PSA: Stop auctioning items below VENDORING cost

fluffymoof

I just found two poor helpless souls on the Exchange who apparently have no idea how to price items in an MMO. they were selling items for BELOW the price it would be to vendor the item. This is just plain dumb, people, as it gives your opportunity cost a negative value (opportunity cost meaning everything else you could have done with that item, including vendoring it). You literally screwed your collective self over.

Know the vendor price before auctioning something so you don't wind up with a negative opportunity cost. Either that or just vendor every item you get.

fluorescentblack

Helping people is bad! For real though, how is this even a thread?

goodscotch

This has to be mentioned in the Rules of Acquisition somewhere.

fluffymoof

fluorescentblack wrote: »

Helping people is bad! For real though, how is this even a thread?

Because after just two of these, it needed said. I then found four more AFTER making this thread.

hanover2

Yeah? What if I don't? What are you gonna do about it? ;-)

byozuma

So doing players a favor... is wrong? If you're posting something that is sold by an NPC that you happened to get as a drop, then your competition isn't other players it's the NPC. So... why not undercut the NPC? Not like you spent any credits on it so it's still all profit for you. I can see matching the NPC if it's something you did pay credits for but wound up not needing, like skill manuals, but that's a specific circumstance. Posting for over the NPC, though, is being a jerk and you shouldn't be a jerk.

leemwatson

byozuma#0956 wrote: »

So doing players a favor... is wrong? If you're posting something that is sold by an NPC that you happened to get as a drop, then your competition isn't other players it's the NPC. So... why not undercut the NPC? Not like you spent any credits on it so it's still all profit for you. I can see matching the NPC if it's something you did pay credits for but wound up not needing, like skill manuals, but that's a specific circumstance. Posting for over the NPC, though, is being a jerk and you shouldn't be a jerk.

Exactly this!

tigeraries

you know vendor prices are not uniform... you can hut out a vendor for a better price (but its not that much more, only a few % points) or you can sell it on auction for what you feel like... sure you can get more but maybe you want to sell for less so as to help other players. Regardless, those items are drops and cost you zip... anything you get from it is pure profit.

cidjack

byozuma#0956 wrote: »

So doing players a favor... is wrong? If you're posting something that is sold by an NPC that you happened to get as a drop, then your competition isn't other players it's the NPC. So... why not undercut the NPC? Not like you spent any credits on it so it's still all profit for you. I can see matching the NPC if it's something you did pay credits for but wound up not needing, like skill manuals, but that's a specific circumstance. Posting for over the NPC, though, is being a jerk and you shouldn't be a jerk.

I completely agree. When some of us are close to the 1 Billion EC limit, vendoring can waste EC.

memnoch

I do it on purpose. I like helping others.

starkaos

byozuma#0956 wrote: »

So doing players a favor... is wrong? If you're posting something that is sold by an NPC that you happened to get as a drop, then your competition isn't other players it's the NPC. So... why not undercut the NPC? Not like you spent any credits on it so it's still all profit for you. I can see matching the NPC if it's something you did pay credits for but wound up not needing, like skill manuals, but that's a specific circumstance. Posting for over the NPC, though, is being a jerk and you shouldn't be a jerk.

Doing players a favor by selling it under the vendor price is more likely to help players that manipulate the market rather than players that actually need help. If you sell a lockbox ship for 20 million thinking that you are actually helping someone that needs the ship, then it is far more likely that whoever bought the ship for 20 million will sell it for 120 million or whatever the current price is. So you are just hurting yourself by trying to be nice. Therefore, in order to help those that need it, then it is better to sell or give the ship to a friend or fleet mate that you know instead of using the Exchange. Of course, vendor trash doesn't matter too much where it is sold to most players since it might be about 1,000 EC that is lost by selling it cheaper than what they can get from the vendor.

Now if the Exchange worked by only the largest bid purchased the item, then it does make sense to post it at a low price to reduce the Auction fees.

byozuma

A lockbox isn't a vendor, though. It's a lockbox that requires a key to even open, which is itself an expensive item whether bought directly with zen or off the Exchange. The issue at heart here isn't something from a lockbox, it's something like a Basic Upgrade, ship or ground equipment and the like. Things that have a vendor selling it somewhere for cheap. Things from lockboxes don't have vendors selling what they drop, it's what makes them so unique and why it's justifiable to sell those drops for high prices.

tousseau

But... How else am I supposed to make my EC, beyond profiting off of those under priced items?

starkaos

byozuma#0956 wrote: »

A lockbox isn't a vendor, though. It's a lockbox that requires a key to even open, which is itself an expensive item whether bought directly with zen or off the Exchange. The issue at heart here isn't something from a lockbox, it's something like a Basic Upgrade, ship or ground equipment and the like. Things that have a vendor selling it somewhere for cheap. Things from lockboxes don't have vendors selling what they drop, it's what makes them so unique and why it's justifiable to sell those drops for high prices.

