$30 USD every two months is insignificant to the amount of money-grabs and grind in STO. Everything (outside subscription) in SWTOR is vanity. Everything ,(outside of subscription) which is roughly 97%, is FAR from vanity (excluding outfits but that's negligible since Crptic/PWe gives them away anyways) so if you were to blow money at all on either game you would end up paying about 80% more in STO than SWTOR BY FAR! This is beyond obvious.... So please enjoy my reaction to your post:
Like I said, you very well can play STO without EVER paying real money. And you will be perfectly good.
I see reading comprehension is not your best subject... now go back and read it again slowly.. My character was in the mid 30s levels AND HAD access to personal storage as soon as I got my starship BEFORE I spent $10 on the game.
It's also possible he may have gotten it via referral -- I can't remember, but I think one of the perks of being referred by a subbed member is that unlock.
Now THAT is a possibility, I do not recall if I used a referral code or not by that point.
Okay, one thing: don't insult people with "reading comprehension" stuff. That invalidates your argument automatically with me. Also, I will say this again: free players never had the priviledge of having the personal cargo hold for free, from the moment the game went from Pure subscription to what it is now. Now, are you going to let it go? I have been playing SWTOR for as long as it's been free-to-play (part of the time as a free player), so I know what I'm talking about in this instance. Plus, the link I provided is further proof that free players never had cargo hold access without purchasing something for $5. Also, to add something, you didn't say "Before" you made the purchase, you said "by the time." That indicates that you didn't have the cargo hold prior to the purchase.
Now, are you going to let it go? I have been playing SWTOR for as long as it's been free-to-play (part of the time as a free player), so I know what I'm talking about in this instance.
Also, to add something, you didn't say "Before" you made the purchase, you said "by the time." That indicates that you didn't have the cargo hold prior to the purchase.
$30 USD every two months is insignificant to the amount of money-grabs and grind in STO. Everything (outside subscription) in SWTOR is vanity. Everything ,(outside of subscription) which is roughly 97%, is FAR from vanity (excluding outfits but that's negligible since Crptic/PWe gives them away anyways) so if you were to blow money at all on either game you would end up paying about 80% more in STO than SWTOR BY FAR! This is beyond obvious.... So please enjoy my reaction to your post:
Like I said, you very well can play STO without EVER paying real money. And you will be perfectly good.
In order for SWTOR to match the kind of content available in STO what all would you have to unlock as an SWTOR F2P?
As an swtor f2p is the content available to you equal to what sto f2p gets? sto gets 10 and 20 man instances for free. Those *are* raid sized instances but are they raid difficulty? i dont know about the lower tier of swtor f2p but i'm preferred f2p and i can run as many 5 man dungeons as i want. If i wanted to run actual raid content i can spend credits and get weekly passes. But i have no more interest in pvp or raiding anymore just leveling and 5 mans.
In 5mans my loot rolls are limited to 3 per week but i dont do dungeons for loot i do it for currency and for fun. How often does anybody here use an actual loot drop from an STO 5 man? All my gear in swtor is adaptive and that type of gear can be easily gotten from vendors or purchased with cartel coins if you have them or even the GTN using credits. I can farm commendation badges and purchase mods and put those in my adaptive gear. In STO my ship is either a free 40 version, cheap mirror ship or one that i farmed a ton of Dil/Zen for. And my gear for those ships is also something that i farmed a ton of Dil/Lobi for.
SWTOR *does* have some features that are limited use for f2p. Bank access, number of action bars, hide helmet, unify colors, pvp and raid access stuff like that. It is probably possible to play the game with limited action bars but it would be annoying. Also possible to play with no professions and probably no bank access either but also annoying. And you guys might have laughed when i mentioned hide helm. But some classes have hideous helm designs and you'd want to hide those helms or unify colors so you dont have multicolored armor pieces. But most of those unlocks can be purchased with in game credits. I can probably check in a little bit to let you all know the typical price for unlocking something like action bars and bank access with credits.
Another point I would bring up. That 12x XP rate for subs. If STO tried that people would bloody riot.
Its optional and can be disabled with a potion of some sort. Though i think it would have been better if they put that potion on the starter worlds but last i heard it was on the fleet which you would normally get to at level 9-10 but probably faster with the 12xp.
Another point I would bring up. That 12x XP rate for subs. If STO tried that people would bloody riot.
Its optional and can be disabled with a potion of some sort. Though i think it would have been better if they put that potion on the starter worlds but last i heard it was on the fleet which you would normally get to at level 9-10 but probably faster with the 12xp.
I was more talking about how big of a gap that puts between subbing players and everyone else.
