question about the Terran Empire

jjotterbear · September 2020

I struggle to see how the Terran Empire is any match for the Federation. The Terran Empire is isolationist and xenophobic. They have no alien alliances. Their forces should be far outnumbered by the Federation who has hundreds of alien alliances.

So what makes them such a match for the Federation? Do they have better tech because they take it from others? Do they produce ships more efficiently that the Federation does? Because, and maybe my math is just bad, but given the vastness of the Federation, it should be able to wipe the floor with a single isolationist entity like the Empire without issue.

Or maybe its because we face them in incursions and not as a full force. I don't know, thoughts?

vetteguy904 · September 2020

well, first, a dictatorial govt can often be much more efficient industry-wise, look at Germany from 1935-42. they went from a broken and beaten country to one of the most powerful in a decade or 2.
Second, Leeta states she got future tech, though it's never used against us. third, the Terrans have spies among us, otherwise how did they get the Enterprise-F designs? and finally, not only do they have the resources of the federation, they control how those resources are used. instead of the ships Risa have made for us, they may have been building Sovereigns, or Defiants or MW Intrepids. someone somewhere are building a metric but-ton of Nebula's that's for sure

gaevsman · September 2020

somtaawkhar wrote: »

The Terran Empire has focused on nothing but conquest for hundreds of years. They were able to defeat and enslave the Vulans, Andorian, Tellarites, Bajorans, and Betazoids(among others). They have renderd the Klingon homeworld uninhabitable, crushed and enslaved the Romulan Star Empire. Their drive for conquest has allowed them to explore beyond what the Federation has ever dared to.

They have also gotten influxes of technology from the Prime Universe. First the Constitution class USS Defiant, which wound up in the Mirror Universe's Enterprise Era. Later again during the DS9 era, where they got the Defiant from the Prime Universe. And in STO's time, Noye, aka Future Guy, aka the Envoy, has given the Terran Empire(specifically Leeta) tech from around 50 years in the future, making Terran ships noticeably better then those of the Federation.

On top of that, Leeta herself has been infused by the Pah-Wraiths, giving her otherworldly powers. And the Mirror Emperor is stated to have bizarre, god-like, powers himself. Which is why no one has been able to overthrow him.

DOFF missions one could get from the Terran/Mirror Universe lockboxes state that the Terran Empire has crushed all known resistance, and even the Mirror Universe Dominion is afraid of them. Leeta also used time travel to wipe out the Iconians in the past, preventing the Iconian War from ever happening in the Mirror Universe. The Terran Empire lost none of its fleet in the process, while the Alliance lost over half of its fleet during the war in the Prime Universe.

I'm pretty sure the Emperor is the PC, we have godly powers!, and never die!

disqord · September 2020

jjotterbear#7583 wrote: »

then there is this from Memory Alpha:

"T'Pol's prediction to Archer regarding the Terran Empire's downfall proved to be prophetic. By the 24th century in the mirror universe, the Terran Empire was destroyed by the Klingon-Cardassian Alliance, and most Terrans were enslaved."

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/T'Pol_(mirror)

I wonder if this will ever be depicted in game or in some other media.

This is one of the reasons I don't like the Terran Empire in STO. Once the Prime TOS guys convinced the Mirror Spock to be cool, the point was the Terrans chilled out, but got curbstomped by an alliance of people they suddenly stopped being as bad to. DS9's Mirror Terrans are actually supposed to be the heroes, so I find it kinda annoying that STO decides to revert them to their RIDICULOUSLY EDGY eyepatch-goatee black and red and so unbelievably "cool" people they were in Enterprise and TOS.

vetteguy904 · September 2020

let alone that all these people had counterparts. depending on where you think the divergence takes place (first contact?) the odds of all those people's families were untouched by a different government, military service, etc. ESPECIALLY the Dax's. both Jadzia AND Ezri were alive in that timeline? very unlikely unless Captain Kirk shows up and they sit there and squeak "surrender".. and let's not even go to Spock... Vucan was CONQUERED, sarek would never have been ambassador to Earth let alone meet a schoolteacher named Greyson..

