Anyways a Cardassian Faction would just be a rehash of the Romulan one anyways, just replace the Tal Shiar with the True Way, Romulan story is about rebuilding themselves back up to full power and raising out of the Ashes like a Phoenix, some of us Romulans are even refusing D'Tan's offer of reunification and joined the Klingons, BTW Vulcan didn't need to have it's name changed but whatever, sorry getting off track, but back to my main point that a Cardassian Faction would just be a rehash of the Romulan one.
Cooperative with the Jem'Hadar/Dominion model seems to make the most sense for a new faction.
People really want to play Borg, it doesn't matter what rationales are speaking against it, such rationales are about as useful as saying "The Constitution class is obsolete and shouldn't be a viable endgame ship".
Cooperative is the compromise that most people can work with, I think.
There are probably still reasons not to do it for Cryptic, like that even if that might be the one where they expect the most people to be interested in, they might still not get an okay from CBS, they might find that the Borg ships don't work well for players because they are too big (Cubes) or look the same in every direction and thus become hard to steer or they simply don't think that a new faction is worth it. A Cooperative faction using Cubes and Spheres for example would be kinda competing with just putting these ships in a promo box.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
Cooperative with the Jem'Hadar/Dominion model seems to make the most sense for a new faction.
People really want to play Borg, it doesn't matter what rationales are speaking against it, such rationales are about as useful as saying "The Constitution class is obsolete and shouldn't be a viable endgame ship".
Honestly, I could write an entire thesis on the numerous cannon violations and discrepancies this game has. eg: did you at least hail that ship before you fired upon it? When did Lieutenants get to captain a dreadnaught? When did starfleet captains get to pick which ship they command? Slavery has been abolished, so why are people being traded on the auction house? If those liberties can be taken in order to make it work for an MMO, same can be done for playable Borg. There is no excuse for it not happening other than Cryptic either not wanting to do it or not having the time and resources to do it. Period. Every other excuse that has been posted has been pure B.S. Other games have had playable Borg and it worked just fine.
Cooperative is the compromise that most people can work with, I think.
There are probably still reasons not to do it for Cryptic, like that even if that might be the one where they expect the most people to be interested in, they might still not get an okay from CBS, they might find that the Borg ships don't work well for players because they are too big (Cubes) or look the same in every direction and thus become hard to steer or they simply don't think that a new faction is worth it. A Cooperative faction using Cubes and Spheres for example would be kinda competing with just putting these ships in a promo box.
I'm not that familiar with the cooperative as I got bored with the picard show by the fifth episode. I remember playing Borg ships in Starfleet Command 3. Steering did take some getting use to, but eventually it becomes second nature like any other ship.
Entire theses could be written about canon violations and discrepancies in Trek in general. No need to limit yourself to STO.
I will add, however, that it's likely not just a matter of whether Cryptic wants and is able to do it. CBS also needs to agree, probably. As those other games show indeed, that's probably not an issue though.
As, once again, there are plenty of canon violations anyway. All of which were accepted by CBS at some point. It's not like they really care about a possible discrepancy.
Entire theses could be written about canon violations and discrepancies in Trek in general. No need to limit yourself to STO.
I will add, however, that it's likely not just a matter of whether Cryptic wants and is able to do it. CBS also needs to agree, probably. As those other games show indeed, that's probably not an issue though.
As, once again, there are plenty of canon violations anyway. All of which were accepted by CBS at some point. It's not like they really care about a possible discrepancy.
Exactly
Canon went down the garbage shoot 11 years ago at launch. It's more important to have a Star Trek game that is fun for everyone, not just the uber trekkies who go ballistic when a warp nacelle doesn't look right.
