The big problem with the original series (and Crusade, and the other attempts) was the JMS was fighting to keep a budget and keep it alive, and the compromises made, reduced the quality of the show in the last season. Even then, i still had some great stuff.
I can see room for a reboot. He'll need two very important things: 1) no studio bigwigs dinking around with his show. Give him the rope to swing or hang himself. 2) a cast that equals or surpasses the original. Additionally, he'll need a stronger first season and last season. Both of those are constantly picked at by the fans.
Frankly, I'm not sure how a reboot would work in this case. For one, he altered the story to accommodate the departure of Commander Sinclair, who would probably have been filling Sheridan's shoes most of the show. I do think the alteration made B5 stronger, but its still something to consider. For another, what surprises are in store the second time around? (short of falling into a vortex into an alternated timeline/universe wibbly wobbly thingie)
Personally, I'd love to see a new series, not a reboot, but sent in the B5 universe. The Psi War would be interesting, as would the B4 story played out, even if we do know the broad outcome of that one. I'd also be fine with a story running parallel to B5, or a reboot of Crusade to finally get it hammered out.
Id rather see a B5 MMO not unlike STO i was a bigger fan of B5 then i was a trek fan i really liked that show and would toss my wallet at a B5 game.
What if PWE/Cryptic got it?
<chuckle>
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I'd like a space combat sim. Flying around in a Starfury would be frickin' AWESOME! Especially if they include the physics they had in the show.
You want The Babylon Project. Free standalone B5 space sim, fan-made using the FreeSpace 2 engine. And Starfuries can turn off inertia and "glide", approximating the tricks they do in the show.
It's really, really good.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Part of me really wants to like the idea of a B5 reboot/return, however a big part of me is also so concerned at what any return would look like. If we look back over the run of B5 as a series one of the things that made it great was that it was a series and so the story arcs could run over many episodes and series (granted they didn't work out quite as JMS originally intended, but nonetheless the multi season shadow war arc worked well). I just can't see how you can capture something like that in a 2 hour movie reboot, get all the characters that are needed introduced and do the original justice.
If we look at the series post the original B5 Crusade wasn't a particularly big hit (personally I thought it was cut off just as it was getting going, but I guess we'll never know what it truly could have been) and then there's the two most recent additions which I think its fair to say were both poor at best and in my opinion didn't do the original series justice at all. With all that I think it really concerns me that the memories of a great series (if looking a little dated on the video footage these days - but still with some great CGI) would be tarnished with a failed reboot attempt that just didn't work.
Now getting the B5 space sim game that was floating around in development (seem to recall acquiring a beta copy where you piloted a starfury) a few years ago completed and into a full game, that could do some justice to the legacy if done right and could be great fun.
You want The Babylon Project. Free standalone B5 space sim, fan-made using the FreeSpace 2 engine. And Starfuries can turn off inertia and "glide", approximating the tricks they do in the show.
It's really, really good.
Might have to check that out sometime. Been keeping my eye on this on Star Fox one that's looking pretty good. Might also have to get my hands on Freespace 2 one of these days as well.
I'm fine with it. Hopefully the end result is spectacular. I guess the question that I want answered the most is will it be a movie adaption of the series along the lines of Macross: Do You Remember Love?, or will it take a different path and set the stage for Babylon Prime.
The artist formally known as Romulus_Prime
0
rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,605Community Moderator
edited September 2014
Considering I've only watched a few episodes of Robotech... not a clue.
You want The Babylon Project. Free standalone B5 space sim, fan-made using the FreeSpace 2 engine. And Starfuries can turn off inertia and "glide", approximating the tricks they do in the show.
It's really, really good.
Any B5 space combat game needs an option to fight in Hyper space.
If we look at the series post the original B5 Crusade wasn't a particularly big hit (personally I thought it was cut off just as it was getting going, but I guess we'll never know what it truly could have been)
Agreed. Crusade needed a chance to fully flower. B5 itself took a whole season to properly set the foundation for the rest of the series. As a result, unfortunately, I've had friends refuse to view more after viewing the initial season. I try to convince them to hang on until about 4 to 6 episodes into to season two. Those that do are usually hooked and see why season one was necessary.
I think he was the guy who tied a rope to it then told Stan to hit the gas in the truck.Any B5 space combat game needs an option to fight in Hyper space.
Only if there's also the option to get off course and lost in hyperspace as well. But yes, absolutely.
