Reading what you've written, OP. It seems that you're looking for an entirely different game. You may want to try out an RTS or 4x game.
No... I am looking for branches to THIS game that add depth, drawing from elements that are implied throughout every Star Trek series that has ever aired. But I know that if it isn't monetized, it won't be prioritized. That is why I say I would be willing to pay to unlock this or any other path that adds depth.
And in my mind, there would be a meta game in the core game that would draw from resultant elements from these paths. Otherwise, the gameplay loops involved will have no more meaning than rerunning the same patrol missions or story arcs over and over.
PWE doesn't seem to be interested in adding depth though. New systems tend to be shallow representations of something grander that we'll never get. Admiralty, doffing, fleet holdings (outside of the actual TFO and colony simulations), R&D etc all amount to basically tons of mouse clicks.
Anything new would likely be similarly shallow in scope. By that I mean, not actual story or content to play but just a new page in addition to admiralty and doffing that we just "click stuff" on and get our rewards after 20 hours are finished counting down. Sad but true.
When you see "TRIBBLE" in my posts, it's because I manually typed "TRIBBLE" and censored myself.
PWE doesn't seem to be interested in adding depth though. New systems tend to be shallow representations of something grander that we'll never get. Admiralty, doffing, fleet holdings (outside of the actual TFO and colony simulations), R&D etc all amount to basically tons of mouse clicks.
Anything new would likely be similarly shallow in scope. By that I mean, not actual story or content to play but just a new page in addition to admiralty and doffing that we just "click stuff" on and get our rewards after 20 hours are finished counting down. Sad but true.
PWE has nothing to do with how the systems in the game turn out, since PWE has nothing to do with writing the code that makes up those systems. ...
Reading what you've written, OP. It seems that you're looking for an entirely different game. You may want to try out an RTS or 4x game.
No... I am looking for branches to THIS game that add depth, drawing from elements that are implied throughout every Star Trek series that has ever aired. But I know that if it isn't monetized, it won't be prioritized. That is why I say I would be willing to pay to unlock this or any other path that adds depth.
And in my mind, there would be a meta game in the core game that would draw from resultant elements from these paths. Otherwise, the gameplay loops involved will have no more meaning than rerunning the same patrol missions or story arcs over and over.
They could do something like that, but it would almost certainly require an entirely new engine to build the game on because features like those go way, way beyond anything a minigame could handle. And a game as old and established as STO is not something to take a gamble like that with lightly.
Short of that, to keep the original game intact it would be a case of (ideally seamless behind the scenes) exiting the current game and entering an entirely new, built-from-scratch game with a translated character model and stats, doing whatever is available in the new game, then exiting the new one to go back to the old one for the traditional stuff. Keeping two systems like that synched would be a horrendous headache, probably worse than the problems they were having with the Foundry.
Of course, they could expand admiralty and doffing out into a more complex card game or something with industrialization, empire building, and whatnot without totally rebuilding the current game from scratch, but I think that is not the kind of thing most players come to STO for.
They could do something like that, but it would almost certainly require an entirely new engine to build the game on because features like those go way, way beyond anything a minigame could handle. And a game as old and established as STO is not something to take a gamble like that with lightly.
I think the more pressing issue is not whether the game engine could handle it, but how it would realistically fit into their development budget(see sir's post directly above yours). I mean, this game survives on 2 simple(to explain) things:
1: selling people new ships.
2: giving people new missions (episodes/TFOs) to play with those new ships they just bought.
That's it. That is literally how this game makes it's money to pay it's employees and keep going. So the question is, how do you fit developing the system the OP wants into the development budget without slowing/hurting the development of the 2 absolutely fundamental (to the game's survival) items mentioned above?
I guess you could make the argument that the system that the OP wants could take the place of some of the new episodes/TFOs in giving people things to do with those new ships. But I should probably add that what most people want to do with those new ships is BLOW THINGS UP, not scan anomalies.
Having said all that, I'll say this: I would love this game to have an exploration system. But sadly, I know it's not going to happen for the reasons already mentioned. Now, if you want to "fight the good fight" and keep asking for one until the day the game finally shuts down; that's fine. I'm not saying you should stop. By all means, ask for the things you want.