It doesn't matter if there are no vendors selling lockbox ships. The same situation applies no matter if it is vendor trash or a lockbox ship. The only difference is one is more profitable and efficient than the other. Someone purchasing items that are less than what they can sell it to the vendor will either sell it to a vendor or sell it on the Exchange for between the vendor's selling and purchase price is the same as purchasing a lockbox ship for 20 million and selling it for 120 million.

officerbatman81

The reason for the OP's post is clear to me. If people under value the item on the exchange the overall value will shift lower. The OP's profits get undercut because they have stock in that item.
Its like a bunch of people who put up master keys for 1mil ec when the average price is 5.5 or 6 mil ec. People who have 6mil ec keys will be pissed because no one will buy their more expensive keys when there are cheaper keys.

But didnt the value of commodities drop due to the fleet change anyway? People are dump devalued stock.

byozuma

The differences, though, is that when an NPC is selling something, no matter where that NPC happens to be located, you have a price almost literally set in stone. Those items that can't be bought from an NPC are on players to give value to, which can vary as wildly as the items themselves. And before anyone brings it up, a white name phaser array is not the same as a green name phaser array. The former can be bought from any Federation Ship Part Requisition NPC while the latter is strictly a drop from a mob.

fluffymoof

officerbatman81 wrote: »

The reason for the OP's post is clear to me. If people under value the item on the exchange the overall value will shift lower. The OP's profits get undercut because they have stock in that item.
Its like a bunch of people who put up master keys for 1mil ec when the average price is 5.5 or 6 mil ec. People who have 6mil ec keys will be pissed because no one will buy their more expensive keys when there are cheaper keys.

But didnt the value of commodities drop due to the fleet change anyway? People are dump devalued stock.

Yep, and they're selling it for less than what I could get from discarding the item.

captainwells

I say let gamers sell stuff for whatever price that they choose, I mean until the game mechanic itself states that lowballing any time is forbidden; seeing someone gripe about how others may price items just to unload it is ridiculous.

The high end players with umpteen multi-millions of credits are going to buy the expensive stuff anyway and this thread seems to have been intended to slam on the smallfry players nowhere near that level. What is the point?

cidjack

tousseau wrote: »

But... How else am I supposed to make my EC, beyond profiting off of those under priced items?

This player gets it!

tigeraries

byozuma#0956 wrote: »

The differences, though, is that when an NPC is selling something, no matter where that NPC happens to be located, you have a price almost literally set in stone. Those items that can't be bought from an NPC are on players to give value to, which can vary as wildly as the items themselves. And before anyone brings it up, a white name phaser array is not the same as a green name phaser array. The former can be bought from any Federation Ship Part Requisition NPC while the latter is strictly a drop from a mob.

OP is talking about "vendoring" an item... ie you sell it to a vendor. OP is thinks folks should put things on auction that are above the EC you can get if you "vendor" it. Vendor gives at best 49.9% of an item's listed price... at best. There are vendors who give less.

For instance I get 1st place in the Crystal event going on... so I get 2 free Purple Mk 10 items at the end. If I vendor it, the npc will give me say 10k ec... instead I put it on the exchange for 8k. OP thinks I shouldnt.

I dont think anyone would "vendor" a lock box ship for less than half of the listed price... they may under cut the average listed price, but even so... as long as the buyer is ok with the price. "What difference does it make?"

tigeraries

tigeraries wrote: »

byozuma#0956 wrote: »

The differences, though, is that when an NPC is selling something, no matter where that NPC happens to be located, you have a price almost literally set in stone. Those items that can't be bought from an NPC are on players to give value to, which can vary as wildly as the items themselves. And before anyone brings it up, a white name phaser array is not the same as a green name phaser array. The former can be bought from any Federation Ship Part Requisition NPC while the latter is strictly a drop from a mob.

