AFK penalty really needs to be looked at

littlesarbonn · October 2015

I just did another one of those fleet alert missions where I was nonstop firing at enemies and having a good time, only to receive a 2 hour penalty for being AFK. I know the Devs are never going to address this, but just because one person goes in with an overpowered ship that devastates everything on the screen shouldn't result in every other player being penalized for not doing enough damage.

Yeah, I know no one cares. And I know the Devs don't care. But man, that is so freaking annoying when you're just trying to have fun in the game. I love doing fleet alerts. They're probably the most fun I get out of the game. So 2 hours of my night not being able to do one basically means having to wait until the next day due to the few hours I have to play this game at night.

Yeah, I know. Nobody cares.

ssbn655 · October 2015

Whaaa... Please stop whining and learn how to build a decent ship and instead of flying around willy nilly learn the fight and contribute. I have seen and read many posts like yours always crying that such and such is broken or OPed. Nothing is OPed in this game and guy you have zero excuse. So stop crying about someone who has taken the time and effort to build a powerful ship. Better yet quit the game and don't come back.

gradii · October 2015

ssbn655 wrote: »

Whaaa... Please stop whining and learn how to build a decent ship and instead of flying around willy nilly learn the fight and contribute. I have seen and read many posts like yours always crying that such and such is broken or OPed. Nothing is OPed in this game and guy you have zero excuse. So stop crying about someone who has taken the time and effort to build a powerful ship. Better yet quit the game and don't come back.

I know an TRIBBLE when I see one. Thanks for illustrating for us.

gradii · October 2015

The AFK penalty is probably glitching on you. if it ain't broke it ain't Cryptic.

littlesarbonn · October 2015

gradii wrote: »

The AFK penalty is probably glitching on you. if it ain't broke it ain't Cryptic.

I remember a few years back it used to glitch like that, but hadn't seen it recur in a very long time.

lingeringsoul888 · October 2015

I find it the only for me to ever get an AFK penalty was to literally do no damage. When I farm dil using my other alt characters, their DPS is usually only around 1.5k-4k max and I've been so lazy as to just fly in set it on auto pew pew and tab out and I still can't get an AFK.

nikephorus · October 2015

I've done fleet alerts in my t1 oberth for poops and giggles and haven't ever gotten penalized with an afk penalty.

paxdawn · October 2015

Do you have a record of this?

Cryptic usually wants something in record/proof before they actually make reasonable action. This means recording in video you really got AFK penalty and it would help if you have a recorded combat log. Proof that you didnt deserve it especially if this is normal.

Because they ask me of this when I found a bug of some sort.

If this is Advance or elite difficulty, better tone down that difficulty.

littlesarbonn · October 2015

It was a regular Federation Fleet Alert. I did a lot of damage and killed a bunch of different enemies. There was definitely one guy that was slaughtering practically everything else though. I wouldn't be surprised if a bunch of people got AFK penalties on that mission.

And no, I have no video of this as I don't video the game when I play it. I play the game to have fun, not to record things that might be going wrong. Basically, when it happened, I quit and went to play another game as I realized I wouldn't be able to do any more fleet alerts for the rest of the night.

nathrael · October 2015

The only problem with the AFK penalty I have encountered is when I got SNR, disconnected from(as an example) CCA, and upon reconnect immediately auto-warped out and got the penalty. If there is something that needs to be fixed about the system, it is this. AFK penalty should not apply when the cause is a technical and/or connectivity error.

darkbladejk · October 2015

littlesarbonn wrote: »

I just did another one of those fleet alert missions where I was nonstop firing at enemies and having a good time, only to receive a 2 hour penalty for being AFK. I know the Devs are never going to address this, but just because one person goes in with an overpowered ship that devastates everything on the screen shouldn't result in every other player being penalized for not doing enough damage.

Yeah, I know no one cares. And I know the Devs don't care. But man, that is so freaking annoying when you're just trying to have fun in the game. I love doing fleet alerts. They're probably the most fun I get out of the game. So 2 hours of my night not being able to do one basically means having to wait until the next day due to the few hours I have to play this game at night.

