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why do new people try advanced/elite content?

deaftravis05deaftravis05 Member Posts: 4,885 Arc User
I run KGA, often by pugging and by myself (no friends). In one match I've done 75 percent of the damage... after joining 3 minutes in.

Often I have a team that at least knows the basics of the purpose of Khitotmer, ground. They know where to go, when to run and what to blow up.

However, there tends to be one guy that's exploring the map, totally ignoring the timer.

when it's one guy, meh...

when it's 2 of them! and one guy with you is using a new toon (but knows what he's doing)... you tend to get pressed...

Honestly, we're clearing the last room to destroy the power and two guys, after getting themselves killed over and over in the ramps and ignoring us call out for them to come on and ignore the drones... they go explore the borg device and summon borg reinforcements...

I'm killing them left and right... at 600 dps... and I've killed most of them... by the time I get the room cleared, there's 2 minutes left on the clock...


Why...


why...



why... do new players go exploring on advanced/elite??? do the exploring on normal... ask questions, chat... don't just stand there and die over and over...
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  • rattler2rattler2 Member Posts: 55,676 Community Moderator
    edited June 2015
    Probably because when they ask questions, someone rips them a new one for not knowing automatically?

    I'm not blaiming you OP, but I am saying that the environment isn't exactly question friendly in most cases. Not enough of us experienced players willing to help, and not enough rookies willing to ask questions.
    66998372863950ee98cf7da9786e2ea9-db80k0m.png
    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
    The nut who actually ground out a Delta Pack, Temporal Pack, and Gamma Pack
    The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
  • thisslerthissler Member Posts: 2,055 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    I run KGA, often by pugging and by myself (no friends). In one match I've done 75 percent of the damage... after joining 3 minutes in.

    Often I have a team that at least knows the basics of the purpose of Khitotmer, ground. They know where to go, when to run and what to blow up.

    However, there tends to be one guy that's exploring the map, totally ignoring the timer.

    when it's one guy, meh...

    when it's 2 of them! and one guy with you is using a new toon (but knows what he's doing)... you tend to get pressed...

    Honestly, we're clearing the last room to destroy the power and two guys, after getting themselves killed over and over in the ramps and ignoring us call out for them to come on and ignore the drones... they go explore the borg device and summon borg reinforcements...

    I'm killing them left and right... at 600 dps... and I've killed most of them... by the time I get the room cleared, there's 2 minutes left on the clock...


    Why...


    why...



    why... do new players go exploring on advanced/elite??? do the exploring on normal... ask questions, chat... don't just stand there and die over and over...

    I'll totally be your friend.

    You seem likable.

    Hold me.
  • praxi5praxi5 Member Posts: 1,562 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Because you breeze through standard content without so much as batting an eye.

    That makes you (artificially) think that you're capable of handling harder content, when you're really not even close.
  • thatcursedwolfthatcursedwolf Member Posts: 1,617 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    praxi5 wrote: »
    Because you breeze through standard content without so much as batting an eye.

    That makes you (artificially) think that you're capable of handling harder content, when you're really not even close.

    Normal queues do not do a good job of teaching you how to run some of the Advanced versions.

    BDN and ANRN teach you very bad things for their Advanced versions.
    This is my Risian Corvette. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
  • deaftravis05deaftravis05 Member Posts: 4,885 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    1. I do have friends, lol, I just like to see if I can do it myself. Not everyone likes ground content

    2. Normal, indeed does not teach players how to do it on harder difficulties, but still, KGN should teach players where to go
  • lordsteve1lordsteve1 Member Posts: 3,492 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    praxi5 wrote: »
    Because you breeze through standard content without so much as batting an eye.

    That makes you (artificially) think that you're capable of handling harder content, when you're really not even close.

    So much this ^^

    The normal modes are literally a cake-wake you could do with your eyes closed and one arm cut off.

    Then you go into advanced or elite and have to climb a veritable mountain range of a learning curve in a game where most attempts at asking things in zone chat get insults or other immature nonsense spouted at you.

