I am going to relate this in a way most can understand.
Every night a group of 10 guys stands around a public park and get together to just play some football. Maybe they get another 10, maybe they just make a couple of groups of 5. Either way, they just get together every night and play a game and have a good time.
Eventually, a professional football team hears of the nightly game and decides that they want to jump in. So the professional football team comes in one night, having training and knowing each others strengths. Well, the group of guys just wanting to have fun are not only beaten.. they are destroyed.
The professional football team then decides that it is time to start yelling "L2P" and "this is where you went wrong.. blah blah blah" when you were just an average guy with a random team..TRYING to have fun.
Well, as time goes on, the professional team starts to show up every night. And as time goes by the guys who used to hang out at that park have either quit coming or have moved on to another park, in hopes that they can have fun again.
The professional football team gets upset that the people are not there any more and decides that it is the other guy's fault for not "learning to play" and just leaving. They then pat themselves on the back for "pwning the nubs" as they wait weeks for a potential game again, until they hear about a NEW park..and go repeat this story again.
This is basically what premades are doing to STO.. and any other darn game they find.
Make a queue for random players only and get the premades out of the way of the guys who just want to play the darn game.
Give them a queue, a ladder.. or whatever feeds their E-peens and let the rest of us have fun.
Or sit around in your empty park slapping each other on the back, congratulating yourselves on how you now rule this empty place.
The pro players in your example started as the guys in the park. They pushed a little harder, corrected their errors, brushed off their defeats, and learned a little more.
Perhaps, there is something you could learn from that yourself. There is the chance that you could be far better at this than you give yourself credit for. It's possible those you team with could do the same.
Even from a purely fan perspective, the characters of the franchise were thrust into a variety of bad situations. They grew, they adapted, they learned their ships, and crews like the back of their hand. Players doing so would eventually get better.
Khan never gave Kirk a time out, nor did the Borg do so for Picard. I honestly think the player base can adapt to these kinds of things just like they do in every other game.
***Last note: the team of five casual friends can meet another team of five casual friends and create a match. It can be done completely on YOUR terms and can be limited to YOUR friends only.
You get all the same rewards as you would from a standard match. It's a cool tool very few people use.***
I think his point is, their should be different ques for pugs and premades. 99% of pugs just don't compare to premades so there should be 2 different types of pvp. Like in WoW where you have regular battlegrounds for the average people and arena's for the organized premade players.
He's actually for what you and I want Ipigi, you just are reading something different from his post.
Hey, I'm all for having premade queues. What my grief is with him is that he implied premade groups ruin PvP. When I told him everybody can run a premade (even in a casual matter) he accused me of missing the point, of being pathetic and questioning my education and my ancestors.
I think I'm a little past seeing his point of view.
The pro players in your example started as the guys in the park. They pushed a little harder, corrected their errors, brushed off their defeats, and learned a little more.
Perhaps, there is something you could learn from that yourself. There is the chance that you could be far better at this than you give yourself credit for. It's possible those you team with could do the same.
Even from a purely fan perspective, the characters of the franchise were thrust into a variety of bad situations. They grew, they adapted, they learned their ships, and crews like the back of their hand. Players doing so would eventually get better.
Khan never gave Kirk a time out, nor did the Borg do so for Picard. I honestly think the player base can adapt to these kinds of things just like they do in every other game.
***Last note: the team of five casual friends can meet another team of five casual friends and create a match. It can be done completely on YOUR terms and can be limited to YOUR friends only.
You get all the same rewards as you would from a standard match. It's a cool tool very few people use.***
:cool:
I understand what you are saying. Don't agree with all of it, but you have some good points.
I am talking about options. There are good pug players too. A challenge is one thing, but almost no pug can beat a coordinated premade on voice chat. That is why the separation has to be made.
I understand what you are saying. Don't agree with all of it, but you have some good points.
I am talking about options. There are good pug players too. A challenge is one thing, but almost no pug can beat a coordinated premade on voice chat. That is why the separation has to be made.
What you want doesn't even work in WOW with a player base of 11.5 million. All the arena fixes never fixed that.
I'm really doubting your idea would do much more than make longer ques and more frustrated players, regardless of play style. IMO, it would be like the RA5 Fed ques pre season one, at absolute best case. That really would kill the game.
Making exactly what you want is easier. The tool exists now and just requires social networking.
Hey, I'm all for having premade queues. What my grief is with him is that he implied premade groups ruin PvP. When I told him everybody can run a premade (even in a casual matter) he accused me of missing the point, of being pathetic and questioning my education and my ancestors.
I think I'm a little past seeing his point of view.
Your base assumption is still wrong.
