I thought last stand was rather easy, the elachi are too busy fighting the little ones to bother with you, i just did cloak strikes in my Mogai (i didn't like the looks of the d'deridex so i kept my lvl 20 ship). Was just using Cannon:Rapid Fire and Cannon: Scatter Volley to make short work of the elachi ships.
I was a bit lucky tho, and had gotten an Reman tactical boff with the Superior Infiltrator trait at 35, so i made most use of the ambush from cloak.
If you thought this was hard don't worry you'll get rewarded with the battle of new romulus. Personally not a big problem with this mission but have helped a lot of friends with it. Which was a lot more fun to do lol. Especially when my sons were whooping in delight when they got past it with their old man (Felt like a hero...Nice to know I can still impress them since they kick my butt at everything else video game related lol)
Just did this recently and agree that it needs some tuning. The Shuttle mission after that needs some tuning also (dont remember the name). 4 waves of like 20 or so shuttles. Died like 3 times each wave because every shuttle always attacked me and never the other ally shuttles following me.
I just ran this mission and the last solar system took more than forty five minutes. (probably about an hour for the whole mission) I know this for certain, because my Pirate Distress Call's fifteen minute cool down counted down three times in the last solar system.
I'm not saying it's hard, I was in a D'deridex and I have lots of good weapons and good shields, it was just LONG. I had my power systems set to "defense" at first, and the first wave took the longest. Then I finally changed them to "attack" and the second and third waves went faster. Sure, I had to keep using shield batteries and hull and shield buffs, but I got it done and didn't die once.
I just want to know why we had to fight so many ships in those waves. And the space station was useless and was only launching fighters to "help" us. It got very repetitive. Of all the missions I've played in this game, this was my least favorite just because of the length and the number of ships in those waves.
I do admit, it is a bit long for a mission....BUT, I rather enjoyed it.
It was a nice break from some of the other, how should I put it, quick, easy breezy missions.
I do kinda wish there were more missions like this one, both space and ground.
Reminds me of the old STF's that took about an hour or so to complete before they broke them down into shorter versions.
I am not a Mod. I am just a player. You have been informed :cool:
Just finished this arc in my second Rom toon. For some reason, I managed to take out the command ship after a relatively short time - I was fully prepared to spend most of an hour dying at the weapons of the Elachi before I could even get a good shot in, but less than ten minutes later, the command ship was dead and the remnants of the Elachi fleet were scattering. Even my Nimbus Pirate buddies were still around!
Okay kept my word I made a new (Romulan sci) toon with zero reputation and when I got to this mission recorded it for your viewing pleasure.
My conclusion is that people are building themselves and ships wrong, trying to have everything when you should be concentrating on a specific build, that or people are playing wrong. I found no issues with this mission and quite enjoyed it, yes it was fairly lengthy but it was enjoyable. My biggest tip is get a shield with disruptor resist as that is the flavour of weapons the Elachi use.
Please do not complain about this battle it is the ONLY battle in the entire Romulan Storyline that is still somewhat difficult. I love that it actually takes a while to complete this battle and I look forward to it every time I make a new Romulan toon....
The defense of New Romulus used to be epic but it was nerfed due to forum complaints and now all you need to do in that one is remain cloaked until you are told its over and New Romulus is saved.
If they listen to forum complaints about The Last Stand and it gets nerfed it would be a real shame indeed...for the love of gaming lets have at least some semblance of difficulty and not make everything a cake walk...:rolleyes:
The only real problem with Last Stand is all 3 waves are the same thing, that gets boring. If it started with small easy to kill but in large numbers ships then fewer harder to kill ships, and a final wave of the hardest to kill ships that are not quite boss level then the mission would be a whole lot less boring and more fun to do. Copypasta suxors is what the mission is, they started it and after making the first wave couldnt think of what to do next or was running out of time so they just copied that wave 2 more times and called it good. That is not good, that is boring.
Nerf it? No it doesnt need a nerf, it needs variety in each wave rather than 3 of the same wave.
