a question for the dpsers (no judgement here, just a question ) why do you like some much these old borg tfos, there is no challenge, no real tests for your builds, except the damage done in an amount of time, but that's all. it is not funny to fight static stuff.
Tzenkheti, Voths, even the Terran are more interesting to fight, because you must really use your ship in all her aspects and they use a lot of different skills. In my opinion, foes should be able to use a lot of different skills, that would create a real challenge, and a need of adaptation.
in isa or kva the piloting skills don't matter. in other tfos, yes piloting skills are important, but not in the borg tfos. Maps are small, and the foes remain in group or are static (generators, gates etc).
Its doesn't matter in terms of completing it but piloting skills do have a large impact on how much DPS you do and how long ISA takes to finish. You can double or more your DPS just from piloting skills alone, along with cutting a large % of the time taken to finish it via piloting skills.
I know, but like I said, foes in ISA or Kva are static, no need to use uber tactics, and the pleasure that I have to do a tfo, is not calculated by the time used to do this tfo. 1 minutes in ISA is not funny at all.
a question for the dpsers (no judgement here, just a question ) why do you like some much these old borg tfos, there is no challenge, no real tests for your builds, except the damage done in an amount of time, but that's all. it is not funny to fight static stuff.
Tzenkheti, Voths, even the Terran are more interesting to fight, because you must really use your ship in all her aspects and they use a lot of different skills. In my opinion, foes should be able to use a lot of different skills, that would create a real challenge, and a need of adaptation.
They like them exactly because they are effortless, and they think it makes them look skilled to blow through said effortless content in seconds because they have high DPS. This is why these same people decry the TFOs with the enemy types you mention, because they can't just sleep through the TFO with their DPS, and they don't look as good.
Some of your replies... well, let me just stay polite, and say that it looks like you definitely have some hangups regarding the DPS crowd.
Now for the normal, non-paranoid explanation, TFO's like ISA are good for DPS measurement, for 2 distinct reasons:
1) They're small. That's important. When a map become too big, like even CSA, for example, personal DPS uploads become skewed, as the DPS of team members who are too far away from you will be distorted (as in: appear less in your own log than they're actually doing). This makes log verification and/or comparison harder (think 75k+).
2) A map like ISA is rather static (enemy spawns, positions, etc). This too is important, for the old scientific repeatability. Reproducibility is, of course, an important factor, as you want pretty much the same conditions, each run, for accurate, comparative DPS measurement among players.
In its current state, ISA has become sub-optimal for DPS measurement, as it finishes too fast. Half-way decent DPS measurements should not rely on who can produce the hardest hitting alpha strike, but should, ideally, reflect one's personal DPS prowess over a reasonable amount of time.
a question for the dpsers (no judgement here, just a question ) why do you like some much these old borg tfos, there is no challenge, no real tests for your builds, except the damage done in an amount of time, but that's all. it is not funny to fight static stuff.
Tzenkheti, Voths, even the Terran are more interesting to fight, because you must really use your ship in all her aspects and they use a lot of different skills. In my opinion, foes should be able to use a lot of different skills, that would create a real challenge, and a need of adaptation.
They like them exactly because they are effortless, and they think it makes them look skilled to blow through said effortless content in seconds because they have high DPS. This is why these same people decry the TFOs with the enemy types you mention, because they can't just sleep through the TFO with their DPS, and they don't look as good.
Many of the people in this thread have said anything that isn't a DPS hallway like Infected Manus is bad game design, because they think that, because they spent to much time getting their DPS to that level, that they need to be "rewarded" for it, and see anything that doesn't reward high DPS as bad.
Its actually fairly funny. I've seen this same argument posted by the same kind of people for well over 10+ years of playing MMOs, and no matter how anyone, even devs, tell them such a belief doesn't make sense, they still believe it.
That's not why I like them in fact its the other way around I like them because I have to put effort in and cannot just sleep though them. My build doesn't have high raw DPS out the box due to the equipment and traits I use. I only have high DPS if I put in a lot of effort and skill and really think about what I am doing. My space builds raw DPS comes out at something like 51k (sitting in ESD with all active damage boost powers on) and that is what I will get unless I use effort and skill to more then quadruple that damage, my ground build is similar its raw DPS is low as its based on electrical damage. Which completely disproves what you are saying about it only being about high DPS, equipment and traits. Its not, its about situational awareness, player skill, piloting and timing.
