The Galaxy was never a carrier in canon, nor was it portrayed to launch attack craft. Slapping a hangar on this ship due to lack of ideas and creativity is plain & simply wrong.
People usually follow at least a great portion of the debate before saying things like "Great. Done.", so when they do, they are sure it's been called upon and valid.
If you followed the discussion in this thread, you'd find out that the majority of the persistent posters in this thread does not want to turn the Galaxy class into a battleship.
Personally, in about 90% of my posts in this thread I'm trying to turn the attention that a fix for the Galaxy is a fix for the engineering/tank role in STO, which would benefit not only the Galaxy class, but the game as a whole. The CE event was a nice example, I could bring on my Galaxy (it's a highly tanking build) with confidence and walk out with 1-st place on more than a few ocassions because the ship was good in her role. Unfortunately, these kind of balanced instances in STO are still rather limited. I sincerely hope that they'll pick the CE example and start adjusting the other portions of the game.
Because as it is for now "The galaxy is an engineering cruiser with no equal." in STO means exactly the same as being the best fisherman in Sahara.
I'm saying out of all cannon ships she's the most likely to serve as the carrier. Should she be one in sto, maybe, maybe not. not for or against it. and again where did the fighters launch from? Not many have Galaxy's hanger space.
Some here don't want a tac orient ship for the Galaxy R. fine my solution then fitsbest, all universal BO slots, the ship would be more in line with cannon. ANd will make her a buyable ship since people can arange her how they like.
- Nebula Class BOFF/Console Layout:
Class wise it would make sense but since the T5 Nebula Class is a Science vessel i am not so sure
about it.
i do personally like the nebula's "balanced" boff layout, especially for the galaxy.
but as the galaxy is a cruiser.. how about like the nebula boff layout, but have the commander, ensign science, switch with the lt. commander engineering?
then take the fourth science console and give it to tac?
- D'Deridex Warbird BOFF/Console Layout:
The classic Counterpart to the Galaxy Class, having it's BOFF/Console Layout would be nice but since it isn't even a Federation ship, i don't know.
the more i look at it.. the more i like its boff layout for the galaxy then reversed nebula.
- D'Kora and Galor Class BOFF/Console Layout:
Same as above.
as much as i love the the galor and its boff layout (cardassian ships are my favorite.. if only i could afford it lol), it feels a bit to tac oriented for the galaxy. but that is just me :P
- Ambassador BOFF/Console Layout:
Would be nice too, but just as the D'Kora it doesn't have a universal BOFF slot. If i had to choose
between those two BOFF/Console Layouts i would go with the D'Kora. (just my Personal opinion)
already got myself the ambassador, so i personally wouldn't want to have another ship with the same layout on my fed character. but it is still a nice layout
- Regent Class BOFF/Console Layout:
The only Problem i see here is that the Regent is like the Galaxy -R a C-Store ship. Ok it wouldn't have
the 180degrees Quantum Torpedo Launcher, so it would be a yes/no question for Cryptics Bosses.
Personally this would be my Favourite, since the Fleet Regent has even a better Console Layout and
other bonuses, i think it wouldn't be too much of a problem.
same as my reason for the galor, but i do understand what you mean.
I always found it unbearable to see a Ferengi Marauder and first and foremost a Galor Class being tactical far superior to a Galaxy Class in STO. Seriously i feel that as a personaly insult.
^very true.
anyways. i think this a pretty good idea, having a mirror universe galaxy
a hanger would not be a fix to the galaxy's issues, even though the main shuttle bay is HUGE, and worthy of 2 hanger slots.
Yeah, that is pretty much common knowledge. The Galaxy class had a pretty big shuttle bay and while it may be "worthy of 2 hangar slots" as you say, I don't think it will bring anything good for the ship, it will essentialy turn it into something it never was.
not really, as much as it wasnt depicted as such on screen, theres a reference to a galaxy carrier refit somewhere.
Not in canon, as in canon being Star Trek shows. We have never seen the Galaxy class work as a carrier. There are references for all kinds of stuff somewhere out there, in soft canon or fanfiction. There's even a book about mixing Star Trek and Dr.Who. I hope this doesn't mean that we should get a Tardis in STO.
a lot of them being rpers & escort jocks.
my idea of allowing boff layouts to be swapped out for different ones side steps that issue completely.
Well, I'm not an escort jock and I don't want the Galaxy being turned into a battleship.
I only have 2 escorts out of which I'm more actively using only one lately - the T'Varo if it can be considered as somewhat escort-y ship. All my other ships are cruisers. I just want the Galaxy's role to have a place in this game again, that would make her very usefull.
and a full team of that would probably to a net effective dps of zero. not to mention that you could win ce by spamming heals even when not needed.
I hope you realize that if the balance and classes in this game worked as they were suposed to, a full team of anythings shouldn't be able to win anything. The current state is broken and I prefer looking to fix this issue so it can benefit the whole game and contribute to the longetivity of STO, rather than just making everything completely tactically oriented, the unfortunate route that Crytpic obviously decided to take as of late.
So if they would make a Mirror Galaxy Class which BOFF/console Layout should it get?
Sorry, had to cut the larger portion of your post because of length. I get what you're aiming for, just wanted to add my 2 cents that I don't believe that there will ever be a mirror version of the Galaxy. They don't make mirror versions of the C-Store ships, just out of free ones.
