced at a higher exchange value then the store. So basically on the zen exchange you get 500 ad to 1 zen, on the wondrous bazaar zen store items would be 600 ad to 1 zen. Therefore making things easier and more economical to buy off the zen store, but still allow it to be purchased outside the store. Basically anything that can be flipped outside the store in high demand. Coal wards for one.
That being said, the zax was pretty low after the keys. It "may" be shooting up because they're doing the same things with coal wards that they were doing with keys. OR it's going up because people know it's going to take a week or so to get their zen, and they want to be able to outfit their warlock right when it comes out.
what happened was there are probably thousands of leftover accounts from caturday or "lucky" thursday who have well over the AD cap and these people control the market .
Nah, they were there since caturday, and the zax went nuts only after mod 3. I still think their influence is overestimated.
Mod 4 introduces a new class so we'll see a rise in new chars wanting gear so that will ease out the exchange a bit but only temporarily unless a significant persistent AD sink is created.
If previous mods are any indication, it will not ease out, quite the opposite.
I said 24k/char/day, not 24k/account/day, so I didn't make mistake.
And it was always like this, the limit of chars per account didn't change either, therefore the amount of AD generated in the system did not increase, what you were suggesting.
The unlimited AD production via armies of invokers/leadership mules is a myth btw, and if you don't belive me, try it yourself. How many characters can you "milk" daily, huh?
I've played every class through the normal questline to level 60. When I went back to my main, I simply followed the AD creation guide and left my unplayed toons to generate AD.
I'm a casual player, I don't need BIS gear, so the bulk of my ADs went into raising various companions from Zen transfers and CTAs to epic quality on multiple characters. Effectively into AD sinks instead of the economy.
Just a few post above, we have more casual players lamenting the AD sink of companion upgrades are too high, while others can upgrade their companions overcoming this AD sink effortlessly with enough AD leftover to increase demand on the AH and raise prices.
I may not be doing it, but I can clearly see how a determined player/gold farmer can employ this towards economic success. This myth seems to be working fine for everyone else that bothered to look at the AD creation guide.
Comments
Ekhm... what you are suggesting is not a f2p anymore. Seriously, that you could play for free til 60 means nothing.
You have some good points, that leveling is too fast for instance, and that everything willl most likely be BoP in the near future, but overall - no and no.
AH is crucial in the f2p model and making everything BoP is not helping. Making AD easier to obtain would make prices higher.
Really, all we need are AD sinks (I am tired of repeating myself. This is so simple, why people can't understand it?) to make AD more desirable. Paying customers would also be more eager to charge zen and exchange it for AD if they had something to do with those AD.
Really? Because you just said that it was such a simple task that it would only take 10 minutes to do. Do you honestly think the botters will simply go. "Well guys, they out smarted us. We gota do blacklake now, and despite all this money we are making, its just to much trouble to do. So thats it, we have been beaten, lets pack up shop and go elsewhere."
You seriously think this is what will break them? that they wont simply just step over this new line and continue to do business? That they wont find a way to speed it up, automate it, or simply just get past it? They already have high level bots, for farming. They have these bots ALREADY, by the thousands. They have already more then likely crossed your magical threshold and would have nothing, at all, to fear by it.
Put simply, your wonderful idea is more then likely to catch some new player unaware of danger of skipping this one singular area. Then it would do anything to stop or slow the bots.
I'm pointing out it is possible to have an account with only lvl 4 characters (so they don't even know where Blacklake is), enchants at least lvl 3, and making AD, all legit and without paying real money. True it is hard to imagine why someone would play like that, but it is possible. Also how can you know bots can't beat Karzov?
And even if they really can't, a real human can do it for them (although it is more likely that bot's AI would be improved to beat him) and after that let them do their job.
And I still don't know how exactly are you going to tell the difference between a bot and a real player.
Auto-ban everyone who got killed by Karzov?
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
Is the backlog of AD-to-Zen a problem? Yes, but only if you are impatient. It is not really a problem. The problem is expecting instant gratification.
IF YOU'RE SMART: You'll proffer your AD for Zen exchange now not wait until you need it. If you're just looking to build-up your Zen *reserves* (as the smart people will do) then waiting one or two weeks for the Proffer to sell isn;t a big deal. Come on, people, you *know* there is new content coming, you *know* there will be sales for Zen market items and new items you will want - so why whine and cry about how long it takes to exchange AD for Zen? Instead of crying about it Proffer your AD now. So what if it take a week to go through, there's still two weeks before the new content is released.
