People have played for years with their skills & specs maxed out. I'm sure you have too, so that argument is blown completely out of the water.
If Cryptic uses your logic, all they have to do is make it 150000000000 points for 1 specialization point. You'd be perfectly happy with that, yes?
^^ Played forever at level 50. It didn't take a year to get to 50. The Argala Wall ahead is much bigger than the waiting for the last mk XII tech to drop in Cure Elite. When it did finally, it still wasn't boring. You were honing your game. You were beating your records. The only record to beat right now is to get all that Argala in before the next "boost" to XP comes.
I have to agree with every single word OP said. Since DR STO is pretty much dead for me. It's gotten way too grindy while offering no inspiration at all. My daily time on STO used to be more than 2 hours. Now it's between 10-30 minutes if I log on at all. I just can't play this game as a casual player anymore. If you log in all you do is catching up on the stuff you missed. No thanks Cryptic.
Make the game fun again. Let me play with people without being hopelessly undergeared and underskilled. And don't make it feel like work, like I'm just doing it for the rewards and nothing else at all. Reduce the insane dill costs from upgrading items. Offer some content. Fix some PvP since it would solve many of the lacking content and repetitive issues you have.
If they simply made all the content and kills match up it would be fine and a lot of this upset wouldn't be going on.
You can't tell me taking out a Kazon carrier should be giving you more XP than a Borg Tac cube, which it does. Kazon Carrier on normal = 206 XP, Borg Tac cube on Elite 105.
That alone makes STFing on Elite almost completely pointless as far as XP gains go.
A normalization across the board would really help a lot as far as XP goes.
Make all the missions pay out the same, hell even use Argala as a base, I wouldn't mind it taking a long time as long as the content was all paying out the same which it is not.
Argala takes all of what, ten minutes to do? If a story mission takes an hour then times the XP gain by 6 compaired to Argala, super easy.
It's interesting reading all the varied opinions, even if I don't agree with most of them.
I am -very- curious how long people think it -should- take to max out their character - again. The game was -way- too fast with EXP before. Making level 50 in a week is insanely easy and stupid. I don't buy the "Casuals are ok with it", mainly because I am casual and made 50 even faster than that.
Now, people are crying because maxxing their spec points might take a few months? So I wonder... how is that so terrible? How long do you -think- it should take? A week? Ten days? So that you can get maxxed out again in the blink of an eye to start complaining about lack of advancement/content again?
Cryptic is facing an issue that has plagued every MMO maker since forever. There's a segment that will max-level as quick as mathematically possible. There's a segment that plays c asually. There's a segment in between. How do they please everyone while creating an environment that encourages people to play/buy/spend?
It's interesting reading all the varied opinions ...
... because maxxing their spec points might take a few months? ...
Read again ... noone is asking for super-easy Spec Points (few months ? you serious ?) ... but most of us want achievable Spec Points, within their Lifetime ... and some fools even want them for their Alts, without outsourcing them to their kids some day ...
Patch Notes : Resolved an Issue, where people would accidently experience Fun.
Difficult to state any simple answer here as everyone is different, however I would expect to see a spec point every hour of grinding, not every three hours as it currently is. You are though quite missing the point. The point of that humongous wall of Argalas in Post #1 was that this is the ONLY way to earn those spec points in anything like a reasonable time frame and in fact even that is far from reasonable since the nerf. It's the lack of content that rewards XP that is the problem here as has been written many times so far but to which I am happy to repeat once again for those that cba to read the whole thread.
Unfortunately for me, I get more time to read a forum post in the middle of having to do other things than spend hours in Argala. I would be happy to see 1 single spec a DAY.
I get 1 spec point from just running ques and doing doffs every 3-4 days.
24h of queuing & doffing, maybe ... during Bonus Mark Event (last 24h) I did ~22 Bug Hunt Advanced + new Doff Assigments ~every hour (-7 hours sleep) ... still no Spec Point (almost there, though) ...
Patch Notes : Resolved an Issue, where people would accidently experience Fun.
