Sorry for being so unreasonable by wanting to have, you know, a choice of ships with Cmdr Sci slot.
Its not unreasonable to want this, but you are being unreasonable about the time frame. Have some patience. You also have to understand that the devs are likely still behind in this regard because when they first designed the Romulan ship line they expected Romulans to have access to Fed or KDF ships (all the way up to T5) to fill in the gaps. This is something they removed due to community dislike.
They have only released a single ship since the faction was released, and that ship was the much more widely expected and loved Scimitar. The republic will eventually get a more full selection of ships like the other factions.
Right now they have exactly one focussed ship of each Boff specialty and a large number of hybrid type ships available. Many of these hybrids can provide powerful science options for now, or play the Guardian warbird.
Did you even read the memory alpha article you posted?
"The studio model is a modification and reuse of the Romulan scout ship seen in The Next Generation episode "The Defector"."
Following this link, you find that it is in fact the Romulan scout ship that forms the basis for the captain's yacht (crew 1-2), not the science ship.
I doubt the community would allow (or cryptic would even attempt) to make two identical ships in game one of which is simply a zoomed in look at the other.
So..... to sum up the majority of replies to this thread....
"Here, fly this ship that's not a sci ship. Or this other one that also isn't a sci ship, but it has some science so that's close enough. And anyway, you have one already so just be happy with that and stfu. Why you would want to fly one anyway is beyond me. Besides, all those C-Store and fleet ships don't count so we're all in the same boat."
*snip*
Sorry for being so unreasonable by wanting to have, you know, a choice of ships with Cmdr Sci slot.
So... you have a complaint about cmdr science? The Ha'nom has the best possible BOff layout for a science ship. I don't know why you're complaining. You get a Cmdr Science and a LtCmdr Science. I don't know what your issue is.
You want more options? Why would you want something different from the most ideal layout there is?
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
People, don't make this ship guy mad and make him leave too. You're nitpicking and they'll add more sci ships if the community politely requests. Oh btw its a game quit getting upset like these are actual physical ships
So... you have a complaint about cmdr science? The Ha'nom has the best possible BOff layout for a science ship. I don't know why you're complaining. You get a Cmdr Science and a LtCmdr Science. I don't know what your issue is.
You want more options? Why would you want something different from the most ideal layout there is?
What puzzles me about the Ha'nom is the fleet version. The other two fleet ships based on the free Lv40 ships have a universal LTC station, but not the fleet Ha'nom. Not sure why, for a ship requiring a T5 shipyard I expected more.
No. No complaint about a Cmdr Sci slot. A reponse to 'Well, ship X has a LtC. Sci slot, so fly that' comments. It's complaint about the lack of choice of Cmdr sci slot ships.
And besides, with all the hybrids that have been mentioned, yea, maybe I want a hybrid ship with a Cmdr Sci slot. 'Best' - highly subjective - possible setup or not.
- captjamjamz
At the most there are two, but only if you include the fleet version. But since neither have a universal Boff slot, the difference between them is a console slot and a bump in some stats. Otherwise it's the same ship. A ship that comes in a box or that I have to buy on the exchange does not count, for obvious reasons.
- originpi
No. Unreasonable about time frame would be asking for more Tac based ships just after the the biggest expansion in the game to date is released with a bunch of Tac based ships. This is not the case for sci based ships.
- overlapo
No. They don't. And I expected more too, hence the complaints.
"So my fun is wrong?"
No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
You see that little button on the upper right? The one that says "multi-on"? You can use that to quote multiple posts.
And think about it. It's the Romulans/Remans. They are very combat oriented with a little subterfuge and some... nasty tactics built in. I honestly was not surprised at all by any ship they came out with (other than the D'deridex... it was far more heavily engi oriented than I anticipated... was expecting a far more science orientation there). They all match the Romulan way of doing things.
You want high damage with more damage... oh and a little more damage? There are times when sheer firepower was needed. Hence the Ha'feh. You want something that can pound things to death and take a beating? The Mogai. You want something that can slap things around, but have the utility to still be sneaky? Dhelan. You want a command class ship that can take one hell of a beating and still sit there looking at you? Haapex. You want something that can mess with the fabric of space and leave your opponents reeling in confusion? Ha'nom.
