Ok, to avoid the Wrath of Khan from some of you guys, looks like it will probably be better to make the improvements far more subtle.
We've got another pass, this time with male and female - very little tweaks here and there. The geo for the head has not been changed other than miniscule vert shifting to tone down the sharpest points. Cleaned up some of the texture map wonkiness, added more definition and detail in key places, and more color depth to the skin tone.
All told, it just looks like increased resolution.
In the mean time, the previous (more drastic) female head and texture revisions that were shown here will probably get added as additional options down the road.
I can except this. it looks largely unchanged, so I am fine with it as I, in essence, still get the look I want on my toons.
And I am fine with having a more "drastic" option available for people who want someone who is more noticeably asian in appearance.
What I see as the most elegant solution is to see the assets of head2/complexion2 replaced with the new proposed ones in order to give the much needed facelift crypticjoejing feels the game needs for the NPCs using these assets. The current ones could then be kept in, as a head2b/complexion2b.
That's actually an interesting potential solution.
As umaeko pointed out we were hoping for a fairly substantial facelift to NPCs and contacts. The most recent subtle updated textures post I made really don't improve the assets to the level we (and as seen on this forum - some of the players) would like.
And in answer to a couple other posts - no, it *isn't* easy to add the new head (as a new version) and go through all of the NPC's and update them. There are possibly 100's of costumes using the current version and we don't have an automatic way to even find out which those are.
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
I would not. The new version you posted first with the more radical changes is a huge improvement.
Even if there's a slight EC cost involved in switching to the 'legacy' head type or complexion, it's a miniscule inconvenience compared to the dramatic facelift the NPC's will receive. I say go for it!
Take a look at my Foundry missions! Conjoined, Re-emergence, and . . .
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
I wouldn't mind , but I'm sure people will complain if there is a cost they don't want to pay. This does seem like the best solution, as long as people are informed.
Is there a chance in the future we'll see alternate options for the existing male complexions; namely having an alternate version which doesn't have stubble on them?
Another vote for the 2a/2b option. The revised head and complexion are too good to pass up, but I'm sensitive to those who have tweaked their characters to perfection. I'm looking forward to the dramatic enhancement of NPCs. It's sorely needed.
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
Nope. Improvements and additions to the customization options are always welcomed on my part, at least. Just look at the Gorn updates. I occasionally see an old school Gorn running around, but it's rare. Like, really rare. Like, Jem'hadar attack ship rare.
That's actually an interesting potential solution.
As umaeko pointed out we were hoping for a fairly substantial facelift to NPCs and contacts. The most recent subtle updated textures post I made really don't improve the assets to the level we (and as seen on this forum - some of the players) would like.
And in answer to a couple other posts - no, it *isn't* easy to add the new head (as a new version) and go through all of the NPC's and update them. There are possibly 100's of costumes using the current version and we don't have an automatic way to even find out which those are.
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
Nope I wont get bent out of shape cause Im really liking the updated look from ur first post.
That's actually an interesting potential solution.
As umaeko pointed out we were hoping for a fairly substantial facelift to NPCs and contacts. The most recent subtle updated textures post I made really don't improve the assets to the level we (and as seen on this forum - some of the players) would like.
And in answer to a couple other posts - no, it *isn't* easy to add the new head (as a new version) and go through all of the NPC's and update them. There are possibly 100's of costumes using the current version and we don't have an automatic way to even find out which those are.
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
Under 2 conditions I believe it's fine:
- If the 'subtle' change option is added at the same time you update all with the more 'drastic' version.
- And if you communicate clearly the steps necessary for getting the subtly changed version.
Then I believe people will more or less understand (the EC cost for changing head type and complexion is negligeable). But still, expect some players raging on the forums.
TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class. Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider. Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
That's actually an interesting potential solution.
As umaeko pointed out we were hoping for a fairly substantial facelift to NPCs and contacts. The most recent subtle updated textures post I made really don't improve the assets to the level we (and as seen on this forum - some of the players) would like.
And in answer to a couple other posts - no, it *isn't* easy to add the new head (as a new version) and go through all of the NPC's and update them. There are possibly 100's of costumes using the current version and we don't have an automatic way to even find out which those are.
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
Under 2 conditions I believe it's fine:
- If the 'subtle' change option is added at the same time you update all with the more 'drastic' version.
- And if you communicate clearly the steps necessary for getting the subtly changed version.
Then I believe people will more or less understand (the EC cost for changing head type and complexion is negligeable). But still, expect some players raging on the forums.
I am just going to say I agree with everything toiva said.