I'm willing to put money toward a game but I find the sub model iffy to me. It feels like I have to play only it or I'm not getting my money worth.
But most of those unlocks can be purchased with in game credits. I can probably check in a little bit to let you all know the typical price for unlocking something like action bars and bank access with credits.
The prices on most those unlocks stop at 250k or 350k because only free players or "premium"(those that spent money once) need to buy it. Usually they're a lot cheaper for most these unlocks, esp character only. Account wide Unlocks are pricey but they ARE for your whole account. I've also had complete strangers just GIVE me character unlocks like one for Section-X because they know it sucks to not be able to run certain areas.
The cash shop costs for MOST the good unlocks can be bought with the "complimentary" coins you get per month you subscribe.. I think I got the important ones for like 3months so give or take 1500cc(their version of zen) to get em all I think youd need about 2.5x that.
$30 USD every two months is insignificant to the amount of money-grabs and grind in STO. Everything (outside subscription) in SWTOR is vanity. Everything ,(outside of subscription) which is roughly 97%, is FAR from vanity (excluding outfits but that's negligible since Crptic/PWe gives them away anyways) so if you were to blow money at all on either game you would end up paying about 80% more in STO than SWTOR BY FAR! This is beyond obvious.... So please enjoy my reaction to your post:
Like I said, you very well can play STO without EVER paying real money. And you will be perfectly good.
o.0 Where's the value in that when that available avenue is not fun? Does that not defeat the whole point of a game? It's like a magazine service.... you can pay to get the latest issue at release OR you can not pay and go dumpster diving for your neighbor's old copy which he/she may or may not have even received and subsequently thrown out.
I can't speak for everyone but I found SWTOR to be a flat out mugging as f2p player. Even some of the more simpler things like trying to get a party together to handle a zone is hard thanks to the crappy chat system.
I still remember the straw that broke my back. A down right ugly hat that I could not get rid of. STO's 1-49 is f2p and fun, most people can agree on that I think. It was the Reps capital world that I said TRIBBLE SWTOR with a lightsaber, I'm guessing the endgame of SWTOR where you have enough credits to buy some of the sub perks is when that game becomes fun.
Another point I would bring up. That 12x XP rate for subs. If STO tried that people would bloody riot.
Its optional and can be disabled with a potion of some sort. Though i think it would have been better if they put that potion on the starter worlds but last i heard it was on the fleet which you would normally get to at level 9-10 but probably faster with the 12xp.
I was more talking about how big of a gap that puts between subbing players and everyone else.
I'm willing to put money toward a game but I find the sub model iffy to me. It feels like I have to play only it or I'm not getting my money worth.
To be honest the "gap" doesn't really effect much seeing as PvP is scaled based on the highest level player and so your gear gets a boost in the match and doesn't really effect much else. I know plenty of players who are F2P (no preferred) and they still love the game and see no reason to sub other than its a boost with goodies.
As for everyone else saying the game is a rip off:
The developers wanted it to stay P2P, the publisher didn't because its a EA and they are the biggest money grabbers in the western market not to mention the game wasn't doing too well in the beginning, when the dev's resisted the change EA realised that if they lose the devs their investment would collapse so they created a 70-30 model, basically everything would be super restrictive but still playable for free, whether you find it enjoyable or not without subbing is up to you, I personally love the game and find I cant enjoy it without subbing, mostly because when I subbed I noticed the difference.
Is swtor worth more than STO, simple answer? yes.
Why? because you don't have to spend ridiculous amounts of money to get cash shop based items as they're all sold on the GTN, alls you have to do is grind credits and hey presto you can buy whatever you want and as someone mentioned a vast majority of Swtor's pack content and cash shop content is cosmetic and convenience nothing more. In STO you have to pay £30 or more for ships that don't really do much than their previous incarnation with the occasional OP specilization that gets nerfed into non-existance. Alls you're really paying for is the visual design, want proof of that? just look at how many T5-U ships are running end game content. why bother buying a new ship when you can just do everything with your old one. Frankly STO right now feels like the F2P version of Swtor the only difference is instead of having to buy PvP passes to play there is barely, if at all any PvP. Swtor is a good deal, STO is a rip off. A single ship costing more than a AAA game DLC? Pfft. A ship pack costing more than a AAA full game? PFFT.
I still like playing STO, if it wasnt for the story content and the nostalgia feel I get from playing I wouldnt have ever started. but overall, the people who are trying to say STO has better content or a better business model are honestly delusional.
Another point I would bring up. That 12x XP rate for subs. If STO tried that people would bloody riot.
Its optional and can be disabled with a potion of some sort. Though i think it would have been better if they put that potion on the starter worlds but last i heard it was on the fleet which you would normally get to at level 9-10 but probably faster with the 12xp.