Could Cryptic do it? Sure. Is there any reason for them to want to? Especially with how awful it would be? Not really.
I don't really think they actually could do it. Like I don't think they have what it takes to pull it off. That might sound like a knock against them but it's not meant to be. Because even if they could pull it off, it likely wouldn't be profitable so there's almost no chance that they'll even try. Hence what I was saying to the OP before. If what you want, in the end, is an entirely different game. Then you're better off just finding that different game.
Sometimes while playing STO, I get the "itch" to fully command a fleet or colonize a planet or whatever. When this happens, I play BoTF or Sins of a Solar Empire or whatever else scratches that itch. Cause STO isn't that game and never will be.
When you see "TRIBBLE" in my posts, it's because I manually typed "TRIBBLE" and censored myself.
So, I think its worth talking about what you've proposed, since no one else has chosen to go into too much detail about what it is you seem to want and how well it might work in STO, besides what somtaawkhar has already mentioned.
First off, I wanna give my opinion on what I think you're trying to get at with an expansion of game systems here. Let's take exploration, how it worked in the series, how we know it works between the Federation, Klingons, Romulans and Dominion, and how I think you might want it to go.
Okay so exploration in the series was usually geared towards a focus with Starfleet vessels, where they would be visiting a new planet, discovering something was not right, spend the episode working to find a solution to what wasn't right, and then go on their way to their next destination once it was done, rarely ever taking the time to revisit the same place on screen. For Klingons, we know that rather than peaceful cooperation with a species, the Klingon approach was to conquer them and fold the planet under Klingon authority. Romulans presented themselves as an Empire as well, looking to expand their territory, while doing what they could to avoid if anything, anyone that wasn't a Romulan. The Romulan Republic's stance on exploration seemed to be a push to expanding their borders as well as acquisition of resources needed to build their influence. As for the Dominion, we know that historically, their stance on exploration was always from a point that they did everything in their power protect to their borders from solids. With the events that have transpired following the Hur'q, they're more willing to work with the Alliance.
Now, in the game with the old exploration system, it functioned much like the show did in terms of exploring a particular system, doing whatever was required to complete it, and we left, never able to revisit the same system again. If we happened to come across a system for anomaly scanning, we'd get materials in which we could put towards use in the old crafting system. I believe you want to have us return to something like this, where we harvest materials we may find while exploring a system. The question is, do you want an exploration system to be generated and retained or generated and reset after the encounter is done?
Moving on, lets talk about what I think it is you want from the other two systems you want to see happen, colonization and industrialization. What I think you're trying to get at with colonization is an approach that you help set up a new colony and over time, they develop resources that go to help develop things within the game. Am I right on this part?
Industrialization is the one thing I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around, because the way you worded it, that part sounds like you might want to replace inputs that we have now and possibly provide an alternate means to build ships. I don't know what you have in mind honestly, considering that everything you stated, for the most part we have already, except for building starships.
- Station construction: We have the Fleet Starbases which we develop with the help of others
- Mining installations: We already have this in the form of the Fleet mine.
Some clarification would be great here.
Now, going back to what you've repeatedly stated, you would be willing to pay to advance stuff. As I have already stated before, cryptic has NEVER made any of their systems in which you had to pay real money to advance any of it. Every system was created to always be free and never had any means of paying real money to advance, at least not directly. For example, leveling up and specialization you could buy experience boosters which increased the amount of experience points you earn. Outside of the Jem'hadar who start at level 60 by design choice, you cannot spend zen to bypass the leveling process with any other character, like what I heard is possible in other games. I get that you said paying to advance is your way of providing a means of monetization, but paying to advance one kind of system really clashes with the rest of STO's systems in my opinion.
SPOCK: One degree to overlap. Stand by to photograph. Now. BAILEY: Three days of this now, sir. Other ships must have made star maps of some of this. SPOCK: Negative, Lieutenant. We are the first to reach this far.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
They could do something like that, but it would almost certainly require an entirely new engine to build the game on because features like those go way, way beyond anything a minigame could handle. And a game as old and established as STO is not something to take a gamble like that with lightly.