All factions are is an origin story. The only two true factions are the UFP and KDF and they are only separated by the factional divide due to technical consequences of the game's core vision once being two opposing factions at war with each other. The game's core narrative no longer reflects that and actually embraces the idea of all players being on the same team. But it can't truly achieve that because of the hardcoded factionl divide that would take too much work to remove. Though they did mitigate it some by allowing everyone to fly any ship, regardless of its faction of origin.
well... allowing everyone to fly any ship, regardless of its faction of origin is stupid and it doesn't follow canon, I preferred it when Romulan ships were only exclusive to Romulans and Starfleet ships were only exclusive to the Federation characters, the only reason I don't have Elachi ships is because Elachi aren't playable and it wouldn't make sense to fly one as non-Elachi, I don't care what other people think but Canon matters to me.
All missions are now faction agnostic. so-called factions they add either automatically get rolled into one of the real factions, or there's a point where the player must choose one. If we are all going to get funneled into the same faction-aghnostic content anyway, then I would rather not get any additional origin stories. Just give us new races we can just play and let us get to playing.
That would be the best way to go, though I think it would be nice to have some sense of identity and difference between the various factions. Otherwise it gets to the point that it's a jumbled mess. For instance, it shouldn't have been that hard to keep jem hadar separate by having a Vorta giving out faction agnostic missions only. You start as a level 60 anyways so there wouldn't be a lack of story content to level up with for the player. That would be the sweet spot between both sides of the argument and it would allow Cryptic to continue adding to the game without stretching the budget too much.
Vorta seem to rub the devs the wrong way, they are sort of the Nova class of races in that they have been actively disparaged in livestreams, in this case called unfit to be a player race. They take the propaganda that Weyoun was spreading about Vorta being pitiful, weak, meek, nearly blind and only fit for being fancy butlers and maids literally even though the show firmly established that they were far more capable than that (in fact that they were the entire officer corps of the Dominion military).
Players have been asking the devs to flesh out the Dominion a little more with Vorta and some of the other races for years, and it has even led to a lot of resentment against DSC because it was (erroneously) seen as having cut ViL short, but the devs have shown a total lack of interest in doing that even though it would probably get a lot more people playing Dominion characters and therefor sell more Dominion ships, weapons, and costumes. For me and a lot of other players I have talked to the Gamma recruit event is just a time to a break from STO for instance.
While they haven't made quite as much in the way of negative comments about other requested races, the devs seem to be in no more of a hurry to put them in the game than they are with the much-maligned Vorta, so new playable races are probably a moot point if they are not even willing to flesh out the Dominion to the point where you could actually play it in a way similar to the canon setup, and that is doubly true for factions no matter how "lite" the implementation.
Vorta seem to rub the devs the wrong way, they are sort of the Nova class of races in that they have been actively disparaged in livestreams, in this case called unfit to be a player race. They take the propaganda that Weyoun was spreading about Vorta being pitiful, weak, meek, nearly blind and only fit for being fancy butlers and maids literally even though the show firmly established that they were far more capable than that (in fact that they were the entire officer corps of the Dominion military).
Players have been asking the devs to flesh out the Dominion a little more with Vorta and some of the other races for years, and it has even led to a lot of resentment against DSC because it was (erroneously) seen as having cut ViL short, but the devs have shown a total lack of interest in doing that even though it would probably get a lot more people playing Dominion characters and therefor sell more Dominion ships, weapons, and costumes. For me and a lot of other players I have talked to the Gamma recruit event is just a time to a break from STO for instance.
While they haven't made quite as much in the way of negative comments about other requested races, the devs seem to be in no more of a hurry to put them in the game than they are with the much-maligned Vorta, so new playable races are probably a moot point if they are not even willing to flesh out the Dominion to the point where you could actually play it in a way similar to the canon setup, and that is doubly true for factions no matter how "lite" the implementation.
Plus Weyoun seems pretty good with a gun, one shot an innocent Hurq, at the 31:00 mark BTW Video is not mine. https://youtu.be/J6ekF1yWB70?t=1864
I could see Terran defectors as a demi-faction, similar to Romulans. Your tutorial is about how you get into the Imperial Fleet, learn how they're even more corrupt than you thought, learn of the existence of the Prime timeline, and manage to defect to Starfleet. Then you're a lieutenant, because they don't really trust you yet, but you get a ship because they need your expertise. Add in some extra missions against the MU, similar in style to the Romulan missions to support the Republic even after choosing a side, and we're good.
