It's not that science isn't amazing it's that it take considerably more thought and resources to make it work then sleeping on the spacebar. I personally have only begun using it recently because of all the nice buffs that make it fun and interesting in different ways then spamming BFAW.
The worst part is how confusing it is to people who may want to try it out, there are several types of science builds with varying degrees of usefulness and no one simple cookie cutter build to suit every need. Particle generators alone lend itself to half a dozen or so viable powers including a threat drawing FBP build. It's just a lot of information to take in and it's hard to sort through it all easily. For science to become more popular we need YouTube channels, chat channels and sub-forums where people can get quick help. It just takes time, but I've found it extremely rewarding so far!
It is something hard to get into. So much more stuff to bolt on now on top of the old problems of how to Skill for it in the first place.
Setting up a useful science build isnt too difficult and the strongest abilities are well known. Bigger problem is the price tag, e.g. TBR is only useful doffed and thats an easy 25-35m EC investment (KDF side when I checked last month a few times). Also have R&D Science > 15 or bust.
Setting up a useful science build isnt too difficult and the strongest abilities are well known. Bigger problem is the price tag, e.g. TBR is only useful doffed and thats an easy 25-35m EC investment (KDF side when I checked last month a few times). Also have R&D Science > 15 or bust.
Yeah, it's not just a steep learning curve of overwhelming information it also has a hefty price tag. My science build cost almost as much as my set of [CRTD]x3 [PEN] Epic Antiproton Beams did... And that was one big hunk of change let me tell you!
As a minor side note the topic; Buffing both Particle generators and graviton generators makes the Gravimetric Rift proc on the Gravimetric Photon Torpedoes better. Part gens will, of course, increase the the damage per second of the rifts and grav gens increase the duration, which can mean sometimes grav gens will get you more rift damage than more part gens will.
i dont know if it was written here or on reddit but somebody compared max partgen vs 400 partgen + max graviton dmg and the dmg difference was minimal.
Personally, i switched from max partgen to partgen/grav and its highly satisfying to see all enemies being pulled into gw...make sure to get the vaadwaur anchor console, it is pretty cheap and boosts the dmg quite a lot.
i dont know if it was written here or on reddit but somebody compared max partgen vs 400 partgen + max graviton dmg and the dmg difference was minimal.
Personally, i switched from max partgen to partgen/grav and its highly satisfying to see all enemies being pulled into gw...make sure to get the vaadwaur anchor console, it is pretty cheap and boosts the dmg quite a lot.
Ever since they changed the sci R&D trait, I've heard with just 200 part gens you're good. Given the gear in-game right now, you can max grav gens and get part gens over 200 at the same time. Deadly combination. Surprised I haven't seen a single grav gens build lately.
The trait caps crith at 250 partgens (including player skill points), so you would be fine with 4 consoles and no other partgen source. critd is increased further but with 0.1% per point that is quite fruitless so better go with something else supporting your build e.g. the already named gravgens.
i dont know if it was written here or on reddit but somebody compared max partgen vs 400 partgen + max graviton dmg and the dmg difference was minimal.
Personally, i switched from max partgen to partgen/grav and its highly satisfying to see all enemies being pulled into gw...make sure to get the vaadwaur anchor console, it is pretty cheap and boosts the dmg quite a lot.
Ever since they changed the sci R&D trait, I've heard with just 200 part gens you're good. Given the gear in-game right now, you can max grav gens and get part gens over 200 at the same time. Deadly combination. Surprised I haven't seen a single grav gens build lately.
Excellent thread. I've never really given a thought to graviton before. It's nice to find that maxing it will grab ships off the map. I'm wondering what the baseline i.e. GW3 versus GW1.
Some alts have GW3+RB2 versus RB3+GW1. After a STF a dps'er noted that I was one from the bottom in dps and had some tips for my build. I commented how I was worried about "overflying" the RB and then realized that adding in TBR would keep the target in front, preventing me from "overflying" the target.