I think the more pressing issue is not whether the game engine could handle it, but how it would realistically fit into their development budget(see sir's post directly above yours). I mean, this game survives on 2 simple(to explain) things:
1: selling people new ships.
2: giving people new missions (episodes/TFOs) to play with those new ships they just bought.
That's it. That is literally how this game makes it's money to pay it's employees and keep going. So the question is, how do you fit developing the system the OP wants into the development budget without slowing/hurting the development of the 2 absolutely fundamental (to the game's survival) items mentioned above?
I guess you could make the argument that the system that the OP wants could take the place of some of the new episodes/TFOs in giving people things to do with those new ships. But I should probably add that what most people want to do with those new ships is BLOW THINGS UP, not scan anomalies.
Having said all that, I'll say this: I would love this game to have an exploration system. But sadly, I know it's not going to happen for the reasons already mentioned. Now, if you want to "fight the good fight" and keep asking for one until the day the game finally shuts down; that's fine. I'm not saying you should stop. By all means, ask for the things you want.
Your post is well worded and includes a healthy dose of realism.
Part of me still wants to still "fight the good fight" but at times it seems easier to be thankful for the enjoyment and entertainment STO has provided through the years.
I wish Cryptic had 10 times the staff and 100 times the budget to bring everybody's dreams to reality because hey, this is Star Trek and Star Trek Online, but sometimes wishes end up getting filed under "dreams".
IMHO I do think that a portion of these requests may stem from a lack of end-game depth and/or challenge for some but would have to concede that it's likely not possible to keep all players completely satisfied forever.
Even after reading your words though there's still part of me that wants to shout "but this game could be so much more". Maybe it's only natural to have thoughts like this for something you're passionate about.
People didn't want to pay for access before which is why STO went F2P. And I doubt they'll pay for access to a new system in 2020. Simply slapping a pay wall on it and calling that "monetization" isn't much of a plan. Especially if not enough people are willing to actually pay for it. And driving away the rest of your potential customers that aren't willing to pay but might otherwise spend smaller amounts is a bad idea.
Bottom line when it comes to systems and story content is it's all loss leaders to get you to play the game in the hopes that a certain percentage will eventually spend money. And many people that think they'll never spend anything eventually cave and start spending a little here and there. But they can't get to that point if you confront them with an up front pay wall that they're likely to turn down before they've been hooked into continuing to play and (for some) eventually pay.
When you see "TRIBBLE" in my posts, it's because I manually typed "TRIBBLE" and censored myself.
Now, going back to what you've repeatedly stated, you would be willing to pay to advance stuff. As I have already stated before, cryptic has NEVER made any of their systems in which you had to pay real money to advance any of it. Every system was created to always be free and never had any means of paying real money to advance, at least not directly. For example, leveling up and specialization you could buy experience boosters which increased the amount of experience points you earn. Outside of the Jem'hadar who start at level 60 by design choice, you cannot spend zen to bypass the leveling process with any other character, like what I heard is possible in other games. I get that you said paying to advance is your way of providing a means of monetization, but paying to advance one kind of system really clashes with the rest of STO's systems in my opinion.
I will address the other points, but I want to start with this. We have a game that is stagnating. We may get new narrative content, but the activities we do in conjunction with it amounts to nothing more than Pew Pew Pew, blow everything up and kill everyone for the win. THAT is not Star Trek. I get it that is all that Cryptic has been able to include, and so long as the lockbox keys keep selling, PWE doesn't really care. I don't like the idea that if I ever want to see the Star Trek universe, as both presented and implied throughout over half a century of TV Shows and movies at least approximated in a game with the potential scope of an MMO, I need to wait for a new game to be made. or go play some other game.
Exploration is part of the Star Trek universe. Why cannot it be part of STO
Colonization is part of the Star Trek universe. Why cannot it be part of STO
Industrialization is part of the Star Trek universe. Why cannot it be part of STO
In STO the solution to everything is kill it or blow it up.
In STO not every issue was resolved with phasers or photon torpedo's.