Yeah, I know. Nobody cares.

if you're getting the afk penalty in a mission that tells me one of a few possibilities is happening.
1: you did little to no damage to the enemy.
2: you sat there
3: you got dcd or SNR at the wrong time.
4: it actually bugged out

The afk penalty can bug out from time to time but it's a very very uncommon thing to see happen. I have to be perfectly honest from the way you're describing it as "an overpowered ship that devastates everything on screen" makes me question how much damage you really did yourself. It truthfully sounds like you did so little damage it triggered the penalty. If you have any type of videos, parse data or anything then please by all means post them up so we can test this for ourselves. You've not given much info just yet for us to go on.

hawkrunner · October 2015

I agree that the AFK penalty maybe needs a few tweaks. There are some queues where it does far more harm than good. Fleet Alert is one of them, and should probably not have an AFK penalty. Another option would be to make a Level 60 only version of Fleet Alert that is restricted to Level 60 captains only, like Starbase Fleet Defense has. Even that may not be sufficient though...

I have often seen T1-T3 ships in Fleet Alert, with the Captain having the appropriate level for the ship, and these ships and builds have virtually no chance of being competitive in the damage race against someone who comes in with a high-end ship (unless that high-end ship decides to go AFK). What happens then is, even with the Level 50 stat handicaps, the person in the high-end ship doesn't have to try very hard, and a wave will be decimated in a single buff/firing cycle before the person with the low-end ship can get in range of the enemies. Then, while the low-end ship is trying to re-orient itself, the high level person has already wiped out another wave on the other side of the map. If you end up with more than one high-end ship on the same team, good luck preventing your T1-T3 ship from getting an AFK penalty.

As for what motivates the high-end ships to go in there, well for one thing, I'm still trying to finish up some of the Siege Breaker accolades, and there are probably others doing the same.

paxdawn · October 2015

littlesarbonn wrote: »

It was a regular Federation Fleet Alert. I did a lot of damage and killed a bunch of different enemies. There was definitely one guy that was slaughtering practically everything else though. I wouldn't be surprised if a bunch of people got AFK penalties on that mission.

And no, I have no video of this as I don't video the game when I play it. I play the game to have fun, not to record things that might be going wrong. Basically, when it happened, I quit and went to play another game as I realized I wouldn't be able to do any more fleet alerts for the rest of the night.

Here is the thing. How to know if you dealt "a lot of damage" if you didn't record it?

There is also an issue if it is a one time thing or repetitive. If it is a one time thing, move along. If it is repetitive, very easy to record it due to being repetitive.

With regards to fun, fed alert is a multiplayer. Hard for the other players to have fun if they have to carry the load of those not contributing. If this is a case of lack of DPs contribution, it means you are doing less than 1% of the team dps. that means other players must compensate for your lack of contribution which disrupts their "fun" because they are being slowed down and must be carry the other player or players.

You got a choice of recording, to check if you are really contributing to the team or not or if there was a bug or not. If don't like recording, There is also a choice to improve oneself. The time you spent posting or complaining could have been a time improving oneself instead, searching the Internet on how to improve space build/piloting or asking from experts for help. We have the build and academy sections in STO forum to start from. Thus, avoiding AFK penalty in the future.

e30ernest · October 2015

hawkrunner wrote: »

As for what motivates the high-end ships to go in there, well for one thing, I'm still trying to finish up some of the Siege Breaker accolades, and there are probably others doing the same.

I do it for the Fleet Marks. When I am in a hurry to get some Fleet Marks, I'll take anything that awards it. Fleet Alert happens to be one of the shortest missions to get them.

I actually wish there was an advanced/elite version of this.

damienvryce2 · October 2015

You know what we need? STO forums elite. This way the so-called DPS elites can have a special little place they can go to show off their numbers like proud little peacocks. Just my opinion. Have a nice day.

serhatgs1905 · October 2015

I did a fleet alert yesterday about maybe 12 hours ago from this moment of reply.

did about 18k while the 2nd ranked did 1.5k iirc...

