and stormshade having u waltz in here saying someting 1 time a week dont mean that you guys listen it means u acknowledge we are here , talking with us is another thing coming and stating facts and sayint thats how it is and then leaving another week to adress some SMURFs notion that his frigging flying glaxay craft has a torp port placed wrong is getting stupid..
I may have it wrong but it seems the Dev's want to pick and choose what type of feed back the players are giving. They seem to be looking for the thumbs up when most of the players are giving them the thumbs down. They want to hear 'great job Dev's' instead of the 'your not doing too hot" that the community has been giving them lately.
"No communication from Cryptic aboout anything at all..", eh. Have youbothered to look at the Dev Tracker lately? If you had, you would have seen the STO Devs posts and communication on:
And there was quite a buit more that I skipped over; but I think the point is made and it's quite clear the STO Dev team is more communicative an up front than any Dev team from any other released MMO to date.
Hyperbole certainly doesn't help the point you're trying to makr imo.
What you posted is all well and good.... if you're playing on Tribble as most of what you posted is Tribble-related. Personally, I don't. I do not pay a monthly subscription fee to be a testing troubleshooter. That's their job, not mine. I am a customer. I pay a monthly subscription fee to play a well-polished final product. Those that are interested in doing so, by all means go ahead. I'm not saying that's wrong or that they shouldn't, just that I and a number of others choose not to. Tribble maintenance info isn't really something that impacts the "regular" player. Yes, it does impact patches and like but patches are what they are; they will happen and change gameplay whether we like the changes or not. Oh, and the recent Engineering Report you cited? I, too, love Engineering reports and devour them on site. It's just too bad we had to wait a month for it, which supports my point that general game feedback is insufficient.
I think what players generally want is an open dialogue, something a little more than a monthly message or troubleshooting test-related posts. Players read and post in the Feedback forums with the expectation of just that: FEEDBACK. As Phlyto pointed out, there has not been much of that in this forum. Clearly, this particular KDF issue (among many others) continues to escalate without much acknowledgement/input from Cryptic. It's true there are a lot of players that just need to get over themselves, many might justly be labeled as those that cannot and will not ever be satisfied with anything. Even when taking those unsatisfiable players out of the equation, Cryptic fails in the general feedback department.
There has been a noticable pickup in Cryptic responses as of VERY LATE. Why would that be? Hmm, maybe it's because a lot of players are ticked off for a myriad of reasons. Whether they are justified in being irked/upset or not, Cryptic does have a responsibility to respond to player issues/inquiries, and the FEEDBACK FORUM is a most appropriate place for those exchanges to take place.
This arguement is more than just over how often we as a playing community should expect feedback from devs, it's about the remaining life of the game. KDF-content has been a hot, sore subject for quite awhile now. I'll go a step further with this and add that I'm strictly a Fed player. I have no Klingon alt. While I'm really into aesthetics and enjoyed the ornate detail that was put into what limited KDF-content that I saw, unfortunately I just didn't get into it and deleted the one I started. That being said, I still find it extremely important that the KDF become and remain a playable, viable faction. To put a Trek spin on an old saying, "As the KDF goes, so goes STO." If the support for and player base of the KDF evaporates, not only will there be no other playable-faction expansions, that'll be the end of the game, period. Fed players also need to wake up and realize that. We should ALL be screaming for more KDF attention so that this game we all enjoy and obviously care about can continue. That won't happen without player support, which I fear is falling significantly. Fingers crossed, though.
and listen up this fighting over what side has more or gets more isent helping the game at all , you feds can cry as much as you like so can we klings , it dont matter devs know klings lack content and so do the feds but since feds seems to be the selling point in all podcasts promotions bug fixes and chats that devs/cryptic do klings will allways be 2nd place ... We still play the same game all content is good content feds need to understand every klingon main pay just as much as them more klingons = more content in game to making klingons leavs means kess cash into devs wich leads to less content all over...
BINGO
...Less content all over = lower subscriber rate, which will sooner or later (unfortunately, probably sooner) = No STO.
and stormshade having u waltz in here saying someting 1 time a week dont mean that you guys listen it means u acknowledge we are here , talking with us is another thing coming and stating facts and sayint thats how it is and then leaving another week to adress some SMURFs notion that his frigging flying glaxay craft has a torp port placed wrong is getting stupid..
There's no need to abandon this forum, and we are listening to your feedback.
It is going to take time to correct the current faction imbalance, and it's something we're actively working on.
Klingons are getting a number of updates this Season to help begin to rectify this balance issue.
You are getting more updated costume options than the Federation is, and you are getting more new episodes than Federation Players are.
Yes, the Federation is getting the Diplomatic Corps, however, you are getting several new episodes strung across several levels, as well as access to any new "standard" PvE content being introduced. We know that this doesn't "fix" anything. However, it is a start.
Thanks,
Stormshade
Why aren't we treated with parity of esteem in this sub-forum?
Wheres the Developer dialogue that was promised?
All other subforums receive interaction with the Developement team while we remain ignored.
The only Dev forum posts in this section are appeasement.
Why should we continue to post here and why should we continue to Subscribe to STO when its clear that the Cryptic vision of expansion for KDF after Season 2 is based on multi-factional episodes that DO NOT account for the possibility of KDF storytelling.
