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Cryptic wants to make money so they must hate us! ... REALLY?
sirsitsalot
Member Posts: 2,803 Arc User
Personally, I think we need to stop with all of this "Cryptic wants to make money so they must hate us" garbage. We all knew that when they announced that STO was going to go Free to Play, that they would find whatever ways they could to generate revenue without requiring a subscription. At the time of the announcement, I was figuring that they would be creating tons of playable content and selling it as mini-expansions... Instead, playable content took a back seat to fluff items. People scream that they would quit if they started having to pay for playable content. And yet they complain about not having enough playable content and feel like quitting.
Now, there is more of a focus on content development, and an increase in hatred for Cryptic for all the monetization. Thing is, if they did not have the monetization they have now, they would be charging for playable content. And we probably would not have so many veteran Star Trek actors reprising their roles in the game. The only beef I have with them is they still cannot manage to create enough content fast enough to satiate our appetite for it. I would like to see them take three months to produce resources and story content and then roll out 24 episodic missions over the next nine months. In other words, they should produce it like a Star Trek TV show. Have the season written with and mapped out in advance, with all the art assets and voice acting produced and recorded early on. A lot of art assets can be creatively reused. I've seen foundry missions that manage some pretty impressive locations all with assets that have been around from the beginning, but just used in clever ways. Cryptic can do the same thing. They don't HAVE to produce all new assets for every little thing. Just when an episode calls for something specific that cannot be believably produced with existing assets.
And the episodic mission season can contain product placement of items that are on their way to the C-store. In this way, the mission content would drive Zen purchases.
People who take a break from STO for whatever reason tend to come back when new content comes out. So the more content Cryptic produces, the more people will play. And let's be clear... If they are not playing, they surely aren't paying.
Because Cryptic wants to make money does not mean they hate us. But I think they could make MORE money in the long run by streamlining their content production process so that they can release material far more regularly than the currently do. Right now they push things out all at once, and we blast through it all almost immediately. With content releases broken into bite-sized chunks and spread out over nine months, even though we would consume each chunk almost immediately, we would not have to wait so bloody long for the next one to drop.
And what would we do during the 3 month hiatus? How bout a the introduction of new settings scattered throughout the galaxy that function similarly to the way Fleet Holdings work, except that they are not locked behind the fleet wall, meaning anyone visiting them can contribute to them. Maybe it is a new space station being built, with new NPC characters showing up as it progresses, and the new season launches from that location. So players will be vested in the rolling out of the new content, and can actually see something they participate in grow as a result of their actions.
We need to stop always looking at Cryptic as if they are the enemy and start finding ways to meet in the middle. Those of you who have known me the longest know that I have been extremely critical of Cryptic in the past. It's easy to be an armchair developer and jump on the cynicism bandwagon. But that does not get anyone anywhere. STO will be what keeps it in line with PWE's profit expectations. If we can wrap our heads around that FACT, maybe we can start asking for things that keep it real within that scope and give us a gameplay experience that keeps us coming back, or better yet, encourages us not to leave in the first place.
But as long as our relationship with Cryptic/PWE remains driven by the "Us vs. Them" mentality, the developers will have no desire to engage with us on anything meaningful. And I cannot say I blame them.
Now, there is more of a focus on content development, and an increase in hatred for Cryptic for all the monetization. Thing is, if they did not have the monetization they have now, they would be charging for playable content. And we probably would not have so many veteran Star Trek actors reprising their roles in the game. The only beef I have with them is they still cannot manage to create enough content fast enough to satiate our appetite for it. I would like to see them take three months to produce resources and story content and then roll out 24 episodic missions over the next nine months. In other words, they should produce it like a Star Trek TV show. Have the season written with and mapped out in advance, with all the art assets and voice acting produced and recorded early on. A lot of art assets can be creatively reused. I've seen foundry missions that manage some pretty impressive locations all with assets that have been around from the beginning, but just used in clever ways. Cryptic can do the same thing. They don't HAVE to produce all new assets for every little thing. Just when an episode calls for something specific that cannot be believably produced with existing assets.
And the episodic mission season can contain product placement of items that are on their way to the C-store. In this way, the mission content would drive Zen purchases.
People who take a break from STO for whatever reason tend to come back when new content comes out. So the more content Cryptic produces, the more people will play. And let's be clear... If they are not playing, they surely aren't paying.