Build up a Zen Reserve. The way the *Smart people do it.
Sheesh.
I'm not sure about that since you need lvl 10 to start any of those things, so you need to do Blacklake to get there... oh wait, we have foundry
I think the idea is that bots falter at a sequence like pressing F to unlock the door, doing the fight, obtaining the crown (open box, deal with the explosion, and then take the crown), taking the crown back to Knox and proceeding through the dialogue.
But if someone doesn't come up with an automated script to handle all that because it's now required of them, they can pay a pittance to some worker who now does that for a living instead of making crappy T-shirts. Then the account gets handed over to automation, and they start a new one.
Weird.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
Still, it is not nearly as hard/expensive to stop botting because of such a small obstacle.
Could you now answer my question? Look, I'm even quoting myself:
The rate at which players and gold sellers generate free AD is ever increasing, fast enough to overcome AD sinks introduce. So far the temporary measures by PWE have always resulted fall in prices for a few days, and prices continue rise beyond what it was before the event/sale happened. Permanent AD sinks will only have a longer duration effect before they too are overcome by the increasing rate of AD influx into the economy and its devaluation. AD cannot be more desirable when it's value is ever decreasing. People prefer to hold on to Zen and buy what they need from the Zen store instead of dealing with the increasingly high prices and lowering value of AD.
I think it is the contrary: In the past many things were cheap (like enchants) because of the bot farmers offering them in mass. The zen prices rised astronomically only after they made coalescent wards bind. But without the black market those prices would already be from the beginning very high. The black market of bot farmers and their customers balanced that out. Now PWE/Cryptic attempt to combat the black market with bound items, which leads to alot of free AD, because coalescent wards and keys will not be tradable anymore. This drives the prices I think.
- Dualspec
- Better rewarding foundry and foundry pvp maps
- Custom PvP leagues with leaderboards instead of the current 'matchmaking'.
- Armory
- make jumping cost stamina (to reduce hopping in pvp)
Nope. Maybe I would agree with you if the backlog stopped where it is, but it is constantly growing, and we still have long weeks til the mod4 launch.
When will you admit there is a problem, when you need to wait a month for your Zen? 2 months? A year?
Because this.
The timeframe in which it would occur was accelerated by a multitude of reasons, bots being one, but probably not even the main cause. PWE/Cryptic is using it as red herring to implement a bunch of changes, that will help the economy. (those changes would be some of the main issues, but they will up play the bot issue to distract you from the changes/issues)
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
Green are my comments.
24k/char/day is not the limit on an account, the freedom to have as many characters generating 24k/char/day is the true limit or lack of. There's even a forum guide on it.
It's been a while since I did blacklake but what makes it impossible for the botters just add code to complete the quest line?
I firmly believe people just need more things they can spend AD on. As it stands, the main use of AD is to buy things on the auction house, so of course as time passes the prices are increasingly pushed ridiculously high. (As an example) if Cryptic frequently introduced cosmetics that could be purchased with AD, I think we would see the amount of AD in circulation go down.
Your solution wouldn't work at all. The only reason bots don't do all of Blacklake currently is that they don't have to. And I've noticed a sudden rise in the number of level 60 rogues with randomly generated account names running around Blacklake since that zen buying change last week so they already are setting up scripts to do it.
All your solution would do is limit legitimate players' options a tiny bit more, which is pretty much exactly what Cryptic has been doing.
The only real solution is to make content extremely difficult to bot, and preferably in a way that won't significantly affect regular players. Here's a couple sample ideas.
Random dialogue choice ordering generation combined with dialogue scripting to minimize botting. For example: A dialogue NPC has 4 choices from the base dialogue prompt, one moves the quest forward, two are recursive, and one exits the prompt without progressing the quest. The order of the choices is randomly generated each time the base prompt is reached.
Random interactive object placement within an area. All quest progression interactive objects (NPCs, chests, etc.) are randomly placed within a relatively small area (to limit graphic collision issues) near their previous static locations, when the instance is generated.
The above should be relatively simple to implement and would have zero impact on players running content for the first time, with only minimal impact on non-bots who repeat the content. While at the same time making script generation more difficult and significantly increase the resources required to run the scripts....and they could get rid of that ridiculous looking, and annoying, loot piñata effect which hardly has any impact on bots since so few quest progression items are dropped that way anyway.