I was more talking about how big of a gap that puts between subbing players and everyone else.
I'm willing to put money toward a game but I find the sub model iffy to me. It feels like I have to play only it or I'm not getting my money worth.
To be honest the "gap" doesn't really effect much seeing as PvP is scaled based on the highest level player and so your gear gets a boost in the match and doesn't really effect much else. I know plenty of players who are F2P (no preferred) and they still love the game and see no reason to sub other than its a boost with goodies.
As for everyone else saying the game is a rip off:
The developers wanted it to stay P2P, the publisher didn't because its a EA and they are the biggest money grabbers in the western market not to mention the game wasn't doing too well in the beginning, when the dev's resisted the change EA realised that if they lose the devs their investment would collapse so they created a 70-30 model, basically everything would be super restrictive but still playable for free, whether you find it enjoyable or not without subbing is up to you, I personally love the game and find I cant enjoy it without subbing, mostly because when I subbed I noticed the difference.
Is swtor worth more than STO, simple answer? yes.
Why? because you don't have to spend ridiculous amounts of money to get cash shop based items as they're all sold on the GTN, alls you have to do is grind credits and hey presto you can buy whatever you want and as someone mentioned a vast majority of Swtor's pack content and cash shop content is cosmetic and convenience nothing more. In STO you have to pay £30 or more for ships that don't really do much than their previous incarnation with the occasional OP specilization that gets nerfed into non-existance. Alls you're really paying for is the visual design, want proof of that? just look at how many T5-U ships are running end game content. why bother buying a new ship when you can just do everything with your old one. Frankly STO right now feels like the F2P version of Swtor the only difference is instead of having to buy PvP passes to play there is barely, if at all any PvP. Swtor is a good deal, STO is a rip off. A single ship costing more than a AAA game DLC? Pfft. A ship pack costing more than a AAA full game? PFFT.
I still like playing STO, if it wasnt for the story content and the nostalgia feel I get from playing I wouldnt have ever started. but overall, the people who are trying to say STO has better content or a better business model are honestly delusional.
I was about to mocking joke about how the same can be said for STO and the dil exchange but that would be mean.
You want to hit the ground running? Haha TRIBBLE you pay me
You want head to the fleet (the major hub of your faction) before level 10? Haha TRIBBLE you pay me
You want to be able to craft without having to buy stuff from other players? Guess what you can do? Pay me
You can read the rest yourself. A demo mode with a lower level cap would not be as ugly as this system and I can't find any way someone can defend this mess.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,117Community Moderator
Now, are you going to let it go? I have been playing SWTOR for as long as it's been free-to-play (part of the time as a free player), so I know what I'm talking about in this instance.
Also, to add something, you didn't say "Before" you made the purchase, you said "by the time." That indicates that you didn't have the cargo hold prior to the purchase.
again learn to read. Done with you now
I can verify that TOR F2P never had access to the bank without spending $5 to get "Preferred" status. I started as F2P, and I had no bank. In fact, according to the F2P model for TOR... the ONLY thing free is the story itself. At least until their expansions. ONce you get to "Preferred" status, a few more things open up a bit, including bank access. Basically its geared towards pushing you into that initial $5 purchase.
And I don't think insulting people's ability to read is a good way to make your point.
Oh yeah, I forgot: Credit cap of 200k or 250k (less than what most important unlocks cost), and you aren't allowed to use the chat *at all* until level 10.
250k for pure free, 350k for "freemium" and most of the character unlocks are less than 250k tho there are day(and sometimes weeks) where derpo's forget who they're selling to
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In order for SWTOR to match the kind of content available in STO what all would you have to unlock as an SWTOR F2P?
As an swtor f2p is the content available to you equal to what sto f2p gets? sto gets 10 and 20 man instances for free. Those *are* raid sized instances but are they raid difficulty? i dont know about the lower tier of swtor f2p but i'm preferred f2p and i can run as many 5 man dungeons as i want. If i wanted to run actual raid content i can spend credits and get weekly passes. But i have no more interest in pvp or raiding anymore just leveling and 5 mans.
In 5mans my loot rolls are limited to 3 per week but i dont do dungeons for loot i do it for currency and for fun. How often does anybody here use an actual loot drop from an STO 5 man? All my gear in swtor is adaptive and that type of gear can be easily gotten from vendors or purchased with cartel coins if you have them or even the GTN using credits. I can farm commendation badges and purchase mods and put those in my adaptive gear. In STO my ship is either a free 40 version, cheap mirror ship or one that i farmed a ton of Dil/Zen for. And my gear for those ships is also something that i farmed a ton of Dil/Lobi for.
