Is there even a point of rolling a toon other than a tac anymore? It seems almost everything in the game is now focused on damage and crits, science and engineering skills are become a joke in space. Look at NWS, a group of tanks would not be able to win it, but a group of escorts.. no problem. The person that gets first place in fleet actions is always whoever did the most damage, why bother being a healer?
Imagine what BO will be like with BO doffs... might as well stop using shields :P
Gonna need to patch Exchange because Elachi DBB just increased in value about ten-fold
Even if BO3 doesnt kill them, well its alright you have the full-power CRF2/HY3 coming down on that guaranteed hole in the shield. And all the other non-draining special abilities.
Last practical use for Nadeon Inversion goes out the window. Any thoughts on a way to give Engi any kind of usefulness for damage output?
You are going the wrong direction. Everything should drain. FAW is broken, the rest is fine. Fix FAW dont break the rest to match it.
Is there even a point of rolling a toon other than a tac anymore? It seems almost everything in the game is now focused on damage and crits, science and engineering skills are become a joke in space. Look at NWS, a group of tanks would not be able to win it, but a group of escorts.. no problem. The person that gets first place in fleet actions is always whoever did the most damage, why bother being a healer?
Imagine what BO will be like with BO doffs... might as well stop using shields :P
Yeah, I'm pretty sure the devs must have seen the 2 man NWS video. That one screams power creep.
PvP is a lost cause, if they boost survivability we get rage about how shield regen is too strong, etc ... if they boost damage we get this rage.
Right now its broken, BO changes dont alter that fact ... oneshoot kills already happened before and will continue to happen later, its only a question if BO is a viable PvE option or not.
Its not.
You want to start fixing PvP? 50% damage nerf against players ... would be a start because it would stop spike oneshoots but moment they did it we would be hearing cries about "killing PVP".
I am not saying this would not have a effect on PvP, I am saying right now it would not change ANYTHING in PvP because BO was/is used to melt shields, it did it before and will do it after.
Apparently the big problem with this changes is that it makes the ability viable in PvE and more viable in PvP, it didnt created vapers builds because they existed and this might not change vapers oneshoot builds but it doesnt intend to, thats another thing that needs to be solved.
I agree to an extent. The reason PvP is borked is because cryptic took 4 years before they even looked at it.
There will always be rage on things. But there is a definite difference on the volume of rage from massive damage output to tanking.
Mainly as there are multiple ways to kill a ship. And you can't tank against it all.
The biggest issue is Cryptic don't tank to use. They don't go. "Hey guys we are trying to balance this, what do you think." They just 'do'.
The biggest thing they need to do is class balancing. There is no point to not rolling a tac. I rolled my main as a tac back in beta. And now that a tac can survive a subnuc, do enough damage to kill just about anything solo.
A PvP rep was mentioned a few weeks back. If thats so, PvP is going to need a hell of a lot of work first.
In the case you presented in your post, 30% of the time your fully buffed ambush BO crit would one-shot a player. Now, every single time a player uses Beam Overload, they will deal substantial damage without reducing their future DPS - but they will do *less* spike damage in an optimal case. This change both reduces randomness of outcome (reliance on crit chance) and brings in the possible variance of spike damage substantially.
As it stands right now people actually try somewhat to balance their crth and values in PvP. Now imagine a tractored target being hit with a 100% crit BO3 with no weapon power drain and CrtD values beyond 200%, which are easily attainable.
Vulnurability Exploiter Consoles (upto x5) +40%
Assimilated Module +9.2%
Bioneural Infusion Circuits + 15.2%
Attack Pattern Alpha (around) +45%-50%
Romulan Operative (depending if you're a rom or not) +5%-25%
CrtDx3 (x4 with the new craftable Antiproton Dual Beam Banks) +60%-80%
All: +174%-219% CrtD, which works as a bonus damage multiplier.
Couple that with the general damage enhancing abilties like Attack Pattern Omega, GDF, and APA (again) and you can secure your one-shot kill every time.
Please consider removing the 100% crit chance. The ability not draining weapons power is already a boost in itself and removes the "trap" aspect of it.
The biggest thing they need to do is class balancing. There is no point to not rolling a tac. I rolled my main as a tac back in beta. And now that a tac can survive a subnuc, do enough damage to kill just about anything solo.
there shouldn't be classes in this game anyway
aside from being outdated, the trinity system really doesn't work properly in a game like this - at least not in the space portion
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
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"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
It's probably an NPC power or something. It was just one of the lance-type powers I found that drained power before, so I included it as an example. Maybe the Mogai electric lance would have been a better example.