Any B5 space combat game needs an option to fight in Hyper space.
There's a level in the "Raider Wars" campaign (side story to the first half of season one) where the cruiser your fighter is attached to gets ambushed in hyperspace.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,605Community Moderator
edited September 2014
Crusade was also aired out of order, which didn't help one bit. In some episodes, they had the standard Explorer style uniforms, in others they had the unique uniforms that Captain Gideon said made him look like a bellhop.
I kinda liked Captain Lockley. Problem is... we didn't get to see her as much as Sheridan, and she was the station commander in that season!
Also... there's that loose thread that is the Thirdspace Aliens. Are they looking for another way into our universe?
with that ea war and shadow coming to an end, sheridan and dalenn elsewhere and lennier off doing is his own thing and then londo, g'kar and vir out to save the centauri from themselves and try to create hope if at all possible and finally garibaldi turning to drink and then getting his life back before long. lochley was swamped out and ignored in all that. there was nothing noteworthy about her time on the show.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
I bloody hated those grey uniforms they ended up using.
Bad, bad move by the production staff. The dark blue uniforms they initially used were not only more visually appealing, but they LOOKED like they were part of EarthForce.
Of course, that was the least of the show's problems. Overall, the story wasn't very uplifting. Maybe for a couple of TV movies ending in a resolution, but not for an entire series. Shows like this need a foundation based on something more compelling and hopeful. I think that's why B5 did as well as it did - because even in the darkness, there was always that light at the end of the tunnel that viewers could clearly see and WANT the crew to strive for.
Last, best hope for peace.
Last, best hope for victory.
It's clearly defined, and you want the characters to succeed. They don't always, but there are far more instances where they do exactly that. And more to the point, you are involved in that struggle. You see the victories and defeats involved with the primary story. In the end, you care about them and what they're going through.
Crusade isn't like that since the primary problem - people suffering and dying on a plague-filled Earth - is removed from the show. It's akin to an annoying sound in the background. You want it to go away, i.e. you want the problem solved, not constantly lingering day after day.
The other problems:
The ship - it's not visually amazing. You'd think a Vorlon-Minbari-human cross-bred ship would look crazy cool, and it just doesn't. It's not totally ugly, but it's far from impressive.
The music - again, not amazing, We went from totally epic to The Zocolo's Greatest Hits. Seriously, this is what I would expect to hear as ambient music in space bar scenes. It's not bad, but it's not epic...not at all.
The characters - I hate to say it, but most of them just aren't compelling enough. At the same time, they are a product of the series, so they could only be as interesting as the setting.
Overall, I think this show could have worked, but only if the objective and foundation for the premise had been different. Something hopeful and uplifting. An adventure you want to be a part of, as opposed to a chore you need to complete before you get to do the things you really want to do.
The artist formally known as Romulus_Prime
0
rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,605Community Moderator
edited September 2014
Besides everyone asking which side she was on... Lockley did kinda blow up a virtural brothel in River of Souls using a grenade.
I've noticed that Hollywood is using the term "reboot" to refer to sequels of things that haven't been made for a long time, and/or using a different cast of characters, or a focus on a different set of characters.. Just recently, I noticed that the next National Lampoon's Vacation movie is a sequel but also being referred to as a reboot.
Tried to watch it, never could. Just seemed to be a DS9 rip off. And I never did like any of the characters. No not flaming just saying. Not a fan.
No problem, but it was created before DS9. B5 is one of the best Sci fi's in history. The most solid story line I've ever seen. I strongly prefer it over anything Star Trek, but that's just me. The laws of physics exists in B5 also. Too much magic and techno babble gets a little boring after a while in Trek.
I see B5 as realistic possible future for mankind, just see the Earth Alliance ship designs.
The dress is gold and white. Over 70% people says so. When viewed from a certain screen angle it appears blue and black. The dress displayed on amazon is a blue and black dress, but it's not the same dress in the picture. If you're seeing blue & black you're slightly colored blind. A normal upright screen = white and gold.
I've noticed that Hollywood is using the term "reboot" to refer to sequels of things that haven't been made for a long time, and/or using a different cast of characters, or a focus on a different set of characters.. Just recently, I noticed that the next National Lampoon's Vacation movie is a sequel but also being referred to as a reboot.
that all Hollywood is about now REboot because creativity is lost now
"The meaning of victory is not to merely defeat your enemy but to destroy him, to completely eradicate him from living memory, to leave no remnant of his endeavours, to crush utterly his achievement and remove from all record his every trace of existence. From that defeat no enemy can ever recover. That is the meaning of victory."