I know that everything about this game involving actual gameplay has been free. And ever since the game went Free to play, there has been no meaningful gameplay loops added. They've been removed though. That being the case, the only hope that new gameplay loops will be added is contingent on them being monetized. Otherwise, PWE will not allocate additional funding for the increase in staff that will be needed to make it happen. So I stand by my statement that I am willing to pay to unlock gameplay branches if there were gameplay branches I could pay to unlock.
I'm sure that they can find other ways to monetize. But if it cannot generate revenue, then PWE is not going to authorize it. This game has always been just a shell of what it could be. I'd like to see it strive to reach the potential I know it still has...
I will address the other points in a bit. I need to get some sleep in the meantime
Night everyone...
I feel in order for Exploration to be worthwhile in STO, you have to balance it so that there's stuff to explore and not make it feel like you're getting repetitive content given how many people play and how fast stuff is usually consumed by players.
Colonization like the way you think it should work for the game isn't how it usually worked in the series. You wanna be able to micromanage the development of a colony right? Where to put it, what resources they need to produce etc. That's something that has usually a higher up power, and Starship Captains (in Starfleet at least) are told to go to a planet with a contingent of colonists and help them set it up. Obviously, our character is an Admiral, but in terms of gameplay, he's an Admiral/Dahar Master/Honored First in rank only as he/she functions more like a Captain.
I'll refrain from the third part as I wanna see what you say.
I will address the other points, but I want to start with this. We have a game that is stagnating. We may get new narrative content, but the activities we do in conjunction with it amounts to nothing more than Pew Pew Pew, blow everything up and kill everyone for the win. THAT is not Star Trek.
This reminded me that the vast majority of Star Trek (and Trek-adjacent) games I've ever run across (X-trek, Star Fleet Battles, Elite Force, etc), has been about blowing stuff up.
Industrialization is part of the Star Trek universe. Why cannot it be part of STO
Can you explain what you mean by this, because I can't think of any examples from the shows & movies I've watched.
And re: "Exploration" - exploration in the shows was, as mentioned, the standard "episode of the week" style thing. Go somewhere, find (or cause) a problem, solve the problem - sometimes by talking, sometimes by blowing stuff up. We have plenty of that in this game - it's called Episodes.
Because STO is a game portrayal of the Star Trek TV shows, not a Star Trek life simulator ala The Sims: Star Trek Edition.
Colonization and Industrialization were never major parts of the star Trek TV shows, and exploration was really only the focus on TOS and ENT. TNG was a political show, DS9 and Discovery were war shows, Voyager was a show about people lost in space.
And all of this discussion has reminded me of another super-core feature of the Star Trek TV shows that this game is sorely lacking. My Captain hasn't slept with a single Green Skinned Space Babe! WTF, STO? Where's my Star Trek?
I will address the other points, but I want to start with this. We have a game that is stagnating. We may get new narrative content, but the activities we do in conjunction with it amounts to nothing more than Pew Pew Pew, blow everything up and kill everyone for the win. THAT is not Star Trek.
This reminded me that the vast majority of Star Trek (and Trek-adjacent) games I've ever run across (X-trek, Star Fleet Battles, Elite Force, etc), has been about blowing stuff up.
Industrialization is part of the Star Trek universe. Why cannot it be part of STO
Can you explain what you mean by this, because I can't think of any examples from the shows & movies I've watched.
And re: "Exploration" - exploration in the shows was, as mentioned, the standard "episode of the week" style thing. Go somewhere, find (or cause) a problem, solve the problem - sometimes by talking, sometimes by blowing stuff up. We have plenty of that in this game - it's called Episodes.
Because STO is a game portrayal of the Star Trek TV shows, not a Star Trek life simulator ala The Sims: Star Trek Edition.
Colonization and Industrialization were never major parts of the star Trek TV shows, and exploration was really only the focus on TOS and ENT. TNG was a political show, DS9 and Discovery were war shows, Voyager was a show about people lost in space.
And all of this discussion has reminded me of another super-core feature of the Star Trek TV shows that this game is sorely lacking. My Captain hasn't slept with a single Green Skinned Space Babe! WTF, STO? Where's my Star Trek?
fun fact there is one girl of the week in sto, the tal'shiar true believer in the romulan only missions. she is of course tovan's girl of the week.
if I stop posting it doesn't make you right it. just means I don't have enough rum to continue interacting with you.