I am saying that the average player will get frustrated from constantly being bashed into the earth by a group of people who are coordinated on voice and play together constantly. It used to not bother me so much, but now with Season 1:"Revenge of the Burst Damage" it has become instant death. So eventually they stop queuing for the battles. How can a premade even find it FUN to instant kill an entire team?
Tell me, is THAT challenging... is THAT fun?
So you HAVE missed the point.
You have and are still missing it.
People have gotten my point CLEARLY, then posted about it .... and you still are not getting it, it seems.
What you want doesn't even work in WOW with a player base of 11.5 million. All the arena fixes never fixed that.
I'm really doubting your idea would do much more than make longer ques and more frustrated players, regardless of play style. IMO, it would be like the RA5 Fed ques pre season one, at absolute best case. That really would kill the game.
Making exactly what you want is easier. The tool exists now and just requires social networking.
If they would just have game TYPES and have the game choose the map.
Not each map and sizes...how about this..
Ground .............................. Premade
Space Objective.................. Premade
Space Brawl....................... Premade
Ground .............................. Pug
Space Objective.................. Pug
Space Brawl....................... Pug
On each side that is FvF FvK for example.. 12 total selections.. game chooses the map
How is that any longer than what we have now?
I can now queue for all 3 types at the same time.. for pug or premade. This actually helps the queue
to Ipigi
I've read every post in this so far and he only questioned your education and breading after several of your posts implying he's a crappy player, has no drive to improve and a variety of other things, so as I see it you insulted him first with your inability to understand the OP. So, I'd say this all started not because of him, but because of you looking to argue with someone thats doesn't like premades. I see both your points and agree with both, but you seem to only see your own and become rude to anyone that doesn't seemingly agree with you and then blame them for insulting you after you were being rude to them.
If they would just have game TYPES and have the game choose the map.
Not each map and sizes...how about this..
Ground .............................. Premade
Space Objective.................. Premade
Space Brawl....................... Premade
Ground .............................. Pug
Space Objective.................. Pug
Space Brawl....................... Pug
On each side that is FvF FvK for example.. 6 selections.. game chooses the map
How is that any longer than what we have now?
WOW tried the same thing with both their arena ques and their pre level 80 battegrounds. It didn't work with a player base of 11.5 million. Ours is much smaller.
You can make the matches you want right now. You just have to network.
WOW tried the same thing with both their arena ques and their pre level 80 battegrounds. It didn't work with a player base of 11.5 million. Ours is much smaller.
You can make the matches you want right now. You just have to network.
I can make the pug matches I want by networking? :rolleyes:
I can make the pug matches I want by networking? :rolleyes:
Yep, you can randomly group with people in a private channel. Have the chat channel be nothing, but casuals who want low impact, simply for casual fun, pvp with random groups rather than consistant teams.
In the end, that's what you are actually looking for. I'll choose to ignore the snarkiness.
to Ipigi
I've read every post in this so far and he only questioned your education and breading after several of your posts implying he's a crappy player, has no drive to improve and a variety of other things, so as I see it you insulted him first with your inability to understand the OP. So, I'd say this all started not because of him, but because of you looking to argue with someone thats doesn't like premades. I see both your points and agree with both, but you seem to only see your own and become rude to anyone that doesn't seemingly agree with you and then blame them for insulting you after you were being rude to them.
Allan, bud, I never attacked him on a personal level. I never once said to him he sucks as a player. If you read my posts, all they say is don't expect to win against a premade if you cant be bothered to make a premade yourself and not to come crying when you lose.
What I did accuse him of is implying that premade groups are just out to easily beat PUGs.
The professional football team then decides that it is time to start yelling "L2P" and "this is where you went wrong.. blah blah blah" when you were just an average guy with a random team..TRYING to have fun.
Apparently, we like to throw around L2P and trash talk when we win. We also seem to like ruining casual player's day. Having PvP'd with me, can you say that this is the case? Do we trash talk to pugs? Do we queue up to ruin peoples experience of the game?
Give them a queue, a ladder.. or whatever feeds their E-peens and let the rest of us have fun.
His way of saying we should get our own queue. Apparently, we just do this for E-peen. Have you ever felt that anyone in the fleet felt like they needed to "pwn nubz" to feel validated?
The Premade vs. PUG problem
The title of the thread. Obviously he sees Premades fighting PUGs as a problem. Although his post does bring the valid idea of premade queues, having the title be "Premade Vs. PUG Solution" sounds much less like an attack and more like an opinion.
/GRABS popcorn and enjoys the drama
to the OP........BWWWWAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Bottom line if you don't want to have a chance to fight a premade then don't PVP, complaining on the forums is not going to get you anything.
