But that last episode. God was that hysterically bad.
When you have to go and apologize for it, you know it's pretty bad. This time, it wasn't Water Temple bad, but a whole different kind of bad they had to apologize for.
Worst Star Trek Episode ever, goes to TNG and the whole "Warp drive is causing singularities and damage to the universe!"
Which was a lame attempt to get people to look at what fossil fuels were doing to the environment.
Star Trek Battles member. Want to roll with a good group of people regardless of fleets and not have to worry about DPS while doing STFs? Come join the channel and join in the fun!
rick berman was one of lead co-writer, director, producer, Fontiana was other member of writer, director, they rotate with 2 other in the team. there is 4 of them.
no wonder why those series had so many holes in various epidoses and too many loose ends.
Jonathan Flakes did direct some epidoses in final season, and did pretty well, he not part of those 4 guys, took over when some of core team writers decide to bail out on last season, so he took over some. he was unable to catch many loose ends to have wrap up. those who quit just became "editors" in final season.
Um, what?
Rick Berman and Brannon Braga were the producers of ENT for the first three years; in the fourth year, they handed off the duties to Manny Coto, but not before also sticking him with time-traveling alien N*zi lizards. Episodes were written by lots of people, which is fairly traditional on TV, and cleared (and often solicited) by the producer(s). B&B did return to both write and direct that infamous final episode, which they described at the time as "a love letter to the fans" (if so, it's the kind of "love letter" that's accompanied by dead flowers).
To the best of my knowledge, D.C. Fontana had nothing to do with ENT, which may explain its overall (poor) quality. I'm also unaware of any episodes directed by Jonathan Frakes, but he certainly never either wrote or produced any, as that's not part of his skillset and he knows it.
I never understood the Enterprise hate. I'm actually rewatching the series right now and I still enjoy the hell out of this show. Does it have a few bad episodes? Sure, but name a Star Trek series that doesn't have a few bad episodes. Either way, despite anyone's opinion of the show's quality, it's still canon and I would love to see more of it in the future. Specifically, I want the NX-class refit. The Official Starship Collection got to make one, so STO should be able to make one as well.
Star Trek Beyond SPOILERS...
This will probably never happen, but it would be neat if we went back in time and saw the Earth-Romulan War where we get to fight side-by-side a MACO squad commanded by Balthazar Edison, voiced by Idris Elba. They did finally add the classic MACO uniforms to STO so they might as well put them to good use. I'm sure people would be quick to point out that no human or Romulan saw each other face to face during the war so MACO fighting Romulans on the ground would be a canon violation, but I think they could easily get around that.
First off we could fight in a hazardous environment requiring EV suits. Good place to introduce the MACO EV Suit to the game. A 22nd century Romulan EV suit could be designed and so no physical features of the Romulans are seen by any human, despite engaging them in combat on the ground. Second, maybe there were ground battles but no one ever got up close and personal? Remember the ground battle of Cestus III had the Gorn and Starfleet officers shooting mortars at each other. Despite the ground battle they were fighting, the two would not actually see each other until Kirk faced the Gorn captain later on. We could meet up on a planet where Edison's unit is being shelled by Romulans from afar, but the player gets the opportunity to break through their defenses and assist because we already know what a Romulan looks like.
Oh another thing I would add, because it's something I wanted to see on Enterprise before it was canceled, is Captain Stiles. Perhaps he can command the NX-03 or something, but if we visit the 22nd century, (specifically Earth-Romulan War), then we really need to bring it full circle with Captain Stiles. Or really, any member of the Stiles family during that time.
I say cool but hell no cause all cryptic/pe going to do is put it in a d.a.m.n. lock box the most dumbest thing ever thought of and brought into the game system the lock box
I say cool but hell no cause all cryptic/pe going to do is put it in a d.a.m.n. lock box the most dumbest thing ever thought of and brought into the game system the lock box
So, you basically just came into the thread to complain about lock boxes. Simply incredible.
I say cool but hell no cause all cryptic/pe going to do is put it in a d.a.m.n. lock box the most dumbest thing ever thought of and brought into the game system the lock box
So, you basically just came into the thread to complain about lock boxes. Simply incredible.
They saw each other face to face. It's a retcon. It wasn't fought with primitive nuclear weapons either but with spatial torpedos and phasers.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
if its not going to be in the Z store then it shouldn't be in the game cause only a select few get ships from a dumb lock box and the reason for me saying that is in the Z store its available for all not to be gambling with lock boxes the T6 connie and the dreadnought shouldn't been put into the game if it was lock box exclusive those ships should of been Z store ships for everyone to use or able to get not a gambling system box where only a select few gets them.
