well.. that next battlezone annoucement has dropped a major clanger, the GQ map will be in effect one giant warzone as you fight the Hur'q, and the end will result in an invasion of the founders homeworld. This strongly suggests that the Alliance is not a threat to the Dominion at all and the Dominion are looking for their help, if not outright openness to the alliance crossing Dominion space and teaming up.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
DR was never going to provide new species because all of them are in the DQ, of which there is no access too until long into the story. Unlike the Gamma Quad, which has a perfectly functioning wormhole right there 24/7
Except Talaxians apparently
And at least one Ocampa (Lieutenant Linnea).
I'd also say Tam (the Ocampa aboard the USS Madison) but we have no idea how long she's been aboard said ship.
One of the Memory Alpha researchers was an Ocampa too. I mentioned Talaxians because they're an officially playable race.
well.. that next battlezone annoucement has dropped a major clanger, the GQ map will be in effect one giant warzone as you fight the Hur'q, and the end will result in an invasion of the founders homeworld. This strongly suggests that the Alliance is not a threat to the Dominion at all and the Dominion are looking for their help, if not outright openness to the alliance crossing Dominion space and teaming up.
I hope there is more to it than just a battlezone as the gamma quadrant should have some story missions
NO TO ARC
Vice Admiral Volmack ISS Thundermole
Brigadier General Jokag IKS Gorkan
Centurion Kares RRW Tomalak
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
> @markhawkman said: > reyan01 wrote: » > > markhawkman wrote: » > > somtaawkhar wrote: » > > DR was never going to provide new species because all of them are in the DQ, of which there is no access too until long into the story. Unlike the Gamma Quad, which has a perfectly functioning wormhole right there 24/7 > > > > Except Talaxians apparently > > > > And at least one Ocampa (Lieutenant Linnea). > > I'd also say Tam (the Ocampa aboard the USS Madison) but we have no idea how long she's been aboard said ship. > > > > One of the Memory Alpha researchers was an Ocampa too. I mentioned Talaxians because they're an officially playable race.
Is it ever explained in any lore how Ocampans are in the Alpha Quadrant?
I don't remember where I read it, I think it was a DOFFing mission, but there used to be a note about multigenerational Ocampan starships that were sent to the Alpha Quadrant and that is how the Ocampan species became established outside of their known space/quadrant.
I believe that content was patched out in a more recent update, so it may not apply anymore.
The Hirogen somehow found their way to the edge of Romulan terrority and were immediately recruited as allies by Empress Sela.
As far as I know, it was never explained how the Hirogen relocated to near Romulan Star Empire controlled space.
Without using an Iconian gateway, the two most likely possibilities are the Borg transwarp network or Underspace, both of which can speed travel between quadrants.
Slipstream technology also originated in the Delta Quadrant and is equivalent in speed to transwarping, so that's a third possibility.
Bees like honey, they don't like vinegar.
Everytime someone makes a character that is an copy of an existing superhuman, Creativity is sad
well.. that next battlezone annoucement has dropped a major clanger, the GQ map will be in effect one giant warzone as you fight the Hur'q, and the end will result in an invasion of the founders homeworld. This strongly suggests that the Alliance is not a threat to the Dominion at all and the Dominion are looking for their help, if not outright openness to the alliance crossing Dominion space and teaming up.
I hope there is more to it than just a battlezone as the gamma quadrant should have some story missions
it's already stated for the Jem'Hadar faction that there is 6 missions there and who knows how many Cryptic have lined up after launch for all four factions.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
I don't remember where I read it, I think it was a DOFFing mission, but there used to be a note about multigenerational Ocampan starships that were sent to the Alpha Quadrant and that is how the Ocampan species became established outside of their known space/quadrant.
I believe that content was patched out in a more recent update, so it may not apply anymore.
The Hirogen somehow found their way to the edge of Romulan terrority and were immediately recruited as allies by Empress Sela.
As far as I know, it was never explained how the Hirogen relocated to near Romulan Star Empire controlled space.
Without using an Iconian gateway, the two most likely possibilities are the Borg transwarp network or Underspace, both of which can speed travel between quadrants.