Both this post and my other one shows what you are saying is incorrect. We are still waiting for you to explain the DPS discrepancy which is anywhere from 100% to 500% depending on pilot. That alone proves what you are saying is wrong. The same applies to ground.
in isa or kva the piloting skills don't matter. in other tfos, yes piloting skills are important, but not in the borg tfos. Maps are small, and the foes remain in group or are static (generators, gates etc).
Its doesn't matter in terms of completing it but piloting skills do have a large impact on how much DPS you do and how long ISA takes to finish. You can double or more your DPS just from piloting skills alone, along with cutting a large % of the time taken to finish it via piloting skills.
I know, but like I said, foes in ISA or Kva are static, no need to use uber tactics, and the pleasure that I have to do a tfo, is not calculated by the time used to do this tfo. 1 minutes in ISA is not funny at all.
I agree there is no need to use uber tactics you can get by without them. What we are saying is the high DPS is coming from uber tactics not just equipment and traits like Somtaawkhar says. Somtaawkhar is over simplifying high DPS in an unrealistic way which doesn't represent the real effort and skill involved.
Getting into the top 1% of a weapon system isn't just reading a guide and spending cash on equipment/traits. There is far more to it then that.
in isa or kva the piloting skills don't matter. in other tfos, yes piloting skills are important, but not in the borg tfos. Maps are small, and the foes remain in group or are static (generators, gates etc).
Its doesn't matter in terms of completing it but piloting skills do have a large impact on how much DPS you do and how long ISA takes to finish. You can double or more your DPS just from piloting skills alone, along with cutting a large % of the time taken to finish it via piloting skills.
I know, but like I said, foes in ISA or Kva are static, no need to use uber tactics, and the pleasure that I have to do a tfo, is not calculated by the time used to do this tfo. 1 minutes in ISA is not funny at all.
I agree there is no need to use uber tactics you can get by without them. What we are saying is the high DPS is coming from uber tactics not just equipment and traits like Somtaawkhar says. Somtaawkhar is over simplifying high DPS in an unrealistic way which doesn't represent the real effort and skill involved.
Getting into the top 1% of a weapon system isn't just reading a guide and spending cash on equipment/traits. There is far more to it then that.
I tend to agree with that. Knowledge, gear and skill are all part of the same coin needed to achieve massive DPS. Put two people in the same ship and the DPS will vary massively.
It is also a bit annoying to see parses thrown around at times. Recently i had a RTFO at KSA where i almost completely cleared out one of the sides single handed and someone posted a parse where i supposedly only did 5k DPS.
At that time i did not bother to point out that KSA was too large for an accurate parse.
Let's leave the DPS discussion for what it is and get back to things we'd like to see in revamped Borg content.
One thing i would not like to see is random Emergency Power to Engines. (anyone remember the short period where the probes in ISA almost sped away to the end of the map and players had to chase them).
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
in isa or kva the piloting skills don't matter. in other tfos, yes piloting skills are important, but not in the borg tfos. Maps are small, and the foes remain in group or are static (generators, gates etc).
Its doesn't matter in terms of completing it but piloting skills do have a large impact on how much DPS you do and how long ISA takes to finish. You can double or more your DPS just from piloting skills alone, along with cutting a large % of the time taken to finish it via piloting skills.
I know, but like I said, foes in ISA or Kva are static, no need to use uber tactics, and the pleasure that I have to do a tfo, is not calculated by the time used to do this tfo. 1 minutes in ISA is not funny at all.
I agree there is no need to use uber tactics you can get by without them. What we are saying is the high DPS is coming from uber tactics not just equipment and traits like Somtaawkhar says. Somtaawkhar is over simplifying high DPS in an unrealistic way which doesn't represent the real effort and skill involved.
Getting into the top 1% of a weapon system isn't just reading a guide and spending cash on equipment/traits. There is far more to it then that.
I agree, that tactics are important in most of the tfos, but not really in borg tfos, that was my point. i just try to understand why these tfos are so loved, personally I totally hate them.
