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SUPER LAG, RUBBERBANDING
stonecold59
Member Posts: 64 Arc User
i realize the Risa event is all but done i just completed a race where do to severe rubberbanding i got pulled back from 3 power up ramps on my board and on my floater 4 gates where i had to turn around and go back threw them. This year on the Risa event was the WORST i've ever had the displeasure of playing and it went unchecked and unrepaired for the entire 5 weeks that the event was on. .
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To their defence they play and test next to the server so most likely they dont see the problems
but they should send someone log from a internet cafe on another town within reasonable distance to let them know of results
I don't know if Cryptic can do much as its a 3rd party host and likely dependant on their ability to resolve the issue. I can't see Cryptic changing providers as they are in a contract with Akamni which may well be expensive to cancel.
Hello rubber banding my old friend, time to bounce around the battlezone again, where are all my bug reports going?, out of love with this game I am falling, As Cryptic fail to acknowledge a problem exists, Shakes an angry fist, And from Support all I'm hearing are the sounds of silence.
I'm sorry, but when it's only the minority that apparently get this, it does not prove they don't care. I'm over in the UK, I don't use the proxies, and I don't get these issues, even on Risa. I'm not using a top-end computer, and I have a 37Mb connection btw.
As repeatedly said, there are dozens up on dozens of reasons why this happens, and it seems people just don't realise this. This simplest explanations are that the user is streaming, or other people in the house-hold are streaming, and it's taking up the bandwidth, or there is a localised line issue, or the router set to a busy band. One issue that isn't immediately apparent in the home is an IP conflict, which happens to me whenever I come home and my phone reconnects to the WiFi. Other reasons such as atmospheric weather events causing interference, net traffic manipulation (not really applicable to the EU or UK as net neutrality bans this practice) and interconnection issues have an effect.
Unless Cryptic acknowledges there is an issue, do not automatically assume the issue is server-side. Approach diagnosis of the issue from the user-end first and work backwards, not the other way around. A simple reset of your devices and/or router is often all that is needed to fix this issue.
I seen then entire armada almost to complain for such issues
where is the info that is the minority?
there was a poll or something?
And what will happen if that "minority" stops playing(and spending) due to this? The game will be better financed and more lively?
My character Tsin'xing
As repeatedly has been proven none of what you listed is the main problem. Approx 95% if not higher of people who are having problems from what I have seen are all having problems in the same area which is one of the servers Cryptic use.
The problem is clearly with the Akamni server Cryptic use. Also Cryptic did acknowledge there was an issue but not what the issue is. We had to work that out our self and once we did they didn't respond.
Yes I have it less often like spikes but many people within the armada I am started to only log for phoenix and admiralty because they can barely play. If that goes on for long they will probably quit altogether eventually
Apologies for being picky, but you have no evidence to ascert '95%'. You only need to judge by how many are reporting an issue to get an idea of how many are affected.
Even if it's Akamai, it's NOT Cryptic's servers is it? They are seperate corporate entities. If it was Cryptic's servers, everybody would be affected, and the further the distance the bigger the effect. Probably it's a different 'pipe' that feeds the UK and EU, but I do not get these issues with the regularity that some people in the US and Canada get.
My post is also to highlight how many potential issues it also COULD be, and you really should not dismiss it out of hand.
Whether it is Cryptic, PWE, or some errant server hop it is still PWE's responsibility to track down the cause and REPORT to us their findings. They are most definitely losing customers and money over this issue whether they want to give a damn or not.
Speed checks on my BB 18.8 MBPS upload and 70.1 MBPS download speed
1 <1 ms <1 ms <1 ms ttrouter [192.168.1.1]
2 * * * Request timed out.
