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Crafting Design: Why are you crafting?
zernin
Member Posts: 8 Arc User
So we've had a couple days with the crafting system now, and it's become pretty clear that the action of crafting is pretty much a bad idea. Let's do the math.
20 hour missions grant you 300 XP/hr.
Mk. II equipment gives 50 xp for 5 minutes. If you could perfectly restart these every 5 minutes that would be 600 XP/hr.
Mk. X equipment, the last level you can craft without spending dil, is 1,800 for 3 hours. Still 600 XP/hr.
Mk. XII equipment gives 3000 xp for 5 hours. That is, yet again, 600 XP/hr.
So crafting gives you double the XP of a non-crafting activity. On the surface, that seems like a good idea, but that ignores a few truths of life. Humans sleep, and every activity we do has an opportunity cost. To get that double xp gain rate, you need materials.
For the low mark equipment, these are pretty easy to gather but that means you are spending a ridiculous amount of time starting craft actions over and over and over. This is not a fun activity, and getting it efficient enough to actually hit that 600 xp/hr rate is pretty much impossible.
For the high mark equipment, gathering the materials is not a trivial task. Its going to take a significant amount of time where you could be focusing on something else. The opportunity cost here is huge, and the benefit is almost non-existent.
Once you throw sleep in to the mix, the 20 hour mission is the only reasonable task for someone with a job and without insomnia.
I would really like to see some modifications to the higher crafting ranks to make crafting and appealing part of the crafting system. Higher rank items need to provide more XP/hr to make crafting appealing at all. It would probably be wise to tie the efficiency of said increase to the crafting level of the player so that the right answer doesn't just become to only craft MK X or MK XII equipment.
Oh, and removing the 20 hour mission or making it worse is not the way to make the other options more appealing. The appeal of the whole system is so dreadfully low right now that such an action would just be the nail in the coffin.
20 hour missions grant you 300 XP/hr.
Mk. II equipment gives 50 xp for 5 minutes. If you could perfectly restart these every 5 minutes that would be 600 XP/hr.
Mk. X equipment, the last level you can craft without spending dil, is 1,800 for 3 hours. Still 600 XP/hr.
Mk. XII equipment gives 3000 xp for 5 hours. That is, yet again, 600 XP/hr.
So crafting gives you double the XP of a non-crafting activity. On the surface, that seems like a good idea, but that ignores a few truths of life. Humans sleep, and every activity we do has an opportunity cost. To get that double xp gain rate, you need materials.
For the low mark equipment, these are pretty easy to gather but that means you are spending a ridiculous amount of time starting craft actions over and over and over. This is not a fun activity, and getting it efficient enough to actually hit that 600 xp/hr rate is pretty much impossible.
For the high mark equipment, gathering the materials is not a trivial task. Its going to take a significant amount of time where you could be focusing on something else. The opportunity cost here is huge, and the benefit is almost non-existent.
Once you throw sleep in to the mix, the 20 hour mission is the only reasonable task for someone with a job and without insomnia.
I would really like to see some modifications to the higher crafting ranks to make crafting and appealing part of the crafting system. Higher rank items need to provide more XP/hr to make crafting appealing at all. It would probably be wise to tie the efficiency of said increase to the crafting level of the player so that the right answer doesn't just become to only craft MK X or MK XII equipment.
Oh, and removing the 20 hour mission or making it worse is not the way to make the other options more appealing. The appeal of the whole system is so dreadfully low right now that such an action would just be the nail in the coffin.
Post edited by zernin on
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As for why i'm crafting - for cheap, top-end beam arrays, naturally. What disappoints me is the lack of variety. Top-end, there's only one item per school, and some items that could have been added in (because there aren't any other way of acquiring them, for example) have been overlooked - non C-Store energy-type quad cannons, for example (Tetryon, Polaron and Antiproton) and additional variants of the Piercing Tetryon, Retrofit Phaser, Chroniton and Dominion Polaron weapons could also have been included.
Nothing else better to do. Thanks Cryptic. :rolleyes:
I'm not interested in the other schools, since the weapons and stuff are randomized mods, and I'm not interested in dilithium lottery that is designed to benefit the house.