It might work out for a standout episode or two like Quark's Lucky Seven but I don't think a lot of people really want to play the comic relief in the normal episodes that constitutes the bulk of the game, and there simply is no support for it since the player character in those is generally either all business or have a droll, dry humor (like the player's dialog with Modren in The 9th Rule.
Well, of course the Ferengi were always intended to be terrifying, with their powerful ships, energy whips...but the makeup didn't allow for that to stick. They looked hilarious and were then written to be.
You could still have a nice mix though...they have a military, they can be cunning, thieving and murderous, so a playable Moogi might be really interesting. Yeah, the humour, but also working to become a Damon.
I still say...a 23rd Century faction. The sets are all there, it's a terrible waste to lose the ability to be on the original ESD...so why not allow 23c characters to either pop back in time or be in some separate pocket of reality.
I could see Terran defectors as a demi-faction, similar to Romulans. Your tutorial is about how you get into the Imperial Fleet, learn how they're even more corrupt than you thought, learn of the existence of the Prime timeline, and manage to defect to Starfleet. Then you're a lieutenant, because they don't really trust you yet, but you get a ship because they need your expertise. Add in some extra missions against the MU, similar in style to the Romulan missions to support the Republic even after choosing a side, and we're good.
Personally I would give Terrans defectors the same treatment as DSC and TOS rather than the Republic or the Dominion, sure it's Imperial Starfleet but they're still Starfleet at the end of the day, also in what universe has Terrans teaming up with the Klingons.
Personally I would give Terrans defectors the same treatment as DSC and TOS rather than the Republic or the Dominion, sure it's Imperial Starfleet but they're still Starfleet at the end of the day, also in what universe has Terrans teaming up with the Klingons.
In one where the Terran Empire sees the strength of the other races?.. or you know .. the one that's happy to use them as cannon fodder?
It might work out for a standout episode or two like Quark's Lucky Seven but I don't think a lot of people really want to play the comic relief in the normal episodes that constitutes the bulk of the game, and there simply is no support for it since the player character in those is generally either all business or have a droll, dry humor (like the player's dialog with Modren in The 9th Rule.
Well, of course the Ferengi were always intended to be terrifying, with their powerful ships, energy whips...but the makeup didn't allow for that to stick.
Well, that and word is that by the time they came into being, Roddenberry had become enough of a Hollywood liberal that he thought the concept of a strictly capitalist race would be abhorrent in and of itself to his audience. Which, ah, turned out not to be the case.
Well, that and word is that by the time they came into being, Roddenberry had become enough of a Hollywood liberal that he thought the concept of a strictly capitalist race would be abhorrent in and of itself to his audience. Which, ah, turned out not to be the case.
The Ferengi were supposed to be based on modern humans which I find it ironic considering how Modern Humans have more in common with Tellarites than Ferengi these days, people are always starting arguments over every little thing, I'm being nice by comparing us to Tellarites since the other race that would fit modern humans perfectly would be the Pakleds, while it may seem rude personally that's how I view modern humanity as a whole.
I would personally like to see more of the delta quadrant expanded on par with the current sizes. Maybe a number of species form a new alliance there. So including playable co-operative, talaxians, turei, etc...include stories countering Voth aggression. Personally I would like to see the Talaxians retake the homeworld..check in with the ocampa etc.
There isn't going to be another faction. No Collective, no Terrans, no Cardassians. None of the above!