Slipstream technology also originated in the Delta Quadrant and is equivalent in speed to transwarping, so that's a third possibility.
Underspace maybe big, but there is such little known about it or how far it spreads or where the tunnels lead to. potentially the Turei already have a complete map of underspace across most of the known galaxy. None the less, a lot of study would be needed to understand underspace before locating a suitable entry point. I doubt the short lived Ocampa have such time between generations to understand and catalogue it because the next generation will have to read, understand to continue on from that point. This is assuming they even know about it.
The Borg Transwarp hub was destroyed by Voyager over 30 years ago. it wasn't the only one but it was one of a very few known to exist through Seven of Nine's retention of information from the collective. However i doubt the Borg would just allow potentially thousands of new drones to slip through their fingers, especially at a place so important to the Borg. it would be an unacceptable risk. Also it assumes they know about this.
It might of been possible that as soon as the Sphere opened and contact was made by the Alliance, the local Ocampa could take a chance and head to far less hostile space inside of a few days via the iconian gateways compared to the centuries they might face with low warp transports. it could easily make that shaky multi-generational travel go away with a far more easy background. Especially considering what Starfleet knows about the Ocampa that they have mental abilities when trained but ultimately they are somewhat naive and sheltered but generally good natured and looking for a home. I mean who would want to setup a home in Kazon space? The Ocampa would be daft to try it after the energy ran out in the underground Ocampa city.
It would be easier to request assistance from Starfleet to setup a colony in their space or near their space and bring on Ocampans to become Starfleet officers or at least give them jobs they really want to do without fear of having a myraid of reasons to fear for the future.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
The Turei have mapped most of Underspace, but according to the Vaardwaur, they don't know all of it, as the Vaardwaur were the only species to have the complete map.
It does appear as though the Vaardwaur never moved beyond the Delta Quadrant though, but that could just mean they didn't explore pathways that left the area they were familiar with.
The error of assumption is that the Ocampan species need the same amount of learning time as the longer species, they do not.
Due to their short lifespans, they developed the ability to learn and memorise much faster then anyone else could, so their learning curve is incredibly rapid when compared to other species. For example, an Ocampan Starfleet Cadet would graduate in 6 months instead of 6 years.
It is not necessary to use the Borg transwarp network to transwarp, it's just faster that way. If enough transwarp coils were salvaged/acquired and integrated into drive technology, the journey between quadrants would be quite short, years instead of decades.
In any case, however, the Ocampans came to be in the Alpha Quadrant, the fact remains that Linnea is present in the Alpha Quadrant long before the Iconian Gateways and the Spheres are discovered, so that is confirmation that however they emigrated, it did not involve any of those devices to move between quadrants.
And it's unlikely just one solitary Ocampan emigrated, so others must have come with her.
For context, Linnea is encountered just after the tutorial in the beginning of the game and the Iconian travel network/Spheres do not appear until near the end of the game.
Bees like honey, they don't like vinegar.
Everytime someone makes a character that is an copy of an existing superhuman, Creativity is sad
With the Ocampa, any extended space mission is going to be multi-generational since each one is lucky if they reach double-figures. I swear their lifespans must have been modelled on that of the domestic dog!
The only issue is someone has got their lore really wrong of late; Kahless never had anything to do with the Hur'Q. He fought the Fek'lhri. The Hur'Q came much later on, well after the empire was established.
Untrue.
It was explicitly established back in DS9 that the Hur'q attacked 1,000 years ago. However, Trek canon has been contradictory about its placement of Kahless's lifetime, with some accounts stating it was 1,000 years ago, and others stating it was 1,500 years ago.
Cryptic just took the one of the two contradictory accounts that better fitted the narrative they wanted, which is the 1,000 years ago one, which would place Kahless at the time of the Hur'q, and the Hur'q's attack around the founding of the Empire. It still fits the lore, since the lore itself stated Kahless lived 1,000 years ago itself more then once.
