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Stop Dilithium Speculation
avengerkid1993
Member Posts: 323 Arc User
Hi guys, I'd like to talk about a very important thing in STO Economy.
Have you noticed how high is the price in the Dilithium Exchange ?
Well, its really high (about 320 dil per point), and its our fault.
We must STOP buying CPs for dil until the price drops below 200.
Be aware of this: we (or at least I do) work hard to gain dil to refine, and I expect it to be worth something ... I don't want to give away a day of hard work for nothing.
So, everyone who sell dil: STOP buy CPs, the price is unfair. And remember that who sell CPs need us as much as we need them.
Have you noticed how high is the price in the Dilithium Exchange ?
Well, its really high (about 320 dil per point), and its our fault.
We must STOP buying CPs for dil until the price drops below 200.
Be aware of this: we (or at least I do) work hard to gain dil to refine, and I expect it to be worth something ... I don't want to give away a day of hard work for nothing.
So, everyone who sell dil: STOP buy CPs, the price is unfair. And remember that who sell CPs need us as much as we need them.
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Although your attempt is interesting you would have to reach a vast amount of players to have any effect. The fact is most people don't seem to mind the price because they are still buying and selling so I'd say the economy is working just fine.
1)Demand Increase: price increases, quantity increases.
2)Demand Decrease: price decreases, quantity decreases.
3)Supply Increase: price decreases, quantity increases.
4)Supply Decrease: price increases, quantity decreases.
This is true. However there really hasn't been anything done to act as a counterbalance. Used to be things like Fleet Holdings would help reign in the prices. But now... its all things that make Zen desirable, which drives the prices up, or flooding the market, which drives prices up.
Not only that, but most people don't read the forums. So no forum request is going to change the in game economy.
Unless, of course, you reach out to someone truly influential like @nabreeki
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
nabreeki?
I'm more inclined to listen to @iconians or @thecosmic1 than nabreeki. Granted I haven't seen thecosmic1 online for some time...
Same goes.
equally any players wanting to buy dil will have had longer to earn their own dil and may not want to buy as much as they would have before your embargo took effect.
also what you are suggesting is for the players wanting to sell dil to hold off in an attempt to drive down the exchange rate and in the real world this would be classed as price fixing and is often treated as a criminal offence.
quote: Price fixing is an agreement between participants on the same side in a market to buy or sell a product, service, or commodity only at a fixed price, or maintain the market conditions such that the price is maintained at a given level by controlling supply and demand.
all you can realistically do is not sell your own until the exchange rate is desirable to you but you could have a long wait for this to happen.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
Well, right now it's as high as it was when I started playing so meh. Anyway, there isn't any new dil sink and people are hoarding for the new lockbox.
To me, this is really what it is all about. At the moment, there is a high demand for Zen. You have a master key sale. Combined with new lockboxes and other things that just make Zen more appealing.
In contrast, there really is not as much that requires dil and this is what you get. I will say that the current price (and I haven't really looked today) is relatively new. The prices used to fluctuate between 302 to 312. Sometimes more then others. but for the most part, for weeks it would bounce between that area. Usually within a 24 hour period. Now it is just climbing.
Nothing but changes to the game will have a drastic impact on the selling price. Again, it was a change to the game that brought the price up as it is.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Yes, you're working hard to refine your dilithium. Those who buy zen with real money to sell it on the Exchange probably work even harder to be able to buy it.
Energy credits are more my area of expertise, so Nabreeki is probably your best bet anyway, regardless of whether or not I was playing bikini catgirl on Risa.
If he says the dilithium economy is fine, then it's probably fine.
Of course you can think its fine, and maybe its really so, but I started play this game when Legacy of Romulus was released and then the price was 80/100 dil per CP (yeah, maybe then it was too low).
I think the ideal price would be about 200, but of course everyone would have a different opinion about this.
However, I'm not suggesting to the ones who sell zen to low their price, I'm just suggesting to the ones who buy it to not buy it until the price drops below 200. Its just a proposal, nothing more.
It was indeed very low then. When I started playing, I think it was well above 400 and it has been between 250 and 300 for a good part of the time I've been here IIRC. The current price may therefore seem high to you, it really isn't that high. It's the normal price, considering the long term trends.
As others have pointed out, there's not much you can do about it as these things are determined by supply and demand. Best thing you can do is consider creating another character to run through the Dyson battlezone, or buy some zen so that you don't need to grind for it. Hoping to change something as big as the overall Zen/dilithium market is unlikely to pay off and may only leave you disappointed, so I'd search for alternatives if I were you
I don't know about your situation, as in how many ships you have etc., but eventually you're likely to reach a point where you don't need all the new ships anymore anyway. There's only so many you can use. Also, whenever a 3-pack is released, ask yourself if you're likely to actually use all three variants of the same ship. To stop buying 3-packs was one of the best Zen-saving decisions for me and I can still get a ship every few weeks if I wanted.
