FBP is working exacyexacy as intended. If escorts can spec everything into a stupid high amount of damage, then why can't the rest of us spec into something that counters this insane amount if damage? This is so typical of every game that has a class system. High dps builders think they should be able to take hits and dish out an extreme amount of damage, and no one should be able to do anything about it. Any game that allows that is broken. Feedback pulse is one ability. One. That's it. And its not that hard to get around. Escorts have many abilities that increase damage, from raw power to fire rate. This is where escort pilots need to use their tiny little brains. You no longer dump all your abilities into one attack. Not only has that always been extremely lazy, but its downright stupid now. Instead, you lead with an attack at about half strength, and, get ready for it, STOP SHOOTING WHEN FBP GOES UP!!! Then swing around when it ends, and attack with all your remaining abilities. I'm sorry if this concept is too .much for some of you to contemplate, but FBP is not the problem. Your ships have become too damn powerful for your own good. Sci and cruiser captains don't have any problem with i t because we don't put out enough damage to kill ourselves. And NPCs aren't really bothered by it because of the same thing. The only problem is you. Fix yourselves, don't whine about abilities that counter you.
FBP counter is a sci build. Drain boat with very high drain and low energy weapons DPS. Target aux 3 combines with other drains ruins their FBP and then blast them away. You cant expect to be able to destroy every oponent sent with a full frontal damage approach, the game would be boring. Anyway, surgical strikes and neut+TS3 are both much worse than FBP.
FBP counter is a sci build. Drain boat with very high drain and low energy weapons DPS. Target aux 3 combines with other drains ruins their FBP and then blast them away. You cant expect to be able to destroy every oponent sent with a full frontal damage approach, the game would be boring. Anyway, surgical strikes and neut+TS3 are both much worse than FBP.
Time to stop living in the past. I know you spent 100+ mil. EC on drain consoles, but it's time to let it go. Drain builds are pretty horrible nowadays.
FBP counter is a sci build. Drain boat with very high drain and low energy weapons DPS. Target aux 3 combines with other drains ruins their FBP and then blast them away. You cant expect to be able to destroy every oponent sent with a full frontal damage approach, the game would be boring. Anyway, surgical strikes and neut+TS3 are both much worse than FBP.
Logical and brilliant. I am building a fresh ship for this now. Thanks!
Time to stop living in the past. I know you spent 100+ mil. EC on drain consoles, but it's time to let it go. Drain builds are pretty horrible nowadays.
Lol, I didn't spend EC on the consoles except 2. Drains are alive and well, its just a pain to fly the ship with all the one hit kills Intel ships. Anyway, working on a Vesta part gens monster, but it will take .a while
Meh, feedback pulse only returns damage.. if said damage is OP then FBP becomes OP but only if said initial damage is such.. Please Nerf, nerf was OP please nerf the nerf.. the nerf used to nerf the nerf was OP so nerf the nerf that nerfed the nerf....
Meh, feedback pulse only returns damage.. if said damage is OP then FBP becomes OP but only if said initial damage is such.. Please Nerf, nerf was OP please nerf the nerf.. the nerf used to nerf the nerf was OP so nerf the nerf that nerfed the nerf....
yes it is as it seems....
you have no idea how FBP works apparently, but thanks for weighing in anyway. with post season 9 crafting consoles , the amount of particle gen you can have skyrocketed. and the partical gen=crit trait was added at the same time too.
with the typical max particles you can have these days,FBP can return more then double, even up to triple the damage the sci ship received. but thats not all, wile FBP returns a multiple of your damage, the FBP itself is also CRITTING too, and if thats not enough FBP also has 50% SHIELD PEN.
FBP ends up returns MANY MANY TIMES the damage received, enough so you can kill yourself against it in a single fireing cycle. i really have no idea how anyone has the gall to defend this.
Simple Drunken Russian, everything in STO has a counter and the counter to FBP is not to shoot. No super p2w console, no lockbox/lobi/doff pack ship, you don't even need to give Cryptic money to stop it. Just don't shoot.
I know, if you're not shooting you're pvping you may say. Stop being a DPSer and live up to your true name. TACTICal. There is a sweet spot between fbp. Find it and make them pay.
Lately it looks like some players will fire off an alpha strike volley then immediately Rock and Roll to be immune to the feedback. Can anyone confirm this?
