The new movie is going to be awesome! The ship looks cool. So it passes the "does it look cool test?" ... the story so far from what I've been teased with is amazing. And the utter joy I feel for a new Star Trek installment, after years of having nothing to look forward to since it was dead on TV is hard to encapsulate. May is right around the corner and I can't wait to see this.
IMO, it looks like the Vengence may have been re-purposed from its original design; perhaps when they "layed the keel" it was meant to be something along the lines of the Ambassador-class, got the saucer-section mostly complete (as it would be mostly crew quarters, labs, etc) , then decided they needed a warship more then they needed an exploration vessel. They crammed as many weapons into the engineering hull as they could since it was only partially constructed and therefore easier to modify "on the fly".
His idea was how to take the biggest dump on TOS-era fans as possible while pandering to whatever is popular with the average action movie patron...
The more cliche and un-original the better as his target demographic isn't going to know or care about the ST universe. Every element from the ST universe he twists and mangles is for the sake of ST fans who care about the franchise... it's his way of giving them a huge F-YOU and laughing all the way to the bank.
I really hope this movie fails horribly as does his Star Wars movie... his ego needs a good b#&*$# slapping
ST2009 was AIMED at the general demographic who didn't know/care about ST, but had plenty of nods for actual ST fans (like a redshirt dying first, which was classic in TOS)
And in doing so, it was a success that got new interest in ST, which is a WIN for us fans. It's okay that you don't like it or Abrams, but that's no reason to treat the film as an abomination :rolleyes:
Was named Trek17.
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Don't forget that George and Winona Kirk are from Trek Novels. There are many more nods like that in the film, much more than previous films.
If you actually look at the background of the Trek films, you will see that those filmmakers tried to do worse than submit the idea of a reboot and follow through.
TMP- It was a soft reboot of TOS.
TWOK- It was a soft reboot of TOS and TMP. This is the movie that led to Roddenberry want to start a new series due to his conflicts with the studio and director. More militaristic Starfleet, the director wanting to lay the groundworks for a new crew, and the inclusion of FJ's ships
TSFS- This movie was to set up the Excelsior as the new Enterprise.
TVH- This movie was to set up a new crew at the end with the Excelsior.
TFF- Shatner's I wanna direct too, but with little money given from the studio
TUC- A compromised movie that was supposed to be about Young Kirk and Young Spock.
Season 1 and 2 of TNG- A soft reboot of TOS
Pretty much Roddenberry, declared all the movies after TWOK not canon.
Don't forget that George and Winona Kirk are from Trek Novels.
George Samuel Kirk was mentioned in an episode of TOS, when it was explained that Kirk's older brother (portrayed by Shatner) was named for their father, but he had always called him Sam...
Hikaru Sulu reveals that his advanced combat training is in fencing. Sulu was first seen fencing in TOS: "The Naked Time".
When Kirk and McCoy first see the Enterprise in space the scene resembles the scene from Star Trek: The Motion Picture when the Enterprise refit is shown for the first time or the similar scene in Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home with the new USS Enterprise-A. This was the general idea in Abrams' view.
At the end of the film, Admiral Christopher Pike is in a wheelchair. This is an allusion to Fleet Captain Christopher Pike from the original timeline who was crippled by delta radiation when a baffle plate had ruptured and then confined to an advanced wheelchair.
While taking the Kobayashi Maru test, Kirk's comic nonchalance extends to him casually munching on an apple as the Klingons attack. In the Genesis cave in Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan, Kirk eats an apple while explaining to Saavik how he beat the Kobayashi Maru test.
Spock Prime tells Kirk "I have been, and always shall be, your friend.", which were his dying words to an older Kirk in Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan, and, recalling that conversation, his first words after his fal-tor-pan in Star Trek III: The Search for Spock.
At one point, Doctor McCoy tells Kirk that "A little suffering is good for the soul." In "The Corbomite Maneuver" Kirk asks McCoy "Aren't you the one who always says a little suffering is good for the soul?" and McCoy dryly replies "I never say that".