My concern on updating the assets really amounts to my characters and how I like them. In my cause i want characters who appear youthful and aren't exactly asian.
That is why I am resistant to the drastic improvements. Effectively doing it that way means the only way to get a character who is not 40+ years old, is to make it asian. Which wouldn't work for me.
But a "middle of the road" solution which combines the "Drastic" solution for those who like it, but keeps the "subtle" solution for those who prefer that works fine for me, and I think ultimately will make everyone happy.
I don't mind having to change my characters look, even with the EC cost (which lets be honest is marginal at best), if I can get my character to look the way I want. But if the choices are 25 yrs and Asian, or 40+ years and Caucasian, then I would not be happy.
That's actually an interesting potential solution.
As umaeko pointed out we were hoping for a fairly substantial facelift to NPCs and contacts. The most recent subtle updated textures post I made really don't improve the assets to the level we (and as seen on this forum - some of the players) would like.
And in answer to a couple other posts - no, it *isn't* easy to add the new head (as a new version) and go through all of the NPC's and update them. There are possibly 100's of costumes using the current version and we don't have an automatic way to even find out which those are.
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
Best solution by far. Also the one I suggested waaaay back in the thread ...
That's actually an interesting potential solution.
As umaeko pointed out we were hoping for a fairly substantial facelift to NPCs and contacts. The most recent subtle updated textures post I made really don't improve the assets to the level we (and as seen on this forum - some of the players) would like.
And in answer to a couple other posts - no, it *isn't* easy to add the new head (as a new version) and go through all of the NPC's and update them. There are possibly 100's of costumes using the current version and we don't have an automatic way to even find out which those are.
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
That seems like the best solution for all concerned. You get to give the NPC's the update you want to and the players get the option to keep the old look if they so prefer.
Even if there is an EC cost it's likely it will be so negligible that only a character fresh out of the tutorial would struggle to pay the couple of hundred it would cost.
If you decide to go with the 2/2b option will the old head/complexion still be getting the subtle upgrade you proposed?
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
I wouldn't mind, even if I have to pay a couple EC... so long as all of the attributes I currently have just swap over nicely without throwing things all asunder.
...So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
This would be awesome. We get the benefit of new looks on 100s of in-game characters, as well as new options for our future characters, but also get to keep our original look on existing characters that we choose to (after a quick trip to the Tailor). I'm totally ok with this.
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
i asked ealier in this post and didnt get a responce, maybe its because you didnt see it. will ever be able to customise our characters into like animals like ducks- howard the duck for example.
even if we have to pay real money like for the romulan expansion. not everyone will like it but those that do will happy pay. i for one would.
i asked ealier in this post and didnt get a responce, maybe its because you didnt see it. will ever be able to customise our characters into like animals like ducks- howard the duck for example.
even if we have to pay real money like for the romulan expansion. not everyone will like it but those that do will happy pay. i for one would.
Yup, somehow I missed this and...uh...for real? You trolling me, Captain?
Regardless, that was a pretty hefty thread hijack, but since you got me to bite:
Short answer...only if it makes sense in the Star Trek universe and is something players want.
And finally, bear in mind this head shape and complexion could be mixed and matched with the other head shapes and complexions exactly the same as before. To give an idea of before and after for different combos using somewhat extreme examples with blond hair and black hair: http://imgur.com/D0Q1UkP
I did ask a question before also but you might have missed it. Is there a Male version of this??
Maybe rewording will work lol.
I did ask a question before also but you might have missed it. Is there a Male version of this??
In the works Like I said, the male head 2, complexion 2 is...pretty not great looking. At all. Even with the texture resolution update. We def want a better option.
troll never, high jack maybe, lol.
everyone loves customisation, that is the basis of what made cryptic so orginal from all the other mmorpg's to date. champions online has alot better customistion capabilites then sto does. as for making sence- universe is infinity- as we delve into the delta quandrant who knows what we can come up with?
bottom line- could be a major money maker for cryptic and pwe
im already a life time sub. you do want more of our money dont you?
In the works Like I said, the male head 2, complexion 2 is...pretty not great looking. At all. Even with the texture resolution update. We def want a better option.
I wanted to give an example of using Humanoid 2 as a basis for a Caucasian, contrasted with everything the exact same but using Humanoid 1. I realize you're not trying to create a character builder that clones likenesses in an unauthorized way but I'm doing this mainly because:
A) I wanted to illustrate that some of us use Humanoid 2 not as an Asian head but as a workaround for limitations of Humanoid 1.
I'd like to inspire further thought on the topic of head makeovers, new complexions, etc. and the best way to do this is a real, recognizable person beside the two head types with the proportions measured out to the actual person's face.