I don't know how Cryptic intends to fix the Galaxy, something I've been hearing a lot about lately - that the Galaxy-R could be enhanced when the fleet Galaxy-X is brought to holodeck, but I don't think they'll do it by making it obtainable as a mirror ship from a lockbox.
I'm saying out of all cannon ships she's the most likely to serve as the carrier. Should she be one in sto, maybe, maybe not. not for or against it. and again where did the fighters launch from? Not many have Galaxy's hanger space.
Like I mentioned when I quoted dontdrunkimshoot post, I realize that the Galaxy class has a big shuttle bay and that it's most likely to serve as a carrier. But, the Galaxy had a shuttle bay. If it was suposed to work as/be a carrier they'd call it a hangar bay.
I don't want to see the Galaxy become a carrier in STO, bacause not only that would be a prime example that the devs. are running out of creative ideas fast, but I also believe it would ruin the experience of having this ship even more for everyone that loves and is a fan of the Galaxy class. People that loved the Galaxy would like to have the ship they've seen in Star Trek, not some carrier type with a Galaxy skin that launches attack craft.
Personally, if the Galaxy receives a hangar, a cloaking device or any other nonsensical enhancement for what it's worth, I wouldn't even poke it with a stick. I'm a Star Trek fan and that would feel wrong to me.
Some here don't want a tac orient ship for the Galaxy R. fine my solution then fitsbest, all universal BO slots, the ship would be more in line with cannon. ANd will make her a buyable ship since people can arange her how they like.
With all due respect, nothing personal here and I'm not trying to be obnoxious, just stating my honest opinion, but I believe this to be one of the worst ideas about fixing the Galaxy.
If the Galaxy recieves a full universal Boff slot layout, two things will happen:
- The raider class of the KDF is finally without any doubt dead.
- Almost all if not in fact all of the cruisers are rendered obsolete.
Regarding the "Galaxy carrier" idea, according to the technical manual (which I know isn't canon, although according to hard-canon we never saw shuttle bay 1 and don't know how big or small it was) the Ent-D had a complement of 10 basic shuttlecraft, 5 dedicated craft (probably runabouts) and a couple of workbees. If you put everyone's beloved "attack fighters" in there which are bigger than shuttles, you won't get THAT huge wings of fighters everyone wants to see. Of course it's no issue in STO but I'd say "meh". The Galaxy isn't a carrier. Not only because there are no freaking carriers in Star Trek but also her design wouldn't support that.
But I don't agree with dontdrunkimshot in the regard that the Gal is the "weakest" ship of all. It's just missing a peak damage ability because that's what pushes those numbers. I'm doing 5000-6000 "dps" (okay maybe around 5 without FAW spam) in a MkXI phaser equipped Gal-R (depends on how dedicated I play, most of the time it's not very much ) - that's quite decent pressure damage. Would BO be an ENG skill it'd allow to plant a few 8-12k criticals in there which wouldn't look all that bad, wouldn't it? Besides, like others said, there's really no reason why BO shouldn't be ENG based as cruisers ARE ships that are intented to use beams, yet almost all f them are unable to take advantage of that.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
the galaxy class isnt a carrier so much as its a warp capable starbase that wile in orbit could serve as a colonies orbital traffic center. having the square feet to single handedly be a safe harbor for an entire colony evacuation, or migration. seriously, its huge, like the entire deck 4 is a big oval shuttle bay.
or, they could stuff it full of fighters, like they apparently did during the dominion war when it was thousands of ships fighting and they were using the kitchen sink strategy.
this is not a typical thing a galaxy would carry, if theres something a galaxy classe's own weapons couldn't handle, no number of near harmless fighters would be of much help. its kinda funny how harmless and easy to kill fighters are in game, thats about right really. they can kill npcs pretty well, but there 0 threat to a player ship. its the ones with sci powers that are a threat in game.
id rather the galaxy did not receive a hanger. in this case, every ship might as well have one, and thats the last thing id like to see.
the galaxy class isnt a carrier so much as its a warp capable starbase that wile in orbit could serve as a colonies orbital traffic center. having the square feet to single handedly be a safe harbor for an entire colony evacuation, or migration. seriously, its huge, like the entire deck 4 is a big oval shuttle bay.
or, they could stuff it full of fighters, like they apparently did during the dominion war when it was thousands of ships fighting and they were using the kitchen sink strategy.
this is not a typical thing a galaxy would carry, if theres something a galaxy classe's own weapons couldn't handle, no number of near harmless fighters would be of much help. its kinda funny how harmless and easy to kill fighters are in game, thats about right really. they can kill npcs pretty well, but there 0 threat to a player ship. its the ones with sci powers that are a threat in game.
id rather the galaxy did not receive a hanger. in this case, every ship might as well have one, and thats the last thing id like to see.
Very true indeed.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
this is not a typical thing a galaxy would carry, if theres something a galaxy classe's own weapons couldn't handle, no number of near harmless fighters would be of much help. its kinda funny how harmless and easy to kill fighters are in game, thats about right really. they can kill npcs pretty well, but there 0 threat to a player ship. its the ones with sci powers that are a threat in game.
