Okay I just found out that Terry Farrell throws a lot of shade at Rick Berman in the DS9 documentary, but at no time is Rick Berman allowed to defend himself or speak at all in the documentary.
So I canceled my order because its not to slander someone and not allow them to defend themselves.
Rick Berman is more responsible in some ways for Star Trek's success then Gene Roddenberry, because he saved TNG, he co created DS9, Voyager, Enterprise, the Golden Era of Star Trek, so to stab him in the back like this is wrong. Actually it'd be wrong to do this to anybody.
But its how things are done in Hollywood now.
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My character Tsin'xing
> Unless some Star Trek fans live in a cave, most are bound to know that there are levels of enmity between some of the various franchise stars and their peers (whether in front of the camera or behind it). For me I never liked how Gene Roddenberry absolutely and completely screwed Alexander Courage by writing lyrics to his iconic main series theme that were never meant to be heard or sung. It was just Gene's way to squeeze more money for himself at the expense of someone else. Gene did that for no other reason. That is just one example, and there are plenty of others. Farrell admits that she was at fault for not couch phrasing her at that time request for a lesser work load on DS9, but that does not mean how and why her character was written out was not retaliatory.
Could Rick have handle it better, yes. Still I'm hearing some people accusing Rick Berman of sexual harrassment so I'm wondering if he was accused of that in the documentary? I haven't seen it yet as Amazon messed up my order.
I've not heard that at all either? I think that the whole Berman/Farrell thing was just the two of them being of entirely different mindsets over the one thing.
> lordgyor wrote: »
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> > @captainwells said:
> > Unless some Star Trek fans live in a cave, most are bound to know that there are levels of enmity between some of the various franchise stars and their peers (whether in front of the camera or behind it). For me I never liked how Gene Roddenberry absolutely and completely screwed Alexander Courage by writing lyrics to his iconic main series theme that were never meant to be heard or sung. It was just Gene's way to squeeze more money for himself at the expense of someone else. Gene did that for no other reason. That is just one example, and there are plenty of others. Farrell admits that she was at fault for not couch phrasing her at that time request for a lesser work load on DS9, but that does not mean how and why her character was written out was not retaliatory.
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> Could Rick have handle it better, yes. Still I'm hearing some people accusing Rick Berman of sexual harrassment so I'm wondering if he was accused of that in the documentary? I haven't seen it yet as Amazon messed up my order.
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> I've not heard that at all either? I think that the whole Berman/Farrell thing was just the two of them being of entirely different mindsets over the one thing.
Some fans are accusing him of sexual harrassment because he had Terry where a bra that made her TRIBBLE look larger when playing Dax, but that was a professional aestetic choice he had every right to make and its no worse then Blacksails or Game of Thrones or Altered Carbon asking for nude scenes for actors and actresses. Honestly this is why Sexual Harrassment laws should be replaced by sexual extortion laws, SH is too vague too easy to misrepresent and manipulate to whatever a person feels like.
I have no idea what "shade" is thrown at Berman in interviews with Ryan, because frankly I don't really care about interpersonal gossip. But I certainly wouldn't credit Berman with "saving" Star Trek. Nearly destroying it, perhaps...
EDIT: Are all words for mammary glands filtered?
My character Tsin'xing
I'll do an experiment: TRIBBLE boob TRIBBLE breast TRIBBLE
Edit: boob and breast both seem to be acceptable, but their plurals are not it seems
Pretty much the same thing was the rule in TOS since it was subjected to ridiculous censorship due to the Hollywood practice of pigeonholing science fiction as either horror or kids-stuff, and Trek was not presented as horror. Unfortunately, when TNG came about it did so just when the "uptight '80s" was nearing full swing at the start of the decade so the practice became locked in to all Trek as a standard and not just an overcensorship issue.
I can even understand why the singular for certain slang terms is okay, but the plural gets hit (one can discuss a chicken-breast sandwich, for instance, and a silly and uncouth person could be called a "boob" - which makes me wonder whether it's okay to discuss the blue-footed booby, or if bird-watchers are left out too?).
