It's time to remove the Loadout System

warmaker001b · May 2022

The Loadout System has had issues since it was put into the game. Hey, here's a 2014 thread talking about how problematic it is.
https://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1165902/loadout-system-please-fix

2014. It's 2022 and there's still issues that stem from this terrible system.

It needs to get removed and it would actually greatly improve the quality of the game when that happens.

Unknown · May 2022

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strathkin · May 2022

I've fine with it, it's not perfect perhaps; yet as long as you save your Ship Loadout in Space (Social Area) most of the time it works fine. Just the odd time it looses or changes a trait or two, or maybe forgets a tray icon the odd time but rarely.

Granted if you start a new ship those always start empty, and the last Traits used in the previous loadout, often are used. Still you'll want to beam to Sol System, New Romulus, or Quonos and save and update Loadouts before continuing.

Most of the time it generally works fine, provided you do as stated above.

protoneous · May 2022

warmaker001b wrote: »

The Loadout System has had issues since it was put into the game. Hey, here's a 2014 thread talking about how problematic it is.
https://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1165902/loadout-system-please-fix

2014. It's 2022 and there's still issues that stem from this terrible system.

It needs to get removed and it would actually greatly improve the quality of the game when that happens.

+1.

Lots of things are removed from the game to improve it. Why not do the same for loadouts?

Edit: I guess I should temper my opinion with loadouts and traits unslotting being mentioned as a known issue in the latest patch notes.

If this next patch doesn't fix things up then perhaps they should be removed

sthe91 · May 2022

I don't support removing the load out system it just needs to work consistently instead of what it currently does. I save my loadouts on my ships in Sector Space or near a planet twice in Loadout Slot 1. As a result on my main I was able to dodge a bullet of loadout issues. I will see what happened to my other characters if they were affected or not. A revamp is needed in my opinion so that it can catch the data from other loadout slots and not just Loadout Slot 1. I do not believe its removal would be wise.

warmaker001b · May 2022

sthe91 wrote: »

I don't support removing the load out system it just needs to work consistently instead of what it currently does. A revamp is needed in my opinion.

This system has been terrible since it was implemented, fraught with bugs. Check the link in my original post. It's from 2014. Browse around enough and you'll see these issues arise again and again.

Maybe the idea of a working Loadout System has merit. But the problem is it isn't working. Again, it's been problematic for like 8 years now.

protoneous wrote: »

warmaker001b wrote: »

The Loadout System has had issues since it was put into the game. Hey, here's a 2014 thread talking about how problematic it is.
https://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1165902/loadout-system-please-fix

2014. It's 2022 and there's still issues that stem from this terrible system.

It needs to get removed and it would actually greatly improve the quality of the game when that happens.

+1.

Lots of things are removed from the game to improve it. Why not do the same for loadouts?

Edit: I guess I should temper my opinion with loadouts and traits unslotting being mentioned as a known issue in the latest patch notes.

If this next patch doesn't fix things up then perhaps they should be removed

It's been a known issue for many years.

warmaker001b · May 2022

wraithshadow13 · May 2022

I never bothered with the loadouts. At all... I just get really annoyed when the build i DO use is still constantly deleted, when i swap maps.

warmaker001b · May 2022

wraithshadow13 wrote: »

I never bothered with the loadouts. At all... I just get really annoyed when the build i DO use is still constantly deleted, when i swap maps.

The system is so broken since Day 1 that it intrudes upon you even if you want nothing at all to do with it. When the system released years and years ago I did not bother with it at all, but there I was with my setup getting altered all the time.

doctorstegi · May 2022

warmaker001b wrote: »

wraithshadow13 wrote: »

I never bothered with the loadouts. At all... I just get really annoyed when the build i DO use is still constantly deleted, when i swap maps.

The system is so broken since Day 1 that it intrudes upon you even if you want nothing at all to do with it. When the system released years and years ago I did not bother with it at all, but there I was with my setup getting altered all the time.

I agree it either gets fixed so that it works or take it out entirely. I'm so tired when a make a new build putting things in and out several times or when I want change a setup on the fly before going to specific tfo it will not load.

As it is right now it is a Pain in the rear and the way Cryptic handles the game lately I highly doubt they will find the time to fix that. Gotta work on new content aka new ships...

husanakx · May 2022

Agreed. They remove content for the good of the game.

Perhaps its time to remove a stupid system for the good of the game. Refund the zen to people with extra slots unlocked. And kill it with fire.

After seeing how it is clearly not deleting unused OLD data from its database. I suspect it is probably also responsible for some of the server load issues. Why it remembers layouts from my ships that are years old is interesting. Seems one problem is the system doesn't properly cull old data.

seaofsorrows · May 2022

Right.. so it's not working for YOU.. so remove it?