The question I am wondering about - you get specialization points. Slowly, but surely. It takes time, yes. But you get something new. You are not actually forced to paly the exact same character for those 10 Trillion or whatever missions it takes - your character advances, plays differently, gets access to new features.
Isn't that better than being static all the time?
AFAIK, people were grinding reputations back then so there was something to gain. You can just combine all the other activities with skill points. It is not actually so that you only can play one mission - you can do all the stuff you previously did - make dilithium, earn marks, build up your fleet, and along the way, instead of getting nothnig else, you get specialization points. It's like a second reputation track, but you get marks from any activity, not just a select few types of missions.
I think the way to Level 60 could be faster, because there are level-bound missions. But you don't need to unlock a particular specialization to get access to particular missions.
I've seen you post this point a variety of times and, with a few exceptions, not received a favorabke response to it. I think the basic premise is wrong for many of us. We did not consider our situation static when we were max level and max rep. When a new rep came out we cringed at a new time gated grind, put our heads down and eagerly awaited when it would be over so we could resume fully enjoying the game before the next silly time gated grind.
I agree with the guy you gave this response too. We were enjoying the game just fine when we were maxed out...many of us anyway it would seem. You seem to feel that was a static situation...it appears many of the people posting here disagee.
The point of leveling is for it to be over.
Trying to force daily logins do not equate to more money for cryptic if we are not having fun when we do.
You can't tell me taking out a Kazon carrier should be giving you more XP than a Borg Tac cube, which it does. Kazon Carrier on normal = 206 XP, Borg Tac cube on Elite 105.
Maybe that's why the Borg were not assimilating the Kazon. They made more XP by killing them
Anyway, so far it's my understanding they doubled the patrol reward, and not the kill themselves. The kill were doubled with a previous patch, which is considered as a bug by the devs, and never made it to holodeck.
A dev comment would be appreciated. The wording of the patch note was vague.
I get 1 spec point from just running ques and doing doffs every 3-4 days. That means for me to max out, I am looking at something like 240 days...which is about 2/3 of a year...as far as a MMO goes...that's NOTHING. And I don't really need those spec points to do what I do anyways. I'm still having fun flying my favorite ST ship and killing millions of innocent drones...and when I do get a spec point, it's a nice sense of progression. If you turned the game from something fun into work just because you feel you NEED something NOW...your doing it wrong.
What is the difference between gardening and farming? Between hobby wood working and being a carpenter? Between cooking as a hobby and being a chef? One if a hobby and one is work. The difference between the two is that you do one because you WANT to, the other because you HAVE to. If your making your hobby into work...your doing it wrong...you should be trying to turn your work into your hobby.
Maybe...but I think the real question is....are you having fun while chipping away at this rate. Tolerance for any long term activity in a game is based ultimately on how much you are enjoying it. I personally am finding it boring and am finding less and less reasons to log on. I'm down to me enjoying doing things with my fleetmates because the game itself is a far less fun experience than it used to be....for me anyway.
No fun and long grind = find something else to do eventually.
What about my other 10 alts? Or perhaps I should dump them and stick with one from each faction, or maybe you think I should just have one main toon and forget all the others with all their gear that I've spent the last 4 years building up?
Alts is where Cryptic really killed the game for me.
Even though I had but a single real Rom alt, I nonetheless invested heavily in her. Got her lockboxes, the very expensive purple doffs, Lobi gear, etc. The insane Upgrade cost has made me have to effectiely abandon her.
And, to add insult to injury, they started heavily nerfing XP across the board, cuz, God forbid, I'd actually be temped to train up my alt too. But you know what, Cryptic?! You win: I won't be using her at all any more. Which means: not a penny spent on her any more. That is what you wanted.
I can't pass up a chance to make a funny, but when did they say that?
New Lunar Republic
"Where monsters rampage, I'm there to take them down! Where treasure glitters, I'm there to claim it! Where an enemy rises to face me, victory will be mine!" -Lina Inverse
I've seen you post this point a variety of times and, with a few exceptions, not received a favorabke response to it. I think the basic premise is wrong for many of us. We did not consider our situation static when we were max level and max rep. When a new rep came out we cringed at a new time gated grind, put our heads down and eagerly awaited when it would be over so we could resume fully enjoying the game before the next silly time gated grind.
