Anyway, to landing page suggestions: we've gone over the major points of how to make the landing page better. To remind folks, here's a copy of Strathkin's aggregate list from a few pages back:
Our new Landing Page only has:
▪ Featured Episode
▪ Infinity Lockbox Returns & Link to Buy Keys
▪ Spotlight - Romulan Imperial Mindfield
▪ What's new in STO 14.5 & Link to What's New.
▪ Later Landing Page is bound to Main Menu and shouldn't be (Neverwinter's is not):
╘ Rearrange Hud, Options, Chat Settings, Change Character, Logout & Exit.
Revisit Landing Page to Integrate HAIL Button on Minimap (Better Landing Page):
▪ Calendar (More Prominent Color to stand out) the Neverwinter Landing Page also as Calendar similar to our Hail.
▪ Featured Series / Events -- with left / right scroll of 3 options.
╘ Features Series (aka Renegades Regret) Play Now
╘ Also shows Delta Recruit as Ongoing Long Term as 2 month ongoing events in middle.
╘ Also shows Mirror Invasion as 2 week ongoing event on right.
▪ Overview shows: Current Primary Mission in Journal, Episode Highlights, Foundry Highlights, Select PvE / PvP Queues.
▪ Episodes shows: Featured Episode, Faction specific Quests, Then Allied Specific Quests, Temporal Alliance Quests,...
▪ Available: All Daily Repeatable Quests.
▪ Foundry: (All Player Published Quests) with Spotlights, Browse All, etc..
Only change needed - aside from open on first login / login.
▪ UPCOMING WEEKEND: Could be expand & renamed SENIOR OFFICER REPORTS : with left/right scroll options.
╘ 'Flash Sales' posted the day they start &/or end - for things like Services, Items, or others...
╘ Infinity Lockbox Returns, along with Reward Highlights, with similar CSTORE Link.
╘═ Perhaps option to claim 40% off single KEY purchase (once per account) - during each lockbox change.
╘ 'Upcoming Weekend' for Bonus Marks, or whatever...
╘ Or story's related to advancing or upcoming content like: https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/10896394
▪ Unbind it from MAIN MENU - as it would be available from HAIL button afterward.
One thing I don't think we've covered in much detail is brand new features. Ex. new tabs for (for instance) lifetime stat tracking that might be worth considering once STO has a centralized and specifically designated "main page." Make it better has been a fairly well litigated next step, so what then after that.
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
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I am more than slightly skeptical on claims that the lander isn't supposed to be seen on logging a character out since the esc menu has been integrated into it.
I am more than slightly skeptical on claims that the lander isn't supposed to be seen on logging a character out since the esc menu has been integrated into it.
Okay, double negative here. Clarification: because the landing page is always displayed right now on logging out, displayed with each characters log in is (by basic reason, never mind anything else said here) a bug. There's no reason to display it by design twice with every log in/out (because that's obviously annoying and no amount of uptick from key sales for the infinity box would offset the impact to player satisfaction.)
Not by design, will fix (to quote Kael again: in an upcoming update.)
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
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I want to get away from the retention issue that is off topic for this thread and get the thread focused back on feedback for the Landing Page.
@patrickngo I hope that you're putting your thoughts in the actual retention thread.
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Views and Opinions May Not Reflect the Views and Opinions of Gearbox/Cryptic
I grant you that having the Landing Page pop up every time you login to or logout of a character is a bit much. But if anyone is letting that (little, my opinion) annoyance dissuade them from playing... I don't know what to say to that.
All I can say is that it's not some big conspiracy to drive key sales. If the claims here are true, and so many people are actually quitting over it, then it's actually having the opposite effect in getting keys sales. So, the accusations make no sense.
The constant pop ups are a bug. It's a bug that has been acknowledged and will be addressed. When? I cannot say, but I would think that players would understand that the devs are hard at work on an expansion right now, and this particular issue will get addressed in good time.
I'm just asking people to calm down with the rhetoric. Focus here on giving feedback on the Landing Page and leave the rest alone.
What we was trying to get across is combined with the other recent annoyance’s its pushing players over the edge. This splash screen problem is not an isolated incident which is why the player reaction has been so strong. Plus those players leaving due to things like this splash screen has now hit the point where it’s starting to impact the players who are still trying to play.
The constant pop up is not just a bug its designed in a way that even after the fix its going to pop up far more often than it should. I only play 1 toon actively and see the splash screen dozens of times a day and it’s frustrating every time. The bug/fix as described is not expected to have any impact on that so it’s not an annoyance I see once a day but an annoyance that I see far too often.