I also agree with the fact that a skilled player is an important part of a build, gears etc bought are not enough to reach high dps. This is why I like to read Felisan and Seaofsorrows' advices, for example. Even if I don't really try to reach a high number of dps.
one thing that I would like to see added to all the foes, is a better AI; and like I said before the possibility for them to use more skills; Borg are ridiculous in this matter, even when the shields are already wiped out, they use again the same skill for nothing.
in isa or kva the piloting skills don't matter. in other tfos, yes piloting skills are important, but not in the borg tfos. Maps are small, and the foes remain in group or are static (generators, gates etc).
Its doesn't matter in terms of completing it but piloting skills do have a large impact on how much DPS you do and how long ISA takes to finish. You can double or more your DPS just from piloting skills alone, along with cutting a large % of the time taken to finish it via piloting skills.
I know, but like I said, foes in ISA or Kva are static, no need to use uber tactics, and the pleasure that I have to do a tfo, is not calculated by the time used to do this tfo. 1 minutes in ISA is not funny at all.
I agree there is no need to use uber tactics you can get by without them. What we are saying is the high DPS is coming from uber tactics not just equipment and traits like Somtaawkhar says. Somtaawkhar is over simplifying high DPS in an unrealistic way which doesn't represent the real effort and skill involved.
Getting into the top 1% of a weapon system isn't just reading a guide and spending cash on equipment/traits. There is far more to it then that.
I agree, that tactics are important in most of the tfos, but not really in borg tfos, that was my point. i just try to understand why these tfos are so loved, personally I totally hate them.
I also agree with the fact that a skilled player is an important part of a build, gears etc bought are not enough to reach high dps. This is why I like to read Felisan and Seaofsorrows' advices, for example. Even if I don't really try to reach a high number of dps.
one thing that I would like to see added to all the foes, is a better AI; and like I said before the possibility for them to use more skills; Borg are ridiculous in this matter, even when the shields are already wiped out, they use again the same skill for nothing.
They are loved for a number of reasons. They benefit from thought, skill and teamwork as what a player does impacts the mission. They are not auto win, sleep though it AFK and it completes which a lot of the new missions suffer from and that is bad design. Many people find the missions flow well which makes it a fun expreince. Another reason is the layout is good for training, learning, improvement and comparing builds. Which is a big reason why so many people run it over and over again. Its great for working out tweaks in your build and piloting skills. That's why I am looking forward to ISE as it should be great for testing.
ok, but in the borg tfos, people learn how to fight the borg and only the borg; and I can see a lot of players who try to fight the tzenkheti in the same way, same thing for the voth, without success. It would be more interesting if players spend more time doing all the tfos than only the borg tfos. the problem is that a lot of tfos are just boring, or badly done.
I'm going to try the new borg tfos, but I don't expect nothing. The AI will be the same, the game mechanic for these tfos will be always the same. I guess that the improvement of the borg will be only huge hp, like at the launch of delta rising.
A Smarter AI would be a better challenge. wait and see.
Excuse me, how was the debate shifted AGAIN to how awesome players supposedly are, and not to how laughable the Borg are, and why?
it is not incompatible; some players are really skilled, and the borg remain like they always have been a dumb and ridiculous foe.
I did today a massacre on defera for the endeavour "kill 60 borg"; wow! that was so boring. something must be done to make the borg a real threat. (btw I don't have the tommygun or the shotgun, nor the sniper riffle TBR or something). Even the scorpions on Nimbus are more dangerous
I tend to agree with that. Knowledge, gear and skill are all part of the same coin needed to achieve massive DPS. Put two people in the same ship and the DPS will vary massively.
It is also a bit annoying to see parses thrown around at times. Recently i had a RTFO at KSA where i almost completely cleared out one of the sides single handed and someone posted a parse where i supposedly only did 5k DPS.
At that time i did not bother to point out that KSA was too large for an accurate parse.
Let's leave the DPS discussion for what it is and get back to things we'd like to see in revamped Borg content.
Agreed. I only briefly delved into the matter of DPS myself, simply to explain to somtaawkhar why ISA worked so well as DPS-measuring tool, as it were (and why it currently no longer fulfills that role in a satisfactory manner). From what I understood, the Borg Cubes and all will get a little tougher (a good thing), and overall those TFO's will be more streamlined, but "Infected will still be the viable DPS check."
Or just any Tzenkethi TFO that said I'd say discussion of DPS and what you need to do gain it is beyond the scope of this thread.