I really liked the storyline mission Echoes of Light from the "New Frontiers" Story arc and the whole story arc of "Cold War" with the Breen, Deferi, and Preservers. The exploration, learning about ancient civilizations, and first contact aspects of these were totally enjoyable to me. The other story lines of political struggle, outright combat, and time travel, are good, but my personal preference is what you get from "New Frontiers" and the "Cold War" material.
Building a whole story arc with main focus of exploration and first contact would be a great addition to the mix. Solving puzzles and putting together clues from exploration would be fun for a change, rather than phaser you way to get to the end of the mission.
And all of this discussion has reminded me of another super-core feature of the Star Trek TV shows that this game is sorely lacking. My Captain hasn't slept with a single Green Skinned Space Babe! WTF, STO? Where's my Star Trek?
This brings an intresting question my main captain is female so would she have "girl of the week" or "boy of the week"
Though, I am right there with you. This game definitely needs more depth. I haven't played anything more than events and new missions since I finished leveling my Temporal recruit way back when (since Gamma recruit was only a short uninvolved leveling process). I am not sure these are the answers but any discussion of and implementation of depth would be very welcome imo.
Although, I am probably in the minority with this opinion, I believe the lack of a true trinity makes implementing anything other than pew pew doomed to fail.
So, I just keep logging in for 20-30 minutes a day and doing the never ending event treadmill until I finally get completely bored or the game ends. Again, another unpopular opinion but I miss the days of the Iconian war when we got featured episodes we had to do for three weeks to get all of the cool rewards. Yeah it was a bit boring after the second week but monthly featured episodes were at least some story expansion to look forward to.
I would very much like to see an expansion of the R&D/crafting system. Increase the number of unique items only craftable at the maximum tier for each R&D school. Increase the R&D tier cap to 20 and add the ability to craft upgrade modifiers (that are character or accound bound) as well as better upgrades. How about craftable weapon sets (energy, projectile, console) and craftable equipment sets for both ground (weapon, shield, armour, maybe even a 4-piece with kit frames) and space (I know there is already one for space, but it is really out of date).
Now, going back to what you've repeatedly stated, you would be willing to pay to advance stuff. As I have already stated before, cryptic has NEVER made any of their systems in which you had to pay real money to advance any of it. Every system was created to always be free and never had any means of paying real money to advance, at least not directly. For example, leveling up and specialization you could buy experience boosters which increased the amount of experience points you earn. Outside of the Jem'hadar who start at level 60 by design choice, you cannot spend zen to bypass the leveling process with any other character, like what I heard is possible in other games. I get that you said paying to advance is your way of providing a means of monetization, but paying to advance one kind of system really clashes with the rest of STO's systems in my opinion.
I will address the other points, but I want to start with this. We have a game that is stagnating. We may get new narrative content, but the activities we do in conjunction with it amounts to nothing more than Pew Pew Pew, blow everything up and kill everyone for the win. THAT is not Star Trek. I get it that is all that Cryptic has been able to include, and so long as the lockbox keys keep selling, PWE doesn't really care. I don't like the idea that if I ever want to see the Star Trek universe, as both presented and implied throughout over half a century of TV Shows and movies at least approximated in a game with the potential scope of an MMO, I need to wait for a new game to be made. or go play some other game.
Exploration is part of the Star Trek universe. Why cannot it be part of STO
Colonization is part of the Star Trek universe. Why cannot it be part of STO
Industrialization is part of the Star Trek universe. Why cannot it be part of STO
In STO the solution to everything is kill it or blow it up.
In STO not every issue was resolved with phasers or photon torpedo's.
I know that everything about this game involving actual gameplay has been free. And ever since the game went Free to play, there has been no meaningful gameplay loops added. They've been removed though. That being the case, the only hope that new gameplay loops will be added is contingent on them being monetized. Otherwise, PWE will not allocate additional funding for the increase in staff that will be needed to make it happen. So I stand by my statement that I am willing to pay to unlock gameplay branches if there were gameplay branches I could pay to unlock.