Join Date: Nobody cares.
"I'm drunk, whats your excuse for being an idiot?" - Unknown drunk man. :eek:
I feel safe in saying that this thread should be closed. It has been proven without doubt that this mission does NOT need a nerf nor is overly difficult. If the content of the mission is not up to certain peoples standards then you will just have to live with it and go do something else instead.
Just because some people cant seem to build a basic character does not mean that things are OP it means that person is misguided and needs help with their build ! The culture of the game lately is that people want a "I win" button, well it does exist in a way the thing is you have to build it yourself. And this is where the problem lay, to many people are just plain and simple lazy.
Just because you cant do it does not mean it is broken it means you dont understand the game mechanics and that is nobody's fault except the individual who is misunderstanding and obviously does not want help nor seek how to change !
If you attack the groups one at a time then it isn't extremely bad - stack CSV with 4 DHCs and 3 Turrets and you can mow them down fairly quickly coming out of cloak. Use CRF after the SV to target individual vessels - if one jumps behind you then either shoot something in front or use Evasive to get around and hit it. I didn't notice anything ridiculous about it running it with the level 30 D'D with an all cannon build (out of cloak ambush DPS with RF or SV was my intention - kill anything before it can react).
At the same time, I once ended up doing the 20 player laurentian system mission by myself when I warped into the system the wrong way, so I might be hardened by that.
I am a new player, just made L33 Rom as my first character. I find I can't stand toe to toe with a battleship with my current build. Your advice below helps a great deal, but I don't have the patience right now (or perhaps even the knowhow) to rebuild for just this one mission so I will likely skip it and come back to it later, if I can clearly identify the next mission beyond.
Quick question, DHC = Dual Heavy Cannons, what do CRF, RF and SV mean? Forgive me, am still relatively new to STO.
And to the others in this thread who weren't as informative and who were looking down on us new players, I completely disagree with your view about those of us who have not yet learned the complete in's and outs of builds and I recommend you respond with build suggestions for this mission. I think this mission, on normal, ought to be easier. I'm sure you can find sufficient challenge elsewhere. I don't think any one mission at least during level progression ought to require a specific build.
If you attack the groups one at a time then it isn't extremely bad - stack CSV with 4 DHCs and 3 Turrets and you can mow them down fairly quickly coming out of cloak. Use CRF after the SV to target individual vessels - if one jumps behind you then either shoot something in front or use Evasive to get around and hit it. I didn't notice anything ridiculous about it running it with the level 30 D'D with an all cannon build (out of cloak ambush DPS with RF or SV was my intention - kill anything before it can react).
At the same time, I once ended up doing the 20 player laurentian system mission by myself when I warped into the system the wrong way, so I might be hardened by that.
Oh my god this was so easy. Im using a standard bc with only stuff i got as mission rewards. Tool me bout 40 mins. Do it one group at a time smallest ship first, no special tactics or anythin. Was watchin an ep of ds 9 while i did it.
Stop whining cause u cant insta win and bltz every mission. Iiked that it was a bit harder
i remember this mission few months ago, within weeks before Risa "summer" event.
i had a help from fleet mate to kill Keldon Galor ship, i wasnt able to kill it as solo, so he just oblivated that ship within seconds.
and now i came back as 50 lvl rom, looking for upgrades, wow, that ship still way too tough, it kept summoning 3 illusion ships, i kept running away and took me 15 mins to kill it, it is hard when it regenerated faster than i could damage it.
this time i was using my Deainos Warbird destroyer, way better than i used D'Dredix from last time i was in.
by the time i was able to take it out when my "pirate distress call" became available and 3 photo-ships and while i was under 50% and prepared with 3 more additional ships.
that keldon galor was bit too much to force me to use 9 ships and have to be very lucky.
this mission isnt friendly to lower level and it scaled off the chart for those who has slow-turning ships and fewer weapon options and the upgrades are junks, or find a faster turning ship to deal with them.
i dont have Mark XII upgrades for my new current ship yet.
