Going from a fairly flexible system (0-9 points in any skill set minus some lock-ins as you move columns)
Although you could add 0-9 pumps into any given skill, as a practical matter the number of pumps put into any skill were typically either 0, 3, 6 or 9, with any other values typically being a rarity due to having "leftover" points from expenditures elsewhere in the build. Thus, going to an investment of 0, 1, 2 or 3 skill points in the new system aligns fairly closely with previous options.
0, 3, 6, 9
0, 1, 2, 3
I might have missed it, but would increasing the amounts also reduce to return like it does currently?
Retired. I'm now in search for that perfect space anomaly.
Thanks for the answer on the Doff Missions Crit +25, but what I was concerned with was the points already gained. Say I have gained +75 Gravgens, is that extra going to be wiped out on the initial reset?
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
So instead of a system where work and effort (in my case through hard experience and mistakes) and learning through building another character it's being 'dumbed down'/made simpler.
Disregarding the work and effort people have made into their character. and now an amorphous glut of similar builds, because its now so much simpler. Because a lot of people I know through this game consider their efforts and years of playing and using respecs, feel cheated somehow, like as been stated here the dumbing down of wow
Or is this 'too much doom and gloom' of a viewpoint
Like what? According to the translation the console in my example should receive a 62.5 bonus from the new control skill but I rather doubt they would allow that. It's a conflict and I would like to know how they're going to handle it.
Maybe they won't? Sure you get a giant stat, but you only get one.
Looks fairly good so far (really guys, stop yelling DOOM! until you've at least tried it on Tribble), but I'm a little worried about how the unlocks are going to be handled.
Just as an example, I'm currently specced into driver coil to minimise the power drain from full impulse. While not vital for my build, I'd like to keep it that way, which I may not be able to, if the Driver Coil unlock is put behind a barrier of needing to have selected a dozen or so Engineering track skills.
it's part of general investment not a skill of it's own. IE you get it for investing in that tree.
Judging from the images and what I can gather, does this mean the existing system will be scrapped in favor of an Open-Class system? Or are Eng, Sci, and Tac still going to be character-separate?
Oh NO. The design looks so horrible. Is there time to update/change or give to community for some input or too late? I know there's lots of work behind it but the icons are just awful and boring....
sorry but that UI is totally un-intuitive. Everything is going to be in tooltips? Wut?
Make the system easier for new players but making it more difficult for the millions of current ones.
Another "don't like" vote
Wouldn't making it easier for new players also make it easier for old players? How the heck would it make it more difficult?
Also millions of current players? BAHAHA. I don't think there are millions playing.
We greatly encourage all existing players to try out the changes, both with new and existing characters, and offer whatever feedback you can before the new Skill System becomes a permanent part of the Star Trek Online experience with the launch of Season 11.5 later this Spring!
Why don't the Devs responsible just release an official guide on what the Skills actually do?
Don't they know?
I think that may have been less work than building another Skills system.
Also, by grouping together previously separate Skills you DO change every build that we now enjoy.
Not to mention the ships themselves would cease to perform as they did before the changes...nor our consoles.
I will certainly understand why some players would not be happy with this revamp.
NO to ARC RIP KDF and PvP 2014-07-17 Season 9.5 - Death by Dev
Judging from the images and what I can gather, does this mean the existing system will be scrapped in favor of an Open-Class system? Or are Eng, Sci, and Tac still going to be character-separate?
I doubt it.
If you look at the skill trees currently in play on Holodeck you will see they already have labels: Tactical, Science, Engineering, Operations etc.
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid." - Q
Or is this 'too much doom and gloom' of a viewpoint
Definitely that. Remember, this is a game, and games are like sharks; without exception, they keep moving or they die. However perfect your build will feel right now, *something* will change and suddenly it will be sub-optimal. Like how my GW-throwing sci is currently "sub-optimal" in my estimation until I get the new flagships. If it wasn't this, it would be something else.
