Since my irl wife is already my ingame 'romance' on two of my toons (in the form of either a chief medical officer or first officer with her name), how exactly would a romance system work?
Why? Would this be an RP element? Would it benefit my characters somehow? And how is it Star Trek? All of the Captains in the series and films are portrayed as people who are dedicated totally to their careers and their ship. Sure, they have the occasional romatic interest. Then the credits roll and the relationship is over just as fast. So how does adding romance to the game make it better?
No thanks, I'll pass on this.
A six year old boy and his starship. Living the dream.
Why? Would this be an RP element? Would it benefit my characters somehow? And how is it Star Trek? All of the Captains in the series and films are portrayed as people who are dedicated totally to their careers and their ship. Sure, they have the occasional romatic interest. Then the credits roll and the relationship is over just as fast. So how does adding romance to the game make it better?
No thanks, I'll pass on this.
Actually... Sisko had a bit of an ongoing thing with Cassidy Yates until he actually married her.
Actually... Sisko had a bit of an ongoing thing with Cassidy Yates until he actually married her.
Kirk and Picard also had long-term relationships and aspirations beyond Starfleet. They made several movies about one, the other, or both.
Also, don't forget about Jennifer Sisko.
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One in Picard's case though... wasn't exactly gonna work out due to regs, seeing as how Dr. Crusher was assigned to the same ship under his command.
I actually didn't have Crusher in mind there. Picard had a family in Inner Light (real to him at the time) and revealed in Generations that his lack of personal attachment had a lot more depth to it than merely a career advancement and ship maintenance. It was about family (acting in one capacity to carry on tradition while his brother carried on the family line. Picard wanted to live up to his family's predecessors, not general heroes from Starfleet history, and his lack of personal attachment can easily be argued as a failing he excused by compensation. It's not something he would have ideally wanted [see. Nexus].)
With the loss of family, Picard's remoteness [a core character trait, more apt than simple dedication] came to deeply haunt him. He only reconciled with mortality and legacies (to some degree) through his experience with the Nexus and confronting Soran. And yet, he still wasn't bothered about the loss of the ENT-D. Picard salvaged the family photo album from the wreckage, not anything specific to his career or his ship.
And following this up in First Contact: Picard's dedication to the ENT-E was portrayed as a situation-specific failing and very directly attributable to his desire for revenge against the Borg for what they did to him (and FED populations.) Again, genuine human complexity rather than cartoonish caricatures (the range of which includes romantic relationships. See. Insurrection and while Anij isn't specifically mentioned in Nemesis there definitely is capitalization on Troy-Riker [who was finally moving up to Captain after their Insurrection arc.])
Oi...(not at you, just what we've had to establish about characters in Star Trek. Romance/relationships are a pervasive throughput of the series, as it must be if it's covering human motivations. Though, to the point of this thread that doesn't necessarily need to be codified into a new system to be addressed in STO. [as with any aspect of your character or your boff's character, it lives inside your own head.])
Post edited by duncanidaho11 on
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
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If they put it in, whatever.. I wouldn't throw a fit as long as it was something I could ignore if I wanted to. If it were done, I would hope it would be optional.
UH...Is this question for real?!
Wouldnt go well here in my opinion at all..Trek has always been about the captian and duty..Kirk was so attached to the enterprise we all know how..Picard was nothing less..Sisko was of the 1% different captians..Yes they all had their flings (kirk had a bit more) but thats a far as it went, they all potraited a duty bound attitude and a crazy attachment to their ships, plenty of examples are there..The only rellationship to go all the way was Troi+Riker that to at the end of the journey and Sisko+CANT REMEMBER THE PERSON AFTER JENNIFER..
Hell even scotty was attached to the enterprise..LaForge how often did we see him outta engineering apart from seson one? Even the engineers were married to the warp cores..
Just my 2 cets here..
SWOTOR like star wars had deep relations between character, Anakin+Padme, Han+Leia from the movies and only one major one in the games Revan+Bastila, so there was major ground work with a crazy skywalker line in the movies now ended by disney, and a legacy in the games to build on..
- Would the romance element suggested by the OP be with another player? Or would it be with an NPC?
- Exactly how does someone fall in love with an NPC?
- Does the NPC benefit from the relationship?
- Does the NPC in such a relationship exist solely for the gratification and enjoyment of the player?
- Does such a relationship sound/look healthy or normal?
- If we have romance and relationships in STO, are we also going to have marriages and offspring?
- If we allow marriages should we not also allow divorce?
- How does STO intend to define marriage if it is allowed?
- Or, more practically, whom do they offend into protesting Cryptic all over social media and reducing Crptic's income stream?
- How is allowing romance between characters in STO going to be beneficial to both the players and the game?
- Will Cryptic charge Zen for a marriage license?