But all of these have one thing in common: they are all designed to fight. Hence the tactical orientation. The Romulans are splintered, they're weak, and everyone knows it. All of their ships needed to be able to fight and defend themselves, and defend the new Republic. I mean cmon, you have the Hirogen, the Tal Shiar, the Elachi, the Nausicans, rebel Klingons, Gorn, the Tholians... all of them are challenging the Romulans. All of them are a danger to the Romulan Republic. And this new Republic needs to be able to survive. Hence the massive tactical portion.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
At the most there are two, but only if you include the fleet version. But since neither have a universal Boff slot, the difference between them is a console slot and a bump in some stats. Otherwise it's the same ship. A ship that comes in a box or that I have to buy on the exchange does not count, for obvious reasons.
According to that, there is one science ship for Klingons, and only two for the Federation.
The Ha'nom warbird is very comparable to the Reconnaissance Science Vessel.
There is no exact counterpart to the Deep Space Science Vessel -- I assume you'd like a Romulan counterpart to the Deep Space Science Vessel?
According to that, there is one science ship for Klingons, and only two for the Federation.
The Ha'nom warbird is very comparable to the Reconnaissance Science Vessel.
There is no exact counterpart to the Deep Space Science Vessel -- I assume you'd like a Romulan counterpart to the Deep Space Science Vessel?
The mirror Ha'nom has the boff layout of the Deep Space Science Vessel.
According to that, there is one science ship for Klingons, and only two for the Federation.
The Ha'nom warbird is very comparable to the Reconnaissance Science Vessel.
There is no exact counterpart to the Deep Space Science Vessel -- I assume you'd like a Romulan counterpart to the Deep Space Science Vessel?
Oh hell no, we do NOT need that much engineering on a sci ship...
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
All the small craft veteran awards are based on canon ships, Romulans do not receive special treatment in this regard.
I'm confused by this reply. I don't think I implied that the small craft veteran rewards weren't based on canon or that I think the Romulans should get special treatment. Misterde3 posted a link to memory alpha and he got my essential meaning, but basically the TNG Romulan science vessel warbird that was seen in 'The Next Phase' was large enough to have a crew of at least 70 people.
Yes, the model was a reuse of the scout vessel we saw in 'The Defector' which was a 1-2 person small craft. I agree that the scout vessel makes a worthy veteran reward for the Romulan Captain's Yacht. But the science vessel was explicitly mentioned as carrying a large crew. It's a starship, not a small craft. My understanding was that the Romulan Captain's Yacht veteran reward has both as alternate skins for the same small craft. My problem with this is the two ships are not equivalent, per the canon. If my understanding is flawed I'd welcome correction from the dev team, and I apologise if my manner was brusque before.
Did you even read the memory alpha article you posted?
"The studio model is a modification and reuse of the Romulan scout ship seen in The Next Generation episode "The Defector"."
Following this link, you find that it is in fact the Romulan scout ship that forms the basis for the captain's yacht (crew 1-2), not the science ship.
I doubt the community would allow (or cryptic would even attempt) to make two identical ships in game one of which is simply a zoomed in look at the other.
There are some differences between the two models. One of which was redoing the forward section where the cockpit was located on the scout vessel. The science vessel has a completely different look.
According to the script for 'The Next Phase', the science vessel was supposed to be half the size of the Enterprise. We know in reality that they reused an existing model to cut costs, but that doesn't help us when it comes time to appropriately appraise the model from an in-universe context. It's simply a scaled-up model of the scout ship's basic chassis, and it shares that with a bunch of other ST spaceships - chief offender is the klingon Bird-of-prey, whose scaling issues are legendary.
But regardless, the fact of the matter is the science vessel is explicitly and implicitly described as being a large starship.
The Ha'nom warbird is very comparable to the Reconnaissance Science Vessel. There is no exact counterpart to the Deep Space Science Vessel -- I assume you'd like a Romulan counterpart to the Deep Space Science Vessel?
What were Romulans using for Science before the Republic? Cant we rustle up a few of those?
Did you even read the memory alpha article you posted?
"The studio model is a modification and reuse of the Romulan scout ship seen in The Next Generation episode "The Defector"."
Following this link, you find that it is in fact the Romulan scout ship that forms the basis for the captain's yacht (crew 1-2), not the science ship.