Here is a crazy idea.....make a private PUG channel and a Private PUG match up.
just go out and say
"hey anyone want to fight 5v5 with none of us having any teamwork or organization?"
I laugh at that you do not want a real challeng, you want crappy / medocre players VS each other rather than learning and get better and overcoming the fight that a premade offers. DO us all a favor stay in your PUGS and keep getting TRIBBLE by premades and crying ont he forums on how its not fair.....
the only thing pathetic is your interest in staying crappy. I will enjoy getting better and enjoying the level of comp to make myself better.
Lawl This Whole Thread Is Because Someone Got Burnt By A Premade Then Qqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqq
Almost this entire forum is because someone got burnt by someone else, and then other people told them to l2p then other people called those people idiots then other people jumped on the bandwagon and the whole thing turned to ****.
/GRABS popcorn and enjoys the drama
to the OP........BWWWWAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Bottom line if you don't want to have a chance to fight a premade then don't PVP, complaining on the forums is not going to get you anything.
Here is a crazy idea.....make a private PUG channel and a Private PUG match up.
just go out and say
"hey anyone want to fight 5v5 with none of us having any teamwork or organization?"
I laugh at that you do not want a real challeng, you want crappy / medocre players VS each other rather than learning and get better and overcoming the fight that a premade offers. DO us all a favor stay in your PUGS and keep getting TRIBBLE by premades and crying ont he forums on how its not fair.....
the only thing pathetic is your interest in staying crappy. I will enjoy getting better and enjoying the level of comp to make myself better.
Lawl This Whole Thread Is Because Someone Got Burnt By A Premade Then Qqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqq
(shortened because this was a dumb post)
Qq
People like you are a dime a dozen. Don't care what you "think" if that is a word I can use with you.
Other games have the setup the splits up the 2 types of gameplay. But apparently you are too afraid to fight people at your own level to consider this.
People like you are a dime a dozen. Don't care what you "think" if that is a word I can use with you.
Other games have the setup the splits up the 2 types of gameplay. But apparently you are too afraid to fight people at your own level to consider this.
Almost this entire forum is because someone got burnt by someone else, and then other people told them to l2p then other people called those people idiots then other people jumped on the bandwagon and the whole thing turned to ****.
Business as usual.
No, that is not why. I have played several MMO's and they have all had the intelligence and reasoning to split up pug and premades.
About time they did it here.
But I guess what people want is to defend the broken system and eventually when it is like CO and pvp is a joke,..you can all just stand around wondering what happened.
Well, you got one letter of the alphabet down. Good work. Maybe tomorrow they can teach you the letter "R"
I already know that one,
U R QQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQ
lol, and the This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Kwoance"
posts again, thinking I can see it.
Comments
I also relish running into 5 guys when I am alone.
Why? Because it forces me to step the play up.
I want the fight. Much more than win or loss.
This thread makes it seem like the OP is running into premades all the time. I count myself LUCKY if I run into more than one a night.
The pro players in your example started as the guys in the park. They pushed a little harder, corrected their errors, brushed off their defeats, and learned a little more.
Perhaps, there is something you could learn from that yourself. There is the chance that you could be far better at this than you give yourself credit for. It's possible those you team with could do the same.
Even from a purely fan perspective, the characters of the franchise were thrust into a variety of bad situations. They grew, they adapted, they learned their ships, and crews like the back of their hand. Players doing so would eventually get better.
Khan never gave Kirk a time out, nor did the Borg do so for Picard. I honestly think the player base can adapt to these kinds of things just like they do in every other game.
***Last note: the team of five casual friends can meet another team of five casual friends and create a match. It can be done completely on YOUR terms and can be limited to YOUR friends only.
You get all the same rewards as you would from a standard match. It's a cool tool very few people use.***
:cool:
I seem to have that bad luck. Only when I am doing the "kill 15" maps though. Most of the time in capture and hold it is safe to play.
Would like to see Enemy Mine used more though... because it is a good map that almost nobody plays
Hey, I'm all for having premade queues. What my grief is with him is that he implied premade groups ruin PvP. When I told him everybody can run a premade (even in a casual matter) he accused me of missing the point, of being pathetic and questioning my education and my ancestors.
I think I'm a little past seeing his point of view.
I understand what you are saying. Don't agree with all of it, but you have some good points.
I am talking about options. There are good pug players too. A challenge is one thing, but almost no pug can beat a coordinated premade on voice chat. That is why the separation has to be made.
What you want doesn't even work in WOW with a player base of 11.5 million. All the arena fixes never fixed that.
I'm really doubting your idea would do much more than make longer ques and more frustrated players, regardless of play style. IMO, it would be like the RA5 Fed ques pre season one, at absolute best case. That really would kill the game.