- Is it possible currently to have a romantic relationship is STO as it exists right now without adding in additional coding to such as old game engine?
- What elements of STO will be changed for the worse if romantic relationships are added to the game?
- What elements of STO recieve reduced Dev time and bughunt time to add and maintain romantic relationships as an official part of the game?
- Are we asking for this simply because 'All the other games have it!'?
I'm not opposed to anything which makes someone's STO experience better. I really do think people should be allowed to play this game the way they want to. But I also think sometimes people ask for things which are unreasonable.
A six year old boy and his starship. Living the dream.
On the face of it I was a little like, no it will be done badly, cheesy and cringe worthy.
But the more I thought about it, Love Interests in SWTOR (whether it would work here or not) are one of the key elements of the game. The end of the last flashpoint you can propose and marry your LI, its how the story ends and perhaps the only unique and redeemable part of the ending. Even if not a personal preference there are plenty of people that seem to feel their love interest is the most important part of the story for them. With claims such as, when other games offer in depth companions in the same way then they would consider playing them.
Likewise its the next logical step after people are able to make their boff's look how they want, dress them in completely inappropriate outfits for away missions or being on the bridge. Once you allow people to make their crew visually pleasing and dress them up as you want then to draw the line at a romance option seems a little late.
Finally its fitting with the source material, Kirk was meant to be a ladies man that like green chicks, while a number of other primary characters were either married, widowed (and remarried), dating other main characters or spending episodes dating guest stars or talking about how they would like to date other characters.
If they put it in, whatever.. I wouldn't throw a fit as long as it was something I could ignore if I wanted to. If it were done, I would hope it would be optional.
Realistically I think the only practical general "romance" system for bridge officers is like what SWTOR has where you can specify the off-screen relationships your character has (across a broad spectrum, merely including partner/spouse) with other characters of yours. It would impact gameplay as much as the boffs you've specified as your department heads, include other things like "mentor" and "adversary," and inclined players can already do this through writing character/boff bios (a blank page is very flexible.) The benefit over a simple bio could be the ability to link directly to crew, for players inspecting your character info, though the impact is restrictive and difficult to quantify (it's an aid to player social interactions. Ie. reading what other players have written about themselves.)
So...it's a big shrug and there's probably other ways of improving bridge officer role in gameplay that enhances the player's ability to specify backstory (ex. new trait/skill system that invokes training, experience, alignment, and/or personality.) Minor things here and there (as reyan01 mentioned) is probably an easier ask.
Post edited by duncanidaho11 on
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
However, romantic content can be created in the foundry. I know it would just be an episode and not a permanent option but romance sometimes is a fling anyway.
Can I send a shoutout to "The Interwarp Experiment"? That was really well-done.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Unless I can be a Targ with a loving mate and a big litter of Targlets that I train to take over the Empire, naw
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
However, romantic content can be created in the foundry. I know it would just be an episode and not a permanent option but romance sometimes is a fling anyway.
Can I send a shoutout to "The Interwarp Experiment"? That was really well-done.
Provided I can also shoutout to Shore Leave Under Siege.
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
I cautiously voted 'yes', but this shouldn't become a sex thing. Otherwise it will become a sordid copy of Second Life, with sex toys, sex furniture, sex anims, etc. I don't think STO needs that.
One in Picard's case though... wasn't exactly gonna work out due to regs, seeing as how Dr. Crusher was assigned to the same ship under his command.
Picard also lounged about a bit with Vash, if I recall correctly.
And lets not forget that Kirk is one of the sources of the stereotype of the cocky Ship Captain sleeping with every Green Skinned Alien Babe/Hot Chick Of The Week they meet.....
...but yeah, that's about the level of "romance" (/eyeroll) one could likely expect from this game. There just isn't enough characterization/cutscenes/etc to really get more.
No, just no. I'm all fine with the space barbie side of the game, still serves a purpose to us that are huge ST fans and enjoys those elements, but this ain't the Sims, nor should it aspire to be.
There are a nest of mechanical and demographic issues that make introducing a 'romantic' storyline element not just a huge risk for the developers, but also likely to create a negative backlash as either some players feel left out, or others feel they're being railroaded along directions that they object to, particularly since the storyline's pretty much "you always say the same thing/right thing" for the predefined plot, which in turn means your 'romantic interest' winds up being forced.
Foundry authors have included optional romance/flirtatious dialog options in their missions. The amount of backlash I've seen afforded to these is zero. Hell, I've whacked players over the head with romantic subplots between NPC's and while I can definitely say that's not to everyone's taste, no one has ever gotten political about it. The public is generally acclimated to the idea of characters having relationships in video games (even in the mainstream media, let alone gaming communities themselves.) After all, it's just translating the concept of characters having relationships in film, TV, literature, oral story telling, ect. to a more interactive format.