Apologies all for going off topic; if you are reading the thread for the actual point, skip to the next post. But, I've got to address it now this person thinks dragging his misunderstanding into criticising someone else; when he did it earlier in the thread I realised it was him and decided it wasn't worth my time.
First off, none of this will make sense without reading the original thread: https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline#/discussion/1238327/kahless-and-the-hurq/p1
It is also worth noting that I hadn't noticed that this same person who once again is out claiming Klingon history is self-contradictory is both the OP and the person I was debating until I realised part way down, a mistake I don't make twice.
Now:
Let's look at Federation obtained evidence ONLY, so that this doesn't devolve into farcical humanocentrism like your thread on the subject did, where you and a bunch of others wanted to pretend that Klingon history is nothing but a fabricated set of myths fabricated to mythologise history.
Jadzia Dax, Trill, Starfleet Science Officer, dates the sword to being 1400 years old by dating metallic particles left on the shroud of the sword, as recovered by Vulcans.{2} (Sadly, it wasn't dated by Data, as if it had, he would have given it far more exactly; of course, in an earlier script of TNG "Rightful Heir", he did state when Kahless died, as 1547 years before 2369; but as your circle-jerking friends will immediately point out no doubt, this was cut content, which is why this section is in brackets, as all I can point out with this is what timeframe the writers intended with a quotation from a character who did not round his numbers to the nearest decade, let alone millennium)
This alone is sufficient to prove that the original Kahless - to short-circuit most of the circle-jerking from that thread - was around 1400 years ago.
Testimony from the Klingons themselves is a 15 centuries figure from the monks on Boreth.{1}
Worf exclaims "A thousand years ago, the dawn of the Empire, five hundred warriors storm the Great Hall at Qam-Chee."{4}
Worf states: "With it he [Kahless] slew Molor, conquered the Fek'Ihri and forged the first Empire."{2}
Worf, Kor and Dax discussing the age of Kahless' sword all happy to say a thousand years, despite the fact it has already been dated to be older, in this very episode.{2}
Worf, serving onboard a Klingon ship speaking in an officer's log report, citing "The fifty third day in the year of Kahless nine ninety nine".{3}
The logical conclusion is same period of time, expressed in two different measurements.
And if in doubt, it has already been established that the true situation is closer to the older figure by virtue of dating a weapon found with Hur'q blood on it at 1400 years. (although, being a melee weapon that is shown on screen as still being battle-worthy, there is not enough evidence to rule out some Hur'q thief centuries later getting cut and therefore leaving DNA from mishandling the weapon)
Your logic only works if a joined-Trill Starfleet science officer is too incompetent to use a Starfleet laboratory properly; a laboratory that features massively advanced sensors, including the capacity to not only tell what time an object was from, but which quantum reality it is from, meaning there is very little margin to assume Jadzia could ID it wrong. And the joined-Trill factor is very significant, as a previous host formed numerous important connections to Klingons, one of which being a crucial plot point of the episode, which if anything would bias the reporter to give the - and yet again, I'll pre-empt the circle-jerking - "correct" figure of over 1500 years. Not 1400 years.
And there is no point appealing to the writers of STO here, when their inaccuracy is the whole problem - these are people who have systemically displayed bias against Klingons in gameplay, and have gotten Klingon lore wrong repeatedly, as has been detailed numerous times on this forum by fans of Klingons.
My premise is that these two are different calendars tracking the same length of time - the most rational way to read it.
Your side however, decided from the outset that Klingons were unreliable about their own history, which makes it nonsensical for you to say anything about trying to determine a canonical time as none of the evidence you'll actually allow. (given none of you actually addressed the point I made about Jadia's dating of the sword in the older thread)
Your thread opened with claiming Kahless' time of living was varied because you humanocentrically decided arbitrarily that Klingon years must be the same as earth years, when there are many reasonable alternatives, such as differing orbital periods (and it is worth noting that a gap of 4-500 years between two planets that are both in the habitable region of a star is not significant) or the Year of Kahless being a socio-religious calendar that does not correlate with the orbital period while still tracking time as an absolute with the result being both calendars are correct in amount of time passed.