This policy for the future is "Copy & Paste" KDF missions which are designed for Starfleet players and Klingons are given them just to shut us up and a lame attempt at providing KDF content.
Why aren't we treated with parity of esteem in this sub-forum?
Wheres the Developer dialogue that was promised?
All other subforums receive interaction with the Developement team while we remain ignored.
The only Dev forum posts in this section are appeasement.
Why should we continue to post here and why should we continue to Subscribe to STO when its clear that the Cryptic vision of expansion for KDF after Season 2 is based on multi-factional episodes that DO NOT account for the possibility of KDF storytelling.
This policy for the future is "Copy & Paste" KDF missions which are designed for Starfleet players and Klingons are given them just to shut us up and a lame attempt at providing KDF content.
well not to shoot u way down but the 8 misisons coming in season 2 ar far from copy and past but this is i way late if the 8 misisons was the 1st baby steps in the 45 day patch then this whould been a lot calmer , but this is a a bit to little to late for most....
DEV 1: Wow. Look at the Klingons. Sigh. A lot of work to do there.
DEV 2: Yep. We need to do something about it.
DEV 3: I agree!
DEV 4 (walks in): Hey guys! Want to see my plans for the new T6 Defiant Refit? Its got battle cloak and three Commander slots!
Ohhs and Ahhs around as the Devs move off....
I do think that the Devs and others in the game are well aware of Klingon issues. I do think that they want to do something about it at some level. However, there is a fundamental, almost philosophical conflict at play that affects the entire situation.
Some posters in this thread are treating ALL content added as moves forward in the game. There is validity in this viewpoint. Others are categorizing content added based on faction. The issue is that in some player's eyes, as long as content is being added, it is good for the game, and good for the player base, while in other player's eyes, the percentage of love given to the factions is imbalanced, and too much love to one faction can actually damage the future of the game.
I have read threads in the General Feedback forum that suggest that the Klingon faction should be dumped. or merged into the Federation as vassals, or otherwise allowed to simply fade away and die. I have read in the General Forums that some Federation players would be happy if this was a Federation faction game only, and that since the Federation is more popular, then focusing all of the content added to the game only makes sense if it is Federation focused.
I don't mean to stir things up..but these posters are not being banned. They are not being debated with, and although their viewpoints are extreme (in my opinion) they are being read...and who knows -- possibly considered. I certainly hope that is not the case.
I do hope that the extra time being taken for the Season 2 rollout has some nice surprises for us. I hope that the reason it was delayed by about a week or so means that maybe we will get a refit or two, or maybe even an actual new ship we could use (I apologize to those extremely few players out there that use Carriers...but you ARE somewhat rare LOL) ourselves. That would be nice...and it would go a long way towards evening some things out.
Maybe I am crazy...but I still do have some faith in the game. The bottom line is that despite all of its warts...and there are quite a few...this is the best Star Trek game to come along in years. However...it could be light years better if the factions were more balanced. I am just saying.
I agree that the KDF side is lacking in content,but you have to realize that it takes time to create the things you want.And yelling and screaming will not make it go any faster.I believe that our patience will be rewarded.
well not to shoot u way down but the 8 misisons coming in season 2 ar far from copy and past but this is i way late if the 8 misisons was the 1st baby steps in the 45 day patch then this whould been a lot calmer , but this is a a bit to little to late for most....
Hi i agree that the 8 KDF specific missions on Tribble are promising.
I've played 2 and enjoyed them.
I've also played the multi-factional epsiodes on Tribble.
Cryptics current stated plan is that the new Weekly missions with be playable by any faction.
This appears to be Cryptics plan for increasing KDF mission content after Season 2.
I believe that such missions will not be able to fully immerse or do justice to KDF storytelling.
I've played 2 missions on Tribble that are playable by either Faction and in the second mission i began to see indications that this entire Concept will not work in a satisfactory way for KDF players.
IT was clearly a Starfleet mission were absolutely ZERO account had been made for KDF players or the possibility to immerse themselves in being Klingon.
There's no need to abandon this forum, and we are listening to your feedback.
I just looked through the 20 pages of the Dev tracker and there are only 3 posts on the Klingon Gameplay forum. The one you just made, and 2 in German.
I agree that the KDF side is lacking in content,but you have to realize that it takes time to create the things you want.And yelling and screaming will not make it go any faster.I believe that our patience will be rewarded.
The problem is Klingons are a low priority for Cryptic. So while "yelling and screaming"(as you so ridiculously put it) may not make Cryptic WORK any faster, it very well MAY make them consider Klingons a higher priority, which effectively means Klingon issues get done faster than they would as a lower priority.
I just looked through the 20 pages of the Dev tracker and there are only 3 posts on the Klingon Gameplay forum. The one you just made, and 2 in German.
Well I guess we have just been doing it all wrong. We should all translate our feedback into German so Hans, the lonely Klingon developer, can actually understand what we are asking for.
There's no need to abandon this forum, and we are listening to your feedback.
It is going to take time to correct the current faction imbalance, and it's something we're actively working on.
Klingons are getting a number of updates this Season to help begin to rectify this balance issue.
You are getting more updated costume options than the Federation is, and you are getting more new episodes than Federation Players are.