That's something I'd like everyone to read repeatedly It sums up how out of place those fighters are and what makes them worthwhile are sci abilities which were better placed on auxilliary shuttlecraft which wouldn't require "carriers" in the first place.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Yeah, that is pretty much common knowledge. The Galaxy class had a pretty big shuttle bay and while it may be "worthy of 2 hangar slots" as you say, I don't think it will bring anything good for the ship, it will essentialy turn it into something it never was.
Not in canon, as in canon being Star Trek shows. We have never seen the Galaxy class work as a carrier. There are references for all kinds of stuff somewhere out there, in soft canon or fanfiction. There's even a book about mixing Star Trek and Dr.Who. I hope this doesn't mean that we should get a Tardis in STO.
Well, I'm not an escort jock and I don't want the Galaxy being turned into a battleship.
I only have 2 escorts out of which I'm more actively using only one lately - the T'Varo if it can be considered as somewhat escort-y ship. All my other ships are cruisers. I just want the Galaxy's role to have a place in this game again, that would make her very usefull.
I hope you realize that if the balance and classes in this game worked as they were suposed to, a full team of anythings shouldn't be able to win anything. The current state is broken and I prefer looking to fix this issue so it can benefit the whole game and contribute to the longetivity of STO, rather than just making everything completely tactically oriented, the unfortunate route that Crytpic obviously decided to take as of late.
Sorry, had to cut the larger portion of your post because of length. I get what you're aiming for, just wanted to add my 2 cents that I don't believe that there will ever be a mirror version of the Galaxy. They don't make mirror versions of the C-Store ships, just out of free ones.
I don't know how Cryptic intends to fix the Galaxy, something I've been hearing a lot about lately - that the Galaxy-R could be enhanced when the fleet Galaxy-X is brought to holodeck, but I don't think they'll do it by making it obtainable as a mirror ship from a lockbox.
Like I mentioned when I quoted dontdrunkimshoot post, I realize that the Galaxy class has a big shuttle bay and that it's most likely to serve as a carrier. But, the Galaxy had a shuttle bay. If it was suposed to work as/be a carrier they'd call it a hangar bay.
I don't want to see the Galaxy become a carrier in STO, bacause not only that would be a prime example that the devs. are running out of creative ideas fast, but I also believe it would ruin the experience of having this ship even more for everyone that loves and is a fan of the Galaxy class. People that loved the Galaxy would like to have the ship they've seen in Star Trek, not some carrier type with a Galaxy skin that launches attack craft.
Personally, if the Galaxy receives a hangar, a cloaking device or any other nonsensical enhancement for what it's worth, I wouldn't even poke it with a stick. I'm a Star Trek fan and that would feel wrong to me.
With all due respect, nothing personal here and I'm not trying to be obnoxious, just stating my honest opinion, but I believe this to be one of the worst ideas about fixing the Galaxy.
If the Galaxy recieves a full universal Boff slot layout, two things will happen:
- The raider class of the KDF is finally without any doubt dead.
- Almost all if not in fact all of the cruisers are rendered obsolete.
This won't be good and it will create riots.
IF they have a Mirror Gal X then there's a Mirror gal. I thought I saw one at somepoint, heck there's a mirror Odyessy.
My idea would NOT render the KDF reaiders obsolete for they are the ONLY KDF ships with that set up. I'm only asking for ONE ship and Zen ship at that. And otehr crusier would not be obsolete for why has it not happen to the KDF side.
I would not like to see the Galaxy used as a carrier either
I would rather it recieve a tactical bridge layout equal to the other races large ships
It could be marketed as the upgraded Galaxy seen in the second encounter with the borg with the new firepower and defenses A Mk-II
And sold as a new ship so cryptic makes some cash
Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
even if that would not fix the galaxy x and galaxy refit problem, i am good with the idea that they are given hangar ( seem logical since the size and shuttle bay capacity of the ship ).
and i will have a nerdgasm when i will be able to see my ship with 2 or 3 runabout flying alongside ( just like the odyssey ).
but i think that what cryptic should do next is categorize these so called carrier.
i don't known much about carrier ship in game, but my idea, if that isn't already there is to limit the weapons, and power of pet of non true carrier ship.
if the galaxy were given a hangar for example it would not be able to equiped with advanced runabout, no tractor beam, no sci power, just regular phaser and torpedo.
that not just for the galaxy but all ship who have been given hangar and that are not meant for that in the first place ( meaning not true carrier ).
concerning BO power as engineer, i am not for it, while you see it as an increase in firepower for cruiser i see it as a decrease in tanking abilitie ( bo3 is a lt commander power )
that is good if you only do pve, but can be dangerous in pvp.
what i would love tho, is the transfert of tractor beam to engineering, it will give more value to ensign engi slot, while give more abilitie to tank with the free sci slot
...
concerning BO power as engineer, i am not for it, while you see it as an increase in firepower for cruiser i see it as a decrease in tanking abilitie ( bo3 is a lt commander power )
that is good if you only do pve, but can be dangerous in pvp.
It would make all Cruisers more versatile, as they should have been in the first place. They actuall could draw benefit from their extreme engineering focussed BOFF slots.
Cruisers could Choose between being more "tanky" or having a bit more Firepower, i don't see a problem with it. Of course at first everyone one will use it, but some will change it back later if they begin to realize their cruiser isn't so tanky at all sometimes.