OP is talking about "vendoring" an item... ie you sell it to a vendor. OP is thinks folks should put things on auction that are above the EC you can get if you "vendor" it. Vendor gives at best 49.9% of an item's listed price... at best. There are vendors who give less.

For instance I get 1st place in the Crystal event going on... so I get 2 free Purple Mk 10 items at the end. If I vendor it, the npc will give me say 10k ec... instead I put it on the exchange for 8k. OP thinks I shouldnt.

I dont think anyone would "vendor" a lock box ship for less than half of the listed price... they may under cut the average exchange price, but even so... as long as the buyer is ok with the price. "What difference does it make?"

rattler2

Supply and demand. The more of an item is available, generally the less its worth. We see it all the time with lockbox ships. When they first start dropping they're 300 mil at least on the Exchange. Over time that price drops to as low as 100 mil.

Market saturation drives the price down. So unless there is some hard coded wall for minimum price FOR EVERY ITEM IN THE GAME, people can sell items for 1 EC each if they wanted.

fluorescentblack

Fluffy I still fail to see how this thread is at all a relevant thing to have an issue with, you quoted me and replied but you may have just replied with "because grass is green"

When people post stuff for less than vendor prices they either help people out who need stuff or for those of us in an auction warrior mood you can repost it. This practice produces only ec savings to everyone and especially to those players who are new and could use some discounted items. Where exactly is the problem with this happening?

fovrel

Everything goes into the replicator. I would pay real money to get an auto replicator. Something that removes al loot and just gives me a little EC. A lot of EC is fine too, but as a matter of fact I don't care . I have characters that are stuck. Stuck, in a way that their inventory is full and I am too lazy to make room, because right when I begin to remove items, I get stuck in doubting to remove something or keep it.

Then I create a new character. I look at it and see a wonderful empty inventory. This is my main progress in the game, not character progression, talents, skillpoints etc, but filling up inventory slots.

fluorescentblack

If the items are not bound then you ought to start mailing stuff to yourself, use that unlimited mail storage! The most immediate way to make this useful is 5 stacks of 20 lockboxes before they cycle out. Just do a quick search for the last lock box to cycle out and check what those are posted for.

rattler2

fluorescentblack wrote: »

If the items are not bound then you ought to start mailing stuff to yourself, use that unlimited mail storage! The most immediate way to make this useful is 5 stacks of 20 lockboxes before they cycle out. Just do a quick search for the last lock box to cycle out and check what those are posted for.

Actually... I think there's a limit to the number of messages you can have in your inbox.

tacticalrook

Weird. Can't help but notice the number of folks in this thread who seem to have missed OP's point.

Either way, some people ignorantly post things under vendor prices due to ignorance (seems to be who OP is trying to reach here), some people refuse to vendor anything on principle (printing new space monies leads to inflation, yada), and some people just want to collect names in their mailbox for whatever reason.

Who knows, maybe there are even folks who want to RP as traders and list things on the exchange at prices that are sure to sell?

Heck, maybe they're too lazy to vendor and have a strict policy to put everything in the exchange at the lowest prices.. like robots?

Could be any number of reasons why this happens, really, and there really is no one-size-fits-all PSA to resolve them all. It seems most likely this type of thing will continue until the game shuts down and it's probably best to just let it go.

marcusdkane

fluffymoof wrote: »

I just found two poor helpless souls on the Exchange who apparently have no idea how to price items in an MMO. they were selling items for BELOW the price it would be to vendor the item. This is just plain dumb, people, as it gives your opportunity cost a negative value (opportunity cost meaning everything else you could have done with that item, including vendoring it). You literally screwed your collective self over.

Know the vendor price before auctioning something so you don't wind up with a negative opportunity cost. Either that or just vendor every item you get.

And? It's their business, not yours... Just leave folks be to play the game as they want...

officerbatman81

Btw, is the OP worrying about the npc's fictitious business?

scififan78

I think many here are misunderstanding what the OP is on about. I don't think it would be selling the item below the vendor's sell price but rather the vendor's buy price.

Vendor sells item for 10,000 ec.
Vendor buys said item for 5,000 ec.
Player gets item as a drop but sells it on the exchange for 2,000 ec.

Sure because the item was a drop, it is still +2,000 ec in the bank but, there is a guaranteed 3,000 ec being left on the table.

I always check the listed price on the exchange. If it is below 50% of the items listed value, it goes to the vendor.