So far it's a bit of a mixed bag. The initial description strikes me as a lot more all-or-nothing than the old one (I'm one of those players who liked to put a few points in lots of things) but there are some real wins. The balancing of skills between energy weapons and torps is great - one less penalty for running a mixed economy. The balancing of range dropoffs for cannons and beams is also good. Scis might find it easier to switch builds now. Plus there may be some more trading with class to be done - an Eng may be able to get away with spending loads on tac skills because they can get resilience from their class abilities, for example.
The current skill tree offers a full, all-at-once overview, sans having to scroll thru a tree or MouseOver every icon, is how.
Many of the old skills will be 'subsumed' by newer ones. I expect it will take days, if not weeks, ere I fully grasp what goes where under the new paradigm. Meanwhile, like I argued earlier, you need to make an ad hoc respec decision the very day it's being introduced (lest you're essentially flying with no skills at all). Who amongst you thinks ýou will get it exactly right, the first day?! Why, not me. Hence I re-iterate my question to Bort: will the initial respec come with a grace period? (So we can change stuff around for free, for a while).
I really don't understand why the devs feel the need to push this change on us. The skills system is PERFECTLY FINE THE WAY IT IS AND DOESN'T NEED TO CHANGE.
If anything, just add more info and leave it the way it is. Like so many others, I like the customization available in the current system and changing it to this cookie-cutter clone of other systems is really just gonna push more people away than attract them. It already appears more confusing than the existing system.
Has anyone asked how this affects the Specialization system or is there no need?
Does not affect it
Explain how this will not affect the specialization system when the Pilot tree has attack patterns in it.
Good point.
To compound, all consoles that effect such abilities (like the +Attack Patterns on the Romulan Deflector), or Partgens, or Flowcaps, or you name it, will need to be rewriten/redefined. Think Biblical Epic FAIL... and then double it!
Has anyone asked how this affects the Specialization system or is there no need?
Does not affect it
Explain how this will not affect the specialization system when the Pilot tree has attack patterns in it.
Good point.
To compound, all consoles that effect such abilities (like the +Attack Patterns on the Romulan Deflector), or Partgens, or Flowcaps, or you name it, will need to be rewriten/redefined. Think Biblical Epic FAIL... and then double it!
but that does not affect the specialization system, as it has NO ATTACK PATTERN
"Frankly, not sure why you're on a one man nerf campaign. "
Has anyone asked how this affects the Specialization system or is there no need?
Does not affect it
Explain how this will not affect the specialization tree when the Pilot tree has attack patterns in it.
Pilot line has no Attack Patterns in it. What it has is a Temp Hull point on using Attack Pattern, as in your Bridge officer Ability
I was talking about the skill system change affecting the specialization system, i.e. a specialization point is used to gain a buff from attack patterns. Try to be less focused on the particulars and keep up.
Has anyone asked how this affects the Specialization system or is there no need?
Does not affect it
Explain how this will not affect the specialization system when the Pilot tree has attack patterns in it.
Good point.
To compound, all consoles that effect such abilities (like the +Attack Patterns on the Romulan Deflector), or Partgens, or Flowcaps, or you name it, will need to be rewriten/redefined. Think Biblical Epic FAIL... and then double it!
but that does not affect the specialization system, as it has NO ATTACK PATTERN
Has anyone asked how this affects the Specialization system or is there no need?
Does not affect it
Explain how this will not affect the specialization tree when the Pilot tree has attack patterns in it.
Pilot line has no Attack Patterns in it. What it has is a Temp Hull point on using Attack Pattern, as in your Bridge officer Ability
I was talking about the skill system change affecting the specialization system, i.e. a specialization point is used to gain a buff from attack patterns. Try to be less focused on the particulars and keep up.
Again Bridge Officers Abilities are not changing, the specialization system is not effected.
"Frankly, not sure why you're on a one man nerf campaign. "
Has anyone asked how this affects the Specialization system or is there no need?