Simple Drunken Russian, everything in STO has a counter and the counter to FBP is not to shoot. No super p2w console, no lockbox/lobi/doff pack ship, you don't even need to give Cryptic money to stop it. Just don't shoot.
I know, if you're not shooting you're pvping you may say. Stop being a DPSer and live up to your true name. TACTICal. There is a sweet spot between fbp. Find it and make them pay.
wow. the particle defenders don't even know how full of **** they are.
a drain sci, or a subnuk or I win neutronic spread is the only thing that can 'harm' a max particle sci ship, that can slow it down or even confront it. counter it? no, not quite.
when more sci is the only thing you can safely use against another sci, thats doesn't even pass the root level rock/paper/scissors balancing test. its like some 4th thing that exists outside of the balance, and also trumps all 3. like water, that rock sinks in, rusts scissors, and dissolves paper. only the rock can skip over the water, it wont sink for a second or two.
FBP isn't a counter to energy damage in post season 8 sto, a counter is something like RSP. no, its an immunity to energy damage, plus any ship that deals energy damage is instantly killed for DARING to fight back.
and its not like you can just not shoot them and they cant harm you back, no, with all that particle they get to pound you in the TRIBBLE with 3k to 7k TBR pulses, any other mine and torp kinetic damage, and clicky consoles that run on particles like ISO and ISO cannon. they get to do their exploity shield bypassing damage against you with IMPUNITY, your energy weapon damage actually has to deal with both shields and hull.
you can like try to fly away from them, thats about as TACTICal as you can get.
fbp doesnt make you immune to energy damage, Drunk.
it does in the context of they are dead after 1 fireing cycle against you. max particle ships can send back AT LEAST 3 times the damage they receive, and 50% directly to hull, the incoming attack doesn't get that kind of shield pen. the only thing thats more literally immune then that is the intrepid console, and that doesn't auto kill an attacker.
Diminishing returns is required in a game where there is so much customization; otherwise, you get the over powered niche builds that ruin PVP matches.
Feedback pulse is no more broken than any other system in the this game that doesn't offer diminishing returns.
For feedback pulse it would be easy to scale it so that it NEVER does more than 100% of the incoming damage based on aux power and particle generator skill.
Truth of the matter is MOST Escort builds really can't handle 50% of the damage they put out in the current game, and FBP hurts so much because it doesn't miss. Escort defense becomes meaningless.
Back to my first sentence, if you really want a balanced game we need to add Diminishing returns to pretty much everything.
Weapons Damage Buffs, Opponent Debuffs, and Heals!
I think the larger problem is within the game's meta-FBP works GREAT against Players. but the Meta from the Devs and staff is that PvP isn't necessary, important, etc. etc., and PvE is...
and FBP doesn't do TRIBBLE to the solid blocks of HP that define the NPC opponents in this game.
ie. it doesn't work well in PvE.
Even on (Snerk) "Elite" content.
In many ways, the game is ridiculously unbalanced, with abilities that only work against players being the majority, while the bulk of 'development' is on NPC's that might as well have a sign hanging over them that says "Immune".
Oh, I absolutely agree that the game is unbalanced. But the way the balanced is skewed changes each and every time there's a new update. But the changes happen because the devs read player feedback and complaints, and for some reason, they take it as fact without actually testing it. The problem with the game, the direct cause, is players. Players who think escorts should have the hitting power of the Death Star and the tankiness of a Tactical Cube. Players who think sci ships should be able to debuff targets to infinity and kill them at the same time. Players who think Cruisers should be able to do everything that the other 2 do. And the devs have responded to the first 2. Escorts kill everything and take little to know range from return fire, and now sci ships can kill escorts with their own attacks. The only thing that's been left out are the cruisers, which, as far as I know, still do exactly what they were designed to do, and only what they were designed to do. But, despite all that, most abilities themselves are still doing what they were intended to do. Feedback pulse is no different. Its taking a percentage of the incoming damage and sending it back to the source. There are 2 contributors to this. First, escorts being overpowered as all hell. If you're killing yourself with your own Firepower's you're simply putting out far too much damage. Second, being able to stack abilities that boost particle generators. As I said, feedback pulse is doing its job. Its the particle generator skill that's boosting it to 100%+ reflection. The solution to this is not nerfing feedback pulse, but rather finding a way to cap both the damage output of escorts, and the boost to partgen skill. And similar measures need to be taken for everything in the game. Boosting and nerfing single items and abilities isn't going to solve anything. Every single problem in this game has more the. 1 cause, and you have to fix all of them at the same time to fix the game. And finally, PWE/Cryptic need to stop listening to players who are trying to get themselves an advantage and actually test these things themselves. If its working g the way they I tended it to work, leave it the hell alone. Only legitimate problems need be addressed, and a whiny escort captain ******** that he can't kill everything in 5 seconds does NOT count.