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
The dress is gold and white. Over 70% people says so. When viewed from a certain screen angle it appears blue and black. The dress displayed on amazon is a blue and black dress, but it's not the same dress in the picture. If you're seeing blue & black you're slightly colored blind. A normal upright screen = white and gold.
I've noticed that Hollywood is using the term "reboot" to refer to sequels of things that haven't been made for a long time, and/or using a different cast of characters, or a focus on a different set of characters.. Just recently, I noticed that the next National Lampoon's Vacation movie is a sequel but also being referred to as a reboot.
I think there's a blurry distinction between "creative reboots," which could also be sequels (see Ghostbusters 3, if they ever get around to making it), and "story reboots," which supersede the source material (Amazing Spider-Man to Spider-Man).
Most people don't bother to clarify which one they're talking about.
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
I think there's a blurry distinction between "creative reboots," which could also be sequels (see Ghostbusters 3, if they ever get around to making it), and "story reboots," which supersede the source material (Amazing Spider-Man to Spider-Man).
Most people don't bother to clarify which one they're talking about.
as i mentioned in an earlier post, media have been known to blow things up for a spectacular story where there isnt one. this may not be what it appears to be.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Always room for a good quality SIFI series! Most of them stink. The premise of BBY5 that bothered me was building a space station that everyone wanted to blow up. If you want something that is hard to blow up you should put it on a planet where vacuum will not instantly kill your population on your first hull breach.
Tried to watch it, never could. Just seemed to be a DS9 rip off.
Oh, the irony of that statement. :rolleyes:
I'm assuming you've probably not heard that JMS pitched B5 to Paramount, in detail, before DS9 was developed. How much of his pitch was swiped and worked into DS9 has been a hotly contested point among fans of both series over the years.
Me personally? I see the point that DS9 was significantly influenced by that pitch. However, I love both, and am glad both exist.
I'm assuming you've probably not heard that JMS pitched B5 to Paramount, in detail, before DS9 was developed. How much of his pitch was swiped and worked into DS9 has been a hotly contested point among fans of both series over the years.
Me personally? I see the point that DS9 was significantly influenced by that pitch. However, I love both, and am glad both exist.
Pretty much all this. It amazes me to see there are still people who believe B5 ripped off DS9. After 20yrs, that myth should be long debunked by now.
Comments
I can see room for a reboot. He'll need two very important things: 1) no studio bigwigs dinking around with his show. Give him the rope to swing or hang himself. 2) a cast that equals or surpasses the original. Additionally, he'll need a stronger first season and last season. Both of those are constantly picked at by the fans.
Frankly, I'm not sure how a reboot would work in this case. For one, he altered the story to accommodate the departure of Commander Sinclair, who would probably have been filling Sheridan's shoes most of the show. I do think the alteration made B5 stronger, but its still something to consider. For another, what surprises are in store the second time around? (short of falling into a vortex into an alternated timeline/universe wibbly wobbly thingie)
Personally, I'd love to see a new series, not a reboot, but sent in the B5 universe. The Psi War would be interesting, as would the B4 story played out, even if we do know the broad outcome of that one. I'd also be fine with a story running parallel to B5, or a reboot of Crusade to finally get it hammered out.
What if PWE/Cryptic got it?
<chuckle>
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
You want The Babylon Project. Free standalone B5 space sim, fan-made using the FreeSpace 2 engine. And Starfuries can turn off inertia and "glide", approximating the tricks they do in the show.
It's really, really good.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
If we look at the series post the original B5 Crusade wasn't a particularly big hit (personally I thought it was cut off just as it was getting going, but I guess we'll never know what it truly could have been) and then there's the two most recent additions which I think its fair to say were both poor at best and in my opinion didn't do the original series justice at all. With all that I think it really concerns me that the memories of a great series (if looking a little dated on the video footage these days - but still with some great CGI) would be tarnished with a failed reboot attempt that just didn't work.
Now getting the B5 space sim game that was floating around in development (seem to recall acquiring a beta copy where you piloted a starfury) a few years ago completed and into a full game, that could do some justice to the legacy if done right and could be great fun.
The Lurker's Guide to Babylon 5.
