Aye, they very briefly brought it up & addressed it during the live stream in a round about way. They never responded to all the direct questions regarding it though for clarification.
If I remember correctly their original intent was nice & true that with the level 61 free T5 ship selection there would be a Upgrade Token for that specific choice of ship. Kael, Al, & Jeremy then stated something about not being able to get it to function how they wanted so they File-13ed it. Still not sure if they're just delaying it or cowardly reneging on it totally since they dodged all the direct questions about it. I think Cryptic is just trying to discreetly sweep this one under the rug.
Is it the biggest thing? No. I look at it this way, they of course didn't have to be this nice, & now they're not at the last minute day of launch, but this would've probably benefited the "free" players the most by this gesture so there's less concern or incentive for Cryptic to follow through on this. If this was some generous gesture that was going to be for the LTS or "space rich" Cryptic would've gotten it done. TRIBBLE poor business ethics, but to play my own devil's advocate this shouldn't be a high priority right now at least neither.
The shame is this: Cryptic has issued bound Upgrade Tokens before having them be either Character or Account bound so they should just do that. The tokens would be bound so no interference with the in game economy & they're only going to be used on T5s anyways so no potential for any foul.
Those Cryptic: Kael, Al, & Jeremy also kept dodging in answering the question about why the playable Cardassians were more expensive than the other Store playable species.
I agree that the Level 61 Vice Admiral reward change was a kick in the gut. I looked at what was available and found very little that the voucher actually got you. I understand that they were trying to build hype, but it is sad to see that what many of us were looking forward to was yet another disappointment.
> @reddwarf#5987 said: > leemwatson wrote: » > > The original article definitely had it that we were getting an Upgraded T5U at Lvl 61 and that article has since been retconned. So does anyone know why they changed it? > > > > > They explained it in the stream. From what I remember, the original plan was when a character hits level 61, they would get a T5 ship and an upgrade token for that ship (and that ship only). However it turned out to be something of a technical challenge to limit the upgrade token to that one ship only, so they scrapped the idea.
As a game developer myself I can testify to something like that happening. This is why pre-release info is subject to change. Now, the question is, if/how they've made up for it.
> @nimbull said: > I just got the ship but I already got a T5 ship from leveling before. Really they should have just made a vanilla generic no frills T6 ship and put that as the reward. Monetizing things is one thing but come on. Even at T5 when 50 was the cap you got a free T5 ship. It's been T6 for a while now and really there should at least be a T6 free intro ship for hitting 65.
You have a good point and I agree. I mean, free Oddys would be nice but I can dream.
> @saedeith said: > reddwarf#5987 wrote: » > > leemwatson wrote: » > > The original article definitely had it that we were getting an Upgraded T5U at Lvl 61 and that article has since been retconned. So does anyone know why they changed it? > > > > > They explained it in the stream. From what I remember, the original plan was when a character hits level 61, they would get a T5 ship and an upgrade token for that ship (and that ship only). However it turned out to be something of a technical challenge to limit the upgrade token to that one ship only, so they scrapped the idea. > > > > > Seems more like not wanting people rolling toons for free upgrade tokens instead of buying them more than a technical issue. They could have implemented a system for those specific ships like the T5 lockbox ships that just have a free upgrade, not tokens.
That would only be feasible if the player didn't get a choice in what ship they wanted to claim as it has already been established by prior ship grants from previous level milestones. This means they'd have to choose at least 9+ ships that would have to work uniquely and independently in the way that you mentioned. By using a token they'd then be only working with 3 ships as opposed to 9+ since the token would be the enabling factor regardless of what ship is chosen. This is a textbook case where a design is sound but is technically unfeasible.
> @nimbull said:
> I just got the ship but I already got a T5 ship from leveling before. Really they should have just made a vanilla generic no frills T6 ship and put that as the reward. Monetizing things is one thing but come on. Even at T5 when 50 was the cap you got a free T5 ship. It's been T6 for a while now and really there should at least be a T6 free intro ship for hitting 65.
You have a good point and I agree. I mean, free Oddys would be nice but I can dream.
You can get a "free" Ody already, it just costs 200k Fleet Credits and a fleet with provisions. I've accumulated that already on my Vanguard toon, who I just started Tuesday night.
"Logic is a little tweeting bird chirping in a meadow. Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers which smell BAD." - Spock
Really, if the devs was having problems making the upgrade token for that one ship only for that character, All they had to do was actually say "Hey, we are having some issues for it not working as intended so we are pulling it."
But instead, they roundabout the question not wanting to give a clear and defined answer makes the players wonder if there was an ulterior motive. Kinda wished the devs would just be straight forward instead of hiding things.