andrewndb · September 2020

The Terran Empire had the tech benefit of a 100 year head start (the Defiant arriving in the 22nd century from the 23rd).

szerontzur · September 2020

Maybe I'm not nerding out enough, but I just view the Mirror Universe as a cosmic constant/counterpart. Like a distorted reflection in the water, whatever happens in the Prime Universe is perversely echoed in the Mirror Universe(s) - or vice-versa.

andrewndb · September 2020

szerontzur wrote: »

Maybe I'm not nerding out enough, but I just view the Mirror Universe as a cosmic constant/counterpart. Like a distorted reflection in the water, whatever happens in the Prime Universe is perversely echoed in the Mirror Universe(s) - or vice-versa.

Kind of has to be like that. Otherwise the Mirror Universe is pretty contrived... like, Ben Sisko and Jennifer Sisko never had Jake in the Mirror Universe... but Ben Sisko and Jennifer Sisko were born on the same date as the regular ones were, with the same parents? And so on, and so on. I mean, these universes aren't just SLIGHTLY off, they're worlds apart but we still get the same people at the same times, pretty much.

smokebailey · September 2020

They ravage other races, pillage and plunder what survives. And there are no treaty of Algerons or so on to 'get in their way'.

I feel the Kelvin verse could have made for good Terran Empire material, especially when the Defiant showed up in a mirror darkly....better than a Borgified Red Dwarf in the least.

rattler2 · September 2020

I think they had a couple comics that delved into alternate Kelvin Timelines. One with everyones gender reversed, and one with the Mirror Universe. Apparently Mirror Khan was a peaceful individual.

Also... Jane Kirk meeting James Kirk was a bit awkward. Jim was like "wut?"

phoenixc · September 2020

corinthalas wrote: »

disqord#9557 wrote: »

jjotterbear#7583 wrote: »

then there is this from Memory Alpha:

"T'Pol's prediction to Archer regarding the Terran Empire's downfall proved to be prophetic. By the 24th century in the mirror universe, the Terran Empire was destroyed by the Klingon-Cardassian Alliance, and most Terrans were enslaved."

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/T'Pol_(mirror)

I wonder if this will ever be depicted in game or in some other media.

This is one of the reasons I don't like the Terran Empire in STO. Once the Prime TOS guys convinced the Mirror Spock to be cool, the point was the Terrans chilled out, but got curbstomped by an alliance of people they suddenly stopped being as bad to. DS9's Mirror Terrans are actually supposed to be the heroes, so I find it kinda annoying that STO decides to revert them to their RIDICULOUSLY EDGY eyepatch-goatee black and red and so unbelievably "cool" people they were in Enterprise and TOS.

The Terran Empire showed 'weakness' and paid a steep price for it. What exactly did you think was going to be their response after freeing themselves? Live and let...live as slaves? *HELL* no. They were going to back-pedal and get some payback. These people have a long history of warfare and crushing their enemies. They were given an object lesson in why their way was so successful. Of course they're going to go back to them.

It wasn't so much that the empire "showed weakness" as it was that Spock's movement and reactions against it fragmented the empire to the point that the others could come in and defeat them in detail. If they had simply mellowed out without the fragmentation the others would never have attacked, and if they did anyway (which would make no sense) they would not have succeeded.

thay8472 · September 2020

reyan01 wrote: »

I FAR prefer the approach the novels took to the MU over STO's to be honest.

Unlike their idiotic STO counterparts the Terrans (in the novels) actually learnt from the mistakes of their ancestors. They very probably learnt something from being on the receiving end of the sort of treatment their ancestors were so fond of dishing out too. Therefore once they freed themselves from the Klingon-Cardassian Alliance they founded a Federation-like organisation called the Galactic Commonwealth.

Letting Mirror Spock disarm your Empire while your enemies continue to be a threat was the mistake.

question about the Terran Empire

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