i would say "skip" this until 50 lvl with bigger and faster ship and full Boff skills, and get Pirate Distress Calling card from Nimbus III episode series.
just did the romulan defense portion (imo it SHOULD be split into to missions and not one huge one like it is now) and if your really just going through it....cloak, thats all i did when i came to that part of the mission at lvl 32....signal the fleet at the first wave, then cloak and move back to the second set HTBTs
I find this line of replies sadly hilarious. We put a lot of work into the massive list of fixes/changes above, and ya'll are hung up on the ability to skip our content. =p
First wave took about 1hour 22 minutes 41 seconds with tactical warbird and sufficient items plus skills. Difficulty is elite.
One wave should be enough, difficulty for foe like Elachi is about right.. Only thing that buggers me is that almost insta death ability that looks cool but takes hull to 14-1% with dot aplied as well and if you happen to have emhimeerimg team or that singularity ability on cd its just waste of resources to repair all the time.
Maybe Starfleet or KDF could send some reinforcements and maybe those shuttles could stand a bit more as well.
So, I actually have done this mission two times. Firstly, with my very first character and more recently, with my second Romulan char. Now, for the sake of fairness I shall compare both attempts.
The first time I tried it, I was flying one of the free ships, I cannot remember which one but I was not under leveled for the mission so that doesn't leave much choices. I was playing as a tac, so I was being pretty aggressive. Nevertheless, they were very tough and I ended up getting bored of how long it took to kill them all, as well as the fact that some of them were seriously kicking my TRIBBLE. This was my first character so yeah, I was using gear I had gotten from loot thus far, I don't think I even had a tac console equiped and I had no idea that the battle cloak was even good. Ended up calling in my younger brother who had been a player for longer and together we won pretty handily.
Second time I actually knew what I was doing; I had run several characters between times so I now knew how to actually outfit a ship, run it properly, use cloak, etc. I was running a Valdore, and I was a sci captain. As I recall, I had two front dual plasma banks and one torp launcher. (Photon, I think) Two rear plasma arrays. I was mostly using looted gear, and some stuff from the exchange so a bit of it was under levelled for the encounter. Nevertheless, I had a pretty easy time of it. I simply cloaked, moved in on one of the groups and popped an aux battery. Then I threw down a gravity well, and took pot shots at them as they tried to escape. If any of them survived, I just cloaked, circled around and did it again. Simple and easy. I didn't die once.
Despite this, it was still kind of long and boring. There's no difference between the waves, its just a long slugging match and while some players do like that, its somewhat of an aquired taste and new players probably don't want it. Sadly, my first experiance is probably more true of what a new player should expect. By my second, I was well used to the game and knew what to expect. Simply put, if you know what you're doing the mission is not hard but it is long. If you don't know what you're doing, you're in the long haul. Better hope you got some good loot in the missions leading up to it.
I don't die all that often during this mission, but Candle in a Hurricane is just plain tedious. The Elachi cut through the shuttles like a hot Bat'leth through butter, leaving you to take them out one at a time.
Time for a little math review, Cryptic: A typical battle group, assuming you're going solo, consists of one of the following: 7 fighters, 3 fighters and 1 frigate, 3 frigates, or 1 escort/curiser/science ship/battleship. Each of the three waves in Candle in a Huricane consists of three groups: one contains 2 escorts and 2 frigates, one contains 3 escorts, and the final one contains 1 frigate, 1 escort, and 1 battleship.
So in a single wave, you encounter 3 frigates, 6 escorts, and 1 battleship. That's the same as facing eight different battle groups. Add all three waves together and you get a grand total of: 9 frigates, 18 escorts, and 3 battleships, which is equivalent to twenty-four battle groups.
TWENTY... FRIGGIN... FOUR!
And your reinforcements? A bunch of Reshirts... er... shuttles. I'll give you credit, Cryptic, for making them not attack you all at once, which would make the mission borderline impossible. But it's almost no consolation in the sheer amount of frustration.