I do enjoy getting a free ship at level 61, but on my FEDs, I can only choose between a cruiser or science vessel. No escort? And all my KDF got to choose from was fek'Ihri carrier. I haven't tried the Romulan characters yet, but I bet it's only one ship.
> @bergins said: > gameverseman wrote: » > > > @nimbull said: > > I just got the ship but I already got a T5 ship from leveling before. Really they should have just made a vanilla generic no frills T6 ship and put that as the reward. Monetizing things is one thing but come on. Even at T5 when 50 was the cap you got a free T5 ship. It's been T6 for a while now and really there should at least be a T6 free intro ship for hitting 65. > > You have a good point and I agree. I mean, free Oddys would be nice but I can dream. > > > > > You can get a "free" Ody already, it just costs 200k Fleet Credits and a fleet with provisions. I've accumulated that already on my Vanguard toon, who I just started Tuesday night.
I mean an 11 console Oddy as T6s is what was being addressed.
> @fftt said: > reddwarf#5987 wrote: » > > leemwatson wrote: » > > The original article definitely had it that we were getting an Upgraded T5U at Lvl 61 and that article has since been retconned. So does anyone know why they changed it? > > > > > They explained it in the stream. From what I remember, the original plan was when a character hits level 61, they would get a T5 ship and an upgrade token for that ship (and that ship only). However it turned out to be something of a technical challenge to limit the upgrade token to that one ship only, so they scrapped the idea. > > > > > I'm not seeing the big issue here. Is it really significant which ship gets upgraded? As long as they make the token character/account bound, like the vet reward, and non-tradable what is Cryptic losing? One of the points of VIL for me is the level cap increase and getting players an edge up past the last free T5 ships earned prior to VIL to prepare for level 65 mobs. Or am I missing something?
Some T5s are inherently 10 console ships. Using an upgrade on them puts them directly on par with their T6 counterparts. Look at the T5 Oddy. If you use an upgrade on it it will have the same exact base stats as the T6 Oddy excluding the specialist boff spot, console, and trait. Every other stat is identical. So, doing it that way would provide players a cost-reduced or cost-free way to get an end-game competitive ship. This reduces the incentive to purchase or grind for T6 ships. Ships and keys are the core sources of the money made from micro transactions. So, if there's less reason to make micro transactions, there's less money made. I'd like to remind people that Cryptic has to meet profit quotas to stay afloat especially since they're essentially earning money for their parent company PWE whom provides revenue and infrastructure for the studio. That's the big picture.
would be nice if they gave everyone One, bound to account Upgrade Token and say "sorry, our mistake, have this on us". Instead they said "oops", edited the news post, and quickly changed the subject. Not a good way to build player goodwill
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Something like that needs better communication than a section within a livestream that a lot of folk won't see because
A) twitch can often be a buffering nightmare and vods are even worse not the best timezone to be doing an afternoon Q&A session from anyway
C) it must have been something they knew about prior to release so why not have it under the known issues for the launch patch
D) as with C why not amend the text before launch and avoid a lot of confusion
> @nimbull said:
> I just got the ship but I already got a T5 ship from leveling before. Really they should have just made a vanilla generic no frills T6 ship and put that as the reward. Monetizing things is one thing but come on. Even at T5 when 50 was the cap you got a free T5 ship. It's been T6 for a while now and really there should at least be a T6 free intro ship for hitting 65.
You have a good point and I agree. I mean, free Oddys would be nice but I can dream.
You can get a "free" Ody already, it just costs 200k Fleet Credits and a fleet with provisions. I've accumulated that already on my Vanguard toon, who I just started Tuesday night.
That's not the same thing at all. You never had to pay credits, fleet credits, etc for a new tier of ship even when the level cap was 50 and you got a T5 freebee basic ship. The same should happen with T6 especially after two level cap increases. This could help encourage new players to stick around more.
The original article definitely had it that we were getting an Upgraded T5U at Lvl 61 and that article has since been retconned. So does anyone know why they changed it?
They explained it in the stream. From what I remember, the original plan was when a character hits level 61, they would get a T5 ship and an upgrade token for that ship (and that ship only). However it turned out to be something of a technical challenge to limit the upgrade token to that one ship only, so they scrapped the idea.
I'm not seeing the big issue here. Is it really significant which ship gets upgraded? As long as they make the token character/account bound, like the vet reward, and non-tradable what is Cryptic losing? One of the points of VIL for me is the level cap increase and getting players an edge up past the last free T5 ships earned prior to VIL to prepare for level 65 mobs. Or am I missing something?