I doubt the community would allow (or cryptic would even attempt) to make two identical ships in game one of which is simply a zoomed in look at the other.
I'm well aware of what this ship is and what it is not.
The scout ship from "The Defector" was turned upside down, the rear part was added and the forward module was replaced from a cockpit with visible windows to something that is completely different.
I also watched the episode and they explicitly state there are still over 70 Romulans left alive onboard.
MIROK: Most of the conduits were damaged during the explosion. I can't even access the central computer.
WORF: Commander. Emergency bulkheads have sealed this section off from the rest of the ship. There is no way to gain access to the main Bridge or control centres.
RIKER: Survivors?
WORF: Readings indicate at least seventy three Romulans are still alive.
VAREL: Seventy three.
(an alarm sounds)
MIROK: The pressure has jumped two hundred melakols!
VAREL: I've lost control of the containment chamber.
So either this is either a clown car or a ship, but either way it's not a shuttle.
Also, considering the amount of people who have say they'd like this ship to not be a shuttle but an actual ship shows your doubts are without basis.
The Ha'nom warbird is very comparable to the Reconnaissance Science Vessel.
There is no exact counterpart to the Deep Space Science Vessel -- I assume you'd like a Romulan counterpart to the Deep Space Science Vessel?
I haven't flown the deep space science vessel. Don't know how big it is. But what I'd really love to see is a Romulan science ship which isn't the size of every other player ship in an STF combined.
First, a Commander Science station or the highest station being Science.
Second, integrated subsystem targeting
Third, Sensor Analysis
The only Romulan ship that fits those requisites is the Ha'nom Guardian Warbird, KDF have more that one science ship as Phalanx, Draguas and Varanus (the Phalanx does as its highest station is science).
KDF have more than one Science ship, but only the Varanus and Fleet Varanus are available at Tier 5. So I'd argue the Romulans having only a Ha'Nom, Mirror Ha'Nom and Fleet Ha'Nom is pretty equal.
I was once DKnight1000, apparently I had taken my own name so now I'm DKnight0001. If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why. When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
regardles of all the theorys people are mentioning, the fact is that there should be at least a healthy variety and choices for any of the 3 types, currently there isnt.
I'm well aware of what this ship is and what it is not.
The scout ship from "The Defector" was turned upside down, the rear part was added and the forward module was replaced from a cockpit with visible windows to something that is completely different.
I also watched the episode and they explicitly state there are still over 70 Romulans left alive onboard.
MIROK: Most of the conduits were damaged during the explosion. I can't even access the central computer.
WORF: Commander. Emergency bulkheads have sealed this section off from the rest of the ship. There is no way to gain access to the main Bridge or control centres.
RIKER: Survivors?
WORF: Readings indicate at least seventy three Romulans are still alive.
VAREL: Seventy three.
(an alarm sounds)
MIROK: The pressure has jumped two hundred melakols!
VAREL: I've lost control of the containment chamber.
So either this is either a clown car or a ship, but either way it's not a shuttle.
Also, considering the amount of people who have say they'd like this ship to not be a shuttle but an actual ship shows your doubts are without basis.
You don't seem to understand still. They are adding the scout ship as a shuttle. They are not adding the science ship as a shuttle. That is all I'm saying. My post was responding to saying "whyfore this ship is veteran shuttle, it holds 70 romulans!" and I said "They are not adding this ship as veteran shuttle, but almost identical small ship".
As it turns out they ARE adding the science ship as a science ship (I didn't think they will, because it was god awful ugly and looks ALMOST identical to the tiny shuttle). Refer to the video that was released that also showed the Romulan time ship and the Vet ship animation (I think Priority-one, but I don't have the link).
Also, to the above poster who is commenting on how the KDF has 3 WHOLE science vessels and the republic has only 1. 2 of those science vessels are lower than T5, so technically a KDF aligned Romulan has access to the exact same number as the KDF do.
By your count, a Fed aligned romulan has access to 6 science vessels (10 if you count refits!).
EDIT: So I guess I should repeat that so the whiny people can rejoice: The abovementioned priority one video reveals TWO romulan specific science ships that are in the works, the (bum-ugly) Romulan Science Vessel and the Romulan version of the Temporal Science vessel.
regardles of all the theorys people are mentioning, the fact is that there should be at least a healthy variety and choices for any of the 3 types, currently there isnt.