The first response was in jest; by the second, the circle-jerking started with claiming the Klingons mythologised the lot. The next poster takes the best way to interpret the dataset that STO itself adds to the known information - the Fek'lhri being a Hur'q force sent in to occupy the world, with the Hur'q themselves not directly getting involved for another 5 centuries. Of the remaining posters who posted to the thread, nearly all of them were hostile to even considering the possibility of reconciling the information, instead desiring to just throw it all out as mythology.
And I shouldn't have to point this out, but if you are going to claim the whole lot is mythology, you really have no place talking about a "canon" age to be accepted.
A conclusive link between the Hur'q and the Fek'lhri is not established in any STO-canon source apart from STO itself, and the data presented in STO up to this point - no doubt Victory is Life will expand on this - fits both the premise that the Fek'lhri were some sort of infantry within the 1000 absolute-year timeline and the alternative premise that the Fek'lhri were pawns of the Hur'q who were placed on Qo'noS ~1500 absolute-years, and therefore centuries before the direct Hur'q attack, which is accepted by everyone to be 1000 absolute-years ago.
It is also vitally important to understand that "Hur'q" is a Klingon word for "outsider", which I remain to be convinced is actually understood...
It is also to be remembered that STO's Fek'lhri conducting the 2409 attack that the player faces may well have been an Iconian, Hur'q or some alliance of the two, ploy to reuse the ancient enemies of the Klingons in an effort to induce fear in them, although neither had anything to do with the original Fek'lhri 1400+ absolute-years previously.
Your premise - some claims are Kahless lived 1500 years ago, others are Kahless lived a 1000 years ago; these two are contradictory, and so Cryptic have gone with what they want to have in order to make their story make sense.
My premise - these are two different calendars that track the same amount of time, a period of at least 1400 years as established by a Starfleet, not KDF, officer; Cryptic have simply got the pre-existing lore wrong, as they have done repeatedly in the past.
To drag this post vaguely back to topic; in STO canon, whether it should be or not, the 1000 year ago position is accepted by Cryptic; obviously, I am against that.
I'm going to guess VIL will substantiate the Hur'q/2409 Fek'lhri link further, and by virtue of the accepted timeline, the link between Hur'q/Fek'lhri of the earlier time.
The logical conclusion is same period of time, expressed in two different measurements.
The logical conclusion is that the Deep Space 9 writers didn't bother to do fact checking within their own show, and thus, got the numbers wrong.
The idea that they are the same period of time expressed in two different measurements is headcanon, and rationalization, over two contradictory statements. Nothing has suggested a Klingon year is 1.5 times longer then a human year, and in the few instances where Klingons speak about years, its always under the assumption that its the same, or close enough, to a human year for them to not specify that there is a difference.
If Klingon years were different then human years, then the monks at Boreth wouldn't have said they have been waiting 15 centuries for Kahless, because they haven't. They have been waiting 10 centuries for Kahless(in Klingon years), which is equivalent to 15 human centuries, and they have no reason to not use their own measurement when talking about it.
Worf, Kor and Dax discussing the age of Kahless' sword all happy to say a thousand years, despite the fact it has already been dated to be older, in this very episode.{2}
If you go back and actually read the source you posted on this bit, the only time any of them use 1,000 years is in reference to the Hur'q invasion, and when the sword was stolen, not that its only 1,000 years old. The episode is actually fairly consistent with itself, just not the the other episodes.
And there is no point appealing to the writers of STO here, when their inaccuracy is the whole problem - these are people who have systemically displayed bias against Klingons in gameplay, and have gotten Klingon lore wrong repeatedly, as has been detailed numerous times on this forum by fans of Klingons.
Cryptic has been giving the Klingons so much for so long I still can't believe anyone can claim that Cryptic has a bias AGAINST them.
Oh, I'm supposed to take lectures from someone, who when proven wrong, just claims DS9 writers - which ignores the fact I cited a TNG episode, not DS9 alone - didn't bother to do fact checking on their own show. Even within a single episode. Your logical conclusion? Totally useless rubbish. What possible good exactly can Cryptic use that assumption for? What me and trygvar13 were saying is that Cryptic have gotten their interpretation of DS9's information wrong. This matters, because Cryptic in their position as choosing to cover Klingon/Hur'q content, have got to have an interpretation of DS9 information that is not to assume the show didn't bother being coherent on things like this.