The point is that it would give players the chance to decide how to play their cruiser. More options = Better
On the other hand Escorts wouldn't be able to have stronger Beam arrays than huge cruisers, but still having strong Cannon weapons.
As someone already said, giving the Galaxy -R one or two Hangar slots wouldn't solve the core problem of this Ship in STO.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Just thinking....
Escorts get Dual Cannons and Dual Heavy Cannons...
Science Vessels get all TSS1 Powers...
What do Cruisers get?
More power would be my obvious choice, but since Cryptic made all Warp cores availlable to all ship types...
Maybe Crusiers could get some additionaly Power. Giving the Odyssey and Galaxy the biggest amount (FED side).
What do you think?
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
It would make all Cruisers more versatile, as they should have been in the first place. They actuall could draw benefit from their extreme engineering focussed BOFF slots.
Cruisers could Choose between being more "tanky" or having a bit more Firepower, i don't see a problem with it. Of course at first everyone one will use it, but some will change it back later if they begin to realize their cruiser isn't so tanky at all sometimes.
The point is that it would give players the chance to decide how to play their cruiser. More options = Better
i am not agree with that statement, it will not make them more versatile, it is the countrary.
if you remove BO from tact abilitie, it mean that if you want to use them , you will sacrifice your taking abilities.
so it is either one OR the other, not both at the same time, as it is currently possible from many cruiser in the game right now ( odyssey, exelsior, regent to name a few ).
think about it, if BO is a engi abiliti it mean that you will not be able to slot BO1 in a tact slot for example.
so you are creating a dilema where there was none before, that a loss not a gain.
to resume, if you want to have a spike damage abiliti, you will have to do it at the lost of a tanking abilitie, if you want to keep your tanking abilities it is at the expense of beam power option.
that is not more options, it is less.
Just thinking....
Escorts get Dual Cannons and Dual Heavy Cannons...
Science Vessels get all TSS1 Powers...
What do Cruisers get?
More power would be my obvious choice, but since Cryptic made all Warp cores availlable to all ship types...
Maybe Crusiers could get some additionaly Power. Giving the Odyssey and Galaxy the biggest amount (FED side).
What do you think?
there is indeed something lacking here in the cruiser department, you are right, something must be found to correct that.
some will argue that the galaxy x have the abilitie to mount DHC but even with 3 rcs purple console and auxtobat build it is not as efficient as escort to use them ( i have test it since LOR launch ).
the science ship also have better shield than all ship in the game.
more power to cruiser, what do you mean? more power level? i don't think it would be as decisive as DHC or tss1, maybe cruiser should get clikable power.
but what, that is the question.
maybe drunk got the answer
i am not agree with that statement, it will not make them more versatile, it is the countrary.
if you remove BO from tact abilitie, it mean that if you want to use them , you will sacrifice your taking abilities.
so it is either one OR the other, not both at the same time, as it is currently possible from many cruiser in the game right now ( odyssey, exelsior, regent to name a few ).
think about it, if BO is a engi abiliti it mean that you will not be able to slot BO1 in a tact slot for example.
so you are creating a dilema where there was none before, that a loss not a gain.
to resume, if you want to have a spike damage abiliti, you will have to do it at the lost of a tanking abilitie, if you want to keep your tanking abilities it is at the expense of beam power option.
that is not more options, it is less.
Pure Cruiser Get 1x Engineering CMDR and at least 1x Engineering Lieutenant (Engineering overkill IMO).
Do you really think that sacrificing one single Power would have such a dramatic impact?
I don't.
All cruisers would benefit from it, because they are Cruisers (engineering focused ships in STO), not because they are tac heavy ships.
There are more than enough useful tactical Power in STO already. Beam Overload should have been an Engineering power from the start IMHO.
there is indeed something lacking here in the cruiser department, you are right, something must be found to correct that.
some will argue that the galaxy x have the abilitie to mount DHC but even with 3 rcs purple console and auxtobat build it is not as efficient as escort to use them ( i have test it since LOR launch ).
the science ship also have better shield than all ship in the game.
more power to cruiser, what do you mean? more power level? i don't think it would be as decisive as DHC or tss1, maybe cruiser should get clikable power.
but what, that is the question.
maybe drunk got the answer
- - - So say we all - - -
(oh wait... wrong francise, damn... )
Yes my first though would have been to increase Cruisers overall Power by a certain amount, but i think it wouldn't have such a big influence than being able to equip DHCs for instance.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
i came here during F2P I personally I don't like the classification system they got on here like tactical officers are best with tactical ship Engineers are best with cruiser etc.
Bull I'm a tactical officer on the Federation side but I choose cruiser class ship mainly because of watching the main star trek series involving the Enterprise(constitution class,Galaxy/X class and the sovereign class) itself and i feel that cruiser class ships should be just as they were in the series and movies.
Couple thoughts based on some of the recent posts.
Escorts and one or two cruisers mount cannons. But everyone can mount beam arrays and turrets. How about an overloaded beam array that is only slottable on a cruiser? Make it like the Defiant quad leveless purple cannon. One per ship.
Also for those thinking to turn ships into carriers. How about a compromise. Instead of adding hangars to ships, have hangars be weapons. You want to launch fighters give up a weapon slot.