Because Cryptic wants to make money does not mean they hate us. But I think they could make MORE money in the long run by streamlining their content production process so that they can release material far more regularly than the currently do. Right now they push things out all at once, and we blast through it all almost immediately. With content releases broken into bite-sized chunks and spread out over nine months, even though we would consume each chunk almost immediately, we would not have to wait so bloody long for the next one to drop.
And what would we do during the 3 month hiatus? How bout a the introduction of new settings scattered throughout the galaxy that function similarly to the way Fleet Holdings work, except that they are not locked behind the fleet wall, meaning anyone visiting them can contribute to them. Maybe it is a new space station being built, with new NPC characters showing up as it progresses, and the new season launches from that location. So players will be vested in the rolling out of the new content, and can actually see something they participate in grow as a result of their actions.
We need to stop always looking at Cryptic as if they are the enemy and start finding ways to meet in the middle. Those of you who have known me the longest know that I have been extremely critical of Cryptic in the past. It's easy to be an armchair developer and jump on the cynicism bandwagon. But that does not get anyone anywhere. STO will be what keeps it in line with PWE's profit expectations. If we can wrap our heads around that FACT, maybe we can start asking for things that keep it real within that scope and give us a gameplay experience that keeps us coming back, or better yet, encourages us not to leave in the first place.
But as long as our relationship with Cryptic/PWE remains driven by the "Us vs. Them" mentality, the developers will have no desire to engage with us on anything meaningful. And I cannot say I blame them.
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I find it difficult to understand people moaning about STO. If you do not want to pay you do not need to. What do you get for nothing, the best Star Trek game I have ever played. In fact I have never played a game for 6 months solid, even the X-COM series.
Every few months Cryptic hand out freebies. I am running T6 ships that I haven't paid for and can wipe out anything in the missions and the PvEs.
Quit bellyaching people and just enjoy the ride.
I do not see this us vs them theme played out.
If you refer to forums a flame: welcome to the internet.
I politely object in specific instances where I feel the monetization conflicts with their own stated goals. The skill revamp was done in part to encourage experimentation, but the respec cost in zen is far too high to agree with that goal.
On top of all this, Cryptic also charges a RIDICULOUS price for something literally no other game has monetized: respecs.
Do I fault then for trying to make money? Hell no, they're a business, that's what they're supposed to do. But I DO take issue with HOW they try to make their money. Things I would be in favor of are requiring a sub to unlock access to a new feature episode (something swtor is currently doing), releasing new T6 ships (the gear aspect) as instance drops with optional c-store cosmetic options (the visual aspect), etc.
I have no problem paying, I'm a lifer here and I sub to every MMO I choose to play, F2P or not. I just really despise the F2P model used for STO, and if it wasn't for the trek license, and well designed SPACE combat (I specify because ground is unbelievably POORLY designed), I wouldn't be here anymore.
Sorry to say, but your entire argument is one huge strawman. Nobody has ever said Cryptic shouldn't be allowed to make money. There's making money, though, and being outright greedy. I'm not saying the latter per se, btw; but I can certainly empathize with people feeling certain areas are over-monetized (like, for me, the Upgrade system).
They explicitly stated they wanted their skill system to more closely emulate the industry standard, to make it easier for new players to pick up. The industry standard across all MMOs, F2P and sub alike, is respecs that only cost gold/credits/energy credits. Those are facts.
So, I'm good peaceful satisfied little customer sheeperson (what's singular of "sheeple" anyway?) now
Well, not really. I still think that lockboxes are a form of gambling (which I personally try to avoid, though if someone else does it that's their money, and this is a free society) but it feels much less like you're pressured into those lotteries than it used to...
And I even like those "such-and-such got a lockbox ship" notes, after seeing a particular game I liked closed down for commercial reasons, every single one of them is a few hundred more proofs this won't happen here anytime soon.
As for your suggestions... I don't know, continuous development like that is far harder than it looks and it may seem to many people that lots of small changes don't add up to much, when they actually do when you consider them all at once (see the story of my ex-Cryptic hate for an example - I'm sure that quite a few people who had been there for those little things introduction actually think F2P isn't all that different and/or got worse overall from what it used to be, unlike me.)
"Open" holdings... I'm not sure, considering how all those "fill a progress bar for stuff to happen" events aren't particularly well-liked (unless it's XP week
With all due respec[sic!], Klingon hamsters may not be quite enough. We need some Sabre-Toothed Giant Space Hamsters imported from D&D. Then ask the good Dr. Khan to work on them a bit further... No one would dare to DDoS that! It's a perfect plan! (As long as they don't escape and take over the world, that is...)