Yes, it is VERY significant though maybe not the way you meant. Since the so called 'T5u' ships (with only one exception I have run into) are moldy old T4 and T3 retreads they feel like a massive step backwards, not an upgrade. Not only do they have the tired old lower-res look and shape of the T3s and T4s, all science captains except KDF get massively screwed over (for instance there are NO T5u science ships available AT ALL for the Romulans unless you can scale the very steep paywall to buy one with cash or EC).
At least the silly space steamer the KDF science captains get in place of the Vo'Quv is actually a fairly decent little carrier with no less in the way of science function than the Vo'Quv (not that they had a lot in the way of science functionality to begin with missing the secondary deflector the way they do). I do not think any other faction or profession gets anything that does not feel like a reversion from what I have seen so far, which is extremely disappointing.
> @fftt said:
> reddwarf#5987 wrote: »
>
> leemwatson wrote: »
>
> The original article definitely had it that we were getting an Upgraded T5U at Lvl 61 and that article has since been retconned. So does anyone know why they changed it?
>
>
>
>
> They explained it in the stream. From what I remember, the original plan was when a character hits level 61, they would get a T5 ship and an upgrade token for that ship (and that ship only). However it turned out to be something of a technical challenge to limit the upgrade token to that one ship only, so they scrapped the idea.
>
>
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> I'm not seeing the big issue here. Is it really significant which ship gets upgraded? As long as they make the token character/account bound, like the vet reward, and non-tradable what is Cryptic losing? One of the points of VIL for me is the level cap increase and getting players an edge up past the last free T5 ships earned prior to VIL to prepare for level 65 mobs. Or am I missing something?
Some T5s are inherently 10 console ships. Using an upgrade on them puts them directly on par with their T6 counterparts. Look at the T5 Oddy. If you use an upgrade on it it will have the same exact base stats as the T6 Oddy excluding the specialist boff spot, console, and trait. Every other stat is identical. So, doing it that way would provide players a cost-reduced or cost-free way to get an end-game competitive ship. This reduces the incentive to purchase or grind for T6 ships. Ships and keys are the core sources of the money made from micro transactions. So, if there's less reason to make micro transactions, there's less money made. I'd like to remind people that Cryptic has to meet profit quotas to stay afloat especially since they're essentially earning money for their parent company PWE whom provides revenue and infrastructure for the studio. That's the big picture.
STO does not have microtransactions, they just have cash shop transactions which is completely different. Microtransactions are defined as "about the price of a cup of coffee" and there is nothing in the cash shop that comes close to that, even if you take Starbucks prices as the standard. They work by the "why not" factor, where someone is likely to spend quite a bit over time if they consider the cost trivial, which is definitely NOT the case here.
> @bergins said:
> gameverseman wrote: »
>
> > @nimbull said:
> > I just got the ship but I already got a T5 ship from leveling before. Really they should have just made a vanilla generic no frills T6 ship and put that as the reward. Monetizing things is one thing but come on. Even at T5 when 50 was the cap you got a free T5 ship. It's been T6 for a while now and really there should at least be a T6 free intro ship for hitting 65.
>
> You have a good point and I agree. I mean, free Oddys would be nice but I can dream.
>
>
>
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> You can get a "free" Ody already, it just costs 200k Fleet Credits and a fleet with provisions. I've accumulated that already on my Vanguard toon, who I just started Tuesday night.
I mean an 11 console Oddy as T6s is what was being addressed.
Doesn't the Oddy also require a cash shop ticket item in addition to the fleet creds and provisions like every other fleet ship does?
I'm not even able to claim a ship on most of my characters (all 65), let alone an upgrade token. Scrolled through everything from Tiers 4-6, including fleet ships, and only a Romulan I think could buy anything with a token. Everything else was the normal currency.
Seems like a pretty underwhelming "reward" at this point.
> @phoenixc#0738 said: > gameverseman wrote: » > > > @fftt said: > > reddwarf#5987 wrote: » > > > > leemwatson wrote: » > > > > The original article definitely had it that we were getting an Upgraded T5U at Lvl 61 and that article has since been retconned. So does anyone know why they changed it? > > > > > > > > > > They explained it in the stream. From what I remember, the original plan was when a character hits level 61, they would get a T5 ship and an upgrade token for that ship (and that ship only). However it turned out to be something of a technical challenge to limit the upgrade token to that one ship only, so they scrapped the idea. > > > > > > > > > > I'm not seeing the big issue here. Is it really significant which ship gets upgraded? As long as they make the token character/account bound, like the vet reward, and non-tradable what is Cryptic losing? One of the points of VIL for me is the level cap increase and getting players an edge up past the last free T5 ships earned prior to VIL to prepare for level 65 mobs. Or am I missing something? > > Some T5s are inherently 10 console ships. Using an upgrade on them puts them directly on par with their T6 counterparts. Look at the T5 Oddy. If you use an upgrade on it it will have the same exact base stats as the T6 Oddy excluding the specialist boff spot, console, and trait. Every other stat is identical. So, doing it that way would provide players a cost-reduced or cost-free way to get an end-game competitive ship. This reduces the incentive to purchase or grind for T6 ships. Ships and keys are the core sources of the money made from micro transactions. So, if there's less reason to make micro transactions, there's less money made. I'd like to remind people that Cryptic has to meet profit quotas to stay afloat especially since they're essentially earning money for their parent company PWE whom provides revenue and infrastructure for the studio. That's the big picture. > > > > > STO does not have microtransactions, they just have cash shop transactions which is completely different. Microtransactions are defined as "about the price of a cup of coffee" and there is nothing in the cash shop that comes close to that, even if you take Starbucks prices as the standard. They work by the "why not" factor, where someone is likely to spend quite a bit over time if they consider the cost trivial, which is definitely NOT the case here.
