Thanks all for your comments. And yeah, I knew some people would flame me. I'm not a hot house flower; I'll live. Personally, I think a big part of the problem is that they created a fight where you have very low level people fighting alongside very high level people. My char for this run is in the mid-level area, which can easily explain what might have happened. My 60th level chars don't have this problem, obviously, but it's still frustrating nonetheless. Yeah, as a few of the flamers have pointed out: Don't play in a queue where there are much higher level people. Sure, but then why have the capability of doing so if you're going to be penalized regardless. Just saying.
Fleet Admiral Duane Gundrum, U.S.S. Merrimack
Fleet Admiral Ventaxa Proxmire, U.S.S. Shaka Walls Fell
Blog: http://www.sarbonn.com/?page_id=1990
Foundry series: Bob From Accounting & For the Sake of the Empire
I was actually one of the players on the forums that fought for the AFK penalty to be introduced in the first place. I'm still glad it's in. If you can't do 1% of the damage to get the reward, you should not be expecting the reward. Anyone at rank 40 with a T5 ship should be able to get it. It's just a matter of learning how to fly your ship.
Problem is, anyone with decent DPS can do that 1% very quickly and then AFK the rest of the mission. Which is why I say its stupid and doesn't work.
Whaaa... Please stop whining and learn how to build a decent ship and instead of flying around willy nilly learn the fight and contribute. I have seen and read many posts like yours always crying that such and such is broken or OPed. Nothing is OPed in this game and guy you have zero excuse. So stop crying about someone who has taken the time and effort to build a powerful ship. Better yet quit the game and don't come back.
I know this may come as a shock to you, but this game does have a lot of bugs in it. The AFK penalty can and does in fact bug out on occasion. Shocking, I know.
Agreed, but I have never myself experienced it, even when actually trying to reproduce it!
"Awww. Poor little player. He gots the penaltys 'cuz the Big Kids all brought their grownup ships to play the game with. That's not fair!"
A few questions I'd like to see answered.
- What is the DPS of an 'average' STO player?
Pretty sure it is under 10K but I have no proof so this is an opinion. My ships all are right around the 8.5 to 9.5k mark. Which is more than enough to successfully partcipate in any game content.
- Just how many actual Uber DPS players are there in this game?
I am guessing they make up a very small percentage of the player population. Not nearly enough to be blamed for all the TRIBBLE they catch since they cannot all be online at the same time nor can they be everywhere at once.
- Why is it always somebody else's fault an AFK Penalty is handed out in one of these threads?
I have gotten a couple since the Penalty was implemented. It's two hours. I can go do something else for two hours. Like figure out how to use my ship better. Like play the parts of STO where my current skillset and gear level are more appropriate. Maybe when I get more proficient I can come back. There are very good reasons eight year olds are not allowed to be F1 drivers.
Yeah, I'm an TRIBBLE. And I don't care people think I'm an TRIBBLE. However, even an TRIBBLE gets to be right once in awhile. TRIBBLE pointing out the truth does not make the truth any less truthful either.
Thank you for this! I feel vindicated. So hate whiners and those that call out people for being blunt about the whiners.
Whaaa... Please stop whining and learn how to build a decent ship and instead of flying around willy nilly learn the fight and contribute. I have seen and read many posts like yours always crying that such and such is broken or OPed. Nothing is OPed in this game and guy you have zero excuse. So stop crying about someone who has taken the time and effort to build a powerful ship. Better yet quit the game and don't come back.
I know this may come as a shock to you, but this game does have a lot of bugs in it. The AFK penalty can and does in fact bug out on occasion. Shocking, I know.
Gee tell me something I don't know but for a player to start crying that it was another player to blame for a glitch if it was an actual glitch is the mark of a whiner.
Whaaa... Please stop whining and learn how to build a decent ship and instead of flying around willy nilly learn the fight and contribute. I have seen and read many posts like yours always crying that such and such is broken or OPed. Nothing is OPed in this game and guy you have zero excuse. So stop crying about someone who has taken the time and effort to build a powerful ship. Better yet quit the game and don't come back.
Pretty much an unacceptable answer to this OP. Maybe you, ssbn655, should go play solitaire. Stack the deck however you like. Solitaire isn't a community game, it should work well for you. You can always come back when you want to play and be nice with real people.
I have been all over about this same topic lately. I am being noisy less for me and my one and only AFK I ever than I am for others. I am being noisy because this is a broken mechanic that hurts anyone who is running a new character, which btw happens to represent almost all new players to the game. It also represents those of us heavily invested in a variety of builds, and who are using those multiple buyable slots for new characters to do that with.
This problem is aggravated by some players like you ssbn655, who suggest that other players should 'leave' the game. I suppose the Devs would like to hear more of that sort of talk from people like you, hmm? It's bad enough I have low levelers in my Fleets who are taking your exact advice. It would please me greatly at the moment if you had a Kemocite chain reaction where the sun don't shine
If you disagree, make your point in a civil fashion ( I admit, it can be difficult at times to remain civil... ) Don't drive people from our community. Most of us like the community, the Devs flat out NEED the community, and you need the Devs. or you have no place to brag about how cool your high dps build is. See the connection?
It seems that calling someone an TRIBBLE is less of a problem than using a phrase that uses the output of that TRIBBLE with the greatest fictional detective.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I just did another one of those fleet alert missions where I was nonstop firing at enemies and having a good time, only to receive a 2 hour penalty for being AFK. I know the Devs are never going to address this, but just because one person goes in with an overpowered ship that devastates everything on the screen shouldn't result in every other player being penalized for not doing enough damage.