    Is it any wonder newbie players have no idea what to do! :eek:
    SulMatuul.png
  • rattler2rattler2 Member Posts: 55,676 Community Moderator
    edited June 2015
    Asking in any chat is likely to get your head bitten off actually. I can't speak for the DPS channels, but the public ones and even team chat in a PUG...
    66998372863950ee98cf7da9786e2ea9-db80k0m.png
    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
    The nut who actually ground out a Delta Pack, Temporal Pack, and Gamma Pack
    The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
  • deaftravis05deaftravis05 Member Posts: 4,885 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    lordsteve1 wrote: »
    So much this ^^

    The normal modes are literally a cake-wake you could do with your eyes closed and one arm cut off.

    Then you go into advanced or elite and have to climb a veritable mountain range of a learning curve in a game where most attempts at asking things in zone chat get insults or other immature nonsense spouted at you.

    Is it any wonder newbie players have no idea what to do! :eek:

    I don't mind teaching new players. When I started, I always asked "Hi, new here, but what to do?" and never got a negative reply. It's how you ask.

    and I always started on normal to LEARN the map... and gradually move up to harder once i got it down pat
  • warmaker001bwarmaker001b Member Posts: 9,204 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    rattler2 wrote: »
    Probably because when they ask questions, someone rips them a new one for not knowing automatically?

    I'm not blaiming you OP, but I am saying that the environment isn't exactly question friendly in most cases. Not enough of us experienced players willing to help, and not enough rookies willing to ask questions.

    Coming from me, this is going to sound funny ;)

    Player communities in online gaming have been in the ****ters for about 10 years now. There was once upon a time, long, long ago, in a galaxy far, far away (the late 90s thru mid-2000s) in MMORPGs where players were very accommodating with each other.

    Not anymore. Online game communities are poisonous, corrosive, abrasive.

    STO isn't the only one. Of the MMORPGs I've played over the years, they've all gone this direction eventually.
    XzRTofz.gif
  • therealmttherealmt Member Posts: 428 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Because they hope others will carry them, or they think they can handle it.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • deaftravis05deaftravis05 Member Posts: 4,885 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    therealmt wrote: »
    Because they hope others will carry them, or they think they can handle it.

    I'm fine with understrengthened players. There is a build in for KGA in case of that...

    just... don't wander off, stay with the group, shoot and don't... explore
  • therealmttherealmt Member Posts: 428 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    I'm fine with understrengthened players. There is a build in for KGA in case of that...

    just... don't wander off, stay with the group, shoot and don't... explore

    I see what you mean, but what does it matter if the said player stays close and shoots, if they havent even figured out basic stuff like autofire etc? Im not surprised if there are people out there which individually click their beams once in a while. Just to RP it up.

    I've seen plenty of instances where the group was better off without a certain person, and just asked him to stay idle instead.

    Seriously lol.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • blackwyvernblackwyvern Member Posts: 14 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    2 of these threads in one day, nice very nice.
  • deaftravis05deaftravis05 Member Posts: 4,885 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    therealmt wrote: »
    I see what you mean, but what does it matter if the said player stays close and shoots, if they havent even figured out basic stuff like autofire etc? Im not surprised if there are people out there which individually click their beams once in a while. Just to RP it up.

    I've seen plenty of instances where the group was better off without a certain person, and just asked him to stay idle instead.

    Seriously lol.

    in space, they're useless

    on ground though, they're excellent because then I dont get everyone shooting at me...

    dealing with 3 elite tac drones, and everyone on all 3 levels in the power room... it's... it hurts...

    beside, the weapons do some damage... though there was this one guy doing 5 dps... probably because he wouldn't remodulate his weapon
  • deaftravis05deaftravis05 Member Posts: 4,885 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    2 of these threads in one day, nice very nice.

    Your reading skills leave much to be desired.

    I am not complaining about their damage, not at all. I am complaining about their lack of... doing the mission... they explore... rather than shoot and stay with the group
  • cptmbateman79cptmbateman79 Member Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    I can bring up two points, one of which was already mentioned.

    1) Normal is a cake walk and players think they can handle it, then when they go to the Advance they realized they aren't as good as they thought they were.