Member Access Denied Armada!
My forum single-issue of rage: Make the Proton Experimental Weapon go for subsystem targetting!
Just because something is drama doesn't mean it's useless. Although drama queening for good reason and within limits is an art that takes years to master.
I'm not going to disagree with your other points, but honestly there is no way STO's F2P model is as bad as SWTOR's. A game judgeing by your sig and comments that you must be familiar with. I like SWTOR despite its flaws, but its F2P model constricts a player like an iron vice. In fact, I can't even imagine trying to level without a Sub and lets not forget that while most of their cash shop is just optional cosmetics, they do also heavily restrict mission rewards, entry to Flashpoints, Warzones, and Artifact Gear among many other things.
Now, obviously, this is because they really want you to sub which, as you noted about STO, is understandable for a business, but if we are ignoring that and simply comparing the "freedoms" a F2Per recieves, compared to SWTOR, and with perhaps the exception of the EC cap, in STO the sky's the limit when it comes to "primary" content. (I've been a lifer a long time myself, so perhaps I'm forgetting something else.) Feel free to disagree, I don't mind, but almost everyone I have ever discussed it with agrees that the gameplay restrictions make SWTOR's model abysmal. (Not charging for content mind you... in SWTOR's case I agree with you there, as I'm ok with buying expansions or subbing monthly for KotFE)
Still, you are right that respecs are free over there, though unlike in STO I don't think I've ever bothered to respec any of my characters.
So you ragequitted in part over something that demonstrably was never true? Not sure how valid that makes your comments.
JHAS, JHSS, etc, all come with a 4/3 layout, far as I know.
Indeed... Ok, I definitely badly misremembered that one. I'm sorry.
"If this will be our end, then I will have them make SUCH an end as to be worthy of rememberance! Out of torpedos you say?! Find me the ferengi!".
original join date 2010
Member: Team Trekyards. Visit Trekyards today!
The ones who say swtor has the worst model, are the ones who want everything free. I'm of the opinion that none of this should be free (ie no subject no service), but the swtor model is a decent compromise and gives value to subs. Also, the mission part of that gives access to all missions released, so you can wait 6 months, sub for 1 month, and get 6 months worth of content if you want. Content is the most expensive part to develop, and the part that gives the most enjoyment, and should therefore be the first thing with a price tag.
I also did not say people should pay for gear:
I said the ship itself should be instance drops, ie loot, ie free with effort, while the new cosmetic options should be in the store.
And the dil store is just a plain horrible idea, and is clearly designed to monetize everything in the game, all the way down to crafting. Though I'd grumble less about it if the conversion was fixed at 500 dil per zen, I'll never accept it as anything less than a sleazy business model.
And I do understand ground, I've played it since beta, I just don't enjoy it at all because of how it's designed. If it was either a classic mmo system, or a full blown third person shooter, I'd enjoy it, but what we have now is one of the worst experiences I've ever had in an mmo.
But why would you be less uncomfortable with it if the exchange rate was fixed? I'm not saying it's a bad or a good idea, I'm just not sure of your reasoning.
*EDIT FOR CLARITY: On the other hand, their lockboxes only ever contained cosmetic items, and not the most coveted ones at that, which is why I played it for quite a while (not the poker part.)
Except for the times when they charged everyone including subbies $20 for new story content. Pretty shabby to make subbies pay for it despite already supporting the game with their $15/month.
Paid expansions are a different animal altogether, and typically include enough additional content to be well worth the cost. I have no problems with them, and routinely pay extra for the deluxe versions of WoW expansions.
I would pay good money to see you post that in their forums... it would not end well.
Either way, as I said in my last post, if you want to compare F2P models clinically, you have to do just that. Look only at the freedoms and restrictions of "core gameplay" each model gives to a new player (trying to decide if the game is for them) and set sub benefits aside for a moment. From that perspective there is no way SWTOR's model is more generous than STO's. Well, except for the cost of respecs... I'll concede that point to you entirely especially now in the light of the upcoming skill revamp. Either way, it doen't really affect me... being a lifer here and a sub there, so I'll leave it at that and get back to wondering what both game's April Fools joke will be tommorow. It will be hard to top STO Rebirth or Kai Zykken's stationary log-speeder. The latter in particular was doubly funny when it actually made it into the game for real.
I have two T6 ships for my characters. Both were free. Are they brilliant, no. That's because neither toon is science.
What do people want Cryptic to do?