Yeah, I know no one cares. And I know the Devs don't care. But man, that is so freaking annoying when you're just trying to have fun in the game. I love doing fleet alerts. They're probably the most fun I get out of the game. So 2 hours of my night not being able to do one basically means having to wait until the next day due to the few hours I have to play this game at night.
Yeah, I know. Nobody cares.
I care! I'm sure I can survive the current AFK stupidity, but I am very worried about newcomers under the current state of affairs. I'm going to change my Fleet description and try and rescue more of the noobs from going in blind. Even if you not a noob it can suck because you are bringing in a new low level toon for the first time.
ALSO! I am very much with you on this idea of having a "good time" and "just trying to have fun". That is essentially what the purpose of a game is, to allow you that experience. I got an AFK last weekend, right in the middle of the only window of time I had. I posted to a GM, cause I was not 'afk'. TWO DAYS LATER I get told by the GM response 'sorry' and that I had to wait two hours Wow! thanks for the heads up there GM! I didn't know that GM!
That isn't the problem. The problem was getting flagged in the first place, for doing something fun, with the build you had. My build wasn't at all bad for my level either. I was in all ways deemed appropriate in terms of level required, and in terms of any gear a reasonable person might expect to be able to get at my toons level. In the chat, I could see the damages (after the battle, there was no time during) and the other players were doing at least 60 to 1 of what I was.
The game should have prevented a low level toon from going in, or should have done something to compensate for the mix of levels that not only was allowed, but which the game encouraged. The Devs really should do something so that low and high levelers aren't in conflict.
I care! I'm with you. It's a bug. The only ones who don't care either don't know about it from experience, or are so busy running after personal glory they forget how to listen to other people. They forget they have as fellow inhabitants of this little universe, a duty to play nice with others. That honor follows those who take time to help. That the loyalty given to the community is returned multiplied many times. Personal glory ... is for the impersonal
"Glory is like a circle in the water,
Which never ceaseth to enlarge itself,
Till by broad spreading it disperses to naught."
William Shakespeare as quoted by General Chang
So. If they fix it, that's awesome, and they should want to fix it for everyone's benefit. If they don't fix it, we have to do it ourselves, although our methods will require constant vigilance. We have to intercept the noobs before they get stuck in with a dps demigod because the queues as designed allowed it. We have to take it upon ourselves to watch out for others who through no fault of their own are at risk of being slapped down, and called a cheat due to a broken game mechanic.
Look at it as a chance to be the best kind of warrior. In cross faction terms, the chance to be the best kind of hero. Don't do it for personal glory, do it with no expectation at all !!! The game will be better for it. The Community will still benefit from your efforts EVEN IF they did fix the problem with level mixing.
You can look at yourself in the mirror and say to yourself, "I gave a damn about others today, and it felt good!"
The broken game mechanic is the enemy. If we can't defeat it head on, we must our maneuver it!
But don't let the Devs forget about it either, because they have a duty also! Just saying.
I find it the only for me to ever get an AFK penalty was to literally do no damage. When I farm dil using my other alt characters, their DPS is usually only around 1.5k-4k max and I've been so lazy as to just fly in set it on auto pew pew and tab out and I still can't get an AFK.
Why would you even DO THAT?! Anyway, I guess that doesn't matter. The point is you probably don't do that with a new level 5-10 toon, but they are still members of the community.
The game allows toons with 300 dps max to mingle with the 50k+ crowd, so it isn't about you or me, it's about what makes the game right for the people playing it, noobs included. Since the game allows them to mix, it should not punish any of them for actually mixing, which it does. It is also pure elitist arrogance on the part of those who DO IT, to suggest that any player needs to know all the games ins and outs by level FIVE! That is essentially what many posters do. 'Yuh need uh better build NOOB! Don't play then till yur better!" The real noobs don't even know what 'better' is yet. Where do they get this knowledge if they avoid all areas where that knowledge can be picked up? If they haven't been where we have yet, it doesn't mean they are stupid, and they don't deserve to be treated as if they are!
When is the last time anyone reading this took a new level 10 toon out there to the basic queues? That is where it is most broken. What we experienced years ago when we were 10th level, was a different environment. It had it's own glitches. Did we complain. Be honest. At least admit you yelled at the screen a little when you were new, like I did.
The new glitches, bugs, problems are just as real as previous ones. The right thing for any of us is to try to help.
Cryptic usually wants something in record/proof before they actually make reasonable action. This means recording in video you really got AFK penalty and it would help if you have a recorded combat log. Proof that you didnt deserve it especially if this is normal.
Because they ask me of this when I found a bug of some sort.
If this is Advance or elite difficulty, better tone down that difficulty.
I'll support that statement as it stands, because trying to bring attention to something is good, and it may help, but like a retail store, its still good to bring a receipt if you complain about the product. For my part, I never felt I needed to record anything before this, but the advice here is sound.
"Awww. Poor little player. He gots the penaltys 'cuz the Big Kids all brought their grownup ships to play the game with. That's not fair!"
A few questions I'd like to see answered.
- What is the DPS of an 'average' STO player?
Pretty sure it is under 10K but I have no proof so this is an opinion. My ships all are right around the 8.5 to 9.5k mark. Which is more than enough to successfully partcipate in any game content.