And try planning the purchase of services a bit (there's a sale every few months) that might help save some Zen too.
I wouldn't mind if they brought dilithium rewards from Admiralty down. Did we really need yet another source of dilithium anyway? Especially one that doesn't give any incentive to play the game?
If they'd reduce the dilithium payout from Admiralty, contraband etc. and add it to some less popular content or missions beside ISA/CCA, it might also provide a solution to the empty queues.
Marks should be left alone though. Those are rewards that you can only get by actually playing the game so they need to be valuable imo.
There is only a few things that net a lot of Dil. FE / Missions, Rep daily turn is not one of them. You don't even get 1k with those.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
I agree with him that the economy is fine. If people had a problem paying 300+ dil per Zen they wouldn't pay it, and the price would go down.
Nerfing dil rewards in game isn't the solution. It would be a bad idea. For a long time players begged Cryptic to increase dil rewards throughout the game and they did, like adding dil rewards to episodes, adventure zones, and the admiality system. And we don't need a new dil sink as that would only work for a short while.
Basically, there's nothing broken and nothing to fix. If you don't want to pay 320 dil per Zen then don't pay it. There are plenty of others happy to fork over the pink stuff for a new shiny in the c-store.
My situation ? Crappy xD
I have a crappy patrol escort and I'm doing missions to get some free sets (like the quantum phase weapons and sol defense).
I think "desperate" would perfectly describe my situation ahah
I'm doing a lot of stfs (mostly normal) to get dil and marks, but sooner or later I'll have to spend something to buy fleet modules or T6 ships ...
I've done some maths: in order to buy a T6 ship, I should sell 960k refined dil. Since the refining cap is 8000 per day, I'll have to refine dil for 120 days (4 months).
Of course I could spend, but I won't ... I noticed that when you get a ship by spending money, you end-up not enjoying it at all (or at least, I don't).
I thought that many other people were in my own situation, so I opened this thread. But maybe its just me ahah
You really can't do anything about it. Most people here in the forums would give you the argument of "There is too much Dil around"
Yes there is much "Dil around" for new Old players not new ones most specially F2P.
Most fail to see the truth that they are comparing their present state to those who aren't in the same situation as they are.
Let me give you an example, they say there is a lot of Dil from the Admiralty this is false but lets analyze:
A. You need lots of good ships for Admiralty.
There are 2 problems about ships for F2P users. 1st they lack the knowledge that when doing admiralty science is one of the most important ships. Hence they either select the Tactical type ships more ore the Engineer ones. When they get to point that they unlock the Admiralty they find out that they need Science ships and it's too late. Which leads to the 2nd part of the problem.
The 2nd part of the problem is New players most specially F2P's can only get 5 ships. The initial ship and the other 4 from ranking up. The only other additional ships one can get for free are the event ships. Sure you can get more ships but that is if you spend ZEN to buy C-Store or EC which for a newbie would look like a monumental task, which is kinda for them and ironically you can buy Ships through the Lobi Store and as a last resort from the ship seller which costs Dil. How about Admiralty Cards gain from events? Well as it states they are event unlocks most new players don't have it and starting players don't have it and in both scenario even those who missed the event won't ever have it again.
So in essence New Players only have 5 ships meaning 5 Admiralty Cards. That's not enough to milk the Admiralty System like most people claim. there are other factors which lead to what I'll discuss below.
B. The Road to actually preparing to milk Admiralty is not easy for most new players.
This is very true. Simply put the Admiralty system has some important things you need even before you actually aim for the ships. That is you need to actually buy some important things from the C-Store 1st before anything else and they are the EC limiter removal which will let you have EC beyond 10m and the Account Bank then after that Ship slots and Dry docks. Arguably the first 2 things mentioned are more important than any ships since those 2 would help you achieve your goals. EC ships costs millions. The good ones anyway and if you're using Gears that are upgraded that is account bind and you want to pass them, then you really need the Account Bank. The last 2 you will need to store those ships you acquire unless your willing to decommission those EC ships or those who you bought from the ship seller with Dil.
All things I mentioned are from the C-Store. Hence they cost Zen. The Account Bank costs 1000 zen. 1000 zen costs how much this days and with the limit of 8k refinement a day it will take a starting player a long time to just to get them.