What do you all think?
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Couple thoughts based on some of the recent posts.
Escorts and one or two cruisers mount cannons. But everyone can mount beam arrays and turrets. How about an overloaded beam array that is only slottable on a cruiser? Make it like the Defiant quad leveless purple cannon. One per ship.
Also for those thinking to turn ships into carriers. How about a compromise. Instead of adding hangars to ships, have hangars be weapons. You want to launch fighters give up a weapon slot.
What do you all think?
Why is everyone obsessed with having a carrier?
Seriously i don't get it.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Why is everyone obsessed with having a carrier?
Seriously i don't get it.
I can't speak for anyone but myself. I use an Atrox. I have a dreadnaught, all three Oddessys, all three Vespas. I did not find any of them fit my science captain very well. The Atrox had the durability of a cruiser with the science bridge officer layout I was hoping for.
It is the carrier of the fleet, so it has some distinction. My observations make me think that because of game mechanics fighters work very well for some people. My recommendation of using weapon points as fighter hangars is from what I am reading here, people seem to want to put hangars on every ship. If they want to slap a hangar on every ship, then add one or two to every ship that is already a carrier.
However you did not mention your thoughts on the beam array.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Mirror event the boss ship is a Mirror Galaxy X, during a tholian mission you blow up a Mirror Oydessy
Oh, you ment those....but they have nothing to do with the point I was trying to make. Those are the ships NPCs use. I was referring to a player controlled mirror Galaxy. That won't happen because the Galaxy is a Zen purchase and they make mirror versions for the lockboxes only out of free ships. To me the whole idea of these mirror ships in lockboxes is meh, but whatever.
The point was - Cryptic won't make a mirror C-Store ship and put it in a lockbox because it's not in their best interest to allow an item that costs 20/25$ become availible for doing a fragment of the "Tour the Universe" event through the exchange.
It is the carrier of the fleet, so it has some distinction. My observations make me think that because of game mechanics fighters work very well for some people. My recommendation of using weapon points as fighter hangars is from what I am reading here, people seem to want to put hangars on every ship. If they want to slap a hangar on every ship, then add one or two to every ship that is already a carrier.
In Star Trek carriers aren't the Center of a fleet like nowadays. The biggest and strongest combat ships (speak Galaxy, Odyssey etc.) are.
Maybe it's just me but i never was a fan of Carrier ships. for me they are just mobile airfields. Beingf out of range of my enemy and having hundeds of fighters attacking a virtually defenceless target (WWII tactics) is cowardly in my eyes.
No, i want my ship go face to face the enemy and fight it directly untill i can wear my enemy down.
However you did not mention your thoughts on the beam array.
I think it's a very good idea. Cruisers should profit from using Beam weapons much more in general.
I think one of those Overload Beam Weapons would be ok per ship. Maybe having it's Damage output directly related to the ships size, so the bigger the ship = more powerful Beam array.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Oh, you ment those....but they have nothing to do with the point I was trying to make. Those are the ships NPCs use. I was referring to a player controlled mirror Galaxy. That won't happen because the Galaxy is a Zen purchase and they make mirror versions for the lockboxes only out of free ships. To me the whole idea of these mirror ships in lockboxes is meh, but whatever.
The point was - Cryptic won't make a mirror C-Store ship and put it in a lockbox because it's not in their best interest to allow an item that costs 20/25$ become availible for doing a fragment of the "Tour the Universe" event through the exchange.
I'm not sure about that. There is the Mirror Vor'Cha Battlecruiser on the Klingon side of things, it's basically the free version ("free" since the exchange is flooded with those things because poor TRIBBLE spent lots of cash on those boxes appearantly) of the Vor'Cha Retrofit, a C-Store ship. There's the free T4 variant but it's the same with the Galaxy class.
EDIT: About the carriers, I get them partly. I mean having pets to command and fight is a nice feature in a game. I do however not get why so many people insist of carriers being put in Star Trek, the ONLY sci-fi franchise that clearly never showed starifghters and carriers on-screen as their combat was originally inspired by submarine duels (TOS) and later by 18th century naval battles (TNG), a uniique characteristic I very much enjoy and love about Star Trek.
I do however have a (Mirror) Vo'Quv carrier on my Klingon char which I play from time to time, though I don't treat it as a carrier. It's a "command ship" in my little lore serving as a mobile outpost/troop transport (because of the huge crew number) which is accompanied by two wings of (cloaked) B'Rel raiders that decloak once "summoned". If they had treated "carriers" as such vessels who are able to let their "pets" warp-in instead of being "carried" (even the huge Galactica... er Vo'Quv can't fit B'Rels in her) I wouldn't oppose them as much. I'd even be fine with those stupid peregrines if those "fighters" would be uncontrollable reinforcements akin to a special attack that warp-in, attack a single target and disable/cripple it and warp-out again.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
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I'm not sure about that. There is the Mirror Vor'Cha Battlecruiser on the Klingon side of things, it's basically the free version ("free" since the exchange is flooded with those things because poor TRIBBLE spent lots of cash on those boxes appearantly) of the Vor'Cha Retrofit, a C-Store ship. There's the free T4 variant but it's the same with the Galaxy class.