Loadouts work just fine for me.. I have multiple ships with different load outs and they all work fine.

But yeah.. it doesn't work for YOU.. so remove it?

I can get behind proposals to enhance or correct a system to address those that are having problems. Ideally, the system should work for everyone.. but complete removal is a short sided solution to put it politely.

This is one of those times where I am happy the Cryptic doesn't listen to players, because this suggestion is awful. If it doesn't work for you.. don't use it. A lot of us use it just fine.

leemwatson · May 2022

I stopped using it a week after it was implemented. Now I just tool up different ships differently instead....far less stressful to just switch ships.

annemarie30 · May 2022

leemwatson wrote: »

I stopped using it a week after it was implemented. Now I just tool up different ships differently instead....far less stressful to just switch ships.

that's what I do. if I think something needs an EPG boat, I go to my sci toon. if I think I want to play escort, my main loads. if I want Odyssey time, my engineer is on deck.

Unknown · May 2022

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warmaker001b · May 2022

seaofsorrows wrote: »

Right.. so it's not working for YOU.. so remove it?

Loadouts work just fine for me.. I have multiple ships with different load outs and they all work fine.

But yeah.. it doesn't work for YOU.. so remove it?

I can get behind proposals to enhance or correct a system to address those that are having problems. Ideally, the system should work for everyone.. but complete removal is a short sided solution to put it politely.

This is one of those times where I am happy the Cryptic doesn't listen to players, because this suggestion is awful. If it doesn't work for you.. don't use it. A lot of us use it just fine.

You think it's just me? LOL no! It's been a recurring problem for others as well over the many years it's been around.

I've shown proof from different people over 8 years of how problematic it's been. Hell there's posts here right now in reply concurring.

But no, it's only me, right?

Also:
I DO NOT USE THE LOADOUT SYSTEM. BUT IT PLAGUES ME NONETHELESS.

I honestly would like nothing more than just to totally ignore the system, but its issues creep into my game despite me wanting nothing to do with it. Heck, there were issues before that arose where others suggested to use the Loadout System if your stuff was getting reset.
===
There's a thread over in the bug reports section with the new update on the Loadout System.
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1266756/loadout-bug-post-update
But the only one having a problem is me, right?

husanakx · May 2022

The loadout system is a PITA for people that it should benefit most. That is what gulls me the most about it. I play a lot of toons... my newer/less played toons where I might swap a build now and then no problem cause I have lots of inventory space ect. My handful of "main" toons where I have expanded dry dock space, multiple gamble ships... and inventories that tend to be full of lots of gear/lockbox prizes ect ect. When you swap a loadout or a ship and the game decides to drop items into your bag till you have a bunch of stuff in overflow... ya its more hassle then its worth. It would almost be easier to just spend 20 min setting up a new build sometimes.

Theory is great... implementation is and always has been suspect.

Get it right or remove it.

warmaker001b · May 2022

husanakx wrote: »

The loadout system is a PITA for people that it should benefit most. That is what gulls me the most about it. I play a lot of toons... my newer/less played toons where I might swap a build now and then no problem cause I have lots of inventory space ect. My handful of "main" toons where I have expanded dry dock space, multiple gamble ships... and inventories that tend to be full of lots of gear/lockbox prizes ect ect. When you swap a loadout or a ship and the game decides to drop items into your bag till you have a bunch of stuff in overflow... ya its more hassle then its worth. It would almost be easier to just spend 20 min setting up a new build sometimes.

Theory is great... implementation is and always has been suspect.

Get it right or remove it.

It's been in the game for over 8 years and it's never been fixed. It will never get fixed. It needs to be removed.

crypticarmsman · May 2022

warmaker001b wrote: »

husanakx wrote: »

The loadout system is a PITA for people that it should benefit most. That is what gulls me the most about it. I play a lot of toons... my newer/less played toons where I might swap a build now and then no problem cause I have lots of inventory space ect. My handful of "main" toons where I have expanded dry dock space, multiple gamble ships... and inventories that tend to be full of lots of gear/lockbox prizes ect ect. When you swap a loadout or a ship and the game decides to drop items into your bag till you have a bunch of stuff in overflow... ya its more hassle then its worth. It would almost be easier to just spend 20 min setting up a new build sometimes.

Theory is great... implementation is and always has been suspect.

Get it right or remove it.

It's been in the game for over 8 years and it's never been fixed. It will never get fixed. It needs to be removed.

