she looks better now than from season 1, if that's her....makeup is MUCH better, one can see the actress in there, and can probably emote, now.
Let's hope the damage control can work to make up for the first season.
Well... we all know first seasons aren't always the best. And naturally getting feedback from the actors themselves will lead to improvements in the costume.
It's just taking the Klingons a bit longer to get over the Phlox Effect.
I'm waiting for Discovery to get out from behind the paywall before I see it. I saw the pilot, and while I was not really impressed, I wasn't disappointed either. I think it's just not my kind of Trek.
the Klingon costumes really don't matter much to me. I liked the TOS fascist race. I liked the TNG samurai race. I don't dislike the Discovery religious fanatics, but I don't know much about them yet. Their appearance is just irrelevant. Story and characterization are much more important to me than latex masks.
I'd rather see a human with a Fu Manchu in a great story than the greatest alien costume ever in a mediocre story. Everything I saw in Discovery screamed mediocre to me, including the costumes.
It's just taking the Klingons a bit longer to get over the Phlox Effect.
I'm waiting for Discovery to get out from behind the paywall before I see it. I saw the pilot, and while I was not really impressed, I wasn't disappointed either. I think it's just not my kind of Trek.
the Klingon costumes really don't matter much to me. I liked the TOS fascist race. I liked the TNG samurai race. I don't dislike the Discovery religious fanatics, but I don't know much about them yet. Their appearance is just irrelevant. Story and characterization are much more important to me than latex masks.
I'd rather see a human with a Fu Manchu in a great story than the greatest alien costume ever in a mediocre story. Everything I saw in Discovery screamed mediocre to me, including the costumes.
the disco costumes were not so great to begin with.
I tell you honestly, Smokey, they should have gotten you to do the design work. You make stunning computer Trek art. I'm betting you could have done their Gothic horror theme ten times better with the tools those guys had.
I tell you honestly, Smokey, they should have gotten you to do the design work. You make stunning computer Trek art. I'm betting you could have done their Gothic horror theme ten times better with the tools those guys had.
No clue, never tried. o.o
Thanks, though!
Though certain folks would scream at me using tos styled stuffs......you know who you folks are.
hmmmm first impression: "Look, they gave hair to a Na'Khul!"
which is kinda the whole problem: They made Klingons into a generic bestial-monster appropriate to 50s era bad horror-sci-fi, now they're rolling back-but it's still generic evul alienz.
And... how does that make them different than when we first saw what would be the "modern" Klingon? Or any other iconic alien species we saw when budget and technology allowed for more than just minimal prosthetics making pretty much every single alien species look human save for maybe a recolor or ears?
hmmmm first impression: "Look, they gave hair to a Na'Khul!"
which is kinda the whole problem: They made Klingons into a generic bestial-monster appropriate to 50s era bad horror-sci-fi, now they're rolling back-but it's still generic evul alienz.
And... how does that make them different than when we first saw what would be the "modern" Klingon? Or any other iconic alien species we saw when budget and technology allowed for more than just minimal prosthetics making pretty much every single alien species look human save for maybe a recolor or ears?
An updated alien race has to look at least similar to the original. The Into Darkness Klingon at least looked like an updated version of a bald Klingon. There is nothing in common between Discovery Klingons and TNG Klingons. It makes no sense why the other original races of TOS still look extremely similar to their original appearance in Discovery, but Klingons look nothing like TOS Klingons or TNG Klingons. It is as if the Klingons were dumped in a vat of FEV and we get the Discovery Klingons as a result.
The issue with the Klingons is more than their appearance. They are stupid.
The "season one" Klingons were something visually different. Now, the radical re-design of their pod-ships into something looking like a D7 seems like empty pandering. Trying to appeal to an audience that does not like the show is a poor decision. The creative team behind Star Trek: Discovery would have been better off going with a new alien antagonist entirely. Also, they should stop stealing plot points and story beats from Star Trek V: The Final Frontier. Most critics and audiences dislike ST:V.
I think what we're seeing is a result of what the Klingons learned from the war with the Federation. The D7 could be what they made as a direct counter to many of the technologies available to Starfleet. A more durable, flexable, standardized platform vs what they had before. They can't rely on cloak tech anymore for years to come. So they need a ship that is not only easier to maintain, but can stand up to the most advanced Fed ships being deployed.
All we can do now is guess. Trying to speculate in a negative light is not going to solve anything. So frankly... why not just wait and see rather than make conspiracy theories that make it look bad. We already knew we would start seeing more TOS style elements back when season 1 came out. We're starting to see a bit of that now.