I say cool but hell no cause all cryptic/pe going to do is put it in a d.a.m.n. lock box the most dumbest thing ever thought of and brought into the game system the lock box
So, you basically just came into the thread to complain about lock boxes. Simply incredible.
They saw each other face to face. It's a retcon. It wasn't fought with primitive nuclear weapons either but with spatial torpedos and phasers.
And then, there was TNG's 'A matter of time', in which Worf told a trime-travelling criminal that Phasers didn't exist in the 22nd century...
The NX-01 didn't have phasers, it was equipped with Phase Cannons, and crew members used Phase Pistols, precursors to actual phasers (even though they look exactly the same).
They saw each other face to face. It's a retcon. It wasn't fought with primitive nuclear weapons either but with spatial torpedos and phasers.
And then, there was TNG's 'A matter of time', in which Worf told a trime-travelling criminal that Phasers didn't exist in the 22nd century...
The NX-01 didn't have phasers, it was equipped with Phase Cannons, and crew members used Phase Pistols, precursors to actual phasers (even though they look exactly the same).
Actually the phase cannons gave way to full phasers. And in Enterprise phasers started coming in. Replaced the old Phase pistols because Hiroshi had to qualify on the new phasers and could barely hit the broadside of a barn because of how different they were to the older phase pistols.
Star Trek Battles member. Want to roll with a good group of people regardless of fleets and not have to worry about DPS while doing STFs? Come join the channel and join in the fun!
Actually the phase cannons gave way to full phasers. And in Enterprise phasers started coming in. Replaced the old Phase pistols because Hiroshi had to qualify on the new phasers and could barely hit the broadside of a barn because of how different they were to the older phase pistols.
Actually... I think you're referring to the difference between the EM pistols that Starfleet was using before the introduction of the Phase Pistol. Unlike the EM pistols, the Phase Pistols didn't need the aim corrected due to particle drift. Phase weapons replaced the plasma cannons and EM weapons that were in use.
They saw each other face to face. It's a retcon. It wasn't fought with primitive nuclear weapons either but with spatial torpedos and phasers.
If you consider the Enterprise era events in Star Trek Legacy to be a good example of the Earth-Romulan War, then using old abandoned fusion powered stations to disable the Romulan ships with an EMP by detonating the stations would qualify as Nuclear Weapons. While not the traditional sense of the term, the fusion reactors were pretty much nuclear, and Romulan ships weren't EM shielded like their Starfleet counterparts.
I would love to see some more ENT-era ships in STO, but I wouldn't get my hopes up. Certainly not for T6.
Regrading the Earth/Romulan war... let's break down Spock's speech piece by piece:
"As you recall from your histories, this conflict was fought, by our standards today, with primitive atomic weapons..."
"By our standards today" kind of leaves the whole thing to interpretation by itself. And "primitive atomic weapons" could be a reference to the spatial torpedoes used in seasons 1-2.
Also, remember that Earth's fleet was pretty tiny at the time. The Romulans probably outnumbered them ten to one. So of course Earth's ships were primitive: they had to constantly pump them out to the front lines to replace their losses.
"...and in primitive space vessels which allowed no quarter, no captives."
Enterprise was easily the largest Earth ship we saw in the show, and its brig only had room for two people. And considering how nasty the fighting probably was in space, I doubt there were any Romulan prisoners, period.
"Nor was there even ship-to-ship, visual communication; therefore, no Human, Romulan, or ally has ever seen the other."
This one is the only thing that flat-out doesn't work, and the other shows were wise to retcon it. Still, since much of the fighting also likely took place in space, it's not like there would have been many opportunities to study the Romulan dead.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them." -Thomas Marrone
They saw each other face to face. It's a retcon. It wasn't fought with primitive nuclear weapons either but with spatial torpedos and phasers.
And then, there was TNG's 'A matter of time', in which Worf told a trime-travelling criminal that Phasers didn't exist in the 22nd century...
The NX-01 didn't have phasers, it was equipped with Phase Cannons, and crew members used Phase Pistols, precursors to actual phasers (even though they look exactly the same).
All of which are phasers. Though replaced later with other, newer phasers. There's also the pulse phasers of the Franklin mentioned in Beyond.
If you consider the Enterprise era events in Star Trek Legacy to be a good example of the Earth-Romulan War, then using old abandoned fusion powered stations to disable the Romulan ships with an EMP by detonating the stations would qualify as Nuclear Weapons. While not the traditional sense of the term, the fusion reactors were pretty much nuclear, and Romulan ships weren't EM shielded like their Starfleet counterparts.
That sounds like non-canon to me.