I agree with the guy you gave this response too. We were enjoying the game just fine when we were maxed out...many of us anyway it would seem. You seem to feel that was a static situation...it appears many of the people posting here disagee.
The point of leveling is for it to be over.
Trying to force daily logins do not equate to more money for cryptic if we are not having fun when we do.
But why be obsessive about being maxxed out? Imagine they had never added specialization points. You went to Level 60 and that would be it. You would do whatever you wanted. Why is it psychologically impossible to ignore those other 50 pseudo-levels that grant you specialisation points? Why is so difficult to see that as a kind of "extra reward"?
I guess psychologists have smart answers for that. Or maybe not, and they are eagerly studying the phenomena and writing papers about it. And if not even that, they really should.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
If your not having fun, then don't PLAY...the point of PLAY is to have FUN. Such a simple concept that people seem unwilling to accept.
So we can't try to improve something we like ? We either like it or leave it ? I seriously hate this non-argument.
We used to like this game before DR, that's why we try to improve it, so we can continue having fun.
I was never taught to back down from a fight. I don't run when I see a complication. I try to fight it.
Nah not obsessive, I'd just wish they added something worth anyones time, instead ...
If it's not worth your time, you don't need to do it. And you can still play STO! It's like having a radio that can also play country music. If you hate country music, you can turn on a classic rock station and ignore all the country stations.
Unless the (very, very rare) indicator implying that you gained a specialization point is bothersome to you.
DOFFing to max levels takes forever, too. But people are not that obsessed about it.
THe first Diplomacy system (before there were DOFFs) would have taken forever to level with the few existing missions.
Maybe that was the mistake Cryptic made. Tying this in with skill points. They should have invented another special token reward system. Tying it to skill points makes it feel like "real" levels that you must have before you can do the real stuff.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
Comments
^^ Played forever at level 50. It didn't take a year to get to 50. The Argala Wall ahead is much bigger than the waiting for the last mk XII tech to drop in Cure Elite. When it did finally, it still wasn't boring. You were honing your game. You were beating your records. The only record to beat right now is to get all that Argala in before the next "boost" to XP comes.
Make the game fun again. Let me play with people without being hopelessly undergeared and underskilled. And don't make it feel like work, like I'm just doing it for the rewards and nothing else at all. Reduce the insane dill costs from upgrading items. Offer some content. Fix some PvP since it would solve many of the lacking content and repetitive issues you have.
You can't tell me taking out a Kazon carrier should be giving you more XP than a Borg Tac cube, which it does. Kazon Carrier on normal = 206 XP, Borg Tac cube on Elite 105.
That alone makes STFing on Elite almost completely pointless as far as XP gains go.
A normalization across the board would really help a lot as far as XP goes.
Make all the missions pay out the same, hell even use Argala as a base, I wouldn't mind it taking a long time as long as the content was all paying out the same which it is not.
Argala takes all of what, ten minutes to do? If a story mission takes an hour then times the XP gain by 6 compaired to Argala, super easy.
I am -very- curious how long people think it -should- take to max out their character - again. The game was -way- too fast with EXP before. Making level 50 in a week is insanely easy and stupid. I don't buy the "Casuals are ok with it", mainly because I am casual and made 50 even faster than that.
Now, people are crying because maxxing their spec points might take a few months? So I wonder... how is that so terrible? How long do you -think- it should take? A week? Ten days? So that you can get maxxed out again in the blink of an eye to start complaining about lack of advancement/content again?
Cryptic is facing an issue that has plagued every MMO maker since forever. There's a segment that will max-level as quick as mathematically possible. There's a segment that plays c asually. There's a segment in between. How do they please everyone while creating an environment that encourages people to play/buy/spend?
Making advancement a breeze is not the answer.