Diminishing returns is required in a game where there is so much customization; otherwise, you get the over powered niche builds that ruin PVP matches.
Feedback pulse is no more broken than any other system in the this game that doesn't offer diminishing returns.
For feedback pulse it would be easy to scale it so that it NEVER does more than 100% of the incoming damage based on aux power and particle generator skill.
Truth of the matter is MOST Escort builds really can't handle 50% of the damage they put out in the current game, and FBP hurts so much because it doesn't miss. Escort defense becomes meaningless.
Back to my first sentence, if you really want a balanced game we need to add Diminishing returns to pretty much everything.
Weapons Damage Buffs, Opponent Debuffs, and Heals!
THIS!!!!!
Why cant they scale it back with diminished returns? All the sci wimps complain cause tacs have more energy damage, well duh thats the way its supposed to be,,,tacs complain cause sci has more shields/hull/exotic abilities, however with FBP, you are shooting up to twice the amount of damage back at the attacker with NO EFFORT at all, and it never misses, thus negating defense values/speed.
FBP at this point is seriously OP,,,i have no problem with sci/engys being able to have higher hull/shields,,,better healing abilities, and a few cheesy spam things but FBP has gone too far.
I buff up,,,oh nose that nasty tac with his big bad cannons, hey no problem, sub nuke his TRIBBLE,,,oh nose that nasty tac with his speed and turn rate,,no problem use all kinds of cheesy sci spam and intel abilities to halt him,,oh nose none of that worked this time,,no prob, pop a FBP and watch that big bad tac commit suicide.
Why cant they scale it back with diminished returns? All the sci wimps complain cause tacs have more energy damage, well duh thats the way its supposed to be,,,tacs complain cause sci has more shields/hull/exotic abilities, however with FBP, you are shooting up to twice the amount of damage back at the attacker with NO EFFORT at all, and it never misses, thus negating defense values/speed.
FBP at this point is seriously OP,,,i have no problem with sci/engys being able to have higher hull/shields,,,better healing abilities, and a few cheesy spam things but FBP has gone too far.
I buff up,,,oh nose that nasty tac with his big bad cannons, hey no problem, sub nuke his TRIBBLE,,,oh nose that nasty tac with his speed and turn rate,,no problem use all kinds of cheesy sci spam and intel abilities to halt him,,oh nose none of that worked this time,,no prob, pop a FBP and watch that big bad tac commit suicide.
Yes escorts have more DPS that science captains, but it doesn't mean science captain have to be rendered helpless. Right now we're at an impasse and PvP is completely ruined. You nerf FBP, then people just SS3, override safeties and hit science captains, and science captains are rendered helpless unless they build non-sci like builds. I've tried my drain build which worked fine pre-DR, but now any moron can come by and one shoot it with the OP tac toys around.
There is also another problem. If a tac captain is allowed to take DPS to ridiculous heights, and they have with all the CrtH/CrtD mess combined with intel powers, why do you have a problem with science captains overspecializing in their career. Anyway, it's only 21% of the players that roll a sci captain. Almost 60% are tac captains.
I use to run a fbp2 on my cruiser before all the sci buffs and it was really balanced a escort firing at me had time to react and it didnt feed back 300 to 500% of his damage it was about 50 and with the shield pen they had to stop shooting or die
Now they cant react if i pop it when they are sending out a cannon volley its a 100% chance they will die they cant stop their weapon fire once it is in the middle of a cycle.
With the cool down reducing stuff and a built a2b fbp/rsp ship you can pretty much make your self imposable to kill unless someone nukes you but not everyone has a nuke
I have fought people using ss3 and the simple counter to that is to hit them with evade target lock but if you want to insta kill them pop off a fbp at the start of their weapon cycle simple way to kill people cant stop shooting at the start of a cycle!