What makes you think removing it will solve any issues? It was put in place because before you could specifically save loadouts; the game would randomly scramble all your loadouts if you deleted a ship; or renamed a ship to the point where it moved locations on the alphabetical list of ships in the ship assignment NPCs. Removing it won't change or fix any issues - and the way Cryptic seems to do QA; it would probably introduce others issues in another player facing component of STO.

seaofsorrows · May 2022

warmaker001b wrote: »

seaofsorrows wrote: »

Right.. so it's not working for YOU.. so remove it?

Loadouts work just fine for me.. I have multiple ships with different load outs and they all work fine.

But yeah.. it doesn't work for YOU.. so remove it?

I can get behind proposals to enhance or correct a system to address those that are having problems. Ideally, the system should work for everyone.. but complete removal is a short sided solution to put it politely.

This is one of those times where I am happy the Cryptic doesn't listen to players, because this suggestion is awful. If it doesn't work for you.. don't use it. A lot of us use it just fine.

You think it's just me? LOL no! It's been a recurring problem for others as well over the many years it's been around.

I've shown proof from different people over 8 years of how problematic it's been. Hell there's posts here right now in reply concurring.

But no, it's only me, right?

Also:
I DO NOT USE THE LOADOUT SYSTEM. BUT IT PLAGUES ME NONETHELESS.

I honestly would like nothing more than just to totally ignore the system, but its issues creep into my game despite me wanting nothing to do with it. Heck, there were issues before that arose where others suggested to use the Loadout System if your stuff was getting reset.
===
There's a thread over in the bug reports section with the new update on the Loadout System.
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1266756/loadout-bug-post-update
But the only one having a problem is me, right?

Yeah, you just don't care about the other people in the game that use it just fine. Sure, you can find other people that have trouble with it.. I am currently having problems with it right now because they bugged it in the last update.

Does that mean it should be removed? Hell no.

I don't care how this sounds.. it gives you trouble? Tough.. deal with it. It works fine for many and you advocating for the removal of a system you don't even use because it causes you some minor inconvenience is about as selfish and ridiculous as it gets.

Again, you want to advocate for fixing it.. great.. they might not do it.. but they're not going to remove it either. Asking for it's complete removal despite the fact that others use it and benefit from it, while you don't even use it is absurd.

warmaker001b · May 2022

seaofsorrows wrote: »

warmaker001b wrote: »

seaofsorrows wrote: »

Right.. so it's not working for YOU.. so remove it?

Loadouts work just fine for me.. I have multiple ships with different load outs and they all work fine.

But yeah.. it doesn't work for YOU.. so remove it?

I can get behind proposals to enhance or correct a system to address those that are having problems. Ideally, the system should work for everyone.. but complete removal is a short sided solution to put it politely.

This is one of those times where I am happy the Cryptic doesn't listen to players, because this suggestion is awful. If it doesn't work for you.. don't use it. A lot of us use it just fine.

You think it's just me? LOL no! It's been a recurring problem for others as well over the many years it's been around.

I've shown proof from different people over 8 years of how problematic it's been. Hell there's posts here right now in reply concurring.

But no, it's only me, right?

Also:
I DO NOT USE THE LOADOUT SYSTEM. BUT IT PLAGUES ME NONETHELESS.

I honestly would like nothing more than just to totally ignore the system, but its issues creep into my game despite me wanting nothing to do with it. Heck, there were issues before that arose where others suggested to use the Loadout System if your stuff was getting reset.
===
There's a thread over in the bug reports section with the new update on the Loadout System.
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1266756/loadout-bug-post-update
But the only one having a problem is me, right?

Yeah, you just don't care about the other people in the game that use it just fine. Sure, you can find other people that have trouble with it.. I am currently having problems with it right now because they bugged it in the last update.

Does that mean it should be removed? Hell no.

I don't care how this sounds.. it gives you trouble? Tough.. deal with it. It works fine for many and you advocating for the removal of a system you don't even use because it causes you some minor inconvenience is about as selfish and ridiculous as it gets.

Again, you want to advocate for fixing it.. great.. they might not do it.. but they're not going to remove it either. Asking for it's complete removal despite the fact that others use it and benefit from it, while you don't even use it is absurd.

I call the removal of a bugged, intrusive system that plagues and bothers me and many others since its inception.

Fix it? IT'S BEEN BROKEN SINCE DAY 1. 8 years later it's still borked.

Go into those linked threads and see how much people had been asking for this screwed up system to get fixed. It's never getting fixed. The devs can't fix it. IT HAS BEEN EIGHT YEARS.

warmaker001b · May 2022

crypticarmsman wrote: »

warmaker001b wrote: »

husanakx wrote: »

The loadout system is a PITA for people that it should benefit most. That is what gulls me the most about it. I play a lot of toons... my newer/less played toons where I might swap a build now and then no problem cause I have lots of inventory space ect. My handful of "main" toons where I have expanded dry dock space, multiple gamble ships... and inventories that tend to be full of lots of gear/lockbox prizes ect ect. When you swap a loadout or a ship and the game decides to drop items into your bag till you have a bunch of stuff in overflow... ya its more hassle then its worth. It would almost be easier to just spend 20 min setting up a new build sometimes.