Read again ... noone is asking for super-easy Spec Points (few months ? you serious ?) ... but most of us want achievable Spec Points, within their Lifetime ... and some fools even want them for their Alts, without outsourcing them to their kids some day ...
Unfortunately for me, I get more time to read a forum post in the middle of having to do other things than spend hours in Argala. I would be happy to see 1 single spec a DAY.
24h of queuing & doffing, maybe ... during Bonus Mark Event (last 24h) I did ~22 Bug Hunt Advanced + new Doff Assigments ~every hour (-7 hours sleep) ... still no Spec Point (almost there, though) ...
I've seen you post this point a variety of times and, with a few exceptions, not received a favorabke response to it. I think the basic premise is wrong for many of us. We did not consider our situation static when we were max level and max rep. When a new rep came out we cringed at a new time gated grind, put our heads down and eagerly awaited when it would be over so we could resume fully enjoying the game before the next silly time gated grind.
I agree with the guy you gave this response too. We were enjoying the game just fine when we were maxed out...many of us anyway it would seem. You seem to feel that was a static situation...it appears many of the people posting here disagee.
The point of leveling is for it to be over.
Trying to force daily logins do not equate to more money for cryptic if we are not having fun when we do.
Anyway, so far it's my understanding they doubled the patrol reward, and not the kill themselves. The kill were doubled with a previous patch, which is considered as a bug by the devs, and never made it to holodeck.
A dev comment would be appreciated. The wording of the patch note was vague.
Maybe...but I think the real question is....are you having fun while chipping away at this rate. Tolerance for any long term activity in a game is based ultimately on how much you are enjoying it. I personally am finding it boring and am finding less and less reasons to log on. I'm down to me enjoying doing things with my fleetmates because the game itself is a far less fun experience than it used to be....for me anyway.
No fun and long grind = find something else to do eventually.
Thanks
Free Tibet!
Alts is where Cryptic really killed the game for me.
Even though I had but a single real Rom alt, I nonetheless invested heavily in her. Got her lockboxes, the very expensive purple doffs, Lobi gear, etc. The insane Upgrade cost has made me have to effectiely abandon her.
And, to add insult to injury, they started heavily nerfing XP across the board, cuz, God forbid, I'd actually be temped to train up my alt too. But you know what, Cryptic?! You win: I won't be using her at all any more. Which means: not a penny spent on her any more. That is what you wanted.
Am I bitter about this? Yes.
Close enough lolz
I can't pass up a chance to make a funny, but when did they say that?
"Where monsters rampage, I'm there to take them down! Where treasure glitters, I'm there to claim it! Where an enemy rises to face me, victory will be mine!" -Lina Inverse
It's a laugh a minute here.
Free Tibet!
Nah ... WoW is just fine ... :P
I guess psychologists have smart answers for that. Or maybe not, and they are eagerly studying the phenomena and writing papers about it. And if not even that, they really should.
We used to like this game before DR, that's why we try to improve it, so we can continue having fun.
I was never taught to back down from a fight. I don't run when I see a complication. I try to fight it.
Nah not obsessive, I'd just wish they added something worth anyones time, instead ...
"If you don't like our product, don't buy it!"
May I suggest you don't pursue a career in advertising.
+
"If you don't like the previous comment, don't respond!"
-> the whole "if you don't ... than don't" - Argument is idiotic at best ... "If you don't like Saddam, don't vote for him" i.E. ....
They lost 500k players in a month. About 750K in 3months.
I think the players listened.
If it's not worth your time, you don't need to do it. And you can still play STO! It's like having a radio that can also play country music. If you hate country music, you can turn on a classic rock station and ignore all the country stations.
Unless the (very, very rare) indicator implying that you gained a specialization point is bothersome to you.
DOFFing to max levels takes forever, too. But people are not that obsessed about it.
THe first Diplomacy system (before there were DOFFs) would have taken forever to level with the few existing missions.
Maybe that was the mistake Cryptic made. Tying this in with skill points. They should have invented another special token reward system. Tying it to skill points makes it feel like "real" levels that you must have before you can do the real stuff.