And then you go off complaining about my supposed headcanon, while proclaiming your own headcanon as true. At least mine lines up with facts, as 1.5 years for one planet -when what kind of star Qo'noS orbits is not even known- in it's star's habitable region is not out of the realms of possibility, and certainly not so dissimilar that it bears special mention for being out of sync. Which is an irrelevancy anyway, as this discussion is about the amount of time being quantified - did Kahless live and act 1000 earth years ago, or 1500 earth years ago? That is the important question, as this debate, until you dragged it off course, was about Cryptic's lining up with DS9 timeline, as they use the 1000 earth year count, whereas the sword of Kahless, which I'll repeat again is the only objectively dated thing in the whole discussion, dated to 1400 Federation-count years, meaning he must have been that time or older. Even if the Klingons did mythologise their own history, that is a fact established by Starfleet science, not Klingon history - not is the Year of Kahless year length the same as a earth year, which is what you maintain.
And as for the Boreth monks and how they would quote the Klingon count; there are two reasons why a real-Klingon would quote the earth year count to Worf. Worf was raised by humans, and he became a Starfleet officer, the first Klingon to do so. To the kind of culture that Klingon is, that is more than enough to besmirch him as some sort of sub-Klingon half-breed. Which means saying it in the earth year count is a massive insult to his honour as a Klingon, as it states plainly the commentor's belief Worf does not belong to the Klingons, and is a challenge to Worf to prove his worth, on the basis his being raised by Humans could be, and in his case was, taken to presume he did not understand Klingon culture.
Now, the monks at Boreth likely did not mean it totally like this, as they have a very good reason to quote it in earth years - Worf came precisely because he is questioning his identity as a Klingon:
PICARD: Mister Worf, your personal affairs are strictly your own concern until they interfere with the operation of this ship. You have now crossed that line. As your Captain, I want to know exactly what is going on.
WORF: It is difficult to explain.
PICARD: Try.
WORF: Ever since I returned from the Carraya system I have felt empty.
PICARD: Does this have something to do with the Klingons you rescued from Carraya Four?
WORF: They were young. They knew nothing of their heritage. So while I was there, I tried to teach them. Teach them about their people, their culture. I told them our ancient stories, instructed them in our customs, explained our beliefs. And then I told them about Kahless. How he united our people long ago. How he gave us strength and honour, and how he promised to return one day and lead us again.
PICARD: Is that what you're doing here? Trying to recapture those feelings?
WORF: Yes. I was trying to summon a vision of Kahless.
PICARD: It's a pity you didn't try using the holodeck instead of setting fire to your quarters.
WORF: Using the holodeck would not have been appropriate. Everything had to be real if Kahless were to appear. But all this was is nothing. He did not come to me. I gave Toq and the others a belief in Sto-Vo-Kor, the life which lies beyond this life where Kahless awaits us. When I saw the power of their beliefs I began to question the strength of my own. And I found it wanting.
PICARD: Have you lost your faith in Sto-Vo-Kor?
WORF: To lose something, one must first possess it. I am not sure I ever had a true belief. But I should not have allowed it to interfere with my duties. My behaviour has been
PICARD: Inexcusable. And understandable. It may be that what you are looking for cannot be found here on the Enterprise. Perhaps you need to immerse yourself in Klingon beliefs in order to discover whether they can hold any truths for you. Is there something you can do, is there somewhere you could go to explore your faith more fully?
WORF: Boreth. The Followers of Kahless await his return there. To Klingons, there is no more sacred place.
PICARD: Boreth is only twelve days from here by shuttle. As of this moment, Mister Worf, you are on leave.
WORF: Thank you, sir.
PICARD: But when you set foot on this ship again, I expect you to perform your duties like a Starfleet officer.
WORF: Yes, sir.
PICARD: And, Mister Worf? I hope you find what you're looking for.
WORF: Thank you, sir.