Now, that being said, if in fact that ever changes there is only one faction that would make any type of sense. A combined Lukari/Kentari faction set on the Colony World, perhaps with a new space dock added. Putting the focus on a faction race that was created solely for this content would be nice. And really, enemy faction? No, just wrong!
there is no need for a new faction...yet. they need to expand upon what they've built and make new episodes. the Klingon arc s good but now it seems like there are no bad guys in the universe. thru the story we have become allies with Klingon, Romulan, Borg to a point, 8472, Krenim, and now maybe mirror. they need to come up with a big bad to keep interest, and maybe have alternate levels with this something like Temporal agent or something. and expand the map to show more places to go and things to do.
Personally, I'd like to se a complete "go away" from the starting factions, making you start as a civilian of whatever species, seeking to go on your own ventures, trading, shipping and doing bounty hunts for factions, buying old hulls from ship depots and scrapyards.
While doing your thing, you find wrecked ships (or wreck them yourself) where you can salvage weapons and equipment from or buy from traders and chop-shops.
Along the way, you earn reputation towards the major factions (for example Klingon, Federation, Romulan republic, Romulan Tal'shiar, Cardassian civilian, Cardassian military, Dominion) and as you earn respect towards one faction, other factions views of you change, so say you befriend the Klingons, The federation will have a moderately positive view of you, while the Romulan Tal'shiar hate you and shoot first ask questions later.
If you reach top rep, you are offered full membership of the faction, and while not exactly a say, Starfleet member, you get access to faction hulls and equipment and missions tailored to that faction, while having to maintain a good rep towards it so you don't lose your benefits.
However, you can start focusing on say, as a mercenary Starfleet member to do missions that start to align you more with the dominion (however this is harder now that you a BFF's with the federation), and eventually join another faction.
OBVIOUSLY: this is a dream only, but I would personally like it.
Don't look silly... Don't call it the "Z-Store/Zen Store"...
Honestly, I do not want to level another faction toon. I have, for example, a "Terran" Starfleet captain. Fully equiped and happy with it. With a Terran faction I have to level it again re-farm all the eqipment....not really fun.
For Terrans and other, none racial factions, just make it possible to join. For Terrans for example you may need Terran traits as requisits. But one could do it for many factions.
GIVE US THANK YOU FOR GIVING US THE TYPHOON! Enough said...
I'm not convinced new factions even work...I genuinely believed with the Romulans that they were going to be a faction all of their own, but then we're faced with the "Choose your Faction". It was crushing for me at the time and I still don't understand why they put so much effort into New Romulus, so that they weren't even a Faction...just a playable Race.
Unless it's a whole new thing...A playable Cooperative Faction say, with a Delta Quadrant home world and no ESD etc, then there's not really any point to it.
Well, of course the Ferengi were always intended to be terrifying, with their powerful ships, energy whips...but the makeup didn't allow for that to stick. They looked hilarious and were then written to be.
You could still have a nice mix though...they have a military, they can be cunning, thieving and murderous, so a playable Moogi might be really interesting. Yeah, the humour, but also working to become a Damon.
Played/written right, the Ferengi can be a great faction. They'd have an aura of humor/genre satire about them, but in-universe could be rather scary, like Skaven in Warhammer Fantasy or Orcs in Warhammer 40k. They are somewhat goofy with lots of references and jabs but ultimately are dangerous and ruthless powers. Ferengi ships are either pirate vessels or trading ships ferrying very valuable cargo, in both cases they'd be heavily armed and defended. And while your rin-of-the-mill Ferengi trader may be a 'weak' character, screaming at danger and running away, their Captains, marauders and raiders wouldn't be. They'd make up for their small frame with technology and numbers in ground combat and their ships are already quite powerful.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
I'm not convinced new factions even work...I genuinely believed with the Romulans that they were going to be a faction all of their own, but then we're faced with the "Choose your Faction". It was crushing for me at the time and I still don't understand why they put so much effort into New Romulus, so that they weren't even a Faction...just a playable Race.
Unless it's a whole new thing...A playable Cooperative Faction say, with a Delta Quadrant home world and no ESD etc, then there's not really any point to it.