EDIT:After all the Borg TFO rewamp isn't a "what if" it's now officially announced and before that at very least strongly implied so we know it's coming and with 3 days.
I'll be perfectly honest and tell you I don't want this thread to become another flamewar because you didn't like that someone did more DPS then you. If you people can't keep this thread on topic and instead must go on at best semi-related personal insults I will call for a mod to close this, though for now I'm willing to give you a chance to get back on topic if the mods want to give you that chance as well.
Of and if you ask what gives me authority ask for closing this thread I'm the OP and while I've not posted as much here I've been watching this thread.
Or just any Tzenkethi TFO that said I'd say discussion of DPS and what you need to do gain it is beyond the scope of this thread.
EDIT:After all the Borg TFO rewamp isn't a "what if" it's now officially announced and before that at very least strongly implied so we know it's coming and with 3 days.
I'll be perfectly honest and tell you I don't want this thread to become another flamewar because you didn't like that someone did more DPS then you. If you people can't keep this thread on topic and instead must go on at best semi-related personal insults I will call for a mod to close this, though for now I'm willing to give you a chance to get back on topic if the mods want to give you that chance as well.
Of and if you ask what gives me authority ask for closing this thread I'm the OP and while I've not posted as much here I've been watching this thread.
Maybe you really should ask for this topic to be closed. The new Borg TFO's are already made (only leaving us tp speculate as to what the changes might be). So, by your own inference, this thread has pretty much outlived its usefulness.
ok, but in the borg tfos, people learn how to fight the borg and only the borg; and I can see a lot of players who try to fight the tzenkheti in the same way, same thing for the voth,
I'm thinking, maybe a GW on Tzenkethi could actually work. First pop that GW, wait a bit, then lay a massive Delayed Overload Cascade on them. The carnage should be awesome!
Both this post and my other one shows what you are saying is incorrect.
They show nothing beyond that you are willing to make absurdist claims like that ISA, literally the easiest and most thoughtless TFO in the game, requires effort. Counterpoint requires more effort then ISA does.
As irony would have it, if you truly want to make a counterpoint, LOL, perhaps you should try 'to explain the DPS discrepancy which is anywhere from 100% to 500% depending on pilot.' So far you haven't. And maybe you shouldn't any more, as I feel this thread is about to get locked.
ok, but in the borg tfos, people learn how to fight the borg and only the borg; and I can see a lot of players who try to fight the tzenkheti in the same way, same thing for the voth,
I'm thinking, maybe a GW on Tzenkethi could actually work. First pop that GW, wait a bit, then lay a massive Delayed Overload Cascade on them. The carnage should be awesome!
It's not the damage potential, but the invoked self healing and AI shield breaching Torpedo spreads.
It's usually not worth the trouble.
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
Or just any Tzenkethi TFO that said I'd say discussion of DPS and what you need to do gain it is beyond the scope of this thread.
EDIT:After all the Borg TFO rewamp isn't a "what if" it's now officially announced and before that at very least strongly implied so we know it's coming and with 3 days.
I'll be perfectly honest and tell you I don't want this thread to become another flamewar because you didn't like that someone did more DPS then you. If you people can't keep this thread on topic and instead must go on at best semi-related personal insults I will call for a mod to close this, though for now I'm willing to give you a chance to get back on topic if the mods want to give you that chance as well.
Of and if you ask what gives me authority ask for closing this thread I'm the OP and while I've not posted as much here I've been watching this thread.
Maybe you really should ask for this topic to be closed. The new Borg TFO's are already made (only leaving us tp speculate as to what the changes might be). So, by your own inference, this thread has pretty much outlived its usefulness.
Well we can still speculate and discuss about it, just I'd prefer we'd leave the DPS/difficulty out of it as it seems there's no way that people can discuss about that without the discussion devolving into personal attacks and general flaming.
After all we don't know if the rewamp does include visual update or just gameplay rewamp.
ok, but in the borg tfos, people learn how to fight the borg and only the borg; and I can see a lot of players who try to fight the tzenkheti in the same way, same thing for the voth,
I'm thinking, maybe a GW on Tzenkethi could actually work. First pop that GW, wait a bit, then lay a massive Delayed Overload Cascade on them. The carnage should be awesome!
it is easier to destroy the cruiser first, and then the rajeh, rabeh whatever is the name of the big ship. I don't like when players use gw, it is became quickly dangerous, when 2 or 3 cruisers are close to the other ships. Delayed overload cascade is not cheap Tractor beam repulsor without the doff is very interesting against them.