In fact, they have an entirely new type that has nothing to do with the three. Warbirds! That is the whole point.
Stop trying to homogenize my game.
You know, I use the above line enough that I think I will set it as my signature.
You don't seem to understand still. They are adding the scout ship as a shuttle. They are not adding the science ship as a shuttle. That is all I'm saying. My post was responding to saying "whyfore this ship is veteran shuttle, it holds 70 romulans!" and I said "They are not adding this ship as veteran shuttle, but almost identical small ship".
Okay, let's have a look at all your comments in this thread:
POST#10
"I don't understand. If you are so desperate for a science ship, why not just fly the Ha'nom Guardian?
The fleet upgrade is just 10% hull and shields and 1 console slot. While I agree the fleet bonuses are nice, they are by no means essential and you can run your T5 Ha'nom just fine.
No offence but your "I don't care about power gaming I just want to do space magic (science)" doesn't hold water if you aren't willing to give up a small amount of optimization for it."
POST#32
"Its not unreasonable to want this, but you are being unreasonable about the time frame. Have some patience. You also have to understand that the devs are likely still behind in this regard because when they first designed the Romulan ship line they expected Romulans to have access to Fed or KDF ships (all the way up to T5) to fill in the gaps. This is something they removed due to community dislike.
They have only released a single ship since the faction was released, and that ship was the much more widely expected and loved Scimitar. The republic will eventually get a more full selection of ships like the other factions.
Right now they have exactly one focussed ship of each Boff specialty and a large number of hybrid type ships available. Many of these hybrids can provide powerful science options for now, or play the Guardian warbird."
POST#33
"No... just no....
Did you even read the memory alpha article you posted?
"The studio model is a modification and reuse of the Romulan scout ship seen in The Next Generation episode "The Defector"."
Following this link, you find that it is in fact the Romulan scout ship that forms the basis for the captain's yacht (crew 1-2), not the science ship.
I doubt the community would allow (or cryptic would even attempt) to make two identical ships in game one of which is simply a zoomed in look at the other."
In which of these posts did you say "They are not adding this ship as veteran shuttle, but almost identical small ship" ?
Because I don't see it.
It's also an interesting strategy to use information that was impossible to have had 6 days ago on me now like I was ignorant while my only ignorance stems from my lack of precognition...
In fact, they have an entirely new type that has nothing to do with the three. Warbirds! That is the whole point.
Stop trying to homogenize my game.
You know, I use the above line enough that I think I will set it as my signature.
if that was the case then they would also remove the supposed need for a romulan sci/eng/tac captain and just have a "warbird captain" but they dont. The "warbird does it all" argument is just because of sheer lazyness on the devs side.
same applies to the reputation system, forced repetitive needless grind as an excuse to make it appear as is the game has content after you hit 50 because theres not much else to do after that which qualifies as "fun".
Their doing the same as eve online which for a long time instead of releasing actual new useful/useable content, they just slap on useless rubbish no1 uses or just add heaps of ships that arent needed and call the updates "expansions" when in fact they do very little. In the case of eve its actual core content is no different now than when i started in 2003.
So again the excuses of a lack of romulan sci/eng boats are still valid, you/me/no1 has the right to self proclaim a reason for a lack of a shiptype, your entitled to your opinion but its just an opinion, its not fact.
if theres people here voicing the need for more sci/eng boats that in itsself raises the fact that there should be more, the guardian ship is also a bit of a pityful excuse to use given that it only drops from a box and theres no certainty there will always be 1 on the market, and the fewer there are the more they cost.
only real non box sci option is the t5 fleet variant, thats 1 massive wait/grind just to get the 1 properly obtainable sci rom ship, those 2 ships are far from easy to aquire and 2 poxy ships doesnt qualify as a healthy choice when compared to tac options.
btw my Eng/Fed char flies a DSSV and my Tac/Rom char flies the Mirror Guardian, i prefer sci boats, ive got plenty of choice on the fed side all the way thru progressing and endgame, my rom char not so much. Havent tried or seen klingon options so cant comment on that side.