Jon's Post, supplemental: Okay, you can discuss a booby, or even a flock of boobies. Good to know.
'When expecting booby traps...always send a boob in first'
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
I am not "whitewashing" it, Ryan herself said as much in an interview, similar to the interview that Sirtis gave where she talked about how the intelligence of Troi was apparently directly inverse to the amount of cleavage showing in the costumes she wore.
Roddenberry talked about pretty much the same thing in a very funny recorded interview (I used to have the record but it went even before the last record player I had broke down), all the ridiculous restrictions that they had to work under to satisfy the censors. In fact, he later remarked that he gave the Tyranians in Genesis II two navels because of the arguments he had with the overzealous censors in TOS that nixed any costume that showed a navel.
> lordgyor wrote: »
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> I do know that in the past she has said she had to stuff her bra on Berman's orders, but that was a professional decision he had every right to make as it about the appearance of the character, and is no wear near as bad as having to wear TRIBBLE ears like the Ferengi had too, so get over it.
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> Yeah, the padded bra thing is just costuming. the character has bigger TRIBBLE than you do. It's like with the spots...
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> EDIT: Are all words for mammary glands filtered?
Exactly! Jeri Ryan andand Sherman had to do it at times and complained less, but I expect we would be hearing abour this if she hadn't gotten herself fired by Berman. Its revenge. Much of the cast had to deal with worse.
> The bra padding was actually to prevent any details or motion from showing through the costumes (Jeri Ryan had an even worse time of it, her catsuit had a very tight and stiff underlayer to keep any motion from being visible anywhere).
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> Pretty much the same thing was the rule in TOS since it was subjected to ridiculous censorship due to the Hollywood practice of pigeonholing science fiction as either horror or kids-stuff, and Trek was not presented as horror. Unfortunately, when TNG came about it did so just when the "uptight '80s" was nearing full swing at the start of the decade so the practice became locked in to all Trek as a standard and not just an overcensorship issue.
Now I picturing Seven's custome, but with jiggling. Wow.
Joe Rogan and Bill Burr talking about beauty standards.
Listen to the video and you hear a different story.
You hate Star Trek that badly? I mean, he did the franchise enough damage with VOY and ENT, I think.
Same with Roddenberry, Braga, and possibly Abrams. If it wasn't for the small army of actually talented people like Moore, Begr, Coon, and Piller, or even Taylor and Kurtzman, then the franchise would be in very poor shape.
Thank the gods he doesn't have anything to do with DSC, PIC or any future projects.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
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When paired with someone who could counter act those weaknesses Berman could do great stuff, however if paired with someone who couldn't well the results weren't generally very pretty.
> From what I've gathered is that Berman wasn't so much a hack as he was overly conservative with Star Trek (as in wanting conserve and retain certain aspects Star Trek, not in his political leaning which I know nothing about) while being out of touch with what audiences actually wanted.
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> When paired with someone who could counter act those weaknesses Berman could do great stuff, however if paired with someone who couldn't well the results weren't generally very pretty.
I think the flip side of that is true too, problems arise when Berman isn't there counter act his opposite sorts excesses.
> lordgyor wrote: »
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> I wish Rick Berman, aka the Russ Meyers of Star Trek was working on Star Trek: Discovery and Star Trek: Picard and most of all Star Trek: Section 31.
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> You hate Star Trek that badly? I mean, he did the franchise enough damage with VOY and ENT, I think.
Berman has had the last laugh, look at the viewership of Voyager and Enterpise on netflix, Voyager does better then DS9 (and I say that as a Niner) and Enterprise does roughly as well as DS9. Berman for the win.
It could be any number of factors which has nothing to do with the showrunner.
Obviously making TV-series is a team effort after all, though due to his position there was rarely a situation where Berman couldn't have countered something if he felt passionate enough about it.
And obviously Berman's not unique in this either Roddenberry had the exact same issue and it nearly killed TNG (as in TNG didn't really get popular until Roddenberry was "kicked upstairs" for season 3 and TNG couldn't have really sustained a third lackluster season).