This mission is not fun. It's hard, tedious, and boring.
The thing is you are a Romulan and you have a cloaking device. You are not supposed to go "toe to toe" you should instead be cloaking, getting into that strategic perfect position, decloak and unleash all you have, cloak, rinse and repeat.
That is how a Romulan mind would approach this battle.
Also you need to draw one or two ships away from the group, kill those and go draw a few more out and you can do this one ship at a time if you do it right.
The way to start this fight is to cloak right after you are told ships are incoming and the beginning of the battle, and remain cloaked until they all settle in pounding on the station. They can not destroy the station even if you just sit there and let them shoot at it for hours and hours so don't worry about that at all, you can not fail the mission because the station blows up it just does not happen.
So once they are all settled into pounding on the station go up and start your cloak, decloak strategy and whittle them down one or two ships at a time.
The thing is you are a Romulan and you have a cloaking device. You are not supposed to go "toe to toe" you should instead be cloaking, getting into that strategic perfect position, decloak and unleash all you have, cloak, rinse and repeat.
That is how a Romulan mind would approach this battle.
Also you need to draw one or two ships away from the group, kill those and go draw a few more out and you can do this one ship at a time if you do it right.
The way to start this fight is to cloak right after you are told ships are incoming and the beginning of the battle, and remain cloaked until they all settle in pounding on the station. They can not destroy the station even if you just sit there and let them shoot at it for hours and hours so don't worry about that at all, you can not fail the mission because the station blows up it just does not happen.
So once they are all settled into pounding on the station go up and start your cloak, decloak strategy and whittle them down one or two ships at a time.
Read the mission name again. What chance does a candle stand in a hurricane?
The Elachi are under orders to "pacify" the Republic soonest, probably because their masters know what still lies beneath the surface of Mol'Rihan/Dewa III. They're not coming at you as a "battle group" - they're coming at you as an exterminating force. It's your job to make them fail.
Read the mission name again. What chance does a candle stand in a hurricane?
The Elachi are under orders to "pacify" the Republic soonest, probably because their masters know what still lies beneath the surface of Mol'Rihan/Dewa III. They're not coming at you as a "battle group" - they're coming at you as an exterminating force. It's your job to make them fail.
From an in-character perspective this is true, but from an out of character one (The one that most people are approaching this from.) That means less than nothing. Unless you believe that the Elachi are actually running the game, what they want and how they go about it is entierly down to how the mission is set to go. Moreover, it is a mission that is supposed to be fun, which it is clearly lacking to a lot of people here. Now, I'm not going to say that I am one of them. In my second run through, I didn't have much trouble. Nevertheless, I can see where people are coming from and to address the point from an in-character perspective is rather like missing it all together.
Comments
I thought last stand was rather easy, the elachi are too busy fighting the little ones to bother with you, i just did cloak strikes in my Mogai (i didn't like the looks of the d'deridex so i kept my lvl 20 ship). Was just using Cannon:Rapid Fire and Cannon: Scatter Volley to make short work of the elachi ships.
I was a bit lucky tho, and had gotten an Reman tactical boff with the Superior Infiltrator trait at 35, so i made most use of the ambush from cloak.
I'm not saying it's hard, I was in a D'deridex and I have lots of good weapons and good shields, it was just LONG. I had my power systems set to "defense" at first, and the first wave took the longest. Then I finally changed them to "attack" and the second and third waves went faster. Sure, I had to keep using shield batteries and hull and shield buffs, but I got it done and didn't die once.
I just want to know why we had to fight so many ships in those waves. And the space station was useless and was only launching fighters to "help" us. It got very repetitive. Of all the missions I've played in this game, this was my least favorite just because of the length and the number of ships in those waves.
It was a nice break from some of the other, how should I put it, quick, easy breezy missions.
I do kinda wish there were more missions like this one, both space and ground.
Reminds me of the old STF's that took about an hour or so to complete before they broke them down into shorter versions.
now THAT was how you make a battle epic. Hard? yes, but VERY VERY EPIC!