I'm sure that they can find other ways to monetize. But if it cannot generate revenue, then PWE is not going to authorize it. This game has always been just a shell of what it could be. I'd like to see it strive to reach the potential I know it still has...
I will address the other points in a bit. I need to get some sleep in the meantime
Night everyone...
I feel in order for Exploration to be worthwhile in STO, you have to balance it so that there's stuff to explore and not make it feel like you're getting repetitive content given how many people play and how fast stuff is usually consumed by players.
Colonization like the way you think it should work for the game isn't how it usually worked in the series. You wanna be able to micromanage the development of a colony right? Where to put it, what resources they need to produce etc. That's something that has usually a higher up power, and Starship Captains (in Starfleet at least) are told to go to a planet with a contingent of colonists and help them set it up. Obviously, our character is an Admiral, but in terms of gameplay, he's an Admiral/Dahar Master/Honored First in rank only as he/she functions more like a Captain.
I'll refrain from the third part as I wanna see what you say.
Micromanaging a colony is not what I really had in mind. The way I perceive it, Exploration let's us find sources of raw materials or civilizations that the alliance can establish relations with. In some cases, we may find a planet rich in a needed resource, but it belongs to a civilization we encounter, and they are not just going to allow us to establish a mining facilities and refineries in their sovereign territory. Diplomatic relations could then be established that would allow trade agreements to be set up, thus gaining access to what the alliance needs in exchange for what that civilization needs.
Colonization would allow us to fulfill colonization assignments. We'd do like we hear about in the shows, delivering colonists, specialists, supplies and equipment. This may be to a planet we discovered, or any number of planets discovered by others who bought into the exploration branch. For a sustained industrial operation a colony would make things a lot easier as it would have facilities to ensure that the people involved in the operation are safe and secure. Industrial installations could be set up without a colony, but they would not be anywhere near as productive.
Industry includes mining, refining and construction. Those who buy into the industrialization branch would get assignments to set up or support installations or facilities. It also would be responsible for the construction of starships (Admiralty cards) using components obtained through the commodities brokers and produced through R&D.
Mining facilities and components thereof would be producible with components that can be obtained or constructed through core gameplay. Colony components would be constructible only through the industrial branch,.
I guess, industrialization would fall under the jurisdiction of the Alliance corps of engineers.
This new metagame and its branches would feed assignments to all players at max level, and would facilitate an overhauled and way more meaningful Admiralty system, as implied. Completion of these assignments would modify metadata rather than just awarding xp/ Dil or EC. These assignments could have real influence on those thresholds I spoke about, triggering all sorts of potential events throughout the game.
These things are not impossible. They just will need some work to make happen. Work that will not get done without man hours allocated. Man hours will not get allocated unless PWE can profit from it.
So in other words, you want there to be a developed system that is triggered by player participation in different areas, that trigger some kind of random event. No offense, but I don't see this as the type of thing many would go for in this game. Not unless there was something worthwhile that makes it worth the trouble of cooperating as a community.
when you say metadata, are you talking about adding to what players can already do with their ships, something in the way that Endeavors provide, so that we get more power creep into the game?
Comments
PWE doesn't seem to be interested in adding depth though. New systems tend to be shallow representations of something grander that we'll never get. Admiralty, doffing, fleet holdings (outside of the actual TFO and colony simulations), R&D etc all amount to basically tons of mouse clicks.
Anything new would likely be similarly shallow in scope. By that I mean, not actual story or content to play but just a new page in addition to admiralty and doffing that we just "click stuff" on and get our rewards after 20 hours are finished counting down. Sad but true.
They could do something like that, but it would almost certainly require an entirely new engine to build the game on because features like those go way, way beyond anything a minigame could handle. And a game as old and established as STO is not something to take a gamble like that with lightly.
Short of that, to keep the original game intact it would be a case of (ideally seamless behind the scenes) exiting the current game and entering an entirely new, built-from-scratch game with a translated character model and stats, doing whatever is available in the new game, then exiting the new one to go back to the old one for the traditional stuff. Keeping two systems like that synched would be a horrendous headache, probably worse than the problems they were having with the Foundry.