Yes, the Federation is getting the Diplomatic Corps, however, you are getting several new episodes strung across several levels, as well as access to any new "standard" PvE content being introduced. We know that this doesn't "fix" anything. However, it is a start.
Thanks,
Stormshade
Yes, there maybe several new episodes, but the Diplomatic Corps is a whole new game mechanic, with its own separate rewards. Several episodes != Diplomatic Corps.
The feds get 3 refit vessels each with unique powers, this in itself is going to have impact on PVP as there is no Klingon equivalents. One carrier just won't cut it.
Feds have another 2 ships coming on C-store yet again both have unique powers, the nebula AWACS power will also cause a pretty big shift of PVP balance as well.
Feds get to have a Klingon BO, complete with all the Klingon costume options through Diplomacy. Whether Klinks want them or not, there is no option to have Fed BO's on Klingon ships.
Diplomacy will also give feds a trans-warp ability, as well as the Excelsior C-store ship having a trans-warp power. Yet again no Klingon equivalent.
Yes, there maybe several new episodes, but the Diplomatic Corps is a whole new game mechanic, with its own separate rewards. Several episodes != Diplomatic Corps.
There's a reason why we didn't open up the Diplomatic Corps to Klingons. We felt it didn't make any sense.
I realize that there have been times when we've seen Klingon Diplomacy at work in the movies and television shows. However, the way that Klingon Diplomacy works is much different from the way federation Diplomacy works, and this was meant to be a non combat system, something the Fed players have been asking for.
The two are vastly different cultures. In "A Matter of Honor" we got to watch Riker become the first ever Star Fleet Officer to participate in an Officer Exchange Program with the KDF. During which time he spent a good deal of time studying the culture. What was the first thing he did once on board his new vessel serving as First Officer?
He beat the TRIBBLE out of the ships second in command.
We've seen countless stories of incidents where Klingon "Diplomats" reach a "consensus" by simply "removing" those who have differing opinions from the conversation. The society is not ran by the pen, but rather by the sword, and sometimes, daggers in the night.
So, if you're telling me that you, the representatives of the "Mighty" Klingon Empire, have decided that you want to set aside your differences and come to the table and talk about all your problems instead of solving them like the warriors you are, I'll go try and convince the powers that be that you should be able to
join the Diplomatic Corps as well.
However, what I think your really want right now is more content that makes sense for Klingons. In which case, my answer remains the same. We're working on rectifying that imbalance. However, it's going to take time.
There's a reason why we didn't open up the Diplomatic Corps to Klingons. We felt it didn't make any sense.
I realize that there have been times when we've seen Klingon Diplomacy at work in the movies and television shows. However, the way that Klingon Diplomacy works is much different from the way federation Diplomacy works, and this was meant to be a non combat system, something the Fed players have been asking for.
The two are vastly different cultures. In "A Matter of Honor" we got to watch Riker become the first ever Star Fleet Officer to participate in an Officer Exchange Program with the KDF. During which time he spent a good deal of time studying the culture. What was the first thing he did once on board his new vessel serving as First Officer?
He beat the TRIBBLE out of the ships second in command.
We've seen countless stories of incidents where Klingon "Diplomats" reach a "consensus" by simply "removing" those who have differing opinions from the conversation. The society is not ran by the pen, but rather by the sword, and sometimes, daggers in the night.
So, if you're telling me that you, the representatives of the "Mighty" Klingon Empire, have decided that you want to set aside your differences and come to the table and talk about all your problems instead of solving them like the warriors you are, I'll go try and convince the powers that be that you should be able to
join the Diplomatic Corps as well.
However, what I think your really want right now is more content that makes sense for Klingons. In which case, my answer remains the same. We're working on rectifying that imbalance. However, it's going to take time.
Thanks,
Stormshade
That sounds fine to me...Since I have killed a great deal of them whilst trying to level, is there a way (since for reasons unknown to me we haven't gotten one yet) to get a tribble killer accolade?
There's a reason why we didn't open up the Diplomatic Corps to Klingons. We felt it didn't make any sense.
<snip>
However, what I think your really want right now is more content that makes sense for Klingons. In which case, my answer remains the same. We're working on rectifying that imbalance. However, it's going to take time.
I agree. The imbalance isn't nearly fixed, but you guys have made great strides with what I've seen so far on Tribble. A diplomatic corps doesn't make sense for the KDF, but I do hope people are brainstorming an alternative system that can be unique to the Klingon faction. It could be related to conquering planets - maybe a combination of ground/space combat for the inital assault, and then a non-combat portion to sign the terms of surrender. Just something to balance out the fact that the Feds get something the KDF doesn't.
That said, I know this stuff takes time. Until then, keep the missions coming!
Pretty sure no one round here actualy wants the FDC copied over lock stock and barrel to the klingon side, as you said it just wouldn't fit. there is a thread in the tribble general discussion forum with some idea's for a klingon style diplomacy system, some of the idea's in there are quite good. http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=167893
As I said before i think the biggest reason for the 'uproar' atm is becuase season 2 was hailed by the devs as a klingon patch for so long and most feel somewhat let down. that and the refits, I seriously can't imagine it would take too long to do a little recoding on some models already in game to get a couple of quick and dirty klingon refits out. (unless of course there is far more work involved than I am envisioning, quite possible.) Hell there's two threads in this section with suggestions that could be used.