- Just how many actual Uber DPS players are there in this game?
I am guessing they make up a very small percentage of the player population. Not nearly enough to be blamed for all the TRIBBLE they catch since they cannot all be online at the same time nor can they be everywhere at once.
- Why is it always somebody else's fault an AFK Penalty is handed out in one of these threads?
I have gotten a couple since the Penalty was implemented. It's two hours. I can go do something else for two hours. Like figure out how to use my ship better. Like play the parts of STO where my current skillset and gear level are more appropriate. Maybe when I get more proficient I can come back. There are very good reasons eight year olds are not allowed to be F1 drivers.
Yeah, I'm an TRIBBLE. And I don't care people think I'm an TRIBBLE. However, even an TRIBBLE gets to be right once in awhile. TRIBBLE pointing out the truth does not make the truth any less truthful either.
First answer;
Your question is irrelevant, since the game obviously sets up queues with no apparent regard for what any theoretically average STO player can do. Instead it sets minimum level requirements, and that means that brand new players, and people starting new toons, will end up in those queues. A so called 'average' has nothing to do with where the gates open, or how experienced a player running an eligible character is expected to be BY THE GAME. The game invites them in, they should therefore not be penalized for accepting. I accept that you have an opinion, but it is just an opinion.
Second Answer;
Mostly irrelevant, since there are obviously plenty enough based on the commotion surrounding them. Since you are guessing, so will I, and I guess there are definitely enough of them for those who aren't Uber DPS players to be affected by the presence of those who are. They don't have to be online all the time, or everywhere, they just have to have a huge impact where they are when they are on. Drop a few atom bombs on some islands, and everyone gets excited. You get more excited if they are being dropped on YOU! Most people seem to think atomic weapons are a problem, even though a very tiny number of them have actually gone off, and that includes people who have not had the experience of being bombed.
Third answer;
It is at least mostly the fault of the game design in how it sets gates, however if your an Uber dps player, and don't own your contribution to the current environment, then not only is it partly your fault, but you are inconsiderate of what your contribution is doing to other people. Many of these other people may have zero warning about what your going to do to day to help mess their day up since they are new! it's nice you have so many chances in your day to come back and play later, but some people only have a half an hour, maybe an hour a day. They are done with queues for the whole day if they miss the window available.
They may not have any support from online friends yet, to warn them, or help them. They may not have any idea WHERE to go with their current skill set, especially since they should have been SAFE playing where they got the AFK to begin with. To get more proficient requires playing the game, but the game just punished them for playing it (?) so where do they go to get more proficient? Especially if they have already breezed past all the story content to this point?
No offense intended but how about this? So you got a couple of AFKs? I only have one! Does that mean your stupid? Does it mean your an 8 year old? Should I talk down to you because I have had fewer AFKs than you? I have had exactly one! Should I talk about how freaking superior all my builds must be compared to yours? Maybe thunderfoot006, you shouldn't play in queues till you fix your build? How did you ever get more than one AFK anyway? Don't you 'parse'?
The truth that I see, is that you don't acknowledge that the game isn't just for you, and it doesn't set the gates, or the tutorials up in a way that suits just YOU! It is set up so as to be inclusive. People who want to do, what they want to do, without regard for others are not inclusive, and go against the grain of a social games intentional design. If the game lets an 8 year old, or anyone else play, and it lets them queue, and it is part of the design, and you ethically should make room at the table, cause it isn't only just your table to sit at. If you eat all the food after the host invites someone to join, you are worse than an TRIBBLE. I don't have the right word for it yet ... I don't want to get banned y'know?
Pointing out the truth doesn't make it any less truthful, whether or not you choose to BE an TRIBBLE about it. Choosing to be an TRIBBLE while ignoring truth doesn't make your post cool, or helpful.
I have nothing against you in spite of what seems to be unwarranted arrogance at the top of your post, and I don't blame you for falling into a role the game made available. I would have to blame you if you choose to take no interest in how the role you have fallen into affects others. We are all in game this together regardless, and we need to behave accordingly. If your bringing a 'grownup ship' to play with, please bring a 'grownup attitude to go with it.
The AFK penalty is stupid and doesn't work. But blaming the false positives on high-DPS players is uncalled for. We're not the ones who make the system.
I agree the tone is incorrect, and that dpsers catch heat they don't deserve. A caveat. Some are dismissive, and arrogant, and all end up paying for the rudeness of a few.
I was actually one of the players on the forums that fought for the AFK penalty to be introduced in the first place. I'm still glad it's in. If you can't do 1% of the damage to get the reward, you should not be expecting the reward. Anyone at rank 40 with a T5 ship should be able to get it. It's just a matter of learning how to fly your ship.
Blaming the high DPSer in the group doesn't fly. If he's doing 100k DPS you just need to do 1k DPS to get the reward. Again, that's easily achievable by any rank 40 player with any T5 ship. If you are a lower level and have a lower tier ship and are just out to get XP or have fun, you don't need the reward to do that. Neither are you going to be below rank 40 for very long. A casual player can get to rank 40 within a week. I can do it on a single weekend. Just play the episodes.
I suspect the OP is an AFKer who is irate they can't sit at spawn and get fleet marks for free.
Sorry, this has got a lot wrong with it, no offense.
The queues invite level 5's with level '1' ships. If you try, you should be able to recieve the promised reward. Level 40+ is not an in game requirement to go for rewards. Nor do low levelers in a Fleet not care about Fleet marks. It is an incorrect assumption. Especially since I always care about Fleet marks no matter which toon I am using.
