I think we need active GMs or atleast a GM-chat in Star Trek Online, so Game Masters can help players with their problems quite fast, by chatting with them. Another F2P-game had this done quite well. They recruited their Game Masters out of the community to help them run the game. The Game Masters would recieve special accounts so their real identity stayed hidden (actually they lost their position if it came out who they were). Then they'd come online, fly here, fly there, and mainly be in Local or Zone-wide chat talking to players and helping them with problems in the GM-channel. Fast, most of the time a problem could be solved, thumbs up for this solution. If they recieved something for them being GMs I can't say, never was a GM there. All I can say it, if there was a reward it wasn't advertised at all.
Would it be possible to implement a similar system here? Atleast the GM-chat could be very helpful. Actually is anyone interested to install such a chat (or point me towards one already existing)? The rules would be simple: A Chat-channel where everyone who is able to help (so is able to solve small solutions or answer players' questions on the game) is a moderator on that channel. The Chat would be moderated strictly in that there shouldn't be any general chatter at all but questions and problems should be discussed and solutions be proposed. Any bigger offence would result in a warning and then a mute for a small time period. Language English obviously.
Would be great to have, would love to help creating one, if there is enough interest.
Greetings
Silverman
Everquest had a Guide program which consisted of volunteers who were able to do this or that, under the supervision of one of the paid GMs at SOE. It was good... for a while.
Unfortunately, there is no honor system on the internet.
You put that kind of power into player hands, and it will be abused. Considering PWE seems to believe rule-breaking only occurs during their business hours, it only takes the span of a weekend to get a few volunteer GMs to create absolute chaos.
Everquest had a Guide program which consisted of volunteers who were able to do this or that, under the supervision of one of the paid GMs at SOE. It was good... for a while.
Unfortunately, there is no honor system on the internet.
You put that kind of power into player hands, and it will be abused. Considering PWE seems to believe rule-breaking only occurs during their business hours, it only takes the span of a weekend to get a few volunteer GMs to create absolute chaos.
Just for the lulz, of course.
The Volunteer GMs in EQ was very limited. They had no enforcement capability, for that was handled by the Senior and higher GMs. The regular GMs was literally limited to in-game events and (I kid you not), giving away cookies.
But in STO, I could easily see it being limited to just chat enforcement, flagging inappropriate names, and noting suspicious activity. So doubt power would corrupt that bad.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,496Community Moderator
edited August 2014
Good luck policing ESD Zone Chat and Drozana Chat.
so, the F2P-game I'm talking about handled it quite well. Most of the time there was no GM-abuse however I can remember one time where a GM wanted to have some fun and accidentally changed the course of a PvP-fight. He promptly abandoned the place himself and apologies publically on the forums.
And to some extent: Considering nabreeki is a veteran player and should know quite a few things about most content, STO has to offer, it wouldn't be far fetched for nabreeki to become Moderator in a GM-chat ;-)
Also obviously I don't want GMs to be able to hand out equipment spontaneously. Their Accounts would be separated from their main-accounts with totally different handles and usernames, they'd be able to give themselves (their GM-account) account-bound equipment because they wouldn't have a single thing from actually playing instances with their accounts (maybe even forbid that). Such a power wouldn't be abuseable, just lock them from playing the Exchange and trading with other players and everything would be fine.
However they should be able to start Events, spawn custom mobs, maybe even start a special instance to be able to hold such an event (e.g. you don't want a boss-type mob to be spawned in a public instance of ESD, so create a special event-type instance for that). Just some small events that could be held spontaneously. Great fun, if done right.
Nobody asked for volunteer GM's. I am declaring that off-topic for this thread. Don't want to see anybody campaigning to be a GM here.
If you want to discuss the idea of a volunteer GM, fine. That's on-topic.
My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Yeah it has always surprised me that STO has no in-game GM presence. I wouldn't be against having volunteers like we do here on the forums, but the selection criteria would have to be rigorous. And if there are any bugs with GM mutes (like how there is a longstanding issue with channel mutes in channels that have a large number of people in them) and the broken channel admin functions, I would want those rectified first.
Nitpicking is a time-honored tradition of science fiction. Asking your readers not to worry about the "little things" is like asking a dog not to sniff at people's crotches. If there's something that appears to violate natural laws, then you can expect someone's going to point it out. That's just the way things are.
Yeah it has always surprised me that STO has no in-game GM presence. I wouldn't be against having volunteers like we do here on the forums, but the selection criteria would have to be rigorous. And if there are any bugs with GM mutes (like how there is a longstanding issue with channel mutes in channels that have a large number of people in them) and the broken channel admin functions, I would want those rectified first.
why are you surprised by that, that tends to be norm, not the unusual.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,496Community Moderator
edited August 2014
It may be the norm for STO, but I'm certain other games actually have GMs haunting the servers.
why are you surprised by that, that tends to be norm, not the unusual.
It's my only MMO. Is my assumption that most MMOs have in-game GMs (no matter how few) incorrect? How about half of other MMOs? Or just the big-name MMOs?