Does not affect it
Explain how this will not affect the specialization tree when the Pilot tree has attack patterns in it.
Pilot line has no Attack Patterns in it. What it has is a Temp Hull point on using Attack Pattern, as in your Bridge officer Ability
I was talking about the skill system change affecting the specialization system, i.e. a specialization point is used to gain a buff from attack patterns. Try to be less focused on the particulars and keep up.
^^ Ninja-ed
Yes, that it what I understood you were talking about.
Has anyone asked how this affects the Specialization system or is there no need?
Does not affect it
Explain how this will not affect the specialization tree when the Pilot tree has attack patterns in it.
Pilot line has no Attack Patterns in it. What it has is a Temp Hull point on using Attack Pattern, as in your Bridge officer Ability
I was talking about the skill system change affecting the specialization system, i.e. a specialization point is used to gain a buff from attack patterns. Try to be less focused on the particulars and keep up.
Again Bridge Officers Abilities are not changing, the specialization system is not effected.
Bridge Officers Abilities?!? LOL. What are you on?! We're talking about the personal Specialization tree here! Try and keep up, please!
The sad reality is, no matter what we say or think or how many of us say it... this is happening.
Once an update is this far on in development the sad reality is the developers don't give a damn of what we want and at most only make a few minor tweaks.
Its a sad state of affairs, and a reason why I in general prefer singleplayer RPG's, as there no developer can force unwanted updates on me.
"If you can't take a little bloody nose, maybe you ought to go back home and crawl under your bed. It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid." - Q
Although you could add 0-9 pumps into any given skill, as a practical matter the number of pumps put into any skill were typically either 0, 3, 6 or 9, with any other values typically being a rarity due to having "leftover" points from expenditures elsewhere in the build. Thus, going to an investment of 0, 1, 2 or 3 skill points in the new system aligns fairly closely with previous options.
0, 3, 6, 9
0, 1, 2, 3
Took 12 pages of reading...but I finally found someone who explained it in a way I can connect to. Thanks!
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
The sad reality is, no matter what we say or think or how many of us say it... this is happening.
Once an update is this far on in development the sad reality is the developers don't give a damn of what we want and at most only make a few minor tweaks.
Its a sad state of affairs, and a reason why I in general prefer singleplayer RPG's, as there no developer can force unwanted updates on me.
Has anyone asked how this affects the Specialization system or is there no need?
Does not affect it
Explain how this will not affect the specialization tree when the Pilot tree has attack patterns in it.
Pilot line has no Attack Patterns in it. What it has is a Temp Hull point on using Attack Pattern, as in your Bridge officer Ability
I was talking about the skill system change affecting the specialization system, i.e. a specialization point is used to gain a buff from attack patterns. Try to be less focused on the particulars and keep up.
Again Bridge Officers Abilities are not changing, the specialization system is not effected.
Bridge Officers Abilities?!? LOL. What are you on?! We're talking about the personal Specialization tree here! Try and keep up, please!
Really, the guy asked about the Specialization Tree, the pilot line, Attack Pattern Exp. The NEW SKILL SYSTEM, will not effect anything withe the Specialization System, as the Attack Pattern Exp is based off of BO Abilities, not anything on the skill system
Perhaps you should keep up with the thread and what is said
"Frankly, not sure why you're on a one man nerf campaign. "
Comments
I might have missed it, but would increasing the amounts also reduce to return like it does currently?
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Disregarding the work and effort people have made into their character. and now an amorphous glut of similar builds, because its now so much simpler. Because a lot of people I know through this game consider their efforts and years of playing and using respecs, feel cheated somehow, like as been stated here the dumbing down of wow
Or is this 'too much doom and gloom' of a viewpoint
My character Tsin'xing
does no effect to it
Wouldn't making it easier for new players also make it easier for old players? How the heck would it make it more difficult?
Also millions of current players? BAHAHA. I don't think there are millions playing.
Why don't the Devs responsible just release an official guide on what the Skills actually do?
Don't they know?