In fact for me it’s more than an annoyance due to the poor design it physically causes me extra pain and discomfort multiple times a day. Granted that doesn’t apply to most players but it’s part of the reason I am so strongly against it. It serves zero useful purpose, provides zero useful information and causes me extra physical discomfort for no good reason.
To me it does look like a badly thought out feature that is only implanted to drive key sales. After all we already have the 1st splash screen giving us all the useful information on log in. EDIT: and another splash screen area that links to new feature mission. The only logical reason I can see to add this new splash screen it to try and push more sales. What other purpose can it server other than to duplicate information from the 1st splash screen? Why do we need 2 splash screens? or 3 if you count the new feature mission splash area. What was wrong with the original first splash screens?
Just because it back fired and caused people to quit it doesn’t mean the original plan wasn’t for it to increase sales.
The constant pop up is not just a bug its designed in a way that even after the fix its going to pop up far more often than it should. I only play 1 toon actively and see the splash screen dozens of times a day and it’s frustrating every time. The bug/fix as described is not expected to have any impact on that so it’s not an annoyance I see once a day but an annoyance that I see far too often.
Assuming of course that no other changes are made and the entire section of this thread, delivering constructive feedback, has said nothing Cryptic could consider.
That's not exactly furthering the cause of productive discussion (more: never mind you guys, it's DOOOOOOOOOM!) Just about every system Cryptic's implemented has received iterative improvements in response to community feedback (Ex. auto-equip gear on readying a ship and the queue system). And it was rare that Cryptic would ever confirm specific changes prior to their deployment or close to it. That's because video game development is an uncertain and fluid process and devs across the industry don't like confirming things that they're not totally certain of as that's likely to cause issues if things change. See. why they don't talk about upcoming content on Ten Forward Weekly.
So, any expectation that we should already know in full what the landing page will ultimately be (such that you could take the uncertainty as a novel discussion point) is faulty. So, ease up. Things will change and we can take that as evolving topic to address in future as need be. This isn't a matter of hope, that is the most reasonable assessment of our situation from long established precedent and the specific circumstances of our current situation.
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
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I am more than slightly skeptical on claims that the lander isn't supposed to be seen on logging a character out since the esc menu has been integrated into it.
Okay, double negative here. Clarification: because the landing page is always displayed right now on logging out, displayed with each characters log in is (by basic reason, never mind anything else said here) a bug. There's no reason to display it by design twice with every log in/out (because that's obviously annoying and no amount of uptick from key sales for the infinity box would offset the impact to player satisfaction.)
Not by design, will fix (to quote Kael again: in an upcoming update.)
It sounds like you might have misunderstood. It is by design that every time we press the escape key the splash screen pops up and the current known bug/fix being worked on is unrelated to that problem. As I understand it even after the bug is fixed we will still get the splash screen every time we go into options. The quote from Kael is just about the multiple toon problem which is not what postagepaid and myself are talking about.
. As I understand it even after the bug is fixed we will still get the splash screen every time we go into options. The quote from Kael is just about the multiple toon problem which is not what postagepaid and myself are talking about.
Yup, that's not really in question. I was just clarifying that the double negative (I'm skeptical -> isn't) was by intent and we weren't going to start questioning "is this once-per-character thing a bug?" again.
Much feedback (by myself and others) has been given about alternatives to the ESC menu as a home for the landing page (ie. combining the landing page and the front page of the journal menu, accessible from the "hail" button or J key.) We've also seen some suggestions to simply make the esc menu landing page less obstructive (ie. set the menu buttons to center again and attach the landing page elements to either side, though IMO this is still a bit awkward considering that this outro menu isn't where a player naturally goes when they're trying to find content to play.)
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
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First of all, the flash sale advertisement thing was a suggestion made by me for improving the Landing Page, and a possible answer to the cries for an in game advertisement for such things (yes, those cries exist). It wasn't meant to suggest any intent on Cryptic's part, though.
Secondly, a more obvious answer (than it is WAI, but they're doing damage control and claiming it's a bug) to why the acknowledged bug hasn't been addressed as yet, is because they are busy with finishing up VIL, which we are weeks away from launch now. It would seem apparent that time for the Landing Page was factored into the development schedule at that time. Time to fix it will be scheduled at some future point, but it's not in the cards right now, because all hands are on deck for an expansion that's about to launch.