Nitpicking is a time-honored tradition of science fiction. Asking your readers not to worry about the "little things" is like asking a dog not to sniff at people's crotches. If there's something that appears to violate natural laws, then you can expect someone's going to point it out. That's just the way things are.
I think we need active GMs or atleast a GM-chat in Star Trek Online, so Game Masters can help players with their problems quite fast, by chatting with them. Another F2P-game had this done quite well. They recruited their Game Masters out of the community to help them run the game. The Game Masters would recieve special accounts so their real identity stayed hidden (actually they lost their position if it came out who they were). Then they'd come online, fly here, fly there, and mainly be in Local or Zone-wide chat talking to players and helping them with problems in the GM-channel. Fast, most of the time a problem could be solved, thumbs up for this solution. If they recieved something for them being GMs I can't say, never was a GM there. All I can say it, if there was a reward it wasn't advertised at all.
Would it be possible to implement a similar system here? Atleast the GM-chat could be very helpful. Actually is anyone interested to install such a chat (or point me towards one already existing)? The rules would be simple: A Chat-channel where everyone who is able to help (so is able to solve small solutions or answer players' questions on the game) is a moderator on that channel. The Chat would be moderated strictly in that there shouldn't be any general chatter at all but questions and problems should be discussed and solutions be proposed. Any bigger offence would result in a warning and then a mute for a small time period. Language English obviously.
Would be great to have, would love to help creating one, if there is enough interest.
Greetings
Silverman
They can't afford basic customer service. Most of the time you get an automated response that says to file a bug report in game and/or they tell you to do what you told them you already did.
You honestly think they can afford GM's to sit around waiting for someone that needs help and/or look into a problem if a player is reported for verbal abuse or some other rules violation?
If a few players right click your name in the chat and report you for "spamming" even though you did nothing wrong, you get automatically banned from using any chat channel and you can't even send mail to anybody for 24 hours. That's how their whole system is designed: automated customer service. Automated punishments. The human equation is almost non-existent.
It's my only MMO. Is my assumption that most MMOs have in-game GMs (no matter how few) incorrect? How about half of other MMOs? Or just the big-name MMOs?
I've played alot. I've seen one and that was indie game with maybe 500 players, no more then 150 on at a time for a big event. I think I've played a few more that say they have them but thats the only one I can remember seeing them and speaking with them.
if I stop posting it doesn't make you right it. just means I don't have enough rum to continue interacting with you.
Anyways, back on topic, official gm'ing a game population as big as STO means multiple chat channels and some $$$. However, Cryptic would suggest that $$$ is too much $$$ to spend $$$ on. So stick with the volunteers. It would cost $$$ to screen volunteers. But $$$ is less than $$$ but still is $$$ too many. One would think Cryptic has enough $$$ with all the stuff/ subs they are selling. But where in the game is all the $$$ going?
Having trouble with the $$$? Don't worry, I just typed this as the crow flew.
No, I agree, that's how it SHOULD be done, but, for some reason, I don't think that is what will actually happen. I'd be interested in seeing a current mod-- Bluegeek, I'm sure, is constantly scanning this thread for any signs of a JOKE DERAIL -- share whether or not there is a vetting process when becoming a forums mod. Not too many specifics, mind you, as to violate some kind of PWE OPSEC, but just a basic overview of the process, if one exists. I wonder this because it appears we have a few names in the "moderator" list that have either fallen into a sinkhole or been kidnapped by FARC, because I haven't seen a single post from them in over two years.
I don't know how PWE/STO works, but I've seen plenty, plenty of game forums, well-known forums, etc staffed by volunteer mods who are only mods because they have posted in said threads for a very long time. That and maybe they are well-known (but maybe not well-respected) by other posters. That's it. There are some decent mods that come from this, as they already know the rules, the posting atmosphere, etc, but there are plenty of terrible, terrible mods as well.
This is, naturally, not meant to jab at the current forums mods; I generally think they are pretty objective and fair (sans one dearly departed CM), even when the result doesn't work out in my favor.
I don't know how PWE/STO works, but I've seen plenty, plenty of game forums, well-known forums, etc staffed by volunteer mods who are only mods because they have posted in said threads for a very long time. That and maybe they are well-known (but maybe not well-respected) by other posters. That's it. There are some decent mods that come from this, as they already know the rules, the posting atmosphere, etc, but there are plenty of terrible, terrible mods as well.
No, I agree, that's how it SHOULD be done, but, for some reason, I don't think that is what will actually happen. I'd be interested in seeing a current mod-- Bluegeek, I'm sure, is constantly scanning this thread for any signs of a JOKE DERAIL -- share whether or not there is a vetting process when becoming a forums mod. Not too many specifics, mind you, as to violate some kind of PWE OPSEC, but just a basic overview of the process, if one exists. I wonder this because it appears we have a few names in the "moderator" list that have either fallen into a sinkhole or been kidnapped by FARC, because I haven't seen a single post from them in over two years.