all the klingon science ships are cstore ships... with exception to the klingon carrier at 40
Do i want to see more science ships for romulans yes, will we likely see many pre-40 science ships not likely. The guardian warbird is awesome science ship and has pretty much anything I'd want in science ship. We are likely to see a sci full carrier for romulans. We are also likely to see the flag ship with some sort of science focused variant. I also believe there will be a cstore science non-carrier eventually for at least Tier 5, but something tells me there will be a Tier 4 too, becuase they are making a Tier 4 quad plasma cannon escort ship for Tier 4. They might as well make a science choice too( maybe with aux plasma cannons), along with D'derix and the escortish ship at Teir 4.
btw my Eng/Fed char flies a DSSV and my Tac/Rom char flies the Mirror Guardian, i prefer sci boats, ive got plenty of choice on the fed side all the way thru progressing and endgame, my rom char not so much. Havent tried or seen klingon options so cant comment on that side.
Nobody has anywhere near the choices of ships the Feds have. Klingons either use a BoP or buy a Sci Ship. Honestly it's not even fair to expect equivalency with the Federation.
I was once DKnight1000, apparently I had taken my own name so now I'm DKnight0001. If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why. When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
Nobody has anywhere near the choices of ships the Feds have. Klingons either use a BoP or buy a Sci Ship. Honestly it's not even fair to expect equivalency with the Federation.
which i find quite strange, i know on various other games people often like to play the "baddies", tho maybe the lack of interest in klingon was because you werent able to start from lvl1 back then, so perhaps people became too invested in their fed chars.
Don't know if anyone has posted in this thread yet or not...but it does look like the Romulans have two Science ships headed their way...
One is a lockbox vessel -- the Temporal Sci Ship. The other is just labeled "Romulan Science Ship".
Priority 1 scooped both as part of their podcast during a visit to Cryptic recently. There is video of both the Sci ship and the Temporal Sci ship.
I know that one likely does not count, considering that it is a Temporal...but the Temporal science ships are arguably some of the best sci ships in the game.
which i find quite strange, i know on various other games people often like to play the "baddies", tho maybe the lack of interest in klingon was because you werent able to start from lvl1 back then, so perhaps people became too invested in their fed chars.
Actually I think that was the problem completely. From day 1 you had to play the Tutorial as Feds, than swap to KDF after say 6 levels. They changed it to 30 and by the time your that far along you don't want to go back to nothing to start a new faction.
I was once DKnight1000, apparently I had taken my own name so now I'm DKnight0001. If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why. When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
You would be better off in a Dhelan or in a D'D, also Romulans do have a science ship ... the Ha'nom, I have no idea why people continue to ignore that ship as if somehow being a free ship at lv 40 makes it "bad".
There is also the mirror version. the normal one is a RSV with battle cloak and the mirror is a DSSV with battle cloak, I agree, not sure why people are ignoring them.
Thats a very bad idea, the Scimitar is a destroyer and what you do with it is you just make a typical Aux2Bat build since that pretty much the only thing that works, you cannot use it in the same way as a science ship being you have to spec to overcome the numerous deficiencies of the ship.
You would be better off in a Dhelan or in a D'D, also Romulans do have a science ship ... the Ha'nom, I have no idea why people continue to ignore that ship as if somehow being a free ship at lv 40 makes it "bad".
Comments
Its not unreasonable to want this, but you are being unreasonable about the time frame. Have some patience. You also have to understand that the devs are likely still behind in this regard because when they first designed the Romulan ship line they expected Romulans to have access to Fed or KDF ships (all the way up to T5) to fill in the gaps. This is something they removed due to community dislike.
They have only released a single ship since the faction was released, and that ship was the much more widely expected and loved Scimitar. The republic will eventually get a more full selection of ships like the other factions.
Right now they have exactly one focussed ship of each Boff specialty and a large number of hybrid type ships available. Many of these hybrids can provide powerful science options for now, or play the Guardian warbird.
No... just no....
Did you even read the memory alpha article you posted?
"The studio model is a modification and reuse of the Romulan scout ship seen in The Next Generation episode "The Defector"."
Following this link, you find that it is in fact the Romulan scout ship that forms the basis for the captain's yacht (crew 1-2), not the science ship.
I doubt the community would allow (or cryptic would even attempt) to make two identical ships in game one of which is simply a zoomed in look at the other.
So... you have a complaint about cmdr science? The Ha'nom has the best possible BOff layout for a science ship. I don't know why you're complaining. You get a Cmdr Science and a LtCmdr Science. I don't know what your issue is.