If you run into a fbp ship i say cloak and put on some nutron torps come back hit them with those broken TRIBBLE things. Torp boats win sto now :P
Comments
Ewok Lock Box.
Time to stop living in the past. I know you spent 100+ mil. EC on drain consoles, but it's time to let it go. Drain builds are pretty horrible nowadays.
@DevolvedOne
Logical and brilliant. I am building a fresh ship for this now. Thanks!
except the guy that kicked you TRIBBLE and made a video of it lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_v14Ll06Qts
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9unHID8nCk
Vin Naftero@playhard88 - FED Sciencie
K'tan@playhard88 - KDF Tactical
Argento@playhard88 - RRF Tactical (FED)
Lol, I didn't spend EC on the consoles except 2. Drains are alive and well, its just a pain to fly the ship with all the one hit kills Intel ships. Anyway, working on a Vesta part gens monster, but it will take .a while
yes it is as it seems....
you have no idea how FBP works apparently, but thanks for weighing in anyway. with post season 9 crafting consoles , the amount of particle gen you can have skyrocketed. and the partical gen=crit trait was added at the same time too.
with the typical max particles you can have these days,FBP can return more then double, even up to triple the damage the sci ship received. but thats not all, wile FBP returns a multiple of your damage, the FBP itself is also CRITTING too, and if thats not enough FBP also has 50% SHIELD PEN.
FBP ends up returns MANY MANY TIMES the damage received, enough so you can kill yourself against it in a single fireing cycle. i really have no idea how anyone has the gall to defend this.
I know, if you're not shooting you're pvping you may say. Stop being a DPSer and live up to your true name. TACTICal. There is a sweet spot between fbp. Find it and make them pay.
wow. the particle defenders don't even know how full of **** they are.
a drain sci, or a subnuk or I win neutronic spread is the only thing that can 'harm' a max particle sci ship, that can slow it down or even confront it. counter it? no, not quite.
when more sci is the only thing you can safely use against another sci, thats doesn't even pass the root level rock/paper/scissors balancing test. its like some 4th thing that exists outside of the balance, and also trumps all 3. like water, that rock sinks in, rusts scissors, and dissolves paper. only the rock can skip over the water, it wont sink for a second or two.
FBP isn't a counter to energy damage in post season 8 sto, a counter is something like RSP. no, its an immunity to energy damage, plus any ship that deals energy damage is instantly killed for DARING to fight back.
and its not like you can just not shoot them and they cant harm you back, no, with all that particle they get to pound you in the TRIBBLE with 3k to 7k TBR pulses, any other mine and torp kinetic damage, and clicky consoles that run on particles like ISO and ISO cannon. they get to do their exploity shield bypassing damage against you with IMPUNITY, your energy weapon damage actually has to deal with both shields and hull.
you can like try to fly away from them, thats about as TACTICal as you can get.
As my pappy once said "STICK AND MOVE YOUNG BLOOD!"
the sticking will send you back to the respawn point
Timing is everything. I'm sure science is not god mode 24/7. The wizard needs 8 hours and that is where you get him.
it does in the context of they are dead after 1 fireing cycle against you. max particle ships can send back AT LEAST 3 times the damage they receive, and 50% directly to hull, the incoming attack doesn't get that kind of shield pen. the only thing thats more literally immune then that is the intrepid console, and that doesn't auto kill an attacker.
rom cloak makes FBP look like a chump! :P
you are not completely immune to FBP but most times you can burst down the target before they can even react to the damage.
crying about FPB is pointless and quite frankly if you kill yourself with it, it's your own fault. j\s
p.s. pvp is not gonna receive ANY attention from devs so crying about this is pointless.
GG
Feedback pulse is no more broken than any other system in the this game that doesn't offer diminishing returns.
For feedback pulse it would be easy to scale it so that it NEVER does more than 100% of the incoming damage based on aux power and particle generator skill.
Truth of the matter is MOST Escort builds really can't handle 50% of the damage they put out in the current game, and FBP hurts so much because it doesn't miss. Escort defense becomes meaningless.
Back to my first sentence, if you really want a balanced game we need to add Diminishing returns to pretty much everything.
Weapons Damage Buffs, Opponent Debuffs, and Heals!
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha 10000000000 Times This!!!!