What the hell man. Being a dev, one would at least expect you to actually know the full extent of what you're modifying with a patch.
What the hell man. Being a dev, one would at least expect you to actually know the full extent of what you're modifying with a patch.
not necessarily; he came to work at cryptic fairly recently, if i recall, and the 'auxiliary disruptor' may have already been in the game and wasn't properly documented by his predecessor
I do agree, but you really can't backstep that now.
The best thing they can do is make most of the captains powers passives and have some weaker augmentation abilities.
how would that work for targetables like subkune, though? you'd have to make it like the subkune doffs - a chance to strip x random buffs, but what would you put on the doff to replace that now superfluous power?
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
Well, as a break from the doom and gloom on the beam overload front here is something to be happy about, if you are one of those people who say the game is too easy.
[*]Craylon Gas now has a chance to be rewarded in the Elite Queues Rhllho Station, Mine Trap, and the Nukara Interior and Exterior fights.
This bit right here. More accurately, it should read, we created NEW Elite Queues for Rhllho Station, Mine Trap, and the Nukara Interior and Exterior fights. Yes, there are now normal and elite versions of these missions. Have fun all.
not necessarily; he came to work at cryptic fairly recently, if i recall, and the 'auxiliary disruptor' may have already been in the game and wasn't properly documented by his predecessor
True, but then agian, it is his 'job' to know.
And as of now. I think 90% of use are sure the dev's don't actually play STO.
And as of now. I think 90% of use are sure the dev's don't actually play STO.
they do, they just don't play it on official accounts, because whenever they show up on such an account, they get swamped with all manner of questions, complaints, requests, etc...so they never get a chance to play when they do so
a better statement might be, they don't squeeze every last ounce of performance out of their builds like we do, so they don't see the kinds of extremes we see, nor would they notice any bugs with such combinations of skills/powers/gear/blablabla (in the case of not seeing how something might wind up either underpowered or overpowered in PvP/PvE when combined with other facters)
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
... as much as possible I want to move combat out of the "one-shot" territory and out of the "infinite slugfest" territory, and towards a happy medium where people die under focused fire but have a chance to react and outplay.
I don't believe you. Not anymore, and not after this!!
Silly question: Does the 100% crit chance/ No extra power drain mechanic apply to the Andorian Cannon Overload power?
Formerly Known as Protector from June 2008 to June 20, 2012
Please enable us to buy a token with Zen to faction change a 25th Century FED to a TOS FED.
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
Its already cut by 25% ... should it be cut so it have the same damage as a non-crit? should it be a non-choice as before?
The problem is there is proof from Tribble that the 25% "cut" seems to have done nothing. If anything, it's more deadly now.
The other thing, plenty of players use BO so there isn't an issue of it not being used.
Fresh of OPvP:
[Combat (Self)] Your Dual Antiproton Banks - Overload III deals 33215 (82285) Antiproton Damage(Critical) to.
And that wasn't max buffed.
The worst part, this is going live tomorrow. No testing time. No time to change things. It's just going straight to Holodeck. May God have mercy on our souls.
This is on tribble, not Holodeck. And I don't know if it will make it through testing tbh. With the responces.
It's already in the patch notes for tomorrow. There is no stopping it now. Once in Tribble, there is a 99.9% chance it ends up in Holodeck.
Still haven't seen them stop a single Tribble change lately except when it comes to major updates, and that is just because things are in flux and stuff comes in from Redshirt supposedly.
It will, its already mentioned on the Holodeck patch notes.
I am not a fan of that happening were I would hope at least a 24 hours of Tribble testing but its going to Holodeck tomorrow, now I maintain this ultimate changes nothing in PvP were vapers have long dominated, might cause a return of BO on builds but as PvP is ... you just get oneshooted without a buffed up BO.
The Nile (Denial) is not just a river in Egypt. (added in case of cultural confusion)
Anyway, this change is horribly game breaking. The only reason it was added was because of the [over] mod and them not being able to fix it in a more elegant way. They couldn't figure out how to make BO drain power and [over] not drain it, so they went ahead and just changed it all to not drain power and crit 100%. The crit 100% on top of the max weapons power is what irks me the most. Now they all are talking about getting DBBs with CrtDx3.
It's already in the patch notes for tomorrow. There is no stopping it now. Once in Tribble, there is a 99.9% chance it ends up in Holodeck.
Still haven't seen them stop a single Tribble change lately except when it comes to major updates, and that is just because things are in flux and stuff comes in from Redshirt supposedly.