I think that may have been less work than building another Skills system.
Also, by grouping together previously separate Skills you DO change every build that we now enjoy.
Not to mention the ships themselves would cease to perform as they did before the changes...nor our consoles.
I will certainly understand why some players would not be happy with this revamp.
RIP KDF and PvP 2014-07-17 Season 9.5 - Death by Dev
Explain how this will not affect the specialization system when the Pilot tree has attack patterns in it.
I doubt it.
If you look at the skill trees currently in play on Holodeck you will see they already have labels: Tactical, Science, Engineering, Operations etc.
And on the rare occasion that I have questions, the Wiki is one click away.
My Ship Builds: USS Conqueror, HMS Victorious, HMS Concord, ISS Queen Elizabeth, Black Widow III
Click here to view my DeviantArt.
Definitely that. Remember, this is a game, and games are like sharks; without exception, they keep moving or they die. However perfect your build will feel right now, *something* will change and suddenly it will be sub-optimal. Like how my GW-throwing sci is currently "sub-optimal" in my estimation until I get the new flagships. If it wasn't this, it would be something else.
So far it's a bit of a mixed bag. The initial description strikes me as a lot more all-or-nothing than the old one (I'm one of those players who liked to put a few points in lots of things) but there are some real wins. The balancing of skills between energy weapons and torps is great - one less penalty for running a mixed economy. The balancing of range dropoffs for cannons and beams is also good. Scis might find it easier to switch builds now. Plus there may be some more trading with class to be done - an Eng may be able to get away with spending loads on tac skills because they can get resilience from their class abilities, for example.
Pilot line has no Attack Patterns in it. What it has is a Temp Hull point on using Attack Pattern, as in your Bridge officer Ability
The current skill tree offers a full, all-at-once overview, sans having to scroll thru a tree or MouseOver every icon, is how.
Many of the old skills will be 'subsumed' by newer ones. I expect it will take days, if not weeks, ere I fully grasp what goes where under the new paradigm. Meanwhile, like I argued earlier, you need to make an ad hoc respec decision the very day it's being introduced (lest you're essentially flying with no skills at all). Who amongst you thinks ýou will get it exactly right, the first day?! Why, not me. Hence I re-iterate my question to Bort: will the initial respec come with a grace period? (So we can change stuff around for free, for a while).
If anything, just add more info and leave it the way it is. Like so many others, I like the customization available in the current system and changing it to this cookie-cutter clone of other systems is really just gonna push more people away than attract them. It already appears more confusing than the existing system.
Good point.
To compound, all consoles that effect such abilities (like the +Attack Patterns on the Romulan Deflector), or Partgens, or Flowcaps, or you name it, will need to be rewriten/redefined. Think Biblical Epic FAIL... and then double it!
but that does not affect the specialization system, as it has NO ATTACK PATTERN
I was talking about the skill system change affecting the specialization system, i.e. a specialization point is used to gain a buff from attack patterns. Try to be less focused on the particulars and keep up.
Look up Attack Pattern Expertise. (Pilot)
Again Bridge Officers Abilities are not changing, the specialization system is not effected.
^^ Ninja-ed
Yes, that it what I understood you were talking about.
Bridge Officers Abilities?!? LOL. What are you on?! We're talking about the personal Specialization tree here! Try and keep up, please!
Once an update is this far on in development the sad reality is the developers don't give a damn of what we want and at most only make a few minor tweaks.
Its a sad state of affairs, and a reason why I in general prefer singleplayer RPG's, as there no developer can force unwanted updates on me.
Took 12 pages of reading...but I finally found someone who explained it in a way I can connect to. Thanks!
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
^^ This, really. Resistance is futile.
Really, the guy asked about the Specialization Tree, the pilot line, Attack Pattern Exp. The NEW SKILL SYSTEM, will not effect anything withe the Specialization System, as the Attack Pattern Exp is based off of BO Abilities, not anything on the skill system
Perhaps you should keep up with the thread and what is said