Making exactly what you want is easier. The tool exists now and just requires social networking.
Your base assumption is still wrong.
I am saying that the average player will get frustrated from constantly being bashed into the earth by a group of people who are coordinated on voice and play together constantly. It used to not bother me so much, but now with Season 1:"Revenge of the Burst Damage" it has become instant death. So eventually they stop queuing for the battles. How can a premade even find it FUN to instant kill an entire team?
Tell me, is THAT challenging... is THAT fun?
So you HAVE missed the point.
You have and are still missing it.
People have gotten my point CLEARLY, then posted about it .... and you still are not getting it, it seems.
If they would just have game TYPES and have the game choose the map.
Not each map and sizes...how about this..
Ground .............................. Premade
Space Objective.................. Premade
Space Brawl....................... Premade
Ground .............................. Pug
Space Objective.................. Pug
Space Brawl....................... Pug
On each side that is FvF FvK for example.. 12 total selections.. game chooses the map
How is that any longer than what we have now?
I can now queue for all 3 types at the same time.. for pug or premade. This actually helps the queue
I've read every post in this so far and he only questioned your education and breading after several of your posts implying he's a crappy player, has no drive to improve and a variety of other things, so as I see it you insulted him first with your inability to understand the OP. So, I'd say this all started not because of him, but because of you looking to argue with someone thats doesn't like premades. I see both your points and agree with both, but you seem to only see your own and become rude to anyone that doesn't seemingly agree with you and then blame them for insulting you after you were being rude to them.
WOW tried the same thing with both their arena ques and their pre level 80 battegrounds. It didn't work with a player base of 11.5 million. Ours is much smaller.
You can make the matches you want right now. You just have to network.
I can make the pug matches I want by networking? :rolleyes:
Yep, you can randomly group with people in a private channel. Have the chat channel be nothing, but casuals who want low impact, simply for casual fun, pvp with random groups rather than consistant teams.
In the end, that's what you are actually looking for. I'll choose to ignore the snarkiness.
Allan, bud, I never attacked him on a personal level. I never once said to him he sucks as a player. If you read my posts, all they say is don't expect to win against a premade if you cant be bothered to make a premade yourself and not to come crying when you lose.
What I did accuse him of is implying that premade groups are just out to easily beat PUGs.
Apparently, we like to throw around L2P and trash talk when we win. We also seem to like ruining casual player's day. Having PvP'd with me, can you say that this is the case? Do we trash talk to pugs? Do we queue up to ruin peoples experience of the game?
His way of saying we should get our own queue. Apparently, we just do this for E-peen. Have you ever felt that anyone in the fleet felt like they needed to "pwn nubz" to feel validated?
The title of the thread. Obviously he sees Premades fighting PUGs as a problem. Although his post does bring the valid idea of premade queues, having the title be "Premade Vs. PUG Solution" sounds much less like an attack and more like an opinion.
to the OP........BWWWWAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Bottom line if you don't want to have a chance to fight a premade then don't PVP, complaining on the forums is not going to get you anything.
Here is a crazy idea.....make a private PUG channel and a Private PUG match up.
just go out and say
"hey anyone want to fight 5v5 with none of us having any teamwork or organization?"
I laugh at that you do not want a real challeng, you want crappy / medocre players VS each other rather than learning and get better and overcoming the fight that a premade offers. DO us all a favor stay in your PUGS and keep getting TRIBBLE by premades and crying ont he forums on how its not fair.....
the only thing pathetic is your interest in staying crappy. I will enjoy getting better and enjoying the level of comp to make myself better.
Qq
Business as usual.
Deep and intellectual. Nuff said.
People like you are a dime a dozen. Don't care what you "think" if that is a word I can use with you.
Other games have the setup the splits up the 2 types of gameplay. But apparently you are too afraid to fight people at your own level to consider this.
Idiot
What are you whining about again
No, that is not why. I have played several MMO's and they have all had the intelligence and reasoning to split up pug and premades.
About time they did it here.
But I guess what people want is to defend the broken system and eventually when it is like CO and pvp is a joke,..you can all just stand around wondering what happened.
Well, you got one letter of the alphabet down. Good work. Maybe tomorrow they can teach you the letter "R"
Cool, deep and thoughtful. You don't even know me man. Been playing since closed beta. I can about guarantee I have more game time than you.
I already know that one,
U R QQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQ
Sorry man. You are now the only person on my ignore list. I know you don't care... but I get tired of seeing a page of one letter over and over.
If you can't think past your troll nature, don't post.
More whine
posts again, thinking I can see it.
I love it.
PS I know your checking it.