> @phoenixc#0738 said: > gameverseman wrote: » > > > @bergins said: > > gameverseman wrote: » > > > > > @nimbull said: > > > I just got the ship but I already got a T5 ship from leveling before. Really they should have just made a vanilla generic no frills T6 ship and put that as the reward. Monetizing things is one thing but come on. Even at T5 when 50 was the cap you got a free T5 ship. It's been T6 for a while now and really there should at least be a T6 free intro ship for hitting 65. > > > > You have a good point and I agree. I mean, free Oddys would be nice but I can dream. > > > > > > > > > > You can get a "free" Ody already, it just costs 200k Fleet Credits and a fleet with provisions. I've accumulated that already on my Vanguard toon, who I just started Tuesday night. > > I mean an 11 console Oddy as T6s is what was being addressed. > > > > > Doesn't the Oddy also require a cash shop ticket item in addition to the fleet creds and provisions like every other fleet ship does?
Not the Oddy Star Cruiser. Just 200k fleet credits.
I'm not even able to claim a ship on most of my characters (all 65), let alone an upgrade token. Scrolled through everything from Tiers 4-6, including fleet ships, and only a Romulan I think could buy anything with a token. Everything else was the normal currency.
Seems like a pretty underwhelming "reward" at this point.
They're the T5 c-store retrofits. If you already own them the token doesn't do much for you. Consider that though from the perspective of someone else. It's a 2500 zen freebie (minus the consoles...in some cases.)
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I'm not even able to claim a ship on most of my characters (all 65), let alone an upgrade token. Scrolled through everything from Tiers 4-6, including fleet ships, and only a Romulan I think could buy anything with a token. Everything else was the normal currency.
Seems like a pretty underwhelming "reward" at this point.
They're the T5 c-store retrofits. If you already own them the token doesn't do much for you. Consider that though from the perspective of someone else. It's a 2500 zen freebie (minus the consoles...in some cases.)
Unfortunately they are 2500 zen useless items for many who do not already own them since there are not enough variety of them to cover all the factions and character types. Romulans do not have a science ship, the Klingons have no cruisers, and I am not sure what the Federation might be missing yet though I strongly suspect that at last one character class will not have a ship they can use too.
A lot of people will be stuck using their old T5s from level 40 even after reaching level 65. If the devs intended this ship at level 61 to give people ships that are more appropriate to the increased cap then they failed miserably, only a subset of players (maybe two out of three from what I have seen) will see any benefit. Many will be frustrated and furious when they get shafted by one of those gaps in ship types in the level 61 offerings, and that is not good for retaining players at all.
I'm not even able to claim a ship on most of my characters (all 65), let alone an upgrade token. Scrolled through everything from Tiers 4-6, including fleet ships, and only a Romulan I think could buy anything with a token. Everything else was the normal currency.
Seems like a pretty underwhelming "reward" at this point.
They're the T5 c-store retrofits. If you already own them the token doesn't do much for you. Consider that though from the perspective of someone else. It's a 2500 zen freebie (minus the consoles...in some cases.)
Unfortunately they are 2500 zen useless items for many who do not already own them since there are not enough variety of them to cover all the factions and character types. Romulans do not have a science ship, the Klingons have no cruisers, and I am not sure what the Federation might be missing yet though I strongly suspect that at last one character class will not have a ship they can use too.
A lot of people will be stuck using their old T5s from level 40 even after reaching level 65. If the devs intended this ship at level 61 to give people ships that are more appropriate to the increased cap then they failed miserably, only a subset of players (maybe two out of three from what I have seen) will see any benefit. Many will be frustrated and furious when they get shafted by one of those gaps in ship types in the level 61 offerings, and that is not good for retaining players at all.
All characters can use any ship.
If you refuse to use a ship because it's not a specific "type," that's your problem.