Kirk emotionally compromising Spock in order to gain command of the Enterprise as he did in "This Side of Paradise".
Seriously...evil big ship cliche....???
Like Star Trek never did that before....Borg Cube, the Scimitar....and those are just off the top of my head.
Your pain runs deep.
Let us explore it... together. Each man hides a secret pain. It must be exposed and reckoned with. It must be dragged from the darkness and forced into the light. Share your pain. Share your pain with me... and gain strength from the sharing.
I'm thinking a lot of the hate comes from "prime timeline" people realising that this movie drives yet another wedge between them and their now lost era.
We TOS people had to take it all during the Next Gen years, welcome to the club.
This ship looks Epic and I eagerly await this movie.
I'm thinking a lot of the hate comes from "prime timeline" people realising that this movie drives yet another wedge between them and their now lost era.
It may take a while, but I have a funny feeling we'll be seeing another "prime timeline" production someday. Not until Abrams is done making his movies, though.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them." -Thomas Marrone
I'm thinking a lot of the hate comes from "prime timeline" people realising that this movie drives yet another wedge between them and their now lost era.
How? I can still watch ToS etc anytime I want... By what logic is any kind of 'wedge' being driven in? As mentioned, my distaste is purely for JJ Abrams... JJVerse might not be Primeline, but it's still tolerable as entertainment and 'what might have been'. That doesn't particularly bother me. What bothers me, is the writer/director combo who are going to try and force the idea that someone, either in Starfleet or Section 31 had the implausibly ludicrous idea, of thinking:
"Back in the 1990s, there was this group of genetically engineered tyrants who were soooo badass epic, that they got shot into space in a sleeper ship. We got our asses kicked last year by a pack of tatted-up miners, we really ought to devote resources to tracking down that ship and making it's leader our trained monkey. What do you think, Admiral?"
"We have people on Earth now, Agent Zero, and much more advanced genetic techniques than they had in the 90s, how about you work with what you've got to hand and come up with something viable..."
"No no, these guys will be badass. Totally Epic! They'll be better than sliced bread. Is that your daughter? She looks like a bit of a goer, does she get it from her mother?"
"Yeah, damn right she does! Fine, you've appealed to my soft-side, go for it!"
:eek:
Nope, can't see anyway in which tracking down the Botany Bay could in anyway be sold as a viable mission...
We TOS people had to take it all during the Next Gen years, welcome to the club.
So what you're saying, is:
"We got screwed over, now's your turn to suck it?"
Nice...
I grew up on ToS, had no issue with TNG when it came out, was a bit unsure how DS-9 would work when proposed (Didn't realize they'd stolen the idea from Babylon 5 proposals) but loved it from the first episode. Won't go so far as to say I 'loved' Voyager, but I didn't see it as any worse than the other series. So that 'we had to put up with it' just doesn't carry any weight with me...
I can tolerate JJverse being an alternate dimension (the film admitted it itself) but what I cannot and will not tolerate, is someone cherry-picking key points from existing works, throwing them in for good measure, filling the rest up with whatever he can be bothered to come up with, and then having the nerve to try and claim he's doing people a favor and re-invigorating a franchise which was doing quite nicely as it had been...
"I'll Be Seeing You" just came on my playlist :cool:
A Star Trek work driven by a flag officer doing something stupid surely is unprecedented, yes.
At this level of magnitude, with such flimsy justification, yeah, it sure is... At least Admiral Dougherty had the demonstrable benefit to the entire Federation as his impetus for his part in the Ba'ku operation... Going after the Botany Bay to scare off the Big Bad Romulans from Teh Future is just weak from an in universe perspective, and sloppy writing from an RL perspective
I'm thinking a lot of the hate comes from "prime timeline" people realising that this movie drives yet another wedge between them and their now lost era.
We TOS people had to take it all during the Next Gen years, welcome to the club.
This ship looks Epic and I eagerly await this movie.
