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Mission fail optionals need to be elite only.
oridjerraa
Member Posts: 313 Arc User
I tried 3 pugs of Azure Nebula Advanced tonight. Something like 17 seconds on the mission countdown timer, no time to communicate. Failed rescue 3 ships fast(way to promote more pew pew/less diversity cryptic)all 3 attempts.
Now, I only speak for myself, I hate getting kicked out of a mission after waiting for the queue to fill. It's bad business in my book. It totally undermines quick play. It undermines having Advance setting at all. I would never waste people's time by pugging the new elites, but Advance was suppose to be like the old elite but it isn't, Not One Bit!
For those who say stick to normal, I say what for? The rewards I need only come from Advance or elite. I'm a long time subscriber, I paid cash for a new T6 ship. I am frustrated and my patients are wearing thin. I've already deleted 3 alts with max gear and rep. I have 1 character left, cryptic...
Make my time and effort worthwild and enjoyable or I will dump you.
Now, I only speak for myself, I hate getting kicked out of a mission after waiting for the queue to fill. It's bad business in my book. It totally undermines quick play. It undermines having Advance setting at all. I would never waste people's time by pugging the new elites, but Advance was suppose to be like the old elite but it isn't, Not One Bit!
For those who say stick to normal, I say what for? The rewards I need only come from Advance or elite. I'm a long time subscriber, I paid cash for a new T6 ship. I am frustrated and my patients are wearing thin. I've already deleted 3 alts with max gear and rep. I have 1 character left, cryptic...
Make my time and effort worthwild and enjoyable or I will dump you.
Post edited by oridjerraa on
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Comments
That aside. I think some of the timers need a reevaluation for some if the optionals and even mission objectives.
120 seconds and GO!
Lion Heart of Hammer Squadron
I would rather see Optional Objectives actually be.. Optional.
Normal Mode - No Optional Objectives
Advanced - Optional Objectives, failure results in slightly reduced rewards but the mission continues.
Elite - All objectives are required.
There are ways of making the Optionals important that don't involve ending the mission in failure.
Business is business. Lose enough, you end up on unemployment buried to your eyeballs in red tape.
What reward only comes out of Azura Nebula Advanced?
Optionals should still be in normals just so you learn what they are and how to get them. The bonuses should just be minimal.
Lion Heart of Hammer Squadron
Good point.
Advance R&D Box and 720 Dil. And, they recently changed the word, but if it quacks like a duck, and walks like a duck, it's a duck. Optional objectives have been around far too long for you to say they never existed.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Making the advanced and elite pves easier would not fit the goals Cryptic has set in place with this newest release. The upgrade system is directly tied to dilithium which is capped at 8 to 9k a day. It isn't like you can just grind your way to increase that number. You can grind to obtain unrefined but if you are like a lot of people, your unrefined cache is quite large and to the point that it would take quite a while to clear. R&D takes forever to advance past lvl 10 but you can of course move this along as well by using dilithium. In another post i discussed the fact that ground pve on advanced and elite stand in stark contrast with space in regards to difficulty. I believe the reason for this is players are more likely to work to upgrade their space equipment rather than ground.. therefore there is no incentive to frustrate players to the point where they will spend cash to buy zen and turn it into dilithium to upgrade ground equipment. People will just stop playing ground pves like many have stopped playing space. I realize that this game is a business for Cryptic and they aren't in it for charity. I also realize that by adopting the freemium model, they stand to make a boat load but making that boat load involves forced frustration, aggrivation and impatience from the player base. Quite frankly, Cryptic is pissing off the players in a gamble that it will make them cought up more dough to advance without having to wait. There is no incentive for the gold players to keep paying, i was for a while but I gave up on that. There is no benefit to giving Cryptic 15 bucks a month... lifetime subscription is a huge waste even with the 500 zen a month. Other MMOs give you 500 "gold" just for paying a monthly subscription... hell that alone in my mind shines a light on Cryptic's greed model.
Subbing (Gold Account) gets you 500 zen too. Not just Lifetime
Did you not get your zen when you were subbing?
Now you went and ruined a perfectly good rant with facts.
Lion Heart of Hammer Squadron
The Azure Nebula one countdown is way too short - we only ever got to the third ship with 20 seconds left on the clock.
I honestly don't think I did but perhaps it is because I switched banks and never changed the card. I will subtract my comment about the gold membership but the rest of my comment was not a rant. There is a difference between ranting and criticism. A rant would be profanity laden and inflamatory. My comment contained neither.
Why queue for a mission which will probably fail and result in a long cooldown?
I don't queue for normal because normal is too easy and bores me.
Undine Assault (Advanced) does not end the mission when optional is failed but other missions usually end when optional is failed.
Mission timer is a very unsatisfying way to play.
Go! Go! Go! Rush! Rush! Rush!
SpeedTrek!
Speed runs are for players who farm and therefore, they don't need to spend any real money.
Cryptic is making a big mistake by making missions only beatable by speed farmers and elite dps fleets because such players don't need to spend any real money on this game.
There's plenty of other things I enjoy doing here so I'll do that while hoping this failure mechanism is removed.
btw in my opinion the enemy HP is fine now. But that does little to solve the various timed objectives in pug teams. People will just not play them at all rather than working together. That's just the facts.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
As much as I hate the mandatory "optionals" in pugs as well, what is with deleting alts? What does that accomplish other than proving you're a hardcore TRIBBLE (and thus should enjoy pugging advanced queues)
You have it the other way around, sir. STO use to be casual enough to allow a player to work up alts. I gave up on mine knowing the extreme, unreasonable, costs associated with upgrading them. I sure many players have reduced down their alts because it just feels too daunting.