Basically, almost no part of Balance of Terror can have happened as we saw in the episode, it's past (the Romulan War) or its present (the episode itself).
Romulan cloaks being a surprise - They cloaked in ENT.
Unknown connection between Romulans and Vulcans (that even surprised Spock) - The Sundering is a well known part of Vulcan history and the RAS is a well known space power to older space faring races like the Vulcans.
Romulans not having warp - Romulan Star Empire.
No quarter, no captives - Sure, for Humans. Vulcans and Andorians, however, are on par with the Romulans of the time. After the kidnap of the Anaer I can see the Andorians specifically looking for a little TRIBBLE for tat.
Primitive ships - Archer would be mortally offended there. Though I will concede the Franklin is fairly basic compared to the NX Class. though I suspect that's not what Spock was getting at. The NX is not that much less advance than the TOSprise, it has all the same features (anti-grav, synthesisers, deflector, shuttlebay, dilithium based warp core etc.), the basics of the Federation Starship don't change from the NX Class to the Universe Class (excluding time ships like the Wells).
Nuclear weapons - neither phasers or spatial torpedoes are nuclear.
Subspace radio based war - There's no way that makes logistical sense even in simplistic TOS never mind in the reality of ENT.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
MACO EV Suits? Only 3.5 Million Dilitium, but you must act fast. This price will only go up, so call in the next 15 minutes.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Giving us a I.S.S Prefix in the C-Store? Along with Terran emblem imprinted on the front hull.
But yeah, NX T6 or T5 would be nice to fly around in.
Post edited by terranempire#7881 on
"Great men are not peacemakers, Great men are conquerors!" - Captain Archer" "When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway #Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
Comments
Worst Star Trek Episode ever, goes to TNG and the whole "Warp drive is causing singularities and damage to the universe!"
Which was a lame attempt to get people to look at what fossil fuels were doing to the environment.
Star Trek Battles member. Want to roll with a good group of people regardless of fleets and not have to worry about DPS while doing STFs? Come join the channel and join in the fun!
http://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1145998/star-trek-battles-channel-got-canon/p1
I think that could be said for the entire series.
Rick Berman and Brannon Braga were the producers of ENT for the first three years; in the fourth year, they handed off the duties to Manny Coto, but not before also sticking him with time-traveling alien N*zi lizards. Episodes were written by lots of people, which is fairly traditional on TV, and cleared (and often solicited) by the producer(s). B&B did return to both write and direct that infamous final episode, which they described at the time as "a love letter to the fans" (if so, it's the kind of "love letter" that's accompanied by dead flowers).
To the best of my knowledge, D.C. Fontana had nothing to do with ENT, which may explain its overall (poor) quality. I'm also unaware of any episodes directed by Jonathan Frakes, but he certainly never either wrote or produced any, as that's not part of his skillset and he knows it.
so much truth there
Star Trek Beyond SPOILERS...
This will probably never happen, but it would be neat if we went back in time and saw the Earth-Romulan War where we get to fight side-by-side a MACO squad commanded by Balthazar Edison, voiced by Idris Elba. They did finally add the classic MACO uniforms to STO so they might as well put them to good use. I'm sure people would be quick to point out that no human or Romulan saw each other face to face during the war so MACO fighting Romulans on the ground would be a canon violation, but I think they could easily get around that.
First off we could fight in a hazardous environment requiring EV suits. Good place to introduce the MACO EV Suit to the game. A 22nd century Romulan EV suit could be designed and so no physical features of the Romulans are seen by any human, despite engaging them in combat on the ground. Second, maybe there were ground battles but no one ever got up close and personal? Remember the ground battle of Cestus III had the Gorn and Starfleet officers shooting mortars at each other. Despite the ground battle they were fighting, the two would not actually see each other until Kirk faced the Gorn captain later on. We could meet up on a planet where Edison's unit is being shelled by Romulans from afar, but the player gets the opportunity to break through their defenses and assist because we already know what a Romulan looks like.
Oh another thing I would add, because it's something I wanted to see on Enterprise before it was canceled, is Captain Stiles. Perhaps he can command the NX-03 or something, but if we visit the 22nd century, (specifically Earth-Romulan War), then we really need to bring it full circle with Captain Stiles. Or really, any member of the Stiles family during that time.
So, you basically just came into the thread to complain about lock boxes. Simply incredible.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
And then, there was TNG's 'A matter of time', in which Worf told a trime-travelling criminal that Phasers didn't exist in the 22nd century...
The NX-01 didn't have phasers, it was equipped with Phase Cannons, and crew members used Phase Pistols, precursors to actual phasers (even though they look exactly the same).
Yes, I would love to see this in game.
Actually the phase cannons gave way to full phasers. And in Enterprise phasers started coming in. Replaced the old Phase pistols because Hiroshi had to qualify on the new phasers and could barely hit the broadside of a barn because of how different they were to the older phase pistols.
Star Trek Battles member. Want to roll with a good group of people regardless of fleets and not have to worry about DPS while doing STFs? Come join the channel and join in the fun!
http://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1145998/star-trek-battles-channel-got-canon/p1
Actually... I think you're referring to the difference between the EM pistols that Starfleet was using before the introduction of the Phase Pistol. Unlike the EM pistols, the Phase Pistols didn't need the aim corrected due to particle drift. Phase weapons replaced the plasma cannons and EM weapons that were in use.
If you consider the Enterprise era events in Star Trek Legacy to be a good example of the Earth-Romulan War, then using old abandoned fusion powered stations to disable the Romulan ships with an EMP by detonating the stations would qualify as Nuclear Weapons. While not the traditional sense of the term, the fusion reactors were pretty much nuclear, and Romulan ships weren't EM shielded like their Starfleet counterparts.
Regrading the Earth/Romulan war... let's break down Spock's speech piece by piece:
"As you recall from your histories, this conflict was fought, by our standards today, with primitive atomic weapons..."
"By our standards today" kind of leaves the whole thing to interpretation by itself. And "primitive atomic weapons" could be a reference to the spatial torpedoes used in seasons 1-2.
Also, remember that Earth's fleet was pretty tiny at the time. The Romulans probably outnumbered them ten to one. So of course Earth's ships were primitive: they had to constantly pump them out to the front lines to replace their losses.
"...and in primitive space vessels which allowed no quarter, no captives."
Enterprise was easily the largest Earth ship we saw in the show, and its brig only had room for two people. And considering how nasty the fighting probably was in space, I doubt there were any Romulan prisoners, period.
"Nor was there even ship-to-ship, visual communication; therefore, no Human, Romulan, or ally has ever seen the other."
This one is the only thing that flat-out doesn't work, and the other shows were wise to retcon it. Still, since much of the fighting also likely took place in space, it's not like there would have been many opportunities to study the Romulan dead.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
Yeah. ENT retconned a lot of things.
All of which are phasers. Though replaced later with other, newer phasers. There's also the pulse phasers of the Franklin mentioned in Beyond.
That sounds like non-canon to me.
Basically, almost no part of Balance of Terror can have happened as we saw in the episode, it's past (the Romulan War) or its present (the episode itself).
Romulan cloaks being a surprise - They cloaked in ENT.
Unknown connection between Romulans and Vulcans (that even surprised Spock) - The Sundering is a well known part of Vulcan history and the RAS is a well known space power to older space faring races like the Vulcans.
Romulans not having warp - Romulan Star Empire.
No quarter, no captives - Sure, for Humans. Vulcans and Andorians, however, are on par with the Romulans of the time. After the kidnap of the Anaer I can see the Andorians specifically looking for a little TRIBBLE for tat.
Primitive ships - Archer would be mortally offended there. Though I will concede the Franklin is fairly basic compared to the NX Class. though I suspect that's not what Spock was getting at. The NX is not that much less advance than the TOSprise, it has all the same features (anti-grav, synthesisers, deflector, shuttlebay, dilithium based warp core etc.), the basics of the Federation Starship don't change from the NX Class to the Universe Class (excluding time ships like the Wells).
Nuclear weapons - neither phasers or spatial torpedoes are nuclear.
Subspace radio based war - There's no way that makes logistical sense even in simplistic TOS never mind in the reality of ENT.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
However, all this talk of "it doesn't deserve T6" is completely irrelevant. Logic has gone far out the window.
We have :
Bio Ships, that are literally living organisms
Ships designed to be piloted by beings of pure energy
Xindi & Andorian ships, that are the same age as the NX class. So the xindi can upgrade the internals, but we cant? wut?
Ships from 600 years into the future
Ships from a completely different timeline
But oooh nooo an upgraded version of a 300 year old prime universe ship is just too crazy, out of the question!
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
*one of many tailor options that need to be added.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Giving us a I.S.S Prefix in the C-Store? Along with Terran emblem imprinted on the front hull.
But yeah, NX T6 or T5 would be nice to fly around in.
"When diplomacy fails, there's only one alternative - violence. Force must be applied without apology. It's the Starfleet way." - Captain Janeway
#Support Mirror Universe I.S.S. Prefixes
I'm another one who enjoyed Enterprise. I would love to see a T6 version. I do have the T1 version and enjoyed flying it around.