Speaking purely as a forum mod, I can say that there is an approval process for new moderators. When I applied back when Branflakes was CM, I had to essentially submit an essay/resume explaining why I wanted to be a mod. I get the impression that the candidates were discussed with other people at Cryptic. I know we were discussed with the current moderators. My posting history, of course, was an open book to PWE. There was an interview over Skype and an orientation session. Not to mention we can be dismissed at any time and for any reason.
Not that Smirk would necessarily handle it the same way, but I would expect it to be a lot like that.
They do not entertain unsolicited applications. When they want new mods, they'll ask. Much like they'll ask if they ever decide they want volunteer GM's, but I'm not holding my breath on that. Being a forum mod is demanding enough for me, I wouldn't want to be an unpaid GM.
My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Comments
Unfortunately, there is no honor system on the internet.
You put that kind of power into player hands, and it will be abused. Considering PWE seems to believe rule-breaking only occurs during their business hours, it only takes the span of a weekend to get a few volunteer GMs to create absolute chaos.
Just for the lulz, of course.
The Volunteer GMs in EQ was very limited. They had no enforcement capability, for that was handled by the Senior and higher GMs. The regular GMs was literally limited to in-game events and (I kid you not), giving away cookies.
But in STO, I could easily see it being limited to just chat enforcement, flagging inappropriate names, and noting suspicious activity. So doubt power would corrupt that bad.
Anyone want to give me a Temporal Heavy Dreadnought pack? I'll be your friend
I see no possible way this could ever backfire, Nabreeki.
And to some extent: Considering nabreeki is a veteran player and should know quite a few things about most content, STO has to offer, it wouldn't be far fetched for nabreeki to become Moderator in a GM-chat ;-)
Also obviously I don't want GMs to be able to hand out equipment spontaneously. Their Accounts would be separated from their main-accounts with totally different handles and usernames, they'd be able to give themselves (their GM-account) account-bound equipment because they wouldn't have a single thing from actually playing instances with their accounts (maybe even forbid that). Such a power wouldn't be abuseable, just lock them from playing the Exchange and trading with other players and everything would be fine.
However they should be able to start Events, spawn custom mobs, maybe even start a special instance to be able to hold such an event (e.g. you don't want a boss-type mob to be spawned in a public instance of ESD, so create a special event-type instance for that). Just some small events that could be held spontaneously. Great fun, if done right.
Oh dear, this is hilarious.
Nobody asked for volunteer GM's. I am declaring that off-topic for this thread. Don't want to see anybody campaigning to be a GM here.
If you want to discuss the idea of a volunteer GM, fine. That's on-topic.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Joined January 2009
why are you surprised by that, that tends to be norm, not the unusual.
It's my only MMO. Is my assumption that most MMOs have in-game GMs (no matter how few) incorrect? How about half of other MMOs? Or just the big-name MMOs?
Joined January 2009
They can't afford basic customer service. Most of the time you get an automated response that says to file a bug report in game and/or they tell you to do what you told them you already did.
You honestly think they can afford GM's to sit around waiting for someone that needs help and/or look into a problem if a player is reported for verbal abuse or some other rules violation?
If a few players right click your name in the chat and report you for "spamming" even though you did nothing wrong, you get automatically banned from using any chat channel and you can't even send mail to anybody for 24 hours. That's how their whole system is designed: automated customer service. Automated punishments. The human equation is almost non-existent.
I've played alot. I've seen one and that was indie game with maybe 500 players, no more then 150 on at a time for a big event. I think I've played a few more that say they have them but thats the only one I can remember seeing them and speaking with them.
if I stop posting it doesn't make you right it. just means I don't have enough rum to continue interacting with you.
I support Nabreeki just for the lulz*.
And because I try to stay the f*** out of ESD and Drozana anyway.
Oh, and Nabreeki? Catch me sometime in-game? I want to know how you keep such an amazingly twisted sense of humor through it all.
*Note the sarcasm.
IRL, I don't think any volunteer GMs are a good idea. Too much potential for abuse.
Having trouble with the $$$? Don't worry, I just typed this as the crow flew.
Got to see if the peep is any good first.
Bad news for the whole GM chat idea then...
This is what happens when moderating power is in any way related to frequency of posting and/or duration on a forum.
Praise Edgardo! And A Guy Called Squid! And Goldnharl, because **** you, he's Goldnharl!
Edit to add: The link's got some strong language, but should be SFW.
Speaking purely as a forum mod, I can say that there is an approval process for new moderators. When I applied back when Branflakes was CM, I had to essentially submit an essay/resume explaining why I wanted to be a mod. I get the impression that the candidates were discussed with other people at Cryptic. I know we were discussed with the current moderators. My posting history, of course, was an open book to PWE. There was an interview over Skype and an orientation session. Not to mention we can be dismissed at any time and for any reason.
Not that Smirk would necessarily handle it the same way, but I would expect it to be a lot like that.
They do not entertain unsolicited applications. When they want new mods, they'll ask. Much like they'll ask if they ever decide they want volunteer GM's, but I'm not holding my breath on that. Being a forum mod is demanding enough for me, I wouldn't want to be an unpaid GM.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek