We generally run most nights with one person on a main, and one to three people on a low-performance alts. The rest of the team is filled with pugs, and there is still crippling lag, rubber banding, and power activation failures all over the place.
We did try running a three man ISA by making a private match and having two people warp out. It seemed to make things a bit smoother, but it is a pain to set that up every time when you just wanna quickly run though a bunch of things. I wish we could start private matches with as many people as we want to make that easier. It is just sad that we have to resort to things like this just to have a semi-playable game, especially on a night when there are more than enough people for a full team on team speak.
Since haste seems to be too expensive when it comes to server resources, I do not see the upcoming haste fix helping the lag situation at all. Maybe Cryptic could bump up STO's server priority with respect to Neverwinter or something...lol.
Have heard from the DPS Channel that team fenzy is causing particularly nasty lag. I am only running the tac ultimate without the team fenzy and did not experience lag that is due to my ultimate power or timeline stabilizer. But I do experience lag spikes in ISA when there are several high DPSers (judging from my parser), maybe due to some of the powers they use or exploitation that damage many enemies at once and rapidly which I can't really tell.
between the DPS Channels and this thread, I am wondering if there's an issue w/ the timing subsystem when the Haste powers come into play. Maybe making an extra call to check the base firing cycle again, and then substitute that call w/ the modified firing cycle call. If that's happening on a cycle (or worse, per-shot) basis, I can easily see where we have our current situation.
FYI, un-nerf Neutronic and Quantum Phase torpedo, and actually address the root problems in the code. I said I'd stay silent until the same issue manifested itself again in a different form, and I kept my word. Those two torpedoes were changed unnecessarily to deal w/ client-server performance and communication issues exclusively, and not because of some flaw in its game mechanics. Are you going to nerf FaW, Frenzy, and Timeline Stabilizer as well, and try to kick the can even further down the road?
I just managed 2 pug ISA yesterday in light of the upgrade weekend and encountered only one other player who seem to made have use of a lot haste abilities. Just had one brief lag spike.
Hope the adjustment to haste stuff didn’t make it worse.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
It was really bad for me today. More and more players are using Frenzy (even in PUGs), and it just lags the heck out of everything whenever they do. I know it's Frenzy because whenever I ask and someone says they used it, they used it at the point when it started lagging heavily.
I like how, with the added haste, I end up about 50% of my typical weapon attacks per second. At this point, solo content is about the only thing that plays smoothly. It kinda makes it hard to log in when you know the game will be almost unplayable. The invincible trait seems to not be working for me in laggy runs also, the game is just a mess at the moment.
We are at the point where we are dropping so many things just to get the game to kind of act normally, jumping though a bunch of hoops to play.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
New player here. I've started playing episodes mixed with Federation Fleet Alert from public queues, my friends have told me this piece of advice for levelling up fast. Episodes are smooth but the Federation Fleet Alerts are almost always extremely laggy. Are all public queues like this? Please tell me because, if it is so, I had better spend my time on another game
I get lag on cca all the time now, its almost unplayable, so far managed to avoid getting penalised with being afk
Same here.
But i must say it's not always like that. Sometimes, it runs smoothly without any problem. The other time it's a slow-mo slide show, totally unplayable. It's funny, as soon as the entity is destroyed it immediately stops lagging.
But it's not just CCA, the na'kuhl queue missions are just as bad.
Strangely the Baldlands adventure zone seems not to be affected, although there are much more players and NPC ships involved.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Yep...since last patch matters are even worse. ISA/CCA runs are worse than ever...and despite the haste "fix", I see a drop in my energy weapon attack/s.
Something really has to be done about these performance issues. Solo play is no problem, but a team environment with several high-end players pretty much breaks the game.
Some people in here are consusing network lag with frame rate drops. Only issues I have in the game are frame rate stalls in CCA, I dont lag while playing. My skills all work fine, but the frame rate tanks. This seems to be because of weapon or skill effects that cause multiple shadows and lighting effects. The game cant display it fast enough. I know its not my system because STO isnt using all of my RAM/GPU/CPU.
The lag issue is not skill related, its a network problem. One I myself suffered for some months last year.
For some reason, my input lag seems to have disappeared and I'm not sure why.
I did a CCA Run yesterday that had some noticeable lag, but outside of that, I have been smooth as silk for the last several days. I'm not saying that the problem is fixed, it likely isn't and will probably return, but I definitely believe it's an issue of power usage over something like server latency.
STO has so many different traits, powers, consoles, etc.. tracking down stuff like this is a nightmare of a job and one I absolutely do not envy. My suspicion is that Ultimate Abilities are having a similar effect that the Command Mechanic had back in the early days of the Command Ships. Most of the skills have just been moved and/or renamed, the Ultimate's are the only 'new shiny' so to me they seem the most likely culprit.
I've been seeing lag in ISA nothing that makes the game unplayable usually a couple secs mainly at the 1st gen or 1st mob of nanites where someone must have hit a system memory gulping skill. Powers def misfiring thou.
In CCA i was wondering why my ship kept losing flight speed for no apparent reason as it didn't look like lag but yup it is but again nothing that makes it unplayable. But plenty of SNR when map switching mainly red alerts/or transferring to my ships bridge or entering Rom Patrols
I don't get lag - allthough I have the Feeling that the game is a bit more sluggish to respond.
But I do get quite a few "Server not responding" Messages and on one run of the featured Episode I got disconnected three times in the last part of the Mission (after defeating the General)
18 characters
KDF: 2 tacs, 2 engs, 3 scis
KDF Roms: 3 tacs, 1 eng, 1 scis
FED: 2 tacs, 1 eng, 2 scis
TOS: 1 tac
all on T5 rep (up to temporal)
all have mastered Intel tree (and some more specs Points)
highest DPS: 60.982
My Paradox gets it far worse than my varied shoot stuff ships. Subspace vortex is extremely bad. Being a prtgen build it has a bunch of crit varying powers, debuffing powers and things that trigger the secondary delefctor. Thats carrying no ultimate powers and not using Timeline Stabilizer. CCA is really bad, ISA and Hive bad also.
I've basically stopped playing all together at this point. I'll hop on ts and do a few runs with people in the late evening in an effort to hit at a low server population time, but even that is very frustrating to the point where we usually just give up after one set of runs because of crippling lag. Jumping through tons of hoops to strip off anything that could be a possible cause lag from our ships is a major pain, and shouldn't even be a thing. If powers and abilities are available, they should be able to actually be used. If they are that costly on the server to cause these issues, they definitely need a rework.
It is funny when customer support comes back saying it is your network performance that is the problem when everyone on ts has the same issue and is spread across North America. The issue is poor server performance do to activation of non-optimized powers and abilities. I've joked for quite awhile that their network optimization patches are just them removing STO servers to save money. I really wonder what they actually are doing, because it only seems to get worse with every upgrade.
I've basically stopped playing all together at this point. I'll hop on ts and do a few runs with people in the late evening in an effort to hit at a low server population time, but even that is very frustrating to the point where we usually just give up after one set of runs because of crippling lag. Jumping through tons of hoops to strip off anything that could be a possible cause lag from our ships is a major pain, and shouldn't even be a thing. If powers and abilities are available, they should be able to actually be used. If they are that costly on the server to cause these issues, they definitely need a rework.
It is funny when customer support comes back saying it is your network performance that is the problem when everyone on ts has the same issue and is spread across North America. The issue is poor server performance do to activation of non-optimized powers and abilities. I've joked for quite awhile that their network optimization patches are just them removing STO servers to save money. I really wonder what they actually are doing, because it only seems to get worse with every upgrade.
I try to do the same. For me it’s rather the late afternoon where things run a bit smoother while already in the early evening the lag increases more and more.
This is really frustrating. ISA records I was able to achieve without breaking into sweat one week ago simply feel out of reach this week.
As one of the lead DPSer in game, could you give a rough estimate how much the haste related lag can lead to DPS drops in ISA or would this be too wild to tell or conclude?
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Given that all doffing sections are now broken, there's not very much to log on for. With the utterly horrible lag in teamed content sto is now a single player game with a chat window. Tbh there's better single player games out there.
I've basically stopped playing all together at this point. I'll hop on ts and do a few runs with people in the late evening in an effort to hit at a low server population time, but even that is very frustrating to the point where we usually just give up after one set of runs because of crippling lag. Jumping through tons of hoops to strip off anything that could be a possible cause lag from our ships is a major pain, and shouldn't even be a thing. If powers and abilities are available, they should be able to actually be used. If they are that costly on the server to cause these issues, they definitely need a rework.