I had no problem raising Counter Command, Dyson, New Republic, and Omega because the queues were fast, fun, and full. I saw the righting on the wall with DR.
I played some with random groups and some with fleet mates, there was often no apparent reason for the fail, one of them failed within seconds of starting and it was plain that the normal fail conditions had not been met.
at the moment these fails seem to be completely random and at most times for no apparent reason.
this is most noticeable when playing with fleet mates where we always used to succeed on the old elite we now fail very quickly with advanced and that should not happen.
it is fine to have a fail if a certain objective is not met like with THE CURE FOUND if you fail to protect the I.K.S. Kang, or with INFECTED: THE CONDUIT when enough Borg Probes get through but the fails seem to happen now when these fail conditions are not met.
the biggest problem is you only seem to get a borg neural processor on advanced & elite and they are what I need most.
just make advanced like the old elite used to be, its no fun as it is now.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
There's your problem. You can quit right there.
I'm not trying to be flipant. I'm trying to be honest. Based on the testing I and my fleetmates have done, Advanced queues require 15k DPS and Elite requires 25k+ DPS just to carry your weight and not be a detriment to the team. The vast and overwhelming majority of players need to stay in Normal queues. Like it or not, that's the way DPS Online works now.
There are many things you can do to better your chances. Look into your own fleet or join a more active fleet. There are dozens of in-game chat channels where people that know what they're doing and can carry their weight run queues constantly. Unless it's just for giggles, I will never, ever, ever PUG a random queue again.
It promotes intelligent option selection and a well thought out map play through.
You should include this into all maps.
:cool:
It's mission, to destroy new worlds and civilizations
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
And to boldly ruin, what no one has ruined before.
I've learned this the hard way the past 48 hours. Despite being pretty rusty coming back to the game, I figured PUGging in a still well-geared Scimi would ease things a bit. I was wrong.
Good PUGs were fine and reminded me of the ISE of old but bad PUGs seem much harder to apply the carry-factor to. It's gotten so bad that I'm considering saying, "TRIBBLE it" and only doing normals. 45 marks are better than 10 for an hour-long queue cooldown.
You are more efficient having a couple of tanks on the team.
The objektive is not killing Tholians.
If you want head first through that HP wall, of course a pug will fail. Go around. Either by having one player distracting the enemy or by stealth. I believe the Intel ships can do that.
Im pretty sure straight up DELETING alts leaves you in the minority. Most sensible people would just not play them, not delete hours of work for no gain. And regular queues for every type of mark are still pretty fast and easy, its the tokens like bio-neural processors that are difficult to get still.
this is because cryptic has forgotten that the concept of punishment for failure doesn't work
what your supposed to do is reward for success and not punish or penalize for failure but they have forgotten this somewhere along the line.
I'm not even sure if I think the elite should have all these punishments built in but people dont enjoy failing then being locked out of something for an hour or whatever. They are trying to design raid type content but without the concepts that go behind them. If you "fail" in a raid you get to stay and try again over and over again until you either give up and leave to come back next week or conquer it and move to the next obsticle so there is no real punishment plus you get to keep any loot etc that drops and wont go away empty handed.
the present design of failing 2 seconds after you start and just everyone being forced to wait an hour to try again is extremely poor game design. They need to cut it out and design real "elite" raid content and leave their q's alone. I dont actually even think the optionals should be present in elite either I think that there should be base rewards with a little gift at the end if you manage to conquer the thing in a flawless run. However each "optional" you conquer should reward something on top of the base reward of making it to the end. The issue here is the basic design of the content to start with. They are trying to squish a "raid" type experience into this 15 minute q system and simply put .. its not going to work.
However they do need to stop punishing people for failing (at any level) because this is what makes people just not bother.
it still baffles me that gecko said that STFs NEED a certain % of failures. I'm not even sure how he arrived at that conclusion. STFs always had a chance to fail anyways with a bad team, but it was a soft cap where people would just leave after respawn timers got silly. coding in failure though makes ZERO sense to me. let players decide if they've failed or not
This was clearly a colossal mistake.
Imagine DR without the failqueues and with say the enemy HP as they are now.
I think it would have been a stunning success.
Not really sure where we go from here. For me, I have moved on to other content and will have the chat window open for once to see if any groups are forming for missions I like.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
I use to be able to hop on and do a bunch of things like DRSE, UIE, VCE, ISE, KVE, and even a Breach Elite when I saw a few in the queue.
That is the whole reason for having the queue panel, QUICK PLAY. I don't care about sub-geared players, I don't care about they lacking any experience, or even plain old lazy. I care about MY free time and what I do to enjoy it.
I have a great fleet, but we are all adults(ToS Veterans only recruit players 30+ in age)and NO, were not a wow raiding guild with set play times and DKP. WERE CASUAL, like this game use to be.
This game has lost all semblance of fun gameplay. Variety has been tossed out the window like Walter's suitcase of dirty white underwear. If I wanted a raiding environment I would join a raiding game.
I challenge ANYONE to say STO was ever a raiding game! Bring back the casual fun.