As for the question of retention, that's jumping to conclusions that they are having a problem. The question wasn't what can they do to keep you, it was what are they already doing that keeps you coming back. It's simply a question of them wanting to know what we think they are doing right that they can do more of, or what we are doing that they can better support or further develop.
Not everything is doom and gloom. Seeing shadows where there are none is just more conspiracy talk.
Thank you! I really appreciate you taking the time to provide a more in-depth answer and update to the situation. Clear answers really go a long a way in helping curb any conspiracy theories. Personally, I don't know how busy or not busy the team is, how big or small the team is, what projects they have, and what their priorities are on any given day. That is why I really appreciate the insight and answer because it goes a long way in helping me understand why it hasn't been addressed yet.
I grant you that having the Landing Page pop up every time you login to or logout of a character is a bit much. But if anyone is letting that (little, my opinion) annoyance dissuade them from playing... I don't know what to say to that.
All I can say is that it's not some big conspiracy to drive key sales. If the claims here are true, and so many people are actually quitting over it, then it's actually having the opposite effect in getting keys sales. So, the accusations make no sense.
The constant pop ups are a bug. It's a bug that has been acknowledged and will be addressed. When? I cannot say, but I would think that players would understand that the devs are hard at work on an expansion right now, and this particular issue will get addressed in good time.
I'm just asking people to calm down with the rhetoric. Focus here on giving feedback on the Landing Page and leave the rest alone.
The annoyance isn't so much when you only play one character. It gets very annoying when players have multiple characters they play daily and are trying to make the best of the daily grind with them. This is why I feel that because the feature is broken and they can't spare the time to fix it, that the feature should be removed until it can be fixed. Sometimes it is the little things that can make or break a situation.
The annoyance isn't so much when you only play one character. It gets very annoying when players have multiple characters they play daily and are trying to make the best of the daily grind with them. This is why I feel that because the feature is broken and they can't spare the time to fix it, that the feature should be removed until it can be fixed. Sometimes it is the little things that can make or break a situation.
It may not be a simple undertaking. For a point of comparison: during the last Ten Forward Weekly it was commented on that the gender buttons in Jem'Hadar's initial tailor weren't strictly necessary (considering that they have no gender options.) So the question came up: can we remove it? Answer: not without breaking other parts of the UI.
Consider that's a single button with static art. The slash page is more elaborate. "Just remove it" may have been considered but for technical reasons not attempted with the live game (who knows what they may have explored internally as a hot-fix.)
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
I am more than slightly skeptical on claims that the lander isn't supposed to be seen on logging a character out since the esc menu has been integrated into it.
Okay, double negative here. Clarification: because the landing page is always displayed right now on logging out, displayed with each characters log in is (by basic reason, never mind anything else said here) a bug. There's no reason to display it by design twice with every log in/out (because that's obviously annoying and no amount of uptick from key sales for the infinity box would offset the impact to player satisfaction.)
Not by design, will fix (to quote Kael again: in an upcoming update.)
It being displayed when you log a character off IS by design since to log out you have to hit esc and get the lander splattered across the screen because the esc menu has been altered to include it.
Its a more in your face variation of the ferengi that welcomes you to drozana every time you leave the place.
It being displayed when you log a character off IS by design since to log out you have to hit esc and get the lander splattered across the screen because the esc menu has been altered to include it.
Log out : By design
Log in: Bug
That was the explicit clarification I posted to be sure we were all on the same page.
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Thank you! I really appreciate you taking the time to provide a more in-depth answer and update to the situation. Clear answers really go a long a way in helping curb any conspiracy theories. Personally, I don't know how busy or not busy the team is, how big or small the team is, what projects they have, and what their priorities are on any given day. That is why I really appreciate the insight and answer because it goes a long way in helping me understand why it hasn't been addressed yet.
Please bear in mind that the person you are thanking for giving you "insight" has absolutely no inside knowledge of this situation. BMR isn't a dev or community representative, just a volunteer mod. He has no information that isn't available to anyone else, so any explanation he gives is just his own personal opinion or speculation.
Makes no sense to me to see it on logging out, especially if one purpose is to promote the store in some way. Perhaps if they had a LOTRO style store that had account level purchases available at the character select screen but as it stands NOPE bad design.
It's like those really bored greeters some shops insist on having who can't tell that the person carrying a bag out the door is actually done shopping and are leaving.