3 9 ms 9 ms 9 ms host-78-151-230-241.as13285.net [78.151.230.241]
4 14 ms 15 ms 14 ms host-78-151-230-226.as13285.net [78.151.230.226]
5 23 ms 24 ms 24 ms host-78-144-0-81.as13285.net [78.144.0.81]
6 25 ms 24 ms 24 ms akamai.prolexic.com [195.66.224.31]
7 23 ms 22 ms 22 ms po110.bs-a.sech-lon2.netarch.akamai.com [72.52.60.192]
8 20 ms 21 ms 21 ms a72-52-1-179.deploy.static.akamaitechnologies.com [72.52.1.179]
9 23 ms 20 ms 21 ms ae120.access-a.sech-lon2.netarch.akamai.com [72.52.60.197]
10 202 ms 187 ms 218 ms 93.191.173.11
11 105 ms 95 ms 95 ms a72-52-27-212.deploy.static.akamaitechnologies.com [72.52.27.212]
12 106 ms 99 ms 102 ms 198.49.243.237
13 96 ms 96 ms 95 ms patchserver.crypticstudios.com [208.95.184.200]
EDIT
Ping result
Pinging patchserver.crypticstudios.com [208.95.184.200] with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 208.95.184.200: bytes=32 time=94ms TTL=48
Reply from 208.95.184.200: bytes=32 time=94ms TTL=48
Reply from 208.95.184.200: bytes=32 time=99ms TTL=48
Reply from 208.95.184.200: bytes=32 time=95ms TTL=48
Ping statistics for 208.95.184.200:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 94ms, Maximum = 99ms, Average = 95ms
Hello rubber banding my old friend, time to bounce around the battlezone again, where are all my bug reports going?, out of love with this game I am falling, As Cryptic fail to acknowledge a problem exists, Shakes an angry fist, And from Support all I'm hearing are the sounds of silence.
Add to that that traceroute was created long before modern Internet infrastructure techniques like MPLS and traffic shaping and is therefore one of the most useless diagnostics tools today and should IMHO be removed from every Windows installation.
"-Grind is good!" --Gordon Geko
Accolades checklist: https://bit.ly/FLUFFYS
We've had lag threads where people did figure out it was a local issue with their home network or PC, and there have been times like the start of a major event when most players really were affected. It varies.
I play other two mmos and I check into a lot more just to check and/or claim things in case I replay them in the future
none has such problems
Exactly.
Last year I diagnosed a line fault that my telecoms supplier couldn't diagnose (even after 4 home-visits!) just by checking my router diagnostics. It was in my local distribution cabinet. Did I ever once blame Cryptic for the SNR's...no. Problem is people are quick to blame another without looking at the wider picture. It's less stressful if I do the checking for myself
You overlook the extent of how many people it affects
I would agree with you if it was just a handful every 100 players, but its not
For what is worth the problems are still there but less intense but for many its almost unplayable and that isnt good for a mid-population game like this
Do you even see 100's complaining? That would be an issue. A small handful, as in this case, means it's not as extensive as you would have us think. Cryptic's servers would not, and cannot be selective in who has problems.
When there is some kind of an issue, there is generally a thousand and one different factors that can be at play when diagnosing lag. It's not a straight shot from your computer to their servers and vice versa. Each time your rig sends info to the servers, and the servers back to your rig, it does so over a series of jumps much like an electronic version of ye old snail mail system, save at the speed of light. The tracert posted about is just one example demonstrating this. The internet is still largely wired and depending on where one lives, there can be hundreds and even thousands of miles of cable between their servers and your rig. If something is happening along the route, even something such as an animal trying to chew the line, it can effect your connection. If there is an issue with a data center along the route, that can also effect your connection. It's 100% possible for your rig to be fine, and their servers to be fine, but something along the way is causing issues.
Your internet speeds are also a huge factor as is your rig itself. If you don't have a good internet connection or slower speeds, it won't matter what kind of rig you have, your connection itself through your ISP will not be able to keep up with the demands of the game. In regards to one's rig, if you're using just integrated graphics, an ancient duo core processor, or just a basic $300 walmart machine that only has the bare minimum specs if that, then you're going to have a bad day. Not everyone can afford to drop $700+ for a gaming machine and I totally understand that. At the same time if you're going to try to play STO or any other game, you're going to need certain basic levels graphical and processing power etc if you want to actually play effectively.