As I said before i think the biggest reason for the 'uproar' atm is becuase season 2 was hailed by the devs as a klingon patch for so long and most feel somewhat let down. that and the refits, I seriously can't imagine it would take too long to do a little recoding on some models already in game to get a couple of quick and dirty klingon refits out. (unless of course there is far more work involved than I am envisioning, quite possible.) Hell there's two threads in this section with suggestions that could be used.
As far as the refits are concerened there really is NO excuse for the Klingons not getting some as Dstahl already posted that the design team knocked 2 of the Fed ones up in an evening!
I think we all agree that Klingon players weren't/aren't asking for a "Diplomtic Corps" identical to the Federation. It is nice that you responded to this point with examples from the show and reasons why you didn't include it. THAT is the kind of communication that we all love to see.
I think what still isn't coming across to us player from you Cryptic folk (no pun intended) is what you really plan on adding. Not what you didn't add, and why you didn't add it. Like I said, it's great that you even took your time to respond to that, but it didn't really answer the question of "what's next for us?"
Have Klingon players been asking for more mission and PvE based content? Absolutely, and despite some of the negative nellies here, we appriciate the work you are doing. It just seems like some of the new content comes way out of left field. Obviously you aren't obligated or required to talk to us at all, but I think some of the concern comes not just from the little content Klingons are getting, but from what we are actually getting. I admit I have been gone for a few months, but I've been scanning the forums and I cannot find where anyone requested a new Carrier class ship, but I do see a lot of people asking for new Cruisers, or at least different skins for our existing ships.
Can't think of a good way to close my point so... there you have it.
However, what I think your really want right now is more content that makes sense for Klingons. In which case, my answer remains the same. We're working on rectifying that imbalance. However, it's going to take time.
How about a first step then and adding refit ships for Klingons to the Season 2 update. As per dstahl it only takes a few hours to design 2 of them.
The point is, you have many Klingons like me that have been waiting since release for the promised updates. We are at max level, and we can't really use low level episodes. At max level all we can do is PvP, since we can't form a group for Infected, rtc. due to lack of players most of the time. At least let us PvP then with the same toys the Federation gets.
Oddly enough they don't need to post to have read everything.
Maybe the Cryptic community folks need to start a Blizzard style approach and constantly remind people not to fish/beg/plead for dev posts and that they do actually read stuff without replying to everything >.>
OK, that's simple. Please do not fish/beg/plead for dev posts. And we do read many, many things without replying to everything. If I replied to every thread I'd read, that's all I'd do.
(Bonus tip: I stop reading a thread any time I see the word "petition." They're against the forum rules, and annoying besides.)
Will I wade into a ragefest? Not normally. I find that people are more intent on saying AAARRRRUUUGHHHH!!!! I'M ANGRY!!!!! ON THE INTERNET!!!! than actually providing feedback and/or having a reasonable discussion. (Although being called an "incompetent cupcake" has been a highlight of my year. )
Now onto the topic at hand ...
I will totally agree with you that the KDF needs more ships, customization, items, stories, etc. It's a process. We're working on it!
We have a small team. Not everything can be done *immediately.* (For example, I'm the only writer on the project, and I'm cross-training in content design so I can help add some things that wouldn't get done otherwise.)
The producers set the schedules, and Dstahl and his crew have to balance everything that everybody wants and figure out how to get the most out of the time and resources available.
Episodes take a lot of manhours from multiple people. (me, content designers, artists, combat designers, maybe software if new tech is involved) So it makes sense to consider content that either faction can play, like the new weekly and high-level Episodes.
I did, however, fight for (and get!) tech that allows me to give different dialogue to the KDF and Starfleet. In the weekly episodes, you'll find that each side has a different reason for helping the Deferi, for example.
I think Season 2 is turning out pretty great. The Klingon-only Episodes are some of my favorites, and I hope I get to do more, because I have more KDF stories that I want to tell. Season 3 is shaping up to be cool as well, and we should be adding more things that players have been asking for.
There's a reason why we didn't open up the Diplomatic Corps to Klingons. We felt it didn't make any sense.
I realize that there have been times when we've seen Klingon Diplomacy at work in the movies and television shows. However, the way that Klingon Diplomacy works is much different from the way federation Diplomacy works, and this was meant to be a non combat system, something the Fed players have been asking for.
The two are vastly different cultures. In "A Matter of Honor" we got to watch Riker become the first ever Star Fleet Officer to participate in an Officer Exchange Program with the KDF. During which time he spent a good deal of time studying the culture. What was the first thing he did once on board his new vessel serving as First Officer?
He beat the TRIBBLE out of the ships second in command.
We've seen countless stories of incidents where Klingon "Diplomats" reach a "consensus" by simply "removing" those who have differing opinions from the conversation. The society is not ran by the pen, but rather by the sword, and sometimes, daggers in the night.
So, if you're telling me that you, the representatives of the "Mighty" Klingon Empire, have decided that you want to set aside your differences and come to the table and talk about all your problems instead of solving them like the warriors you are, I'll go try and convince the powers that be that you should be able to
join the Diplomatic Corps as well.
However, what I think your really want right now is more content that makes sense for Klingons. In which case, my answer remains the same. We're working on rectifying that imbalance. However, it's going to take time.