Now of course "cryptic doing it" introduces another variable but what's probably key to point out here is that under no plausible circumstance would any player be railroaded into making a character decision that they in fact did not want for their character. Applies to all things, all circumstances, and it really shouldn't be necessary to point out here (similar to saying that Cryptic could force weapon choice from here on. It goes against core RPG principles.) Any hypothetical relationship option, be it in story or in system (and I think people are more on the side of the latter here, Mass Effect-style crew interactions aren't supported by the basic format of STO) would be just that: an option. It would not be a mandatory plot point by any conceivable definition.
Post edited by duncanidaho11 on
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Comments
No thanks, I'll pass on this.
Actually... Sisko had a bit of an ongoing thing with Cassidy Yates until he actually married her.
Kirk and Picard also had long-term relationships and aspirations beyond Starfleet. They made several movies about one, the other, or both.
Also, don't forget about Jennifer Sisko.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
I actually didn't have Crusher in mind there. Picard had a family in Inner Light (real to him at the time) and revealed in Generations that his lack of personal attachment had a lot more depth to it than merely a career advancement and ship maintenance. It was about family (acting in one capacity to carry on tradition while his brother carried on the family line. Picard wanted to live up to his family's predecessors, not general heroes from Starfleet history, and his lack of personal attachment can easily be argued as a failing he excused by compensation. It's not something he would have ideally wanted [see. Nexus].)
With the loss of family, Picard's remoteness [a core character trait, more apt than simple dedication] came to deeply haunt him. He only reconciled with mortality and legacies (to some degree) through his experience with the Nexus and confronting Soran. And yet, he still wasn't bothered about the loss of the ENT-D. Picard salvaged the family photo album from the wreckage, not anything specific to his career or his ship.
And following this up in First Contact: Picard's dedication to the ENT-E was portrayed as a situation-specific failing and very directly attributable to his desire for revenge against the Borg for what they did to him (and FED populations.) Again, genuine human complexity rather than cartoonish caricatures (the range of which includes romantic relationships. See. Insurrection and while Anij isn't specifically mentioned in Nemesis there definitely is capitalization on Troy-Riker [who was finally moving up to Captain after their Insurrection arc.])
Oi...(not at you, just what we've had to establish about characters in Star Trek. Romance/relationships are a pervasive throughput of the series, as it must be if it's covering human motivations. Though, to the point of this thread that doesn't necessarily need to be codified into a new system to be addressed in STO. [as with any aspect of your character or your boff's character, it lives inside your own head.])
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
If they put it in, whatever.. I wouldn't throw a fit as long as it was something I could ignore if I wanted to. If it were done, I would hope it would be optional.
I Support Disco | Disco is Love | Disco is Life
"bortaS bIr jablu'DI' reH QaQqu' nay'"
Revenge is a Dish, Best Served Cold ~ Khan Noonien Singh
We come in peace, SHOOT TO KILL!
Wouldnt go well here in my opinion at all..Trek has always been about the captian and duty..Kirk was so attached to the enterprise we all know how..Picard was nothing less..Sisko was of the 1% different captians..Yes they all had their flings (kirk had a bit more) but thats a far as it went, they all potraited a duty bound attitude and a crazy attachment to their ships, plenty of examples are there..The only rellationship to go all the way was Troi+Riker that to at the end of the journey and Sisko+CANT REMEMBER THE PERSON AFTER JENNIFER..
Hell even scotty was attached to the enterprise..LaForge how often did we see him outta engineering apart from seson one? Even the engineers were married to the warp cores..
Just my 2 cets here..
SWOTOR like star wars had deep relations between character, Anakin+Padme, Han+Leia from the movies and only one major one in the games Revan+Bastila, so there was major ground work with a crazy skywalker line in the movies now ended by disney, and a legacy in the games to build on..
Adu-Uss Firefox NCC-93425-F (LVL 65 FED AoY ENG) UR/VR MKXV Fleet Intel Assault Cruiser (July 2016)
Jean-Uss Seratoga Ravenna (LVL 60 FED Delta ENG) UC/R MKVI Bajoran Escort (April 2018)
Dubsa-RRW Mnaudh (LVL 50 FED allied ROM Delta ENG) Warbird (May 2018)
Marop-IKS Orunthi (LVL 50 KNG Delta ENG) BoP (May 2018)
Kanak'lan-TRIBBLE (LVL 65 DOM Gamma ENG) TRIBBLE (June 2018)
- Would the romance element suggested by the OP be with another player? Or would it be with an NPC?
- Exactly how does someone fall in love with an NPC?
- Does the NPC benefit from the relationship?
- Does the NPC in such a relationship exist solely for the gratification and enjoyment of the player?
- Does such a relationship sound/look healthy or normal?
- If we have romance and relationships in STO, are we also going to have marriages and offspring?