Oh and, ROTARY PHASER CANNONS SQUEEEEEE!
Thank you! :P
...Oh, baby, you know, I've really got to leave you / Oh, I can hear it callin 'me / I said don't you hear it callin' me the way it used to do?...
- Anne Bredon
This ship would be over 250 years old in STO, but that would not matter anyway as the Kumari with her more than 300 years outguns the most mordern ships already
This ship would be over 250 years old in STO, but that would not matter anyway as the Kumari with her more than 300 years outguns the most mordern ships already
Nope, the Kumari is a 2409 all new ship based on the old one.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
I see, so it is as would the state of Texas took the old Constitution sailing frigate, rebuilt it with new materials gives it a nuclear drive and guided Missiles, and operates it for the US. Navy. LOL
If anyone has been following Peter Weller's career, you would realize that he has played a role as a "Star Trek" villain. During the series "Star Trek: Enterprise", Weller played the leader of a terrorist group.
As we all know from experience, certain actors have been typecast in certain roles.
John Harrison's character may be in the forefront, but his strings are most likely being pulled by Weller's character. You can always tell who the bad guy is by the cast.
Old, new...it's STO, they do what they want and bastardize whatever to get it. I like the Kumari...tough little PVE ship. But this is about the Vengeance...it looks hella ugly and it needs to be destroyed by a much weaker, superiorly crewed Enterprise. Oh TRIBBLE, did I just ruin the plot??
Whatever the case may be...REDSHIRTS!! INTO YOUR SPACE SUITS AND STAND AT ATTENTION IN LINES THREE DEEP IN FRONT OF THE SHIP!!! Gotta have shields to maximum to survive this....lol...
Comments
ROTFWL That was my first thought as well.
it would be an honor to torture something on THAT LEVEL.:cool::cool::cool:
Not true, I'm very excite at the thought of seeing this ship blow up
I like it (form following dunction).
And in doing so, it was a success that got new interest in ST, which is a WIN for us fans. It's okay that you don't like it or Abrams, but that's no reason to treat the film as an abomination :rolleyes:
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
If you actually look at the background of the Trek films, you will see that those filmmakers tried to do worse than submit the idea of a reboot and follow through.
TMP- It was a soft reboot of TOS.
TWOK- It was a soft reboot of TOS and TMP. This is the movie that led to Roddenberry want to start a new series due to his conflicts with the studio and director. More militaristic Starfleet, the director wanting to lay the groundworks for a new crew, and the inclusion of FJ's ships
TSFS- This movie was to set up the Excelsior as the new Enterprise.
TVH- This movie was to set up a new crew at the end with the Excelsior.
TFF- Shatner's I wanna direct too, but with little money given from the studio
TUC- A compromised movie that was supposed to be about Young Kirk and Young Spock.
Season 1 and 2 of TNG- A soft reboot of TOS
Pretty much Roddenberry, declared all the movies after TWOK not canon.
why would he include so many nods to TOS then?
Hikaru Sulu reveals that his advanced combat training is in fencing. Sulu was first seen fencing in TOS: "The Naked Time".
When Kirk and McCoy first see the Enterprise in space the scene resembles the scene from Star Trek: The Motion Picture when the Enterprise refit is shown for the first time or the similar scene in Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home with the new USS Enterprise-A. This was the general idea in Abrams' view.
At the end of the film, Admiral Christopher Pike is in a wheelchair. This is an allusion to Fleet Captain Christopher Pike from the original timeline who was crippled by delta radiation when a baffle plate had ruptured and then confined to an advanced wheelchair.
While taking the Kobayashi Maru test, Kirk's comic nonchalance extends to him casually munching on an apple as the Klingons attack. In the Genesis cave in Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan, Kirk eats an apple while explaining to Saavik how he beat the Kobayashi Maru test.
Spock Prime tells Kirk "I have been, and always shall be, your friend.", which were his dying words to an older Kirk in Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan, and, recalling that conversation, his first words after his fal-tor-pan in Star Trek III: The Search for Spock.