Thanks,
Stormshade
The point was not about Diplomacy itself, it was a reply to your post saying that, we Klingons, were getting more than the Feds. My point is that several episodes do not equal a whole new game mechanic with it's own rewards, one of which is the use of Klingon BO's on Fed ships.
If Klingons don't do peaceful diplomacy how is it that members of the Klingon Empire will serve on-board the ships of a faction they are at war with! Apparently the Feds who achieve this have done so through peaceful means?
There is also the lack of new ships for the Klingon faction, surely out of the 5 ships (3 refit + 2 C-store) some time could have been found to implement Klingon refits or more ships?
Pretty sure no one round here actualy wants the FDC copied over lock stock and barrel to the klingon side, as you said it just wouldn't fit. there is a thread in the tribble general discussion forum with some idea's for a klingon style diplomacy system, some of the idea's in there are quite good. http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=167893
As I said before i think the biggest reason for the 'uproar' atm is becuase season 2 was hailed by the devs as a klingon patch for so long and most feel somewhat let down. that and the refits, I seriously can't imagine it would take too long to do a little recoding on some models already in game to get a couple of quick and dirty klingon refits out. (unless of course there is far more work involved than I am envisioning, quite possible.) Hell there's two threads in this section with suggestions that could be used.
See, that's the something I don't get. I can't remember a single time that the devs referred to Season 2 as 'The Klingon Patch' or anything to that effect. I recall them mentioning that there was a lot of Klingon stuff planned for Season 2 and it looks like we're getting most of it with some more on the way after release (the biggest thing for me being the spiffy PvE content, something I've wanted since launch). I think a lot of the Klingon faction hard-liners got it into their heads that this was going to be a mostly Klingon-centric update and went ballistic when their assumption didn't pan out.
There is also the lack of new ships for the Klingon faction, surely out of the 5 ships (3 refit + 2 C-store) some time could have been found to implement Klingon refits or more ships?
Not to mention the design devs are still working on a fed ship because the threw a fit that the armor did'nt do what the shows did instead of trying to get a couple of new ships out for us before season 2 release and work on the armor later. heck I'd be happy at this point for a couple new skins for ships that are already there. Feds have a bunch of brand new designs never seen in the movies or the shows so why cant there be Klingon New designs as well. In a perfect world for every fed ship skin released there should be a Klingon Ship skin released as well that would begin to make Klingons happy. Instead Feds get what like 10 skins now plus the 3 per class they already had to our 4 new skins along with the ones we started with. There has got to be a way for the design team to split it up and release one skin per faction every time a new one is released.
The point was not about Diplomacy itself, it was a reply to your post saying that, we Klingons, were getting more than the Feds. My point is that several episodes do not equal a whole new game mechanic with it's own rewards, one of which is the use of Klingon BO's on Fed ships.
If Klingons don't do peaceful diplomacy how is it that members of the Klingon Empire will serve on-board the ships of a faction they are at war with! Apparently the Feds who achieve this have done so through peaceful means?
There is also the lack of new ships for the Klingon faction, surely out of the 5 ships (3 refit + 2 C-store) some time could have been found to implement Klingon refits or more ships?
You can't get blood from a stone.
They're working on new things. They're slowly building up the KDF ... season by season, fleshing them out.
They can't do everything wanted and do it all yesterday.
It's frustrating especially if you're into playing video games which are instantly gratifying disposable entertainment.
But not even Scotty could work the miracle that some posters expect.
This thread is about all you're going to get.
Let's Recap:
Klingons to Devs ... "We want more stuff! We're not complete! This sucks!"
Devs to Klingons ... "We agree. We are working on giving you more stuff. And here's a bunch of reasons why things aren't working out as smoothly as you were hoping."
That you got that much is amazing. That's part of transparency and open communication.
You should appreciate that more than these forums indicate. Because other companies are far more stand offish and antagonistic to their customers on these topics. Internal goals stay internal.
So you think multi faction missions are the way to go? really? maybe that would be fine once you bring the Klingon PvE missions upto what the feds already have but as it stands at the moment i say no.
I know i and my friends don't want multi faction missions, we want true klingon missions that tell a story of the Empire, a propper story like the feds get, giving us 8 missions and a few new costume options is seriously not good enough, especially as time was found to create a whole new game mechanic for the feds with the diplomatic corp.
Also for ships feds get 3 new refits and very soon 2 more completely unique ships with unique powers on the C Store while Klingons get a new carrier, a ship that hardly anyone wants and even fewer asked for.
And in the end what do we basically get told? BE PATIENT.....the same thing were told after ever major update......deja vu all over again it seems.
Comments
Regretably what is posted is what was supposed to be for seaon 2, nothing more. So it does not make anything more balanced. So it's not even a start.
Hyperbole? Ppffft.
**NEWSFLASH** / **BULLETIN** / **THIS JUST IN**
This.is.not.the.Tribble.forum.
This.is.a.forum.in.the.Feedback.section.
Repeat, Feedback.section.