At least the Romulans picking a side made sense storywise since they needed resources at the time, they probably would get the full faction treatment if JJ didn't blow up Romulus, God I wish Picard season 2 would undo JJ's mess aka the destruction of Romulus and Remus with their time travel story.
I'm not convinced new factions even work...I genuinely believed with the Romulans that they were going to be a faction all of their own, but then we're faced with the "Choose your Faction". It was crushing for me at the time and I still don't understand why they put so much effort into New Romulus, so that they weren't even a Faction...just a playable Race.
Unless it's a whole new thing...A playable Cooperative Faction say, with a Delta Quadrant home world and no ESD etc, then there's not really any point to it.
At least the Romulans picking a side made sense storywise since they needed resources at the time, they probably would get the full faction treatment if JJ didn't blow up Romulus, God I wish Picard season 2 would undo JJ's mess aka the destruction of Romulus and Remus with their time travel story.
I doubt they could have made a third full faction for technical reasons, the engine was originally designed for a superhero game with only heroes and villains, the classic red vs. blue setup. And the devs have said it was hardcoded for only two factions so that would mean pretty much writing a whole new engine which is not at all practical to do, especially at this late date.
Comments
People really want to play Borg, it doesn't matter what rationales are speaking against it, such rationales are about as useful as saying "The Constitution class is obsolete and shouldn't be a viable endgame ship".
Cooperative is the compromise that most people can work with, I think.
There are probably still reasons not to do it for Cryptic, like that even if that might be the one where they expect the most people to be interested in, they might still not get an okay from CBS, they might find that the Borg ships don't work well for players because they are too big (Cubes) or look the same in every direction and thus become hard to steer or they simply don't think that a new faction is worth it. A Cooperative faction using Cubes and Spheres for example would be kinda competing with just putting these ships in a promo box.
Star Trek Armada
Star Trek Armada 2
Starfleet Command 3
I'm not that familiar with the cooperative as I got bored with the picard show by the fifth episode. I remember playing Borg ships in Starfleet Command 3. Steering did take some getting use to, but eventually it becomes second nature like any other ship.
I will add, however, that it's likely not just a matter of whether Cryptic wants and is able to do it. CBS also needs to agree, probably. As those other games show indeed, that's probably not an issue though.
As, once again, there are plenty of canon violations anyway. All of which were accepted by CBS at some point. It's not like they really care about a possible discrepancy.
Exactly
Canon went down the garbage shoot 11 years ago at launch. It's more important to have a Star Trek game that is fun for everyone, not just the uber trekkies who go ballistic when a warp nacelle doesn't look right.
Starfleet Command 3
Star Trek Armada
Star Trek Armada 2
Other games did playable Borg and did it very well. Surely STO can do what twenty year old games can.
well... allowing everyone to fly any ship, regardless of its faction of origin is stupid and it doesn't follow canon, I preferred it when Romulan ships were only exclusive to Romulans and Starfleet ships were only exclusive to the Federation characters, the only reason I don't have Elachi ships is because Elachi aren't playable and it wouldn't make sense to fly one as non-Elachi, I don't care what other people think but Canon matters to me.
That would be the best way to go, though I think it would be nice to have some sense of identity and difference between the various factions. Otherwise it gets to the point that it's a jumbled mess. For instance, it shouldn't have been that hard to keep jem hadar separate by having a Vorta giving out faction agnostic missions only. You start as a level 60 anyways so there wouldn't be a lack of story content to level up with for the player. That would be the sweet spot between both sides of the argument and it would allow Cryptic to continue adding to the game without stretching the budget too much.
Players have been asking the devs to flesh out the Dominion a little more with Vorta and some of the other races for years, and it has even led to a lot of resentment against DSC because it was (erroneously) seen as having cut ViL short, but the devs have shown a total lack of interest in doing that even though it would probably get a lot more people playing Dominion characters and therefor sell more Dominion ships, weapons, and costumes. For me and a lot of other players I have talked to the Gamma recruit event is just a time to a break from STO for instance.