Your router can also play a large factor into your connection, especially if you're running through wifi. With each different machine that logs onto your network and tries to use the internet, your internet speed is split up more and more among each device. So if you have 3 different devices, then your connection is being shared among those 3 devices. Certain routers are only rated for certain speeds as well. There can also be interference with your router depending on what frequency it's broadcasting or operating at. If you're operating at a 2.4Ghz and your microwave also operates at around that same frequency it can cause issues if your router or rig are close enough to it. Certain materials in furniture or your house can also absorb or deflect bits of the signal. The less you have between your router and your computer the better. The next thing you have to worry about is the modem. What kind of speeds can your modem pull off? Point being alot goes into the internet and keeping people connected.
There can be issues with the servers such as when the account server takes a dump, or something that happens on your end such as a brain lapse on your computer's end, but those are typically easy to spot. what's not easy is when it's not your rig or their server. If it's not your rig or their server then 99% of the time it will be completely out of Cryptic's control.
Star Trek Online volunteer Community Moderator
That is so cool. So they finally made a router that can dial the appropriate test number for your Central Office to lift (temporarily disconnect) your line at their end and then not only perform basic DC testing but also throws in some of the same functionality of commercial testing gear that can give a distance to the line fault. This would be step number one for copper (although I'd usually suspect and test for a customer premise fault first). Fiber would be slightly different but having transmission and loss testing in a router would be great as well.
None named a Dev - all that was said is it is Cryptic's side
What was named is that its Cryptic's responsibility and only Cryptic's problem. Since other games are not to be mentioned here I can name you privately at least 10 more demanding mmos that run fine or lag once a month. For some reason they dont seem to bother right now with their server problems. Even if they pay a host and its not their own server its still their option to use that host. How is it possible for every game to work fine except theirs?
Also I stated that mid population games cant afford losing players(and potential spenders) like this. Also the extent of people affected ranges from moderate(like me) and many others at a bad rate(might be half the armada I am in to give you an example) is big enough to cause a decent population drop, cause many people wait a while now for lag to be fixed. Their patience wont last forever
There hasnt been any offensive language used anywhere as far as I can see(other maybe than the title being in CAPS from the OP which is considered shouting) but the fact they state in patch notes to "reduce the feeling of lag" doesnt help cause it means they dont acknowledge the problem in first place and when you dont identify a problem, you cannot solve it. The wording also both from the patch and from twitter suggests they think people "imagine" they got lag - it does not help people who are experiencing that:
https://www.arcgames.com/index.php/fr/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/11205923-pc-patch-notes-for-7%2F11%2F19
I never played a game with that much lag as STO in the last few months. When several people from all over the world in teamspeak playing as a team have the same experience of lag at the same time has nothing to do with their rigs or internet connection. The one thing you forgot to mention is the poorly constructed graphic engine the game is using. There has always been lag in certain instances like Azura Nebula ect... I can't tell how much rubberbanding i encounter on a daily base but I can tell you is i play several other online games and its not happening there. If there is a lag spike on another game its an exception and while in this game here its the rule. Beam on to DS9 run to the exchange and find your self back where you just beamed in.
It is a Cryptic / PWE issue for sure but yeah I agree with one thing bashing the Dev's wont help and I don't think that the Dev's necessary can do something about this. However the lag is so frequently for people all over the world with different computer systems, internet and distance and if it happens to be at the same time in the same instance I can only assume its either the Server or the Software.
Doesn't having insufficient or baseline graphics or CPU usually manifest themselves in different ways as compared to latency? Low frame rates, stuttering or stalling game versus rubber banding...
And rubberbands in i3 with 16gb ram, SSD 256 hdd, 3gb vram card with 30 mbps connection that are my win 10 pc specs
my second PC is win 7 with AMD AM3+ triple core 8gb ram SATA3 7200 RPM disk 2gb VRam and same connection - both rubberband - especially Qonos First City, Beta Quadrant, Risa and Qonos Shipyard but can happen anywhere as spikes
Most of the people who lag a lot more, within my armada, got better specs even and close to equal connection at least
One has 50+ mbps I know
Yes the other areas you mentioned are worth looking at but its clear that the main problem is the security server not all those local issues you raised.