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Community Moderators are Unpaid Volunteers and NOT Employees of Gearbox/Cryptic
Views and Opinions May Not Reflect the Views and Opinions of Gearbox/Cryptic
I want to get away from the retention issue that is off topic for this thread and get the thread focused back on feedback for the Landing Page.
@patrickngo I hope that you're putting your thoughts in the actual retention thread.
Honestly, I shouldn't have brought it up here, much less in the 'Retention' thread, since there's a risk that the rest of the feedback will be ignored as a result of my comments here.
but I do see a connection in the two subjects, particularly in how the landing page was formatted. in its current form, it's formatted like a pop-up ad, and that's not a good thing, but it may be an indicator of a seemingly unrelated problem within the metrics that's driving the decision to install it.
and that may, in turn, be tied to an emergent problem with retention, and that, in turn, an emergent problem in spending/income. why? because it doesn't fill any useful role as it's currently arranged or formatted, and it was added without preamble or pre-testing (Hence the immediate presence of a serious bug or defect).
the lack of pre-testing (it wasn't even on Tribble or Redshirt) suggests the motivation wasn't internal to the development team, either. this is something that obviously employed developer resources to make, but has no visible benefit to players. Kind of a 'tacked on' sensation, if you will, and obviously without much careful thought as to what it could be that would be seen as beneficial by the players.
but, it's exactly the kind of thing that a corporation entity with a guaranteed customer base and no great regard for 'game elements' would tack on to a product like STO, or some media outfits tack on to their 'free' websites to try and pump interest in the paid content.
which makes me think, again, of pop-up and pop-under advertising on web pages, and as you can see, the reaction's not a whole lot different to what got released, than it would be to a pop-up selling Cialis or Viagra.
so tinfoil-hat time, I suspect (and can not prove) that it's not driven from inside the team, but from outside and above them in the corporate hierarchy-someone at Perfect World wanted a testbed advertisement and forced the issue, thus forcing it to be implemented without final testing or pre-testing to see if it even works as intended (Mechanically), much less whether it works as intended financially.
The whole "Surprise!!! we've added a pop up ad to your login!!!" doesn't fit the personalities we've seen on the dev staff, whom are highly protective of their artistic vision, but does fit the kind of thing a stuffed suit would force the issue on because of a bad quarterly report.
i'm forced to agree with you on that point…. it's odd for the devs to do this without hint/tell us.. or even test it, i agree that don't have to much time to fix this thing right now, and the format is like a pop up add, wich is also odd, the use of something like this is to promote the patch notes, and some new stuff, but asi it stands now, it looks like "buy one, get two" type of add
i'm forced to agree with you on that point…. it's odd for the devs to do this without hint/tell us.. or even test it, i agree that don't have to much time to fix this thing right now, and the format is like a pop up add, wich is also odd, the use of something like this is to promote the patch notes, and some new stuff, but asi it stands now, it looks like "buy one, get two" type of add
when y ou go back to the (non scientific) stats compiled a couple pages back on this thread, I think that feeling of it being that kind of advertisement is probably the real 'root' of most of the criticism and hostility. People game to get away from real life, including popup advertisements, and having one shoehorned in like this? it's going to generate a visceral reaction, esp. in an on-line savvy audience like STO (or any MMO that's got a steady following).
Yeah, the similarity to a pop-up ad is something I noticed, too.
IMHO I think a lot of the objections to it could be resolved easily enough by adding a "don't show this again" button to the dialog (with an option to re-enable it in the game options if you change your mind later). To handle flash sales, I would have maybe added a HUD pop-up on, say, the lower left side of the screen below the minimap that appears when one starts or when you log in during (that would be active only when the player is on a social map or in sector space and can be quickly closed).
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
It being displayed when you log a character off IS by design since to log out you have to hit esc and get the lander splattered across the screen because the esc menu has been altered to include it.
Log out : By design
Log in: Bug
That was the explicit clarification I posted to be sure we were all on the same page.
You need to take your own advice and ease up. It’s not your job to clarify everyone’s posts for them especially when you are clarifying things that do not need clarifying. You seem so worried about other people bringing up “start questioning "is this once-per-character thing a bug?" again.” That you have brought it up multiple times when it’s not needed. Which as you keep saying is not part of productive discussion. Speaking of which.
““That's not exactly furthering the cause of productive discussion (more: never mind you guys, it's DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM! [quite literally stated]) Just about every system Cryptic's implemented has received iterative improvements in response to community feedback (Ex. auto-equip gear on readying a ship, the queue system). And it was rare that Cryptic would ever confirm specific changes prior to their deployment, or close to it (because video game development is an uncertain and fluid process and devs across the industry don't like confirming things they're not totally certain of because of the issues that may cause if things change. See. why they don't talk about upcoming content on Ten Forward Weekly.)”