Since I'm KDF my Science options are limited to the Hegh'ta which is still a blast to fly. I have a fleet of alts I've started focusing on PG. Now I'll take a look at PG+Graviton.
Ex-CoH players, Please add the chat channel "CoX STO"
For a Science Captain, I think Gravity Well is both crowd control and DPS source. It's a good idea to load up the right torpedoes, anything that has an AoE effect is a good start. Though I wouldn't recommend any heavy torpedoes, but that's a general problem with their unreliability.
The Particle Emission Torpedo (Crafting/Exchange), the Gravimetric Torpedo, the Neutronic Torpedo and the Bio-whatever Torpedo from the Undine reputation all deliver here to some extent. Torpedo Spread is the better buff in general for these - if all those enemies clump together in the center of the grav well, all those torpedoes and all their AOEs and later all those warp core explosion affect most of your targets.
Sometimes, when you catch one of those SPhere/Probe only groups in a Borg Red Alert, it really seems they melt under your Grav Well + torpedo salvo. (THat said - anyone with a good DPS/BFAW build will have the same experience...)
The crowd control potential is awesome for many STFs, as you can ensure that your enemies don't get anywhere you want them to go (like the Nanite Spheres in Infected, or all those Crystal Shards and Tholian ships that are suddenly trapped around the Entity.)
Unfortunately, it's really hard to find any alternatives to Gravity Well. I know there are some people focusing on drain builds, but I don't think anyone is still using Charged Particle Burst, Photonic Shockwave or Scramble Sensors...
i dont know if it was written here or on reddit but somebody compared max partgen vs 400 partgen + max graviton dmg and the dmg difference was minimal.
Personally, i switched from max partgen to partgen/grav and its highly satisfying to see all enemies being pulled into gw...make sure to get the vaadwaur anchor console, it is pretty cheap and boosts the dmg quite a lot.
The Gravimetric and Particle Emission Torpedo are compared in this thread. Particle and Graviton Gens affect on the Gravimetric Torpedo are touched on. Note: At this point the +Pla (plasma) consoles do not buff plasma torpedo damage.
Unfortunately, it's really hard to find any alternatives to Gravity Well. I know there are some people focusing on drain builds, but I don't think anyone is still using Charged Particle Burst, Photonic Shockwave or Scramble Sensors...
I use Charged Particle Burst on a flow cap/Deteriorating Secondary Deflector build. I've also used Scamble Sensors on a Part. Gen/Inhibiting Secondary Deflector build. I'd like to see the disable on Photonic Shockwave increased, perhaps doffs that add electrical/kinetic damage or possible subsystem disable to the attack, or the power tweaked a bit, then I'd consider using it.
GW is more about control then damage mostly due to the fact crits are not working for GW and also similar abilities such as Tyken's Rift. For the most part i have not seen GW break 3k dps if it were able to crit it would be an amazing ability.
Destabilizing Resonance Beam is the strongest damage ability for science atm even with it long cd it + deteriorating deflector put out huge numbers. DRB+deteriorating deflector on the top end can add up to 15k+ dps
TBR is also a great skill for damage due to its short cd but requires a expensive doff to be worth using.
For max dps the setup for a cmmd/lt.cmmd sci ship is x,x,GW1,DRB3/ x,x,TBR2 (x's are whatever you want)
The Vaadwaur constriction anchor console looks weak. It only provides 3.3% bonus exotic damage, not really worth a slot imo. If you did 1000 exotic damage that would be 33 extra damage.
The Vaadwaur constriction anchor console looks weak. It only provides 3.3% bonus exotic damage, not really worth a slot imo. If you did 1000 exotic damage that would be 33 extra damage.
It scales with your level at 60 it is a 23.7% bonus.
For some reason when you view it before equipping it it will always assume your level 1.