Actually, you just proved my point.
The Mirror Vor'cha is the counterpart of the Vor'cha Retrofit - which is a free ship for the KDF availible at Brigadeer General level(lvl 40).
The C-Store one is the Vor'Kang, which is a refit of the standard Vor'cha, a ship availible at Captain(lvl 30) for the KDF.
So no, Cryptic have never made a mirror version of a C-Store ship and I firmly believe they never will.
Why is everyone obsessed with having a carrier?
Seriously i don't get it.
I don't get it either. You want carriers? Go play BSGO.
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I do not recall seeing so much as one in any show or movie.
That being said, the existance of fighters or equivalants.
The Peregrine (fighter) if I am not mistaken was shown as a courier ship the maquis liked to arm and use for raiding.
Similarly Runabouts are armed and were used to draw fire from the Jem'hadar from the Oddysey.
And for the third example, Data in Insurrection twice uses a shuttle to harrass/damage a sona'a ship.
So fighters have canonically been shown to have some effect.
Based on what was shown it should be like the power siphon drones. An annoyance but not something that kills a starship by itself. There fore a carrier is actually not something they would likely use in space combat. (on the other hand using it for precision fights in an atmosphere like they recently created I can see shuttles/fighters being used.)
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Comments
I'm saying out of all cannon ships she's the most likely to serve as the carrier. Should she be one in sto, maybe, maybe not. not for or against it. and again where did the fighters launch from? Not many have Galaxy's hanger space.
Some here don't want a tac orient ship for the Galaxy R. fine my solution then fitsbest, all universal BO slots, the ship would be more in line with cannon. ANd will make her a buyable ship since people can arange her how they like.
but as the galaxy is a cruiser.. how about like the nebula boff layout, but have the commander, ensign science, switch with the lt. commander engineering?
then take the fourth science console and give it to tac? the more i look at it.. the more i like its boff layout for the galaxy then reversed nebula. as much as i love the the galor and its boff layout (cardassian ships are my favorite.. if only i could afford it lol), it feels a bit to tac oriented for the galaxy. but that is just me :P already got myself the ambassador, so i personally wouldn't want to have another ship with the same layout on my fed character. but it is still a nice layout same as my reason for the galor, but i do understand what you mean.
^very true.
anyways. i think this a pretty good idea, having a mirror universe galaxy
Yeah, that is pretty much common knowledge. The Galaxy class had a pretty big shuttle bay and while it may be "worthy of 2 hangar slots" as you say, I don't think it will bring anything good for the ship, it will essentialy turn it into something it never was.
Not in canon, as in canon being Star Trek shows. We have never seen the Galaxy class work as a carrier. There are references for all kinds of stuff somewhere out there, in soft canon or fanfiction. There's even a book about mixing Star Trek and Dr.Who. I hope this doesn't mean that we should get a Tardis in STO.
Well, I'm not an escort jock and I don't want the Galaxy being turned into a battleship.
I only have 2 escorts out of which I'm more actively using only one lately - the T'Varo if it can be considered as somewhat escort-y ship. All my other ships are cruisers. I just want the Galaxy's role to have a place in this game again, that would make her very usefull.
I hope you realize that if the balance and classes in this game worked as they were suposed to, a full team of anythings shouldn't be able to win anything. The current state is broken and I prefer looking to fix this issue so it can benefit the whole game and contribute to the longetivity of STO, rather than just making everything completely tactically oriented, the unfortunate route that Crytpic obviously decided to take as of late.
Sorry, had to cut the larger portion of your post because of length. I get what you're aiming for, just wanted to add my 2 cents that I don't believe that there will ever be a mirror version of the Galaxy. They don't make mirror versions of the C-Store ships, just out of free ones.
I don't know how Cryptic intends to fix the Galaxy, something I've been hearing a lot about lately - that the Galaxy-R could be enhanced when the fleet Galaxy-X is brought to holodeck, but I don't think they'll do it by making it obtainable as a mirror ship from a lockbox.
Like I mentioned when I quoted dontdrunkimshoot post, I realize that the Galaxy class has a big shuttle bay and that it's most likely to serve as a carrier. But, the Galaxy had a shuttle bay. If it was suposed to work as/be a carrier they'd call it a hangar bay.
I don't want to see the Galaxy become a carrier in STO, bacause not only that would be a prime example that the devs. are running out of creative ideas fast, but I also believe it would ruin the experience of having this ship even more for everyone that loves and is a fan of the Galaxy class. People that loved the Galaxy would like to have the ship they've seen in Star Trek, not some carrier type with a Galaxy skin that launches attack craft.
Personally, if the Galaxy receives a hangar, a cloaking device or any other nonsensical enhancement for what it's worth, I wouldn't even poke it with a stick. I'm a Star Trek fan and that would feel wrong to me.
With all due respect, nothing personal here and I'm not trying to be obnoxious, just stating my honest opinion, but I believe this to be one of the worst ideas about fixing the Galaxy.
If the Galaxy recieves a full universal Boff slot layout, two things will happen:
- The raider class of the KDF is finally without any doubt dead.
- Almost all if not in fact all of the cruisers are rendered obsolete.
This won't be good and it will create riots.