Both this post and my other one shows what you are saying is incorrect.
They show nothing beyond that you are willing to make absurdist claims like that ISA, literally the easiest and most thoughtless TFO in the game, requires effort. Counterpoint requires more effort then ISA does.
It shows what you are saying is completely incorrect. ISA is not literally the easiest and most thoughtless TFO in the game. That would be the silly ones like SB1 where you can go AFK do massive damage and complete it asleep without even playing or moving.
What I was showing is what you are saying about high end DPS is all guides, gear and traits is flat out wrong. What I said is a valid counterpoint and unless you counter it then you are proven wrong.
A further example to what I said before my current main ship at the moment has lower raw DPS then the same build on my other ships. But due to the speed bonus combined with player skill I get more DPS out of the lower raw DPS ship which goes directly against what you said. Further proving you wrong.
If you give half a dozen pilots my character, same ship, same build there can be a massive 100% to 500% DPS difference from the pilot. That alone proves what you are saying is wrong. How do you explain that DPS difference? Because if you cannot then what you said is proven wrong.
My build does require effort to play ISA. With it you cannot just sleep though ISA and there is a clear massive difference in DPS that comes from player skill and the pilot. I don't know why its so hard for you to admit the pilot makes a large difference in DPS output and its not all down to gear and traits.
ok, but in the borg tfos, people learn how to fight the borg and only the borg; and I can see a lot of players who try to fight the tzenkheti in the same way, same thing for the voth,
I'm thinking, maybe a GW on Tzenkethi could actually work. First pop that GW, wait a bit, then lay a massive Delayed Overload Cascade on them. The carnage should be awesome!
it is easier to destroy the cruiser first, and then the rajeh, rabeh whatever is the name of the big ship. I don't like when players use gw, it is became quickly dangerous, when 2 or 3 cruisers are close to the other ships. Delayed overload cascade is not cheap Tractor beam repulsor without the doff is very interesting against them.
Yes. As questerius argued already, could very well be that their (induced) close proximity to each other, because of the GW, helps them heal/coordinate more than the damage Delayed Overload Cascade can do. Tractor Beam Repulsors, sans the reverse doff, has indeed so far proven extremely effective in just scattering them (and do particle dmg to boot).
The extend to which some people here insult the readers' intelligence by claiming that "piloting" has anything to do why the Borg are STO's clown enemies is exasperating.
We are not saying piloting has anything to do with the Borg being far to easy. We already stated high end tactics are not needed to beat the Borg which is why we look forward to Elite.
What we are arguing against is the people claiming "piloting" has no impact on high DPS and no impact on the mission because they wrongly think piloting does nothing. They think high DPS is gear and traits only which is proven completely wrong. I am fighting against it as its insulting against those that put the time in to train themselves and other people in piloting and its very bad advice for new players to say gear and traits only.
My build especially doesn't really work without piloting. The only way to get high DPS out of it in ISA and others is via player piloting. It takes effort and work to make it do high DPS in ISA and others. Not Defense of SB1 though that one you can sit AFK asleep though it and still do massive damage. SB1 is a badly designed mission.
The extend to which some people here insult the readers' intelligence by claiming that "piloting" has anything to do why the Borg are STO's clown enemies is exasperating.
This.
Whilst I absolutely accept that piloting accounts for DPS in most cases, ISA is NOT one of them. Facts:
- The Borg spheres are slow, lumbering, idiots
- The Borg spheres are absolutely predictable. They spawn in the same place and proceed to lumber slowly away from it
- All other targets are STATIC. I don't care what anyone says, being an awesome pilot doesnt't mean much against MASSIVE targets that don't move.
Sadly I suspect the numerous static targets, and the fact that the mobile targets move slowly, are one of the reasons the map found favour as a DPS measuring tool.
I honestly fail to understand why people feel compelled to jump to the defense of the likes of ISA. I mean, I used to like it - but no two ways about it - it is BROKEN.