What you posted is all well and good.... if you're playing on Tribble as most of what you posted is Tribble-related. Personally, I don't. I do not pay a monthly subscription fee to be a testing troubleshooter. That's their job, not mine. I am a customer. I pay a monthly subscription fee to play a well-polished final product. Those that are interested in doing so, by all means go ahead. I'm not saying that's wrong or that they shouldn't, just that I and a number of others choose not to. Tribble maintenance info isn't really something that impacts the "regular" player. Yes, it does impact patches and like but patches are what they are; they will happen and change gameplay whether we like the changes or not. Oh, and the recent Engineering Report you cited? I, too, love Engineering reports and devour them on site. It's just too bad we had to wait a month for it, which supports my point that general game feedback is insufficient.
I think what players generally want is an open dialogue, something a little more than a monthly message or troubleshooting test-related posts. Players read and post in the Feedback forums with the expectation of just that: FEEDBACK. As Phlyto pointed out, there has not been much of that in this forum. Clearly, this particular KDF issue (among many others) continues to escalate without much acknowledgement/input from Cryptic. It's true there are a lot of players that just need to get over themselves, many might justly be labeled as those that cannot and will not ever be satisfied with anything. Even when taking those unsatisfiable players out of the equation, Cryptic fails in the general feedback department.
There has been a noticable pickup in Cryptic responses as of VERY LATE. Why would that be? Hmm, maybe it's because a lot of players are ticked off for a myriad of reasons. Whether they are justified in being irked/upset or not, Cryptic does have a responsibility to respond to player issues/inquiries, and the FEEDBACK FORUM is a most appropriate place for those exchanges to take place.
This arguement is more than just over how often we as a playing community should expect feedback from devs, it's about the remaining life of the game. KDF-content has been a hot, sore subject for quite awhile now. I'll go a step further with this and add that I'm strictly a Fed player. I have no Klingon alt. While I'm really into aesthetics and enjoyed the ornate detail that was put into what limited KDF-content that I saw, unfortunately I just didn't get into it and deleted the one I started. That being said, I still find it extremely important that the KDF become and remain a playable, viable faction. To put a Trek spin on an old saying, "As the KDF goes, so goes STO." If the support for and player base of the KDF evaporates, not only will there be no other playable-faction expansions, that'll be the end of the game, period. Fed players also need to wake up and realize that. We should ALL be screaming for more KDF attention so that this game we all enjoy and obviously care about can continue. That won't happen without player support, which I fear is falling significantly. Fingers crossed, though.
BINGO
...Less content all over = lower subscriber rate, which will sooner or later (unfortunately, probably sooner) = No STO.
Another really good, valid point from Tarjan.
Why aren't we treated with parity of esteem in this sub-forum?
Wheres the Developer dialogue that was promised?
All other subforums receive interaction with the Developement team while we remain ignored.
The only Dev forum posts in this section are appeasement.
Why should we continue to post here and why should we continue to Subscribe to STO when its clear that the Cryptic vision of expansion for KDF after Season 2 is based on multi-factional episodes that DO NOT account for the possibility of KDF storytelling.
This policy for the future is "Copy & Paste" KDF missions which are designed for Starfleet players and Klingons are given them just to shut us up and a lame attempt at providing KDF content.
well not to shoot u way down but the 8 misisons coming in season 2 ar far from copy and past but this is i way late if the 8 misisons was the 1st baby steps in the 45 day patch then this whould been a lot calmer , but this is a a bit to little to late for most....
DEV 1: Wow. Look at the Klingons. Sigh. A lot of work to do there.
DEV 2: Yep. We need to do something about it.
DEV 3: I agree!
DEV 4 (walks in): Hey guys! Want to see my plans for the new T6 Defiant Refit? Its got battle cloak and three Commander slots!
Ohhs and Ahhs around as the Devs move off....
I do think that the Devs and others in the game are well aware of Klingon issues. I do think that they want to do something about it at some level. However, there is a fundamental, almost philosophical conflict at play that affects the entire situation.
Some posters in this thread are treating ALL content added as moves forward in the game. There is validity in this viewpoint. Others are categorizing content added based on faction. The issue is that in some player's eyes, as long as content is being added, it is good for the game, and good for the player base, while in other player's eyes, the percentage of love given to the factions is imbalanced, and too much love to one faction can actually damage the future of the game.
I have read threads in the General Feedback forum that suggest that the Klingon faction should be dumped. or merged into the Federation as vassals, or otherwise allowed to simply fade away and die. I have read in the General Forums that some Federation players would be happy if this was a Federation faction game only, and that since the Federation is more popular, then focusing all of the content added to the game only makes sense if it is Federation focused.
I don't mean to stir things up..but these posters are not being banned. They are not being debated with, and although their viewpoints are extreme (in my opinion) they are being read...and who knows -- possibly considered. I certainly hope that is not the case.
I do hope that the extra time being taken for the Season 2 rollout has some nice surprises for us. I hope that the reason it was delayed by about a week or so means that maybe we will get a refit or two, or maybe even an actual new ship we could use (I apologize to those extremely few players out there that use Carriers...but you ARE somewhat rare LOL) ourselves. That would be nice...and it would go a long way towards evening some things out.
Maybe I am crazy...but I still do have some faith in the game. The bottom line is that despite all of its warts...and there are quite a few...this is the best Star Trek game to come along in years. However...it could be light years better if the factions were more balanced. I am just saying.
Hi i agree that the 8 KDF specific missions on Tribble are promising.
I've played 2 and enjoyed them.
I've also played the multi-factional epsiodes on Tribble.