I really hope jms knocks it out of the ballpark with this new production. :cool:
Might have to check that out sometime. Been keeping my eye on this on Star Fox one that's looking pretty good. Might also have to get my hands on Freespace 2 one of these days as well.
I think I'll stick with the English dub episodes whenever I get back to watching them online. Think I left off on Ep. 16...
My character Tsin'xing
My character Tsin'xing
Agreed. Crusade needed a chance to fully flower. B5 itself took a whole season to properly set the foundation for the rest of the series. As a result, unfortunately, I've had friends refuse to view more after viewing the initial season. I try to convince them to hang on until about 4 to 6 episodes into to season two. Those that do are usually hooked and see why season one was necessary.
Only if there's also the option to get off course and lost in hyperspace as well. But yes, absolutely.
There's a level in the "Raider Wars" campaign (side story to the first half of season one) where the cruiser your fighter is attached to gets ambushed in hyperspace.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
with that ea war and shadow coming to an end, sheridan and dalenn elsewhere and lennier off doing is his own thing and then londo, g'kar and vir out to save the centauri from themselves and try to create hope if at all possible and finally garibaldi turning to drink and then getting his life back before long. lochley was swamped out and ignored in all that. there was nothing noteworthy about her time on the show.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Bad, bad move by the production staff. The dark blue uniforms they initially used were not only more visually appealing, but they LOOKED like they were part of EarthForce.
Of course, that was the least of the show's problems. Overall, the story wasn't very uplifting. Maybe for a couple of TV movies ending in a resolution, but not for an entire series. Shows like this need a foundation based on something more compelling and hopeful. I think that's why B5 did as well as it did - because even in the darkness, there was always that light at the end of the tunnel that viewers could clearly see and WANT the crew to strive for.
Last, best hope for peace.
Last, best hope for victory.
It's clearly defined, and you want the characters to succeed. They don't always, but there are far more instances where they do exactly that. And more to the point, you are involved in that struggle. You see the victories and defeats involved with the primary story. In the end, you care about them and what they're going through.
Crusade isn't like that since the primary problem - people suffering and dying on a plague-filled Earth - is removed from the show. It's akin to an annoying sound in the background. You want it to go away, i.e. you want the problem solved, not constantly lingering day after day.
The other problems:
The ship - it's not visually amazing. You'd think a Vorlon-Minbari-human cross-bred ship would look crazy cool, and it just doesn't. It's not totally ugly, but it's far from impressive.
The music - again, not amazing, We went from totally epic to The Zocolo's Greatest Hits. Seriously, this is what I would expect to hear as ambient music in space bar scenes. It's not bad, but it's not epic...not at all.
The characters - I hate to say it, but most of them just aren't compelling enough. At the same time, they are a product of the series, so they could only be as interesting as the setting.
Overall, I think this show could have worked, but only if the objective and foundation for the premise had been different. Something hopeful and uplifting. An adventure you want to be a part of, as opposed to a chore you need to complete before you get to do the things you really want to do.
No problem, but it was created before DS9. B5 is one of the best Sci fi's in history. The most solid story line I've ever seen. I strongly prefer it over anything Star Trek, but that's just me. The laws of physics exists in B5 also. Too much magic and techno babble gets a little boring after a while in Trek.
I see B5 as realistic possible future for mankind, just see the Earth Alliance ship designs.
that all Hollywood is about now REboot because creativity is lost now
system Lord Baal is dead
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
Awesome! I would truly love to see that. The Earth civil war had some epic battle scenes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96idw23kHdY&list=LLJCpgNZ72-Hd_KVmpuXPajA&index=4
I think there's a blurry distinction between "creative reboots," which could also be sequels (see Ghostbusters 3, if they ever get around to making it), and "story reboots," which supersede the source material (Amazing Spider-Man to Spider-Man).
Most people don't bother to clarify which one they're talking about.
as i mentioned in an earlier post, media have been known to blow things up for a spectacular story where there isnt one. this may not be what it appears to be.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Oh, the irony of that statement. :rolleyes:
I'm assuming you've probably not heard that JMS pitched B5 to Paramount, in detail, before DS9 was developed. How much of his pitch was swiped and worked into DS9 has been a hotly contested point among fans of both series over the years.
Me personally? I see the point that DS9 was significantly influenced by that pitch. However, I love both, and am glad both exist.
People still believe that Elvis isn't dead, which of course he isn't. We all choose to live in the reality we make up for ourselves.