I very clearly did further the cause of product discussion by adding new and valid criticism of the landing page. Yet instead of responding to that new valid criticism you ignore it and falsely say “not exactly furthering the cause of productive discussion” from my point of view it’s you who is not helping this thread or being productive. As for “DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM“ I distinctly said the opposite and that I don’t see the game as doomed.
Nobody has any expectation that we should already know in full what the landing page will be. But we do expect the devs to handle this better than they have.
As for the queue system yes it received some small iterative improvements then it got abandoned and left in a worse state with a worse UI then the old queue system. A lot of player are worried and rightly so that the same thing is going to happen to this splash screen.
It being displayed when you log a character off IS by design since to log out you have to hit esc and get the lander splattered across the screen because the esc menu has been altered to include it.
Log out : By design
Log in: Bug
That was the explicit clarification I posted to be sure we were all on the same page.
And that illustrates the flaw in it by design, at least in my opinion. The pop up when logging in to my account is when I want to see it! Show me what is now, what sales are on, etc., when I am just getting ready to play. That way, I can consider buying something or playing specific featured or promoted content. When I am switching characters or logging off, I couldn't care less what the screen pops up because I want to switch characters to do something or log off because I am done for that particular time. If PWE thinks I am going to take the time to look at their advertising when I am logging off, then they are greatly mistaken.
Thank you! I really appreciate you taking the time to provide a more in-depth answer and update to the situation. Clear answers really go a long a way in helping curb any conspiracy theories. Personally, I don't know how busy or not busy the team is, how big or small the team is, what projects they have, and what their priorities are on any given day. That is why I really appreciate the insight and answer because it goes a long way in helping me understand why it hasn't been addressed yet.
Please bear in mind that the person you are thanking for giving you "insight" has absolutely no inside knowledge of this situation. BMR isn't a dev or community representative, just a volunteer mod. He has no information that isn't available to anyone else, so any explanation he gives is just his own personal opinion or speculation.
Hmmm. Good point. Not all mods, at least at one point, were volunteers though. Is there a way to differentiate between which mods are PWE employees and which are volunteers?
All members of the moderation team are volunteers. The Community Manager is a Cryptic employee.
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Community Moderators are Unpaid Volunteers and NOT Employees of Gearbox/Cryptic
Views and Opinions May Not Reflect the Views and Opinions of Gearbox/Cryptic
I can count on one hand the number of online games I know that didn't have some kind of announcement page/pop-up on login. Many have multiple pop-ups in a row. News feed, login bonus or three, events starting, new premium items for sale, etc.
Never seen them get this kind of comment, ever. Rarely seen them get any comment at all, actually. It is, after all, about as trivial an issue as one can get.
I suppose it's because here it's new. People tend to resist change, just because it's different. Nobody would care to complain the exit menu buttons are 3 inches off-center if they'd been that way before. And if someone threatened to quit over an announcement window that had always been there, the only reaction they'd get is "can i haz ur stuff."
All members of the moderation team are volunteers. The Community Manager is a Cryptic employee.
It really disturbs me how UNclear this situation is on the forums. Many people see a mod chime in on a thread and think their statements have more weight than the "regular" posters, but with the SOLE exception of forum rules, that is false.
Like someone said earlier, the mods don't work for Cryptic or PWE. They don't have any inside information. Their comments aren't informed by any inside knowledge.
The sad part is, it seems like some mods make their comments in a declarative way which creates the false impression described above. They need to be more clear that they are only stating their personal opinion and may very well be wrong.
I very clearly did further the cause of product discussion by adding new and valid criticism of the landing page. Yet instead of responding to that new valid criticism you ignore it and falsely say “not exactly furthering the cause of productive discussion” from my point of view it’s you who is not helping this thread or being productive.
New? Players were commenting about pop-up on log-out being a problem on page one. Hence: not furthering the cause of productive discussion. You're circling around old points with greater and greater degrees of distress (see. your comment about physical pain) apparently to try to affect a greater imperative for dev action. Unfortunately, how upset any given individual is at the landing page is not going to have an effect on the speed of a fix and other iterative changes. It'll take as long as it's going to take and you're not going to force action sooner by hyperventilating. Hence: ease up and try engaging in constructive problem solving (ie. concrete suggestions, bearing in mind where discussion is now and what's been said already).