Well I guess now is a good a time as any to take a break from STO then. Unless it gets a serious change during release. It's gameover for all fed sci ships/ escorts/ cruisers. And lot of klink ones too.
It's already in the patch notes for tomorrow. There is no stopping it now. Once in Tribble, there is a 99.9% chance it ends up in Holodeck.
Still haven't seen them stop a single Tribble change lately except when it comes to major updates, and that is just because things are in flux and stuff comes in from Redshirt supposedly.
They'll only stop a tribble change if it affects the sale of Zen items/ Lockbox stuff...
They'll only stop a tribble change if it affects the sale of Zen items/ Lockbox stuff...
negatively affects it, you mean, because between this and the TR-116 now having 100% shield pen, i forsee many more xindi boxes being opened for motivations and deadly intents and...whatever the BO doff comes in being opened for BO doffs
oh, and more people dumping loads of dil to max out beam crafting so they can start churning out [CrtD]x3 DBBs
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
In the case you presented in your post, 30% of the time your fully buffed ambush BO crit would one-shot a player. Now, every single time a player uses Beam Overload, they will deal substantial damage without reducing their future DPS - but they will do *less* spike damage in an optimal case. This change both reduces randomness of outcome (reliance on crit chance) and brings in the possible variance of spike damage substantially.
im cautiously optimistic that this is a genius move, but i doubt its perfectly tuned as is. ether a diminishing return to the application of critical severity needs to be added to BO, or a further diminish of base damage, in the 40% to even 50% range.
this 100% chance to crit thing i thing might work well on torps too, to just crit on hull impacts. you could lower the base damage of torps, remove the 75% base resistance to kinetic shields have, and all torp impacts on hull could be crits. shields will still have resistance levels as high as their energy resistance, which can now be between 70% and 80%, kinetic needs little help being very resisted on shields, surly 95%+ knetic res we got now is absurd.
doing something like this would prevent a ship 100% built for torp damage to be OP if shields lost their near immunity to kinetic damage. i hope you will consider this, because with this BO change, the gap between BO and torp spike just got much wider, BO has 0 downsides com bared to torp's having nothing but downsides.
as a long time user of beam overload i do not see that it needed to be changed because the power loss returns in about 3 seconds after the power drain. crypitc be removing the power drain after beam overload you have actually in total beam dps and beam dpv even with 25% less beam overload base damage. i do not know how to feel about the 100% chance to crit with beam overload other then simply way over powered. runnig 7 or 8 beam just got a little easier and running 7 and 8 beams a lot easier runnign with the romulan experimental plasma beam and beam overload.
Comments
Imagine what BO will be like with BO doffs... might as well stop using shields :P
Even if BO3 doesnt kill them, well its alright you have the full-power CRF2/HY3 coming down on that guaranteed hole in the shield. And all the other non-draining special abilities.
Last practical use for Nadeon Inversion goes out the window. Any thoughts on a way to give Engi any kind of usefulness for damage output?
You are going the wrong direction. Everything should drain. FAW is broken, the rest is fine. Fix FAW dont break the rest to match it.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure the devs must have seen the 2 man NWS video. That one screams power creep.
I already was getting one shot from vapers all the time, now I might as well stay cloaked 90% of the time.
Spike builds are now much stronger. We're still testing.
R.I.P Borg Sphere. You died too soon on Tribble.
I agree to an extent. The reason PvP is borked is because cryptic took 4 years before they even looked at it.
There will always be rage on things. But there is a definite difference on the volume of rage from massive damage output to tanking.
Mainly as there are multiple ways to kill a ship. And you can't tank against it all.
The biggest issue is Cryptic don't tank to use. They don't go. "Hey guys we are trying to balance this, what do you think." They just 'do'.
The biggest thing they need to do is class balancing. There is no point to not rolling a tac. I rolled my main as a tac back in beta. And now that a tac can survive a subnuc, do enough damage to kill just about anything solo.
A PvP rep was mentioned a few weeks back. If thats so, PvP is going to need a hell of a lot of work first.
As it stands right now people actually try somewhat to balance their crth and values in PvP. Now imagine a tractored target being hit with a 100% crit BO3 with no weapon power drain and CrtD values beyond 200%, which are easily attainable.
Vulnurability Exploiter Consoles (upto x5) +40%
Assimilated Module +9.2%
Bioneural Infusion Circuits + 15.2%
Attack Pattern Alpha (around) +45%-50%
Romulan Operative (depending if you're a rom or not) +5%-25%
CrtDx3 (x4 with the new craftable Antiproton Dual Beam Banks) +60%-80%
All: +174%-219% CrtD, which works as a bonus damage multiplier.