BTW, I used an Aux2Batt build in my D'D.
My character Tsin'xing
My conclusion is that people are building themselves and ships wrong, trying to have everything when you should be concentrating on a specific build, that or people are playing wrong. I found no issues with this mission and quite enjoyed it, yes it was fairly lengthy but it was enjoyable. My biggest tip is get a shield with disruptor resist as that is the flavour of weapons the Elachi use.
Click the link to watch if you like
Last Stand Level 30 Rommie Sci
The defense of New Romulus used to be epic but it was nerfed due to forum complaints and now all you need to do in that one is remain cloaked until you are told its over and New Romulus is saved.
If they listen to forum complaints about The Last Stand and it gets nerfed it would be a real shame indeed...for the love of gaming lets have at least some semblance of difficulty and not make everything a cake walk...:rolleyes:
Nerf it? No it doesnt need a nerf, it needs variety in each wave rather than 3 of the same wave.
"I'm drunk, whats your excuse for being an idiot?" - Unknown drunk man. :eek:
Just because some people cant seem to build a basic character does not mean that things are OP it means that person is misguided and needs help with their build ! The culture of the game lately is that people want a "I win" button, well it does exist in a way the thing is you have to build it yourself. And this is where the problem lay, to many people are just plain and simple lazy.
Just because you cant do it does not mean it is broken it means you dont understand the game mechanics and that is nobody's fault except the individual who is misunderstanding and obviously does not want help nor seek how to change !
Last Stand is NOT OP and does NOT need a nerf.
Case closed !
[Combat (Self)] You lose 6549 (7572) Cold from the torment of the underworld.
In-game handle @Janetza
At the same time, I once ended up doing the 20 player laurentian system mission by myself when I warped into the system the wrong way, so I might be hardened by that.
Quick question, DHC = Dual Heavy Cannons, what do CRF, RF and SV mean? Forgive me, am still relatively new to STO.
And to the others in this thread who weren't as informative and who were looking down on us new players, I completely disagree with your view about those of us who have not yet learned the complete in's and outs of builds and I recommend you respond with build suggestions for this mission. I think this mission, on normal, ought to be easier. I'm sure you can find sufficient challenge elsewhere. I don't think any one mission at least during level progression ought to require a specific build.
CRF and RF both refer to the tactical Bridge OFFicer power Cannon: Rapid Fire.
Similarly, CSV and SV refer to the tactical Bridge OFFicer power Cannon: Scatter Volley.
Thanks!
Stop whining cause u cant insta win and bltz every mission. Iiked that it was a bit harder
i had a help from fleet mate to kill Keldon Galor ship, i wasnt able to kill it as solo, so he just oblivated that ship within seconds.
and now i came back as 50 lvl rom, looking for upgrades, wow, that ship still way too tough, it kept summoning 3 illusion ships, i kept running away and took me 15 mins to kill it, it is hard when it regenerated faster than i could damage it.
this time i was using my Deainos Warbird destroyer, way better than i used D'Dredix from last time i was in.
by the time i was able to take it out when my "pirate distress call" became available and 3 photo-ships and while i was under 50% and prepared with 3 more additional ships.
that keldon galor was bit too much to force me to use 9 ships and have to be very lucky.
this mission isnt friendly to lower level and it scaled off the chart for those who has slow-turning ships and fewer weapon options and the upgrades are junks, or find a faster turning ship to deal with them.
i dont have Mark XII upgrades for my new current ship yet.
i would say "skip" this until 50 lvl with bigger and faster ship and full Boff skills, and get Pirate Distress Calling card from Nimbus III episode series.
this was on my fed-rom ENg
One wave should be enough, difficulty for foe like Elachi is about right.. Only thing that buggers me is that almost insta death ability that looks cool but takes hull to 14-1% with dot aplied as well and if you happen to have emhimeerimg team or that singularity ability on cd its just waste of resources to repair all the time.