Now getting to the point: does this mean I shouldn't do pve's such as Fleet alert where it's an easy and fast way for me to get fleet marks just before I go offline? Ques were quite empty yesterday and the dps channels were verry quiet.. so I figured I do one fleet alert before I call it a night.

it could have been me.. could have not been me I don't know and can't look at my log now since I'm at work. One thing that I do remember about this run is that there was 1 player that made a few remarks in team chat along the lines of:

"another one with kemo and I can't get one"
"I'll just chill here " (at this point I checked the player barely moving above the starbase..did engage after a bit but this was wave 3 iirc)

and towards the end there was another remark something along the line of "another boring run"

It could have been me in this run it could have been a different run with a good amount of players that do even more dps than i can bring to the table. but this should not mean that someone whos build is not optimal should just sit there and do nothing. just join the battle from the start and go for it.

I didn't think about possability of the AFK penalty to trigger for the other players. so I'll keep an eye on that if I do another fleet alert and give the group a chance to do some actual damage in the last wave. (not saying it was me.. just saying it could have been me)

also I think in situations like this it's a great oppertunity to talk with the ladd that does way more dps than yourself or someone else and ask for some pointers. I allways help out anyone that ask as long as time permits it.

captinwh0 · October 2015

another one i think needs looked at, it warping into a queue that has already failed, and getting a penalty if you leave, not fair.
if my daily isnt done yet i dont mind warping half way in, but after that, warping in to a failed mission is a big no-no. you should be able to chose

thunderfoot · October 2015

"Awww. Poor little player. He gots the penaltys 'cuz the Big Kids all brought their grownup ships to play the game with. That's not fair!"

A few questions I'd like to see answered.

- What is the DPS of an 'average' STO player?
Pretty sure it is under 10K but I have no proof so this is an opinion. My ships all are right around the 8.5 to 9.5k mark. Which is more than enough to successfully partcipate in any game content.

- Just how many actual Uber DPS players are there in this game?
I am guessing they make up a very small percentage of the player population. Not nearly enough to be blamed for all the TRIBBLE they catch since they cannot all be online at the same time nor can they be everywhere at once.

- Why is it always somebody else's fault an AFK Penalty is handed out in one of these threads?
I have gotten a couple since the Penalty was implemented. It's two hours. I can go do something else for two hours. Like figure out how to use my ship better. Like play the parts of STO where my current skillset and gear level are more appropriate. Maybe when I get more proficient I can come back. There are very good reasons eight year olds are not allowed to be F1 drivers.

Yeah, I'm an TRIBBLE. And I don't care people think I'm an TRIBBLE. However, even an TRIBBLE gets to be right once in awhile. TRIBBLE pointing out the truth does not make the truth any less truthful either.

warpangel · October 2015

The AFK penalty is stupid and doesn't work. But blaming the false positives on high-DPS players is uncalled for. We're not the ones who make the system.

captinwh0 · October 2015

you could have pointed that out without being nasty about it

thunderfoot006 wrote: »

"Awww. Poor little player. He gots the penaltys 'cuz the Big Kids all brought their grownup ships to play the game with. That's not fair!"

.

kamiyama317 · October 2015

I was actually one of the players on the forums that fought for the AFK penalty to be introduced in the first place. I'm still glad it's in. If you can't do 1% of the damage to get the reward, you should not be expecting the reward. Anyone at rank 40 with a T5 ship should be able to get it. It's just a matter of learning how to fly your ship.

Blaming the high DPSer in the group doesn't fly. If he's doing 100k DPS you just need to do 1k DPS to get the reward. Again, that's easily achievable by any rank 40 player with any T5 ship. If you are a lower level and have a lower tier ship and are just out to get XP or have fun, you don't need the reward to do that. Neither are you going to be below rank 40 for very long. A casual player can get to rank 40 within a week. I can do it on a single weekend. Just play the episodes.

I suspect the OP is an AFKer who is irate they can't sit at spawn and get fleet marks for free.

coupaholic · October 2015

I can chip in, I don't consider myself to be anything more or less than an average F2P player.

thunderfoot006 wrote: »

- What is the DPS of an 'average' STO player?

I think I can hit around the 10k mark when applying myself with the best gear I have. But normally perhaps the 6/8k mark when having fun. This is just going on random parser posts to team chat, normally I pay no attention to what my damage is.

thunderfoot006 wrote: »

- Just how many actual Uber DPS players are there in this game?