    2) In order to do half the reputaions they have you need to do the Advanced or Elites, just to get what you need.

    Last but certanily not least, It's how you ask, but also what type of players are in there. I remember when they first launched Borg Disconnect, I asked what needed done and I was told what order and everything. I kept playing it, until I had it down. I also got into a few arguments with players thinking they knew what they were talking about, but I ignored them and did what I was taught.

    I also remember hitting those "OLD Elites" and saying hi I'm new what needs done? Course I got my head chewed off and cussed at, saying I had no reason to be in the Elites or the gaame for that matter. It's pretty sad really to see this kind of behavior.
  • jodarkriderjodarkrider Member Posts: 2,097 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Sadly, pugging and running with weaker teams is the only challenge the 'Advanced' STF grounds offer to me personally. Running under-manned likewise. Too easy when everyone is top-notch.. thus, boring. We need elites, I don't even run my favorite Borg Grounds nowadays, due to them not being too challenging. :(
    [10:20] Your Lunge deals 4798 (2580) Physical Damage(Critical) to Tosk of Borg.

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  • linyivelinyive Member Posts: 1,086 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    While I can understand everyone's plight, the most important thing to remember is that this is a video game. Sure, I have had my issues with new players: however, Star Trek Online is supposed to be about having fun, laughing, being friendly, etc...

    If everyone is having a hard time with new players, why don't you guys open and advertise a public channel. You can use the channel to teach new players about stfs.
  • deaftravis05deaftravis05 Member Posts: 4,885 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    linyive wrote: »
    While I can understand everyone's plight, the most important thing to remember is that this is a video game. Sure, I have had my issues with new players: however, Star Trek Online us supposed to be about having fun, laughing, being friendly, etc...

    If everyone is having a hard time with new players, why don't you guys open and advertise a public channel. You can use the channel to teach new players about stfs.

    we do, they dont listen
  • linyivelinyive Member Posts: 1,086 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    we do, they dont listen
    Do they not listen? Or, are you people not worth the effort of listening to? If you guys are typing disgruntly into the chatbox, new players could be getting the wrong impression. Players might be getting turned off.

    Also, even though we give ourselves a certain value, the people around us may not value us in the same way. While you may 'believe' that you are a great player, other people may not know you enough to agree.

    Remember the world does not revolve around one specific person: thus, the people around you may not care or know that you exist.

    It's called overvaluating your worth and importance.
  • darkjeffdarkjeff Member Posts: 2,590 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    rattler2 wrote: »
    Asking in any chat is likely to get your head bitten off actually. I can't speak for the DPS channels, but the public ones and even team chat in a PUG...

    The DPS channels have always been nice when I say it's the first time I've done something, and ask for instructions.

    Korfez (elite), the worst I got was being chided "Guys, stay in your lane." for the Benthans.
    linyive wrote: »
    Do they not listen? Or, are you people not worth the effort of listening to? If you guys are typing disgruntly into the chatbox, new players could be getting the wrong impression. Players might be getting turned off.

    Also, even though we give ourselves a certain value, the people around us may not value us in the same way. While you may 'believe' that you are a great player, other people may not know you enough to agree.

    Remember the world does not revolve around one specific person: thus, the people around you may not care or know that you exist.

    It's called overvaluating your worth and importance.

    That bolded section is talking about those new players who feel they're hot **** in spite of constantly failing, right? :rolleyes:
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    linyive wrote: »
    linyive wrote: »
    While I can understand everyone's plight, the most important thing to remember is that this is a video game. Sure, I have had my issues with new players: however, Star Trek Online is supposed to be about having fun, laughing, being friendly, etc...

    If everyone is having a hard time with new players, why don't you guys open and advertise a public channel. You can use the channel to teach new players about stfs.

    we do, they dont listen

    Do they not listen? Or, are you people not worth the effort of listening to? If you guys are typing disgruntly into the chatbox, new players could be getting the wrong impression. Players might be getting turned off.

    Also, even though we give ourselves a certain value, the people around us may not value us in the same way. While you may 'believe' that you are a great player, other people may not know you enough to agree.