Maybe Starfleet or KDF could send some reinforcements and maybe those shuttles could stand a bit more as well.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The first time I tried it, I was flying one of the free ships, I cannot remember which one but I was not under leveled for the mission so that doesn't leave much choices. I was playing as a tac, so I was being pretty aggressive. Nevertheless, they were very tough and I ended up getting bored of how long it took to kill them all, as well as the fact that some of them were seriously kicking my TRIBBLE. This was my first character so yeah, I was using gear I had gotten from loot thus far, I don't think I even had a tac console equiped and I had no idea that the battle cloak was even good. Ended up calling in my younger brother who had been a player for longer and together we won pretty handily.
Second time I actually knew what I was doing; I had run several characters between times so I now knew how to actually outfit a ship, run it properly, use cloak, etc. I was running a Valdore, and I was a sci captain. As I recall, I had two front dual plasma banks and one torp launcher. (Photon, I think) Two rear plasma arrays. I was mostly using looted gear, and some stuff from the exchange so a bit of it was under levelled for the encounter. Nevertheless, I had a pretty easy time of it. I simply cloaked, moved in on one of the groups and popped an aux battery. Then I threw down a gravity well, and took pot shots at them as they tried to escape. If any of them survived, I just cloaked, circled around and did it again. Simple and easy. I didn't die once.
Despite this, it was still kind of long and boring. There's no difference between the waves, its just a long slugging match and while some players do like that, its somewhat of an aquired taste and new players probably don't want it. Sadly, my first experiance is probably more true of what a new player should expect. By my second, I was well used to the game and knew what to expect. Simply put, if you know what you're doing the mission is not hard but it is long. If you don't know what you're doing, you're in the long haul. Better hope you got some good loot in the missions leading up to it.
Time for a little math review, Cryptic: A typical battle group, assuming you're going solo, consists of one of the following: 7 fighters, 3 fighters and 1 frigate, 3 frigates, or 1 escort/curiser/science ship/battleship. Each of the three waves in Candle in a Huricane consists of three groups: one contains 2 escorts and 2 frigates, one contains 3 escorts, and the final one contains 1 frigate, 1 escort, and 1 battleship.
So in a single wave, you encounter 3 frigates, 6 escorts, and 1 battleship. That's the same as facing eight different battle groups. Add all three waves together and you get a grand total of: 9 frigates, 18 escorts, and 3 battleships, which is equivalent to twenty-four battle groups.
TWENTY... FRIGGIN... FOUR!
And your reinforcements? A bunch of Reshirts... er... shuttles. I'll give you credit, Cryptic, for making them not attack you all at once, which would make the mission borderline impossible. But it's almost no consolation in the sheer amount of frustration.
This mission is not fun. It's hard, tedious, and boring.
That is how a Romulan mind would approach this battle.
Also you need to draw one or two ships away from the group, kill those and go draw a few more out and you can do this one ship at a time if you do it right.
The way to start this fight is to cloak right after you are told ships are incoming and the beginning of the battle, and remain cloaked until they all settle in pounding on the station. They can not destroy the station even if you just sit there and let them shoot at it for hours and hours so don't worry about that at all, you can not fail the mission because the station blows up it just does not happen.
So once they are all settled into pounding on the station go up and start your cloak, decloak strategy and whittle them down one or two ships at a time.
That doesn't stop it from being tedious as hell.
The Elachi are under orders to "pacify" the Republic soonest, probably because their masters know what still lies beneath the surface of Mol'Rihan/Dewa III. They're not coming at you as a "battle group" - they're coming at you as an exterminating force. It's your job to make them fail.
From an in-character perspective this is true, but from an out of character one (The one that most people are approaching this from.) That means less than nothing. Unless you believe that the Elachi are actually running the game, what they want and how they go about it is entierly down to how the mission is set to go. Moreover, it is a mission that is supposed to be fun, which it is clearly lacking to a lot of people here. Now, I'm not going to say that I am one of them. In my second run through, I didn't have much trouble. Nevertheless, I can see where people are coming from and to address the point from an in-character perspective is rather like missing it all together.