Oh, I absolutely agree that the game is unbalanced. But the way the balanced is skewed changes each and every time there's a new update. But the changes happen because the devs read player feedback and complaints, and for some reason, they take it as fact without actually testing it. The problem with the game, the direct cause, is players. Players who think escorts should have the hitting power of the Death Star and the tankiness of a Tactical Cube. Players who think sci ships should be able to debuff targets to infinity and kill them at the same time. Players who think Cruisers should be able to do everything that the other 2 do. And the devs have responded to the first 2. Escorts kill everything and take little to know range from return fire, and now sci ships can kill escorts with their own attacks. The only thing that's been left out are the cruisers, which, as far as I know, still do exactly what they were designed to do, and only what they were designed to do. But, despite all that, most abilities themselves are still doing what they were intended to do. Feedback pulse is no different. Its taking a percentage of the incoming damage and sending it back to the source. There are 2 contributors to this. First, escorts being overpowered as all hell. If you're killing yourself with your own Firepower's you're simply putting out far too much damage. Second, being able to stack abilities that boost particle generators. As I said, feedback pulse is doing its job. Its the particle generator skill that's boosting it to 100%+ reflection. The solution to this is not nerfing feedback pulse, but rather finding a way to cap both the damage output of escorts, and the boost to partgen skill. And similar measures need to be taken for everything in the game. Boosting and nerfing single items and abilities isn't going to solve anything. Every single problem in this game has more the. 1 cause, and you have to fix all of them at the same time to fix the game. And finally, PWE/Cryptic need to stop listening to players who are trying to get themselves an advantage and actually test these things themselves. If its working g the way they I tended it to work, leave it the hell alone. Only legitimate problems need be addressed, and a whiny escort captain ******** that he can't kill everything in 5 seconds does NOT count.
anchor console has a passive buff to exotic damage 23.7% soo if you have 500 exotic damage you would have 600 and a bit..and so on...
lots of things are exotic damaged based.........tbr gw fbp hmm a few various torpedos in certain unique ways... ;-)
well dont take my word for it, what do i know after all....
only 200k ec to try it.. engineering consoles .. anchor, universal too
THIS!!!!!
Why cant they scale it back with diminished returns? All the sci wimps complain cause tacs have more energy damage, well duh thats the way its supposed to be,,,tacs complain cause sci has more shields/hull/exotic abilities, however with FBP, you are shooting up to twice the amount of damage back at the attacker with NO EFFORT at all, and it never misses, thus negating defense values/speed.
FBP at this point is seriously OP,,,i have no problem with sci/engys being able to have higher hull/shields,,,better healing abilities, and a few cheesy spam things but FBP has gone too far.
I buff up,,,oh nose that nasty tac with his big bad cannons, hey no problem, sub nuke his TRIBBLE,,,oh nose that nasty tac with his speed and turn rate,,no problem use all kinds of cheesy sci spam and intel abilities to halt him,,oh nose none of that worked this time,,no prob, pop a FBP and watch that big bad tac commit suicide.
Yes escorts have more DPS that science captains, but it doesn't mean science captain have to be rendered helpless. Right now we're at an impasse and PvP is completely ruined. You nerf FBP, then people just SS3, override safeties and hit science captains, and science captains are rendered helpless unless they build non-sci like builds. I've tried my drain build which worked fine pre-DR, but now any moron can come by and one shoot it with the OP tac toys around.
There is also another problem. If a tac captain is allowed to take DPS to ridiculous heights, and they have with all the CrtH/CrtD mess combined with intel powers, why do you have a problem with science captains overspecializing in their career. Anyway, it's only 21% of the players that roll a sci captain. Almost 60% are tac captains.
Now they cant react if i pop it when they are sending out a cannon volley its a 100% chance they will die they cant stop their weapon fire once it is in the middle of a cycle.
With the cool down reducing stuff and a built a2b fbp/rsp ship you can pretty much make your self imposable to kill unless someone nukes you but not everyone has a nuke
I have fought people using ss3 and the simple counter to that is to hit them with evade target lock but if you want to insta kill them pop off a fbp at the start of their weapon cycle simple way to kill people cant stop shooting at the start of a cycle!
If you run into a fbp ship i say cloak and put on some nutron torps come back hit them with those broken TRIBBLE things. Torp boats win sto now :P