Still waiting to be able to use forum titles
But as it is now, 3-4 months to reach max rank after which I will have to gamble my dilithium
away with very weak odds that I will get exactly what I want, I just do not feel like it. I don't see the benefit. At least the reps, while they have very little to nothing else to offer me personally, come with a big bag of dilithium at the end. This system has nothing to offer me at the end of the road. I see no reason to waste my time with it.
That's not what I've gotten out of it. What I've mainly gotten out of it would involve comments about fellow posters on the forums that would lead to moderator intervention if I were to share my thoughts on those particular individuals...
No doubt, folks are going to be of differing opinions on things...so it should not be a case of attacking the person for their opinion, but it's damn hard not to laugh while doing a /facepalm at some of the TRIBBLE being said. Oh noes, I no get to have shinies instantly...doom! C'mon...
Get to 2nd level, and you can do 2 20 hr assignments. Can be in the same school or not.
Get to 4th level and you can do 3 20 hr assignments.
Get to 15th level or 5th level in three schools, and you can do 4 20 hr assignments.
Unlock all of them and you can do 5 20 hr assignments at a time for 30,000 xp or 1500 xp/hr.
Granted, not necessarily practical at higher levels, but unlocking 3 slots pretty quickly seems doable.
I'm not certain, but I believe crafting Mk X items will be viable at level 5. So I'm of the opinion that it will be worth doing.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
This is pretty much my answer as well. Even if I only make a blue 12 that is currently 7-8 mil. If I manage a purple it is well over 30 million ec. I am not rich.
I also want the 360 degree beam.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Either way, I come out ahead!
As for the new shineys, i'll buy them off the exchange if I really want them but I already have sooo much stuff I'm not overly concerned about a potential .1% performance increase.
Beyond that it might serve as a decent method to trade purple rock for EC via the components but we shall see.
I am trying to figure out the new system. I think for now, I will level it up on the characters I play most. This is more so to ensure I'd not behind should some new equipment gets released that is either only accessible via crafting or if allowed, rather costly on the EC side via the exchange.
God be between you and harm, and all the empty places we must walk.
Given that the new Aegis set (I think) and the Rank 15 items (360-beam, Wide-Arc cannons, TR-116 etc) are bind on pickup - no, you won't. Everything else in the Crafting System is standard fare stuff you might get from loot drops.
Once I reach level 15 I might start crafting, but only if I'm on the mood of course.
So yes, It's just reputation by another name
In every place,
The deeds of men remain the same..."
Its not for everyone. Just like other features in any game. Some will enjoy some won't.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
They're not Bind on Pickup. They're Account Bind on Equip.
I was going to use the crafting system to gear my characters while leveling. Sadly, this looks like a waste of time as well.
What would help out quite a bit is if they would add a breakdown system for breaking down gear, ect into mats.
TR-116.
or the ability to craft a [CrtD]x3 if you want
~Vice Admiral Saskia - U.S.S. Muenzuka (Dyson Science Destroyer)~
~Lieutenant General Kalinka - I.K.S. Kazami (Negh'Var Heavy Battlecruiser)~
~Vice Admiral Lorel - R.R.W. Aureus Aquila (Mirror Mogai Heavy Warbird)~
I don't craft. I run daily assigments to keep the schools running. I intend to max them this way, and don't craft any single item. I don't want to waste my dil for this, if I want something I will buy it on ex.
RnD and upgrade needs less RNG. Less lottery. Something has to change.
Just the Aegis stuff or all the Level 15 items?
I can seem them leaving the Aegis set tradable but i'm surprised that the other top-level stuff is. Somewhat defeats the point of adding those unique items to crafting if it's not to entice people to actually use the new system.
It gives 6000 XP and uses 1 cheap mat to do. This mission is the only reason I'm bothering w/ crafting at all. I barely have time atm to log in once a day and get a few doff missions going. I sure as hell wasn't going to sit around while some 5 minute 10 XP crafting missions popped off. I don't really care if it's 300 XP per hour. I don't even have an hour of game time to play. I like the long mission w/ big payout. Helps us people that don't have hours to sit and start 50 separate missions every day.
But I do have some questions that have probably been answered elsewhere, but I can't seem to find them...
Is there a list of how much XP is required to reach each level?
The loot from STFs, does it come as a box, with multiple materials in it?
What are the 20hr projects everyone is talking about?
Tons more questions, but I'm on my kindle and it sucks to type...
CM
+1 but will start crafting special items on lvl 20... in a year or two...