It is funny when customer support comes back saying it is your network performance that is the problem when everyone on ts has the same issue and is spread across North America. The issue is poor server performance do to activation of non-optimized powers and abilities. I've joked for quite awhile that their network optimization patches are just them removing STO servers to save money. I really wonder what they actually are doing, because it only seems to get worse with every upgrade.
Did they actually recently state that its our network performance?
As one of the lead DPSer in game, could you give a rough estimate how much the haste related lag can lead to DPS drops in ISA or would this be too wild to tell or conclude?
Last time I actually played on my main, using full haste abilities my attacks per second were about 50%-60% of where they should be if I were not using them, and playing solo. Even with those laggy runs, I've still seen 220s several times. If people think power creep is bad now, I would hate to see the forum rage if the lag was removed.
We have tried pretty much anything we can think of, removing tons of powers deemed to be server intensive. Dropping the number of weapons to reduce calculations. At this point playing on my main is just too painful, and I am unwilling to jump though the number of hoops required to get a smooth experience.
I can play on under geared alts without much noticeable lag, but that is basically giving up on all of the work and resources I have poured into my main. It makes it really difficult to be excited to log in and do anything.
Did they actually recently state that its our network performance?
Recently? No, recently as far as I can tell they have been completely silent on the issue. If you go to the support area of the forums you only get met with requests for trace route info and computer specs. It is like they refuse to admit that some of the crazy abilities that have been created could possibly negatively affect server performance.
Btw, that solo HSE was as impressive as solo HGE. Both had me questioning if I could actually do the same. Nice work.
Thanks, I am sure you could.. I just hope it would take you a few attempts too ;D
Well, considering how the situation was handled last time...
I just wonder if they actually know/see the problem or if its just happening, and no one knows why... But in either case no one will tell, so that will remain a mystery ;D
As one of the lead DPSer in game, could you give a rough estimate how much the haste related lag can lead to DPS drops in ISA or would this be too wild to tell or conclude?
Last time I actually played on my main, using full haste abilities my attacks per second were about 50%-60% of where they should be if I were not using them, and playing solo. Even with those laggy runs, I've still seen 220s several times. If people think power creep is bad now, I would hate to see the forum rage if the lag was removed.
We have tried pretty much anything we can think of, removing tons of powers deemed to be server intensive. Dropping the number of weapons to reduce calculations. At this point playing on my main is just too painful, and I am unwilling to jump though the number of hoops required to get a smooth experience.
I can play on under geared alts without much noticeable lag, but that is basically giving up on all of the work and resources I have poured into my main. It makes it really difficult to be excited to log in and do anything.
Thanks for the elaboration. That was my impression as well. I know that personal DPS numbers have a habit of fluctuating greatly due to team composition and piloting. Still, having variations in over 100k by now and that on the same map, with the same build, the same approach and without going anything wrong as in dying is new (and really frustrating) for me.
And no, up to date I haven’t found as much as a single statement from a dev towards this problem which would show some sort of acknowledgment. With the Command Officer Power lag debacle over a year ago there was at least some clarification and repair but back then I think the number of players tending to performance activities in STO was simply bigger. Nowadays too few seem to care for as long as the tailor works properly.
Here is to the new temporal agent spec. Jesus, the name alone already sounds lagy...
Post edited by peterconnorfirst on
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Ever since the 11.5 update with the introduction of the new skill tree and another secondary specialization the power related lag in this game seems to be back with a vengeance. My friends and I consider it even worse than it was 1-1,5 years ago. Misfiring gravity wells, full CD on Evasive Maneuvers upon activation with our starships remaining steady and entire map freezes when someone engages Focused Frenzy. The latter we can basically coordinate over team speak and it takes multiple seconds to resolve.
At the moment some of the engaging maps like Hive Onslaught, Infected Space and Crystalline Catastrophe are as close to unplayable as it gets the moment multiple maxed out players meet on the same instance and start using their powers.
Are the Devs aware of the situation and have plans to clear it up? Is it best to regularly check, reddit, twitter, facebook and the daily television news or could we please get info about it here?
What about the rest of the community? How has your STO experience been the past two weeks the moment you team for some intense PvE action?
Please discuss and thanks for any participation in advance.
Pete Connor
no issues on my end, i dont expect to see any either. besides if my computer sturggles i would know about it, but that isnt a network issue because i would notice that almost immdiately.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
No lag issues here at all. On the contrary, at my end things going smoother than ever. Sorry OP can't see your problem duplicated at my end.
Trying to get more details on this (and for anyone else who is NOT experiencing any bad game performance, please respond):
What do you typically do in game?
Do you run any Ground STF's with a team?
Do you run any Space STF's with a team?
Do you play any missions with a team?
Do you join any Red Alerts where you participate with others?
Do you PvP? If so, where/which map?
I added your questions to the OP @darkknightucf (thx) to help players realize that we talk about server sided trouble generated by performance players in team making use of a lot of abilities.
At times it’s beyond ridiculous how many times I have to hammer on AP beta or other abilities until they engage during a PvE match while they seem to go on by themselves already when merely look at them in a story mission.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Comments
We did try running a three man ISA by making a private match and having two people warp out. It seemed to make things a bit smoother, but it is a pain to set that up every time when you just wanna quickly run though a bunch of things. I wish we could start private matches with as many people as we want to make that easier. It is just sad that we have to resort to things like this just to have a semi-playable game, especially on a night when there are more than enough people for a full team on team speak.
Since haste seems to be too expensive when it comes to server resources, I do not see the upcoming haste fix helping the lag situation at all. Maybe Cryptic could bump up STO's server priority with respect to Neverwinter or something...lol.
FYI, un-nerf Neutronic and Quantum Phase torpedo, and actually address the root problems in the code. I said I'd stay silent until the same issue manifested itself again in a different form, and I kept my word. Those two torpedoes were changed unnecessarily to deal w/ client-server performance and communication issues exclusively, and not because of some flaw in its game mechanics. Are you going to nerf FaW, Frenzy, and Timeline Stabilizer as well, and try to kick the can even further down the road?
Fleet Defiant Kinetic Heavy Fire Support | Fleet Manticore Kinetic Strike Ship | Tactical Command Kinetic Siege Refit | Fleet Defiant Quantum Phase Escort | Fleet Valiant Kinetic Heavy Fire Support
Turning the Galaxy-X into a Torpedo Dreadnought & torpedo tutorial, with written torpedo guide.
"A good weapon and a great strategy will win you many battles." - Marshall
I knew using Kinetics would be playing the game on hard mode, but what I didn't realize was how bad the deck is stacked against Kinetics.
I just managed 2 pug ISA yesterday in light of the upgrade weekend and encountered only one other player who seem to made have use of a lot haste abilities. Just had one brief lag spike.
Hope the adjustment to haste stuff didn’t make it worse.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
| USS Curiosity - Pathfinder | USS Rift - Eternal |
The Science Ship Build Thread - Share your Sci Ship builds here!
We are at the point where we are dropping so many things just to get the game to kind of act normally, jumping though a bunch of hoops to play.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
I've started playing episodes mixed with Federation Fleet Alert from public queues, my friends have told me this piece of advice for levelling up fast.
Episodes are smooth but the Federation Fleet Alerts are almost always extremely laggy.
Are all public queues like this? Please tell me because, if it is so, I had better spend my time on another game
But i must say it's not always like that. Sometimes, it runs smoothly without any problem. The other time it's a slow-mo slide show, totally unplayable. It's funny, as soon as the entity is destroyed it immediately stops lagging.
But it's not just CCA, the na'kuhl queue missions are just as bad.
Strangely the Baldlands adventure zone seems not to be affected, although there are much more players and NPC ships involved.
Something really has to be done about these performance issues. Solo play is no problem, but a team environment with several high-end players pretty much breaks the game.
The lag issue is not skill related, its a network problem. One I myself suffered for some months last year.
I did a CCA Run yesterday that had some noticeable lag, but outside of that, I have been smooth as silk for the last several days. I'm not saying that the problem is fixed, it likely isn't and will probably return, but I definitely believe it's an issue of power usage over something like server latency.