Cryptics current stated plan is that the new Weekly missions with be playable by any faction.
This appears to be Cryptics plan for increasing KDF mission content after Season 2.
I believe that such missions will not be able to fully immerse or do justice to KDF storytelling.
I've played 2 missions on Tribble that are playable by either Faction and in the second mission i began to see indications that this entire Concept will not work in a satisfactory way for KDF players.
IT was clearly a Starfleet mission were absolutely ZERO account had been made for KDF players or the possibility to immerse themselves in being Klingon.
Cross faction missions are NOT what we neeed, we need TRUE Klingon stories that tell a real tale of the Klingon Empire.
I just looked through the 20 pages of the Dev tracker and there are only 3 posts on the Klingon Gameplay forum. The one you just made, and 2 in German.
The problem is Klingons are a low priority for Cryptic. So while "yelling and screaming"(as you so ridiculously put it) may not make Cryptic WORK any faster, it very well MAY make them consider Klingons a higher priority, which effectively means Klingon issues get done faster than they would as a lower priority.
Well I guess we have just been doing it all wrong. We should all translate our feedback into German so Hans, the lonely Klingon developer, can actually understand what we are asking for.
Lieber Cryptic, Wir m
Yes, there maybe several new episodes, but the Diplomatic Corps is a whole new game mechanic, with its own separate rewards. Several episodes != Diplomatic Corps.
The feds get 3 refit vessels each with unique powers, this in itself is going to have impact on PVP as there is no Klingon equivalents. One carrier just won't cut it.
Feds have another 2 ships coming on C-store yet again both have unique powers, the nebula AWACS power will also cause a pretty big shift of PVP balance as well.
Feds get to have a Klingon BO, complete with all the Klingon costume options through Diplomacy. Whether Klinks want them or not, there is no option to have Fed BO's on Klingon ships.
Diplomacy will also give feds a trans-warp ability, as well as the Excelsior C-store ship having a trans-warp power. Yet again no Klingon equivalent.
There's a reason why we didn't open up the Diplomatic Corps to Klingons. We felt it didn't make any sense.
I realize that there have been times when we've seen Klingon Diplomacy at work in the movies and television shows. However, the way that Klingon Diplomacy works is much different from the way federation Diplomacy works, and this was meant to be a non combat system, something the Fed players have been asking for.
The two are vastly different cultures. In "A Matter of Honor" we got to watch Riker become the first ever Star Fleet Officer to participate in an Officer Exchange Program with the KDF. During which time he spent a good deal of time studying the culture. What was the first thing he did once on board his new vessel serving as First Officer?
He beat the TRIBBLE out of the ships second in command.
We've seen countless stories of incidents where Klingon "Diplomats" reach a "consensus" by simply "removing" those who have differing opinions from the conversation. The society is not ran by the pen, but rather by the sword, and sometimes, daggers in the night.
So, if you're telling me that you, the representatives of the "Mighty" Klingon Empire, have decided that you want to set aside your differences and come to the table and talk about all your problems instead of solving them like the warriors you are, I'll go try and convince the powers that be that you should be able to
join the Diplomatic Corps as well.
However, what I think your really want right now is more content that makes sense for Klingons. In which case, my answer remains the same. We're working on rectifying that imbalance. However, it's going to take time.
Thanks,
Stormshade
That sounds fine to me...Since I have killed a great deal of them whilst trying to level, is there a way (since for reasons unknown to me we haven't gotten one yet) to get a tribble killer accolade?
I agree. The imbalance isn't nearly fixed, but you guys have made great strides with what I've seen so far on Tribble. A diplomatic corps doesn't make sense for the KDF, but I do hope people are brainstorming an alternative system that can be unique to the Klingon faction. It could be related to conquering planets - maybe a combination of ground/space combat for the inital assault, and then a non-combat portion to sign the terms of surrender. Just something to balance out the fact that the Feds get something the KDF doesn't.
That said, I know this stuff takes time. Until then, keep the missions coming!
http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=167893
As I said before i think the biggest reason for the 'uproar' atm is becuase season 2 was hailed by the devs as a klingon patch for so long and most feel somewhat let down. that and the refits, I seriously can't imagine it would take too long to do a little recoding on some models already in game to get a couple of quick and dirty klingon refits out. (unless of course there is far more work involved than I am envisioning, quite possible.) Hell there's two threads in this section with suggestions that could be used.
As far as the refits are concerened there really is NO excuse for the Klingons not getting some as Dstahl already posted that the design team knocked 2 of the Fed ones up in an evening!
I think we all agree that Klingon players weren't/aren't asking for a "Diplomtic Corps" identical to the Federation. It is nice that you responded to this point with examples from the show and reasons why you didn't include it. THAT is the kind of communication that we all love to see.
I think what still isn't coming across to us player from you Cryptic folk (no pun intended) is what you really plan on adding. Not what you didn't add, and why you didn't add it. Like I said, it's great that you even took your time to respond to that, but it didn't really answer the question of "what's next for us?"
Have Klingon players been asking for more mission and PvE based content? Absolutely, and despite some of the negative nellies here, we appriciate the work you are doing. It just seems like some of the new content comes way out of left field. Obviously you aren't obligated or required to talk to us at all, but I think some of the concern comes not just from the little content Klingons are getting, but from what we are actually getting. I admit I have been gone for a few months, but I've been scanning the forums and I cannot find where anyone requested a new Carrier class ship, but I do see a lot of people asking for new Cruisers, or at least different skins for our existing ships.
