FVF will be the death of the game. At that point you will have won and will have the carebear game you have dreaming about.
Cool, I like winning.
Here's another fact, I play mostly Klingon.
I made a fed because I think their ships are superior. But superior ships outfitted with the wrong BOs and consoles is still far inferior to lesser ships with the right skills. Also trying to get feds interested in learning about these abilities instead so they understand how they work and give a challenge instead of stomping them into the ground and calling them noobs every chance I get.
That's not helping keeping the game alive, you take a faction, make them PvP only, it attracts all the hardcore pvp'ers and the min/maxers, then you give them the ability to hide until they're ready to fight on their own terms. Then you pit them against the "carebear" faction who trusts the incomplete tooltip info on the skills. Yeah, wonder who's gonna win 99% of the fights.
On paper, boarding party sounds like a really good skill.
I hear what you are saying. So the dev's have to compensate for the lousy players that don't bother to try new skills etc?
Being owned does not necessarily equate to unbalanced game design. There are always going to be pvp groups on both sides that are going to be damn good.
I just can't see penalizing the pvpers because they are good.
If this is the case get Romulans in the game right now and let the Klinks and Roms have at it. Remove the Fed pvp or make them sign a non QQ clause if they pvp and lets move on.
I made a fed because I think their ships are superior. But superior ships outfitted with the wrong BOs and consoles is still far inferior to lesser ships with the right skills. Also trying to get feds interested in learning about these abilities instead so they understand how they work and give a challenge instead of stomping them into the ground and calling them noobs every chance I get.
That's not helping keeping the game alive, you take a faction, make them PvP only, it attracts all the hardcore pvp'ers and the min/maxers, then you give them the ability to hide until they're ready to fight on their own terms. Then you pit them against the "carebear" faction who trusts the incomplete tooltip info on the skills. Yeah, wonder who's gonna win 99% of the fights.
On paper, boarding party sounds like a really good skill.
I dont get it, you say that you think the Fed ships are superior so why shouldnt the Klingons have the ability to to "Fight on their own terms" if that is indeed the case?
To be honest, many players that I hang out with arent exactly hardcore Klingons, and get rolled by hardcore fed groups quite a bit. I think skill and dedication is equally important on both sides and find the balance as it is quite good.
Not all klingons play to min/max, many play it because they just like to play Klingons
And personally, I run in to very few Klingons that "call the other side noobs every chance they get".
we all know FvF will kill klingons, hell, it's already pretty dead as it is.
The biggest complaints abount cloak come from T4 and below, in T5 the complaints come from carriers being able to swap hangars, that's another story entirely.
Do we really need the whole faction to be able to cloak? My point is I don't care much for the cloak on a cruiser. If there was an option for a cruiser with the same console/bo layouts as the fed equivalents, I'm sure a lot of people would pick it. Especially in T5.
I enjoy both sides. If it comes to that and faction vs faction dies I'll just stick to pre-arranged matches or doing random fed vs fed. But I'd much prefer see the rivalry between the factions continue in the hope of getting some kind of open space pvp in the future. Especially when they add new races.
we all know FvF will kill klingons, hell, it's already pretty dead as it is.
The biggest complaints abount cloak come from T4 and below, in T5 the complaints come from carriers being able to swap hangars, that's another story entirely.
Do we really need the whole faction to be able to cloak? My point is I don't care much for the cloak on a cruiser. If there was an option for a cruiser with the same console/bo layouts as the fed equivalents, I'm sure a lot of people would pick it. Especially in T5.
I enjoy both sides. If it comes to that and faction vs faction dies I'll just stick to pre-arranged matches or doing random fed vs fed. But I'd much prefer see the rivalry between the factions continue in the hope of getting some kind of open space pvp in the future. Especially when they add new races.
Carriers can't cloak...so its not the WHOLE faction
I'm not sure there's much mileage in 'There's the Z-axis to take into account' arguement.
I mean I can see where people are coming from. Technically if you offset yourself on that axis it should still be possible to remain undecteded despite the mini-map. However seeing as the Z-axis is a giant pain in the TRIBBLE anyway I'm not sure how much of the Z-axis is useful. If you are too 'high' or 'low' then it makes attacking and getting weapons in arc problematic at best.
If the bug became a feature then I think it could end up forcing Klingons into hiding at the extremes and delaying attacks as they circle back into attack position (after the inevitable sensor scan/particle burst).
I don't mind Klingon ships showing up occasional if it's related to a player or bo skill as that would help Feds hunt down ships. It'd just need to be balanced by a) not being permanently on and b) not being permanently accurate in 2 out of 3 axi
You know, I like to be as fair as possible to people but this bug that pretty much truncates the primary ability on one side shouldn't be grounds to motivate a huge contingent of fed players who would otherwise be coming here to complain how they can't win a pvp match, to come and have something they think is either clever or even relevant.
Every time I think that I cannot be further disappointed in the average fed player, they surprise and disappoint me anew. From terrible, clueless and uncoordinated and incompetent gameplay to these pathetic attempts at goading.
Please, at least learn to troll and flame. This is embarassing.