SWTOR *does* have some features that are limited use for f2p. Bank access, number of action bars, hide helmet, unify colors, pvp and raid access stuff like that. It is probably possible to play the game with limited action bars but it would be annoying. Also possible to play with no professions and probably no bank access either but also annoying. And you guys might have laughed when i mentioned hide helm. But some classes have hideous helm designs and you'd want to hide those helms or unify colors so you dont have multicolored armor pieces. But most of those unlocks can be purchased with in game credits. I can probably check in a little bit to let you all know the typical price for unlocking something like action bars and bank access with credits.
Its optional and can be disabled with a potion of some sort. Though i think it would have been better if they put that potion on the starter worlds but last i heard it was on the fleet which you would normally get to at level 9-10 but probably faster with the 12xp.
I was more talking about how big of a gap that puts between subbing players and everyone else.
I'm willing to put money toward a game but I find the sub model iffy to me. It feels like I have to play only it or I'm not getting my money worth.
The cash shop costs for MOST the good unlocks can be bought with the "complimentary" coins you get per month you subscribe.. I think I got the important ones for like 3months so give or take 1500cc(their version of zen) to get em all I think youd need about 2.5x that.
I feel like that too... this is why I only sub to swtor during promo's that way I can rationalize it as buying the promo offer not sub time lol
o.0 Where's the value in that when that available avenue is not fun? Does that not defeat the whole point of a game? It's like a magazine service.... you can pay to get the latest issue at release OR you can not pay and go dumpster diving for your neighbor's old copy which he/she may or may not have even received and subsequently thrown out.
I still remember the straw that broke my back. A down right ugly hat that I could not get rid of. STO's 1-49 is f2p and fun, most people can agree on that I think. It was the Reps capital world that I said TRIBBLE SWTOR with a lightsaber, I'm guessing the endgame of SWTOR where you have enough credits to buy some of the sub perks is when that game becomes fun.
To be honest the "gap" doesn't really effect much seeing as PvP is scaled based on the highest level player and so your gear gets a boost in the match and doesn't really effect much else. I know plenty of players who are F2P (no preferred) and they still love the game and see no reason to sub other than its a boost with goodies.
As for everyone else saying the game is a rip off:
The developers wanted it to stay P2P, the publisher didn't because its a EA and they are the biggest money grabbers in the western market not to mention the game wasn't doing too well in the beginning, when the dev's resisted the change EA realised that if they lose the devs their investment would collapse so they created a 70-30 model, basically everything would be super restrictive but still playable for free, whether you find it enjoyable or not without subbing is up to you, I personally love the game and find I cant enjoy it without subbing, mostly because when I subbed I noticed the difference.
Is swtor worth more than STO, simple answer? yes.
Why? because you don't have to spend ridiculous amounts of money to get cash shop based items as they're all sold on the GTN, alls you have to do is grind credits and hey presto you can buy whatever you want and as someone mentioned a vast majority of Swtor's pack content and cash shop content is cosmetic and convenience nothing more. In STO you have to pay £30 or more for ships that don't really do much than their previous incarnation with the occasional OP specilization that gets nerfed into non-existance. Alls you're really paying for is the visual design, want proof of that? just look at how many T5-U ships are running end game content. why bother buying a new ship when you can just do everything with your old one. Frankly STO right now feels like the F2P version of Swtor the only difference is instead of having to buy PvP passes to play there is barely, if at all any PvP. Swtor is a good deal, STO is a rip off. A single ship costing more than a AAA game DLC? Pfft. A ship pack costing more than a AAA full game? PFFT.
I still like playing STO, if it wasnt for the story content and the nostalgia feel I get from playing I wouldnt have ever started. but overall, the people who are trying to say STO has better content or a better business model are honestly delusional.
I was about to mocking joke about how the same can be said for STO and the dil exchange but that would be mean.
Let up cover everything. From their site.
http://www.swtor.com/free/features
You want to hit the ground running? Haha TRIBBLE you pay me
You want head to the fleet (the major hub of your faction) before level 10? Haha TRIBBLE you pay me
You want to be able to craft without having to buy stuff from other players? Guess what you can do? Pay me
You can read the rest yourself. A demo mode with a lower level cap would not be as ugly as this system and I can't find any way someone can defend this mess.
I can verify that TOR F2P never had access to the bank without spending $5 to get "Preferred" status. I started as F2P, and I had no bank. In fact, according to the F2P model for TOR... the ONLY thing free is the story itself. At least until their expansions. ONce you get to "Preferred" status, a few more things open up a bit, including bank access. Basically its geared towards pushing you into that initial $5 purchase.
And I don't think insulting people's ability to read is a good way to make your point.