That's actually an interesting potential solution.
As umaeko pointed out we were hoping for a fairly substantial facelift to NPCs and contacts. The most recent subtle updated textures post I made really don't improve the assets to the level we (and as seen on this forum - some of the players) would like.
And in answer to a couple other posts - no, it *isn't* easy to add the new head (as a new version) and go through all of the NPC's and update them. There are possibly 100's of costumes using the current version and we don't have an automatic way to even find out which those are.
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
Would it be possible to first have a script "repoint" all instances of humanoid 2 to humanoid 3 in the NPC costume database? That's a different library than the player costume database so doing a "find and replace" would convert all NPCs without affecting players.
I have enough experience with the cryptic engine to mod the game files to do that. It's a client hack on my end but if I could hack the client to do this, surely some mix of Cryptic employees could and get it into a patch. I imagine most of the nightmare there is bureaucratic and/or avoiding version mismatches of the codebase.
Yup, somehow I missed this and...uh...for real? You trolling me, Captain?
Regardless, that was a pretty hefty thread hijack, but since you got me to bite:
Short answer...only if it makes sense in the Star Trek universe and is something players want.
I actually would like Grazerites. There was a Federation president Grazerite on DS9. They're goat/cow people.
The Fed president wore a turban to hide his head and long robes mainly because they didn't have the budget for hooves and horns. The various RPGs (including one Jesse Heinig oversaw at Decipher) described them as having cow fur patterns.
In general, I think cute, furry appealing animals are a tall order in Trek (less so in Champs or NW) but I think you can scratch some of that Tauren or Draenei MMO gamer itch if you could take a species or two that were infrequently onscreen and flesh them out for a game.
T^he Anticans (dog people) and Selay (snake headed people) are also popular requests. Probably moreso than Grazerites because they're more exotic spceies from the shows but I think Grazerites, as a vegetarian species of zen monk goats, have a lot of quality game design built into them if you can use the shows as a starting point and get imagintive with things like horns, fur patterns, tribal earrings, etc. In a way, I guess I think of them as being a bit like Rafiki from the Lion King. Stubborn, agile, wise, peace loving.
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
if only it were that easy.
if i elect to modify the head on any outfit other than 'uniform' i will be forced to completely recreate the entire outfit. to make matters worse, many of those outfits cannot be recreated or edited (bves, etc).
imo it might be a good idea to put off something like this until the various tailor bugs/issues are worked out:
- 'modify' means 'modify' (not 'start over') on honour guard, omega, off-duty, etc.
- players can create a base 'shape' (face/body) that is applied to all outfits
- 'load outfit' actually loads the outfit in all cases
- more outside the scope of the immediate discussion!
Comments
I can except this. it looks largely unchanged, so I am fine with it as I, in essence, still get the look I want on my toons.
And I am fine with having a more "drastic" option available for people who want someone who is more noticeably asian in appearance.
That's actually an interesting potential solution.
As umaeko pointed out we were hoping for a fairly substantial facelift to NPCs and contacts. The most recent subtle updated textures post I made really don't improve the assets to the level we (and as seen on this forum - some of the players) would like.
And in answer to a couple other posts - no, it *isn't* easy to add the new head (as a new version) and go through all of the NPC's and update them. There are possibly 100's of costumes using the current version and we don't have an automatic way to even find out which those are.
So...will you, the players get bent out of shape if you don't like the update and have to go to the tailor with your characters and BOFF's to choose "Humanoid 2b" head and "Complexion 2b"? There's no cost to changing head and facial features, right?
I would not. The new version you posted first with the more radical changes is a huge improvement.
My Foundry question remains unanswered though...
Conjoined, Re-emergence, and . . .
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I wouldn't mind , but I'm sure people will complain if there is a cost they don't want to pay. This does seem like the best solution, as long as people are informed.
Reddit Alert, Reddit Star Empire, House of Snoo, House of the Rising Snoo
Good Builds: http://www.reddit.com/r/stobuilds/
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Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Nil Intentatum Reliquit"
Thank you for your great work!
sorry, kept meaning to throw in an answer for that.
Yes, we'd like to make all the player options for heads available in Foundry as well.
Thanks. Appreciate the response.
Nope. Improvements and additions to the customization options are always welcomed on my part, at least. Just look at the Gorn updates. I occasionally see an old school Gorn running around, but it's rare. Like, really rare. Like, Jem'hadar attack ship rare.
Nope I wont get bent out of shape cause Im really liking the updated look from ur first post.
Under 2 conditions I believe it's fine:
- If the 'subtle' change option is added at the same time you update all with the more 'drastic' version.