I think what we're seeing is a result of what the Klingons learned from the war with the Federation. The D7 could be what they made as a direct counter to many of the technologies available to Starfleet. A more durable, flexable, standardized platform vs what they had before. They can't rely on cloak tech anymore for years to come. So they need a ship that is not only easier to maintain, but can stand up to the most advanced Fed ships being deployed.
All we can do now is guess. Trying to speculate in a negative light is not going to solve anything. So frankly... why not just wait and see rather than make conspiracy theories that make it look bad. We already knew we would start seeing more TOS style elements back when season 1 came out. We're starting to see a bit of that now.
The K't'inga's not exactly revolutionary is it? A very similar design existed as far back as the ENT era and the BortaS bir, Qaw', Qoj, and Veqlargh classes and the ENT D5 are built on very similar lines as well. Hell, depending on how seriously we want to take the reused model then the ENT ship is the exact same ship as the TOS/TMP/DS9 K't'inga.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
But it looks like it would be easier to maintain compared to the designs we saw in Discovery. Ease of maintenance could be why the K'tinga was in service all the way through the Dominion War over 100 years later.
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if most of the Klingon ships in Discovery were 22nd century designs that remained in service for another century just because the Klingons had lost the ability to innovate. The new D7 seen in the trailer is what happens once they finally break free of that stagnant period and start fresh again.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them." -Thomas Marrone
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
All we can do now is guess. Trying to speculate in a negative light is not going to solve anything. So frankly... why not just wait and see rather than make conspiracy theories that make it look bad. We already knew we would start seeing more TOS style elements back when season 1 came out. We're starting to see a bit of that now.
"Conspiracy theory"? What, that people complained they did not like TRIBBLE's Klingons so the showrunners "altered their creative vision" to cater to the taste of complainers (and hope to attract more viewers)? You think THAT is a conspiracy theory? What a low bar. It does not even have bigfoot or aliens.
But it looks like it would be easier to maintain compared to the designs we saw in Discovery. Ease of maintenance could be why the K'tinga was in service all the way through the Dominion War over 100 years later.
I suspect it's unlikely it's simple maintenance. Most of the DSC ships look like their parts are easier to access as they're littering the hull rather than hidden behind panels.
It's probably just mass producibility. Whichever House made the ENT BoP, D5, D6/7/K'ti'inga (whatever it is) is now being placed in charge of the unified Klingon fleet rather than letting each house continue to make their own ships.
If it turns out the House native to Kronos is the dominant species and was the particular House featured in ENT then it explains why their ships became the default after the Houses kissed and made up.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
But it looks like it would be easier to maintain compared to the designs we saw in Discovery. Ease of maintenance could be why the K'tinga was in service all the way through the Dominion War over 100 years later.
I suspect it's unlikely it's simple maintenance. Most of the DSC ships look like their parts are easier to access as they're littering the hull rather than hidden behind panels.
But it looks like it would be easier to maintain compared to the designs we saw in Discovery. Ease of maintenance could be why the K'tinga was in service all the way through the Dominion War over 100 years later.
I suspect it's unlikely it's simple maintenance. Most of the DSC ships look like their parts are easier to access as they're littering the hull rather than hidden behind panels.
aka more vulnerable, like in Enterprise.
Yeah because those panels worked out really fine for the KT Conni.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
I don't know why every Trek series has to recon what came before.
The D7 was the contemporary of the Starship Class, (what Constitution was before she was she was Connie. There was a dedication plaque right beside the Transporter with that on it for three years.)
The Klingon ship in Discovery should be the D6, with the D7 being built just before or after the 1701 Enterprise. Unless the Connies are being built at this time in Discovery's timeline. In which case, there should be a few hundred D6s and D5 upgrades flying around too.
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
the constitution isn't being built...it already HAS been built - did you not see the enterprise at the end of S1?
Indeed - Discovery starts in 2256, which means that the NCC-1701 USS Enterprise has been in service for 11 years by the start of the series, given she was launched in 2245. By the time Kirk took command, the Enterprise was already 20 years old. Prior to the Enterprise, the Constellation, Defiant and Constitution had been built and were in service, it was hardly a new class of ship during Discovery's timeframe.
That the Constitution Class was still seen as the pre-eminent ship class for Starfleet during Kirk's time as Captain, says something for the engineering and design of the ship. But given the losses that Starfleet would have suffered during the Klingon War, the Constitution Class seems to have come through it unscathed and without any losses. It may have been the only ship class to survive that war in total. Perhaps that's why it became so important.