- If we allow marriages should we not also allow divorce?
- How does STO intend to define marriage if it is allowed?
- Or, more practically, whom do they offend into protesting Cryptic all over social media and reducing Crptic's income stream?
- How is allowing romance between characters in STO going to be beneficial to both the players and the game?
- Will Cryptic charge Zen for a marriage license?
- Is it possible currently to have a romantic relationship is STO as it exists right now without adding in additional coding to such as old game engine?
- What elements of STO will be changed for the worse if romantic relationships are added to the game?
- What elements of STO recieve reduced Dev time and bughunt time to add and maintain romantic relationships as an official part of the game?
- Are we asking for this simply because 'All the other games have it!'?
I'm not opposed to anything which makes someone's STO experience better. I really do think people should be allowed to play this game the way they want to. But I also think sometimes people ask for things which are unreasonable.
But the more I thought about it, Love Interests in SWTOR (whether it would work here or not) are one of the key elements of the game. The end of the last flashpoint you can propose and marry your LI, its how the story ends and perhaps the only unique and redeemable part of the ending. Even if not a personal preference there are plenty of people that seem to feel their love interest is the most important part of the story for them. With claims such as, when other games offer in depth companions in the same way then they would consider playing them.
Likewise its the next logical step after people are able to make their boff's look how they want, dress them in completely inappropriate outfits for away missions or being on the bridge. Once you allow people to make their crew visually pleasing and dress them up as you want then to draw the line at a romance option seems a little late.
Finally its fitting with the source material, Kirk was meant to be a ladies man that like green chicks, while a number of other primary characters were either married, widowed (and remarried), dating other main characters or spending episodes dating guest stars or talking about how they would like to date other characters.
Realistically I think the only practical general "romance" system for bridge officers is like what SWTOR has where you can specify the off-screen relationships your character has (across a broad spectrum, merely including partner/spouse) with other characters of yours. It would impact gameplay as much as the boffs you've specified as your department heads, include other things like "mentor" and "adversary," and inclined players can already do this through writing character/boff bios (a blank page is very flexible.) The benefit over a simple bio could be the ability to link directly to crew, for players inspecting your character info, though the impact is restrictive and difficult to quantify (it's an aid to player social interactions. Ie. reading what other players have written about themselves.)
So...it's a big shrug and there's probably other ways of improving bridge officer role in gameplay that enhances the player's ability to specify backstory (ex. new trait/skill system that invokes training, experience, alignment, and/or personality.) Minor things here and there (as reyan01 mentioned) is probably an easier ask.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Can I send a shoutout to "The Interwarp Experiment"? That was really well-done.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
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Provided I can also shoutout to Shore Leave Under Siege.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Picard also lounged about a bit with Vash, if I recall correctly.
And lets not forget that Kirk is one of the sources of the stereotype of the cocky Ship Captain sleeping with every Green Skinned Alien Babe/Hot Chick Of The Week they meet.....
...but yeah, that's about the level of "romance" (/eyeroll) one could likely expect from this game. There just isn't enough characterization/cutscenes/etc to really get more.
Adu-Uss Firefox NCC-93425-F (LVL 65 FED AoY ENG) UR/VR MKXV Fleet Intel Assault Cruiser (July 2016)
Jean-Uss Seratoga Ravenna (LVL 60 FED Delta ENG) UC/R MKVI Bajoran Escort (April 2018)
Dubsa-RRW Mnaudh (LVL 50 FED allied ROM Delta ENG) Warbird (May 2018)
Marop-IKS Orunthi (LVL 50 KNG Delta ENG) BoP (May 2018)
Kanak'lan-TRIBBLE (LVL 65 DOM Gamma ENG) TRIBBLE (June 2018)
Case in point, anything map-restricted offends me.
Foundry authors have included optional romance/flirtatious dialog options in their missions. The amount of backlash I've seen afforded to these is zero. Hell, I've whacked players over the head with romantic subplots between NPC's and while I can definitely say that's not to everyone's taste, no one has ever gotten political about it. The public is generally acclimated to the idea of characters having relationships in video games (even in the mainstream media, let alone gaming communities themselves.) After all, it's just translating the concept of characters having relationships in film, TV, literature, oral story telling, ect. to a more interactive format.
Now of course "cryptic doing it" introduces another variable but what's probably key to point out here is that under no plausible circumstance would any player be railroaded into making a character decision that they in fact did not want for their character. Applies to all things, all circumstances, and it really shouldn't be necessary to point out here (similar to saying that Cryptic could force weapon choice from here on. It goes against core RPG principles.) Any hypothetical relationship option, be it in story or in system (and I think people are more on the side of the latter here, Mass Effect-style crew interactions aren't supported by the basic format of STO) would be just that: an option. It would not be a mandatory plot point by any conceivable definition.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!