You want more options? Why would you want something different from the most ideal layout there is?
What puzzles me about the Ha'nom is the fleet version. The other two fleet ships based on the free Lv40 ships have a universal LTC station, but not the fleet Ha'nom. Not sure why, for a ship requiring a T5 shipyard I expected more.
No. No complaint about a Cmdr Sci slot. A reponse to 'Well, ship X has a LtC. Sci slot, so fly that' comments. It's complaint about the lack of choice of Cmdr sci slot ships.
And besides, with all the hybrids that have been mentioned, yea, maybe I want a hybrid ship with a Cmdr Sci slot. 'Best' - highly subjective - possible setup or not.
- captjamjamz
At the most there are two, but only if you include the fleet version. But since neither have a universal Boff slot, the difference between them is a console slot and a bump in some stats. Otherwise it's the same ship. A ship that comes in a box or that I have to buy on the exchange does not count, for obvious reasons.
- originpi
No. Unreasonable about time frame would be asking for more Tac based ships just after the the biggest expansion in the game to date is released with a bunch of Tac based ships. This is not the case for sci based ships.
- overlapo
No. They don't. And I expected more too, hence the complaints.
No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
You see that little button on the upper right? The one that says "multi-on"? You can use that to quote multiple posts.
And think about it. It's the Romulans/Remans. They are very combat oriented with a little subterfuge and some... nasty tactics built in. I honestly was not surprised at all by any ship they came out with (other than the D'deridex... it was far more heavily engi oriented than I anticipated... was expecting a far more science orientation there). They all match the Romulan way of doing things.
You want high damage with more damage... oh and a little more damage? There are times when sheer firepower was needed. Hence the Ha'feh. You want something that can pound things to death and take a beating? The Mogai. You want something that can slap things around, but have the utility to still be sneaky? Dhelan. You want a command class ship that can take one hell of a beating and still sit there looking at you? Haapex. You want something that can mess with the fabric of space and leave your opponents reeling in confusion? Ha'nom.
But all of these have one thing in common: they are all designed to fight. Hence the tactical orientation. The Romulans are splintered, they're weak, and everyone knows it. All of their ships needed to be able to fight and defend themselves, and defend the new Republic. I mean cmon, you have the Hirogen, the Tal Shiar, the Elachi, the Nausicans, rebel Klingons, Gorn, the Tholians... all of them are challenging the Romulans. All of them are a danger to the Romulan Republic. And this new Republic needs to be able to survive. Hence the massive tactical portion.
According to that, there is one science ship for Klingons, and only two for the Federation.
The Ha'nom warbird is very comparable to the Reconnaissance Science Vessel.
There is no exact counterpart to the Deep Space Science Vessel -- I assume you'd like a Romulan counterpart to the Deep Space Science Vessel?
Twitter! STO_JamJamz
The mirror Ha'nom has the boff layout of the Deep Space Science Vessel.
Oh hell no, we do NOT need that much engineering on a sci ship...
Yes, the model was a reuse of the scout vessel we saw in 'The Defector' which was a 1-2 person small craft. I agree that the scout vessel makes a worthy veteran reward for the Romulan Captain's Yacht. But the science vessel was explicitly mentioned as carrying a large crew. It's a starship, not a small craft. My understanding was that the Romulan Captain's Yacht veteran reward has both as alternate skins for the same small craft. My problem with this is the two ships are not equivalent, per the canon. If my understanding is flawed I'd welcome correction from the dev team, and I apologise if my manner was brusque before.
There are some differences between the two models. One of which was redoing the forward section where the cockpit was located on the scout vessel. The science vessel has a completely different look.
According to the script for 'The Next Phase', the science vessel was supposed to be half the size of the Enterprise. We know in reality that they reused an existing model to cut costs, but that doesn't help us when it comes time to appropriately appraise the model from an in-universe context. It's simply a scaled-up model of the scout ship's basic chassis, and it shares that with a bunch of other ST spaceships - chief offender is the klingon Bird-of-prey, whose scaling issues are legendary.
But regardless, the fact of the matter is the science vessel is explicitly and implicitly described as being a large starship.
I'm well aware of what this ship is and what it is not.