For certain I agree it lost a lot of what made it good in the past and personally I prefer HSE as a measuring tool. What I would like to point out is not all of us use energy boats with FaW. Piloting and the impact on DPS matters in varying amounts depending on what build you are using. Even in ISA some builds like what I use require a lot more piloting then a typical FaW build that can get away with a minimum of piloting.
Saying all that, I fully agree ISA needs work and the Borg should be a lot tougher then they currently are. Lets hope Elite goes a long way to fix that.
Piloting determines if you're in the right place at the right time to annihilate them with your alpha strike and also determines if you have the right target selected.
a question for the dpsers (no judgement here, just a question ) why do you like some much these old borg tfos, there is no challenge, no real tests for your builds, except the damage done in an amount of time, but that's all. it is not funny to fight static stuff.
Tzenkheti, Voths, even the Terran are more interesting to fight, because you must really use your ship in all her aspects and they use a lot of different skills. In my opinion, foes should be able to use a lot of different skills, that would create a real challenge, and a need of adaptation.
Because easy as they may be, they nonetheless can and must be completed by playing, rather than having a ~15 minute timer to wait out then being told you win no matter what happened.
It's not that the old missions are that challenging (as they are now), but that the "new standard" is much worse.
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Tzenkheti, Voths, even the Terran are more interesting to fight, because you must really use your ship in all her aspects and they use a lot of different skills. In my opinion, foes should be able to use a lot of different skills, that would create a real challenge, and a need of adaptation.
I know, but like I said, foes in ISA or Kva are static, no need to use uber tactics, and the pleasure that I have to do a tfo, is not calculated by the time used to do this tfo. 1 minutes in ISA is not funny at all.
Some of your replies... well, let me just stay polite, and say that it looks like you definitely have some hangups regarding the DPS crowd.
Now for the normal, non-paranoid explanation, TFO's like ISA are good for DPS measurement, for 2 distinct reasons:
1) They're small. That's important. When a map become too big, like even CSA, for example, personal DPS uploads become skewed, as the DPS of team members who are too far away from you will be distorted (as in: appear less in your own log than they're actually doing). This makes log verification and/or comparison harder (think 75k+).
2) A map like ISA is rather static (enemy spawns, positions, etc). This too is important, for the old scientific repeatability. Reproducibility is, of course, an important factor, as you want pretty much the same conditions, each run, for accurate, comparative DPS measurement among players.
In its current state, ISA has become sub-optimal for DPS measurement, as it finishes too fast. Half-way decent DPS measurements should not rely on who can produce the hardest hitting alpha strike, but should, ideally, reflect one's personal DPS prowess over a reasonable amount of time.
Both this post and my other one shows what you are saying is incorrect. We are still waiting for you to explain the DPS discrepancy which is anywhere from 100% to 500% depending on pilot. That alone proves what you are saying is wrong. The same applies to ground.
Getting into the top 1% of a weapon system isn't just reading a guide and spending cash on equipment/traits. There is far more to it then that.
I tend to agree with that. Knowledge, gear and skill are all part of the same coin needed to achieve massive DPS. Put two people in the same ship and the DPS will vary massively.
It is also a bit annoying to see parses thrown around at times. Recently i had a RTFO at KSA where i almost completely cleared out one of the sides single handed and someone posted a parse where i supposedly only did 5k DPS.
At that time i did not bother to point out that KSA was too large for an accurate parse.
Let's leave the DPS discussion for what it is and get back to things we'd like to see in revamped Borg content.
One thing i would not like to see is random Emergency Power to Engines. (anyone remember the short period where the probes in ISA almost sped away to the end of the map and players had to chase them).
I agree, that tactics are important in most of the tfos, but not really in borg tfos, that was my point. i just try to understand why these tfos are so loved, personally I totally hate them.
I also agree with the fact that a skilled player is an important part of a build, gears etc bought are not enough to reach high dps. This is why I like to read Felisan and Seaofsorrows' advices, for example. Even if I don't really try to reach a high number of dps.
one thing that I would like to see added to all the foes, is a better AI; and like I said before the possibility for them to use more skills; Borg are ridiculous in this matter, even when the shields are already wiped out, they use again the same skill for nothing.
I'm going to try the new borg tfos, but I don't expect nothing. The AI will be the same, the game mechanic for these tfos will be always the same. I guess that the improvement of the borg will be only huge hp, like at the launch of delta rising.