That will at least set you on a different course from reflexively arguing with someone who is explicitly suggesting changes that not only validate but also will satisfy your complaint (ie. move the landing page out of the ESC menu, I've been agreeing with this for several pages now.) If you're not in a good place for that though, take a break and I say that 1. expecting a certain retort and 2. as a fellow community member.
which means, if you're going to add an at-login 'screen' or popup, it should probably be something that doesn't feel like an advertisement, and it should offer some utility to a player's experience beyond "Buy keys! Play a feature that isn't featured anymore! Look, the same ad that's on the launcher!"
because that doesn't offer something useful or valuable to the user end.
Mmm, it's not just an ad though, the landing page directly links to the latest queue and episode. Click and you're there. If you close it out, then there's nothing offered (just the visual for the infinity box), but there's utility built into the basic design that could be better expanded upon (ie. add more shortcuts across more content.)
The sad part is, it seems like some mods make their comments in a declarative way which creates the false impression described above. They need to be more clear that they are only stating their personal opinion and may very well be wrong.
They are labeled as community moderators...what else are you expecting? A stock qualification pasted onto every post? No, mods chiming in is fine. Their opinions are obviously their own and if there's any other impression then it behooves the impression holder to learn more about community dynamics (across the internet.)
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Comments
▪ Featured Episode
▪ Infinity Lockbox Returns & Link to Buy Keys
▪ Spotlight - Romulan Imperial Mindfield
▪ What's new in STO 14.5 & Link to What's New.
▪ Later Landing Page is bound to Main Menu and shouldn't be (Neverwinter's is not):
╘ Rearrange Hud, Options, Chat Settings, Change Character, Logout & Exit.
Revisit Landing Page to Integrate HAIL Button on Minimap (Better Landing Page):
▪ Calendar (More Prominent Color to stand out) the Neverwinter Landing Page also as Calendar similar to our Hail.
▪ Featured Series / Events -- with left / right scroll of 3 options.
╘ Features Series (aka Renegades Regret) Play Now
╘ Also shows Delta Recruit as Ongoing Long Term as 2 month ongoing events in middle.
╘ Also shows Mirror Invasion as 2 week ongoing event on right.
▪ Overview shows: Current Primary Mission in Journal, Episode Highlights, Foundry Highlights, Select PvE / PvP Queues.
▪ Episodes shows: Featured Episode, Faction specific Quests, Then Allied Specific Quests, Temporal Alliance Quests,...
▪ Available: All Daily Repeatable Quests.
▪ Foundry: (All Player Published Quests) with Spotlights, Browse All, etc..
Only change needed - aside from open on first login / login.
▪ UPCOMING WEEKEND: Could be expand & renamed SENIOR OFFICER REPORTS : with left/right scroll options.
╘ 'Flash Sales' posted the day they start &/or end - for things like Services, Items, or others...
╘ Infinity Lockbox Returns, along with Reward Highlights, with similar CSTORE Link.
╘═ Perhaps option to claim 40% off single KEY purchase (once per account) - during each lockbox change.
╘ 'Upcoming Weekend' for Bonus Marks, or whatever...
╘ Or story's related to advancing or upcoming content like:
https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/10896394
▪ Unbind it from MAIN MENU - as it would be available from HAIL button afterward.
One thing I don't think we've covered in much detail is brand new features. Ex. new tabs for (for instance) lifetime stat tracking that might be worth considering once STO has a centralized and specifically designated "main page." Make it better has been a fairly well litigated next step, so what then after that.
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Okay, double negative here. Clarification: because the landing page is always displayed right now on logging out, displayed with each characters log in is (by basic reason, never mind anything else said here) a bug. There's no reason to display it by design twice with every log in/out (because that's obviously annoying and no amount of uptick from key sales for the infinity box would offset the impact to player satisfaction.)
Not by design, will fix (to quote Kael again: in an upcoming update.)
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@patrickngo I hope that you're putting your thoughts in the actual retention thread.
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The constant pop up is not just a bug its designed in a way that even after the fix its going to pop up far more often than it should. I only play 1 toon actively and see the splash screen dozens of times a day and it’s frustrating every time. The bug/fix as described is not expected to have any impact on that so it’s not an annoyance I see once a day but an annoyance that I see far too often.
In fact for me it’s more than an annoyance due to the poor design it physically causes me extra pain and discomfort multiple times a day. Granted that doesn’t apply to most players but it’s part of the reason I am so strongly against it. It serves zero useful purpose, provides zero useful information and causes me extra physical discomfort for no good reason.