The scout ship from "The Defector" was turned upside down, the rear part was added and the forward module was replaced from a cockpit with visible windows to something that is completely different.
http://www.coldnorth.com/owen/game/startrek/challenger/federation/romscience.jpg
http://www.cardassiaprimera.com.ar/romulan-science-ship_1.jpg
http://www.cardassiaprimera.com.ar/romulan-scout-1.jpg
http://trekcore.com/gallery/albums/romulanships/romulan-scout.jpg
I am not an idiot thank you very much.
I also watched the episode and they explicitly state there are still over 70 Romulans left alive onboard.
MIROK: Most of the conduits were damaged during the explosion. I can't even access the central computer.
WORF: Commander. Emergency bulkheads have sealed this section off from the rest of the ship. There is no way to gain access to the main Bridge or control centres.
RIKER: Survivors?
WORF: Readings indicate at least seventy three Romulans are still alive.
VAREL: Seventy three.
(an alarm sounds)
MIROK: The pressure has jumped two hundred melakols!
VAREL: I've lost control of the containment chamber.
So either this is either a clown car or a ship, but either way it's not a shuttle.
Also, considering the amount of people who have say they'd like this ship to not be a shuttle but an actual ship shows your doubts are without basis.
I haven't flown the deep space science vessel. Don't know how big it is. But what I'd really love to see is a Romulan science ship which isn't the size of every other player ship in an STF combined.
KDF have more than one Science ship, but only the Varanus and Fleet Varanus are available at Tier 5. So I'd argue the Romulans having only a Ha'Nom, Mirror Ha'Nom and Fleet Ha'Nom is pretty equal.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
You don't seem to understand still. They are adding the scout ship as a shuttle. They are not adding the science ship as a shuttle. That is all I'm saying. My post was responding to saying "whyfore this ship is veteran shuttle, it holds 70 romulans!" and I said "They are not adding this ship as veteran shuttle, but almost identical small ship".
As it turns out they ARE adding the science ship as a science ship (I didn't think they will, because it was god awful ugly and looks ALMOST identical to the tiny shuttle). Refer to the video that was released that also showed the Romulan time ship and the Vet ship animation (I think Priority-one, but I don't have the link).
Also, to the above poster who is commenting on how the KDF has 3 WHOLE science vessels and the republic has only 1. 2 of those science vessels are lower than T5, so technically a KDF aligned Romulan has access to the exact same number as the KDF do.
By your count, a Fed aligned romulan has access to 6 science vessels (10 if you count refits!).
EDIT: So I guess I should repeat that so the whiny people can rejoice: The abovementioned priority one video reveals TWO romulan specific science ships that are in the works, the (bum-ugly) Romulan Science Vessel and the Romulan version of the Temporal Science vessel.
In fact, they have an entirely new type that has nothing to do with the three. Warbirds! That is the whole point.
Stop trying to homogenize my game.
You know, I use the above line enough that I think I will set it as my signature.
Okay, let's have a look at all your comments in this thread:
POST#10
"I don't understand. If you are so desperate for a science ship, why not just fly the Ha'nom Guardian?
The fleet upgrade is just 10% hull and shields and 1 console slot. While I agree the fleet bonuses are nice, they are by no means essential and you can run your T5 Ha'nom just fine.
No offence but your "I don't care about power gaming I just want to do space magic (science)" doesn't hold water if you aren't willing to give up a small amount of optimization for it."
POST#32
"Its not unreasonable to want this, but you are being unreasonable about the time frame. Have some patience. You also have to understand that the devs are likely still behind in this regard because when they first designed the Romulan ship line they expected Romulans to have access to Fed or KDF ships (all the way up to T5) to fill in the gaps. This is something they removed due to community dislike.
They have only released a single ship since the faction was released, and that ship was the much more widely expected and loved Scimitar. The republic will eventually get a more full selection of ships like the other factions.
Right now they have exactly one focussed ship of each Boff specialty and a large number of hybrid type ships available. Many of these hybrids can provide powerful science options for now, or play the Guardian warbird."
POST#33
"No... just no....
Did you even read the memory alpha article you posted?
"The studio model is a modification and reuse of the Romulan scout ship seen in The Next Generation episode "The Defector"."
Following this link, you find that it is in fact the Romulan scout ship that forms the basis for the captain's yacht (crew 1-2), not the science ship.