But I don't agree with dontdrunkimshot in the regard that the Gal is the "weakest" ship of all. It's just missing a peak damage ability because that's what pushes those numbers. I'm doing 5000-6000 "dps" (okay maybe around 5 without FAW spam) in a MkXI phaser equipped Gal-R (depends on how dedicated I play, most of the time it's not very much
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http://images.wikia.com/startrek/images/0/02/Shuttlebay%2C_main_%28deck_4%29%2C_Galaxy-class.jpg
or, they could stuff it full of fighters, like they apparently did during the dominion war when it was thousands of ships fighting and they were using the kitchen sink strategy.
this is not a typical thing a galaxy would carry, if theres something a galaxy classe's own weapons couldn't handle, no number of near harmless fighters would be of much help. its kinda funny how harmless and easy to kill fighters are in game, thats about right really. they can kill npcs pretty well, but there 0 threat to a player ship. its the ones with sci powers that are a threat in game.
id rather the galaxy did not receive a hanger. in this case, every ship might as well have one, and thats the last thing id like to see.
That's something I'd like everyone to read repeatedly
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IF they have a Mirror Gal X then there's a Mirror gal. I thought I saw one at somepoint, heck there's a mirror Odyessy.
My idea would NOT render the KDF reaiders obsolete for they are the ONLY KDF ships with that set up. I'm only asking for ONE ship and Zen ship at that. And otehr crusier would not be obsolete for why has it not happen to the KDF side.
*scratches head*.......what?!? :eek:
I would rather it recieve a tactical bridge layout equal to the other races large ships
It could be marketed as the upgraded Galaxy seen in the second encounter with the borg with the new firepower and defenses A Mk-II
And sold as a new ship so cryptic makes some cash
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
and i will have a nerdgasm when i will be able to see my ship with 2 or 3 runabout flying alongside ( just like the odyssey ).
but i think that what cryptic should do next is categorize these so called carrier.
i don't known much about carrier ship in game, but my idea, if that isn't already there is to limit the weapons, and power of pet of non true carrier ship.
if the galaxy were given a hangar for example it would not be able to equiped with advanced runabout, no tractor beam, no sci power, just regular phaser and torpedo.
that not just for the galaxy but all ship who have been given hangar and that are not meant for that in the first place ( meaning not true carrier ).
concerning BO power as engineer, i am not for it, while you see it as an increase in firepower for cruiser i see it as a decrease in tanking abilitie ( bo3 is a lt commander power )
that is good if you only do pve, but can be dangerous in pvp.
what i would love tho, is the transfert of tractor beam to engineering, it will give more value to ensign engi slot, while give more abilitie to tank with the free sci slot
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
It would make all Cruisers more versatile, as they should have been in the first place. They actuall could draw benefit from their extreme engineering focussed BOFF slots.
Cruisers could Choose between being more "tanky" or having a bit more Firepower, i don't see a problem with it. Of course at first everyone one will use it, but some will change it back later if they begin to realize their cruiser isn't so tanky at all sometimes.
The point is that it would give players the chance to decide how to play their cruiser.
More options = Better
On the other hand Escorts wouldn't be able to have stronger Beam arrays than huge cruisers, but still having strong Cannon weapons.
As someone already said, giving the Galaxy -R one or two Hangar slots wouldn't solve the core problem of this Ship in STO.
Escorts get Dual Cannons and Dual Heavy Cannons...
Science Vessels get all TSS1 Powers...
What do Cruisers get?
More power would be my obvious choice, but since Cryptic made all Warp cores availlable to all ship types...
Maybe Crusiers could get some additionaly Power. Giving the Odyssey and Galaxy the biggest amount (FED side).
What do you think?
i am not agree with that statement, it will not make them more versatile, it is the countrary.
if you remove BO from tact abilitie, it mean that if you want to use them , you will sacrifice your taking abilities.
so it is either one OR the other, not both at the same time, as it is currently possible from many cruiser in the game right now ( odyssey, exelsior, regent to name a few ).
think about it, if BO is a engi abiliti it mean that you will not be able to slot BO1 in a tact slot for example.
so you are creating a dilema where there was none before, that a loss not a gain.
to resume, if you want to have a spike damage abiliti, you will have to do it at the lost of a tanking abilitie, if you want to keep your tanking abilities it is at the expense of beam power option.
that is not more options, it is less.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
there is indeed something lacking here in the cruiser department, you are right, something must be found to correct that.
some will argue that the galaxy x have the abilitie to mount DHC but even with 3 rcs purple console and auxtobat build it is not as efficient as escort to use them ( i have test it since LOR launch ).
the science ship also have better shield than all ship in the game.
more power to cruiser, what do you mean? more power level? i don't think it would be as decisive as DHC or tss1, maybe cruiser should get clikable power.
but what, that is the question.
maybe drunk got the answer
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
Pure Cruiser Get 1x Engineering CMDR and at least 1x Engineering Lieutenant (Engineering overkill IMO).
Do you really think that sacrificing one single Power would have such a dramatic impact?
I don't.
All cruisers would benefit from it, because they are Cruisers (engineering focused ships in STO), not because they are tac heavy ships.
There are more than enough useful tactical Power in STO already. Beam Overload should have been an Engineering power from the start IMHO.
- - - So say we all - - -
(oh wait... wrong francise, damn...