There are a number of things that prove its not a local problem most of the time
A: when it happens lot of people in local chat report the same thing at the same time.
B: When it happens it often effects the entire group.
C: When the game is suffering from rubberbanding it normally corresponds with the Akamni security server being in the 100’s or 1000’s of MS respond time and/or dropped packets from the same location. A large number of people are confirmed the same thing.
E: Many players have zero lag over dozens of games and only lag in STO which combined with above strongly points to a STO server related problem.
So please don’t dismiss that it’s a problem with the servers that Cryptic are using. It is not looking like it’s one of those localised problems you listed. It is widespread and effecting a large number of players and strongly looks like a server problem related to Cryptic use of Akamai. I see no evidence that is only effects a minority of players.
Yes and a lot more then 100's if not 1000’s. Local chat is just full of people all complaining at the same time combined with fleet chat, group chat and the many forum threads. I have not managed to run a HSE run in months without the entire group suffering from lag and/or disappearing ships. There is no way that’s a local problem when it happens pretty much 100% of the time over months and effects everyone in the group. Its clearly a server problem.
That is incorrect as the past has shown the Cryptic serves can be selective on who has the problem. Lag can be sever related and only effect certain players. Not only is the possible but it has been proven time and time again.
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Tracing route to patchserver.crypticstudios.com [208.95.184.200]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 1 ms <1 ms <1 ms homeportal [192.168.1.254]
2 8 ms 9 ms 9 ms 162-201-164-1.lightspeed.jcvlfl.sbcglobal.net [1
62.201.164.1]
3 2 ms 2 ms 2 ms 99.166.205.62
4 * * * Request timed out.
5 2 ms 3 ms 3 ms 12.83.101.9
6 16 ms 19 ms 15 ms attga402igs.ip.att.net [12.122.117.121]
7 21 ms 20 ms 15 ms 192.205.36.158
8 33 ms 33 ms 33 ms ae-11.r03.atlnga05.us.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.5.
57]
9 22 ms 36 ms 16 ms ae-3.r21.atlnga05.us.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.5.2
11]
10 34 ms 33 ms 33 ms ae-6.r23.dllstx09.us.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.4.1
16]
11 34 ms 34 ms 34 ms ae-6.r10.dllstx09.us.bb.gin.ntt.net [129.250.5.4
]
12 34 ms 34 ms 34 ms ae-0.akamai-prolexic.dllstx09.us.bb.gin.ntt.net
[128.241.219.102]
13 34 ms 34 ms 34 ms po110.bs-a.sech-dfw.netarch.akamai.com [23.57.10
2.243]
14 * * * Request timed out.
15 36 ms 35 ms 35 ms ae120.access-a.sech-dfw.netarch.akamai.com [23.5
7.102.249]
16 * * * Request timed out.
17 95 ms 94 ms 94 ms a72-52-28-178.deploy.static.akamaitechnologies.c
om [72.52.28.178]
18 107 ms 96 ms 96 ms 198.49.243.237
19 95 ms 95 ms 94 ms patchserver.crypticstudios.com [208.95.184.200]
Trace complete.
I have only problems in this game, and it is worse than ever.
they should stop to create monstrous effects for the players skills, if the servers can't handle them.
Well, having worked for an EPoS company, I was taught a fair bit about error diagnostics, so looking for where the router reports the errors (Near or Far-end FEC, CRC etc) is key, and how I knew it wasn't my end, which the Telecoms company were insisting it was. Had 4 engineer visits to test my equipment, and that was more annoying for OpenReach, because the Telecoms company was supposed to request a line investigation, not a home visit. The routers I've had have always been the same manufacturer and for over 10 years, I've been able to view that diagnostic screen.
But back to point, putting the blame on Cryptic for something that's not their fault or with-in their ability to fix is wrong. Akamai handle a considerable amount of net-traffic (up to 30% of it). My guess is they aren't playing fair with bandwidth or prioritization of traffic.