Of course, they could expand admiralty and doffing out into a more complex card game or something with industrialization, empire building, and whatnot without totally rebuilding the current game from scratch, but I think that is not the kind of thing most players come to STO for.
I think the more pressing issue is not whether the game engine could handle it, but how it would realistically fit into their development budget(see sir's post directly above yours). I mean, this game survives on 2 simple(to explain) things:
1: selling people new ships.
2: giving people new missions (episodes/TFOs) to play with those new ships they just bought.
That's it. That is literally how this game makes it's money to pay it's employees and keep going. So the question is, how do you fit developing the system the OP wants into the development budget without slowing/hurting the development of the 2 absolutely fundamental (to the game's survival) items mentioned above?
I guess you could make the argument that the system that the OP wants could take the place of some of the new episodes/TFOs in giving people things to do with those new ships. But I should probably add that what most people want to do with those new ships is BLOW THINGS UP, not scan anomalies.
Having said all that, I'll say this: I would love this game to have an exploration system. But sadly, I know it's not going to happen for the reasons already mentioned. Now, if you want to "fight the good fight" and keep asking for one until the day the game finally shuts down; that's fine. I'm not saying you should stop. By all means, ask for the things you want.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
I don't really think they actually could do it. Like I don't think they have what it takes to pull it off. That might sound like a knock against them but it's not meant to be. Because even if they could pull it off, it likely wouldn't be profitable so there's almost no chance that they'll even try. Hence what I was saying to the OP before. If what you want, in the end, is an entirely different game. Then you're better off just finding that different game.
Sometimes while playing STO, I get the "itch" to fully command a fleet or colonize a planet or whatever. When this happens, I play BoTF or Sins of a Solar Empire or whatever else scratches that itch. Cause STO isn't that game and never will be.
First off, I wanna give my opinion on what I think you're trying to get at with an expansion of game systems here. Let's take exploration, how it worked in the series, how we know it works between the Federation, Klingons, Romulans and Dominion, and how I think you might want it to go.
Okay so exploration in the series was usually geared towards a focus with Starfleet vessels, where they would be visiting a new planet, discovering something was not right, spend the episode working to find a solution to what wasn't right, and then go on their way to their next destination once it was done, rarely ever taking the time to revisit the same place on screen. For Klingons, we know that rather than peaceful cooperation with a species, the Klingon approach was to conquer them and fold the planet under Klingon authority. Romulans presented themselves as an Empire as well, looking to expand their territory, while doing what they could to avoid if anything, anyone that wasn't a Romulan. The Romulan Republic's stance on exploration seemed to be a push to expanding their borders as well as acquisition of resources needed to build their influence. As for the Dominion, we know that historically, their stance on exploration was always from a point that they did everything in their power protect to their borders from solids. With the events that have transpired following the Hur'q, they're more willing to work with the Alliance.
Now, in the game with the old exploration system, it functioned much like the show did in terms of exploring a particular system, doing whatever was required to complete it, and we left, never able to revisit the same system again. If we happened to come across a system for anomaly scanning, we'd get materials in which we could put towards use in the old crafting system. I believe you want to have us return to something like this, where we harvest materials we may find while exploring a system. The question is, do you want an exploration system to be generated and retained or generated and reset after the encounter is done?
Moving on, lets talk about what I think it is you want from the other two systems you want to see happen, colonization and industrialization. What I think you're trying to get at with colonization is an approach that you help set up a new colony and over time, they develop resources that go to help develop things within the game. Am I right on this part?
Industrialization is the one thing I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around, because the way you worded it, that part sounds like you might want to replace inputs that we have now and possibly provide an alternate means to build ships. I don't know what you have in mind honestly, considering that everything you stated, for the most part we have already, except for building starships.
- Station construction: We have the Fleet Starbases which we develop with the help of others
- Mining installations: We already have this in the form of the Fleet mine.
Some clarification would be great here.
Now, going back to what you've repeatedly stated, you would be willing to pay to advance stuff. As I have already stated before, cryptic has NEVER made any of their systems in which you had to pay real money to advance any of it. Every system was created to always be free and never had any means of paying real money to advance, at least not directly. For example, leveling up and specialization you could buy experience boosters which increased the amount of experience points you earn. Outside of the Jem'hadar who start at level 60 by design choice, you cannot spend zen to bypass the leveling process with any other character, like what I heard is possible in other games. I get that you said paying to advance is your way of providing a means of monetization, but paying to advance one kind of system really clashes with the rest of STO's systems in my opinion.