GW is more about control then damage mostly due to the fact crits are not working for GW and also similar abilities such as Tyken's Rift. For the most part i have not seen GW break 3k dps if it were able to crit it would be an amazing ability.
Destabilizing Resonance Beam is the strongest damage ability for science atm even with it long cd it + deteriorating deflector put out huge numbers. DRB+deteriorating deflector on the top end can add up to 15k+ dps
TBR is also a great skill for damage due to its short cd but requires a expensive doff to be worth using.
Well, or a few good speed buffs. Evasive Maneuvers and something else so you can keep up with the uptime with TBR. That used to be my PvP and PvP tactic once with TBR - pop TBR and Evasive Maneuvers and carry the enemy away, while dealing full damage with TBR.
The DOFF is certainly better, since TBR used to actually repulse enemies often meant breaking up enemy groups when you'd rather have them all in your next AoE.
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The Vaadwaur constriction anchor console looks weak. It only provides 3.3% bonus exotic damage, not really worth a slot imo. If you did 1000 exotic damage that would be 33 extra damage.
It scales with your level at 60 it is a 23.7% bonus.
For some reason when you view it before equipping it it will always assume your level 1.
Thanks for the info I was wondering why most people were mentioning this console for an exotic build when its face value was only 3.3% bonus.
Unfortunately, it's really hard to find any alternatives to Gravity Well. I know there are some people focusing on drain builds, but I don't think anyone is still using Charged Particle Burst, Photonic Shockwave or Scramble Sensors...
Scramble sensor builds work, it just takes a lot of very expensive skill points. I don't think I've ever seen a Photonic Shockwave or CBP build build. They did just boost Aceton beam 250%.
So I'm running an annorax w/AP, grav photon in front, PEP in the rear. All consoles are bent toward PartGen, GravGen, and aux power (max part Gen / grav skill points as well). Main attacks are GW3, res beam 3, and ionic turb. Aux boosts are core capacitor, red matter, OSS1 and T5 rom power. She is an absolute BEAST. here's my question. I've been using TB (and Vaadwaur anchor) to keep ships in in GW. But I keep hearing TBR with the reverse DOFF is super powerful. Which should I keep, TB to hold in GW or Reversed TBR?
So I'm running an annorax w/AP, grav photon in front, PEP in the rear. All consoles are bent toward PartGen, GravGen, and aux power (max part Gen / grav skill points as well). Main attacks are GW3, res beam 3, and ionic turb. Aux boosts are core capacitor, red matter, OSS1 and T5 rom power. She is an absolute BEAST. here's my question. I've been using TB (and Vaadwaur anchor) to keep ships in in GW. But I keep hearing TBR with the reverse DOFF is super powerful. Which should I keep, TB to hold in GW or Reversed TBR?
Reverse TBR. You do know there is a GW engine disable doff.
Matter-Antimatter Specialist-Every 1 second has a 20% chance of disabling engines for 1 second (while it might sound weak the 1 second disable is enough to take most mobs from the edge of a GW to the middle)
For exotic damage you want GW1 (due to broken crits it does not scale as well as other abilities) and then either TBR3 or DRB3. DRB3 requires you keep your enemies in your frontal arc for the full channel or else it shuts off so if your running a broadside TBR with reverse doff is a better idea.
I'm looking that specific doff, do you have a name?
I think it's one of the new Delta race doffs.... *looks* Ok, my Kazon M-AM has a trait that appiies a buff to your team when you use DEM. Guess that's not it.
I'm looking that specific doff, do you have a name?
Well there multiple names but the cheapest fed side atm i think is Lespsa at about 1 million. Kdf side Stradurol is the cheapest at about 4 million past that there are some xindi doffs that do the same thing but cost 20+ million.
Comments
Isometric Charge is indeed affected by Particle Gens. I think the Vaadwaur console buffs its damage too.
It is something hard to get into. So much more stuff to bolt on now on top of the old problems of how to Skill for it in the first place.