The original article definitely had it that we were getting an Upgraded T5U at Lvl 61 and that article has since been retconned. So does anyone know why they changed it?
They explained it in the stream. From what I remember, the original plan was when a character hits level 61, they would get a T5 ship and an upgrade token for that ship (and that ship only). However it turned out to be something of a technical challenge to limit the upgrade token to that one ship only, so they scrapped the idea.
I'm not seeing the big issue here. Is it really significant which ship gets upgraded? As long as they make the token character/account bound, like the vet reward, and non-tradable what is Cryptic losing? One of the points of VIL for me is the level cap increase and getting players an edge up past the last free T5 ships earned prior to VIL to prepare for level 65 mobs. Or am I missing something?
Free upgrade tokens per character are very easy to abuse even if they're bound to charcter. Ship upgrades are account wide unlocks, if character 1 upgrades a ship with a token then character 2-50 can upgrade it for free. So one could make a bunch of characters, doff till 52, do the admiratly till 61 and upgrade pretty much all ships he/she has without spending anything besides a couple minutes per character. And considering how convoluted and technically eleborate the alternatives would be I can understand why they scrapped that. Still should be better communicated though.
I'm not even able to claim a ship on most of my characters (all 65), let alone an upgrade token. Scrolled through everything from Tiers 4-6, including fleet ships, and only a Romulan I think could buy anything with a token. Everything else was the normal currency.
Seems like a pretty underwhelming "reward" at this point.
They're the T5 c-store retrofits. If you already own them the token doesn't do much for you. Consider that though from the perspective of someone else. It's a 2500 zen freebie (minus the consoles...in some cases.)
Unfortunately they are 2500 zen useless items for many who do not already own them since there are not enough variety of them to cover all the factions and character types. Romulans do not have a science ship, the Klingons have no cruisers, and I am not sure what the Federation might be missing yet though I strongly suspect that at last one character class will not have a ship they can use too.
While roms & kdf are in a pretty bad spot when it comes to early T5 variety feds are fully covered. They can choose between the T5 gal, T5 defiant and t5 intrepid. Would have been nice if the other 2 factions were as saturated but that only started after we got T6. Though I think the kdf does get all 3 profession covered. The B'rel, the Kar'fi and if I'm not mistaken the Marauder Flight-Deck Cruiser, not 100% if that one ia among the freebies as well.
A lot of people will be stuck using their old T5s from level 40 even after reaching level 65. If the devs intended this ship at level 61 to give people ships that are more appropriate to the increased cap then they failed miserably, only a subset of players (maybe two out of three from what I have seen) will see any benefit. Many will be frustrated and furious when they get shafted by one of those gaps in ship types in the level 61 offerings, and that is not good for retaining players at all.
Can't really blame cryptic if that happens now. Besides the very solid choice of ships they now get there's also 3 top of the line event ships each year, additionally to the various (though inconsistent) giveaways during the year. If you don't like flying the T5(u) Defiant, D'Deridex, B'rel, Kar'Fi, Mogai, Galaxy, etc. then that's your choice. They are solid ships and once upgarded to T5u via a token from the exchange or trading dilithum to zen they're perfectly fine to use at lvl 65. The game lives from the c-store and that's way they can't hand out everything for free.
Free upgrade tokens per character are very easy to abuse even if they're bound to charcter. Ship upgrades are account wide unlocks, if character 1 upgrades a ship with a token then character 2-50 can upgrade it for free. So one could make a bunch of characters, doff till 52, do the admiratly till 61 and upgrade pretty much all ships he/she has without spending anything besides a couple minutes per character. And considering how convoluted and technically eleborate the alternatives would be I can understand why they scrapped that. Still should be better communicated though.
Forget the doffing and admiralty, we've got jemmies that start at 60. They'd be ready to exploit as soon as they're out of the tutorial.
Im a LTS and Level 65 KDF aligned Van'hadar. I got the Karfi(Kafri? sp?) for free but nothing else pops with the token. The retrofits pop like the oddy, 200k fc. Im glad others are getting what they are supposed to but im wondering why its not working for everyone?
OP, well i cant say i blame them if something didn't work right, don't use it, but it is kind of annoying. I know things are subject to change in those pre-release articles, but why even post them if you can't deliver? They should have waited on that one till closer to launch when they had a better idea of what they could actually do.
The original article definitely had it that we were getting an Upgraded T5U at Lvl 61 and that article has since been retconned. So does anyone know why they changed it?
They explained it in the stream. From what I remember, the original plan was when a character hits level 61, they would get a T5 ship and an upgrade token for that ship (and that ship only). However it turned out to be something of a technical challenge to limit the upgrade token to that one ship only, so they scrapped the idea.