- And if you communicate clearly the steps necessary for getting the subtly changed version.
Then I believe people will more or less understand (the EC cost for changing head type and complexion is negligeable). But still, expect some players raging on the forums.
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
I am just going to say I agree with everything toiva said.
My concern on updating the assets really amounts to my characters and how I like them. In my cause i want characters who appear youthful and aren't exactly asian.
That is why I am resistant to the drastic improvements. Effectively doing it that way means the only way to get a character who is not 40+ years old, is to make it asian. Which wouldn't work for me.
But a "middle of the road" solution which combines the "Drastic" solution for those who like it, but keeps the "subtle" solution for those who prefer that works fine for me, and I think ultimately will make everyone happy.
I don't mind having to change my characters look, even with the EC cost (which lets be honest is marginal at best), if I can get my character to look the way I want. But if the choices are 25 yrs and Asian, or 40+ years and Caucasian, then I would not be happy.
Best solution by far. Also the one I suggested waaaay back in the thread
That seems like the best solution for all concerned. You get to give the NPC's the update you want to and the players get the option to keep the old look if they so prefer.
Even if there is an EC cost it's likely it will be so negligible that only a character fresh out of the tutorial would struggle to pay the couple of hundred it would cost.
If you decide to go with the 2/2b option will the old head/complexion still be getting the subtle upgrade you proposed?
Heh, sorry, I missed that before. Props to you as well, sir.
I wouldn't mind, even if I have to pay a couple EC... so long as all of the attributes I currently have just swap over nicely without throwing things all asunder.
You can find/contact me in game as @PatricianVetinari. Playing STO since Feb 2010.
even if we have to pay real money like for the romulan expansion. not everyone will like it but those that do will happy pay. i for one would.
Yup, somehow I missed this and...uh...for real? You trolling me, Captain?
Regardless, that was a pretty hefty thread hijack, but since you got me to bite:
Short answer...only if it makes sense in the Star Trek universe and is something players want.
We all know what's coming next...
I did ask a question before also but you might have missed it. Is there a Male version of this??
Maybe rewording will work lol.
In the works
everyone loves customisation, that is the basis of what made cryptic so orginal from all the other mmorpg's to date. champions online has alot better customistion capabilites then sto does. as for making sence- universe is infinity- as we delve into the delta quandrant who knows what we can come up with?
bottom line- could be a major money maker for cryptic and pwe
im already a life time sub. you do want more of our money dont you?
Cool Thank you!!!
A) I wanted to illustrate that some of us use Humanoid 2 not as an Asian head but as a workaround for limitations of Humanoid 1.
Would it be possible to first have a script "repoint" all instances of humanoid 2 to humanoid 3 in the NPC costume database? That's a different library than the player costume database so doing a "find and replace" would convert all NPCs without affecting players.
I have enough experience with the cryptic engine to mod the game files to do that. It's a client hack on my end but if I could hack the client to do this, surely some mix of Cryptic employees could and get it into a patch. I imagine most of the nightmare there is bureaucratic and/or avoiding version mismatches of the codebase.
I actually would like Grazerites. There was a Federation president Grazerite on DS9. They're goat/cow people.
The Fed president wore a turban to hide his head and long robes mainly because they didn't have the budget for hooves and horns. The various RPGs (including one Jesse Heinig oversaw at Decipher) described them as having cow fur patterns.
In general, I think cute, furry appealing animals are a tall order in Trek (less so in Champs or NW) but I think you can scratch some of that Tauren or Draenei MMO gamer itch if you could take a species or two that were infrequently onscreen and flesh them out for a game.
T^he Anticans (dog people) and Selay (snake headed people) are also popular requests. Probably moreso than Grazerites because they're more exotic spceies from the shows but I think Grazerites, as a vegetarian species of zen monk goats, have a lot of quality game design built into them if you can use the shows as a starting point and get imagintive with things like horns, fur patterns, tribal earrings, etc. In a way, I guess I think of them as being a bit like Rafiki from the Lion King. Stubborn, agile, wise, peace loving.
Ye.
if only it were that easy.
if i elect to modify the head on any outfit other than 'uniform' i will be forced to completely recreate the entire outfit. to make matters worse, many of those outfits cannot be recreated or edited (bves, etc).
imo it might be a good idea to put off something like this until the various tailor bugs/issues are worked out:
- 'modify' means 'modify' (not 'start over') on honour guard, omega, off-duty, etc.
- players can create a base 'shape' (face/body) that is applied to all outfits
- 'load outfit' actually loads the outfit in all cases
- more outside the scope of the immediate discussion!
free jkname
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