Agreed. Every faction should get its Intel Science Vessel IMO.
Yeah, it's not just a steep learning curve of overwhelming information it also has a hefty price tag. My science build cost almost as much as my set of [CRTD]x3 [PEN] Epic Antiproton Beams did... And that was one big hunk of change let me tell you!
Personally, i switched from max partgen to partgen/grav and its highly satisfying to see all enemies being pulled into gw...make sure to get the vaadwaur anchor console, it is pretty cheap and boosts the dmg quite a lot.
Ever since they changed the sci R&D trait, I've heard with just 200 part gens you're good. Given the gear in-game right now, you can max grav gens and get part gens over 200 at the same time. Deadly combination. Surprised I haven't seen a single grav gens build lately.
Have they fixed that trait yet? Last time I tried it, it did not really effect Gravity Well.
https://www.reddit.com/r/sto/comments/3hhxny/what_science_abilities_dont_crit/
Excellent thread. I've never really given a thought to graviton before. It's nice to find that maxing it will grab ships off the map. I'm wondering what the baseline i.e. GW3 versus GW1.
Some alts have GW3+RB2 versus RB3+GW1. After a STF a dps'er noted that I was one from the bottom in dps and had some tips for my build. I commented how I was worried about "overflying" the RB and then realized that adding in TBR would keep the target in front, preventing me from "overflying" the target.
Since I'm KDF my Science options are limited to the Hegh'ta which is still a blast to fly. I have a fleet of alts I've started focusing on PG. Now I'll take a look at PG+Graviton.
Ex-CoH players, Please add the chat channel "CoX STO"
This is only about 320 in partgens.
The Gravimetric and Particle Emission Torpedo are compared in this thread. Particle and Graviton Gens affect on the Gravimetric Torpedo are touched on. Note: At this point the +Pla (plasma) consoles do not buff plasma torpedo damage.
I use Charged Particle Burst on a flow cap/Deteriorating Secondary Deflector build. I've also used Scamble Sensors on a Part. Gen/Inhibiting Secondary Deflector build. I'd like to see the disable on Photonic Shockwave increased, perhaps doffs that add electrical/kinetic damage or possible subsystem disable to the attack, or the power tweaked a bit, then I'd consider using it.
Destabilizing Resonance Beam is the strongest damage ability for science atm even with it long cd it + deteriorating deflector put out huge numbers. DRB+deteriorating deflector on the top end can add up to 15k+ dps
TBR is also a great skill for damage due to its short cd but requires a expensive doff to be worth using.
For max dps the setup for a cmmd/lt.cmmd sci ship is x,x,GW1,DRB3/ x,x,TBR2 (x's are whatever you want)
It scales with your level at 60 it is a 23.7% bonus.
For some reason when you view it before equipping it it will always assume your level 1.
The DOFF is certainly better, since TBR used to actually repulse enemies often meant breaking up enemy groups when you'd rather have them all in your next AoE.
Thanks for the info
Scramble sensor builds work, it just takes a lot of very expensive skill points. I don't think I've ever seen a Photonic Shockwave or CBP build build. They did just boost Aceton beam 250%.
Reverse TBR. You do know there is a GW engine disable doff.
Matter-Antimatter Specialist-Every 1 second has a 20% chance of disabling engines for 1 second (while it might sound weak the 1 second disable is enough to take most mobs from the edge of a GW to the middle)
For exotic damage you want GW1 (due to broken crits it does not scale as well as other abilities) and then either TBR3 or DRB3. DRB3 requires you keep your enemies in your frontal arc for the full channel or else it shuts off so if your running a broadside TBR with reverse doff is a better idea.
My character Tsin'xing
Well there multiple names but the cheapest fed side atm i think is Lespsa at about 1 million. Kdf side Stradurol is the cheapest at about 4 million past that there are some xindi doffs that do the same thing but cost 20+ million.
My character Tsin'xing
Krenim