To me it does look like a badly thought out feature that is only implanted to drive key sales. After all we already have the 1st splash screen giving us all the useful information on log in. EDIT: and another splash screen area that links to new feature mission. The only logical reason I can see to add this new splash screen it to try and push more sales. What other purpose can it server other than to duplicate information from the 1st splash screen? Why do we need 2 splash screens? or 3 if you count the new feature mission splash area. What was wrong with the original first splash screens?
Just because it back fired and caused people to quit it doesn’t mean the original plan wasn’t for it to increase sales.
Assuming of course that no other changes are made and the entire section of this thread, delivering constructive feedback, has said nothing Cryptic could consider.
That's not exactly furthering the cause of productive discussion (more: never mind you guys, it's DOOOOOOOOOM!) Just about every system Cryptic's implemented has received iterative improvements in response to community feedback (Ex. auto-equip gear on readying a ship and the queue system). And it was rare that Cryptic would ever confirm specific changes prior to their deployment or close to it. That's because video game development is an uncertain and fluid process and devs across the industry don't like confirming things that they're not totally certain of as that's likely to cause issues if things change. See. why they don't talk about upcoming content on Ten Forward Weekly.
So, any expectation that we should already know in full what the landing page will ultimately be (such that you could take the uncertainty as a novel discussion point) is faulty. So, ease up. Things will change and we can take that as evolving topic to address in future as need be. This isn't a matter of hope, that is the most reasonable assessment of our situation from long established precedent and the specific circumstances of our current situation.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Yup, that's not really in question. I was just clarifying that the double negative (I'm skeptical -> isn't) was by intent and we weren't going to start questioning "is this once-per-character thing a bug?" again.
Much feedback (by myself and others) has been given about alternatives to the ESC menu as a home for the landing page (ie. combining the landing page and the front page of the journal menu, accessible from the "hail" button or J key.) We've also seen some suggestions to simply make the esc menu landing page less obstructive (ie. set the menu buttons to center again and attach the landing page elements to either side, though IMO this is still a bit awkward considering that this outro menu isn't where a player naturally goes when they're trying to find content to play.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Thank you! I really appreciate you taking the time to provide a more in-depth answer and update to the situation. Clear answers really go a long a way in helping curb any conspiracy theories. Personally, I don't know how busy or not busy the team is, how big or small the team is, what projects they have, and what their priorities are on any given day. That is why I really appreciate the insight and answer because it goes a long way in helping me understand why it hasn't been addressed yet.
The annoyance isn't so much when you only play one character. It gets very annoying when players have multiple characters they play daily and are trying to make the best of the daily grind with them. This is why I feel that because the feature is broken and they can't spare the time to fix it, that the feature should be removed until it can be fixed. Sometimes it is the little things that can make or break a situation.
It may not be a simple undertaking. For a point of comparison: during the last Ten Forward Weekly it was commented on that the gender buttons in Jem'Hadar's initial tailor weren't strictly necessary (considering that they have no gender options.) So the question came up: can we remove it? Answer: not without breaking other parts of the UI.
Consider that's a single button with static art. The slash page is more elaborate. "Just remove it" may have been considered but for technical reasons not attempted with the live game (who knows what they may have explored internally as a hot-fix.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
It being displayed when you log a character off IS by design since to log out you have to hit esc and get the lander splattered across the screen because the esc menu has been altered to include it.
Its a more in your face variation of the ferengi that welcomes you to drozana every time you leave the place.
Log out : By design
Log in: Bug
That was the explicit clarification I posted to be sure we were all on the same page.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
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Please bear in mind that the person you are thanking for giving you "insight" has absolutely no inside knowledge of this situation. BMR isn't a dev or community representative, just a volunteer mod. He has no information that isn't available to anyone else, so any explanation he gives is just his own personal opinion or speculation.
It's like those really bored greeters some shops insist on having who can't tell that the person carrying a bag out the door is actually done shopping and are leaving.
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i'm forced to agree with you on that point…. it's odd for the devs to do this without hint/tell us.. or even test it, i agree that don't have to much time to fix this thing right now, and the format is like a pop up add, wich is also odd, the use of something like this is to promote the patch notes, and some new stuff, but asi it stands now, it looks like "buy one, get two" type of add
Yeah, the similarity to a pop-up ad is something I noticed, too.