BAILEY: Three days of this now, sir. Other ships must have made star maps of some of this.
SPOCK: Negative, Lieutenant. We are the first to reach this far.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Your post is well worded and includes a healthy dose of realism.
Part of me still wants to still "fight the good fight" but at times it seems easier to be thankful for the enjoyment and entertainment STO has provided through the years.
I wish Cryptic had 10 times the staff and 100 times the budget to bring everybody's dreams to reality because hey, this is Star Trek and Star Trek Online, but sometimes wishes end up getting filed under "dreams".
IMHO I do think that a portion of these requests may stem from a lack of end-game depth and/or challenge for some but would have to concede that it's likely not possible to keep all players completely satisfied forever.
Even after reading your words though there's still part of me that wants to shout "but this game could be so much more". Maybe it's only natural to have thoughts like this for something you're passionate about.
Bottom line when it comes to systems and story content is it's all loss leaders to get you to play the game in the hopes that a certain percentage will eventually spend money. And many people that think they'll never spend anything eventually cave and start spending a little here and there. But they can't get to that point if you confront them with an up front pay wall that they're likely to turn down before they've been hooked into continuing to play and (for some) eventually pay.
I feel in order for Exploration to be worthwhile in STO, you have to balance it so that there's stuff to explore and not make it feel like you're getting repetitive content given how many people play and how fast stuff is usually consumed by players.
Colonization like the way you think it should work for the game isn't how it usually worked in the series. You wanna be able to micromanage the development of a colony right? Where to put it, what resources they need to produce etc. That's something that has usually a higher up power, and Starship Captains (in Starfleet at least) are told to go to a planet with a contingent of colonists and help them set it up. Obviously, our character is an Admiral, but in terms of gameplay, he's an Admiral/Dahar Master/Honored First in rank only as he/she functions more like a Captain.
I'll refrain from the third part as I wanna see what you say.
This reminded me that the vast majority of Star Trek (and Trek-adjacent) games I've ever run across (X-trek, Star Fleet Battles, Elite Force, etc), has been about blowing stuff up.
Can you explain what you mean by this, because I can't think of any examples from the shows & movies I've watched.
And re: "Exploration" - exploration in the shows was, as mentioned, the standard "episode of the week" style thing. Go somewhere, find (or cause) a problem, solve the problem - sometimes by talking, sometimes by blowing stuff up. We have plenty of that in this game - it's called Episodes.
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And all of this discussion has reminded me of another super-core feature of the Star Trek TV shows that this game is sorely lacking. My Captain hasn't slept with a single Green Skinned Space Babe! WTF, STO? Where's my Star Trek?
fun fact there is one girl of the week in sto, the tal'shiar true believer in the romulan only missions. she is of course tovan's girl of the week.
if I stop posting it doesn't make you right it. just means I don't have enough rum to continue interacting with you.
Building a whole story arc with main focus of exploration and first contact would be a great addition to the mix. Solving puzzles and putting together clues from exploration would be fun for a change, rather than phaser you way to get to the end of the mission.
Although, I am probably in the minority with this opinion, I believe the lack of a true trinity makes implementing anything other than pew pew doomed to fail.
So, I just keep logging in for 20-30 minutes a day and doing the never ending event treadmill until I finally get completely bored or the game ends. Again, another unpopular opinion but I miss the days of the Iconian war when we got featured episodes we had to do for three weeks to get all of the cool rewards. Yeah it was a bit boring after the second week but monthly featured episodes were at least some story expansion to look forward to.
So in other words, you want there to be a developed system that is triggered by player participation in different areas, that trigger some kind of random event. No offense, but I don't see this as the type of thing many would go for in this game. Not unless there was something worthwhile that makes it worth the trouble of cooperating as a community.
when you say metadata, are you talking about adding to what players can already do with their ships, something in the way that Endeavors provide, so that we get more power creep into the game?