Can't think of a good way to close my point so... there you have it.
How about a first step then and adding refit ships for Klingons to the Season 2 update. As per dstahl it only takes a few hours to design 2 of them.
The point is, you have many Klingons like me that have been waiting since release for the promised updates. We are at max level, and we can't really use low level episodes. At max level all we can do is PvP, since we can't form a group for Infected, rtc. due to lack of players most of the time. At least let us PvP then with the same toys the Federation gets.
OK, that's simple. Please do not fish/beg/plead for dev posts. And we do read many, many things without replying to everything. If I replied to every thread I'd read, that's all I'd do.
(Bonus tip: I stop reading a thread any time I see the word "petition." They're against the forum rules, and annoying besides.)
Will I wade into a ragefest? Not normally. I find that people are more intent on saying AAARRRRUUUGHHHH!!!! I'M ANGRY!!!!! ON THE INTERNET!!!! than actually providing feedback and/or having a reasonable discussion. (Although being called an "incompetent cupcake" has been a highlight of my year.
Now onto the topic at hand ...
I will totally agree with you that the KDF needs more ships, customization, items, stories, etc. It's a process. We're working on it!
We have a small team. Not everything can be done *immediately.* (For example, I'm the only writer on the project, and I'm cross-training in content design so I can help add some things that wouldn't get done otherwise.)
The producers set the schedules, and Dstahl and his crew have to balance everything that everybody wants and figure out how to get the most out of the time and resources available.
Episodes take a lot of manhours from multiple people. (me, content designers, artists, combat designers, maybe software if new tech is involved) So it makes sense to consider content that either faction can play, like the new weekly and high-level Episodes.
I did, however, fight for (and get!) tech that allows me to give different dialogue to the KDF and Starfleet. In the weekly episodes, you'll find that each side has a different reason for helping the Deferi, for example.
I think Season 2 is turning out pretty great. The Klingon-only Episodes are some of my favorites, and I hope I get to do more, because I have more KDF stories that I want to tell. Season 3 is shaping up to be cool as well, and we should be adding more things that players have been asking for.
The point was not about Diplomacy itself, it was a reply to your post saying that, we Klingons, were getting more than the Feds. My point is that several episodes do not equal a whole new game mechanic with it's own rewards, one of which is the use of Klingon BO's on Fed ships.
If Klingons don't do peaceful diplomacy how is it that members of the Klingon Empire will serve on-board the ships of a faction they are at war with! Apparently the Feds who achieve this have done so through peaceful means?
There is also the lack of new ships for the Klingon faction, surely out of the 5 ships (3 refit + 2 C-store) some time could have been found to implement Klingon refits or more ships?
See, that's the something I don't get. I can't remember a single time that the devs referred to Season 2 as 'The Klingon Patch' or anything to that effect. I recall them mentioning that there was a lot of Klingon stuff planned for Season 2 and it looks like we're getting most of it with some more on the way after release (the biggest thing for me being the spiffy PvE content, something I've wanted since launch). I think a lot of the Klingon faction hard-liners got it into their heads that this was going to be a mostly Klingon-centric update and went ballistic when their assumption didn't pan out.
Not to mention the design devs are still working on a fed ship because the threw a fit that the armor did'nt do what the shows did instead of trying to get a couple of new ships out for us before season 2 release and work on the armor later. heck I'd be happy at this point for a couple new skins for ships that are already there. Feds have a bunch of brand new designs never seen in the movies or the shows so why cant there be Klingon New designs as well. In a perfect world for every fed ship skin released there should be a Klingon Ship skin released as well that would begin to make Klingons happy. Instead Feds get what like 10 skins now plus the 3 per class they already had to our 4 new skins along with the ones we started with. There has got to be a way for the design team to split it up and release one skin per faction every time a new one is released.
You can't get blood from a stone.
They're working on new things. They're slowly building up the KDF ... season by season, fleshing them out.
They can't do everything wanted and do it all yesterday.
It's frustrating especially if you're into playing video games which are instantly gratifying disposable entertainment.
But not even Scotty could work the miracle that some posters expect.
This thread is about all you're going to get.
Let's Recap:
Klingons to Devs ... "We want more stuff! We're not complete! This sucks!"
Devs to Klingons ... "We agree. We are working on giving you more stuff. And here's a bunch of reasons why things aren't working out as smoothly as you were hoping."
That you got that much is amazing. That's part of transparency and open communication.
You should appreciate that more than these forums indicate. Because other companies are far more stand offish and antagonistic to their customers on these topics. Internal goals stay internal.
I know i and my friends don't want multi faction missions, we want true klingon missions that tell a story of the Empire, a propper story like the feds get, giving us 8 missions and a few new costume options is seriously not good enough, especially as time was found to create a whole new game mechanic for the feds with the diplomatic corp.
Also for ships feds get 3 new refits and very soon 2 more completely unique ships with unique powers on the C Store while Klingons get a new carrier, a ship that hardly anyone wants and even fewer asked for.
And in the end what do we basically get told? BE PATIENT.....the same thing were told after ever major update......deja vu all over again it seems.