C. The Admiralty system doesn't reward you with lots of Dil.
This is the common mistake of people who argue that the Admiralty System gives lots of Dil. EC I would believe but dil not much. For a new player who probably starts of Fed, you don't have any much access to Dil like KDF's do. They got raids that get them contraband much easier and earlier compare to Feds and even Roms.
If you combined the alt KDF's and the other quests that give good dil rewards and Queues all of this can make the Admiralty look like it's giving much more for the Alts alone. This is not the case for the starting players who most probably just have one toon. The ones in Admiralty that will give you dil rewards in abundance is the Klingon one. Most specially the Tour ones and if you achieve the 10th one you get about 20k of dill as reward. But the more higher the Tour tier is the higher the ship requirements too. This would be troublesome for new players who has a very few ships to start with.
You see the regular reward for Dils for the KDF Admiralty are 100 up to 200. If you actually crit on some you will get 500 dill up to 2000 Dil as bonus reward. But not every KDF Mission gives out Dils and those who do give a decent amount are tied to a "Crit". Then you also have to factor in the fact that large SHIPS have 20+hour cooldown. You can argue that quests from the Admiralty only lasts for 30 mins-4 hours except for the tour ones but it doesn't matter if you don't have the admiralty ship cards to use. Heck for that matter if you actually even have enough Card ships to deploy. Just imagine how hard it is for a new player.
Hence the Admiralty system giving lots of Dils is a false thing to say. It only becomes true if you got lots of spare Ship card to use and even if you do have you have a max of 8 quests slot. And that is if you actually have unlocked the max slot for it and can actually crit the good quests with good Dil reward.
For now I'll stop with these 3 argument about the Admiralty giving lots of Dil. There are more but that is just the gist of it. You see OP, the ones who are actually controlling the Market price are the Veterans and those who actually hate Cryptic for their decisions. Case in point if you look at the other posts some people claim that they would not spend any cent for the game and abuse the Dil system because they have lots of Alt. They gain a lot of Dil and don't care how much inflation they do to the market.
So the Supply and Demand argument is pretty damn wrong here since it's not Supply and demand it's more close to hording. The Dil sink argument also is false since as I said be fore the only ones who are saying that are the ones who has many alts already and are veterans. I was once an advocate for a new Dil sink but until after realizing what is the real problem is, I changed my mind. People don't realize that there are no need for more Dil sinks. The upgrades themselves are a great Dil sinks. If someone argues to me that they have lots of Dil lying around then tell me how many alts you have and how long have you been playing.
So this Dil sinks and the abundance of Dil supply is false. Also since we are at it, I would also like to point why would people who claim they "Need more from their dollars" for the Dil to Zen exchange justify the fact that there is an abundance of Dil from the Admiralty system etch when they are trying to buy tons of it? Surely they have lots of alts and those have easy access to Dil and admiralty so what is the logic of buying more?
2 Things I can only think about it:
1. Just plain greed.
2. In reality there isn't a real abundance of Dil aside from the other vets who has the abundance because they have the time to farm all those this from their alts.
Which further proof my statement that the Inflation is caused by the Veterans themselves and all the new players are just caught in the middle. The longer this lasts the heavier the burden for new players. I honestly don't mind the Dil exchange since I bought my ships using IRL cash. I think there are only 2 times I actually used the exchange for buying Zen but that is only because it wasn't payday and there was a sale on BOFF slot so I just bought enough to buy myself a BOFF slot. The other one I think was for a key but I never got to use it and I think the 400+ Zen I bought is still on my account. Seriously I didn't have time to use it. But anyway as I said it wont affect me but the way things are going and I see most fleets I've been into getting more emptier and emptier and with no end game thing to do in this game I'm holding my wallet tight because I still do not know if this game would last another year after the 50th one. Hopefully it does. Unless of course a T6 Sov came out then I'll probably buy one lol
So OP there is real no hope for your request. Unless Cryptic decides to lock the Dill per toon meaning other toons can't use the earned dils of other toons. Which means even if the put it on the exchange only the toon who put it there can withdraw it.
The problem is that people are quickly forgetting the massive fleet sinks that are now completed. Small to medium sized fleet leaders used to pour millions upon millions of dilithium into their fleets. Not so much anymore. Even small things like fleet lab took a very long time for even large fleets to complete. The sole desire now is to buy keys and open boxes. It's a very different dil economy - with much more supply and no one willing to participate in sinks or sinks largely completed.
That's why I suggest we begin to look at using dil or buying cool stuff with it again as opposed to trying to get people to dump it into bottomless sinks - because few people will be willing to do that anymore.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."