I doubt the community would allow (or cryptic would even attempt) to make two identical ships in game one of which is simply a zoomed in look at the other."
In which of these posts did you say "They are not adding this ship as veteran shuttle, but almost identical small ship" ?
Because I don't see it.
It's also an interesting strategy to use information that was impossible to have had 6 days ago on me now like I was ignorant while my only ignorance stems from my lack of precognition...
But to answer your specific question:
I don't use the exact words, because but what I said was:
The scout ship is what I referred to as "almost identical small ship".
Anyway, back on topic!
Click here to see the video with both the Science ship and Temporal Science ship (and a mystery ship!)
PS: misterde3 Despite my fairly reasonable explaination above I do in fact blame you for not having the ability of precognition. :P
if that was the case then they would also remove the supposed need for a romulan sci/eng/tac captain and just have a "warbird captain" but they dont. The "warbird does it all" argument is just because of sheer lazyness on the devs side.
same applies to the reputation system, forced repetitive needless grind as an excuse to make it appear as is the game has content after you hit 50 because theres not much else to do after that which qualifies as "fun".
Their doing the same as eve online which for a long time instead of releasing actual new useful/useable content, they just slap on useless rubbish no1 uses or just add heaps of ships that arent needed and call the updates "expansions" when in fact they do very little. In the case of eve its actual core content is no different now than when i started in 2003.
So again the excuses of a lack of romulan sci/eng boats are still valid, you/me/no1 has the right to self proclaim a reason for a lack of a shiptype, your entitled to your opinion but its just an opinion, its not fact.
if theres people here voicing the need for more sci/eng boats that in itsself raises the fact that there should be more, the guardian ship is also a bit of a pityful excuse to use given that it only drops from a box and theres no certainty there will always be 1 on the market, and the fewer there are the more they cost.
only real non box sci option is the t5 fleet variant, thats 1 massive wait/grind just to get the 1 properly obtainable sci rom ship, those 2 ships are far from easy to aquire and 2 poxy ships doesnt qualify as a healthy choice when compared to tac options.
btw my Eng/Fed char flies a DSSV and my Tac/Rom char flies the Mirror Guardian, i prefer sci boats, ive got plenty of choice on the fed side all the way thru progressing and endgame, my rom char not so much. Havent tried or seen klingon options so cant comment on that side.
Do i want to see more science ships for romulans yes, will we likely see many pre-40 science ships not likely. The guardian warbird is awesome science ship and has pretty much anything I'd want in science ship. We are likely to see a sci full carrier for romulans. We are also likely to see the flag ship with some sort of science focused variant. I also believe there will be a cstore science non-carrier eventually for at least Tier 5, but something tells me there will be a Tier 4 too, becuase they are making a Tier 4 quad plasma cannon escort ship for Tier 4. They might as well make a science choice too( maybe with aux plasma cannons), along with D'derix and the escortish ship at Teir 4.
Nobody has anywhere near the choices of ships the Feds have. Klingons either use a BoP or buy a Sci Ship. Honestly it's not even fair to expect equivalency with the Federation.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
which i find quite strange, i know on various other games people often like to play the "baddies", tho maybe the lack of interest in klingon was because you werent able to start from lvl1 back then, so perhaps people became too invested in their fed chars.
One is a lockbox vessel -- the Temporal Sci Ship. The other is just labeled "Romulan Science Ship".
Priority 1 scooped both as part of their podcast during a visit to Cryptic recently. There is video of both the Sci ship and the Temporal Sci ship.
I know that one likely does not count, considering that it is a Temporal...but the Temporal science ships are arguably some of the best sci ships in the game.
Here is a link to the video: http://priorityonepodcast.com/priority-one-video-cryptic-visit-2013-art-dept-tour/
Actually I think that was the problem completely. From day 1 you had to play the Tutorial as Feds, than swap to KDF after say 6 levels. They changed it to 30 and by the time your that far along you don't want to go back to nothing to start a new faction.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
I.R.W. Raptor's Claw
Storm Eagle Class Warbird Fleet Ha'feh
I have never trusted humans, and I never will
There is also the mirror version. the normal one is a RSV with battle cloak and the mirror is a DSSV with battle cloak, I agree, not sure why people are ignoring them.
why even bother just get the fleet sci ship