And so, them quoting it in earth years to Worf is a subtle "encouragement" to Worf to find the belief he is searching for; to rise to the challenge. A test he passes at the end of the episode. Frankly, anyone who claims what you do, has missed one of the moments of character development Worf had - this episode marks an important piece of Worf's journey to a full understanding of what it is to be Klingon at the spiritual level. And all you can do is reduce it to claiming that the Boreth monks, who job literally is to know things about Kahless, don't know what they are talking about.
And as for your claim none of them referred to the age of the sword:
KOR: He was honoured to join our quest. That is, if there's going to be a quest. What did you find?
DAX: I found both Klingon and Hur'q DNA on the cloth. And traces of metallic compounds that could only have been left by a Klingon bat'leth. A bat'leth fourteen hundred years old.
KOR: The time of Kahless! I never doubted it. When do we leave?
Note that this time I've bolded it, given you continually choose to be wilfully blind to this fact.
Ok, first of all, you've already been proven that you don't know what you are talking about. Or, you have lied about what the shows actually contained, and frankly, discussing Star Trek lore is going straight over your head as you continually pretend that things you don't like aren't there. Lore inaccuracies? You don't give a damn, you just call it contradictory and say the creators of the show got it wrong. Yet, for some reason, Cryptic can't make mistakes according to you. The hypocrisy stinks.
And in any event, the whole of this revolves around Cryptic making a lore inconsistency - by your own standard of proof, I have done this. You just choose blindness.
I note that you only see fit to partially address one of the two supporting points to the statement.
First off, the giving is directly unequal and weighted in favour of the Federation - far from supporting your position, you actually bring attention to one of the pieces of evidence against your claim.
Let's start by considering ships:
Tier 1:
Fed - 4 for standard Starfleet, and for TOS Starfleet - 2 prior to leaving 25th century, 5 afterwards.
KDF - 2
Rom - 2
Tier 2:
Fed - 7
KDF - 4
Rom - 2
Tier 3:
Fed - 9
KDF - 10
Rom - 2
Tier 4:
Fed - 7
KDF - 9
Rom - 4
Tier 5:
Fed - 75
KDF - 49
Rom - 36
Tier 6:
Fed - 77
KDF - 47
Rom - 48
This listing does not include cross-faction ships, but does include lockbox factional ships, including Tal Shiar adapted ships in the Romulan count. Straight away, we see Fed ships outnumber Klingon ships at almost 3 Fed for every 2 KDF (180:121). And the latter number drops massively once you start removing the ships which aren't Klingon, as specified in my original claim; that makes the numbers 168:97. (Romulans have just 6 other race ships, and even then it is technically 5 as 1 is a Reman refit of a Romulan ship)
And if you're defence is Romulans have it worse, while that is true, that is still not an acceptable defence.
Let's look at uniforms; 1 KDF uniform in the C-Store. Feds get 21.
let's look at missions, in which once you get outside of the faction arcs, all factions are rolled into doing the same missions and content, meaning in practice they only design for the Federation as the long term story is to roll everyone into the Federation.
This is now going way off topic, so I am going to summarise: Me and trygvar13, I presume, made our comments because on the basis of the shows, Cryptic has got it wrong so far - Kahless is not recorded fighting Hur'q in show-canon.
All Cryptic need to do?
In Victory Is Life, give some kind of account that means comments that Kahless fought Hur'q make sense - there is already justification from Hur'q DNA being on the shroud of the sword, as on balance of probabilities, either a Hur'q made a mistake transporting the weapon and cut themselves, or Kahless killed a Hur'q. Given the relatively unlikeliness of the first, and the STO-canon plausibility of the second - the Hur'q are known to have a link to the 2409-Fek'lhri, and so it is not unreasonable to portray the Hur'q as manipulating the Fek'lhri - the second makes for a far better plot-point.
That happens, and I'll concede the point about Kahless fighting Hur'q.
DR was never going to provide new species because all of them are in the DQ, of which there is no access too until long into the story. Unlike the Gamma Quad, which has a perfectly functioning wormhole right there 24/7
Except Talaxians apparently
I dragged my feet when I was thinking of making a Talaxian Delta Recruit the last time that Recruitment 'drive' was in effect.