And how exactly is this a "technical problem"? Seriously, how? I mean every T5 ship in the Phoenix pack comes with a upgrade, all you have to to is click upgrade on the ship. One that you can't use on any other ship.
trennan, they don't know which you'll choose. If they only had 1 option per faction they could do it that way. But you are supposed to have 3. If they set all 3 to be free upgrade then anyone who buys them would get a free upgrade as well, which cryptic does not want. Even if they only had 1, the problem of free upgrades for purchasers would exist unless they took away the ability to purchase these ships, which would not be well received.
Comments
If I remember correctly their original intent was nice & true that with the level 61 free T5 ship selection there would be a Upgrade Token for that specific choice of ship. Kael, Al, & Jeremy then stated something about not being able to get it to function how they wanted so they File-13ed it. Still not sure if they're just delaying it or cowardly reneging on it totally since they dodged all the direct questions about it. I think Cryptic is just trying to discreetly sweep this one under the rug.
Is it the biggest thing? No. I look at it this way, they of course didn't have to be this nice, & now they're not at the last minute day of launch, but this would've probably benefited the "free" players the most by this gesture so there's less concern or incentive for Cryptic to follow through on this. If this was some generous gesture that was going to be for the LTS or "space rich" Cryptic would've gotten it done. TRIBBLE poor business ethics, but to play my own devil's advocate this shouldn't be a high priority right now at least neither.
The shame is this: Cryptic has issued bound Upgrade Tokens before having them be either Character or Account bound so they should just do that. The tokens would be bound so no interference with the in game economy & they're only going to be used on T5s anyways so no potential for any foul.
Those Cryptic: Kael, Al, & Jeremy also kept dodging in answering the question about why the playable Cardassians were more expensive than the other Store playable species.
> leemwatson wrote: »
>
> The original article definitely had it that we were getting an Upgraded T5U at Lvl 61 and that article has since been retconned. So does anyone know why they changed it?
>
>
>
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> They explained it in the stream. From what I remember, the original plan was when a character hits level 61, they would get a T5 ship and an upgrade token for that ship (and that ship only). However it turned out to be something of a technical challenge to limit the upgrade token to that one ship only, so they scrapped the idea.
As a game developer myself I can testify to something like that happening. This is why pre-release info is subject to change. Now, the question is, if/how they've made up for it.
> I just got the ship but I already got a T5 ship from leveling before. Really they should have just made a vanilla generic no frills T6 ship and put that as the reward. Monetizing things is one thing but come on. Even at T5 when 50 was the cap you got a free T5 ship. It's been T6 for a while now and really there should at least be a T6 free intro ship for hitting 65.
You have a good point and I agree. I mean, free Oddys would be nice but I can dream.
> reddwarf#5987 wrote: »
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> leemwatson wrote: »
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> The original article definitely had it that we were getting an Upgraded T5U at Lvl 61 and that article has since been retconned. So does anyone know why they changed it?
>
>
>
>
> They explained it in the stream. From what I remember, the original plan was when a character hits level 61, they would get a T5 ship and an upgrade token for that ship (and that ship only). However it turned out to be something of a technical challenge to limit the upgrade token to that one ship only, so they scrapped the idea.
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> Seems more like not wanting people rolling toons for free upgrade tokens instead of buying them more than a technical issue. They could have implemented a system for those specific ships like the T5 lockbox ships that just have a free upgrade, not tokens.
That would only be feasible if the player didn't get a choice in what ship they wanted to claim as it has already been established by prior ship grants from previous level milestones. This means they'd have to choose at least 9+ ships that would have to work uniquely and independently in the way that you mentioned. By using a token they'd then be only working with 3 ships as opposed to 9+ since the token would be the enabling factor regardless of what ship is chosen. This is a textbook case where a design is sound but is technically unfeasible.
You can get a "free" Ody already, it just costs 200k Fleet Credits and a fleet with provisions. I've accumulated that already on my Vanguard toon, who I just started Tuesday night.
But instead, they roundabout the question not wanting to give a clear and defined answer makes the players wonder if there was an ulterior motive. Kinda wished the devs would just be straight forward instead of hiding things.
I do enjoy getting a free ship at level 61, but on my FEDs, I can only choose between a cruiser or science vessel. No escort? And all my KDF got to choose from was fek'Ihri carrier. I haven't tried the Romulan characters yet, but I bet it's only one ship.
> gameverseman wrote: »
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> > @nimbull said:
> > I just got the ship but I already got a T5 ship from leveling before. Really they should have just made a vanilla generic no frills T6 ship and put that as the reward. Monetizing things is one thing but come on. Even at T5 when 50 was the cap you got a free T5 ship. It's been T6 for a while now and really there should at least be a T6 free intro ship for hitting 65.