At one point, Doctor McCoy tells Kirk that "A little suffering is good for the soul." In "The Corbomite Maneuver" Kirk asks McCoy "Aren't you the one who always says a little suffering is good for the soul?" and McCoy dryly replies "I never say that".
Kirk emotionally compromising Spock in order to gain command of the Enterprise as he did in "This Side of Paradise".
Seriously...evil big ship cliche....???
Like Star Trek never did that before....Borg Cube, the Scimitar....and those are just off the top of my head.
Let us explore it... together. Each man hides a secret pain. It must be exposed and reckoned with. It must be dragged from the darkness and forced into the light. Share your pain. Share your pain with me... and gain strength from the sharing.
We TOS people had to take it all during the Next Gen years, welcome to the club.
This ship looks Epic and I eagerly await this movie.
Oh and, ROTARY PHASER CANNONS SQUEEEEEE!
It may take a while, but I have a funny feeling we'll be seeing another "prime timeline" production someday. Not until Abrams is done making his movies, though.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
How? I can still watch ToS etc anytime I want... By what logic is any kind of 'wedge' being driven in? As mentioned, my distaste is purely for JJ Abrams... JJVerse might not be Primeline, but it's still tolerable as entertainment and 'what might have been'. That doesn't particularly bother me. What bothers me, is the writer/director combo who are going to try and force the idea that someone, either in Starfleet or Section 31 had the implausibly ludicrous idea, of thinking:
"Back in the 1990s, there was this group of genetically engineered tyrants who were soooo badass epic, that they got shot into space in a sleeper ship. We got our asses kicked last year by a pack of tatted-up miners, we really ought to devote resources to tracking down that ship and making it's leader our trained monkey. What do you think, Admiral?"
"We have people on Earth now, Agent Zero, and much more advanced genetic techniques than they had in the 90s, how about you work with what you've got to hand and come up with something viable..."
"No no, these guys will be badass. Totally Epic! They'll be better than sliced bread. Is that your daughter? She looks like a bit of a goer, does she get it from her mother?"
"Yeah, damn right she does! Fine, you've appealed to my soft-side, go for it!"
:eek:
Nope, can't see anyway in which tracking down the Botany Bay could in anyway be sold as a viable mission...
So what you're saying, is:
"We got screwed over, now's your turn to suck it?"
Nice...
I grew up on ToS, had no issue with TNG when it came out, was a bit unsure how DS-9 would work when proposed (Didn't realize they'd stolen the idea from Babylon 5 proposals) but loved it from the first episode. Won't go so far as to say I 'loved' Voyager, but I didn't see it as any worse than the other series. So that 'we had to put up with it' just doesn't carry any weight with me...
I can tolerate JJverse being an alternate dimension (the film admitted it itself) but what I cannot and will not tolerate, is someone cherry-picking key points from existing works, throwing them in for good measure, filling the rest up with whatever he can be bothered to come up with, and then having the nerve to try and claim he's doing people a favor and re-invigorating a franchise which was doing quite nicely as it had been...
"I'll Be Seeing You" just came on my playlist :cool:
At this level of magnitude, with such flimsy justification, yeah, it sure is... At least Admiral Dougherty had the demonstrable benefit to the entire Federation as his impetus for his part in the Ba'ku operation... Going after the Botany Bay to scare off the Big Bad Romulans from Teh Future is just weak from an in universe perspective, and sloppy writing from an RL perspective
Thank you! :P
...Oh, baby, you know, I've really got to leave you / Oh, I can hear it callin 'me / I said don't you hear it callin' me the way it used to do?...
- Anne Bredon
Nope, the Kumari is a 2409 all new ship based on the old one.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
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Link: StarTrek.com's Profile on Peter Weller
As we all know from experience, certain actors have been typecast in certain roles.
John Harrison's character may be in the forefront, but his strings are most likely being pulled by Weller's character. You can always tell who the bad guy is by the cast.