I could accept this. It would be a reasonable balance to cloaking, as we have all heard of the half hour matches where klingons hide unreasonably and try to bore the other team to death. Science players cant always hunt out klingons, as their tracking and revealing abilities are fairly close range or pot luck depth charges into nowhere. It's like playing "battleships".
It would also have the fantastic effect of scaring people silly. Like seeing a big shadow under the water and knowing it is a shark.
No, this is totally unacceptable. It negates cloak almost completely. One CPB or EP in a group of red dots on the mini and they're all uncloaked.
The point of cloak is that your position is unknown. This makes it known in two dimensional space and it becomes quite simple for already OP'd sci officers/ships to decloak ships, or to just simply see them as they do anyway and fire them up. This is a bug that needs fixing.
Who would hang around for a half hour? The only thing I can think of that might have caused that was an afker that cloaked and the queue system was botched or something.
I have better things to do with my 1/2 of time than grief the Feds.
The issue I have with this is that if Cryptic caved in on this from all the Fed QQ we will be nerfed into the ground until we never win, which is exactly what they want. This is a dangerous precedent.
From what i have seen though, it is not having the slightest bit of difference in pvp matches currently. Interesting that this great advantage seems as though it is not being fully utilised while they have it.
I've been playing both sides. My KDF is BG5 already, and I've heavily been working on my Fed who is at Cmdr4.
It does make a difference. You may not exactly tell where the Klingons are at as far as the Z-Axis goes, but you DO know what general direction they're coming from. You DO know where the Klingons are gathering or prowling at. You get to present your defenses / firing arcs towards the threat even before they decloak. It makes it easier for their Science Officers to chase them down and try to pop them out of cloak. There's some guesswork involved for those attempts, but in a bunch of maps, the terrain / obstacles makes those guesses quite easy, i.e. Cracked Planet.
Just the fact that with the current situation, you can just tell where the KDF is at, when they're nearby, so that you really don't have to stay on the alert anymore. I just sit there in my Cruiser and call out, "Okay, there they are. There's a bunch of them there so expect them to decloak any minute now." Or just send the Science Officer there, pop the entire KDF group out of cloak, and watch their confusion as you send a mass of phaser fire and quantum torps their way. Like scattering a bunch of scared mice or ants.
The predators can no longer prowl, hide, and ambush anymore, because they go around with big, red, shining beacons that scream, "HERE I AM!!!"
if this is going to remain as a change to cloak they could at least make it that once you are pop'd shields go up automatically, getting pop'd and having everyone fire thro autofire on a weak hull is annoying, or only the sci player can fire until you come out of cloak manually
All that being said, with the current level of coordination that feds typically display if you can't win as KDF against feds even without cloak, you are doing something wrong.
I noticed a drop in the Klingons participation in PVP battle with Feds. I think that Feds have an advantage over Klingon already and now have removed the only real advantage Kilingons had. Great job TRIBBLE up the Game
I noticed a drop in the Klingons participation in PVP battle with Feds. I think that Feds have an advantage over Klingon already and now have removed the only real advantage Kilingons had. Great job TRIBBLE up the Game
It is not that big a deal tbh. Sure there might be less klingons queuing atm, but whether that is due to this bug or not is debatable. I still think it is due to everyone who is BG5 rolling a fed char to take a break from the 24/7 pvp that they had to do to gain the rank.
I like it myself the feds have been very arogant and sloppy at times because of this change. They think that oh yeah he's here lets go uncloak him but I am above or below them maintaining reasonable distance. I now see feds in T5 running across the map to hunt us or trying to spawn camp us. Only to learn to late how foolish it is to run off alone or in a small group.
I find that this "feature" makes it less likely for the feds to spawn camp. usually the klingons cloak and hide, just sit around hiding (arena obviously, they cant in C&H) either trying to reduce the federation numbers by making fed players get bored and leave, or trying to seperate fed players. Before now, the only way to bring the klingons out of their hiding was to spawn camp and attack a newly joined KDF player... KDF would HAVE to try and help their comrade, and give their cloak away.
Now with the minimap thing, science ships break off and do their cloak scans in "general" areas, cruisers can drop plasma and escorts drop mines, all in an attempt to decloak the klingons, giving the KDF more of a chance of seperating fed players and gives the feds something to do other then spawn camp or leaving due to cowardice on the KDF team.
This is a bug, not something Cryptic did to get you angry so you can rage on the forums.. Why would this be a feature? This is the advantage given to the Klingons over the Federation. If Cryptic purposely nerfed cloak then we should all jump ship now.
Funny thing is it made no difference in the matches I played while it was happening...:p
Not true, i personaly flushed out several klingons lurking behind me with sensor scan and nuked them to death with WTF in zone chat following...har har ooh now back to boring waiting.
Comments
Cool, I like winning.
Here's another fact, I play mostly Klingon.
I made a fed because I think their ships are superior. But superior ships outfitted with the wrong BOs and consoles is still far inferior to lesser ships with the right skills. Also trying to get feds interested in learning about these abilities instead so they understand how they work and give a challenge instead of stomping them into the ground and calling them noobs every chance I get.