While they haven't made quite as much in the way of negative comments about other requested races, the devs seem to be in no more of a hurry to put them in the game than they are with the much-maligned Vorta, so new playable races are probably a moot point if they are not even willing to flesh out the Dominion to the point where you could actually play it in a way similar to the canon setup, and that is doubly true for factions no matter how "lite" the implementation.
Plus Weyoun seems pretty good with a gun, one shot an innocent Hurq, at the 31:00 mark BTW Video is not mine.
Well, of course the Ferengi were always intended to be terrifying, with their powerful ships, energy whips...but the makeup didn't allow for that to stick. They looked hilarious and were then written to be.
You could still have a nice mix though...they have a military, they can be cunning, thieving and murderous, so a playable Moogi might be really interesting. Yeah, the humour, but also working to become a Damon.
Personally I would give Terrans defectors the same treatment as DSC and TOS rather than the Republic or the Dominion, sure it's Imperial Starfleet but they're still Starfleet at the end of the day, also in what universe has Terrans teaming up with the Klingons.
In one where the Terran Empire sees the strength of the other races?.. or you know .. the one that's happy to use them as cannon fodder?
The Ferengi were supposed to be based on modern humans which I find it ironic considering how Modern Humans have more in common with Tellarites than Ferengi these days, people are always starting arguments over every little thing, I'm being nice by comparing us to Tellarites since the other race that would fit modern humans perfectly would be the Pakleds, while it may seem rude personally that's how I view modern humanity as a whole.
Now, that being said, if in fact that ever changes there is only one faction that would make any type of sense. A combined Lukari/Kentari faction set on the Colony World, perhaps with a new space dock added. Putting the focus on a faction race that was created solely for this content would be nice. And really, enemy faction? No, just wrong!
While doing your thing, you find wrecked ships (or wreck them yourself) where you can salvage weapons and equipment from or buy from traders and chop-shops.
Along the way, you earn reputation towards the major factions (for example Klingon, Federation, Romulan republic, Romulan Tal'shiar, Cardassian civilian, Cardassian military, Dominion) and as you earn respect towards one faction, other factions views of you change, so say you befriend the Klingons, The federation will have a moderately positive view of you, while the Romulan Tal'shiar hate you and shoot first ask questions later.
If you reach top rep, you are offered full membership of the faction, and while not exactly a say, Starfleet member, you get access to faction hulls and equipment and missions tailored to that faction, while having to maintain a good rep towards it so you don't lose your benefits.
However, you can start focusing on say, as a mercenary Starfleet member to do missions that start to align you more with the dominion (however this is harder now that you a BFF's with the federation), and eventually join another faction.
OBVIOUSLY: this is a dream only, but I would personally like it.
For Terrans and other, none racial factions, just make it possible to join. For Terrans for example you may need Terran traits as requisits. But one could do it for many factions.
Terran as half-faction of them.
Unless it's a whole new thing...A playable Cooperative Faction say, with a Delta Quadrant home world and no ESD etc, then there's not really any point to it.
Played/written right, the Ferengi can be a great faction. They'd have an aura of humor/genre satire about them, but in-universe could be rather scary, like Skaven in Warhammer Fantasy or Orcs in Warhammer 40k. They are somewhat goofy with lots of references and jabs but ultimately are dangerous and ruthless powers. Ferengi ships are either pirate vessels or trading ships ferrying very valuable cargo, in both cases they'd be heavily armed and defended. And while your rin-of-the-mill Ferengi trader may be a 'weak' character, screaming at danger and running away, their Captains, marauders and raiders wouldn't be. They'd make up for their small frame with technology and numbers in ground combat and their ships are already quite powerful.
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I doubt they could have made a third full faction for technical reasons, the engine was originally designed for a superhero game with only heroes and villains, the classic red vs. blue setup. And the devs have said it was hardcoded for only two factions so that would mean pretty much writing a whole new engine which is not at all practical to do, especially at this late date.