Theory is great... implementation is and always has been suspect.

Get it right or remove it.

It's been in the game for over 8 years and it's never been fixed. It will never get fixed. It needs to be removed.

What makes you think removing it will solve any issues? It was put in place because before you could specifically save loadouts; the game would randomly scramble all your loadouts if you deleted a ship; or renamed a ship to the point where it moved locations on the alphabetical list of ships in the ship assignment NPCs. Removing it won't change or fix any issues - and the way Cryptic seems to do QA; it would probably introduce others issues in another player facing component of STO.

Because all these stupid issues only started when Cryptic introduced this awful system into STO.

truewarper · May 2022

Well, when the code is old and not maintained. It no longer serves the original purpose.

Fix or removed....

malfandor · May 2022

There is a longer list of bugs that have come and gone in this game. The temporary fix was, use the number one loadout until it was addressed.

My vote is leave it in. Work to stabilize it. For now it serves a function. Saving our collective behinds from loading bugs.

That is my two cents.

Personally I would not mind if they took a break from content to stabilize various aspects of this game and give it a more solid foundation to build on. Removal of anything is not a good option. Fixing it and learning why it is causing issues in the first place, is a far better teacher to the development team. It would probably give them rather sound data to use going forward.

warmaker001b · May 2022

So I hop onto my new Delta Recruit this evening, get into Iuppiter Iratus instance and get my Daily Event Progress, etc. The ship was acting weird, not doing things that it should and afterwards I notice my traits are unslotted.

Even better, I was not using a Loadout on this character / ship, yet this bugged system is bothering me.

Get rid of it. It's been broken for 8 years now.

whiteknight1x · May 2022

Sorry, but I don't agree. The Loadout system should be fix and updated. I switch between loadouts all the time. I have 3 loadout per toon. Beam Array FAW, Beam Array BO, and DBB BO. I also have one toon with a 4th label Speed for Tour of the Galaxy.

We do need the Specialization skill add to the Loadout just like they did with the Traits. We also need the ground have a loadout option too. I would also like to have a Keybind for switch between them.

whiteknight1x · May 2022

malfandor wrote: »

Personally I would not mind if they took a break from content to stabilize various aspects of this game and give it a more solid foundation to build on. Removal of anything is not a good option. Fixing it and learning why it is causing issues in the first place, is a far better teacher to the development team. It would probably give them rather sound data to use going forward.

I second this. Make an announcement that for the next six months the priority will be bug fixes and QoL updates.

protoneous · May 2022

Found this on one of my science ships. It won't even work properly without the starship trait Entwined Tactical Matrices... I'm unable to fire a torpedo spread. The two tactical bridge officer abilities I use (bfaw & csv) to get my spread and proc the morphogenic set just don't do the job lol. 2/3 pieces of the set were relocated into my inventory along with 19/20 reactive armor catalysts. Oh well.

wodenaz · May 2022

I dont know if they should remove loadouts, but what really bugs me is with one of the last few patches they set it so it automatically uses a loadout when you select a new ship, it took me ages to fiure out why it kept reverting to the setup that it had when i first changed to a new ship after one of the lat few patches.

And i never have used loadout and dont have a desire to, esp if it acts like this and keeps changing setup to one of the loadouts everytime i go into a pve, esp when i set up in order to complete an endevour.

jennycolvin · May 2022

Loadouts never worked properly for me since they were first introduced... but removing the feature is not the way to go, imho.
What should be done is to test it proprely - not by QAs with devs access, which is what they've been doing until now - and find where the problems are to then fix them.
It's a quality of life asset that should not be done away with, but fixed so that it works properly.

dragon200052 · May 2022

I will be honest I have never had any of these issues with the load out system and i have been using it for years so i suspect i'm in the minority though a lot of my friends also use the system to very little issue it is very rare we have had issues with it the only issue I could possibly attribute to load out was a long time ago when playing missions where it gave you a ship to fly.

By removing this system it would just make things more annoying personally as I run a wide variety of builds in multiple configurations and when the load outs work (as they have been for me) it is a nice time saver instead of having to change traits, weapons, consoles everything.

While yes you could then argue why keep if for those it works for if it annoys so many others, but i would argue that Instead of removal actually fixing it would be the solution yes you say they have not fixed it for years but there are many issues that have had similar issues.

It's time to remove the Loadout System

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