Only a tiny handful of players actually bother posting here or on Reddit, and only a subsection of them are part of the top end DPS crowd. So I'd guess very small indeed.

thunderfoot006 wrote: »

- Why is it always somebody else's fault an AFK Penalty is handed out in one of these threads?

Because we, as players, are naturally always right and we always win. No exceptions.

I have yet to even see this AFK penalty in person even when I know I'm messing everything up. I would think for the vast majority it's not even a concern. And if it was a bug treat it as an isolated incident. If it happens again post a bug report, ideally with screenies and so on.

warpangel · October 2015

kamiyama317 wrote: »

I was actually one of the players on the forums that fought for the AFK penalty to be introduced in the first place. I'm still glad it's in. If you can't do 1% of the damage to get the reward, you should not be expecting the reward. Anyone at rank 40 with a T5 ship should be able to get it. It's just a matter of learning how to fly your ship.

Problem is, anyone with decent DPS can do that 1% very quickly and then AFK the rest of the mission. Which is why I say its stupid and doesn't work.

kamiyama317 · October 2015

reyan01 wrote: »

Although it has been mentioned, I do think that the fault lies with the game rather than the players.

I have to completely disagree with that. They gave us a number we have to reach to get the reward. It's a very, very low number. It's up to us to reach the low bar and if we can't - it's our fault. Not the game.

I wonder if these people ever play chess versus a computer and end up losing - do they accuse the computer of cheating? Do they get angry and toss their controller when they fall into a pit in Mario? Blaming the game, blaming other players, blaming anyone or anything else when you can't even do 1% of the team's damage is just poor sportsmanship.

gradii · October 2015

I seriously feel for the OP being flamed due to a glitch in the game. you morons (you know who you are) should be ashamed of yourselves.

potasssium · October 2015

Try submitting a Bug Ticket, there could be something wrong. Also for the heck of it, I would try to force verify you files.

sarcasmdetector · October 2015

I noticed this thread pop up a few minutes after i had done an FFA. So perhaps I'm the evil and dastardly DPSer who AFked the OP.

I don't typically parse FFA, so I have no record of this run to review. However a few days ago (right around the time of the OPs previous post about AFK.. hmmm...) i warped into an FFA and saw a Cell ship next to me. So I started my combatlog out of curiosity. Here are results.

The person in the Cell ship doesn't even show up in the log. They didn't move, shoot, heal, or get shot at for the whole FFA. that's why you are only seeing 4 entrees in the log.

It also looked like someone else on the team got an AFK ban, the person i'm pointing out in red in the above image. Very low damage, and no healing whatsoever. Breaking down thier contributions:

That pretty much explains it. The infamous "one of everything" build. Couldn't be the OP because he's stated that he is a long time player, knows how to build ships, and participates.

Anyway, I hope the other person *ahem* I AFKed

used his 2 hours well, and looked up how to improve his build a little on the internet.

jaturnley · October 2015

hawkrunner wrote: »

As for what motivates the high-end ships to go in there, well for one thing, I'm still trying to finish up some of the Siege Breaker accolades, and there are probably others doing the same.

High end people run Fleet Alert all the time - it's the absolute quickest way to get fleet marks in the game, even slightly faster than CEA on most runs. With the T3 Lab rewards costing ~600k fleet credits, even vets who saved up are now grinding them to get enough.

mayito2009 · October 2015

For sure OP you need to file a ticket because I have gotten in events (alerts) right at the moment when the mothership Borg has been destroyed and I didnt do 1 single damage and I didnt get penalized.

jaturnley · October 2015

sarcasmdetector wrote: »

It also looked like someone else on the team got an AFK ban, the person i'm pointing out in red in the above image. Very low damage, and no healing whatsoever.

This is pretty typical for fleet mark farmers, using their alt accounts to get extra marks for one-man fleets. They log in, run a macro to fire all of their weapons so they get enough damage to "participate", and then KVM/switch from the VM back to their main to do something else for a couple minutes, and then come back to claim the reward. In most cases it just screws over normal players who have to work extra hard to make up for the freeloader, but in happy cases like yours they get the appropriate AFK penalty.

AFK penalty really needs to be looked at

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