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> You have a good point and I agree. I mean, free Oddys would be nice but I can dream.
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> You can get a "free" Ody already, it just costs 200k Fleet Credits and a fleet with provisions. I've accumulated that already on my Vanguard toon, who I just started Tuesday night.
I mean an 11 console Oddy as T6s is what was being addressed.
> reddwarf#5987 wrote: »
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> leemwatson wrote: »
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> The original article definitely had it that we were getting an Upgraded T5U at Lvl 61 and that article has since been retconned. So does anyone know why they changed it?
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> They explained it in the stream. From what I remember, the original plan was when a character hits level 61, they would get a T5 ship and an upgrade token for that ship (and that ship only). However it turned out to be something of a technical challenge to limit the upgrade token to that one ship only, so they scrapped the idea.
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> I'm not seeing the big issue here. Is it really significant which ship gets upgraded? As long as they make the token character/account bound, like the vet reward, and non-tradable what is Cryptic losing? One of the points of VIL for me is the level cap increase and getting players an edge up past the last free T5 ships earned prior to VIL to prepare for level 65 mobs. Or am I missing something?
Some T5s are inherently 10 console ships. Using an upgrade on them puts them directly on par with their T6 counterparts. Look at the T5 Oddy. If you use an upgrade on it it will have the same exact base stats as the T6 Oddy excluding the specialist boff spot, console, and trait. Every other stat is identical. So, doing it that way would provide players a cost-reduced or cost-free way to get an end-game competitive ship. This reduces the incentive to purchase or grind for T6 ships. Ships and keys are the core sources of the money made from micro transactions. So, if there's less reason to make micro transactions, there's less money made. I'd like to remind people that Cryptic has to meet profit quotas to stay afloat especially since they're essentially earning money for their parent company PWE whom provides revenue and infrastructure for the studio. That's the big picture.
A) twitch can often be a buffering nightmare and vods are even worse
C) it must have been something they knew about prior to release so why not have it under the known issues for the launch patch
D) as with C why not amend the text before launch and avoid a lot of confusion
That's not the same thing at all. You never had to pay credits, fleet credits, etc for a new tier of ship even when the level cap was 50 and you got a T5 freebee basic ship. The same should happen with T6 especially after two level cap increases. This could help encourage new players to stick around more.
Yes, it is VERY significant though maybe not the way you meant. Since the so called 'T5u' ships (with only one exception I have run into) are moldy old T4 and T3 retreads they feel like a massive step backwards, not an upgrade. Not only do they have the tired old lower-res look and shape of the T3s and T4s, all science captains except KDF get massively screwed over (for instance there are NO T5u science ships available AT ALL for the Romulans unless you can scale the very steep paywall to buy one with cash or EC).
At least the silly space steamer the KDF science captains get in place of the Vo'Quv is actually a fairly decent little carrier with no less in the way of science function than the Vo'Quv (not that they had a lot in the way of science functionality to begin with missing the secondary deflector the way they do). I do not think any other faction or profession gets anything that does not feel like a reversion from what I have seen so far, which is extremely disappointing.
STO does not have microtransactions, they just have cash shop transactions which is completely different. Microtransactions are defined as "about the price of a cup of coffee" and there is nothing in the cash shop that comes close to that, even if you take Starbucks prices as the standard. They work by the "why not" factor, where someone is likely to spend quite a bit over time if they consider the cost trivial, which is definitely NOT the case here.
Doesn't the Oddy also require a cash shop ticket item in addition to the fleet creds and provisions like every other fleet ship does?
Seems like a pretty underwhelming "reward" at this point.
> gameverseman wrote: »
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> > @fftt said:
> > reddwarf#5987 wrote: »
> >
> > leemwatson wrote: »
> >
> > The original article definitely had it that we were getting an Upgraded T5U at Lvl 61 and that article has since been retconned. So does anyone know why they changed it?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > They explained it in the stream. From what I remember, the original plan was when a character hits level 61, they would get a T5 ship and an upgrade token for that ship (and that ship only). However it turned out to be something of a technical challenge to limit the upgrade token to that one ship only, so they scrapped the idea.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > I'm not seeing the big issue here. Is it really significant which ship gets upgraded? As long as they make the token character/account bound, like the vet reward, and non-tradable what is Cryptic losing? One of the points of VIL for me is the level cap increase and getting players an edge up past the last free T5 ships earned prior to VIL to prepare for level 65 mobs. Or am I missing something?