Okay, Panic.
I said 24k/char/day, not 24k/account/day, so I didn't make mistake.
And it was always like this, the limit of chars per account didn't change either, therefore the amount of AD generated in the system did not increase, what you were suggesting.
The unlimited AD production via armies of invokers/leadership mules is a myth btw, and if you don't belive me, try it yourself. How many characters can you "milk" daily, huh?
The current devaluation of AD is not a result of increasing AD production, but the increased Zen demand. Many stuff you could buy with Zen was introduced, but we didn't get any new AD stuff except for cockatrice event, which was just not enough, and only temporary, not to mention it targeted the most wealthy players (i.e. minority). I'm not counting marks from wondrous bazaar since they are overpriced. In fact, getting those from lockboxes is more cost-effective.
Making things BoP doesn't help either since a) you don't buy/sell it in AH, therefore no -10% AD, b) instead of using AH, you need to buy those things with Zen now > even higher Zen demand.
I more blame the whole section where they made Coal wards bound - before then everyone thought that $10 per coal was too expensive and the market was seling them at 200k which even with today's 500/zen limit about $4 - so it was more effective for cash players to translate their cash into AD via the zen exchange, and they did, which meant that the supply of zen coming in was a lot more than now. Once the binding happened then the supply of Coals from outside the cash shop dissipated so the price was locked in to be with the cash shop pricing again and there is no incentive to go beyond putting cash into the game and utilising the exchange to get AD. There is still a supply coming in from new players or new chars since people still want armors etc. but nowhere near as much. Mod 4 introduces a new class so we'll see a rise in new chars wanting gear so that will ease out the exchange a bit but only temporarily unless a significant persistent AD sink is created.
what happened was there are probably thousands of leftover accounts from caturday or "lucky" thursday who have well over the AD cap and these people control the market .
Defrag posted he can make 1.2-2mil AD a week. He is probably the 1% in that category. But he's also posted he has a family, job, and other responsibilities. And he's not a bot.
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
A Companion/Mount Upgrade needs to be a quarter of what it it now.
Right now, upgrading 1 'Gold Purchased' Mount to 110% requires the equivalent of nearly 6k Zen.
Reducing it to 50% of the current value makes it still more desireable for a new Player to buy an Accountwide 110% Mount from the Zen Store, for only 500z more.
Mount Upgrades to maximum Speed MUST be cheap enough to get 2 Characters onto 110% Mounts, for the AD one would need to exchange to 3500 Zen.
Companions are more in Line, but the 'white' Companions, since the 'Active Bonus' Introduction, are, with maybe an exception for the Sellsword, not worth it to be upgraded. For the AD it costs to upgrade a 'White' Companion to purple, it is cheaper to buy a purple companion on the Z Store.
A couple weeks ago, one of the socalled 'Whales' suggested a 'I would totally pay AD for this' Sink: Rank 12 Enchants, only able to be aquired with AD.
Which would mean that HE puts his AD onto the ZAX, in the form of a 'Buy Zen' Order, as the PvPers and other selfdeclared 'Elite' Powergamers jump to each others' throat over the latest overpowered Gear that breaks the Game even more, and causes them to cry even more about messed up 'Balance'.
Then, he buys Keys, flips 1k Lockboxes, and, while giggling like a crazed Supervillain, lists his Stuff on the Auction House, pawning it off for enough AD to break even and THEN pull a Profit on top.
That being said, the zax was pretty low after the keys. It "may" be shooting up because they're doing the same things with coal wards that they were doing with keys. OR it's going up because people know it's going to take a week or so to get their zen, and they want to be able to outfit their warlock right when it comes out.
Nah, they were there since caturday, and the zax went nuts only after mod 3. I still think their influence is overestimated.
If previous mods are any indication, it will not ease out, quite the opposite.
I'm a casual player, I don't need BIS gear, so the bulk of my ADs went into raising various companions from Zen transfers and CTAs to epic quality on multiple characters. Effectively into AD sinks instead of the economy.
Just a few post above, we have more casual players lamenting the AD sink of companion upgrades are too high, while others can upgrade their companions overcoming this AD sink effortlessly with enough AD leftover to increase demand on the AH and raise prices.
I may not be doing it, but I can clearly see how a determined player/gold farmer can employ this towards economic success. This myth seems to be working fine for everyone else that bothered to look at the AD creation guide.