IMHO I think a lot of the objections to it could be resolved easily enough by adding a "don't show this again" button to the dialog (with an option to re-enable it in the game options if you change your mind later). To handle flash sales, I would have maybe added a HUD pop-up on, say, the lower left side of the screen below the minimap that appears when one starts or when you log in during (that would be active only when the player is on a social map or in sector space and can be quickly closed).
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““That's not exactly furthering the cause of productive discussion (more: never mind you guys, it's DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM! [quite literally stated]) Just about every system Cryptic's implemented has received iterative improvements in response to community feedback (Ex. auto-equip gear on readying a ship, the queue system). And it was rare that Cryptic would ever confirm specific changes prior to their deployment, or close to it (because video game development is an uncertain and fluid process and devs across the industry don't like confirming things they're not totally certain of because of the issues that may cause if things change. See. why they don't talk about upcoming content on Ten Forward Weekly.)”
I very clearly did further the cause of product discussion by adding new and valid criticism of the landing page. Yet instead of responding to that new valid criticism you ignore it and falsely say “not exactly furthering the cause of productive discussion” from my point of view it’s you who is not helping this thread or being productive. As for “DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM“ I distinctly said the opposite and that I don’t see the game as doomed.
Nobody has any expectation that we should already know in full what the landing page will be. But we do expect the devs to handle this better than they have.
As for the queue system yes it received some small iterative improvements then it got abandoned and left in a worse state with a worse UI then the old queue system. A lot of player are worried and rightly so that the same thing is going to happen to this splash screen.
The only warning is a quick flash of text, a tiny ! blinking in the corner and only 30 secs rather than 60 to accept.
And that illustrates the flaw in it by design, at least in my opinion. The pop up when logging in to my account is when I want to see it! Show me what is now, what sales are on, etc., when I am just getting ready to play. That way, I can consider buying something or playing specific featured or promoted content. When I am switching characters or logging off, I couldn't care less what the screen pops up because I want to switch characters to do something or log off because I am done for that particular time. If PWE thinks I am going to take the time to look at their advertising when I am logging off, then they are greatly mistaken.
Hmmm. Good point. Not all mods, at least at one point, were volunteers though. Is there a way to differentiate between which mods are PWE employees and which are volunteers?
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Never seen them get this kind of comment, ever. Rarely seen them get any comment at all, actually. It is, after all, about as trivial an issue as one can get.
I suppose it's because here it's new. People tend to resist change, just because it's different. Nobody would care to complain the exit menu buttons are 3 inches off-center if they'd been that way before. And if someone threatened to quit over an announcement window that had always been there, the only reaction they'd get is "can i haz ur stuff."
It really disturbs me how UNclear this situation is on the forums. Many people see a mod chime in on a thread and think their statements have more weight than the "regular" posters, but with the SOLE exception of forum rules, that is false.
Like someone said earlier, the mods don't work for Cryptic or PWE. They don't have any inside information. Their comments aren't informed by any inside knowledge.
The sad part is, it seems like some mods make their comments in a declarative way which creates the false impression described above. They need to be more clear that they are only stating their personal opinion and may very well be wrong.
New? Players were commenting about pop-up on log-out being a problem on page one. Hence: not furthering the cause of productive discussion. You're circling around old points with greater and greater degrees of distress (see. your comment about physical pain) apparently to try to affect a greater imperative for dev action. Unfortunately, how upset any given individual is at the landing page is not going to have an effect on the speed of a fix and other iterative changes. It'll take as long as it's going to take and you're not going to force action sooner by hyperventilating. Hence: ease up and try engaging in constructive problem solving (ie. concrete suggestions, bearing in mind where discussion is now and what's been said already).
That will at least set you on a different course from reflexively arguing with someone who is explicitly suggesting changes that not only validate but also will satisfy your complaint (ie. move the landing page out of the ESC menu, I've been agreeing with this for several pages now.) If you're not in a good place for that though, take a break and I say that 1. expecting a certain retort and 2. as a fellow community member.
Mmm, it's not just an ad though, the landing page directly links to the latest queue and episode. Click and you're there. If you close it out, then there's nothing offered (just the visual for the infinity box), but there's utility built into the basic design that could be better expanded upon (ie. add more shortcuts across more content.)
They are labeled as community moderators...what else are you expecting? A stock qualification pasted onto every post? No, mods chiming in is fine. Their opinions are obviously their own and if there's any other impression then it behooves the impression holder to learn more about community dynamics (across the internet.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!