>
> Some T5s are inherently 10 console ships. Using an upgrade on them puts them directly on par with their T6 counterparts. Look at the T5 Oddy. If you use an upgrade on it it will have the same exact base stats as the T6 Oddy excluding the specialist boff spot, console, and trait. Every other stat is identical. So, doing it that way would provide players a cost-reduced or cost-free way to get an end-game competitive ship. This reduces the incentive to purchase or grind for T6 ships. Ships and keys are the core sources of the money made from micro transactions. So, if there's less reason to make micro transactions, there's less money made. I'd like to remind people that Cryptic has to meet profit quotas to stay afloat especially since they're essentially earning money for their parent company PWE whom provides revenue and infrastructure for the studio. That's the big picture.
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> STO does not have microtransactions, they just have cash shop transactions which is completely different. Microtransactions are defined as "about the price of a cup of coffee" and there is nothing in the cash shop that comes close to that, even if you take Starbucks prices as the standard. They work by the "why not" factor, where someone is likely to spend quite a bit over time if they consider the cost trivial, which is definitely NOT the case here.
Cup of Coffee = Master Key
> gameverseman wrote: »
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> > @bergins said:
> > gameverseman wrote: »
> >
> > > @nimbull said:
> > > I just got the ship but I already got a T5 ship from leveling before. Really they should have just made a vanilla generic no frills T6 ship and put that as the reward. Monetizing things is one thing but come on. Even at T5 when 50 was the cap you got a free T5 ship. It's been T6 for a while now and really there should at least be a T6 free intro ship for hitting 65.
> >
> > You have a good point and I agree. I mean, free Oddys would be nice but I can dream.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > You can get a "free" Ody already, it just costs 200k Fleet Credits and a fleet with provisions. I've accumulated that already on my Vanguard toon, who I just started Tuesday night.
>
> I mean an 11 console Oddy as T6s is what was being addressed.
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> Doesn't the Oddy also require a cash shop ticket item in addition to the fleet creds and provisions like every other fleet ship does?
Not the Oddy Star Cruiser. Just 200k fleet credits.
They're the T5 c-store retrofits. If you already own them the token doesn't do much for you. Consider that though from the perspective of someone else. It's a 2500 zen freebie (minus the consoles...in some cases.)
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Unfortunately they are 2500 zen useless items for many who do not already own them since there are not enough variety of them to cover all the factions and character types. Romulans do not have a science ship, the Klingons have no cruisers, and I am not sure what the Federation might be missing yet though I strongly suspect that at last one character class will not have a ship they can use too.
A lot of people will be stuck using their old T5s from level 40 even after reaching level 65. If the devs intended this ship at level 61 to give people ships that are more appropriate to the increased cap then they failed miserably, only a subset of players (maybe two out of three from what I have seen) will see any benefit. Many will be frustrated and furious when they get shafted by one of those gaps in ship types in the level 61 offerings, and that is not good for retaining players at all.
If you refuse to use a ship because it's not a specific "type," that's your problem.
Free upgrade tokens per character are very easy to abuse even if they're bound to charcter. Ship upgrades are account wide unlocks, if character 1 upgrades a ship with a token then character 2-50 can upgrade it for free. So one could make a bunch of characters, doff till 52, do the admiratly till 61 and upgrade pretty much all ships he/she has without spending anything besides a couple minutes per character. And considering how convoluted and technically eleborate the alternatives would be I can understand why they scrapped that. Still should be better communicated though.
While roms & kdf are in a pretty bad spot when it comes to early T5 variety feds are fully covered. They can choose between the T5 gal, T5 defiant and t5 intrepid. Would have been nice if the other 2 factions were as saturated but that only started after we got T6. Though I think the kdf does get all 3 profession covered. The B'rel, the Kar'fi and if I'm not mistaken the Marauder Flight-Deck Cruiser, not 100% if that one ia among the freebies as well.
Can't really blame cryptic if that happens now. Besides the very solid choice of ships they now get there's also 3 top of the line event ships each year, additionally to the various (though inconsistent) giveaways during the year. If you don't like flying the T5(u) Defiant, D'Deridex, B'rel, Kar'Fi, Mogai, Galaxy, etc. then that's your choice. They are solid ships and once upgarded to T5u via a token from the exchange or trading dilithum to zen they're perfectly fine to use at lvl 65. The game lives from the c-store and that's way they can't hand out everything for free.
OP, well i cant say i blame them if something didn't work right, don't use it, but it is kind of annoying. I know things are subject to change in those pre-release articles, but why even post them if you can't deliver? They should have waited on that one till closer to launch when they had a better idea of what they could actually do.
And how exactly is this a "technical problem"? Seriously, how? I mean every T5 ship in the Phoenix pack comes with a upgrade, all you have to to is click upgrade on the ship. One that you can't use on any other ship.
Edit: Mouse bug and doing a double quote.