Finally made a Klingon Tactical Talaxian this time around
Well, Voyager left the extent of Hirogen space vague, but extensive. The relay network was shown to extend to the BQ.
Then again, it was suggested that the Hirogen claimed the relay network, rather than having created it themselves. Whether they explored the extent of the area covered by the network relays was left up in the air.
Well, Voyager left the extent of Hirogen space vague, but extensive. The relay network was shown to extend to the BQ.
Then again, it was suggested that the Hirogen claimed the relay network, rather than having created it themselves. Whether they explored the extent of the area covered by the network relays was left up in the air.
Well, pretty much everything said about the origin of the relay network was subject to the "Unreliable narrator" trope.
The stuff the Hirogen say falls under "maybe they're lying", but everything anyone else says is speculation.
As I understand it, the relay network only sends messages, so it's not a method of travel in itself.
The Hirogen say "it is ours" when referencing the relay network, which doesn't actually say they created it.
Perhaps in their mind since they found it first and nobody else understood how to use it, they own the relay network.
But it is implied that Hirogen ships have a speed advantage over starships.
When viewing the travel log of one Hirogen vessel, the comment is made they've covered a lot of space in only a few years.
I don't know if there is any information on how fast a Hirogen vessel can travel at their version of warp speed or if there is any technology they have that would make an interquadrant journey shorter.
As a general principle, I assume any Delta Quadrant emigration had to take at least 25 years, the time interval between the last episode of Voyager and when the game starts.
Bees like honey, they don't like vinegar.
Everytime someone makes a character that is an copy of an existing superhuman, Creativity is sad
Well as it's a Jem'hadar Dominion faction i'm assuming we're not getting Vorta or Changelings but I hope we still at least get the "alien" option so we can make toons that look the part.
"As of this moment, we are all dead. We go into battle to reclaim our lives.
This we do gladly, for we are Jem'Hadar. Victory is Life!"
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Comments
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
My character Tsin'xing
I hope there is more to it than just a battlezone as the gamma quadrant should have some story missions
Vice Admiral Volmack ISS Thundermole
Brigadier General Jokag IKS Gorkan
Centurion Kares RRW Tomalak
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
> reyan01 wrote: »
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> markhawkman wrote: »
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> somtaawkhar wrote: »
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> DR was never going to provide new species because all of them are in the DQ, of which there is no access too until long into the story. Unlike the Gamma Quad, which has a perfectly functioning wormhole right there 24/7
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>
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> Except Talaxians apparently
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>
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> And at least one Ocampa (Lieutenant Linnea).
>
> I'd also say Tam (the Ocampa aboard the USS Madison) but we have no idea how long she's been aboard said ship.
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> One of the Memory Alpha researchers was an Ocampa too. I mentioned Talaxians because they're an officially playable race.
Is it ever explained in any lore how Ocampans are in the Alpha Quadrant?
My character Tsin'xing
I believe that content was patched out in a more recent update, so it may not apply anymore.
The Hirogen somehow found their way to the edge of Romulan terrority and were immediately recruited as allies by Empress Sela.
As far as I know, it was never explained how the Hirogen relocated to near Romulan Star Empire controlled space.
Without using an Iconian gateway, the two most likely possibilities are the Borg transwarp network or Underspace, both of which can speed travel between quadrants.
Slipstream technology also originated in the Delta Quadrant and is equivalent in speed to transwarping, so that's a third possibility.
Bees like honey, they don't like vinegar.
Everytime someone makes a character that is an copy of an existing superhuman, Creativity is sad
My character Tsin'xing
it's already stated for the Jem'Hadar faction that there is 6 missions there and who knows how many Cryptic have lined up after launch for all four factions.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Underspace maybe big, but there is such little known about it or how far it spreads or where the tunnels lead to. potentially the Turei already have a complete map of underspace across most of the known galaxy. None the less, a lot of study would be needed to understand underspace before locating a suitable entry point. I doubt the short lived Ocampa have such time between generations to understand and catalogue it because the next generation will have to read, understand to continue on from that point. This is assuming they even know about it.