That's not helping keeping the game alive, you take a faction, make them PvP only, it attracts all the hardcore pvp'ers and the min/maxers, then you give them the ability to hide until they're ready to fight on their own terms. Then you pit them against the "carebear" faction who trusts the incomplete tooltip info on the skills. Yeah, wonder who's gonna win 99% of the fights.
On paper, boarding party sounds like a really good skill.
Being owned does not necessarily equate to unbalanced game design. There are always going to be pvp groups on both sides that are going to be damn good.
I just can't see penalizing the pvpers because they are good.
If this is the case get Romulans in the game right now and let the Klinks and Roms have at it. Remove the Fed pvp or make them sign a non QQ clause if they pvp and lets move on.
I dont get it, you say that you think the Fed ships are superior so why shouldnt the Klingons have the ability to to "Fight on their own terms" if that is indeed the case?
To be honest, many players that I hang out with arent exactly hardcore Klingons, and get rolled by hardcore fed groups quite a bit. I think skill and dedication is equally important on both sides and find the balance as it is quite good.
Not all klingons play to min/max, many play it because they just like to play Klingons
And personally, I run in to very few Klingons that "call the other side noobs every chance they get".
Korthos
The biggest complaints abount cloak come from T4 and below, in T5 the complaints come from carriers being able to swap hangars, that's another story entirely.
Do we really need the whole faction to be able to cloak? My point is I don't care much for the cloak on a cruiser. If there was an option for a cruiser with the same console/bo layouts as the fed equivalents, I'm sure a lot of people would pick it. Especially in T5.
I enjoy both sides. If it comes to that and faction vs faction dies I'll just stick to pre-arranged matches or doing random fed vs fed. But I'd much prefer see the rivalry between the factions continue in the hope of getting some kind of open space pvp in the future. Especially when they add new races.
Carriers can't cloak...so its not the WHOLE faction
I think this suggestion should apply to everyone everywhere forever.
I mean I can see where people are coming from. Technically if you offset yourself on that axis it should still be possible to remain undecteded despite the mini-map. However seeing as the Z-axis is a giant pain in the TRIBBLE anyway I'm not sure how much of the Z-axis is useful. If you are too 'high' or 'low' then it makes attacking and getting weapons in arc problematic at best.
If the bug became a feature then I think it could end up forcing Klingons into hiding at the extremes and delaying attacks as they circle back into attack position (after the inevitable sensor scan/particle burst).
I don't mind Klingon ships showing up occasional if it's related to a player or bo skill as that would help Feds hunt down ships. It'd just need to be balanced by a) not being permanently on and b) not being permanently accurate in 2 out of 3 axi
Every time I think that I cannot be further disappointed in the average fed player, they surprise and disappoint me anew. From terrible, clueless and uncoordinated and incompetent gameplay to these pathetic attempts at goading.
Please, at least learn to troll and flame. This is embarassing.
No, this is totally unacceptable. It negates cloak almost completely. One CPB or EP in a group of red dots on the mini and they're all uncloaked.
The point of cloak is that your position is unknown. This makes it known in two dimensional space and it becomes quite simple for already OP'd sci officers/ships to decloak ships, or to just simply see them as they do anyway and fire them up. This is a bug that needs fixing.
Absolutely correct.
It does make a difference. You may not exactly tell where the Klingons are at as far as the Z-Axis goes, but you DO know what general direction they're coming from. You DO know where the Klingons are gathering or prowling at. You get to present your defenses / firing arcs towards the threat even before they decloak. It makes it easier for their Science Officers to chase them down and try to pop them out of cloak. There's some guesswork involved for those attempts, but in a bunch of maps, the terrain / obstacles makes those guesses quite easy, i.e. Cracked Planet.
Just the fact that with the current situation, you can just tell where the KDF is at, when they're nearby, so that you really don't have to stay on the alert anymore. I just sit there in my Cruiser and call out, "Okay, there they are. There's a bunch of them there so expect them to decloak any minute now." Or just send the Science Officer there, pop the entire KDF group out of cloak, and watch their confusion as you send a mass of phaser fire and quantum torps their way. Like scattering a bunch of scared mice or ants.
The predators can no longer prowl, hide, and ambush anymore, because they go around with big, red, shining beacons that scream, "HERE I AM!!!"
It is not that big a deal tbh. Sure there might be less klingons queuing atm, but whether that is due to this bug or not is debatable. I still think it is due to everyone who is BG5 rolling a fed char to take a break from the 24/7 pvp that they had to do to gain the rank.
K'rapok General KDF
Now with the minimap thing, science ships break off and do their cloak scans in "general" areas, cruisers can drop plasma and escorts drop mines, all in an attempt to decloak the klingons, giving the KDF more of a chance of seperating fed players and gives the feds something to do other then spawn camp or leaving due to cowardice on the KDF team.
The minimap is all messed up in other ways too.
>.<
Funny thing is it made no difference in the matches I played while it was happening...:p
Not true, i personaly flushed out several klingons lurking behind me with sensor scan and nuked them to death with WTF in zone chat following...har har
We now return you to your regularly scheduled whine CLOAK IS OMG OP'D NERF NOW!! Already in progress...:D
I see it in the Patch notes. They did it in pretty decent time.