    Remember the world does not revolve around one specific person: thus, the people around you may not care or know that you exist.

    It's called overvaluating your worth and importance.

    Hrmmm, this kind of looks a bit off to me. Rather than jumping the gun on the matter, I figured I'd just ask if I'm misreading what I'm seeing here.

    Tom: Instead of complaining, you guys should help folks.
    Jerry: We try to help folks.
    Tom: You suck at helping folks and think too much of yourself.

    Basically...attack...attack...sort of thing. But hey, even though it stands out as pretty obvious that's what's going on there...I could be wrong. So I figured I'd ask...is that's what's going on?
  • cptmbateman79cptmbateman79 Member Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Even if some do listen, it doesn't help. Every player has a different way of completing stf's. One guy will say and I'm just making this TRIBBLE up. "Hey take out the Ships first then the generators." Another will say: "Take out the generators, then the ships."

    There really is no right way from what I see to get things done.
  • linyivelinyive Member Posts: 1,086 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    darkjeff wrote: »
    That bolded section is talking about those new players who feel they're hot **** in spite of constantly failing, right? :rolleyes:
    I am being rather serious.

    Even though I have been playing for five years, I only know a very tiny amount of people. When someone angerly types into chat, I will most likely shut the system down. At that point in our interaction, I cut off all possible means of communication.

    Are you people getting too impatient with other players?
    Are you degrading people because they don't see value in your feedback?

    Maybe the problem is in how people socially interact.

    While you may be a good player, you could have a problem with social skills.
  • linyivelinyive Member Posts: 1,086 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Even if some do listen, it doesn't help. Every player has a different way of completing stf's. One guy will say and I'm just making this TRIBBLE up. "Hey take out the Ships first then the generators." Another will say: "Take out the generators, then the ships."

    There really is no right way from what I see to get things done.

    Absolutely. Even though people are familiar with one method, each individual player may have a unique playing style.
  • cptmbateman79cptmbateman79 Member Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    linyive wrote: »
    I am being rather serious.

    Even though I have been playing for five years, I only know a very tiny amount of people. When someone angerly types into chat, I will most likely shut the system down. At that point in our interaction, I cut off all possible means of communication.

    Are you people getting too impatient with other players?
    Are you degrading people because they don't see value in your feedback?

    Maybe the problem is in how people socially interact.

    While you may be a good player, you could have a problem with social skills.

    Couldn't have said it better then that. They do not know how to talk to other players
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Couldn't have said it better then that. They do not know how to talk to other players

    It could have easily been said better, though. It's also very stereotypical and who knows just how wrong? While there are definitely those folks out there that will cause a /facepalm with their comments in team chat, why on Earth would one consider those to be the folks that are trying to help people? I mean, honestly, does it look in the least like they are trying to help people? So why is that nonsense being applied to folks that are discussing trying to help people? It makes little sense in the least...
  • darthraiderxxxdarthraiderxxx Member Posts: 200 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Couldn't have said it better then that. They do not know how to talk to other players

    Nice generalisation. How is that any better than someone saying everyone doing under 5k dps is a blithering idiot....
  • cptmbateman79cptmbateman79 Member Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    It could have easily been said better, though. It's also very stereotypical and who knows just how wrong? While there are definitely those folks out there that will cause a /facepalm with their comments in team chat, why on Earth would one consider those to be the folks that are trying to help people? I mean, honestly, does it look in the least like they are trying to help people? So why is that nonsense being applied to folks that are discussing trying to help people? It makes little sense in the least...

    If I see them acting like that and not helping, I ignore the chat or close it all together and try to figure everything out on my own. Even after a match I will look things up to see if there are other ways. Talking down to people, cause you think that your TRIBBLE doesn't stink is not a good way to go about doing things.
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    In order for any attempt to transfer knowledge to take place:

    1) Chat window has to be open to a tab where the information can be presented.
    2) The information has to be presented in a language the recipient understands.
    3) The potential recipient has to be receptive to the information being presented.
    4) If the potential recipient does not understand something, they need to speak up. If they have further questions, they need to ask them.

    The person attempting to transfer that knowledge has no control over those.
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