Also, if there are four out of five 30k dpser that is 120k vs say one who is doing 300, so 1% isn't so simple the way it is gated. Take my word for it, since you don't know me, and I don't know you, that I am able to fly my builds just fine. I have been afk'd once only, on a level 10 toon. Once. I was doing the next mission in my 'In Progress' list while going to level that toon to 40+, like you mentioned. Entry for that was level 5+ and I did the right things while flying it. Short version, there is no good reason for an AFK. No GOOD reason.
So again, sorry, but I have to generally disagree here.
Although it has been mentioned, I do think that the fault lies with the game rather than the players.
I have to completely disagree with that. They gave us a number we have to reach to get the reward. It's a very, very low number. It's up to us to reach the low bar and if we can't - it's our fault. Not the game.
I wonder if these people ever play chess versus a computer and end up losing - do they accuse the computer of cheating? Do they get angry and toss their controller when they fall into a pit in Mario? Blaming the game, blaming other players, blaming anyone or anything else when you can't even do 1% of the team's damage is just poor sportsmanship.
But keep in mind, this isn't ISA we're talking about; we're discussing a mission that allows level 5 players to participate alongside level 60 players....
Exactly! Noobs fresh off the bus are going to go into it. If experienced players can get the penalty, they will for sure.
Not exactly the fairest way to approach what is by DESIGN, a low level mission that happens to ALLOW high level players.
Exactly! Noobs fresh off the bus are going to go into it. If experienced players can get the penalty, they will for sure.
Not exactly the fairest way to approach what is by DESIGN, a low level mission that happens to ALLOW high level players.
Qapla
That is assuming that player actually went straight to that queue. Why do people assume that all new players go straight for the queue? Certain players in a hurry? Impatient? A normal queue is a level 50 mission including the mobs. That is why level 60 players are nerfed down to level 50.
Why not just finish the storied mission first? Need to be carried by other stronger players to leech and get more XP in a level 50 mission?
The most affected by this new convenient reason of lower levels participating a level 50 mission are players who are in a hurry and dont want to go to the storied mission.
If players should be prevented, it has to be players who are lower level as the mobs. Not the other way around wherein knowledgeable players who are level 50 being prevented.
Exactly! Noobs fresh off the bus are going to go into it. If experienced players can get the penalty, they will for sure.
Not exactly the fairest way to approach what is by DESIGN, a low level mission that happens to ALLOW high level players.
Qapla
That is assuming that player actually went straight to that queue. Why do people assume that all new players go straight for the queue? Certain players in a hurry? Impatient? A normal queue is a level 50 mission including the mobs. That is why level 60 players are nerfed down to level 50.
Why not just finish the storied mission first? Need to be carried by other stronger players to leech and get more XP in a level 50 mission?
The most affected by this new convenient reason of lower levels participating a level 50 mission are players who are in a hurry and dont want to go to the storied mission.
If players should be prevented, it has to be players who are lower level as the mobs. Not the other way around wherein knowledgeable players who are level 50 being prevented.
Maybe it's something as simple as a newer player striving to play with other players in an MMO. It's not always about wanting the most exp, but it could be as simple as wanting to participate in a fleet action with other players.
Fleet Admiral Duane Gundrum, U.S.S. Merrimack
Fleet Admiral Ventaxa Proxmire, U.S.S. Shaka Walls Fell
Blog: http://www.sarbonn.com/?page_id=1990
Foundry series: Bob From Accounting & For the Sake of the Empire
Exactly! Noobs fresh off the bus are going to go into it. If experienced players can get the penalty, they will for sure.
Not exactly the fairest way to approach what is by DESIGN, a low level mission that happens to ALLOW high level players.
Qapla
That is assuming that player actually went straight to that queue. Why do people assume that all new players go straight for the queue? Certain players in a hurry? Impatient? A normal queue is a level 50 mission including the mobs. That is why level 60 players are nerfed down to level 50.
Why not just finish the storied mission first? Need to be carried by other stronger players to leech and get more XP in a level 50 mission?
The most affected by this new convenient reason of lower levels participating a level 50 mission are players who are in a hurry and dont want to go to the storied mission.
If players should be prevented, it has to be players who are lower level as the mobs. Not the other way around wherein knowledgeable players who are level 50 being prevented.
Actually it is a level 5 to 60 mission, not a level 50+ mission. I'm talking about queues that are by design, beginner's queues. The ones that beginners first encounter, and first have offered by the game. Lots of high levelers also play them, which is where the unlucky mixes occur.
I know we have not had the easiest of exchanges on this, so let me just say, if the noobs had a tutorial, or a warning label, or something for queues, I would personally not be as hot about this as I have been. I don't want to prevent anyone from doing much anything really. Even if your not a noob, if you have never had that exact trouble before, you may not be expecting it, and it comes as a nasty surprise.
Basically, I would be fine if the noobs (nuggets is the term I like better) could fly in a tutorial PVE. Call it the shallow end of the pool, call it whatever you like, and let low levelers swim in it. I like getting Fleet marks where I can with my high level toons, and I for sure wouldn't care if the low levelers had their own version. Maybe reduce the rewards for the low level queue, and kill the AFK penalty just for that one part of the game.