People ask how long have I been playing STO - well the answer is simple: I have been here since the beginning. I just haven't always had a lot to say.
smokebailey
Member Posts: 4,664 Arc User
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePvH7ZVeFHs
Comments
she looks better now than from season 1, if that's her....makeup is MUCH better, one can see the actress in there, and can probably emote, now.
Let's hope the damage control can work to make up for the first season.
Well... we all know first seasons aren't always the best. And naturally getting feedback from the actors themselves will lead to improvements in the costume.
I'm waiting for Discovery to get out from behind the paywall before I see it. I saw the pilot, and while I was not really impressed, I wasn't disappointed either. I think it's just not my kind of Trek.
the Klingon costumes really don't matter much to me. I liked the TOS fascist race. I liked the TNG samurai race. I don't dislike the Discovery religious fanatics, but I don't know much about them yet. Their appearance is just irrelevant. Story and characterization are much more important to me than latex masks.
I'd rather see a human with a Fu Manchu in a great story than the greatest alien costume ever in a mediocre story. Everything I saw in Discovery screamed mediocre to me, including the costumes.
the disco costumes were not so great to begin with.
No clue, never tried. o.o
Thanks, though!
Though certain folks would scream at me using tos styled stuffs......you know who you folks are.
And... how does that make them different than when we first saw what would be the "modern" Klingon? Or any other iconic alien species we saw when budget and technology allowed for more than just minimal prosthetics making pretty much every single alien species look human save for maybe a recolor or ears?
An updated alien race has to look at least similar to the original. The Into Darkness Klingon at least looked like an updated version of a bald Klingon. There is nothing in common between Discovery Klingons and TNG Klingons. It makes no sense why the other original races of TOS still look extremely similar to their original appearance in Discovery, but Klingons look nothing like TOS Klingons or TNG Klingons. It is as if the Klingons were dumped in a vat of FEV and we get the Discovery Klingons as a result.
The "season one" Klingons were something visually different. Now, the radical re-design of their pod-ships into something looking like a D7 seems like empty pandering. Trying to appeal to an audience that does not like the show is a poor decision. The creative team behind Star Trek: Discovery would have been better off going with a new alien antagonist entirely. Also, they should stop stealing plot points and story beats from Star Trek V: The Final Frontier. Most critics and audiences dislike ST:V.
All we can do now is guess. Trying to speculate in a negative light is not going to solve anything. So frankly... why not just wait and see rather than make conspiracy theories that make it look bad. We already knew we would start seeing more TOS style elements back when season 1 came out. We're starting to see a bit of that now.
The K't'inga's not exactly revolutionary is it? A very similar design existed as far back as the ENT era and the BortaS bir, Qaw', Qoj, and Veqlargh classes and the ENT D5 are built on very similar lines as well. Hell, depending on how seriously we want to take the reused model then the ENT ship is the exact same ship as the TOS/TMP/DS9 K't'inga.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
The only thing that the Discovery BoP has in common is the cannons on the beidge module.
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
My character Tsin'xing
I suspect it's unlikely it's simple maintenance. Most of the DSC ships look like their parts are easier to access as they're littering the hull rather than hidden behind panels.
It's probably just mass producibility. Whichever House made the ENT BoP, D5, D6/7/K'ti'inga (whatever it is) is now being placed in charge of the unified Klingon fleet rather than letting each house continue to make their own ships.
If it turns out the House native to Kronos is the dominant species and was the particular House featured in ENT then it explains why their ships became the default after the Houses kissed and made up.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
aka more vulnerable, like in Enterprise.
Yeah because those panels worked out really fine for the KT Conni.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
The D7 was the contemporary of the Starship Class, (what Constitution was before she was she was Connie. There was a dedication plaque right beside the Transporter with that on it for three years.)
The Klingon ship in Discovery should be the D6, with the D7 being built just before or after the 1701 Enterprise. Unless the Connies are being built at this time in Discovery's timeline. In which case, there should be a few hundred D6s and D5 upgrades flying around too.
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Indeed - Discovery starts in 2256, which means that the NCC-1701 USS Enterprise has been in service for 11 years by the start of the series, given she was launched in 2245. By the time Kirk took command, the Enterprise was already 20 years old. Prior to the Enterprise, the Constellation, Defiant and Constitution had been built and were in service, it was hardly a new class of ship during Discovery's timeframe.
That the Constitution Class was still seen as the pre-eminent ship class for Starfleet during Kirk's time as Captain, says something for the engineering and design of the ship. But given the losses that Starfleet would have suffered during the Klingon War, the Constitution Class seems to have come through it unscathed and without any losses. It may have been the only ship class to survive that war in total. Perhaps that's why it became so important.