The Borg Transwarp hub was destroyed by Voyager over 30 years ago. it wasn't the only one but it was one of a very few known to exist through Seven of Nine's retention of information from the collective. However i doubt the Borg would just allow potentially thousands of new drones to slip through their fingers, especially at a place so important to the Borg. it would be an unacceptable risk. Also it assumes they know about this.
It might of been possible that as soon as the Sphere opened and contact was made by the Alliance, the local Ocampa could take a chance and head to far less hostile space inside of a few days via the iconian gateways compared to the centuries they might face with low warp transports. it could easily make that shaky multi-generational travel go away with a far more easy background. Especially considering what Starfleet knows about the Ocampa that they have mental abilities when trained but ultimately they are somewhat naive and sheltered but generally good natured and looking for a home. I mean who would want to setup a home in Kazon space? The Ocampa would be daft to try it after the energy ran out in the underground Ocampa city.
It would be easier to request assistance from Starfleet to setup a colony in their space or near their space and bring on Ocampans to become Starfleet officers or at least give them jobs they really want to do without fear of having a myraid of reasons to fear for the future.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
It does appear as though the Vaardwaur never moved beyond the Delta Quadrant though, but that could just mean they didn't explore pathways that left the area they were familiar with.
The error of assumption is that the Ocampan species need the same amount of learning time as the longer species, they do not.
Due to their short lifespans, they developed the ability to learn and memorise much faster then anyone else could, so their learning curve is incredibly rapid when compared to other species. For example, an Ocampan Starfleet Cadet would graduate in 6 months instead of 6 years.
It is not necessary to use the Borg transwarp network to transwarp, it's just faster that way. If enough transwarp coils were salvaged/acquired and integrated into drive technology, the journey between quadrants would be quite short, years instead of decades.
In any case, however, the Ocampans came to be in the Alpha Quadrant, the fact remains that Linnea is present in the Alpha Quadrant long before the Iconian Gateways and the Spheres are discovered, so that is confirmation that however they emigrated, it did not involve any of those devices to move between quadrants.
And it's unlikely just one solitary Ocampan emigrated, so others must have come with her.
For context, Linnea is encountered just after the tutorial in the beginning of the game and the Iconian travel network/Spheres do not appear until near the end of the game.
Bees like honey, they don't like vinegar.
Everytime someone makes a character that is an copy of an existing superhuman, Creativity is sad
I dragged my feet when I was thinking of making a Talaxian Delta Recruit the last time that Recruitment 'drive' was in effect.
Finally made a Klingon Tactical Talaxian this time around
Then again, it was suggested that the Hirogen claimed the relay network, rather than having created it themselves. Whether they explored the extent of the area covered by the network relays was left up in the air.
The stuff the Hirogen say falls under "maybe they're lying", but everything anyone else says is speculation.
My character Tsin'xing
The Hirogen say "it is ours" when referencing the relay network, which doesn't actually say they created it.
Perhaps in their mind since they found it first and nobody else understood how to use it, they own the relay network.
But it is implied that Hirogen ships have a speed advantage over starships.
When viewing the travel log of one Hirogen vessel, the comment is made they've covered a lot of space in only a few years.
I don't know if there is any information on how fast a Hirogen vessel can travel at their version of warp speed or if there is any technology they have that would make an interquadrant journey shorter.
As a general principle, I assume any Delta Quadrant emigration had to take at least 25 years, the time interval between the last episode of Voyager and when the game starts.
Bees like honey, they don't like vinegar.
Everytime someone makes a character that is an copy of an existing superhuman, Creativity is sad
This we do gladly, for we are Jem'Hadar. Victory is Life!"
My theory is if Vorta are granted as a playable species, this option will only be accessible to with a Lifetime Subscription.
Changelings I don't see as being playable ever, they're too different to become a playable species.
Bees like honey, they don't like vinegar.
Everytime someone makes a character that is an copy of an existing superhuman, Creativity is sad
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