Couple that with the general damage enhancing abilties like Attack Pattern Omega, GDF, and APA (again) and you can secure your one-shot kill every time.
Please consider removing the 100% crit chance. The ability not draining weapons power is already a boost in itself and removes the "trap" aspect of it.
aside from being outdated, the trinity system really doesn't work properly in a game like this - at least not in the space portion
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
What the hell man. Being a dev, one would at least expect you to actually know the full extent of what you're modifying with a patch.
I do agree, but you really can't backstep that now.
The best thing they can do is make most of the captains powers passives and have some weaker augmentation abilities.
how would that work for targetables like subkune, though? you'd have to make it like the subkune doffs - a chance to strip x random buffs, but what would you put on the doff to replace that now superfluous power?
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
This bit right here. More accurately, it should read, we created NEW Elite Queues for Rhllho Station, Mine Trap, and the Nukara Interior and Exterior fights. Yes, there are now normal and elite versions of these missions. Have fun all.
Nouveau riche LTS member
True, but then agian, it is his 'job' to know.
And as of now. I think 90% of use are sure the dev's don't actually play STO.
a better statement might be, they don't squeeze every last ounce of performance out of their builds like we do, so they don't see the kinds of extremes we see, nor would they notice any bugs with such combinations of skills/powers/gear/blablabla (in the case of not seeing how something might wind up either underpowered or overpowered in PvP/PvE when combined with other facters)
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Look at those replies. And this is going to Holodeck tomorrow!
I don't believe you. Not anymore, and not after this!!
Ugh.
STO Screenshot Archive
Finally some common sense!
[/SIGPIC]
Please enable us to buy a token with Zen to faction change a 25th Century FED to a TOS FED.
lances are usually reserved for beams
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
The problem is there is proof from Tribble that the 25% "cut" seems to have done nothing. If anything, it's more deadly now.
The other thing, plenty of players use BO so there isn't an issue of it not being used.
Fresh of OPvP:
[Combat (Self)] Your Dual Antiproton Banks - Overload III deals 33215 (82285) Antiproton Damage(Critical) to.
And that wasn't max buffed.
The worst part, this is going live tomorrow. No testing time. No time to change things. It's just going straight to Holodeck. May God have mercy on our souls.
Tomorrows release is called: "Vapers Gone Wild"
This is on tribble, not Holodeck. And I don't know if it will make it through testing tbh. With the responces.
It's already in the patch notes for tomorrow. There is no stopping it now. Once in Tribble, there is a 99.9% chance it ends up in Holodeck.
Still haven't seen them stop a single Tribble change lately except when it comes to major updates, and that is just because things are in flux and stuff comes in from Redshirt supposedly.
The Nile (Denial) is not just a river in Egypt. (added in case of cultural confusion)
Anyway, this change is horribly game breaking. The only reason it was added was because of the [over] mod and them not being able to fix it in a more elegant way. They couldn't figure out how to make BO drain power and [over] not drain it, so they went ahead and just changed it all to not drain power and crit 100%. The crit 100% on top of the max weapons power is what irks me the most. Now they all are talking about getting DBBs with CrtDx3.
Well I guess now is a good a time as any to take a break from STO then. Unless it gets a serious change during release. It's gameover for all fed sci ships/ escorts/ cruisers. And lot of klink ones too.
There you go.
*shakes head and walks away*
STO Screenshot Archive
They'll only stop a tribble change if it affects the sale of Zen items/ Lockbox stuff...
oh, and more people dumping loads of dil to max out beam crafting so they can start churning out [CrtD]x3 DBBs
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
im cautiously optimistic that this is a genius move, but i doubt its perfectly tuned as is. ether a diminishing return to the application of critical severity needs to be added to BO, or a further diminish of base damage, in the 40% to even 50% range.
this 100% chance to crit thing i thing might work well on torps too, to just crit on hull impacts. you could lower the base damage of torps, remove the 75% base resistance to kinetic shields have, and all torp impacts on hull could be crits. shields will still have resistance levels as high as their energy resistance, which can now be between 70% and 80%, kinetic needs little help being very resisted on shields, surly 95%+ knetic res we got now is absurd.
doing something like this would prevent a ship 100% built for torp damage to be OP if shields lost their near immunity to kinetic damage. i hope you will consider this, because with this BO change, the gap between BO and torp spike just got much wider, BO has 0 downsides com bared to torp's having nothing but downsides.