High levels could go in, knowing the rewards were lower, but still fly with low level pals without hurting them. The Low levels could get an education at the same time, and be proper help when they get to the high level queues. Leeches would be a problem, but the rewards wouldn't maybe be worth their time. Even still, the leeches might get off of the higher level queues, and the high level players wouldn't have to worry about them.
I am sure a noob is going to charge off in excitement and do any missions the game says are there to take. I can't imagine some new player not having a blast and trying everything in random order, till they get more experience. Being on toons 24, and 25, I am doing the storied missions especially for the KDF, since ship advancement is affected by 'if' you take them. I was lucky I had C-Store ships the first time I found out that the Storied missions had leveled along with me, and all I had was a Brel! That was awhile ago when I was still basically a noob myself.
I started leveling toons 26 and 27 today, and I was offered the queues at level 3 on the UFP side. I took some time to check my damages in the chat window and at level three I was doing 348 dps max without crits, not including torpedoes. I had the phasers that level with you. I can't actually join the queues for two more levels but when I get there, my damage for that new toon will not be a lot greater. Since last week, I know now I can get an AFK with that toon. No problem, I'll adjust my play style until I can be sure my toon's contribution has a good chance of registering. I'll live.
But Noobs have no idea. I want to do something about that. You paxdawn, don't want to have to carry them. I'll bet they don't want to be carried either since everyone (except leeches) likes to feel like they are doing their part. So why not split them up a bit? Or give a break based on level, or something?
How about these ideas? Don't apply the AFK to very low levels and leeches will eventually level themselves out of the safe zone. Or give three tutorial warnings, then apply the AFK on the fourth offense. Leeches can't milk that one for very much since it goes away also. Or apply warnings followed by an even longer penalty (72 hours?) if there are three warnings in a week, and that means leeches only get away with it maybe twice then have to wait, leaving the rest of us alone for three days
There has to be something better. I don't know the best answer. I just think the current AFK arrangement is to faulty. For now I am planning on catching any noobs I can help before they get discouraged enough to not want to queue ever again. A player who is forewarned will roll with an unfair penalty much better, than will one who has no context, imho.
I know I am long winded, but I hope this explains what my main concerns are.
Whaaa... Please stop whining and learn how to build a decent ship and instead of flying around willy nilly learn the fight and contribute. I have seen and read many posts like yours always crying that such and such is broken or OPed. Nothing is OPed in this game and guy you have zero excuse. So stop crying about someone who has taken the time and effort to build a powerful ship. Better yet quit the game and don't come back.
Pretty much an unacceptable answer to this OP. Maybe you, ssbn655, should go play solitaire. Stack the deck however you like. Solitaire isn't a community game, it should work well for you. You can always come back when you want to play and be nice with real people.
This problem is aggravated by some players like you ssbn655, who suggest that other players should 'leave' the game. I suppose the Devs would like to hear more of that sort of talk from people like you, hmm? It's bad enough I have low levelers in my Fleets who are taking your exact advice. It would please me greatly at the moment if you had a Kemocite chain reaction where the sun don't shine
If you disagree, make your point in a civil fashion ( I admit, it can be difficult at times to remain civil... ) Don't drive people from our community. Most of us like the community, the Devs flat out NEED the community, and you need the Devs. or you have no place to brag about how cool your high dps build is. See the connection?
Qapla
OP has played this game since at least 2012 thats 3 years to learn how to build a ship. He's not a noob. he's a whiner.
The only problem with the AFK penalty I have encountered is when I got SNR, disconnected from(as an example) CCA, and upon reconnect immediately auto-warped out and got the penalty. If there is something that needs to be fixed about the system, it is this. AFK penalty should not apply when the cause is a technical and/or connectivity error.
Whaaa... Please stop whining and learn how to build a decent ship and instead of flying around willy nilly learn the fight and contribute. I have seen and read many posts like yours always crying that such and such is broken or OPed. Nothing is OPed in this game and guy you have zero excuse. So stop crying about someone who has taken the time and effort to build a powerful ship. Better yet quit the game and don't come back.
Pretty much an unacceptable answer to this OP. Maybe you, ssbn655, should go play solitaire. Stack the deck however you like. Solitaire isn't a community game, it should work well for you. You can always come back when you want to play and be nice with real people.
This problem is aggravated by some players like you ssbn655, who suggest that other players should 'leave' the game. I suppose the Devs would like to hear more of that sort of talk from people like you, hmm? It's bad enough I have low levelers in my Fleets who are taking your exact advice. It would please me greatly at the moment if you had a Kemocite chain reaction where the sun don't shine
If you disagree, make your point in a civil fashion ( I admit, it can be difficult at times to remain civil... ) Don't drive people from our community. Most of us like the community, the Devs flat out NEED the community, and you need the Devs. or you have no place to brag about how cool your high dps build is. See the connection?
Qapla
OP has played this game since at least 2012 thats 3 years to learn how to build a ship. He's not a noob. he's a whiner.
The OP has said he had a mid level toon in this one. We all know that getting a full speced kemo 60 toon with a level 30ish or less toon is a recipe for AFK penalty. That is actually a valid complaint and something that needs to be tweaked.
A super-simple concept for a fix for all this DPS-based TRIBBLE would be to auto-filter everyone to DPS-gated norm/adv/elite queue ranges. Simple concept. The noobs would be able to learn without getting trolled, the casual players would be able to have fun without getting stomped, and the DPS crowd would have (and be numerically bound to) their own playpens, never to see a lowly low-hitting DPSer alongside them again. It would make a whole lot more sense than just AFK penalty alone if DPS-gating and AFK penalty worked together.
No, not the first time we get false positives with the AFK penalty system. It's frustrating, Cryptic should revamp it. As long as a person move around and shoot a little it should be ok. It should not be your dmg vs the other players because as stated, new or poorly equipped player in a high DPS group will get screwed.
I've been running a lot of FFAs recently to test this "theory" about low levels getting AFKed by high DPSers. What i found?
My level 12 Science captain in a T2 freebie cruiser out DPSing level 60s... averaging around 1.1k DPS in FFA and ~5% of team damage even if there is someone (or more) doing 10-20k DPS in the group.
Damage seems to be capped at around 20k DPS/player and between 30 to 40k combined team DPS. It's nearly impossible for a high DPSer to AFK someone who's participating in FFA.
side note: the AFK ban also takes into consideration science abilities and healing. throw a couple of grav wells and a hazard emitter during a run and you won't get AFKed.
TL:DR if you got AFK banned in FFA, you most probably deserved it.
Comments
I understand that you are having fun but you have to be really really underperforming to trigger it as far as I know.
Fleet Admiral Ventaxa Proxmire, U.S.S. Shaka Walls Fell
Blog: http://www.sarbonn.com/?page_id=1990
Foundry series: Bob From Accounting & For the Sake of the Empire
It sure works better, than not having it!!!
Agreed, but I have never myself experienced it, even when actually trying to reproduce it!
Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!
Thank you for this! I feel vindicated. So hate whiners and those that call out people for being blunt about the whiners.
Gee tell me something I don't know but for a player to start crying that it was another player to blame for a glitch if it was an actual glitch is the mark of a whiner.
Pretty much an unacceptable answer to this OP. Maybe you, ssbn655, should go play solitaire. Stack the deck however you like. Solitaire isn't a community game, it should work well for you. You can always come back when you want to play and be nice with real people.
I have been all over about this same topic lately. I am being noisy less for me and my one and only AFK I ever than I am for others. I am being noisy because this is a broken mechanic that hurts anyone who is running a new character, which btw happens to represent almost all new players to the game. It also represents those of us heavily invested in a variety of builds, and who are using those multiple buyable slots for new characters to do that with.
This problem is aggravated by some players like you ssbn655, who suggest that other players should 'leave' the game. I suppose the Devs would like to hear more of that sort of talk from people like you, hmm? It's bad enough I have low levelers in my Fleets who are taking your exact advice. It would please me greatly at the moment if you had a Kemocite chain reaction where the sun don't shine
If you disagree, make your point in a civil fashion ( I admit, it can be difficult at times to remain civil... ) Don't drive people from our community. Most of us like the community, the Devs flat out NEED the community, and you need the Devs. or you have no place to brag about how cool your high dps build is. See the connection?
Qapla
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I care! I'm sure I can survive the current AFK stupidity, but I am very worried about newcomers under the current state of affairs. I'm going to change my Fleet description and try and rescue more of the noobs from going in blind. Even if you not a noob it can suck because you are bringing in a new low level toon for the first time.
ALSO! I am very much with you on this idea of having a "good time" and "just trying to have fun". That is essentially what the purpose of a game is, to allow you that experience. I got an AFK last weekend, right in the middle of the only window of time I had. I posted to a GM, cause I was not 'afk'. TWO DAYS LATER I get told by the GM response 'sorry' and that I had to wait two hours
That isn't the problem. The problem was getting flagged in the first place, for doing something fun, with the build you had. My build wasn't at all bad for my level either. I was in all ways deemed appropriate in terms of level required, and in terms of any gear a reasonable person might expect to be able to get at my toons level. In the chat, I could see the damages (after the battle, there was no time during) and the other players were doing at least 60 to 1 of what I was.
The game should have prevented a low level toon from going in, or should have done something to compensate for the mix of levels that not only was allowed, but which the game encouraged. The Devs really should do something so that low and high levelers aren't in conflict.
I care! I'm with you. It's a bug. The only ones who don't care either don't know about it from experience, or are so busy running after personal glory they forget how to listen to other people. They forget they have as fellow inhabitants of this little universe, a duty to play nice with others. That honor follows those who take time to help. That the loyalty given to the community is returned multiplied many times. Personal glory ... is for the impersonal
"Glory is like a circle in the water,
Which never ceaseth to enlarge itself,
Till by broad spreading it disperses to naught."
William Shakespeare as quoted by General Chang
So. If they fix it, that's awesome, and they should want to fix it for everyone's benefit. If they don't fix it, we have to do it ourselves, although our methods will require constant vigilance. We have to intercept the noobs before they get stuck in with a dps demigod because the queues as designed allowed it. We have to take it upon ourselves to watch out for others who through no fault of their own are at risk of being slapped down, and called a cheat due to a broken game mechanic.
Look at it as a chance to be the best kind of warrior. In cross faction terms, the chance to be the best kind of hero. Don't do it for personal glory, do it with no expectation at all !!! The game will be better for it. The Community will still benefit from your efforts EVEN IF they did fix the problem with level mixing.
You can look at yourself in the mirror and say to yourself, "I gave a damn about others today, and it felt good!"
The broken game mechanic is the enemy. If we can't defeat it head on, we must our maneuver it!
But don't let the Devs forget about it either, because they have a duty also! Just saying.
Qapla
Why would you even DO THAT?! Anyway, I guess that doesn't matter. The point is you probably don't do that with a new level 5-10 toon, but they are still members of the community.
The game allows toons with 300 dps max to mingle with the 50k+ crowd, so it isn't about you or me, it's about what makes the game right for the people playing it, noobs included. Since the game allows them to mix, it should not punish any of them for actually mixing, which it does. It is also pure elitist arrogance on the part of those who DO IT, to suggest that any player needs to know all the games ins and outs by level FIVE! That is essentially what many posters do. 'Yuh need uh better build NOOB! Don't play then till yur better!" The real noobs don't even know what 'better' is yet. Where do they get this knowledge if they avoid all areas where that knowledge can be picked up? If they haven't been where we have yet, it doesn't mean they are stupid, and they don't deserve to be treated as if they are!
When is the last time anyone reading this took a new level 10 toon out there to the basic queues? That is where it is most broken. What we experienced years ago when we were 10th level, was a different environment. It had it's own glitches. Did we complain. Be honest. At least admit you yelled at the screen a little when you were new, like I did.
The new glitches, bugs, problems are just as real as previous ones. The right thing for any of us is to try to help.
Qapla
I'll support that statement as it stands, because trying to bring attention to something is good, and it may help, but like a retail store, its still good to bring a receipt if you complain about the product. For my part, I never felt I needed to record anything before this, but the advice here is sound.
Qapla
First answer;
Your question is irrelevant, since the game obviously sets up queues with no apparent regard for what any theoretically average STO player can do. Instead it sets minimum level requirements, and that means that brand new players, and people starting new toons, will end up in those queues. A so called 'average' has nothing to do with where the gates open, or how experienced a player running an eligible character is expected to be BY THE GAME. The game invites them in, they should therefore not be penalized for accepting. I accept that you have an opinion, but it is just an opinion.
Second Answer;
Mostly irrelevant, since there are obviously plenty enough based on the commotion surrounding them. Since you are guessing, so will I, and I guess there are definitely enough of them for those who aren't Uber DPS players to be affected by the presence of those who are. They don't have to be online all the time, or everywhere, they just have to have a huge impact where they are when they are on. Drop a few atom bombs on some islands, and everyone gets excited. You get more excited if they are being dropped on YOU! Most people seem to think atomic weapons are a problem, even though a very tiny number of them have actually gone off, and that includes people who have not had the experience of being bombed.
Third answer;
It is at least mostly the fault of the game design in how it sets gates, however if your an Uber dps player, and don't own your contribution to the current environment, then not only is it partly your fault, but you are inconsiderate of what your contribution is doing to other people. Many of these other people may have zero warning about what your going to do to day to help mess their day up since they are new! it's nice you have so many chances in your day to come back and play later, but some people only have a half an hour, maybe an hour a day. They are done with queues for the whole day if they miss the window available.
They may not have any support from online friends yet, to warn them, or help them. They may not have any idea WHERE to go with their current skill set, especially since they should have been SAFE playing where they got the AFK to begin with. To get more proficient requires playing the game, but the game just punished them for playing it (?) so where do they go to get more proficient? Especially if they have already breezed past all the story content to this point?
No offense intended but how about this? So you got a couple of AFKs? I only have one! Does that mean your stupid? Does it mean your an 8 year old? Should I talk down to you because I have had fewer AFKs than you? I have had exactly one! Should I talk about how freaking superior all my builds must be compared to yours? Maybe thunderfoot006, you shouldn't play in queues till you fix your build? How did you ever get more than one AFK anyway? Don't you 'parse'?
The truth that I see, is that you don't acknowledge that the game isn't just for you, and it doesn't set the gates, or the tutorials up in a way that suits just YOU! It is set up so as to be inclusive. People who want to do, what they want to do, without regard for others are not inclusive, and go against the grain of a social games intentional design. If the game lets an 8 year old, or anyone else play, and it lets them queue, and it is part of the design, and you ethically should make room at the table, cause it isn't only just your table to sit at. If you eat all the food after the host invites someone to join, you are worse than an TRIBBLE. I don't have the right word for it yet ... I don't want to get banned y'know?
Pointing out the truth doesn't make it any less truthful, whether or not you choose to BE an TRIBBLE about it. Choosing to be an TRIBBLE while ignoring truth doesn't make your post cool, or helpful.
I have nothing against you in spite of what seems to be unwarranted arrogance at the top of your post, and I don't blame you for falling into a role the game made available. I would have to blame you if you choose to take no interest in how the role you have fallen into affects others. We are all in game this together regardless, and we need to behave accordingly. If your bringing a 'grownup ship' to play with, please bring a 'grownup attitude to go with it.
Qapla
I agree the tone is incorrect, and that dpsers catch heat they don't deserve. A caveat. Some are dismissive, and arrogant, and all end up paying for the rudeness of a few.
Qapla
Sorry, this has got a lot wrong with it, no offense.
The queues invite level 5's with level '1' ships. If you try, you should be able to recieve the promised reward. Level 40+ is not an in game requirement to go for rewards. Nor do low levelers in a Fleet not care about Fleet marks. It is an incorrect assumption. Especially since I always care about Fleet marks no matter which toon I am using.
Also, if there are four out of five 30k dpser that is 120k vs say one who is doing 300, so 1% isn't so simple the way it is gated. Take my word for it, since you don't know me, and I don't know you, that I am able to fly my builds just fine. I have been afk'd once only, on a level 10 toon. Once. I was doing the next mission in my 'In Progress' list while going to level that toon to 40+, like you mentioned. Entry for that was level 5+ and I did the right things while flying it. Short version, there is no good reason for an AFK. No GOOD reason.
So again, sorry, but I have to generally disagree here.
Qapla
Exactly! Noobs fresh off the bus are going to go into it. If experienced players can get the penalty, they will for sure.
Not exactly the fairest way to approach what is by DESIGN, a low level mission that happens to ALLOW high level players.
Qapla
That is assuming that player actually went straight to that queue. Why do people assume that all new players go straight for the queue? Certain players in a hurry? Impatient? A normal queue is a level 50 mission including the mobs. That is why level 60 players are nerfed down to level 50.
Why not just finish the storied mission first? Need to be carried by other stronger players to leech and get more XP in a level 50 mission?
The most affected by this new convenient reason of lower levels participating a level 50 mission are players who are in a hurry and dont want to go to the storied mission.
If players should be prevented, it has to be players who are lower level as the mobs. Not the other way around wherein knowledgeable players who are level 50 being prevented.
Maybe it's something as simple as a newer player striving to play with other players in an MMO. It's not always about wanting the most exp, but it could be as simple as wanting to participate in a fleet action with other players.
Fleet Admiral Ventaxa Proxmire, U.S.S. Shaka Walls Fell
Blog: http://www.sarbonn.com/?page_id=1990
Foundry series: Bob From Accounting & For the Sake of the Empire
Actually it is a level 5 to 60 mission, not a level 50+ mission. I'm talking about queues that are by design, beginner's queues. The ones that beginners first encounter, and first have offered by the game. Lots of high levelers also play them, which is where the unlucky mixes occur.
I know we have not had the easiest of exchanges on this, so let me just say, if the noobs had a tutorial, or a warning label, or something for queues, I would personally not be as hot about this as I have been. I don't want to prevent anyone from doing much anything really. Even if your not a noob, if you have never had that exact trouble before, you may not be expecting it, and it comes as a nasty surprise.
Basically, I would be fine if the noobs (nuggets is the term I like better) could fly in a tutorial PVE. Call it the shallow end of the pool, call it whatever you like, and let low levelers swim in it. I like getting Fleet marks where I can with my high level toons, and I for sure wouldn't care if the low levelers had their own version. Maybe reduce the rewards for the low level queue, and kill the AFK penalty just for that one part of the game.
High levels could go in, knowing the rewards were lower, but still fly with low level pals without hurting them. The Low levels could get an education at the same time, and be proper help when they get to the high level queues. Leeches would be a problem, but the rewards wouldn't maybe be worth their time. Even still, the leeches might get off of the higher level queues, and the high level players wouldn't have to worry about them.
I am sure a noob is going to charge off in excitement and do any missions the game says are there to take. I can't imagine some new player not having a blast and trying everything in random order, till they get more experience. Being on toons 24, and 25, I am doing the storied missions especially for the KDF, since ship advancement is affected by 'if' you take them. I was lucky I had C-Store ships the first time I found out that the Storied missions had leveled along with me, and all I had was a Brel! That was awhile ago when I was still basically a noob myself.
I started leveling toons 26 and 27 today, and I was offered the queues at level 3 on the UFP side. I took some time to check my damages in the chat window and at level three I was doing 348 dps max without crits, not including torpedoes. I had the phasers that level with you. I can't actually join the queues for two more levels but when I get there, my damage for that new toon will not be a lot greater. Since last week, I know now I can get an AFK with that toon. No problem, I'll adjust my play style until I can be sure my toon's contribution has a good chance of registering. I'll live.
But Noobs have no idea. I want to do something about that. You paxdawn, don't want to have to carry them. I'll bet they don't want to be carried either since everyone (except leeches) likes to feel like they are doing their part. So why not split them up a bit? Or give a break based on level, or something?
How about these ideas? Don't apply the AFK to very low levels and leeches will eventually level themselves out of the safe zone. Or give three tutorial warnings, then apply the AFK on the fourth offense. Leeches can't milk that one for very much since it goes away also. Or apply warnings followed by an even longer penalty (72 hours?) if there are three warnings in a week, and that means leeches only get away with it maybe twice then have to wait, leaving the rest of us alone for three days
There has to be something better. I don't know the best answer. I just think the current AFK arrangement is to faulty. For now I am planning on catching any noobs I can help before they get discouraged enough to not want to queue ever again. A player who is forewarned will roll with an unfair penalty much better, than will one who has no context, imho.
I know I am long winded, but I hope this explains what my main concerns are.
Thanks.
Qapla
OP has played this game since at least 2012 thats 3 years to learn how to build a ship. He's not a noob. he's a whiner.
Yeah, I've had that happen.
Well, supposedly Kemo's taking a hit with S11.
I've been running a lot of FFAs recently to test this "theory" about low levels getting AFKed by high DPSers. What i found?
My level 12 Science captain in a T2 freebie cruiser out DPSing level 60s... averaging around 1.1k DPS in FFA and ~5% of team damage even if there is someone (or more) doing 10-20k DPS in the group.
Damage seems to be capped at around 20k DPS/player and between 30 to 40k combined team DPS. It's nearly impossible for a high DPSer to AFK someone who's participating in FFA.
side note: the AFK ban also takes into consideration science abilities and healing. throw a couple of grav wells and a hazard emitter during a run and you won't get AFKed.
TL:DR if you got AFK banned in FFA, you most probably deserved it.