A Smarter AI would be a better challenge. wait and see.
it is not incompatible; some players are really skilled, and the borg remain like they always have been a dumb and ridiculous foe.
I did today a massacre on defera for the endeavour "kill 60 borg"; wow! that was so boring. something must be done to make the borg a real threat. (btw I don't have the tommygun or the shotgun, nor the sniper riffle TBR or something). Even the scorpions on Nimbus are more dangerous
Agreed. I only briefly delved into the matter of DPS myself, simply to explain to somtaawkhar why ISA worked so well as DPS-measuring tool, as it were (and why it currently no longer fulfills that role in a satisfactory manner). From what I understood, the Borg Cubes and all will get a little tougher (a good thing), and overall those TFO's will be more streamlined, but "Infected will still be the viable DPS check."
EDIT:After all the Borg TFO rewamp isn't a "what if" it's now officially announced and before that at very least strongly implied so we know it's coming and with 3 days.
I'll be perfectly honest and tell you I don't want this thread to become another flamewar because you didn't like that someone did more DPS then you. If you people can't keep this thread on topic and instead must go on at best semi-related personal insults I will call for a mod to close this, though for now I'm willing to give you a chance to get back on topic if the mods want to give you that chance as well.
Of and if you ask what gives me authority ask for closing this thread I'm the OP and while I've not posted as much here I've been watching this thread.
Maybe you really should ask for this topic to be closed.
I'm thinking, maybe a GW on Tzenkethi could actually work.
As irony would have it, if you truly want to make a counterpoint, LOL, perhaps you should try 'to explain the DPS discrepancy which is anywhere from 100% to 500% depending on pilot.' So far you haven't. And maybe you shouldn't any more, as I feel this thread is about to get locked.
It's not the damage potential, but the invoked self healing and AI shield breaching Torpedo spreads.
It's usually not worth the trouble.
Well we can still speculate and discuss about it, just I'd prefer we'd leave the DPS/difficulty out of it as it seems there's no way that people can discuss about that without the discussion devolving into personal attacks and general flaming.
After all we don't know if the rewamp does include visual update or just gameplay rewamp.
it is easier to destroy the cruiser first, and then the rajeh, rabeh whatever is the name of the big ship. I don't like when players use gw, it is became quickly dangerous, when 2 or 3 cruisers are close to the other ships. Delayed overload cascade is not cheap
What I was showing is what you are saying about high end DPS is all guides, gear and traits is flat out wrong. What I said is a valid counterpoint and unless you counter it then you are proven wrong.
A further example to what I said before my current main ship at the moment has lower raw DPS then the same build on my other ships. But due to the speed bonus combined with player skill I get more DPS out of the lower raw DPS ship which goes directly against what you said. Further proving you wrong.
If you give half a dozen pilots my character, same ship, same build there can be a massive 100% to 500% DPS difference from the pilot. That alone proves what you are saying is wrong. How do you explain that DPS difference? Because if you cannot then what you said is proven wrong.
My build does require effort to play ISA. With it you cannot just sleep though ISA and there is a clear massive difference in DPS that comes from player skill and the pilot. I don't know why its so hard for you to admit the pilot makes a large difference in DPS output and its not all down to gear and traits.
Yes. As questerius argued already, could very well be that their (induced) close proximity to each other, because of the GW, helps them heal/coordinate more than the damage Delayed Overload Cascade can do. Tractor Beam Repulsors, sans the reverse doff, has indeed so far proven extremely effective in just scattering them (and do particle dmg to boot).
What we are arguing against is the people claiming "piloting" has no impact on high DPS and no impact on the mission because they wrongly think piloting does nothing. They think high DPS is gear and traits only which is proven completely wrong. I am fighting against it as its insulting against those that put the time in to train themselves and other people in piloting and its very bad advice for new players to say gear and traits only.
My build especially doesn't really work without piloting. The only way to get high DPS out of it in ISA and others is via player piloting. It takes effort and work to make it do high DPS in ISA and others. Not Defense of SB1 though that one you can sit AFK asleep though it and still do massive damage. SB1 is a badly designed mission.
Saying all that, I fully agree ISA needs work and the Borg should be a lot tougher then they currently are. Lets hope Elite goes a long way to fix that.
My character Tsin'xing
It's not that the old missions are that challenging (as they are now), but that the "new standard" is much worse.