STO has so many different traits, powers, consoles, etc.. tracking down stuff like this is a nightmare of a job and one I absolutely do not envy. My suspicion is that Ultimate Abilities are having a similar effect that the Command Mechanic had back in the early days of the Command Ships. Most of the skills have just been moved and/or renamed, the Ultimate's are the only 'new shiny' so to me they seem the most likely culprit.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
In CCA i was wondering why my ship kept losing flight speed for no apparent reason as it didn't look like lag but yup it is but again nothing that makes it unplayable. But plenty of SNR when map switching mainly red alerts/or transferring to my ships bridge or entering Rom Patrols
But I do get quite a few "Server not responding" Messages and on one run of the featured Episode I got disconnected three times in the last part of the Mission (after defeating the General)
KDF: 2 tacs, 2 engs, 3 scis
KDF Roms: 3 tacs, 1 eng, 1 scis
FED: 2 tacs, 1 eng, 2 scis
TOS: 1 tac
all on T5 rep (up to temporal)
all have mastered Intel tree (and some more specs Points)
highest DPS: 60.982
It is funny when customer support comes back saying it is your network performance that is the problem when everyone on ts has the same issue and is spread across North America. The issue is poor server performance do to activation of non-optimized powers and abilities. I've joked for quite awhile that their network optimization patches are just them removing STO servers to save money. I really wonder what they actually are doing, because it only seems to get worse with every upgrade.
I try to do the same. For me it’s rather the late afternoon where things run a bit smoother while already in the early evening the lag increases more and more.
This is really frustrating. ISA records I was able to achieve without breaking into sweat one week ago simply feel out of reach this week.
As one of the lead DPSer in game, could you give a rough estimate how much the haste related lag can lead to DPS drops in ISA or would this be too wild to tell or conclude?
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Did they actually recently state that its our network performance?
Last time I actually played on my main, using full haste abilities my attacks per second were about 50%-60% of where they should be if I were not using them, and playing solo. Even with those laggy runs, I've still seen 220s several times. If people think power creep is bad now, I would hate to see the forum rage if the lag was removed.
We have tried pretty much anything we can think of, removing tons of powers deemed to be server intensive. Dropping the number of weapons to reduce calculations. At this point playing on my main is just too painful, and I am unwilling to jump though the number of hoops required to get a smooth experience.
I can play on under geared alts without much noticeable lag, but that is basically giving up on all of the work and resources I have poured into my main. It makes it really difficult to be excited to log in and do anything.
Recently? No, recently as far as I can tell they have been completely silent on the issue. If you go to the support area of the forums you only get met with requests for trace route info and computer specs. It is like they refuse to admit that some of the crazy abilities that have been created could possibly negatively affect server performance.
Btw, that solo HSE was as impressive as solo HGE. Both had me questioning if I could actually do the same. Nice work.
Well, considering how the situation was handled last time...
I just wonder if they actually know/see the problem or if its just happening, and no one knows why... But in either case no one will tell, so that will remain a mystery ;D
Thanks for the elaboration. That was my impression as well. I know that personal DPS numbers have a habit of fluctuating greatly due to team composition and piloting. Still, having variations in over 100k by now and that on the same map, with the same build, the same approach and without going anything wrong as in dying is new (and really frustrating) for me.
And no, up to date I haven’t found as much as a single statement from a dev towards this problem which would show some sort of acknowledgment. With the Command Officer Power lag debacle over a year ago there was at least some clarification and repair but back then I think the number of players tending to performance activities in STO was simply bigger. Nowadays too few seem to care for as long as the tailor works properly.
Here is to the new temporal agent spec. Jesus, the name alone already sounds lagy...
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
no issues on my end, i dont expect to see any either. besides if my computer sturggles i would know about it, but that isnt a network issue because i would notice that almost immdiately.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Trying to get more details on this (and for anyone else who is NOT experiencing any bad game performance, please respond):
What do you typically do in game?
Do you run any Ground STF's with a team?
Do you run any Space STF's with a team?
Do you play any missions with a team?
Do you join any Red Alerts where you participate with others?
Do you PvP? If so, where/which map?
Fleet Defiant Kinetic Heavy Fire Support | Fleet Manticore Kinetic Strike Ship | Tactical Command Kinetic Siege Refit | Fleet Defiant Quantum Phase Escort | Fleet Valiant Kinetic Heavy Fire Support
Turning the Galaxy-X into a Torpedo Dreadnought & torpedo tutorial, with written torpedo guide.
"A good weapon and a great strategy will win you many battles." - Marshall
I knew using Kinetics would be playing the game on hard mode, but what I didn't realize was how bad the deck is stacked against Kinetics.
I added your questions to the OP @darkknightucf (thx) to help players realize that we talk about server sided trouble generated by performance players in team making use of a lot of abilities.
At times it’s beyond ridiculous how many times I have to hammer on AP beta or other abilities until they engage during a PvE match while they seem to go on by themselves already when merely look at them in a story mission.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.