Yes my first though would have been to increase Cruisers overall Power by a certain amount, but i think it wouldn't have such a big influence than being able to equip DHCs for instance.
Bull I'm a tactical officer on the Federation side but I choose cruiser class ship mainly because of watching the main star trek series involving the Enterprise(constitution class,Galaxy/X class and the sovereign class) itself and i feel that cruiser class ships should be just as they were in the series and movies.
Escorts and one or two cruisers mount cannons. But everyone can mount beam arrays and turrets. How about an overloaded beam array that is only slottable on a cruiser? Make it like the Defiant quad leveless purple cannon. One per ship.
Also for those thinking to turn ships into carriers. How about a compromise. Instead of adding hangars to ships, have hangars be weapons. You want to launch fighters give up a weapon slot.
What do you all think?
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Seriously i don't get it.
+1.
Mark me confused and unimpressed as well.
I can't speak for anyone but myself. I use an Atrox. I have a dreadnaught, all three Oddessys, all three Vespas. I did not find any of them fit my science captain very well. The Atrox had the durability of a cruiser with the science bridge officer layout I was hoping for.
It is the carrier of the fleet, so it has some distinction. My observations make me think that because of game mechanics fighters work very well for some people. My recommendation of using weapon points as fighter hangars is from what I am reading here, people seem to want to put hangars on every ship. If they want to slap a hangar on every ship, then add one or two to every ship that is already a carrier.
However you did not mention your thoughts on the beam array.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
Mirror event the boss ship is a Mirror Galaxy X, during a tholian mission you blow up a Mirror Oydessy
Oh, you ment those....but they have nothing to do with the point I was trying to make. Those are the ships NPCs use. I was referring to a player controlled mirror Galaxy. That won't happen because the Galaxy is a Zen purchase and they make mirror versions for the lockboxes only out of free ships. To me the whole idea of these mirror ships in lockboxes is meh, but whatever.
The point was - Cryptic won't make a mirror C-Store ship and put it in a lockbox because it's not in their best interest to allow an item that costs 20/25$ become availible for doing a fragment of the "Tour the Universe" event through the exchange.
Maybe it's just me but i never was a fan of Carrier ships. for me they are just mobile airfields. Beingf out of range of my enemy and having hundeds of fighters attacking a virtually defenceless target (WWII tactics) is cowardly in my eyes.
No, i want my ship go face to face the enemy and fight it directly untill i can wear my enemy down.
Just my personal Preference.
I think it's a very good idea. Cruisers should profit from using Beam weapons much more in general.
I think one of those Overload Beam Weapons would be ok per ship. Maybe having it's Damage output directly related to the ships size, so the bigger the ship = more powerful Beam array.
I'm not sure about that. There is the Mirror Vor'Cha Battlecruiser on the Klingon side of things, it's basically the free version ("free" since the exchange is flooded with those things because poor TRIBBLE spent lots of cash on those boxes appearantly) of the Vor'Cha Retrofit, a C-Store ship. There's the free T4 variant but it's the same with the Galaxy class.
EDIT: About the carriers, I get them partly. I mean having pets to command and fight is a nice feature in a game. I do however not get why so many people insist of carriers being put in Star Trek, the ONLY sci-fi franchise that clearly never showed starifghters and carriers on-screen as their combat was originally inspired by submarine duels (TOS) and later by 18th century naval battles (TNG), a uniique characteristic I very much enjoy and love about Star Trek.
I do however have a (Mirror) Vo'Quv carrier on my Klingon char which I play from time to time, though I don't treat it as a carrier. It's a "command ship" in my little lore serving as a mobile outpost/troop transport (because of the huge crew number) which is accompanied by two wings of (cloaked) B'Rel raiders that decloak once "summoned". If they had treated "carriers" as such vessels who are able to let their "pets" warp-in instead of being "carried" (even the huge Galactica... er Vo'Quv can't fit B'Rels in her) I wouldn't oppose them as much. I'd even be fine with those stupid peregrines if those "fighters" would be uncontrollable reinforcements akin to a special attack that warp-in, attack a single target and disable/cripple it and warp-out again.
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Actually, you just proved my point.
The Mirror Vor'cha is the counterpart of the Vor'cha Retrofit - which is a free ship for the KDF availible at Brigadeer General level(lvl 40).
The C-Store one is the Vor'Kang, which is a refit of the standard Vor'cha, a ship availible at Captain(lvl 30) for the KDF.
So no, Cryptic have never made a mirror version of a C-Store ship and I firmly believe they never will.
I don't get it either. You want carriers? Go play BSGO.
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I do not recall seeing so much as one in any show or movie.
That being said, the existance of fighters or equivalants.
The Peregrine (fighter) if I am not mistaken was shown as a courier ship the maquis liked to arm and use for raiding.
Similarly Runabouts are armed and were used to draw fire from the Jem'hadar from the Oddysey.
And for the third example, Data in Insurrection twice uses a shuttle to harrass/damage a sona'a ship.
So fighters have canonically been shown to have some effect.
Based on what was shown it should be like the power siphon drones. An annoyance but not something that kills a starship by itself. There fore a carrier is actually not something they would likely use in space combat. (on the other hand using it for precision fights in an atmosphere like they recently created I can see shuttles/fighters being used.)
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.